AOE Caps are gone, Praise The 8!

Thalmor-Nordmaster · January 2018

are there bonuses for setting khajiits on fire?

Mureel · January 2018

Samadhi wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

It has been the position in much of the PvP community for ages that the AoE caps are what is causing the lag
when AoE caps were first announced, players pointed to zerg balls and the lag they cause in GW2 and warned it would be a huge issue in ESO

part of the claim has been that having to only pick 6 targets, then 6+ targets plus damaged reduction calculations
means more calculations have to be run for each attack made

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

PvP players have been asking for years for AoE caps to be removed,
can find threads tracing back to when AoE caps were first implemented

It is possible that someone complaining about Bat Swarm being able to leech heals from the entire zerg prompted it
but if my recollection is correct a larger portion of the PvP community has been against having AoE caps than for them
The change that made AoEs hit more than 6 targets in the first place was in response to endless threads about removing the cap
after changes to Siege engines proved insufficient

I was there and actively PVPing daily on Wabbalag when AOE caps happened so I know what I mean. IDK about all the rest of that but yeah they started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it. I laughed then and I laugh now.

After 1.6 everyone was looking for something to blame for sudden bad lag everywhere and there were zergs using the destro AOE skill (this is before Proxy Det even existed) and Springs - and everyone had a bird about it and AOE caps happened.

So yeah. PVPer is rage and whine and cry all the time and then AOE caps happened.

Tasear · January 2018

fastolfv_ESO wrote: »

heals are aoe based so no people will not spread out lol, nothing is going to change except the few guilds that run 2 raids will go down much faster with a well times negate

They are still capped.

KingJ · January 2018

Mureel wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

It has been the position in much of the PvP community for ages that the AoE caps are what is causing the lag
when AoE caps were first announced, players pointed to zerg balls and the lag they cause in GW2 and warned it would be a huge issue in ESO

part of the claim has been that having to only pick 6 targets, then 6+ targets plus damaged reduction calculations
means more calculations have to be run for each attack made

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

PvP players have been asking for years for AoE caps to be removed,
can find threads tracing back to when AoE caps were first implemented

It is possible that someone complaining about Bat Swarm being able to leech heals from the entire zerg prompted it
but if my recollection is correct a larger portion of the PvP community has been against having AoE caps than for them
The change that made AoEs hit more than 6 targets in the first place was in response to endless threads about removing the cap
after changes to Siege engines proved insufficient

I was there and actively PVPing daily on Wabbalag when AOE caps happened so I know what I mean. IDK about all the rest of that but yeah they started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it. I laughed then and I laugh now.

After 1.6 everyone was looking for something to blame for sudden bad lag everywhere and there were zergs using the destro AOE skill (this is before Proxy Det even existed) and Springs - and everyone had a bird about it and AOE caps happened.

So yeah. PVPer is rage and whine and cry all the time and then AOE caps happened.

Find me one thread where someone asked for AOE caps.Obviously you don't know what your talking about and just talking out you a$$.No one knew AOE caps were added until someone did a test and we all pressed Wrobel out to tell the truth,during ESO live.He told us and even admited that AoE caps caused lag but won't remove them because it would negatively effect PVe.

Yea you just prove you don't know what your talking about and just want to cry like the carebear you are.

Sylosi · January 2018

...

Valencer · January 2018

Mureel wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

It has been the position in much of the PvP community for ages that the AoE caps are what is causing the lag
when AoE caps were first announced, players pointed to zerg balls and the lag they cause in GW2 and warned it would be a huge issue in ESO

part of the claim has been that having to only pick 6 targets, then 6+ targets plus damaged reduction calculations
means more calculations have to be run for each attack made

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

PvP players have been asking for years for AoE caps to be removed,
can find threads tracing back to when AoE caps were first implemented

It is possible that someone complaining about Bat Swarm being able to leech heals from the entire zerg prompted it
but if my recollection is correct a larger portion of the PvP community has been against having AoE caps than for them
The change that made AoEs hit more than 6 targets in the first place was in response to endless threads about removing the cap
after changes to Siege engines proved insufficient

I was there and actively PVPing daily on Wabbalag when AOE caps happened so I know what I mean. IDK about all the rest of that but yeah they started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it. I laughed then and I laugh now.

