PTS Update 15 - Feedback Thread for Mundus Stone Changes

Lord_Eomer

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

I dont know why people are talking about diversity. Nothing will change, there will be a best setup. Just accept it, there is nothing wrong with it.

And all honestly we dont even need to have traits to be close in effectiveness. We just need to make them all situational so there are different bests for different scenarios.

Yea different best for differnt scenerio is called diversity infact previously it was only sharpen mojo!

Strider_Roshin

SodanTok wrote: »

Anunakis wrote: »

Jawasa wrote: »

@Nebthet78 comeon you cant blame pvp for the change to thife mundus. It's a pve nerf that affect pvp.

do you really use thief mundus on pvp ?

Who doesnt? Okay this too generic response, people are more inclined in PVP to change mundus based on what they are missing, but it was still the best mundus

Stam doesn't because it's more difficult to sustain as stam than it is magicka.

SodanTok

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

SodanTok wrote: »

Anunakis wrote: »

Jawasa wrote: »

@Nebthet78 comeon you cant blame pvp for the change to thife mundus. It's a pve nerf that affect pvp.

do you really use thief mundus on pvp ?

Who doesnt? Okay this too generic response, people are more inclined in PVP to change mundus based on what they are missing, but it was still the best mundus

Stam doesn't because it's more difficult to sustain as stam than it is magicka.

Depends on the build obviously, but thief is still more popular than serpent imho (or they are very close, but thief is definitely used a lot). Tho that will probably change drastically now.

Tulach

I'm lost I guess. Why change basically everything about the game in morrowind to go back and change everything again a month later? Devs complained they didnt want easy mode resources which I never really felt in the first place but then a month later they increase resource regen from the mundus stones. The devs complained about the power of cp but a month after the last cp increase they go and raise it again by another 30 cp? Then they go and make most all PVP no cp driven?

Still no fix to the stupid guards chain casting 'OLD' eclispe in either cryodil or Imperial City? I mean how long is that going to continue before a fix? How bout the fact that guards still chain negate through walls even as well?

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Tulach wrote: »

I'm lost I guess. Why change basically everything about the game in morrowind to go back and change everything again a month later? Devs complained they didnt want easy mode resources which I never really felt in the first place but then a month later they increase resource regen from the mundus stones. The devs complained about the power of cp but a month after the last cp increase they go and raise it again by another 30 cp? Then they go and make most all PVP no cp driven?

Still no fix to the stupid guards chain casting 'OLD' eclispe in either cryodil or Imperial City? I mean how long is that going to continue before a fix? How bout the fact that guards still chain negate through walls even as well?

The extra regen from the mundas is nothing compared to the 16% cost reduction that was taken away and 10% regen, so pump your brakes with this sort of thinking.

Eejit1331

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

SodanTok wrote: »

Anunakis wrote: »

Jawasa wrote: »

@Nebthet78 comeon you cant blame pvp for the change to thife mundus. It's a pve nerf that affect pvp.

do you really use thief mundus on pvp ?

Who doesnt? Okay this too generic response, people are more inclined in PVP to change mundus based on what they are missing, but it was still the best mundus

Stam doesn't because it's more difficult to sustain as stam than it is magicka.

Being a Nord NB doesn't help you with stamina sustain.

Masel

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

I dont know why people are talking about diversity. Nothing will change, there will be a best setup. Just accept it, there is nothing wrong with it.

And all honestly we dont even need to have traits to be close in effectiveness. We just need to make them all situational so there are different bests for different scenarios.

I don't even know what to say to this one. You do know that this update limits the mindless gear grind by at least 1/3 for everything? And if the best in slot setup gives you 2% more damage, who on earth will grind 500 hours for it? Sharpened was outbeating everything for so long...

People always ask for BiS stuff and don't come up with their own stuff. You only truly master a build if it is your own one and you put a lot of testing and thought into it.

Strider_Roshin

Eejit1331 wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

SodanTok wrote: »

Anunakis wrote: »

Jawasa wrote: »

@Nebthet78 comeon you cant blame pvp for the change to thife mundus. It's a pve nerf that affect pvp.

do you really use thief mundus on pvp ?

Who doesnt? Okay this too generic response, people are more inclined in PVP to change mundus based on what they are missing, but it was still the best mundus

Stam doesn't because it's more difficult to sustain as stam than it is magicka.

Being a Nord NB doesn't help you with stamina sustain.

Lol this is true.

Br1ckst0n

Masel92 wrote: »

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

I dont know why people are talking about diversity. Nothing will change, there will be a best setup. Just accept it, there is nothing wrong with it.

And all honestly we dont even need to have traits to be close in effectiveness. We just need to make them all situational so there are different bests for different scenarios.

I don't even know what to say to this one. You do know that this update limits the mindless gear grind by at least 1/3 for everything? And if the best in slot setup gives you 2% more damage, who on earth will grind 500 hours for it? Sharpened was outbeating everything for so long...

People always ask for BiS stuff and don't come up with their own stuff. You only truly master a build if it is your own one and you put a lot of testing and thought into it.

It doesnt limit the grind for people who go for topscores in trials/vma. The 2nd best trait doesnt cut it even if there is just a 0.1% difference. And that master a build thing is complete bs. You can master a class or even a certain skill setup but gear just gives you stats.

ZOS_GinaBruno

NuclearPath wrote: »

Currently getting an issue with the lover and the lady mundus stones. Every time I port either via selecting a location on the map and paying the fee or by fast travelling in the wayshrines I lose my mundus buff entirely. I have only tested these two and they are of course two of the stones with decently significant changes to them. Along with this, I no longer get a message above my character saying that I've accepted the mundus once done, though the buff does show up. Below is a video linked to the clip I got of the bug.

http://plays.tv/video/596424d67c2c421b01/check-out-my-video-

Thanks! This will be fixed in next week's PTS incremental patch.

Kneighbors

Personally having one trait noticeably stronger than others for attack or defence seemed like a good idea to me. Yea, you want the best, you grind, it makes you sad when you dont get it and makes you feel good when you do. I don't think making equal traits is better. Simply remove them together with similar mundus from the game.

Go ahead and make boring game, remove all traits, remove all sets, because people on the forums say they feel sad when they can't get desired trait. But they are still here, complaining and playing again and again. Who knows maybe the day they finish grinding for BiS they will loose interest?

Masel

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

I dont know why people are talking about diversity. Nothing will change, there will be a best setup. Just accept it, there is nothing wrong with it.

And all honestly we dont even need to have traits to be close in effectiveness. We just need to make them all situational so there are different bests for different scenarios.

I don't even know what to say to this one. You do know that this update limits the mindless gear grind by at least 1/3 for everything? And if the best in slot setup gives you 2% more damage, who on earth will grind 500 hours for it? Sharpened was outbeating everything for so long...

People always ask for BiS stuff and don't come up with their own stuff. You only truly master a build if it is your own one and you put a lot of testing and thought into it.

It doesnt limit the grind for people who go for topscores in trials/vma. The 2nd best trait doesnt cut it even if there is just a 0.1% difference. And that master a build thing is complete bs. You can master a class or even a certain skill setup but gear just gives you stats.

Half of Hodor doesn't have BiS gear and they've been dominating the EU leaderboards for years. It's the player skill (in vMA and other trials) and team synergy (in team trials) that determines the scores you get.

Andy S would do (and did in the past) No 1 runs in vMA with average gear. So have a look at the real ingame environment before you make those claims.

And i don't even get how you can be in favour of a system that requires you to invest hundreds of hours to get what you want. You want a token system yeah, but this is a much better solution. And it does still make a great difference what trait/mundus/gear you choose, in PvP. The raiding community in ESO will greatly benefit from these changes as they allow more players to get the required gear to be able to run endgame content, especially as far as vMA staffs/Moondancer staffs is concerned.

Also, I don't understand your argument why what I said earlier is BS, as you said...

Br1ckst0n

Masel92 wrote: »

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

I dont know why people are talking about diversity. Nothing will change, there will be a best setup. Just accept it, there is nothing wrong with it.

And all honestly we dont even need to have traits to be close in effectiveness. We just need to make them all situational so there are different bests for different scenarios.

I don't even know what to say to this one. You do know that this update limits the mindless gear grind by at least 1/3 for everything? And if the best in slot setup gives you 2% more damage, who on earth will grind 500 hours for it? Sharpened was outbeating everything for so long...

People always ask for BiS stuff and don't come up with their own stuff. You only truly master a build if it is your own one and you put a lot of testing and thought into it.

It doesnt limit the grind for people who go for topscores in trials/vma. The 2nd best trait doesnt cut it even if there is just a 0.1% difference. And that master a build thing is complete bs. You can master a class or even a certain skill setup but gear just gives you stats.

Half of Hodor doesn't have BiS gear and they've been dominating the EU leaderboards for years. It's the player skill (in vMA and other trials) and team synergy (in team trials) that determines the scores you get.

Andy S would do (and did in the past) No 1 runs in vMA with average gear. So have a look at the real ingame environment before you make those claims.

And i don't even get how you can be in favour of a system that requires you to invest hundreds of hours to get what you want. You want a token system yeah, but this is a much better solution. And it does still make a great difference what trait/mundus/gear you choose, in PvP. The raiding community in ESO will greatly benefit from these changes as they allow more players to get the required gear to be able to run endgame content, especially as far as vMA staffs/Moondancer staffs is concerned.

Also, I don't understand your argument why what I said earlier is BS, as you said...

First of all there is no "This is a better solution". That is just your opinion.

And while we are at it. All the topscores in this game were not a result of skill. Its more about the amount of hours people put into it.

Regardless, if you have 2 different groups running for the topscore and both invest 10000 hours then the group with the better equipment will come out on top. Simple as that. Thats why i want a token system.

Also hodor isnt dominating for years. They started getting the highscores around 1.5 years ago by taking them the night before the patch hit just by a couple of points. The following patch they took mol and so highscores by a good margin. They dominated from shadow of the hist patch til morrowind (so about 1 year) with a very dry field of competition.

AuT6GHad

I really like the changes to the Mundus stones.

In my opinion the Shadow should be the best for DPS, because it relies on crits. The Lover should have the second highest DPS potential, because it doesn’t support defense and isn’t effective against damage shield or when you are on penetration cap. Next in the line should be the Thief, it give you everything in PVE, but can be countered in PVP with crit resistance or by shields. On the fourth place should be the Warrior/Apprentice, because it increases offensive and defensive tooltips. The Mage and the Tower moreover offer the same and add some sustain, because of the higher Ressource-pool.

What a surprise, ZOS made the new Mundus stones exactly in line with my thought:
(not on penetration cap, base crit damage (50%), crit chance 50%)

Shadow (6%) > Lover (5,5% PVE) > Thief (4,5%) > Lover (4,16% PVP) > Warrior/Apprentice (4,1%) > Tower/Mage (3,5%)

Nevertheless, the difference between the Shadow and the Mage/Tower (2,5%) is a bit too high. Especially if the crit chance increases to 80% the Shadow would give 9,6%, which clearly outperforms all other stones. Therefore I would suggest to decrease the distances in between the Mundus stones.

The Lover should give 3000 Penetration (6% PVE / 4,54% PVP).

The Warrior / Apprentice should increase the Weapon/Spell Damage by, for example, 260 (4,48%).

The Tower/Mage should increase Resources by 2500 (4,32%).

Shadow (6%) > Lover (6% PVE / 4,54% PVP) > Thief (4,5%) > Warrior/Apprentice (4,48%) > Tower/Mage (4,32%)
(keep in mind that Shadow and Thief can be buffed with higher crit chance/damage)

I really like the buff of the Serpent and the Atronach, but in my opinion their values are still too small, especially after the Morrowind sustain changes. They should be around 300.

The Lady should be matched to the Lover. So 3000 Resistances.

The Lord and the Steed should be adjusted to their above mentioned equivalents.

GeorgeBlack

When using Twice Born Star we can run a second Mundus Effect.
However every time we remove the set we have to go back to the 2nd Stone to get the Effect.

I think a lot of people give up on Twice Born Star because of this.
@Zos can we make it so that the 2nd Mundus is saved and rdy for use when TBS is equipped?

The only exploit I can think of (if there are no design problems) is that Dual Wielding and SnB can run TBS and another 5p set by switching bars. Given the fact that the 3 bonuses of the armor are not very strong I don't see a Red Flag to making the 2nd Mundus saved and rdy for use.


On a different not it would be interesting if certain mundus increasee the tooltip of specific skills in an attemp for people to add a personal touch to the limited min/max metas that we have for competitive gaming.

Eg: warrior increases the tooltip of Wrecking Blow, Twin Slashes, Beast Trap, Focused charge.
You get the idea.

idk

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

When using Twice Born Star we can run a second Mundus Effect.
However every time we remove the set we have to go back to the 2nd Stone to get the Effect.

I think a lot of people give up on Twice Born Star because of this.
@Zos can we make it so that the 2nd Mundus is saved and rdy for use when TBS is equipped?

The only exploit I can think of (if there are no design problems) is that Dual Wielding and SnB can run TBS and another 5p set by switching bars. Given the fact that the 3 bonuses of the armor are not very strong I don't see a Red Flag to making the 2nd Mundus saved and rdy for use.


On a different not it would be interesting if certain mundus increasee the tooltip of specific skills in an attemp for people to add a personal touch to the limited min/max metas that we have for competitive gaming.

Eg: warrior increases the tooltip of Wrecking Blow, Twin Slashes, Beast Trap, Focused charge.
You get the idea.

Due to more than one exploit in the past where players were able to keep the second mundus after removing TBS and slotting other gear Zos is unlikely to create a system where the second mundus is saved as it could easily open the door to another exploit.

Yes, it would be great, however, I would like to not see a TBS exploit again.

Tonnopesce

Mah i will still use the shadow mundus on my shadowscale argonian nothing will change that.

SugaComa

Masel92 wrote: »

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

I dont know why people are talking about diversity. Nothing will change, there will be a best setup. Just accept it, there is nothing wrong with it.

And all honestly we dont even need to have traits to be close in effectiveness. We just need to make them all situational so there are different bests for different scenarios.

I don't even know what to say to this one. You do know that this update limits the mindless gear grind by at least 1/3 for everything? And if the best in slot setup gives you 2% more damage, who on earth will grind 500 hours for it? Sharpened was outbeating everything for so long...

People always ask for BiS stuff and don't come up with their own stuff. You only truly master a build if it is your own one and you put a lot of testing and thought into it.

People all ask me what's the best build for such n such ... My builds are probably rubish because my answer is always this

The one you build for your play style

The one you build for you ...

I love my Magplar she's built and using stuff the waybill want it to, it's not the highest DPS but I've always preferred slow damage over fast, working the mechanics not just steaming in and killing things before they can react, sadly I'm not going to solo mealstrom with this build with out some serious time learning the mechanics, but isn't that the point of ESO ... Not to just blaze content in the blink of an eye looking for BiS to just blaze content

GeorgeBlack

SugaComa wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

I dont know why people are talking about diversity. Nothing will change, there will be a best setup. Just accept it, there is nothing wrong with it.

And all honestly we dont even need to have traits to be close in effectiveness. We just need to make them all situational so there are different bests for different scenarios.

I don't even know what to say to this one. You do know that this update limits the mindless gear grind by at least 1/3 for everything? And if the best in slot setup gives you 2% more damage, who on earth will grind 500 hours for it? Sharpened was outbeating everything for so long...

People always ask for BiS stuff and don't come up with their own stuff. You only truly master a build if it is your own one and you put a lot of testing and thought into it.

People all ask me what's the best build for such n such ... My builds are probably rubish because my answer is always this

The one you build for your play style

The one you build for you ...

I love my Magplar she's built and using stuff the waybill want it to, it's not the highest DPS but I've always preferred slow damage over fast, working the mechanics not just steaming in and killing things before they can react, sadly I'm not going to solo mealstrom with this build with out some serious time learning the mechanics, but isn't that the point of ESO ... Not to just blaze content in the blink of an eye looking for BiS to just blaze content

Good on you for playing how you like instead of going meta. I've played a specific Class based on armor/weapon since I started mmorpgs in 2004. Saddly ESO doesn't support this 'class'. Not going meta though.

idk

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

SugaComa wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

Br1ckst0n wrote: »

I dont know why people are talking about diversity. Nothing will change, there will be a best setup. Just accept it, there is nothing wrong with it.

And all honestly we dont even need to have traits to be close in effectiveness. We just need to make them all situational so there are different bests for different scenarios.

I don't even know what to say to this one. You do know that this update limits the mindless gear grind by at least 1/3 for everything? And if the best in slot setup gives you 2% more damage, who on earth will grind 500 hours for it? Sharpened was outbeating everything for so long...

People always ask for BiS stuff and don't come up with their own stuff. You only truly master a build if it is your own one and you put a lot of testing and thought into it.

People all ask me what's the best build for such n such ... My builds are probably rubish because my answer is always this

The one you build for your play style

The one you build for you ...

I love my Magplar she's built and using stuff the waybill want it to, it's not the highest DPS but I've always preferred slow damage over fast, working the mechanics not just steaming in and killing things before they can react, sadly I'm not going to solo mealstrom with this build with out some serious time learning the mechanics, but isn't that the point of ESO ... Not to just blaze content in the blink of an eye looking for BiS to just blaze content

Good on you for playing how you like instead of going meta. I've played a specific Class based on armor/weapon since I started mmorpgs in 2004. Saddly ESO doesn't support this 'class'. Not going meta though.

iirc, you play a stam DK which is pulling fabulous dps numbers on live ATM.

Of course it is a choice to go meta or not just like it is a choice to put out great dps or not. But none of this really has to do with the topic of this thread.

Transairion

This may be a silly question, but do the Resource Stone changes make Infused on "big pieces" inferior to Divines now?

• The Apprentice: Increased Spell Damage to 238 from 167.
• The Atronach: Increased Magicka Recovery to 238 from 167.
• The Lady: Now grants Spell Resistance in addition to Physical Resistance. Value increased to 2752 from 1980.
• The Lover: Now grants 2752 Physical and Spell Penetration instead of granting Spell Resistance.
• The Lord: Increased Max Health to 2231 from 1452.
• The Mage: Increased Max Magicka to 2028 from 1320.
• The Serpent: Increased Stamina Recovery to 238 from 167.
• The Steed: Increased Health Recovery to 238 from 167.
• The Thief: Reduced Critical Strike Chance to 9% from 11%.
• The Tower: Increased Max Stamina to 2028 from 1320.
• The Warrior: Increased Weapon Damage to 238 from 167.
• The Shadow and The Ritual remain unchanged.

At present, using Infused and the applicable armor enchantment/s on "big pieces" (Head/Chest/Legs) gives more resources than using Divines and the applicable "Resource Stone", while the opposite is true for "small pieces" (Gloves/Belt/Shoulder/Feet) where Divines gives more resources in the end.

Can you now get more resources just by going all Divines?

JustSnilloc

Transairion wrote: »

Can you now get more resources just by going all Divines?

This is a trait question, not a Mundus Stone question. Here's a quote from the Traits topic...

JustSnilloc wrote: »

Divines - 1065 Additional Points of Stamina/Magicka (*with corresponding Mundus)
Infused - 800 or 900 Additonal Points of Stam/Mag or Health. (Was infused armor buffed too? 866 or 975 if it was buffed)

So basically you get 200 additional points of a resource by going all divines.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

.

JustSnilloc wrote: »

Transairion wrote: »

Can you now get more resources just by going all Divines?

This is a trait question, not a Mundus Stone question. Here's a quote from the Traits topic...

JustSnilloc wrote: »

Divines - 1065 Additional Points of Stamina/Magicka (*with corresponding Mundus)
Infused - 800 or 900 Additonal Points of Stam/Mag or Health. (Was infused armor buffed too? 866 or 975 if it was buffed)

So basically you get 200 additional points of a resource by going all divines.

you get more out of infused and divines out of the the small when using a max stat mundas.

so an infused chest leg and helm enchant is 1041, regular enchant is 868, so a difference of 173, with divines 7.5% of the new value of the mundas, 2028, you get only 152.

Rungar

keeping in mind the loss of defending I think it would be prudent to make the lady 3250 considering everyone who will use this mundus generally wont be wearing divines. Even with full gold divines it would be 5k. Slightly less than the old defending weapon trait.

Aeko

I think that the Ritual deserves to be buffed in line with the Atronarch and Apprentice mundus stones.

Unless if I'm completely unaware of something major, I don't think that the Ritual mundus stone is over-performing right now, as the Atronarch remains competitive for sustain necessary to perform all abilities (heals & support as well as damage) in Morrowind and there are spell damage and critical buffs respectively that help aid the healing role while also providing increased damage when the healer is able. Meanwhile the Ritual only increases healing and provides no other support besides that.

Atronarch and Apprentice are getting buffed by around 40%, while Ritual is remaining the same. I think that in order for it to continue being an option it should be buffed at least somewhat, it doesn't need to go up to 14% which would put it in line as the 40% increases to the other mundus stones (which in my opinion, it should, keeping it at 10% just won't do it).

Bam_Bam

Is it possible to post the current Mundus changes here, please? (no access to the PTS here sadly)

Shadow-Fighter

•The values and bonuses of most Mundus Stones have been adjusted in the following ways, with the listed values being for CP160+ characters:

•The Apprentice: Increased Spell Damage to 238 from 167.
•The Atronach: Increased Magicka Recovery to 238 from 167.
•The Lady: Now grants Spell Resistance in addition to Physical Resistance. Value increased to 2752 from 1980.
•The Lover: Now grants 2752 Physical and Spell Penetration instead of granting Spell Resistance.
•The Lord: Increased Max Health to 2231 from 1452.
•The Mage: Increased Max Magicka to 2028 from 1320.
•The Serpent: Increased Stamina Recovery to 238 from 167.
•The Steed: Increased Health Recovery to 238 from 167.
•The Thief: Reduced Critical Strike Chance to 9% from 11%.
•The Tower: Increased Max Stamina to 2028 from 1320.
•The Warrior: Increased Weapon Damage to 238 from 167.
•The Shadow and The Ritual remain unchanged.