PTS Update 15 - Feedback Thread for Bloodroot Forge

ZOS_GinaBruno · July 2017

This is the official feedback thread for Bloodroot Forge. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

Did you enjoy this new dungeon?
How did the difficulty compare to existing dungeons on Normal and Veteran versions?
Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?
Which was your favorite boss in this dungeon, and why?
What level and build was the character you used?
Do you have any other general feedback?

code65536 · July 2017

Did you enjoy this new dungeon?
- Yes, it was a lot of fun!
How did the difficulty compare to existing dungeons on Normal and Veteran versions?
- Definitely easier than the SotH dungeons were on the PTS!
Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?
- Went straight into Vet; haven't tried normal
Which was your favorite boss in this dungeon, and why?
- Galcohbar by far... it took us several wipes figuring out the mechanics, but it was the most engaging and fun boss, once we figured it out
What level and build was the character you used?
- Went straight in with my Live server character in her vMA setup (Breton magblade, Juli/Infal/Skoria) without making any changes
Do you have any other general feedback?
- I liked that you tried to telegraph mechanics before the boss fights, but some of them we didn't figure out until the boss fight (like what to do with the shalk's lava balls)
- The final boss fight was very much a let-down. We wiped just once, and then once we saw the suggestion in the death recap, we 1-shot our next attempt without anyone dying. We didn't try hard mode, however. Maybe next time. It felt too much like a standard tank-and-spank.
- The visuals are fantastic. I love the design of this new dungeon.
- I also found it very helpful to change my combat cue color to hot pink because the amount of fire effects made the red hard to see.

Alcast · July 2017

Did you enjoy this new dungeon?
Yep, pretty cool dungeon and I really liked the design and bossfights!
How did the difficulty compare to existing dungeons on Normal and Veteran versions?
If I compare it to the Shadows of the Hist it is definitely easier, mostly because you can burn through most bosses.
If I compare it to non DLC dungeons then they are more difficult. So if you were looking for smth between non DLC and DLC dungeon then I think you hit the nail more or less.
Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?
Veteran
Which was your favorite boss in this dungeon, and why?
Galchobhar, prolly has the most movement and mechanics involved in this dungeons, really great bossfight!
What level and build was the character you used?
Max Level templates, Dualwield Bow setup, https://alcasthq.com/
Do you have any other general feedback?
I recommend buffing the health of most bosses, otherwise most people will just burn through the mechanics. Difficulty is fine, but if you want people to PLAY the mechanics, then you need to buff Health

code65536 · July 2017

Also, please remove the pillar base from the bust for this dungeon.

For some reason, the busts for the new dungeons have pillar bases.

Aside from these two new dungeons, the busts from dungeons do not have pillars, and the busts from scored trials (the two arenas and the five 12-person trials) have pillar bases.

But the new busts have pillar bases like the trials busts and unlike the existing dungeon busts. This is inconsistent, and furthermore, in my home, I've already set aside an area in my home for dungeon busts (I have a separate area for trials busts), and the design assumes that all of the dungeons busts are pillarless.

Liofa · July 2017

Did you enjoy this new dungeon?

- Yes ! It was amazing . Very cool mechanics .

How did the difficulty compare to existing dungeons on Normal and Veteran versions?

- Well , it seems hard because it just came out . I am sure we still don't know all mechanics . Even though it seems kinda hard now , it will be a cakewalk in couple weeks , when we get our original characters I mean .

Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?

- Veteran Hard Mode .

Which was your favorite boss in this dungeon, and why?

- I would say last boss . I enjoy the chaos ^^

What level and build was the character you used?

- Max CP Template Warden Tank . 5 War Machine , 5 Torug's Pact , 1 Choketorn , 1 Shadowrend . Enchanted Forest Spamming build .

Do you have any other general feedback?

- First of all , I am sure you already know but , NPCs do not move their lips while talking . Other than that , our DDs didn't have Mundus Stones with crappy item sets those Templates have . With 250 ping , we completed Veteran HM . So I guess you could buff it a bit . One of the DDs don't even play a DD , his main is a healer . We wiped several times on some bosses but still , if we had good characters , we could crush every boss easily . So yeah , small Health buff maybe ?

stileanima · July 2017

Did you enjoy this new dungeon?
Yes! Of the two new dungeons, this one was my favorite. The dungeon itself is beautiful and, overall, the boss fights and trash pulls provided more of a challenge/new mechanics to explore compared to those of Falkreath Hold, which is what my team and I look for and enjoy the most in PvE content.

