Initial reaction to Nightblade Changes

Rohamad_Ali

Look at all this ...!

Nightblade
Assassination
Assassin’s Blade: This ability and its morphs now deal their bonus execute damage when the target is below 25% Health, down from 26% Health.

Lotus Fan (Teleport Strike morph): The snare applied by this morph now reduces Movement Speed by 40%, down from 70%.
Shadow

Bolstering Darkness (Consuming Darkness morph): This morph now causes the Major Protection buff to remain on you even after leaving the area. The buff will persist for the duration of the ability.

Dark Cloak (Shadow Cloak morph): This morph no longer grants invisibility; instead it heals you for 32% of your Max Health over 3 seconds and grants Minor Protection for the duration.

Dark Shades (Summon Shade morph):
Renamed this morph to “Dark Shade”. Singular. Because…

This morph now summons one shade instead of two, and the shade will occasionally deal a point blank area of effect damage around it.

Manifestation of Terror (Aspect of Terror morph): Reduced the arming time of the traps created by this morph to 2 seconds from 3 seconds.

Path of Darkness: Reduced the damage and healing done by this ability and Refreshing Path morph by approximately 5%, and reduced the damage done by the Twisting Path morph by approximately 9%.

Shadow Image (Summon Shade morph): This morph can now be cast without an enemy target.

Siphoning
Debilitate (Cripple morph): This morph now refunds 100% of the ability’s cost if the enemy dies while affected by it, increased from 50%.

Malevolent Offering: This ability and its morphs now smart heal an ally in front of you instantly, instead of healing a specific target over time. Each cast of these abilities will place a damage over time effect on you that drains your health over 8 seconds.

Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph): Increased the radius of the heal applied by this morph to 28 meters from 15 seconds.

Strife: Increased the cost of this ability and its morphs to 2700 Magicka from 1891 Magicka.



C'mon ! Really ?

Fellow Nightblades we need you in test center as much as possible to help give constructive data opposing some of these changes . A good defense attorney would help too . Just initial reaction at the sheer amount of changes on top of weapon and guild class ability changes was enough to raise my sodium levels dangerously high .

Sixty5

Decreasing execute threshold by 1%
A 9% damage nerf to something that doesn't even make top 3 in parses
And a cost increase to a spammable to make it competitive with what other classes have?

Yeah, your class dps really got gutted there.

Rohamad_Ali

Sixty5 wrote: »

Decreasing execute threshold by 1%
A 9% damage nerf to something that doesn't even make top 3 in parses
And a cost increase to a spammable to make it competitive with what other classes have?

Yeah, your class dps really got gutted there.

Im going to take a hazmat shower to get all this salt off before properly responding .

JinMori

Sixty5 wrote: »

Decreasing execute threshold by 1%
A 9% damage nerf to something that doesn't even make top 3 in parses
And a cost increase to a spammable to make it competitive with what other classes have?

Yeah, your class dps really got gutted there.

Twisting path is strong, so a 9 % nerf actually has some impact on the total damage.

i don't get the execute change, it seems stupid to me.

The change to strife is also stupid, strife was already worse then force pulse dps wise, the only thing you would take it for is because of the passives, and the healing, this change should be reverted.

Sixty5

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Decreasing execute threshold by 1%
A 9% damage nerf to something that doesn't even make top 3 in parses
And a cost increase to a spammable to make it competitive with what other classes have?

Yeah, your class dps really got gutted there.

Im going to take a hazmat shower to get all this salt off before properly responding .

Considering that the pre pts tests still had magblade pulling over 70k with raid buffs, along with a light attack rotation being sustainable, I don't see the class being anything close to being dead.

JinMori

Sixty5 wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Decreasing execute threshold by 1%
A 9% damage nerf to something that doesn't even make top 3 in parses
And a cost increase to a spammable to make it competitive with what other classes have?

Yeah, your class dps really got gutted there.

Im going to take a hazmat shower to get all this salt off before properly responding .

Considering that the pre pts tests still had magblade pulling over 70k with raid buffs, along with a light attack rotation being sustainable, I don't see the class being anything close to being dead.

No one said that.
Learn to read.

The only thing i really do not like is strife increased cost, they should reduce it to how it was before, force pulse as well should be reduced to about 2.1k, these 2 abilities costs too much, almost 3 k is way too much.

Rohamad_Ali

Sixty5 wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Decreasing execute threshold by 1%
A 9% damage nerf to something that doesn't even make top 3 in parses
And a cost increase to a spammable to make it competitive with what other classes have?

Yeah, your class dps really got gutted there.

Im going to take a hazmat shower to get all this salt off before properly responding .

Considering that the pre pts tests still had magblade pulling over 70k with raid buffs, along with a light attack rotation being sustainable, I don't see the class being anything close to being dead.

I never said anything about being dead . Justification to change shades , another iconic ability . Siphon up 50% on a spammable both dodgeable and reflectable an never once had I read a nerf twisting path thread ever . So much unnecessary change . On top of shadow mundus nerfed further , no more crit effecting heals , empowerment loss .

I would say after a sudzy bath these changes had zero substance for any Magblade pvp players . An since when to PvE players ask for nerfs really ? NPC's don't write posts on forums .

brandonv516

Strife change is stupid. But I already changed to Force Pulse for better weaves so I guess I'll deal with it.

Debilitate will still be the seldomly used morph

Dark Cloak should have minor protection and snare removal (+immunity?), not a heal. Compromise a stealth tool for a snare removal tool.

Ankael07

You forgot the real change to NBs that comes with a bug fix. Heals cannot crit 100% of the time during cloak.

Rohamad_Ali

Ankael07 wrote: »

You forgot the real change to NBs that comes with a bug fix. Heals cannot crit 100% of the time during cloak.

I mentioned that in my third post . Sorry I was covered in salt an had to detox after thread creation .

Thunderknuckles

Shadowy Disguise still cloaks, so I'm happy there. I've heard, too, that some other changes coming will make NB's a bit more tanky.

Vaoh

Honestly this stuff sounds.... balanced.

Assassin's Blade - A "nerf" from 26% threshold to 25% threshold makes sense and will have absolutely zero impact. No one will even notice. Other executes are at 25%, 50%, etc so it was weird that this skill was at 26%.

Lotus Fan - The snare getting reduced is very good. It should be removed tbh, and the same goes for many other skills because snares are way too plentiful in PvP. This change was part of an overall change to reduce the effectiveness of snares. Anyone who thought a 70% snare was okay..... well it wasn't lol. It was disgusting against any build that didn't run Forward Momentum.

Bolstering Darkness - Sounds like a buff. A big buff No complaints possible.

Dark Cloak - Changed into an ability for NB tanks. FINALLY. This was formerly the bad morph of Shadow Cloak. Very good change overall.

Dark Shade(s) - It can now do an AoE Minor Maim. This is nice, but I don't think it was a good idea to remove the second shade. Would have been nice for this skill to either be a viable DPS skill, or for the second shade to remain and use its own separate, unique attack.

Manifestation of Terror - Doesn't take as long to arm. Small buff.

Path of Darkness - Idk about these nerfs. People need to test. It must have been that NB was still parsing way too high against other Magicka setups, and nerfing an AoE DoT like this was an easy way to pull down their DPS a bit. Probably a good change, and also slightly reduces their AoE potential (leaving room for a class like Sorc or Templar to feel more valuable).

Shadow Image - Is this real? This is an enormous buff. Anyone who understands how powerful Shadow Image is will probably laugh at this change. Im not gonna oppose it or anything but Im shocked to see ZOS show so much support for NBs with them already being so powerful.

Debilitate - A noticeable buff, but the other morph still seems superior.

Malevolent Offering - Is this meant to be used by the tank? Not sure about this change. Needs thorough testing in actual use.

Soul Siphon - A substantial buff. 28m is pretty ridiculous. Overall Im not sure if the Ultimate itself is worth using though. Maybe its good for a NB Healer..... its just that I've never seen a NB Healer.

Strife - So this change is the big one. It has an equal cost (or very similar) to Force Pulse. Strife still accesses Siphoning passives and provides a great offheal. Also its being reported that Magicka NB can still sustain their light attack rotation and pull 70K+...... I'm inclined to dislike this change because I never want to see a Mag NB even think about running Force Pulse over Strife, but based on very limited testing so far it seems alright.

adeptusminor

Could someone post some of these 70k+ raid parses from magblades please?

TheUndeadAmulet

*Sees all the magblade nerfs*

Welp, guess I'm running a sorc now.

Berenhir

I think you forgot one of the best "fixes":

Shadowy Disguise (Shadow Cloak morph):
Fixed an issue where this morph’s effect was causing all your healing over time effects to critically strike, and not consume the effect.

Ah you posted it. Sorry. But it's ridiculous anyway

Tholian1

Meh... Not feeling nerfed yet.

SaKGEE

Lysette

As much as I like to be able to heal myself - why is a cloak morph not providing cloak?- This is just silly and why is it healing me, if there are healer classes out there?- This is just taking away from their job and a cloak, which isn't cloaking, seriously?

Rohamad_Ali

Tholian1 wrote: »

Meh... Not feeling nerfed yet.

These nerfs primarily will show impact towards Magic Nightblades when the population of the forums was asking for nerfs towards stamina Nightblades . If you are playing stamina that's understandable and if you are playing magic and are aware of the empower nerf then you will be in for some surprises in PTS .

Unless of course you are a Magic nightblade tank then this will be a strong buff patch for them . Either way , I do not like major changes to my nightblade play style and with two abilities being completely changed , Shades and dark cloak , I've lost a play style I enjoyed that was different from meta for PvE play . Which I would of been more accepting of of Empower wasn't gutted completely for my Magblade .

In PvP I can adapt to Magblade Tanking but do not enjoy tanking in general so probably will just RP with friends on my nightblade now . The loss of burst is too significant in PvP . I have all the other classes to play but will miss playing Magblade as I use too .

I know some other people have little concern for my personal preferences and that is fine but I support all classes when they get changes they did not ask for or need some love to their favorite class .

Peekachu99

Lysette wrote: »

As much as I like to be able to heal myself - why is a cloak morph not providing cloak?- This is just silly and why is it healing me, if there are healer classes out there?- This is just taking away from their job and a cloak, which isn't cloaking, seriously?

I told everyone that the cloak>heal change would be top-tier garbage and it clearly is. The cost is insulting on top of that, for a seriously weaksauce HoT.

They should have made this option a DAMAGE SHIELD, Shadow Shield or something, with its own unique effect, maybe minor maim if it’s supposed to be for tanking and HP scaling, which would have given NB a genuine choice between cloaking (dps) and a means of tanking.

Zagnut123Zagnut123

Sixty5 wrote: »

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Decreasing execute threshold by 1%
A 9% damage nerf to something that doesn't even make top 3 in parses
And a cost increase to a spammable to make it competitive with what other classes have?

Yeah, your class dps really got gutted there.

Im going to take a hazmat shower to get all this salt off before properly responding .

Considering that the pre pts tests still had magblade pulling over 70k with raid buffs, along with a light attack rotation being sustainable, I don't see the class being anything close to being dead.

If anything they're stronger now with the light attack buff. A guildy posted there first parse on mag Blade of 46k

rfennell_ESO

Rohamad_Ali wrote: »

Fellow Nightblades we need you in test center as much as possible to help give constructive data opposing some of these changes . A good defense attorney would help too . Just initial reaction at the sheer amount of changes on top of weapon and guild class ability changes was enough to raise my sodium levels dangerously high .

It's actually not that bad and mostly warranted changes.

Tholian1

@Rohamad_Ali - yeah, I don’t play magicka so I don’t have a strong understanding of how your play style is being affected. But then, I wasn’t trying to make light of it either. I was expecting to be upset when clicking on your thread and was surprised. I still support all my NB brothers and sisters and am against big changes too.

