Fake tank or fake healer, which is best?

LadyNalcarya

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Healers arent nessesary in vet dungeons. I'm a healer main and I'm sad about this, but I see "LFM for pledges/motif farming/whatever, 3 dd run" all the time and I tanked quite a few of those runs... And yeah, usually it means "3dds+1tank".
Tanks can improve group damage by stacking enemies in one place and blocking heavy hits (so the dds can focus on dpsing). Attacking a static target means more dps and the majority of vet dlc mechanics are oneshots anyway, so having a tank in the team is more useful.
This is very unfortunate, in my opinion. Even in Dark Souls level 1 challenge runs you dont get oneshotted that much, and I personally think that oneshot galore is the definition of artificial difficulty. And not only that, they make the healers less desirable, because oneshots cant be healed and with more dps you'll have less of them...

P.S. Yeah, I know, oneshots can be prevented by following mechanics etc. But ZOS netcode is a bit wonky, as we all know, and not all players have ideal ping/reaction time/etc.

ArchMikem

Daus wrote: »

Healers are almost always useless. 12-man trials on vet are the only exception.

Well someone talked their way out of a War Horn and Combat Prayer with Spell Power Cure. Hmph!

LadyNalcarya

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

ArchMikem wrote: »

Daus wrote: »

Healers are almost always useless. 12-man trials on vet are the only exception.

Well someone talked their way out of a War Horn and Combat Prayer with Spell Power Cure. Hmph!

Those are nice, but a magblade will do more damage + almost the same healing...
In dungeons, that is, but still.

firedrgn

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

I can self heal tanks are worth their weight in gold.

D0PAMINE

Guppet wrote: »

D0PAMINE wrote: »

Ehh idc, Im used to healing or tanking on a dps toon.

If your healing or tanking your a healer or a tank, not fake. Fake is queuing for a role and not performing the role. No ones saying you can’t be a crappy tank or healer.

If you taunt and stay alive, your a tank. If you herd the mobs and buff, your a decent one.

If you heal, your a healer, if you supply resources and put out some dps too, your a good one.

Just because your not optimised to be a good tank or healer, doesn’t not mean you can’t tank or heal.

I’m fact most tanks and healers started off pretty crappy at it too.

If your regularly queueing as tank or heal and being bad at it, chances are you’ll actually start to understand it and start to get better. You may not intend to get better, as you see yourself as a fake in that role, but you will. You’ll find yourself wanting to try out leash, Warhorn, caltrops etc and see if they do make a difference.

The first step is performing another role, regardless of how badly. Your not fake at all, just inexperienced at it.

What i ment was that im usually stuck being a makeshift tank(slot a taunt only, so everyone can aoe mobs) or healer because someone queued as tank/healer and was a dps, but im so used to it now it's meh. I didnt realize how vague my previous post was until I re read it.

kargen27

Guppet wrote: »

Kuwhar wrote: »

As someone who plays both only healer and tank, this poll triggers me

Lol it’s ok the situation triggers me too. I tank so I only ever get fake healers. I’m good at self healing though.

This is kind of a service for those that insist on queuing as a fake role, so they know which role to fake, to annoy the least people, since they are going to do it anyway, what with being selfish asses.

The problem being people who are going to go in with a fake role usually have all three options checked.

G1Countdown

Your poll is bad. You only give an option for two extremes. And, both extremes are awful.

DanteYoda

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Fake tanks can't kill anything so at least fake healers can heal others doing content..

JobooAGS

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

At least with a fake healer, you can use self heals and stay alive (though usually with a reduction of individial dps due to an extra gcd wasted on using such a self heal. With a fake tank, it usually leads to wipes

Kadoin

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Only an idiot doesn't put at least one self-heal on their bar.

ihazzit

kargen27 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Kuwhar wrote: »

As someone who plays both only healer and tank, this poll triggers me

Lol it’s ok the situation triggers me too. I tank so I only ever get fake healers. I’m good at self healing though.

This is kind of a service for those that insist on queuing as a fake role, so they know which role to fake, to annoy the least people, since they are going to do it anyway, what with being selfish asses.

The problem being people who are going to go in with a fake role usually have all three options checked.

The first time I was involved in a group dungeon setting was when I had a low level guildmate that was wanting to go into nCoH and so I took him through it and then he wanted to add a friend to go through a normal dungeon as a healer to learn how to improve but we couldn't get a fourth so we had to pug and got a fake tank in nCoA1. It turned out the fake tank only wanted to get a specific sunderflame one-handed weapon and was queuing as all 3 roles. He convinced my guildmate to give him crown so that after the first burn-through of CoA he went right back to it for the purpose of the weapon. My guildmate stepped afk for a sec and the fake tank vote to kick him and told us all to queue as all 3 roles to get another player asap but the guildmate came back quick enough and we went through CoA again so fast the other 2 players were just lost - both runs I had to rez them a few times and I was a dd. I told them he was a fake tank but they decided to go through CoA one more time with him because he was begging for them to help him and they said ok so I helped out. After the 3rd run the rest of us quit because it was ridiculous but I got the weapon he was wanting. I didn't tell him I had it and deconned it later.

max_only

I’d rather have a fake tank and real healer

I only ever play the tank or the healer. I’m glad to see that people appreciate tanks.

