Any bans planned for the Felms VAS exploit?

arkansas_ESO

ATM it's possible to glitch out Saint Felms in VAS (can't say how on the forums obviously) so that he just stands there without doing any mechanics and can be safely DPSed down. Any bans planned for this? @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_RichLambert

maniac4maniac

Ye, ban people who make raw content consistently - the best way to improve further content

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO

sure ban people who encounter glitched things...hell no don't even think of fixing them!

Runefang

Who cares? I get that glitching vAS hardmode was an issue but this one is on ZOS, they need to fix their ***.

Woeler

Lel I reported this weeks ago. Still works then apparently.

Wolfkeks

I thought the people who did that got banned and that ZOS was monitoring it?
And the glitch still works? Mmh ZOS has to work on a fix for that....

Balamoor

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »

sure ban people who encounter glitched things...hell no don't even think of fixing them!

ESO where players can harass, threaten real world harm, doxx, and intimidate you for riding an Apex mount with impunity, but you can get banned for encountering glitches.

It's all about perspective

Vaoh

Bans were already sent out to people who exploited vAS HM by completing the fight vMoL HM style (aka stand far away/outside arena -> Snipe boss to death from safety). That issue is luckily dealt with.

Felms was bugged on PC for awhile (idk if it still is) where Felms would stand still and he’d just get killed while doing zero mechanics. That’s on ZOS. The *actual fight itself* is bugged. No exploit being done. It’d be ridiculous to ban players for beating a fight that the Devs themselves went and messed with. Many thousands of PC players would get banned if this was bannable lol. One guild even posted the “world first speed run” while Felms was bugged this way.

The problem here is that you’re mixing up the massive difference between standing outside vAS HM -> sniping boss to death outside the Arena (exploit) vs. doing the fight normally but ZOS made a boss easier than intended to fight because they themselves bugged it out (hotfix).

There are many scenarios in ESO where the same thing happened but in different trials. Just thinking of upstairs bosson HRC, you’d basically ask for over half of the entire endgame PvE population to get banned

Nifty2g

Is there even a way to ban for this one if theres no video proof? Thats the sad thing

Vaoh

Wolfkeks wrote: »

I thought the people who did that got banned and that ZOS was monitoring it?
And the glitch still works? Mmh ZOS has to work on a fix for that....

It’s an entirely different thing from what people were banned for.

FakeFox

You can bug out Felms very easily accidentally and I think it falls more under clever use of gamemechanics. If you want to ban people for that you should also ban everybody who breaks line of sight to position adds or something, as it literally the same thing.

ManwithBeard9

arkansas_ESO wrote: »

ATM it's possible to glitch out Saint Felms in VAS (can't say how on the forums obviously) so that he just stands there without doing any mechanics and can be safely DPSed down. Any bans planned for this? @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_RichLambert

Any evidence should be sent to those accounts in a private message. Screenshots, videos, chat logs, all of that would be forwarded to them

ThePrinceOfBargains

This is why I’ll never do a trial. They’re always broken at release and ZOS blames the players for their lazy, inadequate testing. I would’ve done that bow strategy and I’d have been pissed if I was banned over it. I’m just not dealing with that BS.

Zagnut123Zagnut123

Nifty2g wrote: »

Is there even a way to ban for this one if theres no video proof? Thats the sad thing

Yeah it would be easy to tell that someone is doing this from a data perspective.

But this exploit could very easily be viewed as a mechanic or working as intended, sure there are aspects of this glitch at might cause some to question this a raise it up as a exploit but @ZOS_Finn and others have failed to identify this on the forums to be a exploit. Instead they identified it as such within the council of raiders as such. This is very a very troubling failure at your fault @ZOS_Finn please make an announcement in acknowledging the exploit in language that won't give away the 'how'.

The lack of communication on subjects such as this is frustrating and demonstrates your lack of genuine passion for your customers.

logarifmik

Why ban? Reward them instead. Ah, this border between well-respected testers and those who abuse exploits is so thin...

paulsimonps

logarifmik wrote: »

Why ban? Reward them instead. Ah, this border between well-respected testers and those who abuse exploits is so thin...

Actually its pretty clear cut, if you notice that something like what they did is possible then they need to report it to the devs with an explanation on how its done so the devs can fix and prevent it. If they instead don't do that and choose to use the exploit and do leaderboard runs for either weekly, quick loot runs or others then they are violating the terms of service. So easy, if you find something iffy, report it and don't use it again or at all and you won't be a cheater.

eso_lags

any eta on perma bans for vmol exploiters?

idk

If they do not report it and especially if they repeat it they should be banned. Plain and simple. Zos finally figured out slaps on the wrist merely encourages exploiting. They need to keep up what they recently started.

ThePrinceOfBargains

Runefang wrote: »

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

Runefang wrote: »

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

This is why I’ll never do a trial. They’re always broken at release and ZOS blames the players for their lazy, inadequate testing. I would’ve done that bow strategy and I’d have been pissed if I was banned over it. I’m just not dealing with that BS.

Do you avoid all types of fun in life because of small problems?

I generally avoid certain types of fun when they involve greedy corporations like ZOS that don’t take responsibility for their incompetence.

So you play a game which has large group content but refuse to play said content because they're 'greedy' (i.e they're out to make money like all other companies) and 'incompetent' (i.e time poor, resource constrained, deadline driven and are carrying technical debt like all other long-running MMO companies)?. Not sure how you're hurting anybody but yourself with your attitude.

There’s a difference between average American greed and “EA” greed. And it’s not like I have this crazy desire to play trials and I’m ignoring it just to spite ZOS. Their constant BS antics honestly make me not want to play the game period, let alone trials. I’m taking a break now, but I usually put up with it. Not trials, though. I’m not risking my account the next time they blunder up, release broken content, and need people to pin it on. Yeah, I know I’d probably be fine, but it’s the principle. I know for a fact that I would’ve been one of the banned ones from the Saint Olms glitch, not even considering said action to be malicious.

