AOE Caps are gone, Praise The 8!

Dymence

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

Every type of gameplay should have it's counters. Destro ult and prox det and such are the counters to massive zergs groups.

Don't want to get bombed? Don't stack. Intelligent play will be more important. I don't think there is need for any nerfs.

Mureel

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

Mureel

josiahva wrote: »

All this means is that zergs AOEs will hit HARDER, it will become one big zerg on zerg battle, each zerg trying to put out more damage with their AOEs before they crumble. I think this wont have the effect small scale players are hoping for. If those players were actually interested in small scale combat, they would go to IC anyway, not run around in Cyrodiil

THIS. And this is why PVPers tizzy'd themselves into a panic before - and how aoe caps got added in the first place xD

Mureel

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

Hurtfan

Negate becomes even more important...

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Here's the test of whether this is a good change or not.

If the no-skill blobspam guilds that love to farm new players at towers are excited about this change and how many "Zergs" they are going to wipe, then this is a bad move because they are the zerg and just dont realize it.

"Hur durr now we run away, now we charge our prox dets, now we run back in a tight blob and spam AOEs" <--- Those guys.

Its too soon to tell but if it buffs them, then its bad for the game.

Cinbri

In meanwhile no nerf for Eartgore..
Cancerous bomb trains wont go anywhere anyway coz those caps affect steam of stacked zerg, not organized group that can evade damage and have still enough option to overheal.

fastolfv_ESO

alot of false information in this thread, aoe caps were in the game since beta but nobody figured it out until zenimax told players it had existed all along. Whenever something changes its always pvpers asked for it! in the end its just better for the game all around

Samadhi

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

I can't believe it, the time has finally arrived; the death of AOE caps. This has been a plague to the games health in terms of lag and overall balance of group gameplay and dynamics. No longer are the days of ball groups rolling around at the speed of sound with no consequence for stacking their armies into one confined area. No longer are the days of winning fights simply because you have greater damage reductions from AOE reductions due to your group size. This is the first major step to incentivising smart and tactical play.

Instead of "stack on crown", it will be "spilt up into organised smaller groups that can communicate so we don't get whooped by their aoes". Finally, the age of skill and tactical play are upon us. Thank you so much for doing this. @ZOS

I laugh so HARD! PVPers were the ones who asked for AOE CAPS in the first place, because of lag xD HAPPY ZERGING!

(Also lols to the other threads about long queues in PVP - CLOSE ALL CAMPAIGNS! OMG I HAVE TO WAIT TOO LONG xD LOLOL)

It has been the position in much of the PvP community for ages that the AoE caps are what is causing the lag
when AoE caps were first announced, players pointed to zerg balls and the lag they cause in GW2 and warned it would be a huge issue in ESO

part of the claim has been that having to only pick 6 targets, then 6+ targets plus damaged reduction calculations
means more calculations have to be run for each attack made

Mureel wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

JamieAubrey wrote: »

Oh yeah, make Eye of cancer bomb groups hit EVERYONE NOW

RIP

Yeah now that AOE caps are gone, I think extremely strong AOE ult should be looked at for nerfs, specifically destroy ult. Also, magicka detonation should perhaps be toned down to only 100% potential bonus damage from 250%.

NO THANK YOU - You made your (stupid) bed so lie in it. I do not feel like having PVE stuff nerfed more again because pvp whining.

I said like so many times: PVPers are the ones who got the AOE caps placed in the first place.

PvP players have been asking for years for AoE caps to be removed,
can find threads tracing back to when AoE caps were first implemented

It is possible that someone complaining about Bat Swarm being able to leech heals from the entire zerg prompted it
but if my recollection is correct a larger portion of the PvP community has been against having AoE caps than for them
The change that made AoEs hit more than 6 targets in the first place was in response to endless threads about removing the cap
after changes to Siege engines proved insufficient

Ackwalan

Groups will stack on the healers, simple because that is where the heals are.

Sarjako

Valera Progib wrote: »

Here is a prediction: “OMG NERF DESTRO ULT” ‘em zergs crying, new forum posts creating...

Probably bomblade will become more relevant than ever...

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..................

BigBadVolk

The Age of Bomblades!

Publius_Scipio

Sarjako wrote: »

Valera Progib wrote: »

Here is a prediction: “OMG NERF DESTRO ULT” ‘em zergs crying, new forum posts creating...

Probably bomblade will become more relevant than ever...

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..................

I can’t hear any of you on the forums

DeadlyRecluse

It'll be interesting. I suspect it will be less impactful than people think when it comes to countering organized ball groups, but will have a huge impact in helping fight poorly-optimized groups who just run deep.

