The answer to the op heals we have in cyro that make people unkillable

Minno

Minalan wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

Honestly, @Minno - in regards to block - I would love to see fully charged heavy attacks stagger blocking targets, with the addition that heavy attacks would be bashable and maybe only the melee ones would stagger.

I don't think I would like ranged stagger because then you can just make heavy attack troll stagger build from miles away - no risk and full reward. But in melee range you would be open to risk at least (ie. bashed).

The stagger effect already is in-game (dark adds wobbly orbs on twins in Maw, for example), it would just need to be attached to heavies.
You would have a counter to perma block, but be exposed to being bashed/interrupted so the other person has a counter too (while it would still drain their stam to do so).

We have an armor pen stat. Add a block pen stat that we can stack with armor and jewelry sets. Done. Block is nerfed for PVP but not for PVE (because monsters won't be wearing those sets). A DPS built to penetrate 40% of block is going to take a block tank down, but sacrifices something else. Sustain. Damage. Crit.

Damage Shields only need for the two big ones to be unstackable.

I have no idea what to do with healing other than reducing up front heal numbers, and adding cast times for bigger heals.

Dropping shuffle to 6-8 seconds is probably all that dodge roll needs. There are already so many AOE and undodgable attacks to choose from. It's not like Block or a double shield stack.

Adding a block dmg stat would be good. Though how many people are going to change their build to fight a block-plar? Lol. Enchants seem the best fit, and might directly combat any block enchant reductions.

Templars already do extra dmg on blocked enemies, it's a shame every dmg ability we own doesn't stack up to the burst versatility of a sorc or the raw dmg of a NB. Plus this templar passive does a small percentage (like 10%) so why bother? At block, if my dmg does 300 I get a puny 30 extras points? Absurd considering how much dmg block actually reduces lol. The passive should be a flat value, considering you can get an easy 50% dmg reduction by pressing the right mouse button.

Regarding shields, as much as healing ward is vital to some classes, having one that gives a burst heal is too much. They should change that morph to Grant a different status effect, because the shield itself should reduce dmg not give back healing. And yes they should only let you use one Shield at a time (maybe except DK who can only get a 3k value from their class Shields?). Shield breaker should be changed to Grant a chance to deal extra dmg, since it's tied to an easy light attack. Shield dmg CP star should get a buff considering it's locked in a tree that putting anything past 10-30 points in means you lose on dmg/healing from the other trees. And maybe nirnhoned should drop from overland sets?

Shuffle could be reduced in seconds. But I'd rather see it changed to give a stat+reduce the cost of an ability (similar to imovable from the HA line). It can be that while slotted, reduce the cost of dodge roll by 15% for one morph with an increased timer per medium armor piece and they either morph could return stamina each time you dodge an attack. Then change Dodge rolling to Grant a chance to ignore an attack instead of being able to dodge 100% attacks.

Minno

KingJ wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

WhiteMage wrote: »

Turns out those healbots are not only getting a massive increase to healing power through CP, they are also practically guaranteed a critical hit on them too!

To me it makes sense to reduce initial healing numbers further with the expectation that crit takes you alot further on healing than with damage. Having that 50% crit chance and Templar extra 10% crit dmg means my 8k BoL will do an easy 60% extra heal. You really can't get that increase any other way. Even with a base 50%, that heal goes along way compared to fighting an enemy in full impen.

In the end, I like risk/reward as a design intent. But being able to instant cast a heal from low health to full is indeed broken. If I am at 1% health, my BoL/Dragons blood should put me back to 40% or 50% health to escape being executed. But I should require a HOT or cast time health to regain the remaining amount.

Currently sorc/NB have a health locked behind either a stat conversation or based on the damage of an enemy (or path of movement). These are more interesting than a straight up instant heal.

As a NB I kinda want the straight up instant heal lol.

Lol I feel you. But at the same time, no one should receive a straight up instant heal without a sacrifice.

KingJ

Minno wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

WhiteMage wrote: »

Turns out those healbots are not only getting a massive increase to healing power through CP, they are also practically guaranteed a critical hit on them too!

To me it makes sense to reduce initial healing numbers further with the expectation that crit takes you alot further on healing than with damage. Having that 50% crit chance and Templar extra 10% crit dmg means my 8k BoL will do an easy 60% extra heal. You really can't get that increase any other way. Even with a base 50%, that heal goes along way compared to fighting an enemy in full impen.

