Let's talk about Warden (Summerset edition)

SanTii.92

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Guys you can ask for single bar bear all you want, it will never happen for the same reason sorcerer pets will never be single bar.

Use your heads; the bear dishes out 5k dps on its own, would you give a permanent 5k damage over time skill to any other class? Being a double bar ability is only thing keeping the bear balanced. If it were to be made single bar, it would probably get changed to a 20 second or less duration, and none of us wants to have to recast it that often.

Sorry, but this argument is downright ridiculous. Just because other classes work some way, doesn't mean that's necessary the case for all of them. And your 5k dps argument is also flawed, because is relative to the overall strength of the class. If it's on average 5 to 10k behind the rest of them, then you are damn right if you think that they are entitle to skill that reduces that gap.

---

On top of that, allowing us to single bar the bear doesn't necessarily mean an increase of dps. If you were to, let's say, slot ele storm on back bar, you would have to choice to proc a single damaging skill, the bear or cast the aoe damaging one.

All this change does is give us more choices, and not making us commit to an ulti so limited on it's functions. The bear, when it works, and that's a big if, does nothing but single target damage. Not having access to supportive/defensive ultis for PvP and aoe damage for Pve is simply too prohibit. And finally, even if it ends up being too op, the fix is as simple as twining some numbers.

Lynx7386

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Guys you can ask for single bar bear all you want, it will never happen for the same reason sorcerer pets will never be single bar.

Use your heads; the bear dishes out 5k dps on its own, would you give a permanent 5k damage over time skill to any other class? Being a double bar ability is only thing keeping the bear balanced. If it were to be made single bar, it would probably get changed to a 20 second or less duration, and none of us wants to have to recast it that often.

Sorry, but this argument is downright ridiculous. Just because other classes work some way, doesn't mean that's necessary the case for all of them. And your 5k dps argument is also flawed, because is relative to the overall strength of the class. If it's on average 5 to 10k behind the rest of them, then you are damn right if you think that they are entitle to skill that reduces that gap.

---

On top of that, allowing us to single bar Dl the bear doesn't necessarily mean an increase of dps. If you were to, let's say, slot ele storm on back bar, you would have to choice to proc a single damaging skill, the bear or cast the aoe damaging one.

All it does change does is give us more choices, and not making us commit to an ulti so limited on it's functions. The bear, when it works, and that's a big if, does nothing but single target damage. Not having access to supportive/defensive ultis for PvP and aoe damage for Pve is simply too prohibit. And finally, even if it ends up being too op, the fix is as simple as twining some numbers.

Nothing is stopping you from slotting other ultimates but you have to give up the bear for it. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

With stamden already pulling 50k+ solo parses, making the bear single slot would be entirely overpowered

SanTii.92

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Guys you can ask for single bar bear all you want, it will never happen for the same reason sorcerer pets will never be single bar.

Use your heads; the bear dishes out 5k dps on its own, would you give a permanent 5k damage over time skill to any other class? Being a double bar ability is only thing keeping the bear balanced. If it were to be made single bar, it would probably get changed to a 20 second or less duration, and none of us wants to have to recast it that often.

Sorry, but this argument is downright ridiculous. Just because other classes work some way, doesn't mean that's necessary the case for all of them. And your 5k dps argument is also flawed, because is relative to the overall strength of the class. If it's on average 5 to 10k behind the rest of them, then you are damn right if you think that they are entitle to skill that reduces that gap.

---

On top of that, allowing us to single bar Dl the bear doesn't necessarily mean an increase of dps. If you were to, let's say, slot ele storm on back bar, you would have to choice to proc a single damaging skill, the bear or cast the aoe damaging one.

All it does change does is give us more choices, and not making us commit to an ulti so limited on it's functions. The bear, when it works, and that's a big if, does nothing but single target damage. Not having access to supportive/defensive ultis for PvP and aoe damage for Pve is simply too prohibit. And finally, even if it ends up being too op, the fix is as simple as twining some numbers.

