This controversy on lootboxes/crown crates needs to stop

Appleblade

Everyone keeps saying it’s a business, but I’m waving my money in Zenimax’s face to buy specific items, and they don’t seem to want it.

Yagorn

Geroken777 wrote: »

Including here. Many of you cry about not having the choice to buy a cosmetic item that will grant you nothing but satisfaction at the end of the day. Remember this: ESO is a business and it needs revenue, and crown store does its job. Many of you suggested going back to sub-mode, but the reason ZOS decided to drop it is because it wasn't profitable. Again, coming to the topic of addiction which also a lot of you discuss. There is a word called 'self responsibility' and some people shoud look it up in the dictionary. This chaos needs to stop. Stop whining about cosmetics.

Self Responsibility I have, I wonder who made you their accounted to say this game isn't profitable...or a psychologist... Funny how the crown store does it's job but most of said cosmetics are behind yet another currency with arbitrary values and lootcrates.

Eyesinthedrk

Next time you want a car come to me with $40k. I’ll have a bag that you can pull one piece of paper from, what ever is on it you will get.

and in that bag will be a piece of paper that says Ferrari la Italia on it. Also one with STR viper, one with corvette zo6, camero ss, and finally one with mustang gt.

There will be 10 that say ford f150. 35 that say Honda Civic, 100 that say smart car.

There will also be 1500 that say wiper fluid, quart of 10-w30 oil, pine tree air freshener, and fuzzy pink steering wheel cover.

Do you want to buy a car from me?

boggo

Eyesinthedrk wrote: »

Next time you want a car come to me with $40k. I’ll have a bag that you can pull one piece of paper from, what ever is on it you will get.

and in that bag will be a piece of paper that says Ferrari la Italia on it. Also one with STR viper, one with corvette zo6, camero ss, and finally one with mustang gt.

There will be 10 that say ford f150. 35 that say Honda Civic, 100 that say smart car.

There will also be 1500 that say wiper fluid, quart of 10-w30 oil, pine tree air freshener, and fuzzy pink steering wheel cover.

Do you want to buy a car from me?

No, so I won‘t. Problem?

Rawkan

There's no controversy. You pay money to gamble for cosmetic items that in the end has no other value than looking cool.

People acting like they're forced to spend money on this need to grow up.

LadyAstrum

The difference between a casino and online loot crates is that a casino can't alter the odds. Online crates can be made to drop nice stuff, or only drop it occasionally. In that case, in my mind, loot crates are worse than gambling in a casino.

Beardimus

Geroken777 wrote: »

Including here. Many of you cry about not having the choice to buy a cosmetic item that will grant you nothing but satisfaction at the end of the day. Remember this: ESO is a business and it needs revenue, and crown store does its job. Many of you suggested going back to sub-mode, but the reason ZOS decided to drop it is because it wasn't profitable. Again, coming to the topic of addiction which also a lot of you discuss. There is a word called 'self responsibility' and some people shoud look it up in the dictionary. This chaos needs to stop. Stop whining about cosmetics.

Agreed. However people feel passionate about this topic so a new thread on it will not stop the whining, as you can see already.

It's a difference of opinion. I respect that some feel strongly about this, however totally disagree with them. If its legal, companies are entitled to do it to money - and so they should.

I wonder if the same people object to all forms of random purchases I.e. Pokemon, KinderEggs, or collectables such as Football Sticker packs or Garbage Pal Kids (showing my age)

I DO object to the collect em all marketing for kids. Children with no Impulse control or financial understanding. This is a PEGI rated game for adults. People need self control. And the argument that some people lack it, and are the same people that want all mounts is pandering to the 1% of the 1%. And they should never tap their card details into anything online if they need protecting.

That's just my view. Individual accountability. As opposed to blaming a system or a Company for ones actions. I.e. The same view that fast food joints make people fat. They don't. People do. Supermarkets don't get the same heat yet sell Brownies and Organic veg, and people choose.

I respect all others views even if polar to mine however. But I have zero issue with crates for cosmetics.

LadyAstrum

The controversy won't end until these things are regulated. As gaming companies, (run by people who don't even care about games) get greedier, these loot boxes will get worse, until finally there'll be no option but to regulate them or ban them outright.

Jade1986

Beardimus wrote: »

Geroken777 wrote: »

Including here. Many of you cry about not having the choice to buy a cosmetic item that will grant you nothing but satisfaction at the end of the day. Remember this: ESO is a business and it needs revenue, and crown store does its job. Many of you suggested going back to sub-mode, but the reason ZOS decided to drop it is because it wasn't profitable. Again, coming to the topic of addiction which also a lot of you discuss. There is a word called 'self responsibility' and some people shoud look it up in the dictionary. This chaos needs to stop. Stop whining about cosmetics.

Agreed. However people feel passionate about this topic so a new thread on it will not stop the whining, as you can see already.

It's a difference of opinion. I respect that some feel strongly about this, however totally disagree with them. If its legal, companies are entitled to do it to money - and so they should.

I wonder if the same people object to all forms of random purchases I.e. Pokemon, KinderEggs, or collectables such as Football Sticker packs or Garbage Pal Kids (showing my age)

I DO object to the collect em all marketing for kids. Children with no Impulse control or financial understanding. This is a PEGI rated game for adults. People need self control. And the argument that some people lack it, and are the same people that want all mounts is pandering to the 1% of the 1%. And they should never tap their card details into anything online if they need protecting.

That's just my view. Individual accountability. As opposed to blaming a system or a Company for ones actions. I.e. The same view that fast food joints make people fat. They don't. People do. Supermarkets don't get the same heat yet sell Brownies and Organic veg, and people choose.

I respect all others views even if polar to mine however. But I have zero issue with crates for cosmetics.

Actually as far as I can see, of 7 places, it only has an 18 rating in 2 . And in the countries where it matters, it is 17 and 16. If the rating were to be hiked to adult only, thatd be one thing, but we all know what the does to a games success. So, that argument is not valid.And it blows my mind that people argue in FAVOR of grab bags when they could get the items they want , increasing your choice amount.

Also, pokemon cards, you get pokemon cards no matter what, kinder eggs, toys no matter what, baseball cards, cards no matter what. ESO scam crates , not guaranteed to get ANYTHING you want. There is a massive difference.

Yagorn

Jade1986 wrote: »

Also, pokemon cards, you get pokemon cards no matter what, kinder eggs, toys no matter what, baseball cards, cards no matter what. ESO scam crates , not guaranteed to get ANYTHING you want. There is a massive difference.

They are pulling this *** about kinder eggs here too ? Unbelivable how people think a digital thing that can be taken from you at any moment is comparable to a *** egg that has a toy you can keep and eat the dam egg as well...

Beardimus

Jade1986 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Geroken777 wrote: »

Including here. Many of you cry about not having the choice to buy a cosmetic item that will grant you nothing but satisfaction at the end of the day. Remember this: ESO is a business and it needs revenue, and crown store does its job. Many of you suggested going back to sub-mode, but the reason ZOS decided to drop it is because it wasn't profitable. Again, coming to the topic of addiction which also a lot of you discuss. There is a word called 'self responsibility' and some people shoud look it up in the dictionary. This chaos needs to stop. Stop whining about cosmetics.

Agreed. However people feel passionate about this topic so a new thread on it will not stop the whining, as you can see already.

It's a difference of opinion. I respect that some feel strongly about this, however totally disagree with them. If its legal, companies are entitled to do it to money - and so they should.

I wonder if the same people object to all forms of random purchases I.e. Pokemon, KinderEggs, or collectables such as Football Sticker packs or Garbage Pal Kids (showing my age)

I DO object to the collect em all marketing for kids. Children with no Impulse control or financial understanding. This is a PEGI rated game for adults. People need self control. And the argument that some people lack it, and are the same people that want all mounts is pandering to the 1% of the 1%. And they should never tap their card details into anything online if they need protecting.

That's just my view. Individual accountability. As opposed to blaming a system or a Company for ones actions. I.e. The same view that fast food joints make people fat. They don't. People do. Supermarkets don't get the same heat yet sell Brownies and Organic veg, and people choose.

I respect all others views even if polar to mine however. But I have zero issue with crates for cosmetics.

Actually as far as I can see, of 7 places, it only has an 18 rating in 2 . And in the countries where it matters, it is 17 and 16. If the rating were to be hiked to adult only, thatd be one thing, but we all know what the does to a games success. So, that argument is not valid.And it blows my mind that people argue in FAVOR of grab bags when they could get the items they want , increasing your choice amount.

Also, pokemon cards, you get pokemon cards no matter what, kinder eggs, toys no matter what, baseball cards, cards no matter what. ESO scam crates , not guaranteed to get ANYTHING you want. There is a massive difference.

Huh? You aren't guaranteed anything you want in kids collection cards. You could get a duplicate or one you don't want. It's the same as crown crates. If you want one specific toy and buy a load to get it its the same thing.

Some people know use the tri pots and crown meals as they don't craft and the total junk you can trade for gems.

Way I see it the only people that have an issue with the crates generally want all the mounts all the time or lack Impulse control. Thus use those arguments to want to void them for all. I assume your view on Pokémon et al is because you also collect those. And as a collector this system frustrates you as you want it all and can't have it.

For the rest of us, who can happily ignore the crates and are glad the game runs a profit they are easy to ignore or think of as a good thing.

Re your comment on kids. If sub 16 year olds are playing a game un supervised with killing in, that's addictive anyway as an MMO and a huge time sink, there is a bigger parenting debate to be had that crown crates. Besides how can a 10 year opd buy anything without mummy or daddys credit cards.

Honestly. The entitlement in this argument is scary. In short you want the mounts and are pissed you can't have then easy.

The_Lex

Sigh....

This topic makes me nostalgic for the days long before loot crates. Back when one price would get you a full game. Where a "DLC" was a full expansion and not cut content that should have been in the base game.

Progression: 1 game > 1 game with expansions > 1 game with cut content repackaged as DLCs > 1 game with DLCs and possible expansions + loot crates.

Eyesinthedrk

boggo wrote: »

Eyesinthedrk wrote: »

Next time you want a car come to me with $40k. I’ll have a bag that you can pull one piece of paper from, what ever is on it you will get.

and in that bag will be a piece of paper that says Ferrari la Italia on it. Also one with STR viper, one with corvette zo6, camero ss, and finally one with mustang gt.

There will be 10 that say ford f150. 35 that say Honda Civic, 100 that say smart car.

There will also be 1500 that say wiper fluid, quart of 10-w30 oil, pine tree air freshener, and fuzzy pink steering wheel cover.

Do you want to buy a car from me?

No, so I won‘t. Problem?

Not while you have another option to buy a car. Would you feel the same if I was the only car salesman in the world?

Eyesinthedrk

How does any other business in the world make a net profit but letting their customers buy what they actually want?

Why don’t you help out your local grocery store. Give them a hundred bucks and tell them to kick a few shelves. Whatever falls on the floor is what you’re eating next week?

Jade1986

Beardimus wrote: »

Jade1986 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Geroken777 wrote: »

Including here. Many of you cry about not having the choice to buy a cosmetic item that will grant you nothing but satisfaction at the end of the day. Remember this: ESO is a business and it needs revenue, and crown store does its job. Many of you suggested going back to sub-mode, but the reason ZOS decided to drop it is because it wasn't profitable. Again, coming to the topic of addiction which also a lot of you discuss. There is a word called 'self responsibility' and some people shoud look it up in the dictionary. This chaos needs to stop. Stop whining about cosmetics.

Agreed. However people feel passionate about this topic so a new thread on it will not stop the whining, as you can see already.

It's a difference of opinion. I respect that some feel strongly about this, however totally disagree with them. If its legal, companies are entitled to do it to money - and so they should.

I wonder if the same people object to all forms of random purchases I.e. Pokemon, KinderEggs, or collectables such as Football Sticker packs or Garbage Pal Kids (showing my age)

I DO object to the collect em all marketing for kids. Children with no Impulse control or financial understanding. This is a PEGI rated game for adults. People need self control. And the argument that some people lack it, and are the same people that want all mounts is pandering to the 1% of the 1%. And they should never tap their card details into anything online if they need protecting.

That's just my view. Individual accountability. As opposed to blaming a system or a Company for ones actions. I.e. The same view that fast food joints make people fat. They don't. People do. Supermarkets don't get the same heat yet sell Brownies and Organic veg, and people choose.

I respect all others views even if polar to mine however. But I have zero issue with crates for cosmetics.

Actually as far as I can see, of 7 places, it only has an 18 rating in 2 . And in the countries where it matters, it is 17 and 16. If the rating were to be hiked to adult only, thatd be one thing, but we all know what the does to a games success. So, that argument is not valid.And it blows my mind that people argue in FAVOR of grab bags when they could get the items they want , increasing your choice amount.

Also, pokemon cards, you get pokemon cards no matter what, kinder eggs, toys no matter what, baseball cards, cards no matter what. ESO scam crates , not guaranteed to get ANYTHING you want. There is a massive difference.

Huh? You aren't guaranteed anything you want in kids collection cards. You could get a duplicate or one you don't want. It's the same as crown crates. If you want one specific toy and buy a load to get it its the same thing.

Some people know use the tri pots and crown meals as they don't craft and the total junk you can trade for gems.

Way I see it the only people that have an issue with the crates generally want all the mounts all the time or lack Impulse control. Thus use those arguments to want to void them for all. I assume your view on Pokémon et al is because you also collect those. And as a collector this system frustrates you as you want it all and can't have it.

For the rest of us, who can happily ignore the crates and are glad the game runs a profit they are easy to ignore or think of as a good thing.

Re your comment on kids. If sub 16 year olds are playing a game un supervised with killing in, that's addictive anyway as an MMO and a huge time sink, there is a bigger parenting debate to be had that crown crates. Besides how can a 10 year opd buy anything without mummy or daddys credit cards.

Honestly. The entitlement in this argument is scary. In short you want the mounts and are pissed you can't have then easy.

Hahahahaha! Yeah wanting to know what I'm getting I entitlement. Oh boy....

Raideen

LadyAstrum wrote: »

The difference between a casino and online loot crates is that a casino can't alter the odds. Online crates can be made to drop nice stuff, or only drop it occasionally. In that case, in my mind, loot crates are worse than gambling in a casino.

Especially when you consider that in any given card game there is a fixed amount of possibilities. Vegas, or any casino can not change the outcome of the card game itself.

With loot crates, ZOS in fact sets the drop chance of an item. They can fix this in future loot crates by lowering the drop chance of a rare mount, where as in the past the same level of rare mount could have had a higher drop chance.

Its sleazy to say the least.

BlazingDynamo

DocFrost72 wrote: »

The singular predatory thing in the crown crates (in my opinion) is the mounts you can't buy with gems.

If you're a collector, there is an exact cap of price for everything else.

These "collectors" sound like addicts. Maybe they should seek help because if you HAVE to have every virtual mount that comes out in eso regardless of how they make it obtainable you're spending way too much damn money in the first place.

Appleblade

Actually Vegas can tweak the results of slot machines, and if you walk into a casino there that seems to be the bulk of their business. There’s plenty of stories about how the ones near the entrances tend to pay off more to attract customers, and other marketing strategies, but I have no idea how apocryphal they are. They also have complete control over the payouts. The video poker machines used to be fun. You could put a $20 bill in and play for quite a long time-a good time waster if you’re waiting for someone. Then they severely nerfed the payouts and it just isn’t even worth it now.

The mood there goes the other way. I used to be a decent card counter and played blackjack. There are some who consider that cheating. Utter nonsense. How was it cheating to simply keep track of information is freely presented to me during the course of a game?

Hanokihs

Eyesinthedrk wrote: »

How does any other business in the world make a net profit but letting their customers buy what they actually want?

Why don’t you help out your local grocery store. Give them a hundred bucks and tell them to kick a few shelves. Whatever falls on the floor is what you’re eating next week?

Your arguments about cars and groceries are nonsensical, because those are necessities. Crown crate items aren't necessary for anything beyond their intrinsic value, and even that can change on a whim depending on the person.

If you just have to stick with these analogies...:

You get to pick the make and model of the car, but you're stuck with whatever color or aesthetic gets thrown at you. Maybe you'll get the blue one you want; maybe you'll get a neon orange eyesore, or maybe you'll get one that has bumper stickers all over it. Luck of the draw.

You get to pick your groceries, but not the brand or style where applicable. Looking for pasta? Maybe you get elbow noodles for your mac 'n cheese; maybe you get lasagna sheets and have to make due. Want chicken? Okay, well, we know you were going for only chicken breast cutlets, but as it turns out, you got a whole hen. You'll manage, won't you? And as a bonus draw - here's some tuna!

MercyKilling

It'll stop when crates go away. No compromise. No crates. Ever.

Radiance

Can't use Crown Crate Gems, for this exact purpose, Acquired from already having Bought Crown Crate gems on Crate items... Cool. Then, what's the point of having them!?
How you all sound defending Highway Robbery: