PTS Update 20 - Feedback Thread for Wardens

TiZzA93

Yh would have been maybe 10k less with the PTS changes AND the bear not nerfed BUT like i mentioned the bear is unwant in any vet/hm trials etc anyway so the MAGwarden needs its own buff away from stam

MLGProPlayer

fierackas wrote: »

Problem is that with all the screaming about the shield nerfs this is being overlooked and wasn't even mentioned in the meeting notes.

ZOS has shown now for 15 months that they simply don't care about magicka warden.

TiZzA93

@ZOS_GinaBruno @Joy_Division @ZOS_Wrobel The easiest (i assume, im not a programmer etc) way they could buff Mag warden for DPS BALANCE without making stam even more OP wud be to change the magic damage and frost damage passive to spell damage and frost damage? That wud give warden healers a little buff to.

Drygon

I think you guys should move the buff from Advanced species to Piercing cold, that would balance magicka and stamina warden a bit. @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

fierackas

I'm guessing if no one uses the Bear anymore that would actually be a 33% drop?

WillParkinson

The change to Arctic Blast is ridiculous. I don't understand any of the 'logic' behind it, and the change to the bear makes even less sense.

WillParkinson

I suppose I should put this here...

I'm trying to test out the changes on the PTS in Stormhaven. I get up to a monster, but it doesn't react. When I attack, and it finally does, my abilities aren't highlighted, so I can't use any single target attacks on it. Then, if I try to move something from the bar, the game crashes on me.

WillParkinson

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

fierackas wrote: »

Problem is that with all the screaming about the shield nerfs this is being overlooked and wasn't even mentioned in the meeting notes.

ZOS has shown now for 15 months that they simply don't care about magicka warden.

They got your money, they're happy.

Drygon

I would like to see Arctic Blast lose the healing and get some dmg on impact along with the stun and dmg over time but they might not wanna go that way as we already have Swarm that is similar, and i bet they want to keep mechanics different from one tree to another. therefore i sugest:

Lower Swarm and all morph dmg by "X" and make them return "Y" of that DMG back as health to the caster. The DMG scales of Max magicka.

Remove heal from Arctic Blast, and add along with the stun DMG over time and make the projectile travel a bit faster. While i used it so far i find it a bit slow.

Alternative 1:

Revert the changes to Arctic Blast and implement the stun to another skill, like the second cast of Fetcher Infection so people will actually feel rewarded for using it. But at the same time this would mean an increase in the swarms traveling speed for it to be a viable stun.

Alternative 2:

Revert the changes to Arctic Blast and add the stun to Crystalized Slab. Make it so that It remain the same as it is only that when the ability ends or when all shields are destroyed it sends out a blast arround the character that stuns for "X" Seconds.

Make Fetcher infection instead of Dealing 50% more dmg on second cast, deal more dmg to targets under 50% HP.

Also, as i posted on this forum about the fact that Advanced Species is a buff for stamina warden more than for magicka warden and while i understand the idea, i still think that with the upcoming changes to evasion and to shields, and the buffs other classes recieved Icy Aura is also a great candidate to be reworked into a Frost DMG Interactive Passive
Shatter: When you deal critical frost direct damage to a Chilled target, it shatters receaving X DMG and gets debuffed with minor Breach and Minor Fracture for X seconds. This ability can proc once every X seconds.

There can be lots of ideas to balance magicka warden in a way that won't actually nerf him.

Please reconsider the current changes and help the MAGDEN fleshout.

To all wardens, we gotta keep giving this feedback and show them we are here!

Raise your voice for the cause! Save a Magden.

@ZOS_GinaBruno

Maura_Neysa

FFS ZoS
Arctic Blast, really? That' not where the stun belongs. Leave Arctic Blast alone or move the it to Base morph. Really though Crystallized Slab is where it belonged. This would force the choice between Major Heroism or Stun, both very good. The instant heal morph of Embrace would also have been a good option, or Frozen Retreat

The Bear, Warden DPS is already low and you nerf its highest DPS Skill????

Swarm, this was already a blaah skill and it gets nerfed? If you want to penalize double casting, just make the damage grow, like Hurricane. Then people wont double cast it.

Falcon, wtf just buff the duration. BoP 24second with 12sec of Breserk, Deceptive 24 sec of all 3 buffs. You already buffed Deceptive to balance for the weaker (5% vs 8%) buff but now you go back to them being same again?

