ESO PVP is a Joke < ! >

VirtualElizabeth

Baranthus wrote: »

I'm mediocre, don't one shot people, die a LOT and I still LOVE PvP. Sorry!

YES, a thousand times this! Frankly I LEARN by dying. It forces me to change combos or even gear. The "meta" doesn't always work or guarantee 100%. What works for player A &B may not work for me at all.

In fact I find that 70% of the time the meta doesn't work for me.

@Mr_Gallows Aren't "builds" indeed player input? Also you are referring to different builds within GW2 - so aren't "builds" still impactful even in GW2?

/me confused

Sergykid

pvp indeed is the most disturbing and unbalanced thing in this game. I've been in love since the first time i entered the game, and even pvp fascinated me. But now, over time, i learned about it, and i start to hate it more and more.

horse simulator, great unbalance. There should not be possible for one player to kill another 5 by himself. The skill cap is too big. That may be a good thing, but you have to learn every animation, every class skill, when to dodge, what is dodgeable, kiting, all sets what do and how react with other sets, etc etc etc. There's so much to know and still the game doesn't teach you anything from these.

For me it's completely stupid that after so much investment and work to learn and improve you maybe finally beat someone 1-1, then finally maybe win a 1v2, there's someone else that simply 1v10. You being among them, with golden gear good rotation good build etc etc and still not just he doesn't die, he actually even kills you too. This should not be possible, balance is very broken in these cases. It's not a thing about L2P, it's about meta all the time, like cost increase poisons, specific abilities and sets.

Caleb_Kadesh

Sergykid wrote: »

pvp indeed is the most disturbing and unbalanced thing in this game. I've been in love since the first time i entered the game, and even pvp fascinated me. But now, over time, i learned about it, and i start to hate it more and more.

horse simulator, great unbalance. There should not be possible for one player to kill another 5 by himself. The skill cap is too big. That may be a good thing, but you have to learn every animation, every class skill, when to dodge, what is dodgeable, kiting, all sets what do and how react with other sets, etc etc etc. There's so much to know and still the game doesn't teach you anything from these.

For me it's completely stupid that after so much investment and work to learn and improve you maybe finally beat someone 1-1, then finally maybe win a 1v2, there's someone else that simply 1v10. You being among them, with golden gear good rotation good build etc etc and still not just he doesn't die, he actually even kills you too. This should not be possible, balance is very broken in these cases. It's not a thing about L2P, it's about meta all the time, like cost increase poisons, specific abilities and sets.

I have the same problem. I play tennis. I have the same racket as the pros. I practice as much as the pros, bu they won't let me compete at Wimbledon. They say I have to qualify. Tennis is all about the meta. Balance is very broken in tennis.

Mr_Gallows

@VirtualElizabeth

Builds are not player input in the sense that I consider meaningful for determining player skill.

Take race car driving. Driver skill is what he does on the track. Mechanic skill is what is done to the car. There is a reason competitive sports have rather strict control of what may assist a competitors skill.

I see builds like that, some use better tires and some go all the way and use illegal drugs to help them. For player skill I am talking about the fight itself.

Yes gear does matter in GW2, but the balance of the numbers are much better. There is a very standardized ceiling and there are not multiple sources of stat stacking as there is in ESO. So while there are many builds, armor sets (runes) etc. it is much better controlled. This is the main reason GW2 was quite big in e-sports.

As for Tennis. Give a good player the worst racket and he'll still beat you. Give an ESO "pro" player the worst gear/stats and an amateur the very best meta gear. Even a child could beat the pro. So no... tennis is not unbalanced. Gear matters a lot in ESO, but tennis rackets are not game changers across levels of skill.

CyrusArya

Mr_Gallows wrote: »

As for Tennis. Give a good player the worst racket and he'll still beat you. Give an ESO "pro" player the worst gear/stats and an amateur the very best meta gear. Even a child could beat the pro. So no... tennis is not unbalanced. Gear matters a lot in ESO, but tennis rackets are not game changers across levels of skill.

Giving someone the “worst build and stats” is not asking a pro to play with an average racket...it’s asking them to play with a broken one. Bad analogy, just like most of the logic in your posts. In eso, a player in a simple but functional and reasonable build will stomp a bad player in a best in slot build pretty consistently. But tennis and eso are wildly different games so the analogy might be bad to begin with.

The root problem is, like I said, too many entitled baddies. No doubt gear plays a major role in this game. But your complete dismissal of player controlled mechanical elements is telling of where you stand. My suggestion to you and all similar whiners is that you learn and develop a bit more as a player before assuming your input and balance concerns are worth entertaining.

Pijng

Mr_Gallows wrote: »

@VirtualElizabeth

Builds are not player input in the sense that I consider meaningful for determining player skill.

Take race car driving. Driver skill is what he does on the track. Mechanic skill is what is done to the car. There is a reason competitive sports have rather strict control of what may assist a competitors skill.

I see builds like that, some use better tires and some go all the way and use illegal drugs to help them. For player skill I am talking about the fight itself.

Yes gear does matter in GW2, but the balance of the numbers are much better. There is a very standardized ceiling and there are not multiple sources of stat stacking as there is in ESO. So while there are many builds, armor sets (runes) etc. it is much better controlled. This is the main reason GW2 was quite big in e-sports.

As for Tennis. Give a good player the worst racket and he'll still beat you. Give an ESO "pro" player the worst gear/stats and an amateur the very best meta gear. Even a child could beat the pro. So no... tennis is not unbalanced. Gear matters a lot in ESO, but tennis rackets are not game changers across levels of skill.

Give me the best gear and give Heresya (for example) the worst – and no doubt I'll lose. Sorry, it doesn't work this way.

technohic

The problem with the tennis analogy is; the pro tennis players don’t come and play at the local park and start power serving multiple beginners in the face rather than go play the other pro who’s at another park doing the same thing.

That said; it’s a terrible analogy to begin with. A non team sport does not match up with large scale Cyrodiil. And if you don’t want to get Xv1ed , maybe don’t start chasing someone around a resource tower, rock, and trees.

FearlessOne_2014

Mr_Gallows wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Mr_Gallows wrote: »

Yes memeboi... very good. You score teh pwns long time

Sorry, I stopped playing attention when it became clear you wanted to talk about GW2 instead of ESO.

* rereads thread *

I'm not sure that GW2 offers me much of anything. You see, I love Cyrodiil in all its laggy, zergy, solo, ganker, small scale, organized raids, 1v1, 1vX, Xv1, faction-stacking, emperor pushing, dethroning, Alessia bridge farming, Remember the Chalamo fight, ring-around-the-home-keeps, scroll running glory.

If you can't tell, competitive PVP isn't what I'm there for. I'm in Cyrodiil to have fun, to play with my guildies, to wipe enemy raids, and to play the map. My player versus player starts with out-thinking the enemy and ends with wiping the enemy while helping my faction win the war.

So from that standpoint, there are specific skills and gear sets that are annoying at worst, but none that actually touch my enjoyment of PVP in Cyrodiil. Not everyone plays the game as I do, but not everyone plays the game as you do, either.

I can understand that and I actually agree. Cyrodill is absolutely amazing, even with the lag. But I would really love to see them revamp the combat system. Not to make it play like GW2, because they are different games - but GW is a good example of design principles that work better. While no cooldown, free choice of skills and everything is cool in theory, it does create massive issues for gameplay.

Yup GW2 is so much better... Can I have what every you'er high on please?


https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/26534/the-game-is-at-its-worst-since-release

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/25823/matchmaking-by-anet

Mr_Gallows wrote: »

@VirtualElizabeth

Builds are not player input in the sense that I consider meaningful for determining player skill.

Take race car driving. Driver skill is what he does on the track. Mechanic skill is what is done to the car. There is a reason competitive sports have rather strict control of what may assist a competitors skill.

I see builds like that, some use better tires and some go all the way and use illegal drugs to help them. For player skill I am talking about the fight itself.

Yes gear does matter in GW2, but the balance of the numbers are much better. There is a very standardized ceiling and there are not multiple sources of stat stacking as there is in ESO. So while there are many builds, armor sets (runes) etc. it is much better controlled. This is the main reason GW2 was quite big in e-sports.

As for Tennis. Give a good player the worst racket and he'll still beat you. Give an ESO "pro" player the worst gear/stats and an amateur the very best meta gear. Even a child could beat the pro. So no... tennis is not unbalanced. Gear matters a lot in ESO, but tennis rackets are not game changers across levels of skill.

Wait what?.....

https://youtu.be/wKjxFJfcrcA

Neither is paying to win with some mechanically overpowered Elite Spec. That is soo easy a brain dead monkey can be successful at it, against decent players who don't have access to said Elite Specs.

And how did that eSports venture go for GW2? Here I'll answer that for you... http://massivelyop.com/2017/04/04/esl-gaming-is-shutting-down-guild-wars-2s-e-sports-section/

@Mr_Gallows you come here trying to recruit ESO players, to experience the sad excuses of PvP GW2 has. At least here we have loads of "Competitive Build Options." In GW2 you basically have maybe one competitive build per a class, if you are lucky.{Looks a current Revenant} Also since GW2 is unofficially a P2W PvE MMO now.

The paywall specs like Scourge, Mirage, Firebrand, and Holosmith, have such a huge gap in powercreep compared to prior specs that you are pretty much gimping yourself in PvP.

I mean sure i get, coming from a P2W F2P skill-less super casual MMO. A player like yourself will have some adjustment issues. More so when moving from a Skill-less P2W F2P MMO to a somewhat skill-based non casual B2P MMO. I recommend you trying to improve your ESO's gameplay. After a while you will start to notice your performance increase many folds.

Also giving the example of 10 - 15 zerglings who can't be bothered to learn how to play. Instead just relies on strength in number to soak up damage against highly dedicated and trained players. Is very poor and not so thought out example. As unlike in GW2, in ESO the skill-gap is much more higher than the class or gear gap. Not to mention ZOS is completely revamping this game's combat, so my guess is the whole mindless stack numbers and burn tactics, will thankfully be completely nerfed.

But as I've said before. I don't thank you are seriously trying have a dialogue here. You are just simply here to troll. Because skill gap in this game is 100 times higher then GW2's PvP will ever dream to being. Sorry you actually have to learn to play in this game. As there is no P2W Elite Spec, or out of game METAs that will carry you to victory in this game. You have to actually use your brain here if you want to be successful.

Unless you are just fine with just mindlessly Fail-Zerging down the map with 15 - 24 other can't be bothered to L2P zerglings. Getting completely crushed by any small group of players who have L2P. And in some cases those few solo players who have such a mastery on the combat system here in ESO. That they are able to go head to head with 5 plus bad zerglings and win, no matter what gear those bad zerglings have on. [Because skill in this game means something, unlike in GW2.]

Mr_Gallows

Fearless one you wonderful toxic memeboi.

You keep just spewing crap, in pointless strawman arguments.

I already explained it's not about which game is best. GWs system is easier to balance because the stats are more streamlined. More streamlined stats where extreme stacking isn't a thing would be good for ESO.

Not trying to recuit eso players so stop whining about it already princess.

So you're saying eso is perfect and without issues. Magic Mushrooms? There's a strawman for you to dance with. Give him a hug and a big kiss.

Mr_Gallows

Fearless one you wonderful toxic memeboi.

You keep just spewing crap, in pointless strawman arguments.

I already explained it's not about which game is best. GWs system is easier to balance because the stats are more streamlined. More streamlined stats where extreme stacking isn't a thing would be good for ESO.

Not trying to recuit eso players so stop whining about it already princess. I play ESO and have done so since beta. I like the game, but it has flaws that could, to use your own words, make the game a 100 times better if they were fixed.

So you're saying eso is perfect and without issues. Magic Mushrooms? There's a strawman for you to dance with. Give him a hug and a big kiss.


A general piece of advice to everyone. Control the Teenage hormones. I am not Black and white about this. And when I mention GW2 it is not' to say ESO is the gimp of that game. But some things like the core balance of stats, healing/damage etc are balanced better. That does not mean GW2 is perfect, and the question of it being better or not is really irrelevant. Don't interpret everything in that defensive teenage black and white mindset.

GW2 has very controlled healing, compared to eso. Damage has a smaller variance as well. This is easier to balance.

So relax. It feels like having a discussion with a kid who thinks everything in the world is just the worst and life is over, because he dropped his ice cream, or got told to clean his room.

Pijng

Mr_Gallows wrote: »

Fearless one you wonderful toxic memeboi.

You keep just spewing crap, in pointless strawman arguments.

I already explained it's not about which game is best. GWs system is easier to balance because the stats are more streamlined. More streamlined stats where extreme stacking isn't a thing would be good for ESO.

Not trying to recuit eso players so stop whining about it already princess. I play ESO and have done so since beta. I like the game, but it has flaws that could, to use your own words, make the game a 100 times better if they were fixed.

So you're saying eso is perfect and without issues. Magic Mushrooms? There's a strawman for you to dance with. Give him a hug and a big kiss.


A general piece of advice to everyone. Control the Teenage hormones. I am not Black and white about this. And when I mention GW2 it is not' to say ESO is the gimp of that game. But some things like the core balance of stats, healing/damage etc are balanced better. That does not mean GW2 is perfect, and the question of it being better or not is really irrelevant. Don't interpret everything in that defensive teenage black and white mindset.

GW2 has very controlled healing, compared to eso. Damage has a smaller variance as well. This is easier to balance.

So relax. It feels like having a discussion with a kid who thinks everything in the world is just the worst and life is over, because he dropped his ice cream, or got told to clean his room.

Well, ok, GWs system is better and easier to balance. ESOs system isn't and that's true (if we talking about balance theme as the main one). That's all? I think this is the answer for the whole thread.

Mr_Gallows

Yes that's the gist of it really.

I don't want ESO to become GW2. There are things in GW2's core setup that is valuable to think about in terms of balance. P2W, elite classes and all that is irrelevant. It's about the core, before classes and talents are factored in. Individual skills can be balanced in eso if the core works.

Mr_Gallows

One thing that could work is to seperate set bonuses from gear. You would have a number of slots for set effects (5 would be a good number). Then you could either have a full set or mix and match for incomplete sets. Generally reduce the stacking

FearlessOne_2014

Pijng wrote: »

Mr_Gallows wrote: »

Fearless one you wonderful toxic memeboi.

You keep just spewing crap, in pointless strawman arguments.

I already explained it's not about which game is best. GWs system is easier to balance because the stats are more streamlined. More streamlined stats where extreme stacking isn't a thing would be good for ESO.

Not trying to recuit eso players so stop whining about it already princess. I play ESO and have done so since beta. I like the game, but it has flaws that could, to use your own words, make the game a 100 times better if they were fixed.

So you're saying eso is perfect and without issues. Magic Mushrooms? There's a strawman for you to dance with. Give him a hug and a big kiss.


A general piece of advice to everyone. Control the Teenage hormones. I am not Black and white about this. And when I mention GW2 it is not' to say ESO is the gimp of that game. But some things like the core balance of stats, healing/damage etc are balanced better. That does not mean GW2 is perfect, and the question of it being better or not is really irrelevant. Don't interpret everything in that defensive teenage black and white mindset.

GW2 has very controlled healing, compared to eso. Damage has a smaller variance as well. This is easier to balance.

So relax. It feels like having a discussion with a kid who thinks everything in the world is just the worst and life is over, because he dropped his ice cream, or got told to clean his room.

Well, ok, GWs system is better and easier to balance. ESOs system isn't and that's true (if we talking about balance theme as the main one). That's all? I think this is the answer for the whole thread.

But that is the thing, GW2's system is much easier to balance then ESO. Because It's dumb down to the point a 3 year old monkey can be successful in it. Just stacking in a corner and burning down the bosses

However even tho GW2's system is much easier to balance. The fact still reminds that the balance in GW2 is worse then ESO's by factor of at least 3 times. The WvW meta is people just server stacking Scourges and Firebrands. All the Thieves specs, and all of the Mesmer's specs. Push almost every other class out of small scale to solo combat. Because the mechanics just make these classes completely overtuned. To the point the other classes don't have a place other then getting their faces pushed in. Which is the main reason the roaming scene in that game is more or less dead.

Now if OP was talking about GW2 pre-Heart of Thorns. I would completely agree with him. However since ANet stop trying to balance for effect and started imbalancing the game on purpose for quick easy and effortless money. GW2's systems across the board are mechanically bad, in terms of modern day MMO standards.

ESO is not perfect either, I'm not saying that one bit. However going to GW2 from ESO, in the two MMOs current states. Is like downgrading from X-Box One to a Super Nintendo.

Also for @Mr_Gallows since you don't understand the difference between evidence and a strawman argument. Here you go....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Now that you know what it actually is. You can now attempt to throw that term around with some precision.

Sergykid

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

Sorry you actually have to learn to play in this game. As there is no P2W Elite Spec, or out of game METAs that will carry you to victory in this game. You have to actually use your brain here if you want to be successful.

that's the problem with the game. Yes you need brain, skill cap is high, that's very good from both. BUT, to be at least competitive in ESO and not just resource generation for enemy's heavy attacks:

1) you have to learn all animations, skills, what is dodgeable, what sets do, how they react against certain skills, what other sets do against those, etc
2) you must learn and search on wikis how to improve both your dps and resistances, like to put max stam or wep dmg? how much impenetrable i need? what's defensive resistances cap?
3) the game doesn't give you all the above information. You have to learn it the raw way. This takes very much time, and very much failure. Preparing for pvp is not fun, is a grind, a chore. You may be happy once it's done, but someone else will come and 1vX ur party.

FearlessOne_2014

Sergykid wrote: »

FearlessOne_2014 wrote: »

Sorry you actually have to learn to play in this game. As there is no P2W Elite Spec, or out of game METAs that will carry you to victory in this game. You have to actually use your brain here if you want to be successful.

that's the problem with the game. Yes you need brain, skill cap is high, that's very good from both. BUT, to be at least competitive in ESO and not just resource generation for enemy's heavy attacks:

1) you have to learn all animations, skills, what is dodgeable, what sets do, how they react against certain skills, what other sets do against those, etc
2) you must learn and search on wikis how to improve both your dps and resistances, like to put max stam or wep dmg? how much impenetrable i need? what's defensive resistances cap?
3) the game doesn't give you all the above information. You have to learn it the raw way. This takes very much time, and very much failure. Preparing for pvp is not fun, is a grind, a chore. You may be happy once it's done, but someone else will come and 1vX ur party.

Well if you are going to fault ESO for being a somewhat skill-base MMO. There is always brain dead special needs gamer fest. Over there all you have to do is buy the latest expansion which is current Path of Fire. Then roll super overtuned elite specs, require no thought process to be successful. Where everything is handled to you at no effort.

Or you can go towards the other end of the spectrum. Black Desert Online where skill takes a backrow seat. And put a unfair gear based korean style game. Where someone who is complete trash at the game but has played for 2 years. Thus have a gear score of 550 and a player with 400 GS but has complete mastery of the mechanics of the game will get crushed 99% of the times. Because nothing but time in game/grind matters.

Needless to say in my personal experience in my 16 plus years of gaming. ESO has the healthiest balance between skill and gear/class based combat system in a Fantasy MMORPG.

Kas

Waffennacht wrote: »

Game was made for PvP fyi.

But what you're talking about is the power creep

There was a time when a single attack dealing 7k was unheard-of

... because all values were a tenth of that. after that we went straight to 20k snipes being possible. only after that we got the 50% reduction as part of battle spirit and still you could 1-shot if done correctly. tbh maximum damage per attack went DOWN ever since we got CP and the tenfold scaling. the last big change was the remake of out-of-steath opening damage.

but keep spreading whatever nonsense you want, get tons of people to "agree" and y'all can complain and create threads like these when you get 3v15'd...

however, there are several things that may rightfully be discussed. but a thread starting with Trump-like pseudo facts just triggers me...

Mr_Gallows

If you find animation skipping and such tricks to be a good part of skillful play, then I guess we just have to disagree what makes a game suck.

As for GW2. I AM talking about, pre-hot. I am talking about the core system of stats, healing/damage balance, energy for dodge, rune sets etc. I am not talking about the effect of runes - just the way it is organized. You keep posting the same stupid crap no matter how many times I tell you, that it's not my point. It's fine you can look strawman up, to pretend you get it, but I guess comprehension will take a few days.

You really are in a state of teenage resistence to communication. I am NOT saying ESO is completely bad and that it takes no skill. It's a longer debate than that, but certain setups should just be advertized as a must for PvP, which would save a lot of people frustration. You really want me to hate everything about ESO, so you can scream madly at me and tell me why I am wrong in so many colourful words. It's just not the case

I have played ESO since beta. Play on PS4 now as well once in a while and brought over my Tiger. I would not bother posting here or play that long if everything about the game sucked. I am playing GW2 and I find that PvP better and the skills it requires more thoughtful and less Lord of geeks style. Some of it is personal preference of course. I don't dislike skillful games. I've played fighting games for decades and for many years competitively, and that level of mastery of frames is so far beyond anything needed for ESO or any MMO. It's not a matter of difficulty. It's a matter of gameplay, consistency between input and outcome (not just talking lag). It's core mechanics, those concieved before classes, skills and such is even finished. That's where I see the problem in eso and that's where I find GW2 to have a much better setup for adversial play.

Just chill ffs. You're going to get a seizure if you stay that high strung

Agree on BDO. Decent combat mechanics, but it's so pointless having such a nice combat system with that kind of gear weight. Eso is nowhere near that and gear isn't the issue in eso. It's the stacking. Regen especially is too easy and healing too spammy. Their dodge change was stupid while at the same time needed - if dodge had a special resource, the issue would not have been there. I can understand the idea in concept about why they have designed the stuff around stamina - it just doesn't work so well in gameplay. They need to streamline the game, while keeping the diversity. They already did with the minor/major buffs, which was a step in the right direction. But they should take the whole system, build it up from the ground in terms of stats and then implement changes instead of these patches that often break as much as they solve, because it's all connected.

Rianai

Mr_Gallows wrote: »

If you find animation skipping and such tricks to be a good part of skillful play, then I guess we just have to disagree what makes a game suck.

To some extent this is a thing in GW2 too

I kinda agree with you btw. I absolutely loved the GW2 combat system. I could duel people for hours, just for the sake of fighting them and having fun, and would never get bored or frustrated, no matter if win or loss. I can't do that in ESO. There is always something that pisses me off quickly. From a general point i would say, combat and PvP are a lot better designed in GW2, and not less demanding or skillful than ESO (even though it got dumbed down a lot and is now easier than it was in the past). But unfortunately there have been some detrimental changes and the game went into a direction that i (and many others) no longer enjoy, which can't be ignored. Just like bugs and lags can't be ignored when talking about ESO.

But i also think that ESO PvP could be improved a lot without giving up its general design, which apparently a lot of players enjoy. I doubt anything meaningful is going to happen though.

Mr_Gallows

Yes I know GW2 has some tricks you can use but not to the extent they exist in eso. Some of the rotations I have used in eso with cancelling through swap, dodge etc. just make combat feel so stupid, but it's the only option of you want to be competitive.

My honest view is that combat in eso could be better than in gw - in theory. In beta where balance was worse, but stacking regen, procs and animation cancelling, weaving wasn't that big, and overall the game played better. I also had a one shot bow nightblade, when that was a thing. which was stupid. The fixes they made for damage just wasn't a fix. It was just mixing up the issues.

Animation cancelling is needed for defence, or the game won't work. But it should not be an offensive tool. That's a fairly simple concept.

I think regen needs a make-over. Some stats could be removed and others split into two. I don't really like the GW2 split between direct and condition damage, although it did eventually balance out to not make it stack unless you sacrifice other stats. But they have some good stat splits and distributions.

I find making strong builds, with few sacrifices is too easy in eso. The regen meta is of course a big part of many problems of the game.

I like that the game doesn't have cooldowns, but the way it's implemented with the current regen meta is poor. The thief in GW has no cooldowns, but resource management is done better. Cooldown or no cooldown doesn't matter - it's about management either way.

The CC and break free mechanics are also somewhat wonky at times.

They should set a ceiling for the stats. Remove attribute points and then balance gear around those ceilings, so all sets have the same total points, for true diversity. Because being free to choose between crap and good gear is not diversity. The GW2 gear sets all have a very consistent stat distribution. It's simple things like that. As you level up your crafting or your gear aquisition, you will have more to pick from. I'd like to see the quality of the gear being the only power Factor for gear. The interconnected nature of eso stats and damage output/resistence. Resource cost/gain, healing/damage is not consistent.

GWs 6-Rune effects are somewhat toned down compared to ESOs. Generally the eso free rng effects are problematic. It exists in GW2, but they are just much more controlled.

Also the inconsistencies of dodge/block is annoying. In GW2 for instance the aoe size and speed has been balanced with the dodge speed and distance. Lost of small core things like that could be better in eso. Dodge/block is very powerful in GW2, but you can't spam it - even as a daredevil with an extra dodge resource point.

Of course the 5 piece effects would need a hard review.

Zendran

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_BQFRBOqSY&amp;t

Stop blaming gear differences for every issue.

Mr_Gallows

Zendran wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_BQFRBOqSY&amp;t

Stop blaming gear differences for every issue.

Stop making up arguments to counter

kyle.wilson

shiningforce wrote: »

Now before I start I just wanted to say I really do like ESO for its other aspects of the game. PVE is fantastic and the Dungeons are fun to run through. Crafting is crafting and Housing needs a few fixes like more items to put into housing but other than that the game is solid..... until you hit PVP.

I have read countless articles on pvp and there are way too many people that dont like it. Zenimax doesnt seem to care honestly. The only people that seem to really love PVP are the ones with the higher gear sets and can One shot you EVERY TIME. These are the people that defend pvp on each thread. At least in games like SWO or WoW you can just show up and have a slight chance of success each time.

The issue with PVP in ESO is its not built for PVP in Mind! Every attack is basically automatic with no cooldowns or having to wait small durations like 1 1/2 seconds to shoot a magic spell like every other MMO. So all you have are ppl that get the highest level gear (Usually by purchasing it with RL money) and people that just start get Hit once blasted to death every time they spawn. Now there are a lot of builds you can use but everyone pretty much ends up with the same.

This is a gear driven pvp game and that royally sucks. Look I have played many MMO's since Everquest and have always been really good at PVP. But ESO is just nonsense. Even if someone has more gear than you, at least you should be able to use your skill against them. Nope because they ONE or TWO SHOT YOU!

The map is too long for raiding pvp. The Battleground are so lazily constructed, Run in a circle and capture flags..... You can't even pick the battleground you want, queing for random just stinks all by itself.

I do not see the appeal of PvP, Which is a real deal breaker for me, whenever better gear comes out everyone will run to get it. Didn't need to do that in other MMO's, Honestly it really falls on the combat system itself, I know its made for PC and Console but only 5 /10 buttons which you switch from and all attacks are automatic is ridiculous.

Spam spam spam, have top gear, spam. No skill involved. Its pretty lackluster.

Anyway its just my Opinion if you love it thats nice but after taking years of looking at the comments sections of people tlaking about PvP its obvious for many reasons its broke. This is also a reason many people end up leaving this game, The combat system needs to be fixed, We were originally told this game wouldnt be like it is now, that is would be fair to players. Anyone should be able to come into pvp and have a chance at Fun and succeeding a bit.

If I misspelled anything/grammar issues sorry English is not my first language.

Actually the game was sold initially as a heavy PVP game, it wasn't until a few months after launch that an "end game" pve came around with craglorn's release.

"Spam spam spam, have top gear, spam. No skill involved. Its pretty lackluster" That's PVE to a tee. The only one that needs to know the mechanics is the group leader.

jhharvest

Zendran wrote: »

Stop blaming gear differences for every issue.

Hmmm. Ok.

NB OP! Nerf NB!

Raudgrani

shiningforce wrote: »

Now before I start I just wanted to say I really do like ESO for its other aspects of the game. PVE is fantastic and the Dungeons are fun to run through. Crafting is crafting and Housing needs a few fixes like more items to put into housing but other than that the game is solid..... until you hit PVP.

I have read countless articles on pvp and there are way too many people that dont like it. Zenimax doesnt seem to care honestly. The only people that seem to really love PVP are the ones with the higher gear sets and can One shot you EVERY TIME. These are the people that defend pvp on each thread. At least in games like SWO or WoW you can just show up and have a slight chance of success each time.

