Fake tank or fake healer, which is best?

BuyMe500Pugs_Please

I’d rather have a fake tank and real healer

I just use group dungeon finder for dungeons, from my experience being the healer the majority of those would have ended badly if i was a fake healer instead. The tank wouldn't have been able to keep the dps alive whilst they stand in every single red area, again this is purely based on randoms lol, i imagine things are a lot smoother in a familiar group.

zaria

kargen27 wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Kuwhar wrote: »

As someone who plays both only healer and tank, this poll triggers me

Lol it’s ok the situation triggers me too. I tank so I only ever get fake healers. I’m good at self healing though.

This is kind of a service for those that insist on queuing as a fake role, so they know which role to fake, to annoy the least people, since they are going to do it anyway, what with being selfish asses.

The problem being people who are going to go in with a fake role usually have all three options checked.

And for some weird reason, even real healers sometimes has DD / heal, now the problem is then you get put in front of queue and get in as DD. Both used mutagen before first trash pull. I said I only had healer gear on templar so he switched to DD.

And as healer you feel an fake tank even in an normal dungeon, no that is not an issue in an normal as long as the guy do decent damage but far to often they do tank level dps.

Also flexibility, yes its a bit easier on pc as you can change layout with an hotkey, for healer this is easy as you are magic focused can easy move from being an DD with heals to an trial healer. For tanks its mostly about the annoying bosses like DS2 or direfrost who can not be tanked.

idk

ArchMikem wrote: »

Daus wrote: »

Healers are almost always useless. 12-man trials on vet are the only exception.

Well someone talked their way out of a War Horn and Combat Prayer with Spell Power Cure. Hmph!

And I have cleared a number of vet dungeons in HM without a healer. If the group can manage the mechancs well and tank care of themselves they are not needed.

Though that is not the case with every group and in many of the vet dungeons the tank is voluntary or does not really need to be a full tank.

Merlin13KAGL

Biased poll is biased.

Completion capable or not, I'd rather both get banned from using the group finder for a period of time if they're blatantly *** the queue.

Unless you're new to the role, do the *** job you signed up for.

Guppet wrote: »

Numerikuu wrote: »

Other: Depends on the dungeon and difficulty.

You do understand that other is not an option for a reason? You have to choose which you would rather live with. If you can’t do that, your choice is useless.

If someone offers you vanilla or strawberry shake, you don’t get another option. Just because you’d prefer another option, does not mean one exists.

You have the option to go to another restaurant or find a competent server.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Biased poll is biased.

Completion capable or not, I'd rather both get banned from using the group finder for a period of time if they're blatantly *** the queue.

Unless you're new to the role, do the *** job you signed up for.

Guppet wrote: »

Numerikuu wrote: »

Other: Depends on the dungeon and difficulty.

You do understand that other is not an option for a reason? You have to choose which you would rather live with. If you can’t do that, your choice is useless.

If someone offers you vanilla or strawberry shake, you don’t get another option. Just because you’d prefer another option, does not mean one exists.

You have the option to go to another restaurant or find a competent server.

Do you know what biased means?

The poll is not biased, it just doesn’t include an option you would like.

By all means do your own poll and include options that everyone would like. The poll will be useless then though. Being all inclusive doesn’t nescaserrily help in these days of political inclusion just for the sake of it.

Heck I’ll even vote in it for you, since I’d rather help than argue, just for the sake of it.

Everyone else gets it. It’s about which role can be compensated for more easily. Luckily it shows fairly clearly.

Biased means skewed to a set angle. That is what bias is. The poll is not biased.

I’ve been fairly clear all along with my dislike for anyone queuing as a fake role.

Knaxia

I would say it depends. If the player/group is high level and skilled and know what they're doing , I would say it's fine. I mostly run on my healer and I've seen a couple DPS come in as tank, but most of them warned it as they got in, I didn't mind and most runs went smooth.