Kram8ion

Will it affect splash dmg like lightning staff or shrouded daggers

DeadlyRecluse

Kram8ion wrote: »

Will it affect splash dmg like lightning staff or shrouded daggers

It only affected abilities that hit >6 targets. So shrouded daggers should be unaffected, but lightning heavies get a small technical buff against dense groups.

zaria

magictucktuck wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

magictucktuck wrote: »

im am glad they are gone! but i am also scared that its not going to help us small groupers as much as we think it will.

Now it will put you on an equal footing. Having AOEs will be just as beneficial to you as it was to them. You are no longer at a disadvantage other than skill and simply having more abilities.

Well i get that argument, im for taking them away. but with 50 of them spamming aoes now your 5-10-20 man group is still going to get hit with 20 ultis and 50 spam able aoes and die lol. but like someone else said lets see it in practice and hopefully it helps and does not make it worse for us. worse case at least you can get 5 friends together and bomb a giant zerg and see a screen full of numbers

An large group will out dps you, an 20 man group will do double the damage of your 10 man group, however large groups don't take reduced damage simply for being many.

Dredlord

zaria wrote: »

magictucktuck wrote: »

Yubarius wrote: »

magictucktuck wrote: »

im am glad they are gone! but i am also scared that its not going to help us small groupers as much as we think it will.

Now it will put you on an equal footing. Having AOEs will be just as beneficial to you as it was to them. You are no longer at a disadvantage other than skill and simply having more abilities.

Well i get that argument, im for taking them away. but with 50 of them spamming aoes now your 5-10-20 man group is still going to get hit with 20 ultis and 50 spam able aoes and die lol. but like someone else said lets see it in practice and hopefully it helps and does not make it worse for us. worse case at least you can get 5 friends together and bomb a giant zerg and see a screen full of numbers

An large group will out dps you, an 20 man group will do double the damage of your 10 man group, however large groups don't take reduced damage simply for being many.

They will out dps the 10 man grp, but if the 10 man group is good they will outburst the 20 man first.

davey1107

I am eager to see what willl happen with no AOE caps in an area with tons of aoe laid down and strategically placed fear traps that hit 6-12 players. Choke points could become death traps.

Ackwalan

Many people got used to standing in oil because of heals and AoE caps. The first few days of the learning curve are going to be hilarious.

Saint_Bud

This is not a nerf for good ballgroups. this is a buff for this groups, because its will be easyer to bomb a large group of randoms.

Sanct16

Ackwalan wrote: »

Many people got used to standing in oil because of heals and AoE caps. The first few days of the learning curve are going to be hilarious.

Pretty sure sieges are not affected by aoe caps.

Goshua

like the current *** storm in a tea cup iust enough, poor pugs

Farorin

I might actually dust off my PVP gear (or more realistically, get some updated gear), and start playing again. I missed the old days of smaller groups, skirmishes, and tactical use of both AOE and single target damage.

zyk

At the end of the day, this is just another lazy blanket change because ZOS doesn't want to invest in a real effort to improve AvA gameplay.

Sanct16

zyk wrote: »

At the end of the day, this is just another lazy blanket change because ZOS doesn't want to invest in a real effort to improve AvA gameplay.

This is probably the most requested AvA change. Can't blame ZOS for players yelling for the wrong things.

Uviryth

This Thread sounds like Zerg vs Zerg is a bad thing. The fact that large Armies collide in this game is one of the mainreasons it stands out of the pool of "battlegroundandarenammorpgnumber123.500"

KingJ

boombazookajd wrote: »

So, maybe a silly question, how does this (if at all) impact PVE AoE?

Well in raids stacking on crown would no longer work which will make stuff like VSO HM a bit hard at some point.

zyk

Sanct16 wrote: »

zyk wrote: »

At the end of the day, this is just another lazy blanket change because ZOS doesn't want to invest in a real effort to improve AvA gameplay.

This is probably the most requested AvA change. Can't blame ZOS for players yelling for the wrong things.

I can. They're the professionals and we're the peanut gallery. Great games are made by great designers, not focus groups or by popular vote.

ZOS knows this as well as anyone. The underlying issues of AvA aren't being solved because ZOS just isn't trying. This may be a popular move, but it is also another unnuanced blanket change that required almost no effort.

I'm completely neutral about the change itself. I think it's probably going to be bad for the average player as emp keeps and outposts are composed only of choke points and the inner keeps aren't much better. The inexperienced and casual players will be hit harder than ever. Regardless, my point is that whether this particular change is good or bad, it's effortless and probably won't come close to addressing any of the fundamental issues of AvA.

Qbiken

Cinbri wrote: »

In meanwhile no nerf for Eartgore..
Cancerous bomb trains wont go anywhere anyway coz those caps affect steam of stacked zerg, not organized group that can evade damage and have still enough option to overheal.

Will probably be addressed in the upcoming PTS-patches (hopefully)