Buff the Invigorating Trait

wildbear247

As mentioned in the discussions at the bottom, the Invigorating trait could use a buff to make it a more viable recovery trait. I've pasted two good ideas mentioned by others below. The first idea is definitely something that could be done in this patch cycle without too much work, as it just means increasing the current numbers. What do you folks think?

IDEA 1: @dsalter

dsalter wrote: »

more or less yep.
tbh just changing the base amount to 12 and increase it by 4 per tier would do the trick (12/16/20/24) all gold would be 24x7=168, not game breaking but alot better than what we currently have for "invigorating"

IDEA 2: @Avran_Sylt

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

Could just make it increase the % resource return on Heavy Attacks.

Previous Invigorating Discussions
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/369102/is-the-invigorating-trait-just-as-useless-as-prosperous/p1
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/400092/do-you-believe-the-invigorating-trait-should-be-revisited-by-zos-developers/p1

Sixty5

I wanted to see Invigorating changed to non-recovery regen, so that you get it even while blocking or sprinting.

Could be an interesting mechanic for the trait

Gallagher563

Two points about the trait. First is that this trait will never be viable in PVE because recovery doesn't really matter in long sustained fights so even if the value was buffed no one would use it. Also an increased magic recovery on a stamina character is wasted so that also hurts it's viability. As some one who does mostly PVE a cost reduction would be much more useful to me and would be especially useful on classes like DK and Templar's where sustain is an issue. Second health recovery isn't great and really meaningful. Just look at the number of vampires in Cyrodil. I understand if you want to run a health recovery build it might be useful, but with the new infused jewelry trait this may become increasingly obsolete.

Taleof2Cities

Always get a kick out of players posting ideas not related to new PTS content ... in the PTS forums.

As if the devs are going to immediately implement it into the next PTS patch.

NyassaV

I'd kinda be ok with this

wildbear247

The tri-recovery is viable for PvP (including health recovery), but I'm not married on any one idea to overhaul Invigorating.

The cost reduction would be an interesting change for sure, doesn't seem like it would take a lot to implement either. And it would be nice to try and make Invigorating viable for both PvE and PvP.

ZOS what say ye? Can we get some kinda love for Invigorating this patch? Y'all have the numbers, so if you don't see Invigorating being used much across the board, give it some love dudes.

Mudcrabber

I assume the rationale was to make it like the infused armor trait, but for recovery instead of max stats. A gold recovery jewelry glyph gives 169, and 20% of that is 33.8. Divided by 3 stats you get 11, which is what the gold invigorating trait adds to each.

But if they followed the same rationale that they did for prismatic glyphs, you'd divide by 2 instead of 3, getting 17.

Conversely jewelry enchants are a bit more powerful than armor enchants, comparing 174 spell damage to 868 magicka. Wanting to base it off what the armor equivalent of a jewelry recovery enchant would be might have led them to choose 11 over 17.

What they failed to consider is that very few people use recovery glyphs, and so an armor trait based on the same numbers won't see much use either.

Solariken

Sixty5 wrote: »

I wanted to see Invigorating changed to non-recovery regen, so that you get it even while blocking or sprinting.

Could be an interesting mechanic for the trait

^ This is how it should be addressed.

One idea:

Increases health recovery by 12. Each time you regen health, gain 12 magicka and 12 stamina.

ToRelax

Mudcrabber wrote: »

I assume the rationale was to make it like the infused armor trait, but for recovery instead of max stats. A gold recovery jewelry glyph gives 169, and 20% of that is 33.8. Divided by 3 stats you get 11, which is what the gold invigorating trait adds to each.

But if they followed the same rationale that they did for prismatic glyphs, you'd divide by 2 instead of 3, getting 17.

Conversely jewelry enchants are a bit more powerful than armor enchants, comparing 174 spell damage to 868 magicka. Wanting to base it off what the armor equivalent of a jewelry recovery enchant would be might have led them to choose 11 over 17.

What they failed to consider is that very few people use recovery glyphs, and so an armor trait based on the same numbers won't see much use either.

Where do you get the idea with jewelry enchantments from? There is no max stat enchantment, nothing to compare the regen enchantment with. With your method you'd have to compare spell damage enchantments with another source of spell damage that has a mag/stam equivalent, which makes it pointless.

If you simply take the stat gain from Infused on prismatic glyphs divided by the regen gain from Invigorating and compare it to max stat set bonuses divided by their regen counterparts, you will find that Invigorating is actually slightly more efficient. It's not used much because it has to compete with the rest of the armor traits and because Infused on non-prismatic enchantments is better in PvE on big pieces if you neglect the secondary resource pool.

Love Wizard

It definetly needs a buff to how it is right now, its more or less useless. However, I'd be VERY careful in adjusting this, as regeneration right now, especially in Cyrodiil is a joke. I feel that people should have to be careful about how they spend their resource pools, and not just be able to spam skills brainlessly.

Gallagher563

I will go back to my original point and say this trait is not useful in PVE. Only a tank may need tri stat recovery and even then their are better options. If it just returned 1 resource that would be more effective but still not great. I would prefer cost reduction depending on armor glyph.

Royaji

Numberwise it's actually not that bad. Divines with Atronach/Serpent gives around 17-18 (don't remeber the precise value) recovery per piece but only for one resource. So invigorating is a bit weaker but for all three resources. It's just that noone really needs recovery for all three resources.

Health regen is a trash stat anyway and with most builds focusing purely on one resource (in PvE) there is no need to increase regen of the other one. Even tanks don't need it since resources don't regen while blocking so they usually only stack one of the regens. It might be viable for hybrids and tanks who use both resources for blocking but those are just to rare to make that trait viable.

So you can't fix invigorating with number tweaking. We just need a generally better trait.

Strider__Roshin

Yeah I was positive that they were going to increase it before going live with its current value. When they didn't I knew it was going to be a dead trait.

StoicSunbro

I'd rather it be percent based than flat values.
These number likely need work but as an example 2.5/3/3.5/4/5 %. 35% with 7 gold.

The nice thing is it scales with your setup so it is rewarding if you are focused on a single stat. So a PVE healer might drop 4 divines for 4 invigorating for 20% extra magicka regen.

Pve Healers, pve off-tanks, and various pvp builds might find it appealing.