Relequen

MashmalloMan

LiquidPony wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

@LiquidPony if the rotation is 11-12 seconds based on PotL, Endless Hail and Caltrops, that should mean 3/12 giving you 75%, + casting backbar ults and human error you probably get closer to 65-70% uptime. If you use crit surge on a stam sorc or rune focus on stam plar that max 75% uptime changes from 60-66%.

Edit: For a stamplar ravager has to be the best set. That set gives 645 weapon dmg with 60% + uptime and hp bonus for dubious cameron throne users. Easy to buy gold jewelry for 70k (for me at the time) vs golding out jewelry for 220+k per piece.

Biarheart with max 66% uptime is probably closer to 60% in practice?

Briarheart affects all dmg (poison injection/ults) where as automaton doesn't. They are all probably VERY close to one another, but automaton forces you in to a 3 skill back bar rotation and a physical ult to get real value out of it.

If you like to run 4 skills on back bar with crit surge in some content or like me, enjoy using greater storm atronach (shock dmg), automaton seems like the lesser option vs briarheart. Briarheart also gives heals.

I won't bother with either with the 90+ % uptime on veiled, plus I already have the set. Will invest in golding the jewelry . AY is still great and probably the same dps as Veiled. I'd like to think with +8% weapon dmg in a group and the freedom to keep veiled on from range, vs being in melee range to proc AY, Veiled is more versatile. Remember in real boss fights. You need to run between positions when the boss moves or attacks. You will get less practical uptime with the x5 stack on AY then you would on being ranged and bar swapping with Veiled.

Oddly enough my best Veiled Heritance parse had the lowest uptime (82% versus most of the rest which were 89%), but that was due to some better crit rates elsewhere and probably some minor rotational inefficiencies.

Automaton was pretty consistently about 47-47.5k for me, the other pairings varied from 46.5-48.5 or so (on most of the Veiled parses where I got 82%, which is 4 procs on the 3mil, I was around 46.5-47k).

Will do more testing ... maybe level Vampirism and do them on the 6mil instead, but honestly I doubt there's a huge difference between any of the three in the end. Will need to level some things out as for instance the Automaton parse above had garbage crit on Ballista, which can make a pretty big difference. * After a bit of crit farming with Automaton I hit a 48.4k max.

I'd say my dps parses varied more so on a 3mil dummy then 6m, but on PTS it was more difficult to sustain without vampire for sure. Due to the fact that 3m parses are shorter, you're dealing with more RNG. Sets that only proc on front bar will appear to have a lower % uptime on a 3m dummy due to the fact that you spend the first 3 seconds on your backbar without the buffs before you get in to a real rotation. 3/60 is a larger percent then 3/120.

Consider this, if Automaton/Veiled/AY/Briarheart/Ravager all perform within 500 dps of each other on 45k+ parse. Which 1 has the most benefits besides dps in an actual fight.

Automaton: (Only Stamsorc/Stamplar)Static 5pc stat.

• - No free stat (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• + No RNG, active immediately on front bar.
• - Only physical DMG skills, not versatile.
• - 5pc Does not buff healing on Vigor, etc.
• - Only effective on front bar, does not carry to back bar. Must use 3 skills back bar to maximize uptime.
• +/- Farmed in group dungeon Darkshade 1/2.

Briarheart:10 sec buff/15 sec CD, procs 10% chance on only crit dmg

• + Free healing proc (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• + Easy/Medium to proc, carries to backbar.
• - Tied to CD, highest uptime possible will only be anything below 66%.
• + Can be purchased, over-world Wrothgar set.

Veiled Heritance:5 sec buff, 10% chance to proc on any dmg

• +/- Free physical resistance stat (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• + Easy to proc, carries to backbar. No CD.
• + Versatile, useful in fights like FG 2's final boss where you need to fight from range.
• + Can be purchased, over-world Auridon set.

Advancing Yokeda:5 sec buff/5 stacks, procs on any melee dmg.

• - No free stat (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• + Crit effects enchants/blade and blunt bleed proc.
• + Easy to proc, carries to backbar.
• - Without Relequen as melee dmg, need to be in melee range to build stacks.
• - Forced to use 3 skills back bar to keep max uptime, if you lose stacks, takes about 3+ sec to build again.
• - Farmed through Hel Ra Citadel trial, transmutation on jewelry required.

Ravager: (With Relequen change, best uptime w Stamplar)10 sec buff/10 sec CD, 8% chance to proc on only melee dmg

• + Free 1200 hp stat (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• - Hard to proc, carries to backbar.
• - Without Relequen as melee dmg, need to be in melee range to proc, any class but templar will have lower uptime.
• -/+ Very cheap to purchase, easily found gold jewelry myself, cyrodiil elite vendor set, transmutation required.

