Why would I want to cancel an animation?

temjiu

First off, OP you have 2 statements in your post. You are asking what Animation Cancelling is, and then stating that it shouldn't be in the game, so I'm a bit confused. If you understand it enough to not want it in the game, why are you asking what it is? So I will answer the issue of it being in the game, since it seems like you already understand what it is (I'm assuming that your question was rhetorical).

First off, I am one of those people who are challenged in fast reactions. I have a degenerative eye condition, which makes it tough sometimes to be able to see or determine differences in colors and shard detail, especially when I'm tired. And I'm older, and don't have a huge motivation to try and prove myself through amazing feats of wonder in an online fantasy game.

That being said, I don't mind animation cancelling being in the game. Why you ask? It's simple. Because I DON'T NEED TO DO IT TO COMPLETE 90-95% OF THE GAME. The other 5% or so involves high end leaderboard competition, and I simply couldn't care to bother with that. the high end trails could be impacted by that, but at the same time, the high end trials aren't necessary, and the rewards from them are only need if you are going to be doing...more trials.

And before you say, "well, what if I want to be competitive?", I'll point out that in any game where competition is pivotal, ping and latency and physical challenges will affect it. Period. This is nothing new (the latency in this game is a separate issue, it's bad for a AAA title, but the game mechanics shouldn't be based on latency that only; affects a portion of the populace. They should simply fix the latency).

I wasn't a huge fan of AC initially, and I still don't feel like it's necessary or that I have to do it like a pro to finish group content. However, I still find myself doing it, simply because it's there.

....I block during an animation so I don't get stomped by a boss.
...I swing a light attack or a fast skill after a slow one so I don't feel like I have to sit there and pick my nose waiting for an animation I've seen 10,000 times to finish.
...I AC with a light attack on some animations because they simply look cooler paired up.

And this is all w/o even necessarily trying or wanting to. Most people in the game are already doing it. and the whole "it's necessary" is a bunch of bunk. It's ONLY necessary if you plan on wanting to be competitive, and if you do, then go back to my previous paragraph. If you struggle being competitive in this game, you'll struggle being competitive in any game.

I'll say it again because people just don't seem to get it, in thread after thread. YOU DON'T NEED AC TO PLAY ALMOST ALL OF THE GAME OR DO ENOUGH DPS TO PLAY GROUP CONTENT. if your DPS sucks and you can't do group content, honestly it's probably an issue of build or skill rotation more then AC. AC is the tip of the iceberg, it's what you polish AFTER you're already a pro on rotation, boss mechanics, and proper builds. And if you do those things, you wont' need AC. unless you want epeen.

And I can't help you with epeen. My desire for epeen died right around the first time I changed my son's diapers when he was young.

GeorgeBlack

Ppl in eso believe that mastering AC requires 5 years in Tibet.
This false sense of belonging in the skilled category makes them hate you for suggesting that the illusion of higher level of accomplishment should be removed, thus making them plebs "like you".

Everybody can AC.
Not everybody likes the look of a glitched combat.
AC excludes a lot of skills, favouring instant casting abilities, ranged light weaving, SnB for bash passive, builds that can switch from turtle to burst smoother, thus AC is removing a lot of contect that glitched combat cannot support.

People like to feel winners and unique.
1)Fast passed fluid combat 2) reactive combat are bvllshit arguments.
1)Tera Online had blocking countering rolling blinking back in 2011. If you cancelled your attack to block incoming dmg, your atk was cancelled ZERO DMG OUTPUT.
2)reactive and rotation are two opposite concepts.
a)Rotating your atk spams and switching to turtle spams is not reactive combat. It's repetative.
b)Same keys no matter what opponent you are facing: dps, healer, tank.
c)same reaction to CC: break free lose - some stamina.

