Does the Nord need a buff?

Strider_Roshin

I've always been a big fan of Nords, and I recommend them for my PvP builds for my stamblade, but I never see anyone suggest Nords for anything DPS related.

Essentially when the question is asked "Which race for stam DPS?"
I see Khajiit, Redguard, Orc, Imperial, Wood elf, and now I'm even seeing suggestions for Argonians for resource management purposes.

I never see Nords get recommended. Heck even as tanks I usually see people use either Imperials or Argonians.

Do you guys feel like Nords need an adjustment? I don't feel weak using one, but the lack of usage makes me wonder if an adjustment is needed.

Sheey

Yes. Nord needs to be increased mag and hp. Since we have imperial having max stam and hp already.

Sheey

Nord also should be like dumner increasing frostdamage by 7%

Baconlad

Resource mangement is becoming king.

Therefore any race with nothing to offer for resource regen is considered bad. The exception is magic races but magic in general relies on less recovery than stamina.

Personally i would recomend you pick the most badass race that speaks to you. A race whos butt you could enjoy watching shake around for hours on end, its why so many male players play female toons...they like their butts

cheemers

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

I've always been a big fan of Nords, and I recommend them for my PvP builds for my stamblade, but I never see anyone suggest Nords for anything DPS related.

Essentially when the question is asked "Which race for stam DPS?"
I see Khajiit, Redguard, Orc, Imperial, Wood elf, and now I'm even seeing suggestions for Argonians for resource management purposes.

I never see Nords get recommended. Heck even as tanks I usually see people use either Imperials or Argonians.

Do you guys feel like Nords need an adjustment? I don't feel weak using one, but the lack of usage makes me wonder if an adjustment is needed.

I don't think Nords are particularly underpowered compared to the other races. I don't think people quite realise that "6% reduction in damage taken" can be translated as "6% extra health, 6% extra healing taken, 6% extra health recovery". I think the problem with Nords is that they don't excel at any one thing - they are very good at stamina pvp builds, especially with the +20% health recovery making them very strong troll king users, but they aren't the top of the table PvE DPS, tanks, or healers, meaning they get neglected slightly from that front. Nords are the tankiest race, but tanks in ESO are all about group support and sustain rather than self-survival.

LadyLavina

My Nord tank would disagree. Don't take away my extra HP

KeiruNicrom

Nords are definately the weakest race since all they have is defensive passives and they arent even that noticable in a fight partly due to how easily one can reach high damage reduction on any race. They need a damage increasing passive of some sort or a unique proc passive like redguard, imperial, and argonians have.

Asardes

Actually the damage reduction passive is kinda weak. If it stacked properly with minor/major protection and CP mitigation it would be much better.

klowdy1

2h weapon line increase is OP. Seriously though, some kind of damage passive would be nice. I love my viking stamplar, but my redguard does better with sustain, so what's the point of pushing a sub optimal character if I have one that works better.

As for the nords tank response from LadyLavina, no one said anything about taking away any traits. If they would actually do this, I would hope they would drop one of the less useful traits.

neverwalk

nords needs cold damage and jarrin root for bow.

scipionumatia

agreed nords need a buff. i think they should keep max health/recovery, and reduce incoming damage. id like to see a "reduce stam cost" or a +X bonus to max stam & mag, even recovery would be sweet.
i would really like to have nords be a race you could play reliably as stam or mag and have the option to play either kinda like argonians, but more attractive :P

Strider_Roshin

LadyLavina wrote: »

My Nord tank would disagree. Don't take away my extra HP

I have a Nord tank as well, and it works wonderfully with my health regen build. I wouldn't dare ask for anything to be taken away. Don't worry.

notimetocare

Nope,fine as is. A bit less max stats with dmg reduction. I play a nord sorc just fine

idk

I wouldn't expect a class with damage reduction to be considered often for dps builds.

I'd say it's better suited for tanking but again, not my first or second choice. Maybe it should be buffed so it would be consider more often as a solid tank class as it's is clearly design for.

I heard Nords are milk drinkers. I think an argonian told me that.

Strider_Roshin

I think if they were to add anything it should go along with the "Tough Warrior" persona they have going on with the Nords. I was thinking they could go one of two directions with it:

1) Increased damage by X% for Y seconds after receiving damage. This would work similar to the Wrath passive. Personally I think the amount should be 5 or 6% for 2/3 seconds. This way it's stronger than the Orc passive, but more situational.

2) Restore magicka and stamina by X amount for Y seconds after taking damage with a cool down. This would be analogous to the Constitution passive, and would be beneficial to both tanks, and DPS. My only concern is this type of passive might make tank builds stronger than they already are in PvP so I would prefer the first option.

casparian

cheemers wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

I've always been a big fan of Nords, and I recommend them for my PvP builds for my stamblade, but I never see anyone suggest Nords for anything DPS related.

Essentially when the question is asked "Which race for stam DPS?"
I see Khajiit, Redguard, Orc, Imperial, Wood elf, and now I'm even seeing suggestions for Argonians for resource management purposes.

I never see Nords get recommended. Heck even as tanks I usually see people use either Imperials or Argonians.

Do you guys feel like Nords need an adjustment? I don't feel weak using one, but the lack of usage makes me wonder if an adjustment is needed.

I don't think Nords are particularly underpowered compared to the other races. I don't think people quite realise that "6% reduction in damage taken" can be translated as "6% extra health, 6% extra healing taken, 6% extra health recovery". I think the problem with Nords is that they don't excel at any one thing - they are very good at stamina pvp builds, especially with the +20% health recovery making them very strong troll king users, but they aren't the top of the table PvE DPS, tanks, or healers, meaning they get neglected slightly from that front. Nords are the tankiest race, but tanks in ESO are all about group support and sustain rather than self-survival.

Here is a great discussion of the Nord passive for anyone curious.

WalksonGraves

If the dr passive was doubled it might actually be noticeable.

subtlezeroub17_ESO

And you people still won't admit that racials are a hindrance to the game...

Reivax

Nord racials should be fun. Like when drinking a potion in combat, your Nord throws the empty bottle at the enemy and knock him off balance.
Or a super power where the Nord whistles and his goat comes and butts the enemy.
Something fun.
Not everything needs to be some flavorless stat +/-

Strider_Roshin

It just would be nice if they would actually be considered a viable race for PvE DPS. With that said, I do believe that they're the best stam race for PvP, and the best tank race. I suppose I'm just being greedy. Thanks for the replies everyone

Anti_Virus

Yes but not too much now.

Also the best Stam races are Imperial Redguard and Orc just putting it out there( My opinion doe)

Megabear

I don't think Nord needs a buff. What Nord needs is a makeover.

kaorunandrak

cheemers wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

I've always been a big fan of Nords, and I recommend them for my PvP builds for my stamblade, but I never see anyone suggest Nords for anything DPS related.

Essentially when the question is asked "Which race for stam DPS?"
I see Khajiit, Redguard, Orc, Imperial, Wood elf, and now I'm even seeing suggestions for Argonians for resource management purposes.

I never see Nords get recommended. Heck even as tanks I usually see people use either Imperials or Argonians.

Do you guys feel like Nords need an adjustment? I don't feel weak using one, but the lack of usage makes me wonder if an adjustment is needed.

I don't think Nords are particularly underpowered compared to the other races. I don't think people quite realise that "6% reduction in damage taken" can be translated as "6% extra health, 6% extra healing taken, 6% extra health recovery". I think the problem with Nords is that they don't excel at any one thing - they are very good at stamina pvp builds, especially with the +20% health recovery making them very strong troll king users, but they aren't the top of the table PvE DPS, tanks, or healers, meaning they get neglected slightly from that front. Nords are the tankiest race, but tanks in ESO are all about group support and sustain rather than self-survival.

The problem with that is the 6% damage reduction is reduced by your armor, it's not like the Major/minor Protection once your reach cap that 6% goes away making it useless

GreenSoup2HoT

Nords dont get a buff until Imperial Red DAMN DIAMOND GETS A REWORK!

Nemesis7884

cheemers wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

I've always been a big fan of Nords, and I recommend them for my PvP builds for my stamblade, but I never see anyone suggest Nords for anything DPS related.

Essentially when the question is asked "Which race for stam DPS?"
I see Khajiit, Redguard, Orc, Imperial, Wood elf, and now I'm even seeing suggestions for Argonians for resource management purposes.

I never see Nords get recommended. Heck even as tanks I usually see people use either Imperials or Argonians.

Do you guys feel like Nords need an adjustment? I don't feel weak using one, but the lack of usage makes me wonder if an adjustment is needed.

I don't think Nords are particularly underpowered compared to the other races. I don't think people quite realise that "6% reduction in damage taken" can be translated as "6% extra health, 6% extra healing taken, 6% extra health recovery". I think the problem with Nords is that they don't excel at any one thing - they are very good at stamina pvp builds, especially with the +20% health recovery making them very strong troll king users, but they aren't the top of the table PvE DPS, tanks, or healers, meaning they get neglected slightly from that front. Nords are the tankiest race, but tanks in ESO are all about group support and sustain rather than self-survival.

in the past the way this 6% was calculated afaik it was way les than that...now everything is additive, maybe this too?

But i too think the nord has the weakest sets of benefits and could use a buff...e.g. frost damage plus, stamina recovery or increase the bonus to health/stamina or some sort of physical damage bonus....

Honestly to me it is alos INCREDIBLY weird and inconstistant WHY an imperial should have the highest bonus to stamina and health and a higher one that a nord...it just makes no sense lorewise

I do think imperials need a rework cause they bonus is just really lore unfriendly...and i do think nords need a rework cause their bonus makes them the least attractive (and probably leaast utilized) race.....

a cool bonus imo could be what the warden was taken away - a bonus to physical and cold damage....

MyKillv2.0

Nords are just fine, 9health 6%sta, 6mit is perfectly fine for being a Tanky race. I hope they do not change anything.

If anything, I wish they would give Imperials Magic bonus too. Makes no sense to me to pay extra money to play a race that gives me no advantage as a magic user since the game leans heavily in that regard

sneakymitchell

If you say give 3% melee damage like orc since orcs got healing received for no reason.

Bobby_V_Rockit

Nah, they always brag about how great they are and how weak other races are. *** 'em.

binaryAegis

kaorunandrak wrote: »

The problem with that is the 6% damage reduction is reduced by your armor, it's not like the Major/minor Protection once your reach cap that 6% goes away making it useless

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

in the past the way this 6% was calculated afaik it was way les than that...now everything is additive, maybe this too?

The 6% scales multiplicatively, but that doesn't make it as bad as many people make it out to be, and contrary to popular belief it's effectiveness isn't reduced as you increase your mitigation from other sources. Casparian already linked to my reddit thread that explains all the math behind this (This one), but the TL;DR is that, regardless of whatever other armor or mitigation your character has, the 6% damage reduction you get from Rugged will always give you the effective equivalent of 6.38% increased Max Health, Healing Received, Damage Shield Strength, and Health Recovery. Factored in with their other passives Nords effectively get:

• 15.95% increased Max Health
• 27.65% increased Health Recovery
• 6.38% Increased Healing Received
• 6.38% increased Damage Shield Strength
• 6% increased Max Stamina
• 2079 extra Cold Resist

Joy_Division

binaryAegis wrote: »

kaorunandrak wrote: »

The problem with that is the 6% damage reduction is reduced by your armor, it's not like the Major/minor Protection once your reach cap that 6% goes away making it useless

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

in the past the way this 6% was calculated afaik it was way les than that...now everything is additive, maybe this too?

The 6% scales multiplicatively, but that doesn't make it as bad as many people make it out to be, and contrary to popular belief it's effectiveness isn't reduced as you increase your mitigation from other sources. Casparian already linked to my reddit thread that explains all the math behind this (This one), but the TL;DR is that, regardless of whatever other armor or mitigation your character has, the 6% damage reduction you get from Rugged will always give you the effective equivalent of 6.38% increased Max Health, Healing Received, Damage Shield Strength, and Health Recovery. Factored in with their other passives Nords effectively get:

• 15.95% increased Max Health
• 27.65% increased Health Recovery
• 6.38% Increased Healing Received
• 6.38% increased Damage Shield Strength
• 6% increased Max Stamina
• 2079 extra Cold Resist

The Nord racial passive isn't as good as you are making it out to be.

You want to say the that passive reduces the damage a nord would have taken by 6%, but that is disingenuous, because it's 6% of a (potentially a lot) lower value from the original hit. Orcs, Altmer, Dunmer, Khajiit, and other classes with damage passives do not have their racials compromised or undermined in this way. In fact their passives become even better the more damage they do.

I play a nord templar that had Channeled Focus (minor protection), Vampire (undeath passive), Empowering Sweeps (15+X targets % reduction) and wore Reactive or Cyrodiil Light Armor (conditional 35% or 15%) plus various champion Point damage reductions and the passive was marginal. Damage dealing racials are rewarded for tailoring their builds to the passive, Nords (and Bretons) are punished.

As far as your example of effective health and how the 30K health Nord survives 1 more hit than the 30K health Imperial, that's also disingenuous because your hypothetical completely ignores the Imperial's Red Diamond Racial. Why is the Imperial AFK and thus not able to use her health restoring passive? Because you want a selective corner case that speciously reinforces your hypothesis. As a melee Templar, I would have more effective health with the Imperial Passive (that I still think has no cooldown) than I would the Nord.

A lot of us have been playing this game for three years. It's not like we overlooked some unappreciated power Nords have. The only recovery stat they have is health, which is by far the weakest of the three. Fire damage is ubiquitous in PvE and PvP.
Where is the content in ESO that features frost damage? Damage is king in ESO. Nords make decent tanks and are strong at Roleplaying, but way too often players are going to be better off picking something else

ofSunhold

I'd really prefer racial passives just be toned the f down across the board (I'm looking at you, Altmer) but it's a bit late for that I guess.

So yes. Nords need some love. They don't even have a niche, that one thing they're best at. I was kind of hoping it would be ice tanking.