Proc sets need to go!!!

Ectheliontnacil

(From a pvp perspective):

With the sustain changes that came with Morrowind, proc sets are more of an issue than ever. Since it's harder to sustain, builds had to sacrifice some damage so they wouldn't run out of resources. Here proc sets with their "Build your character as tanky and sustainable as possible cuz with a proc set you hit hard anyway" attitude come as a godsend. They are now stupidly op, especially in no cp environements like battlegrounds.

Proc sets need to be nerfed or removed from the game, because at this point it's hard to play successfully without them.

Imo some of the worst proc sets that need to be addressed asap are:

vipers sting
selene
tremorscale
and velidreth

STEVIL

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

(From a pvp perspective):

With the sustain changes that came with Morrowind, proc sets are more of an issue than ever. Since it's harder to sustain, builds had to sacrifice some damage so they wouldn't run out of resources. Here proc sets with their "Build your character as tanky and sustainable as possible cuz with a proc set you hit hard anyway" attitude come as a godsend. They are now stupidly op, especially in no cp environements like battlegrounds.

Proc sets need to be nerfed or removed from the game, because at this point it's hard to play successfully without them.

Imo some of the worst proc sets that need to be addressed asap are:

vipers sting
selene
tremorscale
and velidreth

if this is to be limited to PVP perspective, should it not be posted in the pvp combat section?

CavalryPK

I made few posts asking for help in changing my play style to fight stambaldes running selen/viper. Got few ppl who gave me good pointers. and i spent hours practicing against viper selen builds.

I did not improve what so ever.

The Uninvited

Agreed, only as long as the nerfs ONLY affect PVP and not PVE.

Ectheliontnacil

@The Uninvited

Yup, that's fine with me. In pve there's other options and who cares if players kill the mobs with broken sets right? Its not like they're gonna complain^^.

Chilly-McFreeze

STEVIL wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

(From a pvp perspective):

With the sustain changes that came with Morrowind, proc sets are more of an issue than ever. Since it's harder to sustain, builds had to sacrifice some damage so they wouldn't run out of resources. Here proc sets with their "Build your character as tanky and sustainable as possible cuz with a proc set you hit hard anyway" attitude come as a godsend. They are now stupidly op, especially in no cp environements like battlegrounds.

Proc sets need to be nerfed or removed from the game, because at this point it's hard to play successfully without them.

Imo some of the worst proc sets that need to be addressed asap are:

vipers sting
selene
tremorscale
and velidreth

if this is to be limited to PVP perspective, should it not be posted in the pvp combat section?

Aren't we in the PVP Combat & Skills section?

@ OP, I agree with you. The recent changes were intended to create a balance between survivability, sustain and damage. With simply slotting proc sets I couldn't care less about my wpn dmg and max stam.
I didn't counted but it feels like 75%+ of my death recaps have one or more procs in it. Funny thing is, when some extrem high pvp rank guy wipes the floor with me, most of the times I don't see any of this cheese sets.

So what is your suggestion to tone them down in PvP and let them untouched everywhere else. The chance to "proc sets can't crit" had negative effects on PvE. So would if they link the proc strength to max resources and dmg stats.
Add another layer to the battle spirit to reduce there damage again by some margin? Add global cooldown to offensive procs? Make it impossible to wear multiple proc sets simultaneously?

olsborg

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

(From a pvp perspective):

With the sustain changes that came with Morrowind, proc sets are more of an issue than ever. Since it's harder to sustain, builds had to sacrifice some damage so they wouldn't run out of resources. Here proc sets with their "Build your character as tanky and sustainable as possible cuz with a proc set you hit hard anyway" attitude come as a godsend. They are now stupidly op, especially in no cp environements like battlegrounds.

Proc sets need to be nerfed or removed from the game, because at this point it's hard to play successfully without them.

Imo some of the worst proc sets that need to be addressed asap are:

vipers sting
selene
tremorscale
and velidreth

Also valkyn skoria and widowmaker.

Strider_Roshin

Add Grothdar, and Skoria to that list.

Ectheliontnacil

@Chilly-McFreeze

Awesome comment! I also really liked some of the ideas you had on how to balance proc sets. Personally I dislike the whole concept of light attacking and dealing a ton of dmg for free, so I'd suggest turning them into dots, in a way that wouldn't impact pve. (like vicecannon or sheer venom).

Or like you said they could be tied to max resources/damage pools but that would still make them insanely op on burst builds since you just get a free and very high damage source, but it would certainly be an improvement .

Ectheliontnacil

@Strider_Roshin and @olsborg


Hahah yes, the list is a long one. Almost all of the proc sets in game need to be addressed in some way just wanted to give you a couple of the most annoying ones ^^.

CyrusArya

The flaw with your argument is that there is a very real opportunity cost in choosing Selene/veil/tremor over troll/blood spawn/ pirate. Also, procs alone without a strong build around it won't carry anyone against decent players. Can't build 'tanky as possible' and be carried by procs alone. That's hyperbole.

At any rate it's not proc sets that an issue as much as stacking em. Also, the fact that you don't list skoria reveals your bias when that's one of the strongest ones.

Ectheliontnacil

@CyrusArya

1. There is no flaw in my argument, the amount of burst you gain by slotting a proc set e.g selenes/scoria/viper. Is completely disproportional to the amount of burst you would get by slotting a top tier damage set like spriggans/hundings/necropotence. So for the same amount of burst a non-proc set builds needs to spec a lot more into damage (and you probably still wouldn't have the same burst), whereas a proc build can run sustain/damage mitigation sets along his proc set and still achieve the same amount of burst damage
2. Agree, the stacking of proc sets is the main issue probably...very hard to survive a viper+selene proc
3. I just listed a couple of them, the ones that are worst in my opinion since they are very easy to proc. Skoria is powerful, but you need to apply dots to an enemy and it will still take a couple seconds to proc, so there is counter play. Viper and veli on the other hand have an almost guaranteed proc chance when ganking someone or going for a quick burst combo . If anything the fact that you pointed out scoria shows your bias

Waffennacht

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

@CyrusArya

1. There is no flaw in my argument, the amount of burst you gain by slotting a proc set e.g selenes/scoria/viper. Is completely disproportional to the amount of burst you would get by slotting a top tier damage set like spriggans/hundings/necropotence. So for the same amount of burst a non-proc set builds needs to spec a lot more into damage (and you probably still wouldn't have the same burst), whereas a proc build can run sustain/damage mitigation sets along his proc set and still achieve the same amount of burst damage
2. Agree, the stacking of proc sets is the main issue probably...very hard to survive a viper+selene proc
3. I just listed a couple of them, the ones that are worst in my opinion since they are very easy to proc. Skoria is powerful, but you need to apply dots to an enemy and it will still take a couple seconds to proc, so there is counter play. Viper and veli on the other hand have an almost guaranteed proc chance when ganking someone or going for a quick burst combo . If anything the fact that you pointed out scoria shows your bias

Also, skoria has a difficult proc, and I think the ONLY proc set that it can stack with for magicka would be Winterborn, which has an even more difficult set of standards to proc.

Plus, ya know, skoria has an animation

Xvorg

Waffennacht wrote: »

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

@CyrusArya

1. There is no flaw in my argument, the amount of burst you gain by slotting a proc set e.g selenes/scoria/viper. Is completely disproportional to the amount of burst you would get by slotting a top tier damage set like spriggans/hundings/necropotence. So for the same amount of burst a non-proc set builds needs to spec a lot more into damage (and you probably still wouldn't have the same burst), whereas a proc build can run sustain/damage mitigation sets along his proc set and still achieve the same amount of burst damage
2. Agree, the stacking of proc sets is the main issue probably...very hard to survive a viper+selene proc
3. I just listed a couple of them, the ones that are worst in my opinion since they are very easy to proc. Skoria is powerful, but you need to apply dots to an enemy and it will still take a couple seconds to proc, so there is counter play. Viper and veli on the other hand have an almost guaranteed proc chance when ganking someone or going for a quick burst combo . If anything the fact that you pointed out scoria shows your bias

Also, skoria has a difficult proc, and I think the ONLY proc set that it can stack with for magicka would be Winterborn, which has an even more difficult set of standards to proc.

Plus, ya know, skoria has an animation

And winterborn proc rate is a little more than a half of selene proc rate

But you know "VD too OP"...

DeHei

Best Option would be super strong PvP only Sets without any proccs, but much much damage reduction with increasing your output together. There wouldn't be any discussions anymore about Monster- and proccsets.. It worked in WoW too and was a good deal.

I know Nightblades with heavy armor and this sets together: Warriors Fury and Seventh Legion brute... They dont need to do much. Normally they wear 2x 1H Axes for Dual wield and 1x 2H Axe.. They just stack the buffs on that sets and spamming some skills.. the bleedingeffect will kill you..

overclocker303b14_ESO

The Uninvited wrote: »

Agreed, only as long as the nerfs ONLY affect PVP and not PVE.

THIS.

I'm tired of getting nerfed in PVE because people are upset about dying in PVP.

I spent a lot of time getting a devines velidreth helm. Having it nerfed or removed from the game would be BS.

At this point I feel like they have done more than enough to appease PVP players at the expense of PVE players. Some PVP players continue to complain. Some will always complain. Nobody is putting a gun to your head and making you play PVP in ESO. If you are that unhappy about the game the way it is go find something else to complain about.

QuebraRegra

get ger grubby nerf mitts off my Bahrahas Curse PVE set! Don't even think about it

Sandman929

I still don't understand the "don't nerf PvE for PvP" attitude. Every single aspect of PvE is scripted and can be changed as needed. If some massive change happened for the sake of PvP balance, couldn't they just tweak the robot enemies to accommodate?

CyrusArya

The point I'm trying to make is, you are not gonna kill any decent players running no damage outside of proc sets, unless you stack them. You are exaggerating the issue. A single proc set on its own is by no means over powered or difficult to deal with, and it will not carry anyone. Strong yes, overpowered to the extent you claim..no. It only becomes an issue when you stack them.

Also, skoria absolutely is as strong as stamina proc sets as it cannot be avoided and is ranged, and procs at a very healthy rate with just a few dots.

Ectheliontnacil

@overclocker303b14_ESO

Lol brah, they've been trying to please the PVE overlords since launch. its pvp players that have to deal with broken stuff, its pvp players that have to endure lag, bugs, fps drops etc....

PVE is not and will never be broken the way pvp is, so don't hate on this discussion just because you don't play pvp.

Ectheliontnacil

@QuebraRegra

Hahaha I don't want to change Baharas, dw man

CavalryPK

I would say the following: regarding viper + selen

A bad player with 2 proc sets - you are fine... they will die anyways.

2 bad players with 2 procs sets ---- ugh... no comment....

Average player with 2 proc sets - watch out... and be carful.

Good player with 2 proc sets - super carful and hope that selen does not proc when you are incaped.

mook-eb16_ESO

When Selenes is doing higher damage than the ulti that preceeded it, there's a problem.

Ectheliontnacil

@CavalryPK

A selene+viper+heavy attack+incap gank is something that you can pull of in a splittsecond, it doesn't matter if you are skilled or (cuz stun from stealth or incap) and this combo is in most cases over 20k damage. Your average light/medium armour build cant take that kind of gank, skill really doesn't matter here

Ectheliontnacil

@mook-eb16_ESO

mook-eb16_ESO wrote: »

When Selenes is doing higher damage than the ulti that preceeded it, there's a problem.

Precisely!!!!

Qbiken

The horse isn´t even dead anymore. It´s vaporized

leepalmer95

I'd like them to nerf individual proc sets in order to not kill off the already unused ones but i doubt they'll do that.

Stick in battle spirit damage done by sets reduced by 30%. Done.

FlyLionel

leepalmer95 wrote: »

I'd like them to nerf individual proc sets in order to not kill off the already unused ones but i doubt they'll do that.

Stick in battle spirit damage done by sets reduced by 30%. Done.

Exactly what I had in mind, proc sets can crit for PVE sake....Battle spirit is applied to proc sets..universal cooldown or whatever they find best.

Ectheliontnacil

leepalmer95 wrote: »

I'd like them to nerf individual proc sets in order to not kill off the already unused ones but i doubt they'll do that.

Stick in battle spirit damage done by sets reduced by 30%. Done.

@leepalmer95

I like that idea

Lets hope they do something about it

The Uninvited

Sandman929 wrote: »

I still don't understand the "don't nerf PvE for PvP" attitude. Every single aspect of PvE is scripted and can be changed as needed. If some massive change happened for the sake of PvP balance, couldn't they just tweak the robot enemies to accommodate?

They could, but they never do.

Waffennacht

leepalmer95 wrote: »

I'd like them to nerf individual proc sets in order to not kill off the already unused ones but i doubt they'll do that.

Stick in battle spirit damage done by sets reduced by 30%. Done.

I like it!

@leepalmer95 on second thought, no I don't because every idea the community likes and agrees on is a sure fire way to make​ sure it doesn't happen