All those words people are using to defend the AC bullshido should be replaced with "unfortunatly Zos cannot achieve a fluid non glitch looking combat, so we ended up with AC. Learn to use it for more dps, and switch to meta rotations"

Juju_beans

Knowledge wrote: »

F_16C_VIPER wrote: »

Oh god, this guy again.... it's just a troll, everyone. Don't take the bait.

I am by no means trolling anyone and you are only attempting to derail valid discussion focused on cancelling animations that prohibit the less fortunate from playing this game. It is nothing to joke about.

They do not need to produce 40K dps or better to play this game.

I'm 18K-20K and am not prohibited from playing the game.

[Deleted User]

Hello there,

Recently we've had to remove a mass of posts for flaming, baiting and inappropriate content, all being against the Forum Rules. For further posts be sure to stay constructive towards the topic and respectful towards each other. Any continuation of the disruptive behavior that was removed will only lead to action on one's own account.

Thank you for understanding.

NewBlacksmurf

You’d only want to if your goal was to be a min/max player but even then it also takes a lot of practice and experience.

Sucks that it’s a real thing but depending on your intent, you may want to do it.

I’d argue it’s often expected in competitive dps roles for trials or some vet content

Should it be removed entirely. Yes

ol_BANK_lo

Knowledge wrote: »

I'm not really sure I understand why someone would want to cancel an animation that they started. Why start the animation if you have no intention of finishing said animation? I personally think animation cancelling should be removed from the game to aid players with a slower reaction time making the game more accessible.

This subject keeps coming up by people who don't know how to do it, or don't understand it. Maybe this will be the last forum topic on it. Animation cancelling is there and allowed because it allows people to get more skills off in a shorter amount of time, thereby doing more dps. It is not required to complete most content, but helps tremendously the harder the content. If you have to ask, or can't do it, you are already not doing the hardest content. Just the facts. There is a lot to do in the game where you don't need to be able to animation cancel.

You can't make everyone happy, but most every good player in the game, who relies on animation cancelling, would leave...and that's still a lot of people. Those same people, me included, are still not happy with the sustain changes, which started requiring heavy attacks, as it slowed down the pace of the game. It would be much worse if you had to sit and watch every full animation.

Anotherone773

A summary of this thread seems to be:

Casuals: It makes no sense to have to cancel animations to do game content. If full animations are the problem with completing game content, then why are their animations in the game? IE: The system is obviously broken.

Elites: Not being able to animation cancel shows that you are not skilled enough to complete end game content. Thus you should "git gud" and " L2P". Its obviously an intended feature, because they havent fixed it and its " needed" to do end game content.


Lets assume both arguments are valid. If you do a survey of the games population, you will find that an overwhelming majority of players are casual players and not "elites". So why cater to the smallest group when the largest group is what supports the game. You could say it dumbs down the game, but i would argue that the leveling system is what dumbs down a game. Having to do a complex rotation for the sake of trying to impersonate skill is ridiculous. Skill is not about how many buttons you can push in what order at what intervals, you can train a monkey to do that. Skill is about being able to overcome obstacles( mechanics and challenges) not maxing dps. Think about this next time you are trying to find some people to fill an end game raid with.

Biro123

Knowledge wrote: »

I'm not really sure I understand why someone would want to cancel an animation that they started. Why start the animation if you have no intention of finishing said animation? I personally think animation cancelling should be removed from the game to aid players with a slower reaction time making the game more accessible.

Am I reading this right?

You're saying 'I don't understand something and know I don't understand but regardless have a strong enough opinion on it to argue."

Your name is ironic, btw.

Jade1986

Sixty5 wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

At this point it isn't an issue, it's an accepted mechanic in the game

Heh.

An unintended exploit that alters gameplay but ZOS can actually do something about: Cheating.

An unintended exploit that alters gameplay but ZOS can't do anything about, or doesn't want to: "Accepted Mechanic"

An unintended side effect of the combat system that makes combat feel better, that also adds more skill expression.

It's like getting a job, and then meeting the girl of your dreams.