Nothing is stopping you from slotting other ultimates but you have to give up the bear for it. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

With stamden already pulling 50k+ solo parses, making the bear single slot would be entirely overpowered

Did you not understood when I mention that's only an easily fixable numbers issue?

Or when I explained that this change should not affect dps that much, cause you would be forced to proc either single target or aoe/support?

In any case, balance issues are most definetly not enough to not modify something that is fundamentally broken. Unless the bear is astronomically superior in terms of single target DPS, it will never, or almost never, be enough to drop the so necessary aoe damage for pve, and even less so, supportive/defensive ultis for PvP. So yeah, there is also that.

Lynx7386

It's no more or less broken than sorc pets are.

SanTii.92

Lynx7386 wrote: »

It's no more or less broken than sorc pets are.

Sure, except one is an appendix on the sorc's kit and the other is supposed to be the cornerstone of warden's offensive capabilities.

But whatever, keep arguing this, I'm sure you are so tired of seeing those bears plaguing cyrodiil all day.

MLGProPlayer

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Guys you can ask for single bar bear all you want, it will never happen for the same reason sorcerer pets will never be single bar.

Use your heads; the bear dishes out 5k dps on its own, would you give a permanent 5k damage over time skill to any other class? Being a double bar ability is only thing keeping the bear balanced. If it were to be made single bar, it would probably get changed to a 20 second or less duration, and none of us wants to have to recast it that often.

The warden class was designed around needing the bear (DPS is nearly 10k behind the other classes without it). As long as the bear requires double barring, we will not be able to use any other ult.

MLGProPlayer

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Guys you can ask for single bar bear all you want, it will never happen for the same reason sorcerer pets will never be single bar.

Use your heads; the bear dishes out 5k dps on its own, would you give a permanent 5k damage over time skill to any other class? Being a double bar ability is only thing keeping the bear balanced. If it were to be made single bar, it would probably get changed to a 20 second or less duration, and none of us wants to have to recast it that often.

Sorry, but this argument is downright ridiculous. Just because other classes work some way, doesn't mean that's necessary the case for all of them. And your 5k dps argument is also flawed, because is relative to the overall strength of the class. If it's on average 5 to 10k behind the rest of them, then you are damn right if you think that they are entitle to skill that reduces that gap.

---

On top of that, allowing us to single bar Dl the bear doesn't necessarily mean an increase of dps. If you were to, let's say, slot ele storm on back bar, you would have to choice to proc a single damaging skill, the bear or cast the aoe damaging one.

All it does change does is give us more choices, and not making us commit to an ulti so limited on it's functions. The bear, when it works, and that's a big if, does nothing but single target damage. Not having access to supportive/defensive ultis for PvP and aoe damage for Pve is simply too prohibit. And finally, even if it ends up being too op, the fix is as simple as twining some numbers.

Nothing is stopping you from slotting other ultimates but you have to give up the bear for it. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

With stamden already pulling 50k+ solo parses, making the bear single slot would be entirely overpowered

Magden is parsing a pathetic 38k with the bear and drops to 33-34k with destro ult. Those destro ult numbers are beyond abysmal. The DPS parse with the bear is just as awful as that's single target damage, and the bear is a non-factor in most boss fights as it dies instantly.

Bear DPS will also go down if it became a single bar ability because you'd be saving ult points for destro ult (meanibg less bear ult spam).

Capt_Morgan

Lynx7386 wrote: »

I definitely like the changes to arctic wind/morphs. I've been saying since morrowind beta that 10% up front + 10% over time is not even close to sufficient for a tank's emergency self heal. I'm hoping that when they said it was being increased by 20% that they mean it'll be 30% of your max health + 10% over time, and not just 20% max health + 10% over time. 30% would put it on par with the new dark cloak, clannfear heal, and dragon's blood (in dire cases).

I'm a little disappointed they increased the cost of shimmering shield. I think it would have been a better fix to remove or reduce the magicka return on absorbed projectiles, instead of increasing the cost of the skill overall. This just makes it harder to use for tanks, who are the ones that need it most. They should reduce the cost and just remove the magicka return, it's a convoluted ability at this point.

