Vvardenfell is huge yet so empty - do you like this design approach?

helediron

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

The reason Moronwind feel so sparse is that it was originally slated to be a DLC. Its content and activity density are most similar to either wrothgar or craglorn both of which were DLCs. This was in the era were ZOS told us there were going to be 4 DLC per year. But shortly after promising that, ZOS got this great idea of pretending Moronwind wasn't a DLC, because then they could screw over subscribers and charge more money for the same thing. Tack on a class that was mothballed since beta and BAM you have an expansion.

Now that they have set this precident, they get to choose the biggest DLC, call it something else, and then make more money from it since they don't have to make it free with subscription as originally promised.

But Moronwind was hollow inside and now everyone has seen that. My friend @MisterBigglesworth said it best with one image.

It's actually 53% bigger than Wrothgar and 64% bigger than Craglorn, and that's not counting the inaccessible areas. It was the biggest zone in the game, by a wide margin.

Source: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/339865/vvardenfell-overworld-is-64-26-larger-than-craglorn-and-52-90-larger-than-wrothgar-with-math/p1

And this is a perfect example how making something bigger does not make it better.

TheCyberDruid

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Did you miss the entire point of this thread? It FEELS empty. Notice that I said content and activity density. Not physical size. I'm not just talking about the inaccessible volcano, i'm talking about the accessible parts that are barren with nothing to do. Tons of dwemer ruins that you could actually go into in TES 3: Morrowind, but can't do anything but look at in Moronwind. All of the islands of Sheogorad that were explorable in TES 3 but not even included in this DLC. So its the biggest map. Hooray for being technically correct. It's barren.

Amen.

Yes, there's a new class and a new game mode. But the problem is there is too much land for too less things to do otherwise.

dodgehopper_ESO

helediron wrote: »

It was bad world design.

• wayshrines in useless places.
• Huge cliffs you need to go around for dailies.
• Land littered with small obstacles.

It's the only area where traveling keeps me cursing all the time. I just didn't like it at all. Waste of money. Just to compare, CWC has kept me entertained much, much longer. How can little, ESO+ funded DLC be so much better than expansion-priced "chapter"?

Play Grahtwood more.

Jade1986

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

I wouldnt mind it so much if they would add to it in the future. But we all know THAT wont happen.

helediron

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

helediron wrote: »

It was bad world design.

• wayshrines in useless places.
• Huge cliffs you need to go around for dailies.
• Land littered with small obstacles.

It's the only area where traveling keeps me cursing all the time. I just didn't like it at all. Waste of money. Just to compare, CWC has kept me entertained much, much longer. How can little, ESO+ funded DLC be so much better than expansion-priced "chapter"?

Play Grahtwood more.

Played Grahtwood more, approximately 53 times.

luen79rwb17_ESO

Not only huge and empty, terrain was atrocious. It's a chore to get form point A to point B. Which is btw what you usually had to do with 90% of quests. In this aspect, I didn't have fun with Morrowind I must a say.

Loves_guars

I like it!

I like it this way, feels less mmorish with less mob packs, this way actually is a lot better for exploration, imo.

Kodrac wrote: »

The zone is fine, but Viviec City is a pain in the ass to navigate.

It was a pain in TES III too... so I say, kudos to the dev team xD

Elvent

I like it!

I thought it was a nice zone to explore. I didn't really feel the emptiness. And it sure isn't empty of players that's for sure.

Leogon

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

Apache_Kid wrote: »

It would've been great If other cities offered more services like Vivec.

This. Also, let's not forget about all the inaccessible buildings.

Iccotak

I like it!

I think Morrowind just needs more enemies wandering around

theskymoves

Could have been better!

wayfarerx wrote: »

TheCyberDruid wrote: »

The fact that there are no stablemasters in all of Vvardenfell combined with the fact how vast it is... it's really not hard to see what they tried to do there. You can even see that they aimed for more content and just blocked it off in the end. Wrothgar has a great balance between content and space, so it's a bit baffling why Vvardenfell is the big empty.

There's a stablemaster right between the Vivec City wayshrine and the silt-strider station, I use him every day.

And another in Balmora, also near the strider port.

Narvuntien

Could have been better!

I like the empty space between the towns but I feel like the towns needed to be more fleshed out, too many locked doors and they lack amenities.

Also you can't get inside the dwavern ruins and most of the daedric ruins are pretty empty and pointless.

Jusey1

I honestly don't see how it is empty. The map is pretty filled with places to go to, explore, and see again. The quests are amazing and well written too on top of that, and many other elements that makes the world feel so alive and free. The only real complaints I have is the lack of Red Mountain exploration we can do and the fact that we can't go to the Dagon Fel island up north, but they made it up a little with the Forgotten Wastes Public Dungeon, plus the island down south (which is a huge nod to an official mod that was released for free for Morrowind).

I think the biggest problem with this zone is that it has a lot less to do with ESO and more to do with "The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind". It's filled to the brim with nostalgia and pays so much respect to the 3rd game in the main series while still being an ESO expansion. The problem with this is that it doesn't appeases the ESO crowd as much as it could've but as a long term fan of the series... I personally love and welcome the nostalgia.

leeux

No option to say "I completely dislike it, no buts or howevers..."

Morrowind was just a cash grab, pandering to nostalgia to justify the huge nerf to sustain we had to suffer on that patch... they couldn't possibly have done that without the cover of "Hey look... we did Morrowind again!"

And zone design and quests show that.

Just my opinion, ofc.

FloppyTouch

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

I know this is not a popular opinion but I hated elder scrolls 3. Was a horrible game and even for that time the graphics where horrible and nothing like swinging a sword and not feeling like ur hitting anything at all.

Now for ESO even though I played the original I still hated it. Ugly map just like TES 3 and tons of nothing traveling was just horrible reminded me a lot of the AD zones and why I hate them. The quest boring, tried so hard to get into it but ended up skipping it all and rushing it just to get it done.

Truth be told I was not going to buy this chapter I mean expensive dlc, I still don't have a warden I think it's a dumb class. I only got it to play bgs with my friends that's it and even those they failed at. With the long wait for que to get in most of my friends gave up on this game.

The horrible nerfs to sustain hurt more then anything else made doing pve on a mdk just a pain love how they keep trying to kill the only class I like.

I will buy this new chapter even though I know it's going to be a huge piece of failed crap but I still want that stuff that come with it. Not the map that will be empty not the quest those are boring but the pay to win stuff like the maybe skill line and I'm sure jewelry crafting will be linked to it some how.

monktoasty

Could have been better!

Could use more stuff

Wolfenbelle

Could have been better!

The Vvardenfell esthetic is not my thing. Giant mushrooms everywhere. Cramped roads and long rides through scenery I don't like. Vivec City is truly a pain to navigate. The dailies are boring. And yes, the map feels empty in the sense that all of the activities occur in a relatively small portion of the map along those cramped twisty roads and in the towns.

The quests are ok, with interesting stories.

The worst part of the Morrowind release is the -- I agree -- horrible nerf to sustain. I still don't get the point of that. I hate having to rely on heavy attacks for help with sustain.

Ermiq

I like it!

I love open spaces! I hate Skyrim and Fallout4 for their minimized zones with 3*4 meters cities, and where the next city is in 5 steps from the previous one. I hate that level design.
And I really love ESO for wide open spaces. Just compare TESV Skyrim and ESO Skyrim. Riften in TESV, oh, what the... Are you really trying to say that someone could live in this tight and compressed box which you called a city?

srfrogg23

I like it!

I’m ok with it. It didn’t seem too empty to me. I Ike to explore a bit without constant interruptions from NPCs, though.

Stinkyremy

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

Seraphayel wrote: »

Title says it all.

Vvardenfell is such a gigantic zone but there is barely anything in it. Lots of empty spaces and not many quests or hidden incentives. In comparison to other zones it is visually stunning but boring to explore.

Do you like this approach of zone design? Or do you dislike it?

I actually think it is a rip off "chapter" it is no bigger than wrothgar DLC, actually smaller in explorable area. There is pretty much nothing to do after the main quest, which was just the same length as wrothgars. The only difference from this to other DLC;s is that they added a class, and death match. We didn't even need either.

Aquanova

Could have been better!

I wish ZOS would update zones, like add new dropped sets and new world bosses to the existing zones to keep them interesting especially a paid for dlc zone.

MarrazzMist

I like it!

Sorry, it’s never seemed or felt empty to me.

Autumnhart

Could have been better!

Doors that can't be opened and interesting places that can't be accessed should never happen again.

necr0o

Could have been better!

Cities/towns should’ve been done a lot better - was really disappointed with the Balmora approach.. lots of locked doors and blocked off areas

Starlight_Knight

Don't really care...

As far as the zone goes it was an enjoyable little thing, but as ive been playing E$O since launch the most things i look forward to from ZO$ are end game content (that isnt grindy elitist trials) and base game performance improvements, and class balances

Dojohoda

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

.. especially considering the price tag on this. There are too many places that are closed off.

Lunarhound

I like it!

One of the things that's always irked me about ESO is the quest density. There are too many, in far too small of a space. Whatever the reason may be, I liked that Vvardenfell spaced out quests more. Every single square inch of the map doesn't need to be crammed full of things and people shouting at me for help. I hate taking a quest and, while trying to do it, having someone else constantly waving at me from the road or running up to me to tell me about their kidnapped child/spouse/dog.

cyclonus11

Empty as in the traversable terrain has nothing in it, or empty as in there's a bunch of map that you can't get to?

Seraphayel

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

cyclonus11 wrote: »

Empty as in the traversable terrain has nothing in it, or empty as in there's a bunch of map that you can't get to?

Empty as "much space, nothing to do there".

Vermintide

Don't like the amount of empty, "useless" space

Feels like they took a normal zone and stretched it out tbh. And then threw a ton of those impassable cliff-sides in for good measure.

Trouble is this is an MMO- the world and its content are more static than a single player game. So It doesn't matter how many more dungeons or whatever they put in, it would still feel empty and dead. There's no interesting AI to mess with, no hand-placed loot to stumble on.

Either way though it's undeniable some areas of it, particularly on the northern edge of the island, are literally empty and pointless. It's nothing but a road you can run down.