A lot of negative discussion about Argonians and Khajiit.

Cadbury

TheMaster wrote: »

I'll admit it. My eyes were drawn to...something else first

Sixty5

Cadbury wrote: »

TheMaster wrote: »

I'll admit it. My eyes were drawn to...something else first

Same here.

That unharvested columbine sings to me.

Enslaved

Sixty5 wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Khajiit are fine in my book.

They are a seperate race that has a whole lot of interesting stuff going on, with interactions with the moons and all, as well as likely being created in part by Sheogorath.

The Argonians on the other hand were made to serve the Hist, and that is kinda their whole deal. There are a bunch of battles that they ran away from, and they mostly just hide in Black Marsh. Even their supposed badassery during the Oblivion crisis was really just the Hist seeing what was coming and pumping them full of 'roids, not a push by an organised Argonian army.

Look at the Altmer on the other hand. They turned basically the entirity of Summerset into a giant magical construct, They've fought off the Maromer and the Sload repeatedly throughout their history, and the only time they have every really been defeated was when a Dragonborn marched a giant mech powered by the heart of a dead god up to their shores.

People will argue there and say that "but he didn't beat the argonians with it" and while that is true, you have to realise that the Argonians didn't beat Tiber Septim, he just came to the conclusion that Black Marsh wasn't worth the trouble.

Plus my experience with them over all Elder Scrolls games has been mostly negative.

What a bs post.
Saxhleel first came on their own to help Dunmer and Nords drive off the Akaviri invaders. Then they stayed to fight against breton and altmer scum. Did a lizard bite you irl so you are so biased toward Saxhleel in ESO?
First you claimed they were souless.
Then you claimed they cannot exist without Hist.
Now you want to present them as a bunch of cowards.
Just go to Alessia bridge. Someone will kill you there and end your misery.

Never said they were soulless, just that they got their souls from the hist. Likewise I said they wouldn't exist without the hist. And yes they are pretty cowardly.

Their "great society" was most likely wiped out by the Aylieds in the Merethic Era.
In the first era they were beaten soundly by the first Empire, and retreated deep into Black Marsh along with those that were too slow being made into slaves.
In the second era the only thing of note they did was make a lot of people sick.
The third era saw them do the one slightly cool thing their race ever did. And even then it was only because the Hist forewarned them.
In the fourth era they invaded a Morrowind severely weakened by the eruption of red mountain in order to pay the dunmer back for the years of slavery, but even then they were pretty quickly defeated.

They have a history of losing to pretty much everyone who attacks them, and then running back into Black Marsh.

What can you offer to prove to me that the Argonians are a cool race beyond the fact that they are Lizard People?

Aylieds were destroyed by their former slaves. Now half of you proudly use a former slave races and try to be racist toward a race that still has its own enslavement issues. If that is not bigoted than nothing is.

For example, Bretons, a former slaves to the Mer ancestors, have only one type of their native culture - the savages obsessed with crows and, who would guess, some trees. What we see as Breton kingdoms and "cultured" stuff is what they inherited from their former masters.

On the other hand, Saxhleel had way older culture, did not start to nourish slaver's culture, did not enslave other races and now they are seen savages that are good only to be used as slaves or, as sad pathetic beings here say, crafting materials? Yeah, not bigoted at all.

Why is the Breton tree cult and their numerous Wyresses and Hagravens good, and Hist is seen as something bad? Or maybe Bosmer tree cult that made them cannibals is better than Saxhleel tree cult? Oh, yeah, I know, bosmer folk are cute so cannibalism is OK. Pathetic reasoning.

Saxhleel are natives to Tamriel, unlike races of Men and Mer. Saxhleel did not invade anyone until their retribution war in 4th Era against Dunmer slavers. Saxhleel do not hunt other races to consume their flesh, nor do they impose their religious beliefs on others. You might not like them but they will prevail long after races of Men and Mer vanish from face of Nirn.

If I am being honest, my biggest problem is that Argonians seem like a random side offshoot to the main Divine history of Nirn. They weren't created by the divines, and honestly seem to lack the same sort of connection to the mythology that the other races have.
It just feels like you could take the Argonians and the Hist and throw them into any other game and they'd fit there just as well.
And then the lore they do have just isn't all that interesting.

I mean I'd love to look more into the lore of the Hist and all, but there really isn't much there apart from them being Magical transdimensional trees with semi godly powers.

Why must all be created by same set of self proclaimed gods?
Also, who can say that Hist is not a divinity of some sort as well?

My biggest problem with threads like this one is that, if anyone would make similar thread and try to be openly racist toward Redguards, he/she/it would end banned for sure. Also, I haven't seen anyone bashing Redguards for being from another timeline, nor anyone said they would cease to exist withou their tu'wacca and other non existing gods. As I said, bigotry at its finest.

Loc2262

Do we really need another thread about this crap? ZOS should start locking them.

Ch4mpTW

My how lovely it is being a proud High Elf amongst The Dominion.

Jamini

The amount of ignorance and outright falsehoods being bandied around in this thread are golden. This one is highly offended by some of these insinuations.

1. Khajiit as a species have absolutely nothing to do with the Skooma Cat.

https://www.imperial-library.info/content/words-clan-mother-ahnissi-her-favored-daughter

And Azurah came to her and said, "Poor Nirni, stop your tears. Azurah makes for you a gift of a new people." Nirni stopped weeping, and Azurah spoke the First Secret to the Moons and they parted and let Azurah pass. And Azurah took some forest people who were torn between man and beast, and she placed them in the best deserts and forests on Nirni. And Azurah in her wisdom made them of many shapes, one for every purpose. And Azurah named them Khajiit and told them her Second Secret and taught them the value of secrets. And Azurah bound the new Khajiit to the Lunar Lattice, as is proper for Nirni's secret defenders. Then Azurah spoke the Third Secret, and the Moons shone down on the marshes and their light became sugar.

But Y'ffer heard the First Secret and snuck in behind Azurah. And Y'ffer could not appreciate secrets, and he told Nirni of Azurah's trick. So Nirni made the deserts hot and the sands biting. And Nirni made the forests wet and filled with poisons. And Nirni thanked Y'ffer and let him change the forest people also. And Y'ffer did not have Azurah's subtle wisdom, so Y'ffer made the forest people Elves always and never beasts. And Y'ffer named them Bosmer. And from that moment they were no longer in the same litter as the Khajiit.

2. The Argonians are directly tied to the Hist, and are likely soul-extensions of it. The Hist is not native in any way to Nirn, though it is not a classic Daedra as we would know it either (Though it is still Daedric by strict definition). The Argonians themselves have bodies made from the lizards/birds/fish of the black marsh that have been given souls by the Hist.

Argonian physiology can be dramatically altered by the hist at-will. (Going from Oviporous to Viviporous. Turning into Behemoths after ingesting hist sap. Becoming warm-blooded in cold climates). Argonians can live anywhere, but for Saxheel to be wholly complete they need to at some point ingest hist sap, which can only really be found in the Black Marsh.

No empire has successfully invaded the black marsh. The closest any group has come to domination were the Empire in the 2nd era, and even then they barely were able to tame the edges of it. The only reason the Argonians "Always retreat to the black marsh" is because they have significant difficulty raising children outside of it.

Shezzarrine

Sixty5 wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Khajiit are fine in my book.

They are a seperate race that has a whole lot of interesting stuff going on, with interactions with the moons and all, as well as likely being created in part by Sheogorath.

The Argonians on the other hand were made to serve the Hist, and that is kinda their whole deal. There are a bunch of battles that they ran away from, and they mostly just hide in Black Marsh. Even their supposed badassery during the Oblivion crisis was really just the Hist seeing what was coming and pumping them full of 'roids, not a push by an organised Argonian army.

Look at the Altmer on the other hand. They turned basically the entirity of Summerset into a giant magical construct, They've fought off the Maromer and the Sload repeatedly throughout their history, and the only time they have every really been defeated was when a Dragonborn marched a giant mech powered by the heart of a dead god up to their shores.

People will argue there and say that "but he didn't beat the argonians with it" and while that is true, you have to realise that the Argonians didn't beat Tiber Septim, he just came to the conclusion that Black Marsh wasn't worth the trouble.

Plus my experience with them over all Elder Scrolls games has been mostly negative.

What a bs post.
Saxhleel first came on their own to help Dunmer and Nords drive off the Akaviri invaders. Then they stayed to fight against breton and altmer scum. Did a lizard bite you irl so you are so biased toward Saxhleel in ESO?
First you claimed they were souless.
Then you claimed they cannot exist without Hist.
Now you want to present them as a bunch of cowards.
Just go to Alessia bridge. Someone will kill you there and end your misery.

Never said they were soulless, just that they got their souls from the hist. Likewise I said they wouldn't exist without the hist. And yes they are pretty cowardly.

Their "great society" was most likely wiped out by the Aylieds in the Merethic Era.
In the first era they were beaten soundly by the first Empire, and retreated deep into Black Marsh along with those that were too slow being made into slaves.
In the second era the only thing of note they did was make a lot of people sick.
The third era saw them do the one slightly cool thing their race ever did. And even then it was only because the Hist forewarned them.
In the fourth era they invaded a Morrowind severely weakened by the eruption of red mountain in order to pay the dunmer back for the years of slavery, but even then they were pretty quickly defeated.

They have a history of losing to pretty much everyone who attacks them, and then running back into Black Marsh.

What can you offer to prove to me that the Argonians are a cool race beyond the fact that they are Lizard People?

Aylieds were destroyed by their former slaves. Now half of you proudly use a former slave races and try to be racist toward a race that still has its own enslavement issues. If that is not bigoted than nothing is.

For example, Bretons, a former slaves to the Mer ancestors, have only one type of their native culture - the savages obsessed with crows and, who would guess, some trees. What we see as Breton kingdoms and "cultured" stuff is what they inherited from their former masters.

On the other hand, Saxhleel had way older culture, did not start to nourish slaver's culture, did not enslave other races and now they are seen savages that are good only to be used as slaves or, as sad pathetic beings here say, crafting materials? Yeah, not bigoted at all.

Why is the Breton tree cult and their numerous Wyresses and Hagravens good, and Hist is seen as something bad? Or maybe Bosmer tree cult that made them cannibals is better than Saxhleel tree cult? Oh, yeah, I know, bosmer folk are cute so cannibalism is OK. Pathetic reasoning.

Saxhleel are natives to Tamriel, unlike races of Men and Mer. Saxhleel did not invade anyone until their retribution war in 4th Era against Dunmer slavers. Saxhleel do not hunt other races to consume their flesh, nor do they impose their religious beliefs on others. You might not like them but they will prevail long after races of Men and Mer vanish from face of Nirn.

If I am being honest, my biggest problem is that Argonians seem like a random side offshoot to the main Divine history of Nirn. They weren't created by the divines, and honestly seem to lack the same sort of connection to the mythology that the other races have.
It just feels like you could take the Argonians and the Hist and throw them into any other game and they'd fit there just as well.
And then the lore they do have just isn't all that interesting.

I mean I'd love to look more into the lore of the Hist and all, but there really isn't much there apart from them being Magical transdimensional trees with semi godly powers.

Because they were not created by the divines and really have nothing to do with the divines. The Hist is from another kalpa (previous world) entirely that somehow survived to this one. I'm not sure of it's connections to the metaphysical but it obviously has some connection to Sithis. The Hist is really an alien species. Same with the dreugh, who ruled the world in another kalpa, and Molag Bal was their king/deity before he was Molag Bal. But that's off topic. Back to the point, the Hist has nothing to do with the creation of Tamriel or this version of Nirn

ThePrinceOfBargains

Shezzarrine wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Sixty5 wrote: »

Khajiit are fine in my book.

They are a seperate race that has a whole lot of interesting stuff going on, with interactions with the moons and all, as well as likely being created in part by Sheogorath.

The Argonians on the other hand were made to serve the Hist, and that is kinda their whole deal. There are a bunch of battles that they ran away from, and they mostly just hide in Black Marsh. Even their supposed badassery during the Oblivion crisis was really just the Hist seeing what was coming and pumping them full of 'roids, not a push by an organised Argonian army.

Look at the Altmer on the other hand. They turned basically the entirity of Summerset into a giant magical construct, They've fought off the Maromer and the Sload repeatedly throughout their history, and the only time they have every really been defeated was when a Dragonborn marched a giant mech powered by the heart of a dead god up to their shores.

People will argue there and say that "but he didn't beat the argonians with it" and while that is true, you have to realise that the Argonians didn't beat Tiber Septim, he just came to the conclusion that Black Marsh wasn't worth the trouble.

Plus my experience with them over all Elder Scrolls games has been mostly negative.

What a bs post.
Saxhleel first came on their own to help Dunmer and Nords drive off the Akaviri invaders. Then they stayed to fight against breton and altmer scum. Did a lizard bite you irl so you are so biased toward Saxhleel in ESO?
First you claimed they were souless.
Then you claimed they cannot exist without Hist.
Now you want to present them as a bunch of cowards.
Just go to Alessia bridge. Someone will kill you there and end your misery.

Never said they were soulless, just that they got their souls from the hist. Likewise I said they wouldn't exist without the hist. And yes they are pretty cowardly.

Their "great society" was most likely wiped out by the Aylieds in the Merethic Era.
In the first era they were beaten soundly by the first Empire, and retreated deep into Black Marsh along with those that were too slow being made into slaves.
In the second era the only thing of note they did was make a lot of people sick.
The third era saw them do the one slightly cool thing their race ever did. And even then it was only because the Hist forewarned them.
In the fourth era they invaded a Morrowind severely weakened by the eruption of red mountain in order to pay the dunmer back for the years of slavery, but even then they were pretty quickly defeated.

They have a history of losing to pretty much everyone who attacks them, and then running back into Black Marsh.

What can you offer to prove to me that the Argonians are a cool race beyond the fact that they are Lizard People?

Aylieds were destroyed by their former slaves. Now half of you proudly use a former slave races and try to be racist toward a race that still has its own enslavement issues. If that is not bigoted than nothing is.

For example, Bretons, a former slaves to the Mer ancestors, have only one type of their native culture - the savages obsessed with crows and, who would guess, some trees. What we see as Breton kingdoms and "cultured" stuff is what they inherited from their former masters.

On the other hand, Saxhleel had way older culture, did not start to nourish slaver's culture, did not enslave other races and now they are seen savages that are good only to be used as slaves or, as sad pathetic beings here say, crafting materials? Yeah, not bigoted at all.

Why is the Breton tree cult and their numerous Wyresses and Hagravens good, and Hist is seen as something bad? Or maybe Bosmer tree cult that made them cannibals is better than Saxhleel tree cult? Oh, yeah, I know, bosmer folk are cute so cannibalism is OK. Pathetic reasoning.

Saxhleel are natives to Tamriel, unlike races of Men and Mer. Saxhleel did not invade anyone until their retribution war in 4th Era against Dunmer slavers. Saxhleel do not hunt other races to consume their flesh, nor do they impose their religious beliefs on others. You might not like them but they will prevail long after races of Men and Mer vanish from face of Nirn.

If I am being honest, my biggest problem is that Argonians seem like a random side offshoot to the main Divine history of Nirn. They weren't created by the divines, and honestly seem to lack the same sort of connection to the mythology that the other races have.
It just feels like you could take the Argonians and the Hist and throw them into any other game and they'd fit there just as well.
And then the lore they do have just isn't all that interesting.

I mean I'd love to look more into the lore of the Hist and all, but there really isn't much there apart from them being Magical transdimensional trees with semi godly powers.

The Hist is from another kalpa (previous world) entirely that somehow survived to this one.

All the more reason to finish Alduin’s job for him.

Aliyavana

TheMaster wrote: »

This so much, we need a montage of the argonian scum dieing

Hawco10

Argonian is my favorite race, love them. Best tanks and healers in the game bar none !!

Gargath

How sad, she died because she had natural boobs.

Yarlenzey

Loc2262 wrote: »

Do we really need another thread about this crap?

No.

ZOS should start locking them.

Ok.

Demycilian

The rampant racism amongst the inferior races is quite disheartening. Time for the Altmer to roll back this shitshow and return to the Dawn.

coop500

Probably because being racist is edgy and 'cool' for some reason. I have no idea why, but it reminds me why people like playing evil. Because being nice and respectful is 'boring'. That's why Dunmer are so popular too.

Wreuntzylla

Cadbury wrote: »

That's probably the best response GIF ever with respect to being on-point.

DeathHouseInc

OP has culturally appropriated the Argonian and Khajiit races and I find this offensive.

Chilly-McFreeze

Enslaved wrote: »

I can understand hatred toward any race in ESO. But comments about boots and rugs are just sad. I would call those who use such comments a lowlife scumbags, but that would get me banned, and also do not describe them nearly as bad as they are.

Good time for a cooldown. You know you're too deep into a video game if you start calling people names for making fun of in-game things.

Talking "***" from an in character PoV about fictional things (especially if the slave and leather boots part is already part of the ingame content) gives you no insight on the real character of a person. Or are you running rampant in SWTOR forum and calling people scumbacks because the play a sith?

Don't mix reality up with video game stuff.

Enslaved

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

I can understand hatred toward any race in ESO. But comments about boots and rugs are just sad. I would call those who use such comments a lowlife scumbags, but that would get me banned, and also do not describe them nearly as bad as they are.

Good time for a cooldown. You know you're too deep into a video game if you start calling people names for making fun of in-game things.

Talking "***" from an in character PoV about fictional things (especially if the slave and leather boots part is already part of the ingame content) gives you no insight on the real character of a person. Or are you running rampant in SWTOR forum and calling people scumbacks because the play a sith?

Don't mix reality up with video game stuff.

I dont give shaved Molag Bal for SWITOR. Nor do I care if you are racist irl or just in game, you are all the same to me.

Cadbury

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

I can understand hatred toward any race in ESO. But comments about boots and rugs are just sad. I would call those who use such comments a lowlife scumbags, but that would get me banned, and also do not describe them nearly as bad as they are.

mix reality up with video game stuff.

^ sadly, that's an all too common reaction nowadays

Ajaxduo

People getting upset over a fictional universe where racism is more than evident in the games? From more than just one race alone mind you. The forum trolling (if you can even call it that, let’s call it RP) will just continue if people respond to it. Just ignore it and it will stop. If you want to appropriate it and push a SJW agenda calling for bans etc, I don’t even. You are just making it worse for yourselves and more enjoyable for ‘them’. Now if you’ll excuse me...

Stania

Let me see if I get it right: People are very salty just because others say crap about a fictional race, from a videogame, that don't even resemble any IRL race?



And I thought elitists take the game too seriously.

Enslaved

Stania wrote: »

Let me see if I get it right: People are very salty just because others say crap about a fictional race, from a videogame, that don't even resemble any IRL race?



And I thought elitists take the game too seriously.

Joke is on you, since you spent money and time on something you find not worth giving a single carp*

JiKama

Some people like bear skin rugs. I like a Argonian rug to be honest. The scales really scrub the mud off the hard to reach spots on my boots.

Enslaved

TheMaster wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Stania wrote: »

Let me see if I get it right: People are very salty just because others say crap about a fictional race, from a videogame, that don't even resemble any IRL race?



And I thought elitists take the game too seriously.

Joke is on you, since you spent money and time on something you find not worth giving a single carp*

Bro, there’s liking the game and getting invested, and then there’s being a total psychopath, freaking out and starting drama over it because somebody talked bad about the fictional characters. You fall under the latter.

I will not write here what group you fall into, but will dare you to write same bs about Redguards. Let's see how many SECONDS would it take for you to get banned.

Stania

Enslaved wrote: »

Joke is on you, since you spent money and time on something you find not worth giving a single carp*

Just as we spend money and time on watching a TV series or reading a book, and not because of that we have to take it that seriously to the degree of getting angry and call people names, just because they say trash about a fictional character or race.

Chilly-McFreeze

Enslaved wrote: »

TheMaster wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Stania wrote: »

Let me see if I get it right: People are very salty just because others say crap about a fictional race, from a videogame, that don't even resemble any IRL race?



And I thought elitists take the game too seriously.

Joke is on you, since you spent money and time on something you find not worth giving a single carp*

Bro, there’s liking the game and getting invested, and then there’s being a total psychopath, freaking out and starting drama over it because somebody talked bad about the fictional characters. You fall under the latter.

I will not write here what group you fall into, but will dare you to write same bs about Redguards. Let's see how many SECONDS would it take for you to get banned.

It's more likely to get banned for calling people names like you do than for making fun of in game content.

Enslaved wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

I can understand hatred toward any race in ESO. But comments about boots and rugs are just sad. I would call those who use such comments a lowlife scumbags, but that would get me banned, and also do not describe them nearly as bad as they are.

Good time for a cooldown. You know you're too deep into a video game if you start calling people names for making fun of in-game things.

Talking "***" from an in character PoV about fictional things (especially if the slave and leather boots part is already part of the ingame content) gives you no insight on the real character of a person. Or are you running rampant in SWTOR forum and calling people scumbacks because the play a sith?

Don't mix reality up with video game stuff.

I dont give shaved Molag Bal for SWITOR. Nor do I care if you are racist irl or just in game, you are all the same to me.

Already thinking about using this quote as my signature. ^^

ThePrinceOfBargains

Enslaved wrote: »

TheMaster wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

Stania wrote: »

Let me see if I get it right: People are very salty just because others say crap about a fictional race, from a videogame, that don't even resemble any IRL race?



And I thought elitists take the game too seriously.

Joke is on you, since you spent money and time on something you find not worth giving a single carp*

Bro, there’s liking the game and getting invested, and then there’s being a total psychopath, freaking out and starting drama over it because somebody talked bad about the fictional characters. You fall under the latter.

I will not write here what group you fall into, but will dare you to write same bs about Redguards. Let's see how many SECONDS would it take for you to get banned.

Perhaps I would, perhaps not. But if so, it would be because Redguards are actually people.

ZOS_MattL

Hey there,
We have had to remove several comments for being off topic and inflammatory. In the future when making a post make sure it does not single out any user and can be discussed in a constructive manner. If this behavior continues this thread will be closed.
Regards,
Matt

Gandrhulf_Harbard

I have the utmost respect for Argonians and Khajiit.

That is why I have Argonian and Khajiit decorations in my slav... ...erm... ...guest quarters in my Forsaken Stronghold homestead.


All The Best

nimander99

As a Dunmer loyal to House Redoran it is my duty to uphold the Pact... It doesn't change that I view the beast races as animals though...