The changes to swinging vines wont really make them any more used by anyone, IMO - healers or otherwise. The ability itself needs to be entirely reworked, the targeting is terrible,t he healing amount is terrible, and there are other ways to generate ultimate. I'd much rather see this used as a gap closer (self pull to enemy) for at least one morph to help out the damage builds for warden, and have the other morph act more like guard or something, linking you to a player. It'd be really cool if it linked you to one other player (like guard), had a longer range (28m or so), and 'shared' all healing received between the two. That'd make it better for healers to use when cast on tanks, and tanks could cast it on healers or dps to share healing with them for survival (especially with a new 30% max hp heal on the tank).

Bird of prey still needs to be looked at, the 10 second duration is completely insufficient for damage dealers - nightblades have basically the same ability and it lasts for 20 seconds and has a massive burst damage added in that can be cast up to 3 times per activation. Having this thing stuck at 10 seconds is pathetic.

Swarm, fetcher infection, and growing swarm all need to be looked at as well. Swarm's damage is pretty pitiful as far as DoTs go. Fetcher infection really should be a stamina morph, dealing disease damage over time - the current functionality of increased damage on every other cast is fine IMO, though a little uninspired. Growing swarm is terrible, and should be a ground cast aoe that gains radius and damage over time not unlike hurricane, such would befit the name and the playstyle of wardens far more appropriately than the piece of shalk dung it is right now.

Growing warm is a 6k heal as well. Don't forget the passives. Warden isn't nearly as bad as people think..

Also as far as damage goes I think we need to wait and see how it synergizes with the new psijic skill line. Right now warden hits competitive numbers as long as it's able to guard someone and honestly having one magen DPS guarding a MagBlade DPS is more group dmg then having 2 Magblades.

And group utility is way to often scoffed at. Having a dps with a flex slot set to an conal burst heal isn't such a bad thing. I'm excited to also for the psijic passive 5k shield. I can see that being enough for good players to drop shield on their bar for it. Where there is a will there is a way. I can see Magden being really strong in the right hands. We won't be seeing any 8man warden dps raids sure, but I think any raid lead would be foolish to not see the benefit of having 1 Magden dps in the group next patch. I can see optimal group being 1 of each the range Mag DPS with maybe 2 Magblades for their strong single target.

Skander

Warden needed an ice spammable, that dealt dmg. Idk, an ice javeling.



We have a class that without a skill (bugs) can't deal dmg

Lynx7386

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

It's no more or less broken than sorc pets are.

Sure, except one is an appendix on the sorc's kit and the other is supposed to be the cornerstone of warden's offensive capabilities.

But whatever, keep arguing this, I'm sure you are so tired of seeing those bears plaguing cyrodiil all day.

Pure speculation and personal opinion. I would argue that sorcs were built around their pets just a much a wardens are. In fact, considering that sorcs were the -only- per class for 4 years, even more so.

Btw, I'm not a pvper and I'm not disagreeing that the bear needs improvement, I just think your request is unreasonable and is the wrong way to go about improving it.

MLGProPlayer

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

It's no more or less broken than sorc pets are.

Sure, except one is an appendix on the sorc's kit and the other is supposed to be the cornerstone of warden's offensive capabilities.

But whatever, keep arguing this, I'm sure you are so tired of seeing those bears plaguing cyrodiil all day.

Pure speculation and personal opinion. I would argue that sorcs were built around their pets just a much a wardens are. In fact, considering that sorcs were the -only- per class for 4 years, even more so.

Btw, I'm not a pvper and I'm not disagreeing that the bear needs improvement, I just think your request is unreasonable and is the wrong way to go about improving it.

Sorcs can hit competitive DPS numbers without pets. Wardens cannot. Warden was clearly designed around the bear being mandatory.

Lynx7386

Skander wrote: »

Warden needed an ice spammable, that dealt dmg. Idk, an ice javeling.



