FPS Problem

Hauteecole_Rider16

Here’s something interesting I noticed about the screen flickering, which I have had since yesterday (very bad, too).

When I switched to windowed mode to turn on screen video capture (Shift-Cmd-5 brings up the toolbar), initiated recording, then turned back to fullscreen (where the problem is occurring), the flicker went away. Went back to windowed fullscreen mode, stopped recording, and returned to fullscreen mode. Flickering DID NOT RETURN.

So there’s something really weird going on, and it seems that setting the Mac to video capture the screen fixes it, at least for the session? Quitting out and logging back in restores the problem.

Wodinn

I can confirm most of this is happening to me too. Game opens up an not in full screen. The full screen toggle doesn't work properly. Even with V-sync off the screen still flickers heavily. I have personally noticed a small improvement in fps. But the lag spikes are insane. And so far, EVERY time I've quit the game I've also gotten an error message, saying the game shut down on it's own.

dm_critic

I'm checking out Guild Wars 2 today. I like what I see so far, though I'm not thrilled about starting a new game from scratch. But it runs great under macOS and I'm digging the aesthetics.

My ESO+ renews on the 27th, so I'm going to take the next week or so to decide if it's worth continuing and having to boot into Windows whenever I want to play or cancel renewal and switch over to GW2. I've also tried out WoW, but it seems like maybe GW2 has less baggage. Plus it looks less mid-2000s.

I'm guessing at this point ZOS won't do anything logical like move back to OpenGL until the MoltenVK client is actually usable because ... particles are more important than playability? And we have no indication if this is an iterative fix or if they're declaring "mission accomplished" and moving on.

Wodinn

dm_critic wrote: »

I'm checking out Guild Wars 2 today. I like what I see so far, though I'm not thrilled about starting a new game from scratch. But it runs great under macOS and I'm digging the aesthetics.

My ESO+ renews on the 27th, so I'm going to take the next week or so to decide if it's worth continuing and having to boot into Windows whenever I want to play or cancel renewal and switch over to GW2. I've also tried out WoW, but it seems like maybe GW2 has less baggage. Plus it looks less mid-2000s.

I'm guessing at this point ZOS won't do anything logical like move back to OpenGL until the MoltenVK client is actually usable because ... particles are more important than playability? And we have no indication if this is an iterative fix or if they're declaring "mission accomplished" and moving on.

I have a biased against wow. It's a waste of money. However as a fellow gamer I do recommend trying GW2. I was playing it on Mac before ZoS ever released eso. I still play it now. I personally have let my + membership laps. So I don't blame you for that one. But I do still feel like ZoS will get the game working better on OS. They just don't seem to be concerned with giving us any sort of time frame whatsoever. The lack of communication is unacceptable.

Montie

Wodinn wrote: »

dm_critic wrote: »

I'm checking out Guild Wars 2 today. I like what I see so far, though I'm not thrilled about starting a new game from scratch. But it runs great under macOS and I'm digging the aesthetics.

My ESO+ renews on the 27th, so I'm going to take the next week or so to decide if it's worth continuing and having to boot into Windows whenever I want to play or cancel renewal and switch over to GW2. I've also tried out WoW, but it seems like maybe GW2 has less baggage. Plus it looks less mid-2000s.

I'm guessing at this point ZOS won't do anything logical like move back to OpenGL until the MoltenVK client is actually usable because ... particles are more important than playability? And we have no indication if this is an iterative fix or if they're declaring "mission accomplished" and moving on.

I have a biased against wow. It's a waste of money. However as a fellow gamer I do recommend trying GW2. I was playing it on Mac before ZoS ever released eso. I still play it now. I personally have let my + membership laps. So I don't blame you for that one. But I do still feel like ZoS will get the game working better on OS. They just don't seem to be concerned with giving us any sort of time frame whatsoever. The lack of communication is unacceptable.

The lack of communication is pushing me away from the game more than the broken state is.

ethernut60

Carmina wrote: »

So it seems things are better.

....

Bottomline:

Get rid of the graphics crap
Bring back Fullscreen with tabbing and all that
START TALKING TO PEOPLE! Gina Bruno sucks, OK, she had trouble with Twitter, but leaving the community alone, while being community manager is actually a reason to fire her, sexual harassment yes or no. She is not doing her job. End of story.

C.

Actually, it is the manager(s) that approved release of thiw debacle that need to be fired. What do you expect Gina, or anyone downline of those managers to say "Hey Mac users, we know you are being screwed, but nothing we can do but say smile and suck it up because Management made stupid decisions"?

karpok

Ok for my part I can see some fps improvement since last patch (+10-15 fps). But still bellow pre-murkmire performance.
I also still experience unexplained fps drop bellow 10. It can happen during heavily crafted combat or just riding alone in the wild. Hardly twice at the same place.
And games now crashes when I quit it.

Appart from that I noticed that my CPU is less busy now (compare to before patch), while GPU is under constant load. So I guess it means that hardware acceleration is eventually working now.

I must confess this all is half a good surprise after passed weeks. But there is still work ahead.

Wodinn

karpok wrote: »

Ok for my part I can see some fps improvement since last patch (+10-15 fps). But still bellow pre-murkmire performance.
I also still experience unexplained fps drop bellow 10. It can happen during heavily crafted combat or just riding alone in the wild. Hardly twice at the same place.
And games now crashes when I quit it.

Appart from that I noticed that my CPU is less busy now (compare to before patch), while GPU is under constant load. So I guess it means that hardware acceleration is eventually working now.

I must confess this all is half a good surprise after passed weeks. But there is still work ahead.

Basically the exact same situation for me. Along with the heavy screen flickering in full screen.

voyxx

I am experiencing a slight increase in FPS (10 - 20 fps more), but get stuck quite often when riding around in Cyro. And the game crashes everytime I quit (started after the patch)! Not really a problem but quite annoying!

Montie

dm_critic wrote: »

I'm checking out Guild Wars 2 today. I like what I see so far, though I'm not thrilled about starting a new game from scratch. But it runs great under macOS and I'm digging the aesthetics.

My ESO+ renews on the 27th, so I'm going to take the next week or so to decide if it's worth continuing and having to boot into Windows whenever I want to play or cancel renewal and switch over to GW2. I've also tried out WoW, but it seems like maybe GW2 has less baggage. Plus it looks less mid-2000s.

I'm guessing at this point ZOS won't do anything logical like move back to OpenGL until the MoltenVK client is actually usable because ... particles are more important than playability? And we have no indication if this is an iterative fix or if they're declaring "mission accomplished" and moving on.

Downloading Guild Wars 2 now!

SukeyRH

Montie wrote: »

dm_critic wrote: »

I'm checking out Guild Wars 2 today. I like what I see so far, though I'm not thrilled about starting a new game from scratch. But it runs great under macOS and I'm digging the aesthetics.

My ESO+ renews on the 27th, so I'm going to take the next week or so to decide if it's worth continuing and having to boot into Windows whenever I want to play or cancel renewal and switch over to GW2. I've also tried out WoW, but it seems like maybe GW2 has less baggage. Plus it looks less mid-2000s.

I'm guessing at this point ZOS won't do anything logical like move back to OpenGL until the MoltenVK client is actually usable because ... particles are more important than playability? And we have no indication if this is an iterative fix or if they're declaring "mission accomplished" and moving on.

Downloading Guild Wars 2 now!

I am downloading Guild Wars 2 as well. I want to be able to play something.

Ramber

Are you all doing video editing on them systems or something? 48GB RAM? 8gb added on with graphics card! You know having too much RAM can actually slow your access time as the OS has to access it all every time it needs to?

8-16GB is the suggested max these days on gaming systems. More then that your just showing off or maybe you got a sick deal on it idk but its too much ram man its just too much ram

Wodinn

Ramber wrote: »

Are you all doing video editing on them systems or something? 48GB RAM? 8gb added on with graphics card! You know having too much RAM can actually slow your access time as the OS has to access it all every time it needs to?