How did the difficulty compare to existing dungeons on Normal and Veteran versions?
In my opinion, the difficulty lies between that of the Imperial City and Shadows of the Hist dungeons, with some bosses being even easier than those in Imperial City dungeons, yet none as challenging as those in Shadows of the Hist dungeons, save for the third-to-last and last bosses.

Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?
My team and I completed only the Veteran Hard-mode version of the dungeon. We did not attempt Normal or non-Hard-mode Veteran.

Which was your favorite boss in this dungeon, and why?
My favorite boss (as well as the favorite of my teammates) was Galchobhar, the third-to-last boss.

I think this boss is absolutely stunning:

It was extremely fun to figure out the mechanics. Even though at the end we realized that they had been laid out for us one by one as we made our way through the dungeon, we didn't actually understand what they were until we reached this boss.
The mechanics are very unforgiving if you do not actually do them. Trying simply to "stack and whack" this boss will most likely lead to failure.
The achievement that involves not killing any Shalks sounds awesome! We did not attempt it, though, and only saw that it was a thing to do after we completed the dungeon, but I would imagine going for it will bring yet another added challenge- a welcome one at that!
All of the different mechanics and required group coordination made it feel like a mini trial boss- very cool!
There are absolutely no RNG mechanics. Thank you!! Only those that, with practice and development of skill, players can learn and master.
All mechanics are well-telegraphed and leave plenty of reaction time.
The graphics and animations are beautiful.

What level and build was the character you used?
I played as a "healer", though we found that no "dedicated healer" was actually needed. I was able to DPS and off-heal if and when needed. I used a 660 CP template character with Mending and Mother's Sorrow (because lols). My teammates also used template characters with provided gear.

Do you have any other general feedback?
First, I would like to give feedback on each individual boss:

Mathgamain
To be honest, this boss didn't actually feel like a "real" boss, and left our group disappointed. We killed him in under one minute, and the adds that spawned were easily restrained and cleaved down while we focused on single-target DPS. The biggest threat we found to be the Strangler's poison cloud, but even then, the boss died so fast that it wasn't even a problem as the one DD that received the poison could easily sidestep it and continue to damage the boss at the same time.

Perhaps more Stranglers could be added to make the fight more interesting (or maybe the Strangler could add a poison DoT to someone, instead of just around them, with the ticks increasing in potency the longer it is alive), or the adds could have some added mechanics/buffs/dish out some debuffs to make them more of a threat.

(As a side-note: Can we please have a Mathgamain mount?

)

Caillaoife
This one was a lot more fun and interesting than the previous.
She hits hard, so the group needs to be aware of her positioning to avoid taking unnecessary damage. The Tank also has an important job as well, as the adds hit pretty hard, too, plus need to be taken out of the protective forest so they can be dispatched as quickly as possible. The boss is also immune to taunt while she is in the forest, so everyone will need to be aware of this and prepare accordingly while killing the adds. The Stranglers and their poison clouds are great here as well- something else to look out for amidst the rest of the chaos. Very nice for a second boss, and I think an appropriate step up from the first difficulty-wise.

Stoneheart
Pretty cool boss graphics and animation-wise, but overall not very exciting: kill Atro > DPS boss > DPS boss + Atro if he happens to teleport close to one > rinse and repeat. At around 5% it looked like he was in the process of waking all of the atros in the room, but he died before they came to life. Maybe he could do this mechanic at a higher HP % to make it more of a challenge?

I also enjoyed how the key mechanic of this fight (kill Atros) is sort of a "warm-up" for the next boss, and again how the Tank has an important role in kiting the boss's ground fire around out of melee.

(Another side-note: Loved the boss's voice acting.)

Galchobhar
See above!

Gherig Bullblood and His Attendants
Pretty "meh" overall, in my opinion. The most "challenging" mechanic here is the interrupts, and the nasty flame DoT that ticks pretty hard if the "chained" person fails to move quickly out of the circle after being freed- I would imagine this would wind up wiping some PUGs. There's also a big nasty AOE circle that expands from the main boss in the pack, but I don't know how hard it actually hits as it's easily avoided. Maybe this might also be a challenge for PUGs. Overall just another "stack and whack" fight.

Earthgore Amalgam
I have to say, I was extremely disappointed with this fight, especially after seeing how much HP it had with hard-mode. The ONLY threats here are environmental, and the boss(es) are completely irresistible to damage while the "ceiling cave-in" damage occurs. Also, I'm not 100% certain on this, but aside from the ceiling damage that targets and falls on top of players, the lava spawns (+ other ceiling AOE) appear to be completely random.

This makes for zero "use" of team coordination and skill, aside from where the Tank should re-position the boss after the lava spawns- it's just an RNG-fest.

Maybe some additional mechanics could be added to the "mini" spawns of the boss, and there could be some strategic placement of lava (for example of the latter- perhaps lava could spawn in the direction the boss is facing, and if lava is ever stacked, its total area is doubled or something, I dunno). Edit: After reviewing my video of this boss fight, it appears that the boss actually does do this already, or at least something along the lines of targeted placement, lol. Again, not 100% sure how it works, but if that is the case- very nice.

Overall, kind of a letdown as a final dungeon boss in my opinion. Galchobhar provides more of a challenge, and I think will be the "real" test for quite a few groups, and certainly all PUGs.

Other general notes
I enjoyed the "hints" that appeared in your death recap if you happened to die to a certain mechanic. This will really be helpful to new players, and players in general who might otherwise struggle to learn the mechanics.

Similar to the Imperial City and Shadows of the Hist dungeons, I don't think this will be "PUG-able" by your average-ish group.

I am disappointed that the skin associated with this dungeon appears to only be available through the Crown Store. I really hope that this will be changed so that it is unlocked through completing certain dungeon achievements.

I would say that this dungeon sort of "builds up" to Galchobhar in terms of difficulty, and then winds down with the last two bosses, which, for me, was a bit of a let-down. I understand that the difficulty of dungeons shouldn't be such that the majority of the community cannot complete them, but even still, I wish the last boss would require something more of your team than simply staying out of red and not standing too close to lava.

Cellentel · July 2017

Did you enjoy this new dungeon?

Yes. The environment was great and the bosses were fun. I enjoyed the fights much more than I do the Hist ones - you're encouraged to follow the mechanics without the heavy handedness of forced helplessness.
Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?

Vet. We attempted hardmore but eventually got tired and did non hardmode.
How did the difficulty compare to existing dungeons on Normal and Veteran versions?

Non-HM, it felt on par with the Hist dungeons and harder than everything else. HM seems quite difficult, although a good portion of that is us not understanding the mechanics yet.
Which was your favorite boss in this dungeon, and why?

Galchobhar. This guy took us quite a few attempts to beat. We figured out the geyser mechanic pretty quickly with the help of Death Recap, but it took us longer to figure out the right way to deal with the adds. We tried both slow burn and fast burn; ultimately slow burn seemed to work better.

We also wiped repeatedly because for some reason our default action after the big AoE was to jump back onto the main island immediately. This did not end well.
What level and build was the character you used?

We used our live characters. Mine was a CP660 Warden Tank (Plague Doctor + War Machine). The Warden worked great in there because so much could be absorbed by the ice shield.
Do you have any other general feedback?

We burned through the first few bosses without really paying attention to the mechanics. Starting with Galchobhar, though, I felt that the difficult was good - burning seems possible, but painful until you really know what you're doing. Mobs in the trash fights hit really hard, but we still didn't figure out the mechanics on how to fight them until Galchobhar (it didn't help that Death Recap wasn't working for several of us).

The placement of the scroll at the final boss was a bit confusing since there's another boss in the same location immediately before it. We didn't know that there was another boss and thus spent a lot of time looking for the scroll.

During the final boss, we had the lava spawn on top of the synergy used to remove the lava. This seems mean.

code65536 · July 2017

I went back into Bloodroot today. The dungeon up to the final boss seems much easier the second time through, now that I know the mechanics and strategies.

This time, we did the final boss with HM (last time, due to time constraints, we didn't even attempt HM), and I have to say, vet HM is actually hard. It felt comparable to SotH levels of difficulty.

Vet vs. Vet HM in Bloodroot is a sharp contrast to Vet vs. Vet HM in Falkreath. In Falkreath, HM felt exactly like non-HM, and having two fewer pillars was a non-issue. In contrast, in Bloodroot, HM was a completely different fight. Without the synergies, the fight was very different and quickly became very chaotic, particularly if the lava was shooting fireballs during a cave-in.
The way I would describe it, HM/non-HM in vFH was like HM/non-HM in vICP--there's barely any increase in difficulty, whereas HM/non-HM in vBF is like HM/non-HM in the SotH dungeons, where activating HM resulted in a very noticeable spike in difficulty and a fight that felt substantially different.
We're not sure if we're missing some mechanic to stop or otherwise avoid the lava fireballs--we just healed/dodged/shielded through it.
It took us a number of attempts, but we cleared vet HM. It just took practice with avoiding damage amidst all the chaos and mayhem. It was pretty satisfying, though, much more so than the non-HM version.

Avran_Sylt · July 2017

Note: This was just a run-through of the dungeon, not a run-through of mechanics

Did you enjoy this new dungeon?
-Yeah, it was a very interesting dungeon, seemed to have more interesting high-rank NPC's (FireHide,Earthgorer).
- The level design was very cool, I did have a few gripes with that (which I'll describe in general Feedback)
-The Bosses had some very cool attacks

How did the difficulty compare to existing dungeons on Normal and Veteran versions?
- It seemed harder than non-dlc dungeons, but seemed easier than dlc dungeons

Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?
- Normal - Solo - Reached Last Boss (Attendent of Flame Shackling Ability -> Flames of Retribution kept me from completing it)

Which was your favorite boss in this dungeon, and why?
- From a Normal Solo standpoint, Caillaoife. Overall just a cool boss that brings in a respectable amount of adds over time, keeping ya on your toes.

What level and build was the character you used?
- CP660, but using a Live Stamblade (Torug's,Selene,Red Mountain)

Do you have any other general feedback?

When I first entered the dungeon, and saw the nearby hills, I thought: Oooh! I wonder if they've hidden any sacks/chests/books or put any small little resting points that npc's might have frequented

Unfortunately it was just sheer unpassable invisible walls that lead up there, so no cool views or exploring the area

After defeating Stoneheart, I noticed several ledges with what appeared to be camps, and I thought: Oooh! I wonder if there's a way to get up there, maybe there's an optional mini-boss or two?

But alas it's just some visual flair

Few protruding objects I noticed:

The Eruption caused by the Earthgorer seems better suited to be on the Firehide. The Large ground AoE of the Firehide seems better suited to the ground smash of the Earthgorer

I'll be providing more feedback on additional runs with groups.

Masel · July 2017

Did you enjoy this new dungeon?

Yep, I did. More fun than the other one.

•How did the difficulty compare to existing dungeons on Normal and Veteran versions?

Ehm as we only did veteran on HM three times, I can't comment on Normal.

First
•Did you complete Normal or Veteran (or both)?
Only veteran with Hardmode

•Which was your favorite boss in this dungeon, and why?

Galchobhar. A lot of mechanics that you need to follow that were killing you if you didn't follow them. After that the last one. On Hardmode it's a pure DPS race and also RNG based depending on where the lava lands, but other than that, very satisfying fight that required good positioning in the room.

•What level and build was the character you used?

CPmaxed, Magicka Sorcerer, Magicka DK, Magicka Nightblade. Ran through 3 times.

•Do you have any other general feedback?

This dungeon is longer than the other one. And the 20 Minute timer for the speed run seems veeeeery short. You can barely run through it in that time.

code65536 · July 2017

Added additional mechanics for the Earthgore Amalgam when Hard Mode is activated.

Earthgore HM was already the harder of the two hardmodes. It's the HM that actually feels substantially harder (and different) compared to its non-HM counterpart.

In contrast, Falkreath HM is easier, and, most importantly, it didn't feel any different from non-HM.

So, given two HMs, one of them is harder and a noticeable step up from non-HM, and the other is easier and virtually the same as non-HM, you decide to buff the former and not the latter?

Since my friends and I no longer have our characters on the PTS, it's unlikely we'll be able to get in to test this change (or even see what this cryptic new mechanic is), but when we ran Bloodroot HM on the PTS a couple of weeks ago, we felt that it was in a good place difficulty-wise. I'm concerned that you're overtuning it with this change.

Reorx_Holybeard · August 2017

Looks like a fun dungeon and can't wait to try it on veteran:

Soloed on normal up to the Attendant of Flame/Blood boss. Definitely harder than Falkreath but in general easier than nCOA2 and all the DLC dungeons.
Caillaoife took a few tries to figure out how to survive but not too bad once you figure out the basics. The power attack from the large hounds has a very large range and sometimes they turn to face you right when they perform it which is a little unexpected (i.e., they'll start their power attack, you move to the side but they keep facing their original direction, right when they perform the PA they immediately turn to face you resulting in death if you aren't blocking).
Loved the area of the Galchobhar fight.
Couldn't figure out the mechanic of the Attendant of Flame/Blood boss. Unsure if I was just dying to their normal DPS or if I was dying to the mechanic. There seems to be a glowing area of affect around the blood/flame altars that only appears after you die. Only tried it a dozen times so can't really say it is too difficult to figure out just yet.