Should ZOS add an additional free crown crate to the ESO+ Package?

Tai-Chi

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

I have never bought a Crown Crate and I shall never buy one in the future. I do not like the idea of having them forced upon me. If other people want to buy Crown Crates, that is up to them; it is their choice.

Next week I shall be starting my 6th, 180 day, ESO + subscription. As a long-term, continuous subscriber I find the notion of Crown Crate rewards for subscription quite insulting because the end result is that free Crown Crates, as rewards, treat some subscribers more favourably than others.

Is it fair that for my loyalty and support I might only get something I neither want or need, whereas another player, who takes out a one-off, monthly subscription but never subscribes again, gets a legendary reward? I call that a smack-in-the-eye.

Rewards for loyalty and support of the game should be based proportionally and not on a lottery.

SantieClaws

Khajiit feels that something extra is needed.

Possibly an increase in the amount of crowns received would be best - then it up to the traveller to decide how to use them.

The cost of items in the store is now usually so high that the crowns received have been devalued in terms of what you may obtain with them.

This one never wanted the crates in Tamriel. As an honest merchant this one she believes in knowing exactly what you buy before you loosen your purse strings. No one should have to gamble repeatedly for the small chance of getting the thing they wish to purchase.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

Slick_007

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

BlueViolet wrote: »

I would rather have a loyalty rewards program of some form, be it for subscribers, or even people who have been playing for years, subbers or not.

how is not subbing loyalty?

re the crates, pointless gesture. i'll take it if they are handing it out. do i think they should? no. for no other reason than its not required. i very much doubt they'd get a single extra sub from it.

Autumnhart

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

No thanks.

TheMaster wrote: »

They should get rid of this crap entirely.

^ Yes.

esotoon

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

PrayingSeraph wrote: »

1. Actually its a fair substitute to mandatory subscription fees. MMO's arent cheap to make or maintain. While microtransactions often sucked in other games, they aren't bad in ESO. Comparing it to Shadow of Mordor is a false equivalency.

I guess we have different views on what "fair" means. To me a system where you pay money yet have no idea what you are getting in exchange, isn't fair. Nor is a model is that is based on a few, paying for the many. And a model that is designed to take advantage of human being's addictive nature and in some cases, lack of education and failure to understand the maths behind the system (in other words a system that preys on a proportion of the population that is unable to make an otherwise informed buying decision), is to me, not only unfair but morally pretty disgusting. And if you add it as part of a subscriber benefit, I'm not sure how a few subscribers ending up with a nice mount, and the majority ending up with nothing but a few gems, despite having paid the same subscription fee, is in anyway fair.

As for ME:SoW - I wasn't trying to make an equivalency. It's that fact that because some people defend the loot crate system so much, and are so willing to part with their cash this way, or see no problem with things such as adding a loot crate as part of a subscription, that the practice has now become so pernicious that it has even spread to single player games. It's not that ESO's system is as bad as ME:SoW's, it's the fact that the system itself, as a whole, is bad for gaming.

you're getting something you would not have otherwise got with no additional cost. You are not forced to buy any crown crates yourself, and if you do so, you will get items of value or gems.Unlike in real life, you may buy a lottery ticket, but in all likelihood, you will win absolutely nothing.

(Edited as I misread this originally)

To me, getting something I do not want has no more inherent value than getting nothing. If I could resell or trade that item in order to get something I want, as I could with a physical item, then perhaps, but the CC system doesn't allow for this. Yes, providing the item is a duplicate you can get gems, but the gems are not worth the equivalent value. i.e. If you get a duplicate mount in a crown crate, you do not get back enough gems to buy a replacement mount. So no, the Crown Crates are not value for money. If they were they would not use the system in the first place, as the money invested in creating and maintaining the system would far outweigh the cost of just selling the items for a price in the Crown Store.

I don't see how this is a logical reason to say no to a additional crown crate. You would be no means obligated to open the collections menu if they were to give you a crown crate. Also, if you think its hard to find something in the collections menu, you must really despise inventories, bank etc.

It's a weak point and not one that would affect everyone, but for me, it would bug the hell out of me to know that my subscription fee has paid for an item I have already chosen not to buy, and that was now also making it harder to find the things I did choose to buy. Finding the right costume from the 61 I already have is hard enough as it is. And yeah, I do despise the bank/inventory system. . The difference is, there are add-on's that can fix those. There is no possibility for add-ons to fix the collections system, so we are stuck with the mess it is.

In regards to your suggestion, they could do it, but that doesn't change the fact that its unreasonable to want the current subscription system to stay the same for everyone instead of increasing in value for what we pay.

It only increases the value for some though. For others it doesn't. My suggestion was an alternative that would increase the value for all.

AFrostWolf

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

The items available in crown crates have no effect on the game, and the odds are so bad that It's almost not worth it. However, Anything to increase the value of the sub.

Slick_007

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

esotoon wrote: »

I guess we have different views on what "fair" means. To me a system where you pay money yet have no idea what you are getting in exchange, isn't fair. Nor is a model is that is based on a few, paying for the many. And a model that is designed to take advantage of human being's addictive nature and in some cases, lack of education and failure to understand the maths behind the system (in other words a system that preys on a proportion of the population that is unable to make an otherwise informed buying decision), is to me, not only unfair but morally pretty disgusting. And if you add it as part of a subscriber benefit, I'm not sure how a few subscribers ending up with a nice mount, and the majority ending up with nothing but a few gems, despite having paid the same subscription fee, is in anyway fair.

Its a random item. its absolutely fair in that all players have the exact same chance to get the same items. You mentioned people failing to understand the maths....you havent even looked at the maths. You skipped right over that to make a point that the maths makes incorrect. not invalid, i do see where you are coming from. but incorrect because the maths says you are.

It's a weak point and not one that would affect everyone, but for me, it would bug the hell out of me to know that my subscription fee has paid for an item I have already chosen not to buy, and that was now also making it harder to find the things I did choose to buy. Finding the right costume from the 61 I already have is hard enough as it is. And yeah, I do despise the bank/inventory system. . The difference is, there are add-on's that can fix those. There is no possibility for add-ons to fix the collections system, so we are stuck with the mess it is.

You would be offended by having an extra costume is what you are saying here? Seriously? This from the person admitting they have 61 already. how often do you even look at these or change costume?

im against adding crates too, but not for any reasons remotely close to yours.

Khenarthi

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

I would prefer that something actually useful is added to ESO+.

As a subscriber who got Morrowind on preorder, I got a crate full of junk. I do not intend on gambling, so I deleted the junk (no point in getting half a dozen gems, cant get anything with that. More "free" crates will fuel my junk pile... unless there's a large enough number of them coming to actually get me enough gems to choose a relevant reward. But I doubt it. I also don't want to clog my collections tab with ugly unwanted nixhounds, dogs, and sparkly eyelashes.

The current incentive to sub for me is the craft bag, increased bank space, and DLC access. For perspective, I also have a second account with no sub, which is completely playable. Subbing is in no way required to enjoy the game, the incentives are good but marginal.

randomkeyhits

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

To me the sub should not include gambling in any form.

Pay your sub, receive your services and benefits, enjoy while the sub is active.

The crates, being gambling, should always be an opt in thing. If you want them, buy them, but it is always a choice to be made.

I'm not against crown crates myself in principle but purchasing should be an informed decision. Does what I want from the crates equal or exceed their cost, if the answer is yes, I'll buy, if no I won't and that decision is based on the crown gem conversion rates always.

That does mean @STEVIL 's idea of crown gems does appeal to me.

esotoon

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

Slick_007 wrote: »

Its a random item. its absolutely fair in that all players have the exact same chance to get the same items.

You mentioned people failing to understand the maths....you havent even looked at the maths. You skipped right over that to make a point that the maths makes incorrect. not invalid, i do see where you are coming from. but incorrect because the maths says you are.

I didn't skip over the maths, I just assumed when talking about the added value to subscribers, we would take into account the chances of actually getting something that has value. Because if you want to look at the strict maths, then getting a Crown Crate in ESO that gives an "x" amount chance of getting "y" item, in and of itself, has zero value, until it is actually opened.

You would be offended by having an extra costume is what you are saying here? Seriously? This from the person admitting they have 61 already. how often do you even look at these or change costume?

Frequently. I have 14 characters. Each of those characters I use between 4-8 costumes on depending what I'm doing/feeling like/who I'm playing with.

Which brings up another point, to someone like me who has supported the game through multiple Crown Store purchases, the value of a free Crown crate is even more diminished, because the chances of getting an item which isn't a duplicate is even smaller. So all I would end up would be gems, which as already discussed, do not have the same value as the item they replace.

reiverx

I'm sure we'd all like a little bit extra from our subs but I'd rather have a few more crowns.

RaddlemanNumber7

I read the title of the thread as "Should ZOS add an addiction free crown crate to the ESO+ Package?"

I wondered how they were going to manage that.

Thrymbauld

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

I live twenty miles from a casino, if I wanted to gamble(I don't) I'd go try to win the fifteen dollars for my subscription back.

But I don't want to gamble, especially in this game, so I subscribe, know exactly what I paid for, and I'm fine with that. I'd rather have no "loyalty reward" at all than have crown crates for it, even setting the precedent that this is ok is the wrong direction to go.

TaintedKurse

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

SantieClaws wrote: »

Khajiit feels that something extra is needed.

Possibly an increase in the amount of crowns received would be best - then it up to the traveller to decide how to use them.

The cost of items in the store is now usually so high that the crowns received have been devalued in terms of what you may obtain with them.

This one never wanted the crates in Tamriel. As an honest merchant this one she believes in knowing exactly what you buy before you loosen your purse strings. No one should have to gamble repeatedly for the small chance of getting the thing they wish to purchase.

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

I would also like to see an increase in the amount crowns received however, I have a feeling ZOS wont do that because of how it might effect the value of the crown.

Also, I never wanted crown crates either. In fact I've never even purchased one. Despite this ZOS is making a ton off of crown crates and I don't expect them to be leaving anytime soon. So knowing this I still would like a shot at some of the items in it. So considering that logic, a free crown crate sounds like a good way to give subscribers a chance at those rare cosmetic items.

On top of that, there are so many items in the boxes that just aren't in the store. If we were getting a free box instead of an increase in crowns we still have a chance at that unique loot. Without having to purchase crates. Most importantly we would be able to save gems to buy what you actually want with something your already paying for.

TaintedKurse

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

Autumnhart wrote: »

No thanks.

TheMaster wrote: »

They should get rid of this crap entirely.

^ Yes.

Agreed but, lets be real that's not happening anytime soon with the amount of money ZOS is making on them.

So considering they exist and are going to continue existing lets give the players who aren't going to buy them a small opportunity so more people can enjoy the content.

DeadlyRecluse

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

Do I want free stuff? Sure.

As far as I'm concerned, subbing is essentially mandatory. I play the game 10+ hours a week, so I'm getting a fabulous entertainment value, and I'd bet my inventory management without craft bag would take a good bit more than an hour a month. So I don't particularly *want* a free crate, but I wouldn't complain.

TaintedKurse

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

STEVIL wrote: »

voted no because of lack of an "other" option which is akin to saying "obviously nobody else can have better ideas."

i would rather see some number of the crown gems things so that instead of lotto you get the alt currency of the crown store or at least an option to get crowns or gems (in some ratio) as your sub reward. Since they now have two currencies and some items are not really available from just crowns, it seems to me reasonable to offer up both currencies as optional reawrds.

I was going to put in an other option but, I thought we would get too off topic.

I would definitely approve of us receiving some gems on top of crowns if we wanted to bypass the crates entirely. I just want some sort of passive gem system to make the trade in system actually plausible to use. I just figured with a free crate you have a chance at getting one of those items directly or getting more gems then you would on a set value system. Also, I have a feeling getting a free costume or mount every now and then with your sub would put a smile on peoples face. Its something I personally would enjoy. However, i'm in favor of both ideas.

TaintedKurse

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

BlueViolet wrote: »

I would rather have a loyalty rewards program of some form, be it for subscribers, or even people who have been playing for years, subbers or not.

Ultimately I would love to see the ESO+ reward program return.

However, I do think this would help mitigate its disappearance in the mean time.

TaintedKurse

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

phermitgb wrote: »

I found your vote to be limited, as reading it for the first time it occurred to me that there should be at least a few more options for responding...

but, regarding your question - sure, why not. I sub. I have since release...I certainly have no objection to getting free crown crates. I've enjoyed the freebies that they gave away as promos.

however, I still feel the crown crates are an insulting and stupid way to deliver otherwise interesting game items. I have never paid money for a crown crate, and I never will...there are a ton of costumes I'd like, mounts and pets and things that look interesting - I pay for a sub, and this crown crate random crap is the biggest load of *** I can think of...I find them personally insulting, and won't pay a cent for them NOT EVEN WITH MY ACCUMULATED *FREE* CROWNS FROM SUBBING

I only ever buy items from the crown store that AREN'T random - I pay money, I get what I want that the store offers.

I also find all this LIMITED TIME ONLY DISNEY VAULT *** to be...well...***. but that's another complaint

so sure, send me free crates if you want - I won't say no - still won't get me to buy them.

If I made the vote to open we would just end up talking about why crown crates should be removed. I didn't want to get to off topic.

Personally I've never purchased any either. However, this would be a good way to give people like you and me a shot at those items. ZOS is making a ton of money off them and were 3 generations of crates in. So, considering that, I doubt there going anywhere. Might as well give the players who are against them a chance to actually use the content there working on.

Tornaad

What I would like to see is several different levels of ESO Plus. The most basic simply giving you access to the craft bag and nothing else.
If they priced it right I would be a subscriber for life.

Megabear

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

Adding Crown Crates would be a nice touch. I've played another MMO with buy to play model with subscription bonus that adds similar ingame currency only boxes with random items contained within. It was nice.

BlueViolet

Slick_007 wrote: »

BlueViolet wrote: »

I would rather have a loyalty rewards program of some form, be it for subscribers, or even people who have been playing for years, subbers or not.

how is not subbing loyalty?

re the crates, pointless gesture. i'll take it if they are handing it out. do i think they should? no. for no other reason than its not required. i very much doubt they'd get a single extra sub from it.

Because there are people who have not subbed, no longer sub, but have played for a long time, and probably spent quite a lot on crowns to shop in the store. I'm quite sure there are people who have played since the game went B2P, which was in early 2015 I believe.

Either way, they have spent quite a bit of either time and money, or both, supporting the game. Why should they not be acknowledged as loyal supporters?

Rainraven

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

If I want a crown crate, I know where they are. I don't want a crown crate.

I'm ok with the value I'm getting for subscription. They could boost the crowns a bit now that so many things are more crown-expensive.

MasterSpatula

Other: ZOS should admit they're ashamed of themselves for ever putting Crown Crates into the game and promise never to gate any items behind a gambling system again. They should rededicate themselves to integrity and at least one staff member should be shown the door.

mesmerizedish

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

I voted yes, because... why not? I don't super care though.

Morgul667

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

Would feel nice, but the danger with this is for people who cant stop gambling once they start.

ZOS could actually make more money for but those people, not so nice

AzraelKrieg

ZOS should continue just offering free crown crates as promotional items but, should do it more regularly

As much as I'd like the ESO+ membership to come with some extra goodies, the crown crate is not one I'd want for a few reasons, the main concern is for those players that do the longer subscription periods. If you do month to month getting a crate every month is no problem. But if you do 3 months or 6 months then you'll end up with all your crates at the start of the renewal similar to crowns. And you may not want to open them straight away because you don't want anything from that season or you already have what you want. But unopened crates as far as we can tell don't change when the season changes so a person with a longer sub could end up with 3 or 6 crates from a season they don't like that won't give them the rewards for the next season if they want something from it.

JKorr

BlueViolet wrote: »

Slick_007 wrote: »

BlueViolet wrote: »

I would rather have a loyalty rewards program of some form, be it for subscribers, or even people who have been playing for years, subbers or not.

how is not subbing loyalty?

re the crates, pointless gesture. i'll take it if they are handing it out. do i think they should? no. for no other reason than its not required. i very much doubt they'd get a single extra sub from it.

Because there are people who have not subbed, no longer sub, but have played for a long time, and probably spent quite a lot on crowns to shop in the store. I'm quite sure there are people who have played since the game went B2P, which was in early 2015 I believe.

Either way, they have spent quite a bit of either time and money, or both, supporting the game. Why should they not be acknowledged as loyal supporters?

The people who subbed for a long time from the beginning actually do have an item that acknowledges they were loyal supporters. I have one; the striped senche/tiger mount. I also have the loyalty pets they handed out that I'll never use.

As long as they kept the same requirement [for the tiger it was 300 days subbed, iirc] I would have no problem with them restarting the loyalty reward program. But not if the reward has anything to do with the rngesus boxes.

Mettaricana

ZOS should add a single crown crate to the monthly rewards for ESO+ Subscribers

Maybe 1 crate a week while subbed 4 crates doesnt break the game nor does it p2w its just 1 extra shot at cool mount or garbage

Jayne_Doe

ZOS should not offer a free crown crate to ESO+ Subscribers in any form

I haven't read any of the responses, but I'm against this as one who hates the scam crates. This would NOT incentivize me to keep subbing or to sub if I weren't already. And I would guess it wouldn't be an incentive for anyone else who hates these crates. It would seem to me that the only people it would entice to sub are those who are already spending a small fortune on the gamble boxes. It would be unlikely to entice anyone who isn't already participating in the gambling system to sub.

Bottom line to me is, that those who suggest this are addicted to the crates and want other options for obtaining more chances at getting what they want, and then justifying it by arguing that it would be an incentive for subs and would increase crate sales. But, it isn't really a benefit to anyone who isn't trying to scrape together enough gems or hoping for that extra rare mount to finally drop for them. My free crate could have crap potions in it every month, and that would definitely NOT be a benefit to me.

Also, Crowns are received on the day your sub renews, so what happens when new crates are introduced? Some people will get the previous season as their free crate, and then others will get the new season, depending on when their sub renews? For those on PC with 6-month subs, when do they get their monthly crate? At the beginning of the month? You'll end up with people complaining that they got the old season when they wanted to start on the new one, or vice versa - just wanted one more free old season crate to have one last chance at X or to get enough gems to purchase X before it's gone.

I know this post is a little snarky, but I'm getting tired of this suggestion as some great ESO+ perk and that it's a good idea as it'll increase subs and crate sales. A better idea would be to ask for an increase in the Crowns allotment to 2,000 - that'll give you an extra 400 for your "free" crate, and the rest of us who don't want to participate in the gambling system an actual perk that they would use by spending it in the Crown Store.

EDIT: typo