I've seen worse "real tanks" come in than "fake tanks" in my runs so it's a fair trade.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Knaxia wrote: »

I would say it depends. If the player/group is high level and skilled and know what they're doing , I would say it's fine. I mostly run on my healer and I've seen a couple DPS come in as tank, but most of them warned it as they got in, I didn't mind and most runs went smooth.

I've seen worse "real tanks" come in than "fake tanks" in my runs so it's a fair trade.

So many people have never played “would you rather”.

Merlin13KAGL

Guppet wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Biased poll is biased.

Completion capable or not, I'd rather both get banned from using the group finder for a period of time if they're blatantly *** the queue.

Unless you're new to the role, do the *** job you signed up for.

Guppet wrote: »

Numerikuu wrote: »

Other: Depends on the dungeon and difficulty.

You do understand that other is not an option for a reason? You have to choose which you would rather live with. If you can’t do that, your choice is useless.

If someone offers you vanilla or strawberry shake, you don’t get another option. Just because you’d prefer another option, does not mean one exists.

You have the option to go to another restaurant or find a competent server.

Do you know what biased means?

The poll is not biased, it just doesn’t include an option you would like.

By all means do your own poll and include options that everyone would like. The poll will be useless then though. Being all inclusive doesn’t nescaserrily help in these days of political inclusion just for the sake of it.

Heck I’ll even vote in it for you, since I’d rather help than argue, just for the sake of it.

Everyone else gets it. It’s about which role can be compensated for more easily. Luckily it shows fairly clearly.

Biased means skewed to a set angle. That is what bias is. The poll is not biased.

I’ve been fairly clear all along with my dislike for anyone queuing as a fake role.

Except those are not the only options.

Perhaps limited, skewed would be better choice of terminology?

Neither should have to be compensated for (unless the person is new and learning, which is different than fake.)

It's like asking would you rather get hit by a truck full of cement bags or truck full of bricks.

Personally, I'd rather not get hit by a truck at all. Option 3.

You offer limited, exclusive options from a larger available set of possibilities.

Ergo: Bias.

FWIW: By your definition, I could make a poll with a single option (just not including all the others you would like) and it would not be biased.

Do you see the flaw in that line of thinking?

Knaxia

Guppet wrote: »

Knaxia wrote: »

I would say it depends. If the player/group is high level and skilled and know what they're doing , I would say it's fine. I mostly run on my healer and I've seen a couple DPS come in as tank, but most of them warned it as they got in, I didn't mind and most runs went smooth.

I've seen worse "real tanks" come in than "fake tanks" in my runs so it's a fair trade.

So many people have never played “would you rather”.

Ne need to be hostile. I'm just giving out my opinion since I almost never run as another role than healer and I'm just talking experience after reading most replies. This is just a forums, if you think my reply wasn't "needed", then yours wasn't as needed as it didn't grant anything to the discussion.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Biased poll is biased.

Completion capable or not, I'd rather both get banned from using the group finder for a period of time if they're blatantly *** the queue.

Unless you're new to the role, do the *** job you signed up for.

Guppet wrote: »

Numerikuu wrote: »

Other: Depends on the dungeon and difficulty.

You do understand that other is not an option for a reason? You have to choose which you would rather live with. If you can’t do that, your choice is useless.

If someone offers you vanilla or strawberry shake, you don’t get another option. Just because you’d prefer another option, does not mean one exists.

You have the option to go to another restaurant or find a competent server.

Do you know what biased means?

The poll is not biased, it just doesn’t include an option you would like.

By all means do your own poll and include options that everyone would like. The poll will be useless then though. Being all inclusive doesn’t nescaserrily help in these days of political inclusion just for the sake of it.

Heck I’ll even vote in it for you, since I’d rather help than argue, just for the sake of it.

Everyone else gets it. It’s about which role can be compensated for more easily. Luckily it shows fairly clearly.

Biased means skewed to a set angle. That is what bias is. The poll is not biased.