We have a class that without a skill (bugs) can't deal dmg

Your spammable is cliff racer. Not zenimax's fault you refuse to use it.

MLGProPlayer

Capt_Morgan wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

I definitely like the changes to arctic wind/morphs. I've been saying since morrowind beta that 10% up front + 10% over time is not even close to sufficient for a tank's emergency self heal. I'm hoping that when they said it was being increased by 20% that they mean it'll be 30% of your max health + 10% over time, and not just 20% max health + 10% over time. 30% would put it on par with the new dark cloak, clannfear heal, and dragon's blood (in dire cases).

I'm a little disappointed they increased the cost of shimmering shield. I think it would have been a better fix to remove or reduce the magicka return on absorbed projectiles, instead of increasing the cost of the skill overall. This just makes it harder to use for tanks, who are the ones that need it most. They should reduce the cost and just remove the magicka return, it's a convoluted ability at this point.

The changes to swinging vines wont really make them any more used by anyone, IMO - healers or otherwise. The ability itself needs to be entirely reworked, the targeting is terrible,t he healing amount is terrible, and there are other ways to generate ultimate. I'd much rather see this used as a gap closer (self pull to enemy) for at least one morph to help out the damage builds for warden, and have the other morph act more like guard or something, linking you to a player. It'd be really cool if it linked you to one other player (like guard), had a longer range (28m or so), and 'shared' all healing received between the two. That'd make it better for healers to use when cast on tanks, and tanks could cast it on healers or dps to share healing with them for survival (especially with a new 30% max hp heal on the tank).

Bird of prey still needs to be looked at, the 10 second duration is completely insufficient for damage dealers - nightblades have basically the same ability and it lasts for 20 seconds and has a massive burst damage added in that can be cast up to 3 times per activation. Having this thing stuck at 10 seconds is pathetic.

Swarm, fetcher infection, and growing swarm all need to be looked at as well. Swarm's damage is pretty pitiful as far as DoTs go. Fetcher infection really should be a stamina morph, dealing disease damage over time - the current functionality of increased damage on every other cast is fine IMO, though a little uninspired. Growing swarm is terrible, and should be a ground cast aoe that gains radius and damage over time not unlike hurricane, such would befit the name and the playstyle of wardens far more appropriately than the piece of shalk dung it is right now.

Growing warm is a 6k heal as well. Don't forget the passives. Warden isn't nearly as bad as people think..

Also as far as damage goes I think we need to wait and see how it synergizes with the new psijic skill line. Right now warden hits competitive numbers as long as it's able to guard someone and honestly having one magen DPS guarding a MagBlade DPS is more group dmg then having 2 Magblades.

And group utility is way to often scoffed at. Having a dps with a flex slot set to an conal burst heal isn't such a bad thing. I'm excited to also for the psijic passive 5k shield. I can see that being enough for good players to drop shield on their bar for it. Where there is a will there is a way. I can see Magden being really strong in the right hands. We won't be seeing any 8man warden dps raids sure, but I think any raid lead would be foolish to not see the benefit of having 1 Magden dps in the group next patch. I can see optimal group being 1 of each the range Mag DPS with maybe 2 Magblades for their strong single target.

Wardens have no dupport utility on their DPS skills. Slotting an extra support ability drops DPS or survivability far too low.

In their current state, you will never see a DPS magden in a vet trial group. That's been the case ever since the class was released.

dodgehopper_ESO

Lynx7386 wrote: »

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

After acknowledging numerous times that magicka warden DPS was underperforming, ZOS now had the opportunity to fix the class. So what do they do? Nothing.

The class has had both of its "OP" PvP abilities nerfed now (Cliff Rracer is dodgeable and Shalks no longer stun), making warden one of the weaker PvP classes. Great, now they can buff PvE since the excuse was always that PvE buffs would make them too strong in PvP. Nope. Nothing, just a mediocre solo buff (where wardens already excelled). Now warden just sucks in PvE AND PvP.