8-16GB is the suggested max these days on gaming systems. More then that your just showing off or maybe you got a sick deal on it idk but its too much ram man its just too much ram

What does that matter? What is your point?

dm_critic

Ramber wrote: »

Are you all doing video editing on them systems or something? 48GB RAM? 8gb added on with graphics card! You know having too much RAM can actually slow your access time as the OS has to access it all every time it needs to?

8-16GB is the suggested max these days on gaming systems. More then that your just showing off or maybe you got a sick deal on it idk but its too much ram man its just too much ram

Higher amounts of RAM also allow you to disable virtual memory on a Mac (using a utility like Cocktail or through the Unix shell), speeding up overall performance since you aren't swapping out frequently to disk. Windows and macOS handle memory management differently. Windows pages out as much as possible up front, whereas Unix-based systems like macOS and Linux rely primarily on physical memory and only swap to disk when needed.

Plus some of us run multiple apps while using ESO (discord, browser, etc.). Chrome gets pretty heavy with multiple tabs open since they use individual processes. I'm frequently tabbing back and forth with Chrome while working on alt builds or hunting around guild traders for items (using the Tamriel Trade Centre web app to search for deals).

yacoob

While I wouldn't want to derail the discussion, I find the voices of people moving to GW2 bit amusing - it always ran like crap on my mac. Downloaded it again to verify, similar settings as ESO (not highest, but decent), same resolution - topping 25fps, usually around 17.

Wodinn

yacoob wrote: »

While I wouldn't want to derail the discussion, I find the voices of people moving to GW2 bit amusing - it always ran like crap on my mac. Downloaded it again to verify, similar settings as ESO (not highest, but decent), same resolution - topping 25fps, usually around 17.

You are right. It's not ideal at all. All I ever do is wvw so I leave my graphic settings on low anyways. It's still running slightly better than eso for me, for the time being.

Montie

yacoob wrote: »

While I wouldn't want to derail the discussion, I find the voices of people moving to GW2 bit amusing - it always ran like crap on my mac. Downloaded it again to verify, similar settings as ESO (not highest, but decent), same resolution - topping 25fps, usually around 17.

Yeah, I am trying it. Not the greatest but as Wodinn said, it is running better than ESO.

Carmina

I think we should not get back to some discussions about whether or not RAM is a culprit, or how to configure a crippled client to be less crippled. Just the facts:

• ZOS lied to the users, telling them that Apple is not supporting OpenGL anymore.
• No one from ZOS talked to the people here until a major *** had taken place
• The problem is still not fixed
• Another problem was "fixed" by taking away the window mode most people used
• ZOS is still not talking to us

Discussion on how to play better is kinda useless. Let's not forget that Zenimax took away a client we were all happy with, and turned it into something most of us find unplayable. And they obviously don't care. They try to sit this out.

I still do not get how a company can treat their paying users like that. I just don't.

C.

otab

I solved the situation to my satisfaction by uninstalling eso and turning off my eso+ subscription.

I'll continue to lurk around, and will consider reinstalling it and reinstating my subscription if I ever see news that the Mac client is actually fixed.

In the meantime, I have better uses for 80GB+ of my disk space, and better uses for $15/month than to be given lip service by a company that clearly could give less than a crap that they screwed over a fair piece of their userbase.

I voted with my feet and my wallet.

Grimsinger

Wodinn wrote: »

I can confirm most of this is happening to me too. Game opens up an not in full screen. The full screen toggle doesn't work properly. Even with V-sync off the screen still flickers heavily. I have personally noticed a small improvement in fps. But the lag spikes are insane. And so far, EVERY time I've quit the game I've also gotten an error message, saying the game shut down on it's own.

This. This exact thing is happening to me as well. Everything this person said.

I am still experiencing unplayable FPS in most places, most specifically in Summerset.

Others seem to report "problem solved," or at least "mostly solved."

otab wrote: »

I solved the situation to my satisfaction by uninstalling eso and turning off my eso+ subscription.

I'll continue to lurk around, and will consider reinstalling it and reinstating my subscription if I ever see news that the Mac client is actually fixed.

In the meantime, I have better uses for 80GB+ of my disk space, and better uses for $15/month than to be given lip service by a company that clearly could give less than a crap that they screwed over a fair piece of their userbase.

I voted with my feet and my wallet.

I really hate to say it, because I have been here since beta, but I think I might be finally at this stage if I can't play the game Im paying for every month.

But I would rather just have it work. Thoughts?

Thanks.

Wodinn

I agree with both of you @otab @Carmina. Playing without the + membership and craft bag sucks. But it is doable. And hitting them in the wallet is the only thing left to do. They don't seem to care enough to listen.

Wodinn

Grimsinger wrote: »

I really hate to say it, because I have been here since beta, but I think I might be finally at this stage if I can't play the game Im paying for every month.

But I would rather just have it work. Thoughts?

Thanks.

I have also. All I can hope is they are still working on it. And at some point, sooner than later, it'll play well again.

Montie

I just submitted my refund request for my 6 month sub.

SukeyRH

Went ahead and cancelled my sub. I refuse to continue to pay for a game I cannot play.

Callah

Well they say that if you don't like something then vote with your wallet - I am cancelling my ESO+ as of today.

I am likely to still play so if I see that the Mac client gets the attention that it is due then I may activate my ESO+ again.

I will miss the convenience of my + membership but if ZOS is unwilling to communicate their intentions and acknowledge the significant multiple issues that they introduced to the Mac client with their premature switch to Vulcan then I will learn to live without buying crowns or monthly subscription.

Ophion

I've also cancelled my subscription for ESO+ until these issues get sorted out properly. I refuse to support a game that laughs of the issues for the mac client as a joke (like ZOS did on their ESO Live stream) and give almost no customer support or update on the topic when asked about it. That makes me feel like they don't value an entire client base, because if this would be an issue on the PC it would be so much more updated with dev responses. Sad to see really...

Wodinn

Ophion wrote: »

I've also cancelled my subscription for ESO+ until these issues get sorted out properly. I refuse to support a game that laughs of the issues for the mac client as a joke (like ZOS did on their ESO Live stream) and give almost no customer support or update on the topic when asked about it. That makes me feel like they don't value an entire client base, because if this would be an issue on the PC it would be so much more updated with dev responses. Sad to see really...

I was not aware that they actually laughed at the Mac OS consumer base on the live stream. That leaves an extremely bitter after taste without a doubt. I know I've already mentioned this, I was on a 3 months sub and I also recently cancelled my + membership. Guess the question now is how much money do they have to lose before they think they really have to start communicating with us better...

... well doing a better job with our game client in general, let's be honest. Because exactly as you stated, if this was happening on the PC client. It would be an absolutely nightmare for them.

dm_critic

For everyone cancelling their subs, I'd suggest also opening a support ticket on the issue and indicating it's why you're cancelling. I just got a notification that my ticket is getting escalated after I pointed out this thread and told ZOS I wasn't renewing, so we might just get it farther up the ladder if more people do the same.

Which isn't to say I won't get some canned response back from the next support level, but making a lot more noise doesn't hurt.

JJBoomer

to any of the people who are reporting that the issue is "solved" or "mostly solved"...

any reports that the mac client has been fixed by tuesday's patch, is actually just statistical error. 90+% of mac users are still unable to play, and nothing has been fixed. those whose performance improved ever so slightly, are just outliers and should not be counted.

also, I can't believe they laughed at the mac user base during a live stream. I mean, I can believe it. but the unprofessionalism, not to mention how crappy thats makes them as people. Wow.

can someone post that part of the livestream so we can have it for posterity if they try to deny that? maybe we can report them to BBB?

Montie

Here is the video, not sure they were necessarily laughing at Mac users but what do I know. It's about 7:50 into the video: