Bleed Builds

Toast_STS

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

ak_pvp wrote: »

They also use flury, which is more likely to proc bleed from axes vs jabs.

Are you sure flurry can proc tbab bleed? Thought only la and ha can do that.

Other skills with direct damage can proc bleed but no not flurry. Example: Noxious breath and venomous claw can proc bleed on the initial hit.

idk

Pretty much any stamina build is a solid DoT build which seems to be what OP is looking for.

Thogard

idk wrote: »

Pretty much any stamina build is a solid DoT build which seems to be what OP is looking for.

I’m not trying to make a bleed build, was just trying to figure out why I died in a PvP area without making a qq thread lol.

Was getting hit for 5k a tick rending slashes bleed.

I’m wondering if it was VMA and VDSA dual wield combined...

devilsTear

Thogard wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Pretty much any stamina build is a solid DoT build which seems to be what OP is looking for.

I’m not trying to make a bleed build, was just trying to figure out why I died in a PvP area without making a qq thread lol.

Was getting hit for 5k a tick rending slashes bleed.

I’m wondering if it was VMA and VDSA dual wield combined...

You can't do that anymore I think, you need 2 master weapons for the effect now.

Thogard

devilsTear wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Pretty much any stamina build is a solid DoT build which seems to be what OP is looking for.

I’m not trying to make a bleed build, was just trying to figure out why I died in a PvP area without making a qq thread lol.

Was getting hit for 5k a tick rending slashes bleed.

I’m wondering if it was VMA and VDSA dual wield combined...

You can't do that anymore I think, you need 2 master weapons for the effect now.

I was thinking more like VMA DW frontbar for flurry, then VDSA backbar for rending slashes

devilsTear

Thogard wrote: »

devilsTear wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Pretty much any stamina build is a solid DoT build which seems to be what OP is looking for.

I’m not trying to make a bleed build, was just trying to figure out why I died in a PvP area without making a qq thread lol.

Was getting hit for 5k a tick rending slashes bleed.

I’m wondering if it was VMA and VDSA dual wield combined...

You can't do that anymore I think, you need 2 master weapons for the effect now.

I was thinking more like VMA DW frontbar for flurry, then VDSA backbar for rending slashes

Oh okay my bad then

Rohaus

Dual wield both bars... LOL... sick

Thogard

Rohaus wrote: »

Dual wield both bars... LOL... sick

yeah im just theory crafting at this point lol.

But you get 2k from VMA DW, 2k from vDSA 2h... and then lets say you have a native WD of 2.5k... then you use blooddrinker for your other set... dump everything in thaumaturge..

that bleed would be pretty god damn ridiculous.

waitwhat

Rianai wrote: »

waitwhat wrote: »

One of the advantages on an NB with bleed is that you can apply the DoT (with say, master's daggers or whatever), and then cloak, whereupon all the bleed ticks immediately start critting.

Unless they changed it recently, DoTs - like any damage - consume the guaranteed crit buff and therefore you get only one critical tick. It does not work like heals.

@Rianai

If what you say is true, then they must have changed it. It does work like heals. I'll get 4k+ non crit ticks from rending slashes, pop cloak, and get three crit ticks every time. It also applies to all my DoTs.

Edit: Trust me, I've testing this extensively on the live server once I acquired my Master's Daggers. It may not be intended, but it does happen with Rending Slashes.

Thogard

waitwhat wrote: »

Rianai wrote: »

waitwhat wrote: »

One of the advantages on an NB with bleed is that you can apply the DoT (with say, master's daggers or whatever), and then cloak, whereupon all the bleed ticks immediately start critting.

Unless they changed it recently, DoTs - like any damage - consume the guaranteed crit buff and therefore you get only one critical tick. It does not work like heals.

@Rianai

If what you say is true, then they must have changed it. It does work like heals. I'll get 4k+ non crit ticks from rending slashes, pop cloak, and get three crit ticks every time. It also applies to all my DoTs.

Edit: Trust me, I've testing this extensively on the live server once I acquired my Master's Daggers. It may not be intended, but it does happen with Rending Slashes.

interesting

TankHealz2015

Argonian- Stamina-DK- with WW: what is the most extreme bleed build I could make?

monster set: unknown?

Blood-drinker +20% bleed damage?

Pilar of Nirn - new set from Falkreath dungeon? the proc delay could be awkward in PvP...

Twin Sisters - 20% chance Bleed proc when you block?
*not a big fan of having to block a lot when there is not clear visual cue that the proc went off


--dual wield with an axe and whatever up front and then with 2 handed axe on back bar?


Thoughts?

Sixty5

waitwhat wrote: »

Rianai wrote: »

waitwhat wrote: »

One of the advantages on an NB with bleed is that you can apply the DoT (with say, master's daggers or whatever), and then cloak, whereupon all the bleed ticks immediately start critting.

Unless they changed it recently, DoTs - like any damage - consume the guaranteed crit buff and therefore you get only one critical tick. It does not work like heals.

@Rianai

If what you say is true, then they must have changed it. It does work like heals. I'll get 4k+ non crit ticks from rending slashes, pop cloak, and get three crit ticks every time. It also applies to all my DoTs.

Edit: Trust me, I've testing this extensively on the live server once I acquired my Master's Daggers. It may not be intended, but it does happen with Rending Slashes.

Can somewhat confirm here, mate wanted to make a Stygian DOT build, so we did some testing.

Cloaking applied crit and stygian buff to all of the running dots, even if they had not been cast from cloak.

dsalter

sorc hands down. pulverize can proc off EVERY bleed tick at threshhold

Qbiken

TankHealz2015 wrote: »

I experimented with the following:

Hulking set 5pc is all + stam

Blood-drinker set 5pc is +20% bleed damge

Veledreth monster helmet set drops poison party balls

Werewolf -- the beserker build - the morph with no pets

CP into Thaumaturge (DoT) bumps up the bleed.

Pounce in, light attack, light attack, Howl, Disease, light attack, light attack... pounce away,... sick damage.


Only problem is that Cyridil open world is very situational and it's almost impossible to be consistent.

If you´re running solo with that setup as a WW you´ll be done for it quite quickly. Sure you´ve high damage, but no reliable way to heal yourself or mitigate damage. And even if the WW-bleed looks good on paper it will refresh itself on every light attack you do, and since the majority of your damage comes from light attacks (due to how expensive WW`s skills are. Even with Hulking you´ll run dry very fast if spamming WW´s skills) you won´t get much out of the bleed. If I remember it correctly, bleed-damage doesn´t do damage on the second it´s applied, and you´ve to wait 2 seconds before the first tick appear, and if you refresh it everytime you light attack you won´t get much benefits from it.

WillhelmBlack

How many real bleeds are there? I can think of 3.

Carve
Blood Craze
Maelstrom 2h

I found out that the DW ultimate though very strong, was supposed to be a bleed but it isn't, it's just a regular DoT.

Since looking into it myself, I don't think Blood Drinker set is the best way of amping up a Bleed builds damage. Any class can run a bleed build, just go with your favourite.

Thogard

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

How many real bleeds are there? I can think of 3.

Carve
Blood Craze
Maelstrom 2h

I found out that the DW ultimate though very strong, was supposed to be a bleed but it isn't, it's just a regular DoT.

Since looking into it myself, I don't think Blood Drinker set is the best way of amping up a Bleed builds damage. Any class can run a bleed build, just go with your favourite.

Are we sure VMA 2h is a bleed? I thought it wasn’t.

Qbiken

Thogard wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

How many real bleeds are there? I can think of 3.

Carve
Blood Craze
Maelstrom 2h

I found out that the DW ultimate though very strong, was supposed to be a bleed but it isn't, it's just a regular DoT.

Since looking into it myself, I don't think Blood Drinker set is the best way of amping up a Bleed builds damage. Any class can run a bleed build, just go with your favourite.

Are we sure VMA 2h is a bleed? I thought it wasn’t.

From my testings (done a few months ago) blood-drinker will buff any damage that are described as a "Physical damage of time" (Doesn´t buff any AoE physical DoT´s). Will check later when I get home if the tooltip on vMA 2h is increased with blooddrinker.

WillhelmBlack

Thogard wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

How many real bleeds are there? I can think of 3.

Carve
Blood Craze
Maelstrom 2h

I found out that the DW ultimate though very strong, was supposed to be a bleed but it isn't, it's just a regular DoT.

Since looking into it myself, I don't think Blood Drinker set is the best way of amping up a Bleed builds damage. Any class can run a bleed build, just go with your favourite.

Are we sure VMA 2h is a bleed? I thought it wasn’t.

Just checked, no it isn't.

WillhelmBlack

Qbiken wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

How many real bleeds are there? I can think of 3.

Carve
Blood Craze
Maelstrom 2h

I found out that the DW ultimate though very strong, was supposed to be a bleed but it isn't, it's just a regular DoT.

Since looking into it myself, I don't think Blood Drinker set is the best way of amping up a Bleed builds damage. Any class can run a bleed build, just go with your favourite.

Are we sure VMA 2h is a bleed? I thought it wasn’t.

From my testings (done a few months ago) blood-drinker will buff any damage that are described as a "Physical damage of time" (Doesn´t buff any AoE physical DoT´s). Will check later when I get home if the tooltip on vMA 2h is increased with blooddrinker.

Would you check the tooltip damage on Lacerate with Blood Drinker for us? I've fell in love with this ultimate recently.

Thogard

Are bleeds affected by automaton?
Also, can bleeds trigger implosion?

Qbiken

Thogard wrote: »

Are bleeds affected by automaton?
Also, can bleeds trigger implosion?

First question: Not sure,
Second question: Yes

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

How many real bleeds are there? I can think of 3.

Carve
Blood Craze
Maelstrom 2h

I found out that the DW ultimate though very strong, was supposed to be a bleed but it isn't, it's just a regular DoT.

Since looking into it myself, I don't think Blood Drinker set is the best way of amping up a Bleed builds damage. Any class can run a bleed build, just go with your favourite.

Are we sure VMA 2h is a bleed? I thought it wasn’t.

From my testings (done a few months ago) blood-drinker will buff any damage that are described as a "Physical damage of time" (Doesn´t buff any AoE physical DoT´s). Will check later when I get home if the tooltip on vMA 2h is increased with blooddrinker.

Would you check the tooltip damage on Lacerate with Blood Drinker for us? I've fell in love with this ultimate recently.

Sure, can check

Speed_Kills

@Thogard yes and yes

Wreuntzylla

Thogard wrote: »

waitwhat wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

waitwhat wrote: »

@Thogard

One of the advantages on an NB with bleed is that you can apply the DoT (with say, master's daggers or whatever), and then cloak, whereupon all the bleed ticks immediately start critting.

.

Thanks! That’s the piece of the puzzle I was missing and needed to know.

@Thogard No prob!

Also, wardens and templars will always be a hard counter to a bleed build, because they have easy access to cleanses with netch + ritual.

My blue netch purges 1 effect per cast

Trashs1 wrote: »

i tried a blead build and farmed bloodtrinker set for it.

paired with another dmg set i came on my tests with dw ult+ dw bleed skill+ axebleed not above 2.700 per tick (duell)

every vigor can outheal this easily so i went back to my old build

I don’t think blood drinker is the best way to max out a bleed build. I was literally getting hit for OVER 5k a tic in pvp.

I’m wondering if it’s feasible to stack VMA dual wield (after a flurry, extra 2kish dmg on next single target DOT) with the vDSA dual wield (bleed ticks for 1500ish more per tic)

I must do some testing...

Getting hit for over 5k a tic = bloodrinker...

When I am in a group, I'll run a ravager/bloodrinker build on my warden. If running WW, add kena for spectacular results... but only in group, you are a soft WW in that setup.

Wreuntzylla

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

How many real bleeds are there? I can think of 3.

Carve
Blood Craze
Maelstrom 2h

I found out that the DW ultimate though very strong, was supposed to be a bleed but it isn't, it's just a regular DoT.

Since looking into it myself, I don't think Blood Drinker set is the best way of amping up a Bleed builds damage. Any class can run a bleed build, just go with your favourite.

Are we sure VMA 2h is a bleed? I thought it wasn’t.

From my testings (done a few months ago) blood-drinker will buff any damage that are described as a "Physical damage of time" (Doesn´t buff any AoE physical DoT´s). Will check later when I get home if the tooltip on vMA 2h is increased with blooddrinker.

Would you check the tooltip damage on Lacerate with Blood Drinker for us? I've fell in love with this ultimate recently.

When I was testing bleed and WW builds, lacerate did not benefit from blood drinker. Huge disappointment, but then, I understand why it wouldn't be.

waitwhat

I love this thread. I think these builds will be the solution to the tanking meta.

Drakkdjinn

Still testing my version of the build, main drawback I see is that the delayed "burst" of bleed dots forces the user to play a lot of bleed tag in many engagements if not tanky enough to brawl while they do their work. Also shield cheesers are still able to ez mode counter bleeds with their one button answer for everything even without purge which is disappointing. Not convinced it's better than the current standard meta builds for Stam just yet, but it's a fun alternative so far in testing for sure, esp. vs. permablocktards.

WillhelmBlack

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

How many real bleeds are there? I can think of 3.

Carve
Blood Craze
Maelstrom 2h

I found out that the DW ultimate though very strong, was supposed to be a bleed but it isn't, it's just a regular DoT.

Since looking into it myself, I don't think Blood Drinker set is the best way of amping up a Bleed builds damage. Any class can run a bleed build, just go with your favourite.

Are we sure VMA 2h is a bleed? I thought it wasn’t.

From my testings (done a few months ago) blood-drinker will buff any damage that are described as a "Physical damage of time" (Doesn´t buff any AoE physical DoT´s). Will check later when I get home if the tooltip on vMA 2h is increased with blooddrinker.

Would you check the tooltip damage on Lacerate with Blood Drinker for us? I've fell in love with this ultimate recently.

When I was testing bleed and WW builds, lacerate did not benefit from blood drinker. Huge disappointment, but then, I understand why it wouldn't be.

Cheers! I'll stick with my current set up.

TankHealz2015

From my testings (done a few months ago) blood-drinker will buff any damage that are described as a "Physical damage of time" (Doesn´t buff any AoE physical DoT´s). Will check later when I get home if the tooltip on vMA 2h is increased with blooddrinker.[/quote]




Please, could you give example(s) of sets that would be get buffed with this?

Also-- some sets are weird about CP allocation..

I guess I remembered playing Guild Wars 2 (GW2) and a bleed build in that game was very strong. But the bleed DoTs would stack and last much longer making them quite dangerous... big difference.

Wreuntzylla

waitwhat wrote: »

I love this thread. I think these builds will be the solution to the tanking meta.

Werewolf is the anti-tank meta. ZoS added some sets that pulled it out of the dustpile and pushed it into (arguably) overperforming.

The only reason Cyrodiil isn't filled with them is that you have to group with 2-3 other werewolves so that you aren't falling out of transformation all the time.

We took a group of 4 into BGs, 3 WW's and one Warden healer, and after an hour or so, the people dominating the charts would just leave the BG before it started. Some of that was due to having one of our two awesome healers in group, which let's you use certain dps sets, but 2-3 WW's on an assist train is ... well... barely passable, nothing to see here.

Thogard

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

waitwhat wrote: »

I love this thread. I think these builds will be the solution to the tanking meta.

Werewolf is the anti-tank meta. ZoS added some sets that pulled it out of the dustpile and pushed it into (arguably) overperforming.

The only reason Cyrodiil isn't filled with them is that you have to group with 2-3 other werewolves so that you aren't falling out of transformation all the time.

We took a group of 4 into BGs, 3 WW's and one Warden healer, and after an hour or so, the people dominating the charts would just leave the BG before it started. Some of that was due to having one of our two awesome healers in group, which let's you use certain dps sets, but 2-3 WW's on an assist train is ... well... barely passable, nothing to see here.

What server are you on?