But hey at least there is some positives.
- Screaming now synergies with Fissure.
- Sorch wont be a DPS loss anymore.
- Slotting an AC skill over a Fighters guild skill will be worth it.
- The Netch might make it so we can afford a non Balance build. (dont think I didnt notice you slipped in another arbitrary "Fixed the graphics of this skill" note.
- Maturation is now a true group buff.
- #EmbracetheBear

In general it feels like rather than actually trying to balance you just through in Chaos in hopes we will complain about something new.....

Maura_Neysa

Also, as i posted on this forum about the fact that Advanced Species is a buff for stamina warden more than for magicka warden and while i understand the idea, i still think that with the upcoming changes to evasion and to shields, and the buffs other classes recieved Icy Aura is also a great candidate to be reworked into a Frost DMG Interactive Passive
Shatter: When you deal critical frost direct damage to a Chilled target, it shatters receaving X DMG and gets debuffed with minor Breach and Minor Fracture for X seconds. This ability can proc once every X seconds.
[/quote]

How is Advanced Species a bigger buff to StamDen when Mag can run every skill in the tree effectively while StamDen cannot

Drygon

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

Also, as i posted on this forum about the fact that Advanced Species is a buff for stamina warden more than for magicka warden and while i understand the idea, i still think that with the upcoming changes to evasion and to shields, and the buffs other classes recieved Icy Aura is also a great candidate to be reworked into a Frost DMG Interactive Passive
Shatter: When you deal critical frost direct damage to a Chilled target, it shatters receaving X DMG and gets debuffed with minor Breach and Minor Fracture for X seconds. This ability can proc once every X seconds.

How is Advanced Species a bigger buff to StamDen when Mag can run every skill in the tree effectively while StamDen cannot[/quote]

The way it works now in pvp Magden can run 2 if 3 of those skills so that is a 3% dmg increase(9 instead of 6). We get the netch 40% buff and the Bird of pray constant but so do stamdens, while Magicka wardens have bigger issues seeing as we got no execute and only one stun. So 3% to magicka wardens is still the middlefinger.

Stamina wardens have acces to aoe execute from weapon skill and CC +execute from two handed+ CC from shield. Magicka wardens have snares and slows but no stun. (i do not count permafrost as both wardens use it)

Stamina warden is a strong class in pvp and in pve, and it is even stronger now with the cost reduction of the Pidgeon and the Increase of Advanced species as now it is a good idea to slot it, a long raged spammable on a otherwise melee character that also heals and increases 3% dmg...

Not to say that with the upcoming changes to evasion, Magden woo uses a lot fo AOE gets anotehr big hit unlike Stamden.(that gets hit too but not as much as Magden)

They need to buff Warden in a manner that will only affect the magicka version.

fierackas

Drygon wrote: »

Stamina wardens have acces to aoe execute from weapon skill and CC +execute from two handed+ CC from shield. Magicka wardens have snares and slows but no stun. (i do not count permafrost as both wardens use it)

Eh? How does this make Stam Wardens good in PVE? It seems a lot of people are blinded by Stam Wardens performance in PVP and mistakenly think this makes them good in PVE

Drygon

fierackas wrote: »

Drygon wrote: »

Stamina wardens have acces to aoe execute from weapon skill and CC +execute from two handed+ CC from shield. Magicka wardens have snares and slows but no stun. (i do not count permafrost as both wardens use it)

Eh? How does this make Stam Wardens good in PVE? It seems a lot of people are blinded by Stam Wardens performance in PVP and mistakenly think this makes them good in PVE

I specified that i was talking about pvp. I started with "The way it works now in pvp..."

Even without the buff to Advanced Species this patch still would provide a buff to stamina warden too in PVE and in PVP. I am more concerned about Magicka and Stamina beeing balanced in PVP, and that Magicka Warden gets fleshed out, to that exctent i belive the changes proposed are sensible.

fierackas

Ah sorry I missed that. TBH I don't give a **** about PVP, I dabble but its not the mainstay of my playing time. Really they need to rethink things and allow characters to develop a PVP branch of skills separate from PVE or maybe have the skills they do have work differently when the toon enters Cyro/BG

Drygon

fierackas wrote: »

Ah sorry I missed that. TBH I don't give a **** about PVP, I dabble but its not the mainstay of my playing time. Really they need to rethink things and allow characters to develop a PVP branch of skills separate from PVE or maybe have the skills they do have work differently when the toon enters Cyro/BG

That has been sayed for years. Doubd they will do it.

From what PVE i do i am happy that i can clear the content but i do know that there are people out there who try to push fast times or scores and for them changes made to balance out PVP might be a hindrance but as it is now, pvp is in a more dire state.

My first toons were stamina and now i play only magicka as i like the roleplay of a mage. Magicka classes have some problems that they adresses this patch (our stamina management via sprint cost reduction). Using stamina to sprint and be unable to break free off CC. Other classes have easy to acces stuns unlike warden.

Magicka warden has no stun that he can activate to create a window on demand and *** execute ability (bear is a joke can't get to the target). At the curent state we are forced to group play.

Maura_Neysa

Drygon wrote: »

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

Also, as i posted on this forum about the fact that Advanced Species is a buff for stamina warden more than for magicka warden and while i understand the idea, i still think that with the upcoming changes to evasion and to shields, and the buffs other classes recieved Icy Aura is also a great candidate to be reworked into a Frost DMG Interactive Passive
Shatter: When you deal critical frost direct damage to a Chilled target, it shatters receaving X DMG and gets debuffed with minor Breach and Minor Fracture for X seconds. This ability can proc once every X seconds.

How is Advanced Species a bigger buff to StamDen when Mag can run every skill in the tree effectively while StamDen cannot

The way it works now in pvp Magden can run 2 if 3 of those skills so that is a 3% dmg increase(9 instead of 6). We get the netch 40% buff and the Bird of pray constant but so do stamdens, while Magicka wardens have bigger issues seeing as we got no execute and only one stun. So 3% to magicka wardens is still the middlefinger.

Stamina wardens have acces to aoe execute from weapon skill and CC +execute from two handed+ CC from shield. Magicka wardens have snares and slows but no stun. (i do not count permafrost as both wardens use it)

Stamina warden is a strong class in pvp and in pve, and it is even stronger now with the cost reduction of the Pidgeon and the Increase of Advanced species as now it is a good idea to slot it, a long raged spammable on a otherwise melee character that also heals and increases 3% dmg...

Not to say that with the upcoming changes to evasion, Magden woo uses a lot fo AOE gets anotehr big hit unlike Stamden.(that gets hit too but not as much as Magden)

They need to buff Warden in a manner that will only affect the magicka version.

PvP MagDen run Swarm, no StamDen does. Also Dive is not a common StamDen skill either. So StamDen is getting a 2% buff because of BoP and Sub, MagDen is getting a 4% buff because of Fissure, Swarm, SCR, and BoP

Maura_Neysa

fierackas wrote: »

Drygon wrote: »

Stamina wardens have acces to aoe execute from weapon skill and CC +execute from two handed+ CC from shield. Magicka wardens have snares and slows but no stun. (i do not count permafrost as both wardens use it)

Eh? How does this make Stam Wardens good in PVE? It seems a lot of people are blinded by Stam Wardens performance in PVP and mistakenly think this makes them good in PVE

Well actually in DragonBones it was the seconded highest DPS class, behind only StamBlades 🤷🏻‍♀️

Drygon

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

Drygon wrote: »

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

Also, as i posted on this forum about the fact that Advanced Species is a buff for stamina warden more than for magicka warden and while i understand the idea, i still think that with the upcoming changes to evasion and to shields, and the buffs other classes recieved Icy Aura is also a great candidate to be reworked into a Frost DMG Interactive Passive
Shatter: When you deal critical frost direct damage to a Chilled target, it shatters receaving X DMG and gets debuffed with minor Breach and Minor Fracture for X seconds. This ability can proc once every X seconds.

How is Advanced Species a bigger buff to StamDen when Mag can run every skill in the tree effectively while StamDen cannot

The way it works now in pvp Magden can run 2 if 3 of those skills so that is a 3% dmg increase(9 instead of 6). We get the netch 40% buff and the Bird of pray constant but so do stamdens, while Magicka wardens have bigger issues seeing as we got no execute and only one stun. So 3% to magicka wardens is still the middlefinger.

Stamina wardens have acces to aoe execute from weapon skill and CC +execute from two handed+ CC from shield. Magicka wardens have snares and slows but no stun. (i do not count permafrost as both wardens use it)

Stamina warden is a strong class in pvp and in pve, and it is even stronger now with the cost reduction of the Pidgeon and the Increase of Advanced species as now it is a good idea to slot it, a long raged spammable on a otherwise melee character that also heals and increases 3% dmg...

Not to say that with the upcoming changes to evasion, Magden woo uses a lot fo AOE gets anotehr big hit unlike Stamden.(that gets hit too but not as much as Magden)

They need to buff Warden in a manner that will only affect the magicka version.

PvP MagDen run Swarm, no StamDen does. Also Dive is not a common StamDen skill either. So StamDen is getting a 2% buff because of BoP and Sub, MagDen is getting a 4% buff because of Fissure, Swarm, SCR, and BoP

It is as MAx a 3% as one of the skills needs to be on backbar for passive regeneration bonus ( most slot Netch, i slot swarm backbar).

At its curent value the Pidgeon in PVP is good for snipe type gameplay or executing running targets, that is good for a class that has no ranged attacks but for Magden Crushing shock makes more sense in PVP.

Lets say some Use the Pidgeon instead of Crushing shock and decide to get rid of all their defensive on the mainbar just to slot for that dmg % increase, they will indeed get a 4% bonus (other skill most likely is innerlight) but that will make for a bad pvp build without much versatility.

At most Magden can get a 3% DMG increase on mainbar and 1% more on Backbar, but from my personal experience, and i want to point out again, PERSONAL experience, most of the times me and the other Magdens i've talked to in the game use 2 Animal companions Skills on the mainbar most of the time, in certain situation three of them.

I try to avoid the pooping bugs as much as possible as that animation is just plain lazy and seeing as it is melee range it feels way too much as stamina when you play with it.

Magden needs his own playstyle way different from the stamina one, that is why we need buff to frost dmg, so the Cryomancer playstyle gets more fleshed out.

DanteYoda

They could always add a larger dot to leeching vines?

Maura_Neysa

Well that’s the end of Falcon. Can’t get Berserk/Evasion in both bars and Expedition isn’t worth the cost

_Ahala_

BIRD OF PREY NERF IS ABSOLUTELY UNACCEPTABLE!!!!! Has zos completely lost it? That expedition buff uptime was one of the only things Magden had going for it... Magden was already underperforming to the point of extinction and they went ahead and destroyed another class skill in ways unimaginable

TiZzA93

HAHAHA WTF ARE ZOS DOING

so they buff sustain which we have plenty of already then just keep nerfing and changing the skills we use

weedgenius

I honestly am speechless at this point. Clearly what Wardens needed was a new nerf. Just mind boggling.

_Ahala_

weedgenius wrote: »

I honestly am speechless at this point. Clearly what Wardens needed was a new nerf. Just mind boggling.

I know right... Magden was so bad for the last year that I was optimistic for this patch... You see I didn’t think it could get any worse... Man was I wrong... This patch is amazing, and not in a good way

MLGProPlayer

Immortal bear is a good change (and long overdue). This means that the eternal guardian morph needs a new effect though.

LeHarrt91

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Immortal bear is a good change (and long overdue). This means that the eternal guardian morph needs a new effect though.

Finn said the Bear can still die in overland pve (world bosses etc) and solo arenas like Maelstrom. So the morph is apparently "still useful"

_Ahala_

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Immortal bear is a good change (and long overdue). This means that the eternal guardian morph needs a new effect though.

Finn said the Bear can still die in overland pve (world bosses etc) and solo arenas like Maelstrom. So the morph is apparently "still useful"

Not to meantion PvP

LeHarrt91

So the Eternal Guardian morph on the Bear, needs something additional. I understand that in overland content, Solo Arenas and pvp it will still die and respawn. But in trials, dungeons and group arenas this morph does nothing for a Magicka Warden with the new change to pets.

make its 10 ulti cheaper or something in additonal to respawn. or grant a defensive buff when activated.

Maura_Neysa

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

So the Eternal Guardian morph on the Bear, needs something additional. I understand that in overland content, Solo Arenas and pvp it will still die and respawn. But in trials, dungeons and group arenas this morph does nothing for a Magicka Warden with the new change to pets.

make its 10 ulti cheaper or something in additonal to respawn. or grant a defensive buff when activated.

Single Bar with room for Destro Ulti