Etrella

ZOS keeps yapping about diversity, yet they want abilities to act similar and cost the same. Whats diverse about that?. They're too slow to understand that everytime they nerf something, a new "Meta" will just be created, and every single endgame player will be running the SAME damn thing. Talk about diversity.

Lysette

Peekachu99 wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

As much as I like to be able to heal myself - why is a cloak morph not providing cloak?- This is just silly and why is it healing me, if there are healer classes out there?- This is just taking away from their job and a cloak, which isn't cloaking, seriously?

I told everyone that the cloak>heal change would be top-tier garbage and it clearly is. The cost is insulting on top of that, for a seriously weaksauce HoT.

They should have made this option a DAMAGE SHIELD, Shadow Shield or something, with its own unique effect, maybe minor maim if it’s supposed to be for tanking and HP scaling, which would have given NB a genuine choice between cloaking (dps) and a means of tanking.

I agree, NB is the typical hit and run tactics play style - I am not a tank nor a healer, what I want is to be able to do high burst damage for a short while and disappear again - namely hit and run - and if possible in the stealthiest way possible. A short term damage shield would be ok to me as well, because it provides some protection in the "hit" phase. I don't see my NBs as tanks or effective healers. Hit and run is neither made to be tanky nor have sustain - but it should have high burst damage and a way to disappear quickly again after the strike is performed. NB should be a glass cannon with extreme damage output for a short while - and that's it, if one does not get away after the strike, well ... doomed. That is my idea of the NB class.

Ch4mpTW

Finally NB’s are getting what they deserve. They were long overdue for being looked at, to the point that the vast majority of DPS in PvE and PvP are Nightblades. It’s disgusting. Yours truly, a MagDK DPS.

Rohamad_Ali

Tholian1 wrote: »

@Rohamad_Ali - yeah, I don’t play magicka so I don’t have a strong understanding of how your play style is being affected. But then, I wasn’t trying to make light of it either. I was expecting to be upset when clicking on your thread and was surprised. I still support all my NB brothers and sisters and am against big changes too.

Thank you @Tholian1 . We will see after TC finishes downloading how this plays out better but be aware the crit heal nerf will really impact stamina Nightblades a lot when fighting multiple players . That was your OH shiii ! Heal lol .

Rohamad_Ali

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

Finally NB’s are getting what they deserve. They were long overdue for being looked at, to the point that the vast majority of DPS in PvE and PvP are Nightblades. It’s disgusting. Yours truly, a MagDK DPS.

Bah !

ccfeeling

All other classes accept the changes

Rohamad_Ali

ccfeeling wrote: »

All other classes accept the changes

Farming salt . I've already taken one shower !

Bow ganker's and Roll Dodge NB's are still going to rek a lot of players . Eternal Hunt got a buff . I forgot I do technically have an option to go stamina on NB because I did level all morphs equally so I didn't have to create a second NB . Especially with Bow and Two handed counting as two piece sets now ....

Lysette

ccfeeling wrote: »

All other classes accept the changes

Well, we will have to accept it too - but ... if the typical playstyle of a NB is watered down again and again and again, what is left from that class then, what we chose this class for?- It is not fun to change the very basics of a class into something which the class was never meant to be.

Edit: think of the names of the class ability groups - assassination, this should enable you to kill at least one target pretty much instantly, i.e. extreme burst damage - shadow - this should enable you to be more stealthy than other classes and provide a way to escape after the initial strike - then siphoning - this should harvest a bit of the life power of a target and channel it to oneself or an ally, this is not healing per se, it is a drain/absorb or channel to others ability.

And what do we have when this is watered down - assassination - which does not provide the ability to successfully assassinate a target - shadow - which leaves you out in the open, if you choose the wrong morph - siphoning - which is replaced basically by a healing function in the shadow group, a healing function, which does not drain the enemies life force - NB is an offensive class, not a defensive one and it should maintain it's character as such.