It’s sad people are saying they don’t need healers. I’d rather have a great healer and a dps with a taunt than a great tank and no heals in a pug. Pugs need healers to cover their asses when they make mistakes.

mocap

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

I'm a fake healer. I main a DPS Templar and I queue as healer 100% of the time. Healers are almost never needed, and in the rare event that they are, I know it's my responsibility to shift gears and fulfill the role as needed.

The REAL problem is not fakes, but fakes who can't or won't fulfill their role when needed.

same. Awesome Puryfing light do nice damage as well as big HoT (close combat though). Mutagen prefight and BoL for "wtf are you standing in that red circle???" situations ) Anything else is my humble 20-25k dps.

TheGr8David

I main a Tank, so this is what makes me mad. I'd be more okay with it if they would tell me that they're not a healer when the dungeon starts, instead of me having to find out on the boss, when I have no self-heals slotted.

adeptusminor wrote: »

Generally speaking, I prefer a fake healer since I can heal myself if needed. I don't mind fake tanks either, honestly. What I do mind is when fake tanks/real tanks drag the bosses around and out of my aoes murdering my dps And yes, even real tanks do that sometimes, although generally it's while they are learning, so I don't mention it or give them any grief, but it's still mildly irritating lol. And yeah, like mentioned above, the debuffs gotten by a real tank substantially increase dps, so that's always preferred.

edit: I've noticed a lot of healers in 4 man content don't realize or don't care to equip a destro backbar, providing ele drain for magicka dps increasing their dps, and increasing overall group dps by throwng down their own blockade, so the ele drain is something I usually provide myself anyway.

^I've heard of other tanks doing this, and I'm sorry it happens. I say give them grief for it. These are the same tanks who off tank for MoL and thinks it's okay to taunt Rahkkhat off the platform.

FrancisCrawford

I always queue as healer, so for me fake tank is the only possibility.

That said, I don't understand why anybody would fake heal, at least among magicka characters. Destro/resto works for all classes.

mocap wrote: »

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

I'm a fake healer. I main a DPS Templar and I queue as healer 100% of the time. Healers are almost never needed, and in the rare event that they are, I know it's my responsibility to shift gears and fulfill the role as needed.

The REAL problem is not fakes, but fakes who can't or won't fulfill their role when needed.

same. Awesome Puryfing light do nice damage as well as big HoT (close combat though). Mutagen prefight and BoL for "wtf are you standing in that red circle???" situations ) Anything else is my humble 20-25k dps.

On a templar I'm more of a healer than that. Shards is in my DPS rotation, and it's the Shards morph. I wear SPC. Etc. But it's the same general idea. Often I heal a group and turn out to have done 40%+ of the DPS as well.

alainjbrennanb16_ESO

no third option stop them queuing unless correct role

Runefang

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

I can I can self heal on all my toons if required. I can't suddenly tank.

Still, if its a normal I hope they're both fake with high dps.

mocap

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Imo, current list of non dlc vet dungeons where real healer is needed:
- Darkshade Caverns 2: big-ass netch, last boss
- Banished Cells 2: last boss, especially hard mode

WuffyCerulei

I’d rather have a fake tank and real healer

Fake healers irritate me the most. I can deal with a fake tank, but if there's no healer to heal people... I can heal myelf, but a vast majority of pugs won't have heals.

On the side note, fake tanks and healers are why I don't pug dungeons.

Tasear

This poll is sad.

Numerikuu

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Guppet wrote: »

Numerikuu wrote: »

Other: Depends on the dungeon and difficulty.

You do understand that other is not an option for a reason? You have to choose which you would rather live with. If you can’t do that, your choice is useless.

If someone offers you vanilla or strawberry shake, you don’t get another option. Just because you’d prefer another option, does not mean one exists.

There's always another option~ It's called vote kick. Nobody should have to put up with a liar, though once again it depends on the dungeon or difficulty. Some places don't really need healers. Some don't need proper tanks. But over half need both.

But just to humor you, I'll go with fake healer.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

G1Countdown wrote: »

Your poll is bad. You only give an option for two extremes. And, both extremes are awful.

That’s the whole point. You have to choose which of the two bad options you’d rather.

Your capable of choosing. If you were kidnapped and they said we are cutting off an arm or a leg, you choose, then you’d choose. Same concept. No third option, just two bad ones, but which do you take if you have to take one.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Numerikuu wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Numerikuu wrote: »

Other: Depends on the dungeon and difficulty.

You do understand that other is not an option for a reason? You have to choose which you would rather live with. If you can’t do that, your choice is useless.

If someone offers you vanilla or strawberry shake, you don’t get another option. Just because you’d prefer another option, does not mean one exists.

There's always another option~ It's called vote kick. Nobody should have to put up with a liar, though once again it depends on the dungeon or difficulty. Some places don't really need healers. Some don't need proper tanks. But over half need both.

But just to humor you, I'll go with fake healer.

Thank you

JobooAGS

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Guppet wrote: »

G1Countdown wrote: »

Your poll is bad. You only give an option for two extremes. And, both extremes are awful.

That’s the whole point. You have to choose which of the two bad options you’d rather.

Your capable of choosing. If you were kidnapped and they said we are cutting off an arm or a leg, you choose, then you’d choose. Same concept. No third option, just two bad ones, but which do you take if you have to take one.

Under your example def death. As a result, for the op, if it is a hard vet, then vote to kick. If is an easy one or a normal, I wouldn't care

BejaProphet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

I think the ideal healer in a dungeon is already a hybrid heal/DPS imo. But I am a believer that these 3 or 4 man DD groups aren't the best. I want a real tank, two solid DD, and a healer who is capable of both DPS and heals. But I do nothing but PUG so that may shape my thinking a lot.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

JobooAGS wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

G1Countdown wrote: »

Your poll is bad. You only give an option for two extremes. And, both extremes are awful.

That’s the whole point. You have to choose which of the two bad options you’d rather.

Your capable of choosing. If you were kidnapped and they said we are cutting off an arm or a leg, you choose, then you’d choose. Same concept. No third option, just two bad ones, but which do you take if you have to take one.

Under your example def death. As a result, for the op, if it is a hard vet, then vote to kick. If is an easy one or a normal, I wouldn't care

Ok now choose, either your arm or your leg, failure means they kill everyone you love. Still choose neither option?

Well thank you for voting anyway.

I dont like either option either.

I know your saying you always have a choice and yeah you can kick or leave. It’s just a bit of fun though, if you have to have one.

Hopefully it helps let people see which is more acceptable and who knows even the devs may see it and think, are healers really that useless, but they have been told that so so many times.

This is the the only game where it feels tank and healer are not actual roles, just support to make DPS feel even better.

Seems mechanics are unhealable oneshots or DPS checks.

Aurielle

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

I use a DPS/Healer hybrid when queued for pug dungeons, as I usually have to carry the DDs (who often can only cobble about 15k DPS between the two of them) and frequently have to save their butts when they stand in red/neglect mechanics/etc. When grouped with guild mates, 1 tank & 3 DDs is the way to go.

JobooAGS

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Guppet wrote: »

JobooAGS wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

G1Countdown wrote: »

Your poll is bad. You only give an option for two extremes. And, both extremes are awful.

That’s the whole point. You have to choose which of the two bad options you’d rather.

Your capable of choosing. If you were kidnapped and they said we are cutting off an arm or a leg, you choose, then you’d choose. Same concept. No third option, just two bad ones, but which do you take if you have to take one.

Under your example def death. As a result, for the op, if it is a hard vet, then vote to kick. If is an easy one or a normal, I wouldn't care

Ok now choose, either your arm or your leg, failure means they kill everyone you love. Still choose neither option?

Well thank you for voting anyway.

I dont like either option either.

I know your saying you always have a choice and yeah you can kick or leave. It’s just a bit of fun though, if you have to have one.

Hopefully it helps let people see which is more acceptable and who knows even the devs may see it and think, are healers really that useless, but they have been told that so so many times.

This is the the only game where it feels tank and healer are not actual roles, just support to make DPS feel even better.

Seems mechanics are unhealable oneshots or DPS checks.

Kill them or die trying, otherwise *** the world

JobooAGS

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Guppet wrote: »

JobooAGS wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

G1Countdown wrote: »

Your poll is bad. You only give an option for two extremes. And, both extremes are awful.

That’s the whole point. You have to choose which of the two bad options you’d rather.

Your capable of choosing. If you were kidnapped and they said we are cutting off an arm or a leg, you choose, then you’d choose. Same concept. No third option, just two bad ones, but which do you take if you have to take one.

Under your example def death. As a result, for the op, if it is a hard vet, then vote to kick. If is an easy one or a normal, I wouldn't care

Ok now choose, either your arm or your leg, failure means they kill everyone you love. Still choose neither option?

Well thank you for voting anyway.

I dont like either option either.

I know your saying you always have a choice and yeah you can kick or leave. It’s just a bit of fun though, if you have to have one.

Hopefully it helps let people see which is more acceptable and who knows even the devs may see it and think, are healers really that useless, but they have been told that so so many times.

This is the the only game where it feels tank and healer are not actual roles, just support to make DPS feel even better.

Seems mechanics are unhealable oneshots or DPS checks.

But it is a good poll, op. It can tell us which role is more easily compensated too

Serjustin19

I'm not real, if I'm fake