Seriously ZOS, why do you hate the warden? Honest question.

I called this a long time ago. When I saw Warden come on the scene I thought 'Gee this is a lot like I remember Templar being' followed by 'They're going to nerf it to the ground'. Mark my words: They don't like DK that much either. Everything about this game is pushing toward being a DD. Everything. The classes that don't lean that way are gonna get ground into a fine silty powder before there's a chance of them being decent again. That's my optimistic view anyway.

This is a weird time to be saying that ZOS is pushing everyone to be a DD. This patch has more tank/healer-friendly class changes than we've seen since at least Homestead, if not longer.

I'm talking about general trajectory - they've sucked the soul out of tanking slowly and painfully for years. I would say tanking got some good and some bad here. Take Dragon Knights for instance, they now get to joyfully split the effects of that lovely igneous shield across two separate morphs. YAY.

You're wrong there. Igneous shield still has major mending and has a more powerful damage shield. Fragmented shield simply has a longer-lasting major mending buff (5 seconds instead of 2.5), meaning it's better for DK healers.

DK tanking didnt get worse this patch, it got better, especially if you take into consideration that they will have even MORE resource recovery now thanks to the combustion changes. They'll also have an aoe heal to add to their repertoire with cinder storm.

It was my understanding that Mending was stripped from Igneous altogether and given to Frag. I stand corrected. I do still disagree with some of the changes they've exacted over the years but I don't want to get into all the points on Tanking that bother me. I can still have fun with the game I just would have gone with things a bit differently.

SanTii.92

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

It's no more or less broken than sorc pets are.

Sure, except one is an appendix on the sorc's kit and the other is supposed to be the cornerstone of warden's offensive capabilities.

But whatever, keep arguing this, I'm sure you are so tired of seeing those bears plaguing cyrodiil all day.

I just think your request is unreasonable and is the wrong way to go about improving it.

Which I'd be totally fine with, if only you gave me any argument other than "cause thets how sorcs work" or that you think it would be too strong. Which is pretty ridiculous to say when you remember that Wardens are, and have always, been a bottom tier dps; but even then if this was the case, it's an easily fixable issue, that only requires some number tweaking, or just move some dps from the bar's basic attacks to the proc component.

Waffennacht

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

Skander

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

Warden needed an ice spammable, that dealt dmg. Idk, an ice javeling.



We have a class that without a skill (bugs) can't deal dmg

Your spammable is cliff racer. Not zenimax's fault you refuse to use it.

It's delayed. Aka you can't burst people. And it doesn't do any kind of elemental dmg. So no status effects

It's a Surprise attack that doesn't lower armor and it's delayed

nah.

SanTii.92

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

Skander

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

Destro staff offers blockade, and that's what you want to find

SanTii.92

Skander wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

Destro staff offers blockade, and that's what you want to find

Blockade is nothing like that, and you can't PvP with blockade. AND Wardens need more offensive skills to try and claw back the dps difference with other classes. Did you know that, other than ultis, they only got 4 offensive skills? That's right, four. Now go ahead and check how many the other classes got.

Skander

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

Destro staff offers blockade, and that's what you want to find

Blockade is nothing like that, and you can't PvP with blockade. AND Wardens need more offensive skills to try and claw back the dps difference with other classes. Did you know that, other than ultis, they only got 4 skills? Go ahead and check how many the other classes got.

I pvp with blockade, it's actually a decent utility You need a destro staff anyway for warden to deal dmg. Crushing shock is the way

QuebraRegra

Lynx7386 wrote: »

It's no more or less broken than sorc pets are.

disagree... the sorc pets actually do useful things.. heal, AOE, etc. Must say, I'm a little disappointed in the sleepy bear

Waffennacht

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

It's a cool idea, however, just combined with Blockade you get something like 6-12% chance of root per dmg tick via warden passive, then there's the Blockade effect that roots chilled players, then the massive stacked snares.

I mean it is a cool idea, but my word, for 2 abilities you like stop all non Templars in their tracks literally

The javelin idea I like because warden passives, direct dmg, single Target, and lines up with burst and isn't OP. The real question is though, for any change, what ability would become such a thing?

SanTii.92

Skander wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

Destro staff offers blockade, and that's what you want to find

Blockade is nothing like that, and you can't PvP with blockade. AND Wardens need more offensive skills to try and claw back the dps difference with other classes. Did you know that, other than ultis, they only got 4 skills? Go ahead and check how many the other classes got.

I pvp with blockade, it's actually a decent utility You need a destro staff anyway for warden to deal dmg. Crushing shock is the way

Ya, I give up.

QuebraRegra

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

I like this "cone of cold" idea.... that's a 5th level magic user spell isn't it?

Skander

Waffennacht wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

It's a cool idea, however, just combined with Blockade you get something like 6-12% chance of root per dmg tick via warden passive, then there's the Blockade effect that roots chilled players, then the massive stacked snares.

I mean it is a cool idea, but my word, for 2 abilities you like stop all non Templars in their tracks literally

The javelin idea I like because warden passives, direct dmg, single Target, and lines up with burst and isn't OP. The real question is though, for any change, what ability would become such a thing?

The useless ice AOE wardan has

QuebraRegra

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

Jade1986 wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

As a warden tank I'm on the fence here. They removed my access to an aoe major breach and fracture, which is a big deal imo, but they also made arctic wind a good tank self heal which kinda counters things.

I'm very disappointed to see no changes to swarm or bird of prey though.

wait, they got rid of the breach and fracture!?

Welp, i might as well just delete my warden tank right now. I thought, yay, i had a viable end game magicka tank with frost staff. and this literally just smashed that.

Is the debuf added to anything else, or was it just nerf no give?

Sub Assult will still give Major Fracture
Fissure will now give Major Breach and won’t stun anymore.
I’ve been working on a Frost tank for a while. 2x Frost I haven’t found. S&B/Frost though is absolute viable though.

I lost breech on my sub assault... I'm less than happy at the NERF. Call it what is is.

Waffennacht

Skander wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Skander I absolutely love the ice javelin idea

What about a frost cone waffen? Imagine the size of combat preyer, moderate instant damage + low hitting 10secs dot and snare. Wardens are in desperate need of some extra forms of Ccs, particularly snares. Would be nice if also we could add some other group oriented buff here, like 10% increase frost damage done to enemies hitter by it.

It's a cool idea, however, just combined with Blockade you get something like 6-12% chance of root per dmg tick via warden passive, then there's the Blockade effect that roots chilled players, then the massive stacked snares.

I mean it is a cool idea, but my word, for 2 abilities you like stop all non Templars in their tracks literally

The javelin idea I like because warden passives, direct dmg, single Target, and lines up with burst and isn't OP. The real question is though, for any change, what ability would become such a thing?

The useless ice AOE wardan has

Gripping shards? That'll really *** off the tanks, and I think winter's revenge would *** a lot off.

Artic Blast? Make on morph different? I'd agree but seriously doubt it'll get changed that much, adding some sort of effect to it is the only likely change this ability would see

What's possible is an adjustment to pigeon, but it's doubtfull frost or ice damage would be included there, but can get the mechanics.

Maybe a fusion of gripping and an artic morph, but that's a lot of changes. But I suppose it possible

xbobx

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Skander wrote: »

Warden needed an ice spammable, that dealt dmg. Idk, an ice javeling.



We have a class that without a skill (bugs) can't deal dmg

Your spammable is cliff racer. Not zenimax's fault you refuse to use it.

then change cliff racer to ice damage that chills which opens up that set to use.

xbobx

Their changes to assault kind of shows them their mentality.

They kept major fracture on the stamina build and took off major breach and put it on the magic morph.

its interesting because that tells me they dont care about the group affect of the skill only that it benefits the warden with their current build.

now i know you hate the no stun, but will major breach not help the damage of magden if you are running solo content?