For me, veiled heritance has the most benefits if it has the same dps. IF is the thing though, Ravager can still be very useful to stamplar next patch as it was before Relequen ever existed. Briarheart always parses lower for me. Automaton doesn't work for my setup with Greater Storm Atro. Advancing Yokeda will be flat out annoying to keep up effectively. There will be more weapon dmg then live with minor brutality (10%) therefore I prefer weapon dmg over crit chance.

LiquidPony

Marshall1289 wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

Marshall1289 wrote: »

@LiquidPony if the rotation is 11-12 seconds based on PotL, Endless Hail and Caltrops, that should mean 3/12 giving you 75%, + casting backbar ults and human error you probably get closer to 65-70% uptime. If you use crit surge on a stam sorc or rune focus on stam plar that max 75% uptime changes from 60-66%.

Edit: For a stamplar ravager has to be the best set. That set gives 645 weapon dmg with 60% + uptime and hp bonus for dubious cameron throne users. Easy to buy gold jewelry for 70k (for me at the time) vs golding out jewelry for 220+k per piece.

Biarheart with max 66% uptime is probably closer to 60% in practice?

Briarheart affects all dmg (poison injection/ults) where as automaton doesn't. They are all probably VERY close to one another, but automaton forces you in to a 3 skill back bar rotation and a physical ult to get real value out of it.

If you like to run 4 skills on back bar with crit surge in some content or like me, enjoy using greater storm atronach (shock dmg), automaton seems like the lesser option vs briarheart. Briarheart also gives heals.

I won't bother with either with the 90+ % uptime on veiled, plus I already have the set. Will invest in golding the jewelry . AY is still great and probably the same dps as Veiled. I'd like to think with +8% weapon dmg in a group and the freedom to keep veiled on from range, vs being in melee range to proc AY, Veiled is more versatile. Remember in real boss fights. You need to run between positions when the boss moves or attacks. You will get less practical uptime with the x5 stack on AY then you would on being ranged and bar swapping with Veiled.

Oddly enough my best Veiled Heritance parse had the lowest uptime (82% versus most of the rest which were 89%), but that was due to some better crit rates elsewhere and probably some minor rotational inefficiencies.

Automaton was pretty consistently about 47-47.5k for me, the other pairings varied from 46.5-48.5 or so (on most of the Veiled parses where I got 82%, which is 4 procs on the 3mil, I was around 46.5-47k).

Will do more testing ... maybe level Vampirism and do them on the 6mil instead, but honestly I doubt there's a huge difference between any of the three in the end. Will need to level some things out as for instance the Automaton parse above had garbage crit on Ballista, which can make a pretty big difference. * After a bit of crit farming with Automaton I hit a 48.4k max.

I'd say my dps parses varied more so on a 3mil dummy then 6m, but on PTS it was more difficult to sustain without vampire for sure. Due to the fact that 3m parses are shorter, you're dealing with more RNG. Sets that only proc on front bar will appear to have a lower % uptime on a 3m dummy due to the fact that you spend the first 3 seconds on your backbar without the buffs before you get in to a real rotation. 3/60 is a larger percent then 3/120.

Consider this, if Automaton/Veiled/AY/Briarheart/Ravager all perform within 500 dps of each other on 45k+ parse. Which 1 has the most benefits besides dps in an actual fight.

Automaton: (Only Stamsorc/Stamplar)Static 5pc stat.

• - No free stat (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• + No RNG, active immediately on front bar.
• - Only physical DMG skills, not versatile.
• - 5pc Does not buff healing on Vigor, etc.
• - Only effective on front bar, does not carry to back bar. Must use 3 skills back bar to maximize uptime.
• +/- Farmed in group dungeon Darkshade 1/2.

Briarheart:10 sec buff/15 sec CD, procs 10% chance on only crit dmg

• + Free healing proc (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• + Easy/Medium to proc, carries to backbar.
• - Tied to CD, highest uptime possible will only be anything below 66%.
• + Can be purchased, over-world Wrothgar set.

Veiled Heritance:5 sec buff, 10% chance to proc on any dmg

• +/- Free physical resistance stat (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• + Easy to proc, carries to backbar. No CD.
• + Versatile, useful in fights like FG 2's final boss where you need to fight from range.
• + Can be purchased, over-world Auridon set.

Advancing Yokeda:5 sec buff/5 stacks, procs on any melee dmg.

• - No free stat (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• + Crit effects enchants/blade and blunt bleed proc.
• + Easy to proc, carries to backbar.
• - Without Relequen as melee dmg, need to be in melee range to build stacks.
• - Forced to use 3 skills back bar to keep max uptime, if you lose stacks, takes about 3+ sec to build again.
• - Farmed through Hel Ra Citadel trial, transmutation on jewelry required.

Ravager: (With Relequen change, best uptime w Stamplar)10 sec buff/10 sec CD, 8% chance to proc on only melee dmg

• + Free 1200 hp stat (if you consider same dps as other sets).
• - Hard to proc, carries to backbar.
• - Without Relequen as melee dmg, need to be in melee range to proc, any class but templar will have lower uptime.
• -/+ Very cheap to purchase, easily found gold jewelry myself, cyrodiil elite vendor set, transmutation required.

For me, veiled heritance has the most benefits if it has the same dps. IF is the thing though, Ravager can still be very useful to stamplar next patch as it was before Relequen ever existed. Briarheart always parses lower for me. Automaton doesn't work for my setup with Greater Storm Atro. Advancing Yokeda will be flat out annoying to keep up effectively. There will be more weapon dmg then live with minor brutality (10%) therefore I prefer weapon dmg over crit chance.

I'm not entirely sure I agree with this list of pros and cons as a whole. In particular, I think the Veiled Heritance 3-piece bonus is almost entirely useless and jewelry from that set has to be transmuted as well.

However, I'm not all that concerned with the difficulty of acquiring a set or the necessity to transmute it. And just speaking in terms of pure DPS/utility, if all of the sets are within ~500 DPS of each other in a solo parse, I'd probably go Advancing Yokeda > Briarheart > Veiled Heritance/Automaton/Ravager as my preference.

IMO Advancing Yokeda will scale better in raid, as the boost from Major Force with +2000 Weapon Critical (give or take, depending on the 2-4 piece crit bonuses on the set to which it is being compared) is fairly significant while the +40 weapon damage from Minor Brutality stacked on top of Veiled Heritance/Automaton (or 44 from Briarheart or 63 from Ravager) is going to be pretty hard to differentiate.

I'd take Briarheart second because, while not really *important*, the small heal does provide some utility that is entirely lacking in the other sets. So all else being equal, it is worth considering.

Anyway, I did a bunch of tests with Dubious on a 6mil (same setup as before aside from that) and also included Advancing Yokeda this time.

In this case here are the median parses for each set:

Automaton (46.6k median; 46.1k min; 47.3k max):


Briarheart (46.3k median; 45.5k min; 47.2k max):


Veiled Heritance (46.8k median; 46.1k min; 47.4k max):


Advancing Yokeda (48.1k median; 47.0k min; 48.6k max):


I also went back and did a single 3mil parse with bi-stat food using Advancing Yokeda to compare to the earlier 3mil parses:


At a glance I think I got a bit lucky on a few consecutive Advancing Yokeda 6mil parses (and a bit unlucky on a few Briarheart parses), so there's certainly much more testing to be done, but given the +10% crit damage bonus of a stamplar (the same would be true of a stamblade) it's not that surprising that AY comes out on top. I did about 6-10 parses with each set and discarded a few where I clearly made a mistake in the rotation (got a little tired at the end and started making mistakes), or a charge ran out, or my food ran out, etc.

Given that, for a stamplar (and presumably stamblade), I'd wager Advancing Yokeda is the meta going forward. I'm not sure what the other classes will prefer. Honestly there seems to be very little difference between them.

And also, I don't do a pure 3-skill backbar rotation on the stamplar regardless of set. I throw Blazing Spear on cooldown so the backbar is 3/4/5 skills depending on when Blazing Spear needs to be thrown and whether or not it's Ballista time.

Schattenfluegel

Automaton would be stronger on Stamsorc...maybe BiS on it, too.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Schattenfluegel wrote: »

Automaton would be stronger on Stamsorc...maybe BiS on it, too.

All these sets are within 1-2%, when properly played around but automaton is the weakest in my opinion, since it doesn't buff heals at all.

LiquidPony

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Schattenfluegel wrote: »

Automaton would be stronger on Stamsorc...maybe BiS on it, too.

All these sets are within 1-2%, when properly played around but automaton is the weakest in my opinion, since it doesn't buff heals at all.

I guess that judgement depends on what content you're playing ... if we're talking about "raid meta" then a buff to self-healing doesn't really matter to most people. Briarheart's passive healing is OK but buffing Vigor or whatever is basically irrelevant since most people really concerned with "the meta" aren't going to be running Vigor most of the time.

And none of these are really relevant for a stamsorc/stamplar in vMA since VO/NMG will still be the way to go.

As far as dungeons go ... I can't imagine anyone really being all that concerned with the very small difference. Use whatever.