No its not, its like you got a job and everyone is getting promoted because of something you cant see.

Juju_beans

Knowledge wrote: »

I'm not really sure I understand why someone would want to cancel an animation that they started. Why start the animation if you have no intention of finishing said animation? I personally think animation cancelling should be removed from the game to aid players with a slower reaction time making the game more accessible.

Ok, so you don't understand animation cancelling yet you insist it be removed ?

Folks with slower reaction times should worry more about roll dodging than animation cancelling.
Roll dodging can save your life as opposed to looking for higher dps numbers.

NewBlacksmurf

Anotherone773 wrote: »

A summary of this thread seems to be:

Casuals: It makes no sense to have to cancel animations to do game content. If full animations are the problem with completing game content, then why are their animations in the game? IE: The system is obviously broken.

Elites: Not being able to animation cancel shows that you are not skilled enough to complete end game content. Thus you should "git gud" and " L2P". Its obviously an intended feature, because they havent fixed it and its " needed" to do end game content.


Lets assume both arguments are valid. If you do a survey of the games population, you will find that an overwhelming majority of players are casual players and not "elites". So why cater to the smallest group when the largest group is what supports the game. You could say it dumbs down the game, but i would argue that the leveling system is what dumbs down a game. Having to do a complex rotation for the sake of trying to impersonate skill is ridiculous. Skill is not about how many buttons you can push in what order at what intervals, you can train a monkey to do that. Skill is about being able to overcome obstacles( mechanics and challenges) not maxing dps. Think about this next time you are trying to find some people to fill an end game raid with.

Or

Why not fix the situation because it is a problem if it’s “allowed” but requires accidental knowledge or skill. Considering it’s intentionally omitted from the leveling guide....patch notes even suggest changes to animation that suggested to some it was being removed and to some extent has changed.

Casual or Elite

It seems a simple fix. Increase the dmg and require that animations all complete.

Not sure why it’s been a discussions since release IMO

Robo_Hobo

Getting rid of animation cancelling would make it even worse for people with a bad reaction time. Blocking and dodge rolling during an ability also cuts it short, or, "cancels" it - but in many fights that's what you need to do. Imagine if a boss starts up a heavy attack that will one shot you unless you block or dodge roll it, but you didn't react quick enough and started an ability with a long animation (like endless hail). Without animation cancelling you wouldn't be able to block or dodge roll, you would be stuck in the animation and just have to accept death from the heavy attack, which wouldn't actually hit you for another full second - enough time to react if you had animation cancelling.

GeorgeBlack

I would like to see other video games and their combat. But with a twist. AC is added to them "as a feature"
Lets c how bad they would look. As bad as eso combat looks I rec

SanTii.92

Knowledge wrote: »

aliyavana wrote: »

No, git gud

I'm failing to understand why cancelling an animation makes someone good.

Because, you know, this is also a competitive game, and one of the (few) instances that the game rewards, skill and dedication is with consistant and proper laid down of animation cancels.

Same reason why, for example, fighting games are build around the idea of trying to maximize combos.

SanTii.92

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

Ppl in eso believe that mastering AC requires 5 years in Tibet.
This false sense of belonging in the skilled category makes them hate you for suggesting that the illusion of higher level of accomplishment should be removed, thus making them plebs "like you".

Everybody can AC.
Not everybody likes the look of a glitched combat.
AC excludes a lot of skills, favouring instant casting abilities, ranged light weaving, SnB for bash passive, builds that can switch from turtle to burst smoother, thus AC is removing a lot of contect that glitched combat cannot support.

People like to feel winners and unique.
1)Fast passed fluid combat 2) reactive combat are bvllshit arguments.
1)Tera Online had blocking countering rolling blinking back in 2011. If you cancelled your attack to block incoming dmg, your atk was cancelled ZERO DMG OUTPUT.
2)reactive and rotation are two opposite concepts.
a)Rotating your atk spams and switching to turtle spams is not reactive combat. It's repetative.
b)Same keys no matter what opponent you are facing: dps, healer, tank.
c)same reaction to CC: break free lose - some stamina.