The issue with PVP in ESO is its not built for PVP in Mind! Every attack is basically automatic with no cooldowns or having to wait small durations like 1 1/2 seconds to shoot a magic spell like every other MMO. So all you have are ppl that get the highest level gear (Usually by purchasing it with RL money) and people that just start get Hit once blasted to death every time they spawn. Now there are a lot of builds you can use but everyone pretty much ends up with the same.

This is a gear driven pvp game and that royally sucks. Look I have played many MMO's since Everquest and have always been really good at PVP. But ESO is just nonsense. Even if someone has more gear than you, at least you should be able to use your skill against them. Nope because they ONE or TWO SHOT YOU!

The map is too long for raiding pvp. The Battleground are so lazily constructed, Run in a circle and capture flags..... You can't even pick the battleground you want, queing for random just stinks all by itself.

I do not see the appeal of PvP, Which is a real deal breaker for me, whenever better gear comes out everyone will run to get it. Didn't need to do that in other MMO's, Honestly it really falls on the combat system itself, I know its made for PC and Console but only 5 /10 buttons which you switch from and all attacks are automatic is ridiculous.

Spam spam spam, have top gear, spam. No skill involved. Its pretty lackluster.

Anyway its just my Opinion if you love it thats nice but after taking years of looking at the comments sections of people tlaking about PvP its obvious for many reasons its broke. This is also a reason many people end up leaving this game, The combat system needs to be fixed, We were originally told this game wouldnt be like it is now, that is would be fair to players. Anyone should be able to come into pvp and have a chance at Fun and succeeding a bit.

If I misspelled anything/grammar issues sorry English is not my first language.

I understand your frustration. But you have a pretty different view than I do. I do not agree. I don't like to say "L2P", but I feel the need to do it here. No one "one shots" me, a few Onslaught gankers etc. might "two shot" me - and I'm usually on either a Magicka or Stamina Nightblade, with 25k or 21k health respectively, running all Infused and Divines armor.

What you describe in my eyes, is the "zerging" that seems to be currently going on, at least on Xbox EU. Fun sure, that there's so much people online that you have to queue to get in, but when most people are either low levels, or obvious PVE'ers running about - there's no wonder things are not like before.

MajBludd

I think one of the biggest issues when people go into pvp is they think because they have BIS gear and have max cps they will rek ppl. When that doesn't happen they get salty and give up.

Then they will say how pvp is broken because with their setup they destroy mobs in pve and can't do any damage in pvp.

Lag, as @Rohamad_Ali said, is the biggest problem in pvp at the moment along with the lack of any improvements to it.

Datthaw

MajBludd wrote: »

I think one of the biggest issues when people go into pvp is they think because they have BIS gear and have max cps they will rek ppl. When that doesn't happen they get salty and give up.

Then they will say how pvp is broken because with their setup they destroy mobs in pve and can't do any damage in pvp.

Lag, as @Rohamad_Ali said, is the biggest problem in pvp at the moment along with the lack of any improvements to it.

Yeah it always come to lag, and the problem is they will never fix it. They could add objectives and try to spread the population, which would probably help the lag. The issue with that is eso is full of lemmings, they will follow the other lemming to one spot and jump off a cliff. It's the one thing that always bothers me I have the feeling it will never be fixed. Casual players go where the battle markers are then it snowballs into a zerg lag fest.

CyrusArya

Kid just get good. Less QQ more Pew Pew

Ermiq

Hehe... I constantly die in IC from Surprise Attack spamming gankers, constantly die from Templars, constantly die from DKs...
I've tried to wear 5H-2L, 5L-2H, 7H, 7L, Rattlecage, Shacklebraker, War Maiden, Warlock, Seducer (all purple with golden glyphs), I've tried Impen+Infused on Head/Chest/Legs and tried all Impen, I've tried gold weapons Sharpened, Defending, with Oblivion damage glyphs, I've tried Sword&Board, Dual Swords, Destro & Resto staff, I've tried busrt damage setups and tanky setups, I've watched some MagWarden PvP builds on Alcast, Deltia and here on the forums, I've tried to use all defensive and healing skills I have but...
They still kill me in like I'm wear some random quest gear and I have no clue what's going on.
Maybe it's MagWarden itself, maybe it's my crappy internet (300-900 ping), maybe it's me so dumb.

Thogard

This thread: