Buff heavy armor with Wrath to have crit as well.

GreatGildersleeve

I think someone in ZoS HQ was watching a movie somewhere and thought 'hey. A berserker would be cool in game'. Problem is, Wrath does very little (in my experience tanking.) It was a mistake and should never have been put in there. I'd be fine removing it entirely. Tanks don't deal enough damage anyway...

Durham

Kay1 wrote: »

Heavy is perfect in the PTS

I think it was over nerfed like so much other stuff....

sneakymitchell

Durham wrote: »

Kay1 wrote: »

Heavy is perfect in the PTS

I think it was over nerfed like so much other stuff....

Yea and people in pvp will still hit each other like wet noodles. Even when using recovery and increase stat of the new food or drinks. Having burst in heavy armor can't be that bad. Helps pve players do a DPS build with them and also can manage to burst a player down if that one player is hitting him with a DoT. Or a wet noodle damage on the target.

MehrunesFlagon

pieratsos wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

I say no to this. Simply because I see nightmarish pug groups using heavy armor for dps. We already have *** doing this don't make it worse.

Would u want end game pve be simple skills and rotations with copy paste builds? In pvp u can run mostly any set up.

No you are right. We should make heavy armor the only setup for both end game PVE and PVP. Cause that makes much more sense.

Contrary to what you may think alot of people that seem to copy builds don't. I come up with some near identical builds without looking it up. Also last time I checked heavy dominated pvp. So that would just make matters worse there.

Hurika

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Durham wrote: »

Kay1 wrote: »

Heavy is perfect in the PTS

I think it was over nerfed like so much other stuff....

Yea and people in pvp will still hit each other like wet noodles. Even when using recovery and increase stat of the new food or drinks. Having burst in heavy armor can't be that bad. Helps pve players do a DPS build with them and also can manage to burst a player down if that one player is hitting him with a DoT. Or a wet noodle damage on the target.

I don't think you have any concept that having burst in heavy armor IS the problem. If you want to burst DPS then use armor focused on that. STOP trying to get HA to the point it has everything.

Xvorg

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Docmandu wrote: »

Somebody wants his cake and eat it too. Heavy = tanky option != DPS.

You can tank in medium armor if u wish. But u will be off tanking most likely.

WUT!!!

Sneaky-Snurr

Magıc wrote: »

Heavy armour should just be deleted from the game lol

@Magıc
That's not lore-friendly.

sneakymitchell

Xvorg wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Docmandu wrote: »

Somebody wants his cake and eat it too. Heavy = tanky option != DPS.

You can tank in medium armor if u wish. But u will be off tanking most likely.

WUT!!!

Look at some of the set bonuses for medium and tell me you can tank with it?

sneakymitchell

@MehrunesFlagon If you do make different builds then why not make a heavy armor DPS build? If you can't make that then there is an issue for diversity in this game.

Xvorg

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Docmandu wrote: »

Somebody wants his cake and eat it too. Heavy = tanky option != DPS.

You can tank in medium armor if u wish. But u will be off tanking most likely.

WUT!!!

Look at some of the set bonuses for medium and tell me you can tank with it?

No.

Those bonus are good for weapon and jewelry

Murador178

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Durham wrote: »

Kay1 wrote: »

Heavy is perfect in the PTS

I think it was over nerfed like so much other stuff....

Yea and people in pvp will still hit each other like wet noodles. Even when using recovery and increase stat of the new food or drinks. Having burst in heavy armor can't be that bad. Helps pve players do a DPS build with them and also can manage to burst a player down if that one player is hitting him with a DoT. Or a wet noodle damage on the target.

Hmm i didnt know my legion, trollking, fury/ravager stamblade hits like wet noodle(18k will crits)(11k suprise attack tooltip with bleed stacks)- it actually hits harder than medium nbs on the live servers(i mainly play medium just tested that setup), bc their is no medium armor set giving near the bonuses of ravager/fury or legion. Ontop of that u didnt need near as much stam reg on heavy on the live servers- rolldodge is damn expensive. So i rly hope that the heavy nerf makes heavy more like its intended: Tankier but not the same or more dmg. But when the OP wrote crit doesnt matter in PvP I knew he is pretty sure a PvE hero that didnt play cyro or duels alot .

tplink3r1

BohnT wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

@BohnT u forget that u can midigate crit with crit restiance. Probably if u go all crit on ur medium armor or light armor build like almost 100 restiant in the cp and enough for the rest u would probably feel like it in heavy but even though u don't have high resistance but u can midigate couple burst.

No there is around 8k resistance difference between MA and HA. HA is way too good in its current state and that is wrong so wrong.
Why would i waste 100cp to only lower ~30% of all incoming damage abilities if i can lower the damage of all abilities at the same time?

Additionally MA gets ~2400 crit rating with 7 pieces medium armor equipped why should heavy armor get almost the same value along with the other strong passives?

HA is fine and doesn't need any buffs. Ma and LA really do on the other side

*Source needed*

sneakymitchell

Xvorg wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Docmandu wrote: »

Somebody wants his cake and eat it too. Heavy = tanky option != DPS.

You can tank in medium armor if u wish. But u will be off tanking most likely.

WUT!!!

Look at some of the set bonuses for medium and tell me you can tank with it?

No.

Those bonus are good for weapon and jewelry

How about set ups that make you substain? Like witch mother set that gives you health and stam when using an ultimate? Combined that with werewolf hide and bam you can a tanky set up rolling. And also look up ward of croydiil for medium but it mostly used for pvp. And also you can still combine some heavy like a 2 piece and jewelry. So many ways to tank in medium armor but some players are blind at these sets. And zenimax just throws it in cause it's like whatever.

Rinmaethodain

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

How about remove this wretched Wraith alltogether so the "nerf HA" PVPers threads will stop and PVE tanks will stop suffering from PVP nerfs with each patch?

I'm PvP'er and i want old HA back, what's wrong with me?:(

You are the shining ray of hope in the dark age of PVP

IxSTALKERxI

Why is this thread still on the front page?

sneakymitchell

@MaximusDargus True that. Why not let everyone wear heavy and let alone that next patch resource management will change. (In which it's whatever's) If players continue to just wear heavy its like players just hitting wet noddles with each other even if the battle was a long fight.

Xvorg

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

Docmandu wrote: »

Somebody wants his cake and eat it too. Heavy = tanky option != DPS.

You can tank in medium armor if u wish. But u will be off tanking most likely.

WUT!!!

Look at some of the set bonuses for medium and tell me you can tank with it?

No.

Those bonus are good for weapon and jewelry

How about set ups that make you substain? Like witch mother set that gives you health and stam when using an ultimate? Combined that with werewolf hide and bam you can a tanky set up rolling. And also look up ward of croydiil for medium but it mostly used for pvp. And also you can still combine some heavy like a 2 piece and jewelry. So many ways to tank in medium armor but some players are blind at these sets. And zenimax just throws it in cause it's like whatever.

Please, leave HA as it is now, it doesn't need any buff that later becomes an overnerf, because that's how thinks work with ZoS: a buff and a overnerf

Xvorg

sneakymitchell wrote: »

@MaximusDargus True that. Why not let everyone wear heavy and let alone that next patch resource management will change. (In which it's whatever's) If players continue to just wear heavy its like players just hitting wet noddles with each other even if the battle was a long fight.

I wear heavy and I don't hit with wet noodles. Maybe you are the problem...

acw37162

Ummmmmm, No.

sneakymitchell

@Xvorg like the resource management and mostly the nerf is cause of the cp. If they would nerf the cp and not nerf all armor passives then the resource management would be fine. And now we got a slight buff in resource management with heavy attacks being 30% if I'm correct but a 15% nerf in damage.

Xvorg

sneakymitchell wrote: »

@Xvorg like the resource management and mostly the nerf is cause of the cp. If they would nerf the cp and not nerf all armor passives then the resource management would be fine. And now we got a slight buff in resource management with heavy attacks being 30% if I'm correct but a 15% nerf in damage.

You missed the part were light attacks were buffed...

If you want to play smart, get a mag/stam regen weapon glyph. If you want to play smarter, get Torug's 5 pieces or an infused weapon with a mag/stam regen weapon glyph

getting ~400 res per LA each 2.4 secs is a good start

sneakymitchell

Xvorg wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

@MaximusDargus True that. Why not let everyone wear heavy and let alone that next patch resource management will change. (In which it's whatever's) If players continue to just wear heavy its like players just hitting wet noddles with each other even if the battle was a long fight.

I wear heavy and I don't hit with wet noodles. Maybe you are the problem...

You probably don't play a DK with Dual wield sword and board? We keep on being in endless fights cause heavy armor can't have enough burst. At least major defile has got increase to 55% so that way you will be able to kill those in pvp. But also you sometimes get health recovery builds that have so much health recovery that you can't do anything to them. It's better when heavy armor gets crit for pve wise. I'm not asking for pure damage like another 200 then it would be too much in pvp and the pvp players will complain even more on the issue.

sneakymitchell

Xvorg wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

@Xvorg like the resource management and mostly the nerf is cause of the cp. If they would nerf the cp and not nerf all armor passives then the resource management would be fine. And now we got a slight buff in resource management with heavy attacks being 30% if I'm correct but a 15% nerf in damage.

You missed the part were light attacks were buffed...

If you want to play smart, get a mag/stam regen weapon glyph. If you want to play smarter, get Torug's 5 pieces or an infused weapon with a mag/stam regen weapon glyph

getting ~400 res per LA each 2.4 secs is a good start

I know that it gets 15% increase and also bow attack charge time is 10% quicker and fire/ice is 12.5%.

MehrunesFlagon

sneakymitchell wrote: »

@MehrunesFlagon If you do make different builds then why not make a heavy armor DPS build? If you can't make that then their is an issue for diversity in this game.

If you look at alot of the sets. especially drop sets. Those that are heavy armor are pretty obviously suited for a tank, and not a dps.

sneakymitchell

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

sneakymitchell wrote: »

@MehrunesFlagon If you do make different builds then why not make a heavy armor DPS build? If you can't make that then there is an issue for diversity in this game.

If you look at alot of the sets. especially drop sets. Those that are heavy armor are pretty obviously suited for a tank, and not a dps.

And if you look at some other sets like the trail set berserking warrior that came from "Trail set". In which the set has no health bonus except for the jewelry which comes in healthy. Medium armor has things like witch mothers set and werewolf hide set. You can make a combination with it to make a tank set up for medium armor.

HeroOfNone

I don't feel damage is the way to go for heavy armor bonuses, but there needs to be a serious reduction in health bounce backs (the bane of slow go tanky builds) and there needs to be more utility. If bracing gave enemies minor defile for well timed bashed after blocking, or maybe something with increasing enemy CC cost, then it could find a more unique place in pvp. Adding more crit or more damage though leads us into the current state of PVP where everyone uses heavy armor.

sneakymitchell

HeroOfNone wrote: »

I don't feel damage is the way to go for heavy armor bonuses, but there needs to be a serious reduction in health bounce backs (the bane of slow go tanky builds) and there needs to be more utility. If bracing gave enemies minor defile for well timed bashed after blocking, or maybe something with increasing enemy CC cost, then it could find a more unique place in pvp. Adding more crit or more damage though leads us into the current state of PVP where everyone uses heavy armor.

Evergone use impenetrable in pvp. And probably stack crit restiance in the cp for pvp. So it won't matter if you just give them 1k crit to stack.

leepalmer95

sneakymitchell wrote: »

HeroOfNone wrote: »

I don't feel damage is the way to go for heavy armor bonuses, but there needs to be a serious reduction in health bounce backs (the bane of slow go tanky builds) and there needs to be more utility. If bracing gave enemies minor defile for well timed bashed after blocking, or maybe something with increasing enemy CC cost, then it could find a more unique place in pvp. Adding more crit or more damage though leads us into the current state of PVP where everyone uses heavy armor.

Evergone use impenetrable in pvp. And probably stack crit restiance in the cp for pvp. So it won't matter if you just give them 1k crit to stack.

You can crit heals.

Heavy doesn't need more dmg and more healing..

Impen reduced crit dmg not crit chance.

Even with crit resist cap (which literally no one has) crits will still deal around 25-35% more damage than normal hits.

sneakymitchell

@leepalmer95 Don't forget you can defile the user. And the befoul is going to be 55% instead of 25%. And there are plenty of sets in pvp that reduces healing a lot.

So you say that Crits hit more? Then mostly everyone goes for burst in pvp and the cp of ironclad will change so that way you can handle burst damage. Everyone complains about endless fights. Why not have more burst? It makes sense to do so to kill that annoying healer if they do or don't have heavy armor. Or maybe a medium or light armor just outburst you in a fight even with their burst heals as well?

Hurika

You realize being HA doesn't mean you should be able to burst anyone down. It's a mechanic meant to survive and provide utility, not to kill. Lost of people already do way too much damage in HA - maybe you should ask them in game what their setup is or use an armor type meant for dps if you want to dps. I honestly think the whole resource bonus from HA should be moved to MA/LA and HA should only have damage mitigation and bonus to healing recieved.