All those words people are using to defend the AC bullshido should be replaced with "unfortunatly Zos cannot achieve a fluid non glitch looking combat, so we ended up with AC. Learn to use it for more dps, and switch to meta rotations"

The only reason why top parses are so is, quite literally, perfecting your rotation and animation cancels. Trying to downplay the impact of it is rather stupid really.

klowdy1

Knowledge wrote: »

dovakiin5574 wrote: »

Knowledge wrote: »

I'm not really sure I understand why someone would want to cancel an animation that they started. Why start the animation if you have no intention of finishing said animation?

It makes DPS rotations faster and allows a player to BLOCK during certain boss mechanics so they have an opportunity to avoid getting 1-hit-KO'ed (unlike Dark Souls)

Knowledge wrote: »

I personally think animation cancelling should be removed from the game to aid players with a slower reaction time making the game more accessible.

This would make 99% of players angry. The point of this type of game *IS* to have a high/fast reaction time to be good at it. Players with slower reaction times should look more into single player games or perhaps getting a console CONTROLLER (I use one) either Xbox or PS ones for their PC. If you are already on console then I would suggest single player games.

Also, you could just not animation cancel yourself. That works fine, you just wont be pulling >30k DPS - If you tank or heal you don't really *need* to animation cancel so there's that.

What if an individual is impaired and cannot react fast enough but wishes to play an MMORPG based on The Elder Scrolls universe? Should that person not be allowed to play or have the game be made harder specifically to counter their ability to play it?

I'm not a fan of animation canceling, I can do it, but it isn't the best mechanic to make combat better. That said, if you can't animation cancel, you can still play this game just fine. You won't be competing with the best of the best, but not many do. The only thing you miss out on is trials, and that can be alleviated with 7 friends/guildies.

Wayshuba

The majority of content can be beat without animation cancelling it just some fights require more coordination to accomplish it. That being said, some of the content does have DPS checks that require all DPS to be on their A game.

Animation cancelling is especially critical when you are in the process of attacking and suddenly have to block. So it can't really be removed from the game.

Additionally, like any MMO, some players try to maximize what they can get out of their chosen gameplay style. DPS in ESO are trying to squeak every last point of damage they can lay down as fast as possible. Healers are trying to keep buffs up, resources restored and keep everyone's health up. Tanks are debuffing the boss while buffing the party and party's damage.

Whatever is your preference, some of the Veteran content (particularly DLC dungeons and trials), requires you to be at a certain level - and this is a good thing. Otherwise, some players would get bored of not having a challenge. For example, most players who have mastered their chosen discipline can breeze through vanilla area Vet dungeons - frequently sometimes checking their group settings because it seems to easy. Yet, Vet Cradle of Shadows, Fang Lair and other DLC dungeons still require them to be on their A game. Same can be said of trials.

The game needs a balance of content to try and appeal to all players. Animation cancelling is needed for this tougher content and should be. If one has trouble with it in rotations, then maybe a tank or healer would be a better class to play for this type of content.

rustic_potato

Wow another animation cancelling thread. The game doesn't need animation cancelling to be played. However it adds a tier of play attained either through skill or repeated muscle memory. Latency is not really an issue doing it as people playing from high latency regions do it just fine.

Potatoes who don't want to get to that level are the ones that usually complain about it. The ones who are not able to do it due to physical conditions are just fine where they are.

KiraTsukasa

Sounds to me like a clever use of game mechanics.

srfrogg23

Meh. I get to push buttons really fast and stuff happens. Seems fine to me.

Nihility42

Why is this STILL a discussion? Let it go. Animation cancelling is an important part of the game's combat. It's not going anywhere. And it's not the bogeyman people seem to think it is. It doesn't really have any great effect on PVE DPS, and it's important to PVP, but only one of many things that you need to learn to PVP.