After 1.6 everyone was looking for something to blame for sudden bad lag everywhere and there were zergs using the destro AOE skill (this is before Proxy Det even existed) and Springs - and everyone had a bird about it and AOE caps happened.

So yeah. PVPer is rage and whine and cry all the time and then AOE caps happened.

Hello guys, Mureel's ESO timeline here.

People were begging ZOS for AoE caps. The lag and impulse/springs trains only suddenly appeared after 1.6. Proximity Detonation was not yet added during 1.6. Finally somewhere after 1.6 hit AoE caps were added.

Palidon · January 2018

Although it makes no difference to me, we will see how long the AoE cap removal lasts especially after players start complaining.

cazlonb16_ESO · January 2018

If the reduced calculations serverside mean that I can actually break/prevent CC in the vicinity of the usual eye blobs now, it'll be a grat change. Otherwise...meh.

Animus-ESO · January 2018

josiahva wrote: »

All this means is that zergs AOEs will hit HARDER, it will become one big zerg on zerg battle, each zerg trying to put out more damage with their AOEs before they crumble. I think this wont have the effect small scale players are hoping for. If those players were actually interested in small scale combat, they would go to IC anyway, not run around in Cyrodiil

ROFL, Bro. Most small scale PVPers run with less then 6 people anyway. We have ALWAYS taken 100% damage but the zergs have had a nice advantage over us built into the system. Now that advantage is gone giving us a real chance of actually wiping them when we didn't have it before.

-NO ONE IS SAYING WE WILL 100% WIPE ZERGS! BUT NOW WE HAVE A REAL CHANCE TO OUT PLAY THEM.-

dotme · January 2018

jasonthorpeb14_ESO wrote: »

-NO ONE IS SAYING WE WILL 100% WIPE ZERGS! BUT NOW WE HAVE A REAL CHANCE TO OUT PLAY THEM.-

Good luck against a 24 man group also all running permafrost, eye of the storm, negate and heals. You'll melt so fast your recap will just say "Exploded. RIP"

A_G_G_R_O · January 2018

dotme wrote: »

jasonthorpeb14_ESO wrote: »

-NO ONE IS SAYING WE WILL 100% WIPE ZERGS! BUT NOW WE HAVE A REAL CHANCE TO OUT PLAY THEM.-

Good luck against a 24 man group also all running permafrost, eye of the storm, negate and heals. You'll melt so fast your recap will just say "Exploded. RIP"

Eh my groups usually stop at 6 anyways and have wiped 20 man groups. So we were always taking fulll AoE dmg. So... slight buff?

zaria · January 2018

Mureel wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

It has been the position in much of the PvP community for ages that the AoE caps are what is causing the lag
when AoE caps were first announced, players pointed to zerg balls and the lag they cause in GW2 and warned it would be a huge issue in ESO

part of the claim has been that having to only pick 6 targets, then 6+ targets plus damaged reduction calculations
means more calculations have to be run for each attack made

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

PvP players have been asking for years for AoE caps to be removed,
can find threads tracing back to when AoE caps were first implemented

It is possible that someone complaining about Bat Swarm being able to leech heals from the entire zerg prompted it
but if my recollection is correct a larger portion of the PvP community has been against having AoE caps than for them
The change that made AoEs hit more than 6 targets in the first place was in response to endless threads about removing the cap
after changes to Siege engines proved insufficient

I was there and actively PVPing daily on Wabbalag when AOE caps happened so I know what I mean. IDK about all the rest of that but yeah they started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it. I laughed then and I laugh now.

After 1.6 everyone was looking for something to blame for sudden bad lag everywhere and there were zergs using the destro AOE skill (this is before Proxy Det even existed) and Springs - and everyone had a bird about it and AOE caps happened.