WrathOfInnos

How about a hotfix, followed by 7 day bans, and then a repeat of vAS weekly during the time exploiters are banned. Would be nice to have a fair shot at perfected weapons, instead of falling just below all the groups that turned Felms into a group target skeleton.

AzraelKrieg

Felms getting bugged during the fight is different from finding a location where you won't be hit and starting the fight from there. If NPCs not attacking when engaged properly is considered an exploit than anyone that engaged a spider daedra up until two weeks ago should be banned for exploiting since they didn't attack back.

Nifty2g

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

Felms getting bugged during the fight is different from finding a location where you won't be hit and starting the fight from there. If NPCs not attacking when engaged properly is considered an exploit than anyone that engaged a spider daedra up until two weeks ago should be banned for exploiting since they didn't attack back.

Following step by step to make it so part of the hardmode is basically non existent to get yourself rewards such as the polymorph, perfected weapons, the skin and also devaluing players efforts is well of an enough reason to be banned over. You know what you're doing, you're damaging multiple parts of the game.

Don't act as if this is not an exploit you can't be banned over. I don't believe permanent ban but a harsh punishment for sure.

Boggus

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

This is why I’ll never do a trial. They’re always broken at release and ZOS blames the players for their lazy, inadequate testing. I would’ve done that bow strategy and I’d have been pissed if I was banned over it. I’m just not dealing with that BS.

You sure know what you're talking about when you've never done any trials

Mister_DMC

Well we had Felms bug in a different way tonight. Had about 8 reflections up and boss health resetting to 100%...

AzraelKrieg

Mister_DMC wrote: »

Well we had Felms bug in a different way tonight. Had about 8 reflections up and boss health resetting to 100%...

Sounds like when he was jumping around someone was too far out and he jumped to them and reset. It's an annoying mechanic but it's unfortunately working as intended.

zaria

Nifty2g wrote: »

AzraelKrieg wrote: »

Felms getting bugged during the fight is different from finding a location where you won't be hit and starting the fight from there. If NPCs not attacking when engaged properly is considered an exploit than anyone that engaged a spider daedra up until two weeks ago should be banned for exploiting since they didn't attack back.

Following step by step to make it so part of the hardmode is basically non existent to get yourself rewards such as the polymorph, perfected weapons, the skin and also devaluing players efforts is well of an enough reason to be banned over. You know what you're doing, you're damaging multiple parts of the game.

Don't act as if this is not an exploit you can't be banned over. I don't believe permanent ban but a harsh punishment for sure.

How is he bugged? has only done it at normal.
If its not something players are doing who seems like an exploit or just that the boss don't use all his abilities. If later players can obviously not be punished for playing the trial even if bugged. ZoS could take it down or disable hard mode or limit it so you get weapons but not title.

Doctordarkspawn

Balamoor wrote: »

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »

sure ban people who encounter glitched things...hell no don't even think of fixing them!

ESO where players can harass, threaten real world harm, doxx, and intimidate you for riding an Apex mount with impunity, but get banned for encountering glitches.

It's all about perspective

You keep saying this at any available opportunity.

Provide proof, why dont you? Or report it to the proper authorities?

Shardan4968

Last time someone made thread about this, most of the community were blaming players, now they blame ZOS. I can't keep up!

ThePrinceOfBargains

Boggus wrote: »

ThePrinceOfBargains wrote: »

This is why I’ll never do a trial. They’re always broken at release and ZOS blames the players for their lazy, inadequate testing. I would’ve done that bow strategy and I’d have been pissed if I was banned over it. I’m just not dealing with that BS.

You sure know what you're talking about when you've never done any trials

What does me personally having done the trials have to do with anything in this situation? I never said anything about trials that would require first-hand experience, only a history of recurring forum complaints. The Saint Olms snipe exploit (seriously, how the hell did that get past testing?) and how ZOS handled it just showed me that they’re not willing to take responsibility for their inadequacy.

Elsonso

Shardan4968 wrote: »

Last time someone made thread about this, most of the community were blaming players, now they blame ZOS. I can't keep up!

There were a number of people who were blaming ZOS, but they were late to the party. This time, they are arriving early. This is still a new issue, so once details get out, that could change.

ESO is littered with bugs. We are not supposed to be exploiting them.

If it has to be triggered through an unusual player action, then we aren't supposed to do that. They will suspend people. (There are indications that ZOS calls this suspension a "permanent ban". Ahem.)

If it just happens and there is no way to avoid it, or it does not happen consistently through player actions, then different story. They probably won't be banning people.

Going into final weeks of 2017, if it is not fixed and is not already in the pipeline to be delivered in the next 2 weeks, it will be well into January before this gets fixed. Just saying it.

HatchetHaro

It is much less of an exploit and much more of a clever use of game mechanics. Line-of-sight is a core mechanic in raiding and score pushing, used to stack enemies for a fast AOE burn, and that is the same technique used to glitch out Felms.

Rumors have it that the developers already knew of this and had even responded, telling the guild responsible, as far as I know, that they were fine clearing vAS that way. (Take that with a mine's worth of salt, though; please tell me if I'm wrong.)

In any case, I believe that the absolute most ZOS should do would be to remove the scores where Felms was glitched from the leaderboards. Seriously, that's about it. I can not, in any moral view, say that any of the raiders using that glitch should be punished.

More importantly, ZOS should just fix the damn thing; they've known about it for a long time, so if they did not acknowledge it as an offense and did not fix it during this entire time, it's their fault that raiders would abuse that mechanic.