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What was the point Zenimax?
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Delerium✭✭Very quickly realizing that all this company does is take whatever skills/signs/gear is being used and just nerfs it. No real improvements. Even PVE is going to suck eventually.Edited by Delerium on August 14, 2017 9:53PM11 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ConnorWoods wrote: »ConnorWoods wrote: »ConnorWoods wrote: »So I downloaded the PTS for Horns of The Reach as soon as it came out and enthusiastic as ever I set out to work out what would be best for my character... you know how the PTS is supposed to work.
I didn't bother to read beyond that total lack of comprehension as to how the PTS is supposed to work.
The PTS is for testing and providing feedback , not for getting a headstart on the other players on Live.
Is the PTS not free and open to all who have a PC?
Don't start with this cry baby "you used the PTS" argument again after the Morrowind Fiasco, the changes are there for me to make a decision on what I want to run next patch.
Especially when arguably the biggest changes this patch by a large margin were the gameplay changes.
I find it ironic in the light of your original post that you should accuse me of being a "cry baby". I was just pointing out that the purpose of the Public Test Server is to test the changes and provide feedback on them, not to gain a headstart from them when they come to Live (and complain when the PTS changes don't all make it to Live as a result of the feedback others gave on them and the data ZOS derived from the testing).
If you just want to use the PTS to plan your future build/tactics and don't bother to read the bit about the changes on the PTS not necessarily indicating what will go Live, don't complain when you find you wasted your time because late changes were indeed made when the update went Live.
It seems to me like you're attempting to defend ZoS, who have a notorious record of late of changing their minds and not thinking things through, you don't in the slightest think it's a bit of a joke and a huge swing to increase crit passives by 55% and then decide 6 weeks later that they don't like it? They leave little to no justification on any of these changes. What was with the thief being double nerfed?, as well as the long list of things that are getting buffed, nerfed, buffed, changed, hell just look at viper and the fiasco of pvp.
As for the whole "PTS can change any time" argument, it's true but they've never done anything this drastic in the last weeks before. This is a complete and total U-turn of everything they've done so far and looks to me like they have no clue what they're doing.
I haven't said anything that was attempting to defend ZOS, I merely pointed out twice that you have a false understanding of the purpose of the PTS. Indeed, I don't even know the detail of the point you're making about the changes because as I said earlier I stopped reading your original post as soon as I realised you were totally failing to comprehend the purpose of the PTS.4 -
ConnorWoods✭✭✭ConnorWoods wrote: »ConnorWoods wrote: »ConnorWoods wrote: »So I downloaded the PTS for Horns of The Reach as soon as it came out and enthusiastic as ever I set out to work out what would be best for my character... you know how the PTS is supposed to work.
I didn't bother to read beyond that total lack of comprehension as to how the PTS is supposed to work.
The PTS is for testing and providing feedback , not for getting a headstart on the other players on Live.
Is the PTS not free and open to all who have a PC?
Don't start with this cry baby "you used the PTS" argument again after the Morrowind Fiasco, the changes are there for me to make a decision on what I want to run next patch.
Especially when arguably the biggest changes this patch by a large margin were the gameplay changes.
I find it ironic in the light of your original post that you should accuse me of being a "cry baby". I was just pointing out that the purpose of the Public Test Server is to test the changes and provide feedback on them, not to gain a headstart from them when they come to Live (and complain when the PTS changes don't all make it to Live as a result of the feedback others gave on them and the data ZOS derived from the testing).
If you just want to use the PTS to plan your future build/tactics and don't bother to read the bit about the changes on the PTS not necessarily indicating what will go Live, don't complain when you find you wasted your time because late changes were indeed made when the update went Live.
It seems to me like you're attempting to defend ZoS, who have a notorious record of late of changing their minds and not thinking things through, you don't in the slightest think it's a bit of a joke and a huge swing to increase crit passives by 55% and then decide 6 weeks later that they don't like it? They leave little to no justification on any of these changes. What was with the thief being double nerfed?, as well as the long list of things that are getting buffed, nerfed, buffed, changed, hell just look at viper and the fiasco of pvp.
As for the whole "PTS can change any time" argument, it's true but they've never done anything this drastic in the last weeks before. This is a complete and total U-turn of everything they've done so far and looks to me like they have no clue what they're doing.
I haven't said anything that was attempting to defend ZOS, I merely pointed out twice that you have a false understanding of the purpose of the PTS. Indeed, I don't even know the detail of the point you're making about the changes because as I said earlier I stopped reading your original post as soon as I realised you were totally failing to comprehend the purpose of the PTS.
And why would I take anyone seriously if they're so entitled that they won't read what I've put?
You're very persistent for someone who didn't read what I put you know that
Washed up player0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Can someone please link me or list the last minute changes? I can't find anything0 -
ConnorWoods✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Can someone please link me or list the last minute changes? I can't find anything
it's in the patch notes, you'll have to have been paying attention to previous notes to get what they've changed last minute because Leviathan being dropped from 12.5 to 9% for example is still technically a buff on what it was on liveWashed up player1 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't believe all the theory-crafting was completed to the point that anyone, whether it's the OP, Alcast, me, anyone, can definitely proclaim what was BiS, whether or not the mundas's were equal, or anything.
Also, the PTS process is not for anyone was prep and perfect their characters so they can just jump in on Live. All those people who were farming and pawning off Mother Sorrow's gear in Deshaan last night; that wasted time is 1000% percent on them and not on ZoS.
Anyone who has played this game for any lengths of time should 100% know not to buy, invest, make any gear whatsoever, regardless of what tests indicate on the PTS, until the actual patch drops on Live.
As it is, so many times we as PTS testers are flat out wrong - remember how mag sorcs were "ruined" after the Thieve's Guild lol. All those sorcs who quit they game convinced ZoS overnerfed their class were 1000% wrong and just goes to show that now matter how much you think you got the PTS figured out, you don't know.
It may be possible that ZoS overnerfed crit and crit damage, but you aren't even on Live and yet it is being proclaimed as if it's a fact. That's ridiculous. It takes weeks, sometimes months before theory-crafters unravel the extent of these changes. It may also be possible that ZoS was right that crit was too strong (perhaps for magicka builds) and, using the PTS as it was designed, adjusted what would have been an overperforming mechanic.
If it is decisively shown that crit is too weak and things were over-nerfed that can always be adjusted.Edited by Joy_Division on August 14, 2017 10:47PMMake Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.7 -
STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Very quickly realizing that all this company does is take whatever skills/signs/gear is being used and just nerfs it. No real improvements. Even PVE is going to suck eventually.
uhhh... and to reach this conclusion you drew on the fact that a LOT of sets improved - 2-3-4pc - and that even sorrow iirc is now stronger than it was on live yesterday - just not as good as the overdone values tested?
Impressive logical jump there!
Proudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
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"The good way I used to get good kills *with good skill* was good but the way others kill me now is bad."1 -
ConnorWoods✭✭✭Joy_Division wrote: »I don't believe all the theory-crafting was completed to the point that anyone, whether it's the OP, Alcast, me, anyone, can definitely proclaim what was BiS, whether or not the mundas's were equal, or anything.
Also, the PTS process is not for anyone was prep and perfect their characters so they can just jump in on Live. All those people who were farming and pawning off Mother Sorrow's gear in Deshaan last night; that wasted time is 1000% percent on them and not on ZoS.
Anyone who has played this game for any lengths of time should 100% know not to buy, invest, make any gear whatsoever, regardless of what tests indicate on the PTS, until the actual patch drops on Live.
As it is, so many times we as PTS testers are flat out wrong - remember how mag sorcs were "ruined" after the Thieve's Guild lol. All those sorcs who quit they game convinced ZoS overnerfed their class were 1000% wrong and just goes to show that now matter how much you think you got the PTS figured out, you don't know.
It may be possible that ZoS overnerfed crit and crit damage, but you aren't even on Live and yet it is being proclaimed as if it's a fact. That's ridiculous. It takes weeks, sometimes months before theory-crafters unravel the extent of these changes. It may also be possible that ZoS was right that crit was too strong (perhaps for magicka builds) and, using the PTS as it was designed, adjusted what would have been an overperforming mechanic.
If it is decisively shown that crit is too weak and things were over-nerfed that can always be adjusted.
I've been on live since 4pm if you care to actually read the whole post before ranting about changes I didn't even mention you [snip]. I agree everyone who bought up all this mothers sorrow pieces deserved it. I waited myself actually to gold and make the sets I deemed to be BiS for me on my class.
Please re read it all and find my 2 arguments and complaints were;
1.) The timing of these nerfs
2.) Mundus stone changes being unnecessary
you just contribute to the complete mess and flood of comments of people not reading what I'm putting
[Edited for inappropriate language]Edited by ZOS_Mika on August 15, 2017 2:42PMWashed up player0 -
twev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ConnorWoods wrote: »The changes aren't whats making me mad, the timing is. I spent so much time perfecting my characters as did everyone and now it's thrown up in the air. Not even a reason why in the patch notes, just a giant "who cares, we know better"
PTS doesn't mean you test YOUR stuff so YOU can get the jump on everyone ELSE.
PTS means you test code and gameplay, for bugs and issues and broken stuff, and so that the devs can see how stuff works in usage compared to how they thought it MIGHT work in usage.
If you're thinking that it's your own personal server so you can be king of the hill before anyone else gets the stuff - you gotz the wrong attitude, and I hope you can see your way to getting it adjusted.....The problem with society these days is that no one drinks from the skulls of their enemies anymore.3 -
ConnorWoods✭✭✭ConnorWoods wrote: »The changes aren't whats making me mad, the timing is. I spent so much time perfecting my characters as did everyone and now it's thrown up in the air. Not even a reason why in the patch notes, just a giant "who cares, we know better"
PTS doesn't mean you test YOUR stuff so YOU can get the jump on everyone ELSE.
PTS means you test code and gameplay, for bugs and issues and broken stuff, and so that the devs can see how stuff works in usage compared to how they thought it MIGHT work in usage.
If you're thinking that it's your own personal server so you can be king of the hill before anyone else gets the stuff - you gotz the wrong attitude, and I hope you can see your way to getting it adjusted.....
I'm using the PTS to test new gear sets and changes to my character, if they didn't want you to do it they wouldn't give you unlimited crafting mats, coffers full of training dummys and access to the gameplay changes as well.
You are #1087 by now probably that has decided you wanted to post a negative comment before you even read my post.Washed up player0 -
twev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ConnorWoods wrote: »ConnorWoods wrote: »The changes aren't whats making me mad, the timing is. I spent so much time perfecting my characters as did everyone and now it's thrown up in the air. Not even a reason why in the patch notes, just a giant "who cares, we know better"
PTS doesn't mean you test YOUR stuff so YOU can get the jump on everyone ELSE.
PTS means you test code and gameplay, for bugs and issues and broken stuff, and so that the devs can see how stuff works in usage compared to how they thought it MIGHT work in usage.
If you're thinking that it's your own personal server so you can be king of the hill before anyone else gets the stuff - you gotz the wrong attitude, and I hope you can see your way to getting it adjusted.....
I'm using the PTS to test new gear sets and changes to my character, if they didn't want you to do it they wouldn't give you unlimited crafting mats, coffers full of training dummys and access to the gameplay changes as well.
You are #1087 by now probably that has decided you wanted to post a negative comment before you even read my post.
No, AFTER I read your post.
They give you unlimited mats so you can test LOTS of stuff without running out.
NOT so you can make the stuff for your own personal weapons development system.
Please, TRY to think of PTS as something used to enhance the game play, and not as something to enhance ConnorWoods.The problem with society these days is that no one drinks from the skulls of their enemies anymore.2 -
twev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Live is the final test for any individual PTS run.
They then use this live version as the initial basis for the changes in the PTS of the next build.The problem with society these days is that no one drinks from the skulls of their enemies anymore.0 -
twev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭For me the point is, that zos has a great player base. People like the op who spend hours of their time in doing work for zos which is not appreciated by zos but it SHOULD BE. Hands down, what could be better for them, other than fanboys who spend their precious time to discover their mistakes.?
PTS is clearly misunderstood by many, and not clearly understood or explained by the Powers That Be at Zeni.
As such, it is misused by some, and not taken seriously by a few others as a useful tool in the development of any game that hopes to remain viable.
It used to be that unpaid beta-testers of software builds would get tossed out of a test if they weren't among the first in a (some number of reporters) pool and didn't produce proof and report a minimum number of unique bugs in any given testing session.
PTS users ought have to do a minimum amount of PTS usage and reporting to remain as 'Tier One PTS Users' rather than just 'Users who dabble/play on the PTS'.
Tier One PTS users ought get (Some game perk, such as) a unique glowing dye for weapons to show their valuable participation in game development, that works until the next PTS, when game perks are rescinded, and new ones given.
PTS users ought to have the expected role of being a valued PTS user explained to them before hand, and the fact that casual PTS users are also valued as players testing the system and stability of the new stuff.
PTS users ought to have the fact that their input and builds are used to adjust balance downward if their builds are deemed Over Powered, and not expect such stuff to make it into Live.
No matter how cool they think their shiny new stuff is.
Just my thoughts, scoff or agree as you see fit.
But recruiting PTS users who are in it for the betterment of the game is a priority.
The problem with society these days is that no one drinks from the skulls of their enemies anymore.5 -
itscompton✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Bugs make it into the PC live version because the PTS is primarily used for people's own self advancement (like the entitled OP) rather than its intended purpose.
On behalf of all console players I would like to thank those who actually test for bugs before they make it to PC live...and another thanks to those who find bugs before they make it to console.
Exactly, if you didn't find those bugs for them now they wouldn't be able to put in patches to fix them either A) six months from now B)two years from now or C) working on it but no ETA
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Grymmoire✭✭✭✭They took the work that Alcast and Gilliamtherogue did on the PTS seriously. They saw that the bonus to Crit was creating an environment where that was BiS, particularly pairing high crit chance sets with Shadow, and so decided to decrease the impact of those things. The set/mundus/trait bonuses were already incredibly close and now are likely even closer. It really looks like ZOS has taken the min/maxer crowd very seriously this patch. Min/maxers will always try to exploit whatever flaws in a system allow one build to overtake others. So the devs' job with balance is largely plugging holes the min/maxers would try to go through.
If the developers had taken the work done by the all testers, including Alcast and Gilliam, then the last minute changes would have been unnecessary; the balance had become close and diversity was closer to being achievable, if that is truly ZOS's goal. Now it is further from the goal, imho.
The problem lies with these constant and many, untested changes which affect intertwined components creating unintended consequences. This has become a pattern in supposed "balance" changes by ZOS. They cannot just seem to incrementally change one variable at a time and assess the effect, but instead change many, some dramatically, without seemingly knowledge of the ultimate outcome. This is chaos balancing.
All this leads to is a sense that the developers are either incompetent or just plain do not care; either scenario, leads to player frustration and anger.
Sorry, but one might as well let chimps toss darts at a wall with various game elements attached and implement changes based on what is hit. <Well, not so dramatic of course, but you get the gist.>
*Bold and italics in quoted part for emphasis.*
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Kalante✭✭✭✭✭
✭OC_Justice wrote: »All I read was, "they didn't do what I wanted."
Are you guys on Zenimax payroll?
EDIT:
I am also hearing, "I played the game for hours and now I gotta play some more." too funny
and all i see in your post is "i have no idea what is going on but ill try to get into the conversation"2 -
mb10✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭lmao Im so happy I never do any PTS
Stop wasting your time and money on these people. You never have and never will get anything in return
I NEVER let ZOS the chance to get one on me.
I havent even bought Morrowind yet lmao Im waiting until they reach desperate stage which they always do and offer it for like $/£ 5
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MehrunesFlagon✭✭✭✭✭
✭MehrunesFlagon wrote: »ConnorWoods wrote: »... I'm pretty entitled...
You said it, not me
You are free to get upset, am only attempting to 'stop' you as it is unproductive for you to do so
have already explained how to show the stone is underperforming -- if it is not coming up to measure in any scenario it is, in itself, not good enough
My personal desires regarding wanting to see other, non-combat, bonuses on Mundus
similar to the small non-combat passive buffs Racials got
is about promoting diversity of play, and thus diversity of builds
am having difficulty seeing the genuine build diversity in simply changing a Mundus to alter how much damage is done
fully respect that it is upsetting to you individually
Non combat is how we got terrible traits like training and prosperous.Everything should be combat related.
Training is frequently used in the leveling of alts or skill lines,
and the benefit only exists relative to combat (ie: from kills) rather than quests or lockpicking
Prosperous has been removed and replaced with regen tri-stat
time will tell if Invigorating becomes highly desired, or largely ignored
Your first sentence is not really in accord with your second sentence,
could you more clearly elucidate the point you are trying to make
and, perhaps, tie it to something relevant to my comment?
Such as the Racial passives that went from only buffing exp in one skill line
to additionally having a small flavour passive
Am not saying to remove the Crit passive from Thief,
but that adding an additional benefit can encourage it's use for players more generally
beyond picking and choosing between which stone makes number measurements slightly larger
I've had this idea for those traits for a while to replace their respective values with something such as a scroll you could read.I honestly thinking this would be better than cluttering up armor traits.I just hold that armor traits should be purely combat related, and that those benefits from the non combat related trait could be transferred to an additional medium.0 -
NiclasFridholm✭✭✭✭Ty Connor for all your testing in PTS. Agree with you on the subject that good balance was incoming. Such a shame they decided to go this route...Tobias Funke - Magplar since forever1 -
bebynnag✭✭✭✭✭
✭ConnorWoods wrote: »puffytheslayer wrote: »ConnorWoods wrote: »
So I downloaded the PTS for Horns of The Reach as soon as it came out and enthusiastic as ever I set out to work out what would be best for my character... you know how the PTS is supposed to work. I have been posting videos on my channel frequently to offer feedback.
really?
i thought PTS was about checking new content/gear for bugs
checking old content/gear that have been changed for bugs
checking to make sure that new gear works as intended when paired with old gear (and vice versa)
never realised it was so PTS players could get hits on their youtube channels!
Evidently we were there to test the impact of the new stones and traits otherwise how would they have known to change anything in the first place? The PTS was for testing changes, these include gameplay as well as bugs, please gtfo with that stupid argument being churned out time and time again
im sorry i dont understand your reply
i also suspect you failed to realise my post was a joke - taking the *** out of you for even mentioning that you posted videos!Edited by bebynnag on August 15, 2017 8:37AM1 -
LadyDestiny✭✭✭✭✭ConnorWoods wrote: »I'll start with a question then give you some personal feedback. What was the point of the 6 week PTS period when you decide that you don't like something on patch day and dish out nerfs? without any prior warning?
So I downloaded the PTS for Horns of The Reach as soon as it came out and enthusiastic as ever I set out to work out what would be best for my character... you know how the PTS is supposed to work. I have been posting videos on my channel frequently to offer feedback on what I think are good changes to the stones and traits as well as offering insight into this on your own public forums. I was compliant in showing how broken Torug's Pact was and called for it's nerf with everyone else because it was needed.
What isn't needed however is un called for changes on the day of the patch throwing everything I worked for in the trash can.
I just wanna make it crystal clear however that in your efforts to balance the stones on the final patch day you've actually just removed the diversity altogether when nerfing the shadow and thief stones as now the warrior is now going to over perform over the other 2 by a noticeable margin.
I liked having the option to choose my stone on different stamina variants, if you did the maths the Thief was BiS for Stam DKs and Stam Sorcs and Shadow was best for Nightblades and Templars, Warrior was great for PvP and now it's all wrecked, you're gonna see a meta of Warrior users.
The nerfs aren't even the worst bit, I can handle changes, but all those hours I've pumped in have been completely wasted, and you've yet again demonstrated how incompetent and out of touch you really are with your fan base.
Next time I'm just gonna go ahead and refrain from using the PTS as who knows? Wrobel is gonna decide what I have made is too powerful and strike forth his nerf hammer.
Stop with the constant mind changing on every topic you seem to address because you're hurting the game we all so very much love to play.
I agree. Just glad I did not waste time or resources to get sets ready for this update. I have played since pc beta but getting kind of worn out. Make no doubt I will still play as I have too much time and money invested in this game. That being said, Destiny 2 comes out in about three weeks. Looking forward to a change of pace and a break for a bit.0 -
Yolokin_Swagonborn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The nerfs will continue until the disgusting champion system is completely removed from the game. I've said this for over a year now.0 -
Asardes✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »The nerfs will continue until the disgusting champion system is completely removed from the game. I've said this for over a year now.
If they ever do it I hope they'll leave the content as it is now, and simply remove player stats, protection and damage buffs Edited by Asardes on August 15, 2017 9:52AMBeta tester since February 2014, played ESO-TU October 2015 - August 2022, currently on an extended break
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ConnorWoods✭✭✭Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »The nerfs will continue until the disgusting champion system is completely removed from the game. I've said this for over a year now.
Whilst I think the champion point system is broken I don't think it shall be removed, simply because at this point in the product life cycle of ESO, whatever they put in will probably be worse.
Washed up player0 -
Maryal✭✭✭✭✭
✭HoR (pts) was supposed to center around balance ... and it did a decent job of that during pts (for the most part anyway, nothing is perfect). HoR (pts version) was a gigantic balancing act and the game seemed in a fairly good place, and we had counters to almost everything.
But, there was this outcry on pts ... an unrelenting outcry to nerf the oblivion damage glyph. But ... was it possible to just nerf the glyph and leave everything else the way it was (on pts)?
---> If you answered "yes" you would be wrong.
As difficult as this will be for a lot of folks to hear, the oblivion damage glyph couldn't get nerfed in isolation ... it was part of the overall balancing act ... it was there to help maintain the equilibrium.
Think about it ... the amount of damage caused by the glyph was mediocre at best AND it couldn't crit. This glyph really only hurt very low-health builds ... the lower your health, the more butt-hurt you would get.
If you compare the pts version to what we got on live, what else got nerfed? Yep, crit chance (Thief) and crit damage (Shadow) and the precise weapon trait. Anyone making the connection yet? Let me put it this way:
What sort of damage can become totally insane with high crit chance / high crit damage? You know, the kind of damage that if it hits you, you're probably gonna die real fast. You know, the kind of damage that can trigger status effects, and those status effects can trigger increased damage (via CP), etc.,
Counters or balancing won't always be about dodging, or zoom zooming away, or going invisible. Counters or balance can also include going through shields (shield stackers) (oblivion damage) as well as damage strong enough to exceed shield protection if wearing a shield, and pretty much instant death if no shield .
Yea, so, in the end, we got what was promised, just not the way we thought we were going to get it.
moral of the story: be careful what you wish for, because you just might get it.Edited by Maryal on August 15, 2017 11:24AM0 -
Flynch✭✭✭✭Isn't it a good thing that people can go on the PTS and test out new overpowered builds, so that they can be tuned down prior to going live? The more the merrier in my opinion. To get a balanced game, you need to see what builds become viable, and how to bring them/others into sync.
It strikes me as very strange that fairly significant changes are put through on live without at least a couple of days testing on the PTS to 'seal the deal', if you like.
It feels more like:
Hey guys, could you all sit down and tell me which of these fruits you prefer. The orange, banana or peach?
Oh great, looks like they're liked fairly evenly, we can go ahead and make our new fruit salad! Cheers gu..... APPLE!!
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Fuxo✭✭✭✭HoR (pts) was supposed to center around balance ... and it did a decent job of that during pts (for the most part anyway, nothing is perfect). HoR (pts version) was a gigantic balancing act and the game seemed in a fairly good place, and we had counters to almost everything.
But, there was this outcry on pts ... an unrelenting outcry to nerf the oblivion damage glyph. But ... was it possible to just nerf the glyph and leave everything else the way it was (on pts)?
---> If you answered "yes" you would be wrong.
As difficult as this will be for a lot of folks to hear, the oblivion damage glyph couldn't get nerfed in isolation ... it was part of the overall balancing act ... it was there to help maintain the equilibrium.
Think about it ... the amount of damage caused by the glyph was mediocre at best AND it couldn't crit. This glyph really only hurt very low-health builds ... the lower your health, the more butt-hurt you would get.
If you compare the pts version to what we got on live, what else got nerfed? Yep, crit chance (Thief) and crit damage (Shadow) and the precise weapon trait. Anyone making the connection yet? Let me put it this way:
What sort of damage can become totally insane with high crit chance / high crit damage? You know, the kind of damage that if it hits you, you're probably gonna die real fast. You know, the kind of damage that can trigger status effects, and those status effects can trigger increased damage (via CP), etc.,
Counters or balancing won't always be about dodging, or zoom zooming away, or going invisible. Counters or balance can also include going through shields (shield stackers) (oblivion damage) as well as damage strong enough to exceed shield protection if wearing a shield, and pretty much instant death if no shield .
Yea, so, in the end, we got what was promised, just not the way we thought we were going to get it.
moral of the story: be careful what you wish for, because you just might get it.
The real reason for the nerf to oblivion damage is zerging. It could lead to a "zerg or gtfo" pvp style. The same with high crit chance with magicka builds. They had to decrease it as the only counter play is shielding. Unavailable to many stamina builds. Imagine a zerg of magicka builds spamming shields, using oblivion damage together with 75%+ crit chance and shadow mundus. The outcry to such meta would be insane.0 -
Haquor✭✭✭✭✭As much as I find ZOS change things too drastically, the point of the PTS is to test things and correct them before going live
So by rights the changes they just made should have been a new pts update that could have been tested and then when feedback is mostly positive you go live.
In an ideal system the last pts update for any new dlc or major patch should go live with very small changes if any.
How hotr went live was just stupid. I mean why even have a pts?0 -
SoLooney✭✭✭✭✭Big youtubers just need to put out crap sets and call those BiS then ZOS nerfs them and leaves the other good sets alone lol. btw at alcast and gilliam, it doesnt help when you guys passionately state in your video that something is friggin op, thats all ZOS needs to hear to get the nerf hammer going, i understand super op things like the torugs pact, but something that is strong, using words like that doesnt help0