So yeah. PVPer is rage and whine and cry all the time and then AOE caps happened.

it makes some sense, instead of just: player is inside AoE DoT, base damage 1200 HP - players damage reduction server had to keep track of number of players inside all the various partial overlapping AoE then do the damage - reduction for each tick.
Do this again on next tick. Just being able to handle each player standing in 3 hail and 2 walls of lighting would be easier as you could bundle them up as resistance to both are equal.

Samadhi · January 2018

.

Mureel wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

It has been the position in much of the PvP community for ages that the AoE caps are what is causing the lag
when AoE caps were first announced, players pointed to zerg balls and the lag they cause in GW2 and warned it would be a huge issue in ESO

part of the claim has been that having to only pick 6 targets, then 6+ targets plus damaged reduction calculations
means more calculations have to be run for each attack made

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

PvP players have been asking for years for AoE caps to be removed,
can find threads tracing back to when AoE caps were first implemented

It is possible that someone complaining about Bat Swarm being able to leech heals from the entire zerg prompted it
but if my recollection is correct a larger portion of the PvP community has been against having AoE caps than for them
The change that made AoEs hit more than 6 targets in the first place was in response to endless threads about removing the cap
after changes to Siege engines proved insufficient

I was there and actively PVPing daily on Wabbalag when AOE caps happened so I know what I mean. IDK about all the rest of that but yeah they started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it. I laughed then and I laugh now.
...

Interesting, your forum profile says that you joined in the forum in June 2016,
several years after players had already been asking for removal of AoE caps

Meanwhile, here is a poll with an overwhelming vote against AoE caps from April 2014,
the same month the game originally launched
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/88049/do-you-think-there-should-be-an-aoe-cap/p1
prior to 1.6, which the Patch Notes thread dates as January 2015
The 1.6 Patch Notes also list Proximity Detonation,
but am unable to recall if that was because the skill as newly added in that patch or just updated

Not certain where you get the idea that they "started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it."
unless your position is that it was part of the Beta crew that asked for AoE caps

Mureel wrote: »

...
After 1.6 everyone was looking for something to blame for sudden bad lag everywhere and there were zergs using the destro AOE skill (this is before Proxy Det even existed) and Springs - and everyone had a bird about it and AOE caps happened.

So yeah. PVPer is rage and whine and cry all the time and then AOE caps happened.

My memory may be off, but wasn't 1.6 the patch where we all started trying to blame it on the lighting changes?
Maybe that was 1.3...
Nevermind, found the patch notes, it was 1.2 for the lighting change

If you could find me a thread from prior to April 2014 of players asking for caps, would be interested in seeing where the issue traced to during the Beta

There were certainly complaints about Impulse trains a few months after the caps were announced
Tho this thread from July 2014 seems to imply it was still earlier than your proposed "6 mos after they got it"
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/122292/aoe-caps-arent-the-reason-that-zerg-impulse-is-i-win/p1

And hell, this thread had some real idiocy in it
just look at this stupid ***'s post:

Samadhi wrote: »

Raeder wrote: »

...

And before people even say it. Negate is not a valid counter to this kind of thing because the zergball just moves out of it and keeps wrecking, and it is an 200 ultimate that only one class has.

...

Negate is also not a valid counter for a zerg
because Negate currently has an AoE cap.

Raeder wrote: »

...
A third solution would be to make Caltrops and perhaps Volcanic Rune effect everyone, no matter what.
...

This "solution" wouldn't fix anything
because AoE caps limit how many targets are impacted
unless by "effect everyone" you want to specifically remove AoE caps from these two skills.

With AoE caps removed, players would be punished for zergballing.
With AoE caps in place, players are rewarded for zergballing.

If you want to stop zergballing, remove the AoE caps and stop it from being rewarding to do.

I don't disagree with changing Immovable; however, even if Immovable were changed CCs would only impact 6 people out of a ball of 50+.
I'm not clear on how you think that is going to fix the issue. Those 6 players could simply CC break and then get right back into the ball and let their Stamina regen before they ever get CC on them again.

"With AoE caps in place, players are rewarded for zergballing."

What the hell sort of Skooma was she on?
If your post is correct, AoE caps were not even in the game yet for her to be complaining about
since this post was made prior to 1.6 hitting the PTS

Yubarius · January 2018

dotme wrote: »

jasonthorpeb14_ESO wrote: »

-NO ONE IS SAYING WE WILL 100% WIPE ZERGS! BUT NOW WE HAVE A REAL CHANCE TO OUT PLAY THEM.-

Good luck against a 24 man group also all running permafrost, eye of the storm, negate and heals. You'll melt so fast your recap will just say "Exploded. RIP"

Small groups already get wiped quick against ball zerg. Removing AOE caps simply makes it easier for small groups to have a fighting chance.

dotme · January 2018

Yubarius wrote: »

Small groups already get wiped quick against ball zerg. Removing AOE caps simply makes it easier for small groups to have a fighting chance.

Well in a field fight or when your group is the only one defending or taking an objective, I would agree. But if a 6 man group is assisting with a defense alongside, for example, another 6 man group, chances are some of you would not feel the full wrath of a zerg's AOEs. Now, you will.

Takes-No-Prisoner · January 2018

Yubarius wrote: »

magictucktuck wrote: »

im am glad they are gone! but i am also scared that its not going to help us small groupers as much as we think it will.

Now it will put you on an equal footing. Having AOEs will be just as beneficial to you as it was to them. You are no longer at a disadvantage other than skill and simply having more abilities.

Yup. I run with a group that gets as big as 14 people. We all coordinate ults together.

Right now, we run into a problem where the coordination is fine, but the damage isn't there because the enemy is simply out healing everything we can burst them down with.

After this patch, one very coordinated Permafrost +Bomb should be enough to wipe a tightly stacked group. Where as, it would take all bombs and all ults on deck at once to keep us alive.

dotme · January 2018

Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »

After this patch, one very coordinated Permafrost +Bomb should be enough to wipe a tightly stacked group. Where as, it would take all bombs and all ults on deck at once to keep us alive.

I think it's likely that resource tower farming will be back with a vengeance. You can't clear a resource tower out without stacking "tightly" because the interior space of a resource tower doesn't exactly lend itself to spreading out. I do hope ZOS knows what they're doing because if Cyrodill becomes a tower farm game again, I'm probably done.

Takes-No-Prisoner · January 2018

dotme wrote: »

Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »

After this patch, one very coordinated Permafrost +Bomb should be enough to wipe a tightly stacked group. Where as, it would take all bombs and all ults on deck at once to keep us alive.

I think it's likely that resource tower farming will be back with a vengeance. You can't clear a resource tower out without stacking "tightly" because the interior space of a resource tower doesn't exactly lend itself to spreading out. I do hope ZOS knows what they're doing because if Cyrodill becomes a tower farm game again, I'm probably done.

Resource towers don't have doors anymore. So that is a plus.

Hurtfan · January 2018

Uviryth wrote: »

This Thread sounds like Zerg vs Zerg is a bad thing. The fact that large Armies collide in this game is one of the mainreasons it stands out of the pool of "battlegroundandarenammorpgnumber123.500"

Agreed, I'm not a huge PvP person but ESO's PvP sucked me in because of the large scale of things. Why the zerg gets bagged on, I'm not sure, it's a glorious sight to see imo.

Buffler · January 2018

I can taste the salty tears of all the zerglings already

Yubarius · January 2018

dotme wrote: »

Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »

After this patch, one very coordinated Permafrost +Bomb should be enough to wipe a tightly stacked group. Where as, it would take all bombs and all ults on deck at once to keep us alive.

I think it's likely that resource tower farming will be back with a vengeance. You can't clear a resource tower out without stacking "tightly" because the interior space of a resource tower doesn't exactly lend itself to spreading out. I do hope ZOS knows what they're doing because if Cyrodill becomes a tower farm game again, I'm probably done.

Here's an idea. Don't go into the tower and they'll come out eventually.

deepseamk20b14_ESO · January 2018

I don’t think this is going to work out as much as everyone thinks. Maybe against unorganized groups it will help. But that same capless AoE Attack you have that makes you think you can now take out a Zerg with your small group is also the same capless AoE Attack that an organized Zerg with a full raid has. They will have more heals, even with the CC cap it wouldn’t matter as organized groups spam retreating maneuvers. If anything, the large groups just got stronger. But hey, if it reduces lag I don’t care, I’ll be happy!

Firstmep · January 2018

OP, you mean 9 right? RIGHT? Xd

zaria · January 2018

Buffler wrote: »

I can taste the salty tears of all the zerglings already

The zergs i tend to end up in is so disoriented you are lucky to get 6 inside wall of elements.

CatchMeTrolling · January 2018

I don't know why people are bringing up the irrelevant point of the big groups will have no aoe caps too, small groups already take the full damage from bigger groups. This change will only make those mindless zergers have to think twice now because they can get wiped by a group of 4.

Buffler · January 2018

zaria wrote: »

Buffler wrote: »

I can taste the salty tears of all the zerglings already

The zergs i tend to end up in is so disoriented you are lucky to get 6 inside wall of elements.

Wall of elements?? In pvp??? Lol

Takes-No-Prisoner · January 2018

Buffler wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

Buffler wrote: »

I can taste the salty tears of all the zerglings already

The zergs i tend to end up in is so disoriented you are lucky to get 6 inside wall of elements.

Wall of elements?? In pvp??? Lol

Was in a 4 man group on Saturday with a magDK running it. We were cp690 with lv27 healer and lv45 tank. We were taking on groups twice our size and burning them down with his Talons/Animation Cancelled Wall/Inhale/Standard combined with my StamWarden DPS we were melting everything into the ground.

ordraveeb17_ESO · January 2018

what a pain for randoms ))) lol )))

exeeter702 · January 2018

KingJ wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

It has been the position in much of the PvP community for ages that the AoE caps are what is causing the lag
when AoE caps were first announced, players pointed to zerg balls and the lag they cause in GW2 and warned it would be a huge issue in ESO

part of the claim has been that having to only pick 6 targets, then 6+ targets plus damaged reduction calculations
means more calculations have to be run for each attack made

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

PvP players have been asking for years for AoE caps to be removed,
can find threads tracing back to when AoE caps were first implemented

It is possible that someone complaining about Bat Swarm being able to leech heals from the entire zerg prompted it
but if my recollection is correct a larger portion of the PvP community has been against having AoE caps than for them
The change that made AoEs hit more than 6 targets in the first place was in response to endless threads about removing the cap
after changes to Siege engines proved insufficient

I was there and actively PVPing daily on Wabbalag when AOE caps happened so I know what I mean. IDK about all the rest of that but yeah they started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it. I laughed then and I laugh now.

After 1.6 everyone was looking for something to blame for sudden bad lag everywhere and there were zergs using the destro AOE skill (this is before Proxy Det even existed) and Springs - and everyone had a bird about it and AOE caps happened.

So yeah. PVPer is rage and whine and cry all the time and then AOE caps happened.

Find me one thread where someone asked for AOE caps.Obviously you don't know what your talking about and just talking out you a$$.No one knew AOE caps were added until someone did a test and we all pressed Wrobel out to tell the truth,during ESO live.He told us and even admited that AoE caps caused lag but won't remove them because it would negatively effect PVe.

Yea you just prove you don't know what your talking about and just want to cry like the carebear you are.

Samadhi wrote: »

.

Mureel wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

It has been the position in much of the PvP community for ages that the AoE caps are what is causing the lag
when AoE caps were first announced, players pointed to zerg balls and the lag they cause in GW2 and warned it would be a huge issue in ESO

part of the claim has been that having to only pick 6 targets, then 6+ targets plus damaged reduction calculations
means more calculations have to be run for each attack made

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

PvP players have been asking for years for AoE caps to be removed,
can find threads tracing back to when AoE caps were first implemented

It is possible that someone complaining about Bat Swarm being able to leech heals from the entire zerg prompted it
but if my recollection is correct a larger portion of the PvP community has been against having AoE caps than for them
The change that made AoEs hit more than 6 targets in the first place was in response to endless threads about removing the cap
after changes to Siege engines proved insufficient

I was there and actively PVPing daily on Wabbalag when AOE caps happened so I know what I mean. IDK about all the rest of that but yeah they started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it. I laughed then and I laugh now.
...

Interesting, your forum profile says that you joined in the forum in June 2016,
several years after players had already been asking for removal of AoE caps

Meanwhile, here is a poll with an overwhelming vote against AoE caps from April 2014,
the same month the game originally launched
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/88049/do-you-think-there-should-be-an-aoe-cap/p1
prior to 1.6, which the Patch Notes thread dates as January 2015
The 1.6 Patch Notes also list Proximity Detonation,
but am unable to recall if that was because the skill as newly added in that patch or just updated

Not certain where you get the idea that they "started wanting it removed like 6 mos after they got it."
unless your position is that it was part of the Beta crew that asked for AoE caps

Mureel wrote: »

...
After 1.6 everyone was looking for something to blame for sudden bad lag everywhere and there were zergs using the destro AOE skill (this is before Proxy Det even existed) and Springs - and everyone had a bird about it and AOE caps happened.

So yeah. PVPer is rage and whine and cry all the time and then AOE caps happened.

My memory may be off, but wasn't 1.6 the patch where we all started trying to blame it on the lighting changes?
Maybe that was 1.3...
Nevermind, found the patch notes, it was 1.2 for the lighting change

If you could find me a thread from prior to April 2014 of players asking for caps, would be interested in seeing where the issue traced to during the Beta

There were certainly complaints about Impulse trains a few months after the caps were announced
Tho this thread from July 2014 seems to imply it was still earlier than your proposed "6 mos after they got it"
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/122292/aoe-caps-arent-the-reason-that-zerg-impulse-is-i-win/p1

And hell, this thread had some real idiocy in it
just look at this stupid ***'s post:

Samadhi wrote: »

Raeder wrote: »

...

And before people even say it. Negate is not a valid counter to this kind of thing because the zergball just moves out of it and keeps wrecking, and it is an 200 ultimate that only one class has.

...

Negate is also not a valid counter for a zerg
because Negate currently has an AoE cap.

Raeder wrote: »

...
A third solution would be to make Caltrops and perhaps Volcanic Rune effect everyone, no matter what.
...

This "solution" wouldn't fix anything
because AoE caps limit how many targets are impacted
unless by "effect everyone" you want to specifically remove AoE caps from these two skills.

With AoE caps removed, players would be punished for zergballing.
With AoE caps in place, players are rewarded for zergballing.

If you want to stop zergballing, remove the AoE caps and stop it from being rewarding to do.

I don't disagree with changing Immovable; however, even if Immovable were changed CCs would only impact 6 people out of a ball of 50+.
I'm not clear on how you think that is going to fix the issue. Those 6 players could simply CC break and then get right back into the ball and let their Stamina regen before they ever get CC on them again.

"With AoE caps in place, players are rewarded for zergballing."

What the hell sort of Skooma was she on?
If your post is correct, AoE caps were not even in the game yet for her to be complaining about
since this post was made prior to 1.6 hitting the PTS

@Mureel quietly exit the thread, its ok, no one will think any worse of you

Kode · January 2018

Lets give it a shot, I'm not sure how much worse things can get anyway.

I maintain, the best nerf for the pain train is adding a channel to most AoE abilities, with a speed reduction while channeling. The train would grind down to a more manageable speed, and even if they stacked a flag, well placed bashes could counter AoE. It would be a nice addition to the new bashing changes too.