Knowledge

Nihility42 wrote: »

Why is this STILL a discussion? Let it go. Animation cancelling is an important part of the game's combat. It's not going anywhere. And it's not the bogeyman people seem to think it is. It doesn't really have any great effect on PVE DPS, and it's important to PVP, but only one of many things that you need to learn to PVP.

It's still a discussion because it's a problem.

rustic_potato

Knowledge wrote: »

Nihility42 wrote: »

Why is this STILL a discussion? Let it go. Animation cancelling is an important part of the game's combat. It's not going anywhere. And it's not the bogeyman people seem to think it is. It doesn't really have any great effect on PVE DPS, and it's important to PVP, but only one of many things that you need to learn to PVP.

It's still a discussion because it's a problem.

No its not. ZOS lead game combat dev has said that it is a core part of the game. So it is a problem only if you can't spend a couple of hours learning it.

ValkynSketha

Because they are ugly.

ecru

Colecovision wrote: »

Knowledge wrote: »

I'm not really sure I understand why someone would want to cancel an animation that they started. Why start the animation if you have no intention of finishing said animation? I personally think animation cancelling should be removed from the game to aid players with a slower reaction time making the game more accessible.

It's like jazz drummers that leave the beat implied. You know it's there, so let's move on and just enjoy the show.

this is a really good analogy and the thread should have ended here imo

Sjizzle

damn u want now cancel animation ?? in other thread u want to buy CP's ....learn the game use your mouse software to make macros... no need to be NASA engineer to make a cancel animation !!!!
Cancel animation = more dmg.... more dmg faster clear !

what u ask here is something like removing the macros from WoW

instead for asking useless things on the forum Learn The Game mechanics !!!!

Knowledge

Sjizzle wrote: »

damn u want now cancel animation ?? in other thread u want to buy CP's ....learn the game use your mouse software to make macros... no need to be NASA engineer to make a cancel animation !!!!
Cancel animation = more dmg.... more dmg faster clear !

what u ask here is something like removing the macros from WoW

instead for asking useless things on the forum Learn The Game mechanics !!!!

I think an easier CP grind and no animation cancelling is an ideal goal.

Sjizzle

Knowledge wrote: »

I think an easier CP grind and no animation cancelling is an ideal goal.

LEARN TO PLAY or go an play other games ....cancel animation is a part of this game and will be a part of this game !
in all game u need to grind here u grind only 1 time in other games u grind for the same character 3 time like AP in WoW and in next Xpack the azerite ..... so play the game and learn the mechanics easy


PS if u can not do it that doesn't mean that must be removed !!!! LEARN and PLAY

Knowledge

ZOS_AntonioP wrote: »

Hello there,

Recently we've had to remove a mass of posts for flaming, baiting and inappropriate content, all being against the Forum Rules. For further posts be sure to stay constructive towards the topic and respectful towards each other. Any continuation of the disruptive behavior that was removed will only lead to action on one's own account.

Thank you for understanding.

Thank you for your assistance and for being a community moderator.

munster1404

mesmerizedish wrote: »

Animation canceling is an unnecessary impediment to those who play with 250ms+ latencies, such as p. much anyone in Oceania.

It really is the responsibility of the developers of an MMO to make as sure as is reasonable that skill really is the limiting factor and not things entirely outside of players' control, like what country they live in.

It's one thing to say "hey, if you've got the skills, you can eke out a couple thousand more dps." It's another to say "oh, and also, if you live in Australia, you're screwed."

I was told animation cancelling is doable in higher pings except at really high levels such as 450ms+. At least that's what my ex guild members say. The ping needs to be consistent so players can adapt to the lag.

I can't do any animation cancelling or light weaving consistently. That's the main reason why I main a tank; I don't die to minor silly mistakes. Makes it less frustrating. Lol