CALLING ALL GUILD PVP GUILD LEADERS AND CONCERNED CITIZENS! Council is Set-up, gathering members!

Vincelex

I know in the PvE world, specifically the end-game trial community there is a Council of Raiders in place that is a essentially a union of many PvE guilds on both the NA and EU servers that collectively send feedback to ZOS and ZOS in turn communicates with them.
If there is enough interest, why not set one up with the same idea but for those of us who love to PVP?
IF this is set-up as well will there be any ZOS employees willing to communicate with us in say a discord channel about the issues that collectively affect us PVPers in Cyrodill?
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @Wrobel @ZOS_MattFiror @ZOS_BrianWheeler

AbraXuSeXile

A group tried it, ZoS ignored it.

Rickter

the problem is that they will only take the opinions of streamers and "youtube creators" more seriously than say, someone like myself.

They invited quite a bit of people to their baltimore headquarters earlier in the year and amoung them were the likes of Sypher, Fengrush, Speez etc. they even had Kodi on their eso live. Im sure Jules has their ear as well.

problem is most of these guys dont play ESO much anymore. they go through ups and downs to provide "variety" to their channel despite the fact that it was ESO roots that got them where they are.

the agenda driven pvp elite pushed for noCP pvp. how did that work out? hello Shor. .

Nivellan

Rickter wrote: »

the problem is that they will only take the opinions of streamers and "youtube creators" more seriously than say, someone like myself.

They invited quite a bit of people to their baltimore headquarters earlier in the year and amoung them were the likes of Sypher, Fengrush, Speez etc. they even had Kodi on their eso live. Im sure Jules has their ear as well.

problem is most of these guys dont play ESO much anymore. they go through ups and downs to provide "variety" to their channel despite the fact that it was ESO roots that got them where they are.

the agenda driven pvp elite pushed for noCP pvp. how did that work out? hello Shor. .

PvP guilds have had ZOS's ear since the game came out. They're listening to everybody whether you're a streamer or not. The people invited to HQ earlier in the year, whether they should have been invited at all, probably feel the same way the PvP guilds did. At the end of the day no matter what feedback you give ZOS, and what direction you want the game to go in... it's only going to go in one direction. ZOS's direction. Anyone giving private feedback to ZOS understands they're only influencing the game in a very small way. People who aren't part of the meetings don't understand that and think more of it than what it is.

Publius_Scipio

ZOS doesn't listen to me.

DisgracefulMind

Rickter wrote: »

the problem is that they will only take the opinions of streamers and "youtube creators" more seriously than say, someone like myself.

They invited quite a bit of people to their baltimore headquarters earlier in the year and amoung them were the likes of Sypher, Fengrush, Speez etc. they even had Kodi on their eso live. Im sure Jules has their ear as well.

problem is most of these guys dont play ESO much anymore. they go through ups and downs to provide "variety" to their channel despite the fact that it was ESO roots that got them where they are.

the agenda driven pvp elite pushed for noCP pvp. how did that work out? hello Shor. .

Just putting it out there, in a meeting with ZoS last year we asked for bankable AP, were given an explanation how it wasn't possible atm but that they would work on making it possible, and here we are with bankable AP next patch. It's not much, but it's just an example of them listening to players who aren't just streamers. In fact, there's a couple of other changes that have happened that came from that meeting. I know ZoS needs to work harder at listening, but they listen somewhat.

Sanct16

We tried to set something up like this.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler said he was interested but we should talk to @ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom and/or @ZOS_RichLambert about it. Sadly, despite sending multiple requests to each of them, they didn't bother replying.

Pchela

A bunch of us in EU and NA gathered to make one in early this year. Our last contact with them was April.

Edit: what abraxus said.

Morgul667

That would be interesting provided it goes in a constructive way and does not hop on the nerf train

Satiar

If there was such a thing I know VE would want to be there. The track record is not good tho

Glory

Sanct16 wrote: »

We tried to set something up like this.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler said he was interested but we should talk to @ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom and/or @ZOS_RichLambert about it. Sadly, despite sending multiple requests to each of them, they didn't bother replying.

Can confirm. It was a pretty well-rounded (play style preference, faction, server mixture) group.

No response from them.

IxSTALKERxI

Alacrity and a few other guilds used to have meetings in TS to provide feedback in the first year of the game. So did some prominent trade guilds.

It was always just done as another method of feedback though - they still gather feedback from forums, tickets, messages etc. Whilst the feedback they get has some influence on decision making, in the end zos will always take the game in the direction that they believe is best and what works for them.

@Rickter They value feedback from people like you just as much as streamers etc. You just need to talk to them in a professional manner and present ideas to them in a constructive and positive way.

IxSTALKERxI

The good thing about having a 'council of pvpers' is the feedback will be more consolidated and less biased so long as a large variety of players with conflicting interests and opinions are represented. PvPer's of all backgrounds can have debates with each other about x,y,z prior to the meeting and then the feedback provided with zos will be more consistent with everyone on the same page and mindful of each others opinions & playstyles.

Joy_Division

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

Alacrity and a few other guilds used to have meetings in TS to provide feedback in the first year of the game. So did some prominent trade guilds.

It was always just done as another method of feedback though - they still gather feedback from forums, tickets, messages etc. Whilst the feedback they get has some influence on decision making, in the end zos will always take the game in the direction that they believe is best and what works for them.

@Rickter They value feedback from people like you just as much as streamers etc. You just need to talk to them in a professional manner and present ideas to them in a constructive and positive way.

Exactly this. I was in a PvE raiding guild back in the day and I remember those TS sessions.

It may seem ZoS doesn't take your feedback seriously, but what is the expectation? ZoS gets 1000s and 1000s of ideas - what makes me the special snowflake that they should ignore everyone else and discard their own vision just to implement what I think is a good idea? Sure, I think my ideas are great, but it's ZoS name and reputation, not mine, and I'm pretty sure budget constrains, finite manpower, and higher priority projects are the principle reason why feedback is seemingly ignored.

I do think a PvP committee or advisory board would be a good idea, but I'm not to sure if we as a PvP community can agree on enough to even present a coherent or unified vision or a list of things we even want from ZoS. I can tell from the passion and very vocal pleas that there are many people out there that are 1000% convinced of opinions that they feel are certitudes and Truths. While they are entitled to feel that way, I would feel uncomfortable if many of those opinions somehow represented me or what "we" PvPers though would be best for the game.

Rohamad_Ali

This One wants to be on the council of Role players that PVP . Give us back our pets and momentous . Those were not causing the lag . That was a far fetched assumption . I also want to be on the councils of PvP'ers for the return of the Cyrodiil torch bug and deer . You removed them but it did not stop lag so pit them back ! We might as well have beautiful scenery in between loading screens . Thank you for reading this important message to the RP PVP community .

Vincelex

Joy_Division wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

Alacrity and a few other guilds used to have meetings in TS to provide feedback in the first year of the game. So did some prominent trade guilds.

It was always just done as another method of feedback though - they still gather feedback from forums, tickets, messages etc. Whilst the feedback they get has some influence on decision making, in the end zos will always take the game in the direction that they believe is best and what works for them.

@Rickter They value feedback from people like you just as much as streamers etc. You just need to talk to them in a professional manner and present ideas to them in a constructive and positive way.

Exactly this. I was in a PvE raiding guild back in the day and I remember those TS sessions.

It may seem ZoS doesn't take your feedback seriously, but what is the expectation? ZoS gets 1000s and 1000s of ideas - what makes me the special snowflake that they should ignore everyone else and discard their own vision just to implement what I think is a good idea? Sure, I think my ideas are great, but it's ZoS name and reputation, not mine, and I'm pretty sure budget constrains, finite manpower, and higher priority projects are the principle reason why feedback is seemingly ignored.

I do think a PvP committee or advisory board would be a good idea, but I'm not to sure if we as a PvP community can agree on enough to even present a coherent or unified vision or a list of things we even want from ZoS. I can tell from the passion and very vocal pleas that there are many people out there that are 1000% convinced of opinions that they feel are certitudes and Truths. While they are entitled to feel that way, I would feel uncomfortable if many of those opinions somehow represented me or what "we" PvPers though would be best for the game.

Well if ZOS decides to respond to this thread, the structure I envision would be at least one representative from a pvp guild/community, no more than two to represent their guild's interests and to relay information. Definitely separate the CP and non-cp campaigns and a strict no salt policy. It would an area of discussion, debate, but overall direct feedback to ZOS from the community that makes Cyrodill their home. The expectation is not that every suggestion and opinion be acted upon but rather to keep an open line of communication between the developers and the people who make PVP fun and alive. I know in the PvE council of raiders there is feedback given to ZOS about how trials work, bugs, possible exploits, I mean in the couple months Morrowind has been out, Halls of Fabrication has been changed 3-4 times based upon player feedback and experience. I also think it would be very nice to have most if not all PVP guilds that are in Cyrodill to be represented and kinda let everyone know who is who in our relatively small community. So even if ZOS decides to ignore this thread and it withers away at least we can be more unified as a community of PVPers.
Really hope you guys stop by and offer a response though @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_MattFiror @Wrobel

Vincelex

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

The good thing about having a 'council of pvpers' is the feedback will be more consolidated and less biased so long as a large variety of players with conflicting interests and opinions are represented. PvPer's of all backgrounds can have debates with each other about x,y,z prior to the meeting and then the feedback provided with zos will be more consistent with everyone on the same page and mindful of each others opinions & playstyles.

Essentially this!

Nivellan

Vincelex wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

Alacrity and a few other guilds used to have meetings in TS to provide feedback in the first year of the game. So did some prominent trade guilds.

It was always just done as another method of feedback though - they still gather feedback from forums, tickets, messages etc. Whilst the feedback they get has some influence on decision making, in the end zos will always take the game in the direction that they believe is best and what works for them.

@Rickter They value feedback from people like you just as much as streamers etc. You just need to talk to them in a professional manner and present ideas to them in a constructive and positive way.

Exactly this. I was in a PvE raiding guild back in the day and I remember those TS sessions.

It may seem ZoS doesn't take your feedback seriously, but what is the expectation? ZoS gets 1000s and 1000s of ideas - what makes me the special snowflake that they should ignore everyone else and discard their own vision just to implement what I think is a good idea? Sure, I think my ideas are great, but it's ZoS name and reputation, not mine, and I'm pretty sure budget constrains, finite manpower, and higher priority projects are the principle reason why feedback is seemingly ignored.

I do think a PvP committee or advisory board would be a good idea, but I'm not to sure if we as a PvP community can agree on enough to even present a coherent or unified vision or a list of things we even want from ZoS. I can tell from the passion and very vocal pleas that there are many people out there that are 1000% convinced of opinions that they feel are certitudes and Truths. While they are entitled to feel that way, I would feel uncomfortable if many of those opinions somehow represented me or what "we" PvPers though would be best for the game.

Well if ZOS decides to respond to this thread, the structure I envision would be at least one representative from a pvp guild/community, no more than two to represent their guild's interests and to relay information. Definitely separate the CP and non-cp campaigns and a strict no salt policy. It would an area of discussion, debate, but overall direct feedback to ZOS from the community that makes Cyrodill their home. The expectation is not that every suggestion and opinion be acted upon but rather to keep an open line of communication between the developers and the people who make PVP fun and alive. I know in the PvE council of raiders there is feedback given to ZOS about how trials work, bugs, possible exploits, I mean in the couple months Morrowind has been out, Halls of Fabrication has been changed 3-4 times based upon player feedback and experience. I also think it would be very nice to have most if not all PVP guilds that are in Cyrodill to be represented and kinda let everyone know who is who in our relatively small community. So even if ZOS decides to ignore this thread and it withers away at least we can be more unified as a community of PVPers.
Really hope you guys stop by and offer a response though @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_MattFiror @Wrobel

This is something simple to setup. I just don't want people involved to get discouraged.

Nermy

I'll gladly help, Wabbajack is re-building again after we lost a lot of players to other alliances but I have members who have 3+ years PvP experience. Gotta count for something, right?

I just worry it comes to little or even nothing. ZoS haven't the greatest track record in listening to their player base. Though it would be nice to chat to some other PvP guild leaders

@Turelus Have you anything you can contribute? Maybe outside your remit.

Turelus

Damn it Nermy why do you always tag me in stuff, I am retired!

I am always behind better developer player communication but I feel small council groups are a bad way of doing this.

If there is information from a developer it needs to be open to everyone to view and not kept to a select few because as small as any bit of information given is, it will effect how things are done.
I don't agree with the council of raiders as it is because it's an unfair benefit for guild which are represented vs new guilds who want to be competitive and can't have things verified from a dev directly.
There is a reason other games companies tend to have a stance against this kind of stuff because it can and does effect the competitive aspect of the game in favour of those with the information.

With my cynical whining out of the way...

If this is going to be set up I would imagine a Discord or Slack group with representatives from each PVP guild which wishes to contribute having a place to speak with Wheeler, Rich and Wrobel directly. Of course this would be on the condition of good behaviour and anyone smacking them would be banned from the program.
A place where the guild reps can give direct feedback and get answers to questions which would push towards a better Cyrodiil and PvP game for everyone.

Otherwise sorry Nermy I have nothing to really say nor can I do anything to help with this.

Nermy

@Turelus because you always have really good input...

NACtron

Pact Militia would be happy to be a part of this. If ZOS is willing to do it.

Dutchessx

If a council of pvp'ers is set up I would be willing to join it on behalf of Darkest Requiem. Actually I disagree that no-cp should be separate from cp issues. I know a lot of us play both but have homed one or the other. The reason I believe that a council of pvp'ers should not separate cp & no cp is whatever you do to cp such as buffing guards while it might help in cp would be amplified in no cp and guards at a level 5 keep or resource are more difficult to kill than some players. When we ran into @ZOS_RichLambert in game and one time I spoke with @ZOS_GinaBruno in during a q & a, they did listen to me. Granted when I spoke with @ZOS_GinaBruno it was at the beginning of the game about a personal issue of character progression that support had issues fixing but she had someone contact me eventually it got fixed. When we ran into @ZOS_RichLambert he was very attentive in regards to issues we brought to him & asked it to be demonstrated most have been fixed. I believe it was the way we brought it to him and for that reason I would be willing to try a council.

LarsS

The Daggerfall Authority would be willing participate. In fact juging on the threads on forum I think there is things we could agree on.

Vincelex

Turelus wrote: »

Damn it Nermy why do you always tag me in stuff, I am retired!

I am always behind better developer player communication but I feel small council groups are a bad way of doing this.

If there is information from a developer it needs to be open to everyone to view and not kept to a select few because as small as any bit of information given is, it will effect how things are done.
I don't agree with the council of raiders as it is because it's an unfair benefit for guild which are represented vs new guilds who want to be competitive and can't have things verified from a dev directly.
There is a reason other games companies tend to have a stance against this kind of stuff because it can and does effect the competitive aspect of the game in favour of those with the information.

With my cynical whining out of the way...

If this is going to be set up I would imagine a Discord or Slack group with representatives from each PVP guild which wishes to contribute having a place to speak with Wheeler, Rich and Wrobel directly. Of course this would be on the condition of good behaviour and anyone smacking them would be banned from the program.
A place where the guild reps can give direct feedback and get answers to questions which would push towards a better Cyrodiil and PvP game for everyone.

Otherwise sorry Nermy I have nothing to really say nor can I do anything to help with this.

I am meaning this to be inclusive to all guilds that main cyrodill. Not meant to be a small council group. Really the only reason I wouldn't want a guild to be a part of this is because of salt, but limiting guilds to a maximum of two representatives with a minimum of one I feel is fair.

Nihilos

I'd be down to rep mine and my friends' guild, MLP, if this goes forward.

Prince_of_all_Pugs

I would like this alot for pvp guild together but i really dont see Zerg guilds and small man and 1vX guilds working together. Anyways im bored and willing to give this a shot, DR pledges support for this "council" as long as it stays civil and constructive.

incite

Prince_of_ all_Pugs wrote: »

I would like this alot for pvp guild together but i really dont see Zerg guilds and small man and 1vX guilds working together. Anyways im bored and willing to give this a shot, DR pledges support for this "council" as long as it stays civil and constructive.

Glad you're bored and therefor wanna participate

olivesforge

DD has always supported such a move, and were involved in the PvE side during launch (back when we were a PvE guild). Of course we'd happily support such a measure (and are indeed doing a smaller version of this for AD guilds), so long as it allows for a wide diversity of play styles, levels and experience. It shouldn't just be large TS guilds.

Nermy

I'm all for representing Wabbajack if this comes to fruition. I think it could benefit all sides if done properly and kudos to @Vincelex for having the balls to suggest it and take it forward.

Vincelex

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Can Confirm I have balls
Its great to see people interested in doing this, its only been a day since I made this post but the feedback is nice.
If the ones' interested could send me PM, with the following details
What Server?
What Guild?
What Faction?
Other Details not required, but nice to know: Type of Gameplay ( Large-Scale, Medium-Scale, Small-Scale, 1vx, Etc), Campaign (Vivec, Shor, Sotha Sil, Kyne), Any other details you feel is important for me to know.
I am currently setting up a discord server so once it is functional I will PM the link back to the interested parties.
Keep in mind, minimum of 1 representative from a guild, with a maximum of two, I'll give more details as I work on setting this up.