I’ve been fairly clear all along with my dislike for anyone queuing as a fake role.

Except those are not the only options.

Perhaps limited, skewed would be better choice of terminology?

Neither should have to be compensated for (unless the person is new and learning, which is different than fake.)

It's like asking would you rather get hit by a truck full of cement bags or truck full of bricks.

Personally, I'd rather not get hit by a truck at all. Option 3.

You offer limited, exclusive options from a larger available set of possibilities.

Ergo: Bias.

FWIW: By your definition, I could make a poll with a single option (just not including all the others you would like) and it would not be biased.

Do you see the flaw in that line of thinking?

You can’t have a poll with one option lol. You still don’t understand what bias means it seems.

I tried to help you as much as I could.

Seriously if an ice cream seller says would you like a free vanilla or free strawberry cone, you go right ahead and argue his options are biased and he has to offer you more, because other flavours exist. See how far that gets you.

I won’t respond to you again.

LadyLavina

"Cancer or an incurable Flesh Eating Disease, which is best?"


Neither.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

LadyLavina wrote: »

"Cancer or an incurable Flesh Eating Disease, which is best?"


Neither.

Look I do get the point and I’ll do another poll just to ram the message Home for those that do queue as fake roles.

This is just to emphasise if you going to get one which role is more easily compensated.

Me, I’d rather no fakes.

WhiteCoatSyndrome

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

The character I usually run group content with has a Resto Staff on the back bar. So fake healers aren't usually an issue. It has gotten to the point that I try to reassure groups I join by throwing a Healing Springs at them when we meet up, just so they know I can do the job I queued for.

But there have been occasions where someone asked me to DPS and it turned out the official healer needed extra help. And it's relatively simple to swap bars as needed in those cases. I don't have much practice tanking so I much prefer the tank to know what they're doing.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Knaxia wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Knaxia wrote: »

I would say it depends. If the player/group is high level and skilled and know what they're doing , I would say it's fine. I mostly run on my healer and I've seen a couple DPS come in as tank, but most of them warned it as they got in, I didn't mind and most runs went smooth.

I've seen worse "real tanks" come in than "fake tanks" in my runs so it's a fair trade.

So many people have never played “would you rather”.

Ne need to be hostile. I'm just giving out my opinion since I almost never run as another role than healer and I'm just talking experience after reading most replies. This is just a forums, if you think my reply wasn't "needed", then yours wasn't as needed as it didn't grant anything to the discussion.

Apologies if that came across as hostile.

Aesthier

Neither

KeiruNicrom

I’d rather have a fake tank and real healer

always depends but most content can do 3 dps and healer. while self heals can be reliant I would rather not have to slow damage down using vigor every 5 seconds and running out of resources quicker

Delpi

I’d rather have a fake tank and real healer

As a Healer, I feel offended by this poll.

Guppet

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Delpi wrote: »

As a Healer, I feel offended by this poll.

I think in general healers should feel offended in this game. It’s clear the role needs work from the devs. Content should need one.

Maybe they need to split healing and damage stats, it would not be popular, but DPS heals would then no longer be enough. Self sustain has been far to easy for far too long.

Wifeaggro13

I’d rather have a fake tank and real healer

Guppet wrote: »

Ok we have all come across it. You join a pug and either the tank or healer is a dps, who just chose the role for a quicker queue.

So the question is if you join a pug and you have to have one (just one, the other is the role they queued for), which would you rather have? It’s an either or poll to see which people dislike most.

The game design really does nothing to require a tank for 90% of the content

driosketch

I’d rather have a fake tank and real healer

WhitePawPrints wrote: »

Tanks are responsible for taking the damage from bosses and most mobs. So if the tank is doing the job right, there is very little health loss on your DPS players.

If a tank is good, healer not really needed much. But I've run some dungeons without a tank, e.g. vDFK. A good healer can provide debuffs as well as buffs. A tank's main asset is the predictability of enemy positions. But, especially for some bosses who don't taunt well, players adjust well enough to being on their toes.

Of course, since we are talking pug groups, if the majority of the group is bad/inexperienced, I don't think it matters much what your tank or healer are. In this scenario, however, I guess I'm a dps, and I have three randoms, a mediocre dps, another mediocre dps with no taunt/major heals unlocked or sloted, and a mediocre tank/healer who has at least the right skills slotted. Worst case scenario:

Fake heals w/real tank - tank has a taunt, most health of anyone in the group, blocks, but also no resource management. So tank is kiting from time to time pulling and turing the boss all over the room. Tank occasionally dies, because no heals incoming, and dps die because occasionally their path crosses the red and they aren't getting enough heals or are squishy. I'm spending about a third of my time on defensive skills, maybe another quarter rezzing.

Fake tank/real healer - healer has healing springs, maybe rapid regen, and a burst heal. But they also have no sense of wound severity, and not the greatest resource management. So they are continously overhealing and leaving dead periods where no heals are coming. Also, with no taunts, boss is running loose, occasionally one shotting the others. I'm spending about a quarter of my time on my own defenses here, accounting for the times I have aggro, and likewise another quarter rezzing.

So, by my rough estimate, I'm getting a tiny bit more dpsing done with a real healer. Maybe not enough to cover other variables, but if I have to make a choice, I want a healer.

Zimbugga

I hate fake healers and tanks. Don't use them, please.

Malacthulhu

Hard to say if they are fake or not bc you would have to know their intention and everyone has to start somewhere. Given, if they declare their intention to fake, I drop or kick. If they do not declare, then I try out the hardmode tank or healer.

Saturn

I’d rather have a fake tank and real healer

Guppet wrote: »

Ok we have all come across it. You join a pug and either the tank or healer is a dps, who just chose the role for a quicker queue.

So the question is if you join a pug and you have to have one (just one, the other is the role they queued for), which would you rather have? It’s an either or poll to see which people dislike most.

Most fights can be done without a tank, unless it's some of the newer content, but if there are no heals in the group, that group is doomed

Thorstienn

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Every DPS stacks their main resource which applies to all heals. Every class has heals and Stamina has vigor; most of which will heal others too. So unfortunately healers are not super important in the design of this game for pure healing!
A tank only Needs 2 things: a taunt, that everyone can put on their bar from undaunted. And survivability to take the big hits! A mag character can get away with stacking shields, stamina not so much. And at the end of the day DPS don't stack health! And I see far too many "miss" a dodge roll, block or interrupt and game over fake tank!

Runefang

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

Delpi wrote: »

As a Healer, I feel offended by this poll.

As a healer you should be offended by the content which doesn't require your role.

The issue is that very few fights have enough consistent incoming damage for a healer to be needed. It's either the mechanics are one-shot meaning you can't heal through it, or the damage isn't consistent enough that a DPS can't self-heal through it.

AbysmalGhul

You can probably get away with a fake tank and healer in most dungeons, but most definitely not the newer DLC dungeons. If I had to pick, I would prefer a fake tank that can throw down some damage numbers....that's if they aren't kiting like they're on fire.

Ashdroid

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

I can generally get by with just Vigor as long as there's someone to keep the boss off me.

disintegr8

The biggest problem in a normal dungeon is having a fake tank who does not slot a taunt. Having a boss running around chasing everyone willy-nilly is just annoying.

orubor

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

If you've got a real tank, there are some that can carry the PUG through the dungeon without a healer. One time was in nCoS with 4 nightblades, the healer just actually being a dps, and we made it through without even a restoration staff. Died quite a bit, but it still happened.

It's entirely situational though, depending on the dungeon and difficulty, the dps being done, if the tank can sustain without a healer or vice versa, etc. You can out-dps some things without needing all the roles, others you can't. Just depends.

Lifemocker

I’d rather have a fake Healer and real tank

You don't need a healer for dungeons really, so I'd rather have a tank.