In the end, I like risk/reward as a design intent. But being able to instant cast a heal from low health to full is indeed broken. If I am at 1% health, my BoL/Dragons blood should put me back to 40% or 50% health to escape being executed. But I should require a HOT or cast time health to regain the remaining amount.

Currently sorc/NB have a health locked behind either a stat conversation or based on the damage of an enemy (or path of movement). These are more interesting than a straight up instant heal.

As a NB I kinda want the straight up instant heal lol.

Lol I feel you. But at the same time, no one should receive a straight up instant heal without a sacrifice.

True a easier solution to all of this is maybe remove major mending from the game or stop the 100% crit heal thing.

josh.lackey_ESO

Too many ways to get one-shot from a trashy gank build. This is why so many people eventually roll tanks. You can only get burst down with no ability to react so many times before either quit the game or roll a tank. It's pretty much inevitable due to how much toxic ganking happens in ESO. It's way over the top. If ZOS put an end to the free kills, less people would cheese out on the tank builds. The solution is to eliminate the toxic ganking and let the community self-correct. A recent example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mC0BPHz43Gw

More generally, the game is out of control at both extremes. There is too much damage from min-max dps builds, and too much damage mitigation from min-max tank builds. Both the burst dps and the tanks need to be brought more towards the center. It's not the CP system so much as all the gear sets that allow the extreme builds. And I don't see how nerfing sustain is going to hurt the cheese builds at all. It's just going to make it harder to have a balanced, well-rounded build. In fact, I predict more people will move to cheese builds with the incoming sustain nerfs.

deepseamk20b14_ESO

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

KingJ

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

LordSlif

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

deepseamk20b14_ESO

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

True but stamina users cannot use it reliably considering its cost, even efficient purge. Though I'm not complaining.

For Temps you just have to look at where they are healing at. Time your CC, debuff, and burst combo just above that point and kill them. Easier said than done I know lol.

KingJ

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

Yea but magplar have the cheapest purge that can be spammed.

Stam builds can't use it because they won't be able to use any of there other buff.Most magic build don't have room for it.

Just saying slotting purge doesn't address the problem.

Waffennacht

josh.lackey_ESO wrote: »

Too many ways to get one-shot from a trashy gank build. This is why so many people eventually roll tanks. You can only get burst down with no ability to react so many times before either quit the game or roll a tank. It's pretty much inevitable due to how much toxic ganking happens in ESO. It's way over the top. If ZOS put an end to the free kills, less people would cheese out on the tank builds. The solution is to eliminate the toxic ganking and let the community self-correct. A recent example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mC0BPHz43Gw

More generally, the game is out of control at both extremes. There is too much damage from min-max dps builds, and too much damage mitigation from min-max tank builds. Both the burst dps and the tanks need to be brought more towards the center. It's not the CP system so much as all the gear sets that allow the extreme builds. And I don't see how nerfing sustain is going to hurt the cheese builds at all. It's just going to make it harder to have a balanced, well-rounded build. In fact, I predict more people will move to cheese builds with the incoming sustain nerfs.

Exactly. Exactly. God @$!#I wanna say exactly more.

Derra

Minno wrote: »

Metemsycosis wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

Metemsycosis wrote: »

It's a 3v1

Blessed, elfborn, quick recovery

Vs

Befoul

It's a 3v1
Bastion, Hardy/ele defender, Pirate Skeleton, Undeath, + Elfborn + Blessed + Quick Recovery (potentially) on Resto ult cross heal and cross bubbles, etc.

vs???

Shield Breaker?

Lol
Yeah
My point is that in the CP trees damage, critical damage, dot damage, and penetration can be directly countered by other cp trees . There is a shield counter too. But I can't crit a heal debuff, now can I ?

Maybe that's why impen traits originally also reduced friendly crit heals? We should bring that back

I think morrowind cp changes adress this issue as leaked elfborn changes were only increasing dmg no longer healing.

KingJ

Derra wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Metemsycosis wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

Metemsycosis wrote: »

It's a 3v1

Blessed, elfborn, quick recovery

Vs

Befoul

It's a 3v1
Bastion, Hardy/ele defender, Pirate Skeleton, Undeath, + Elfborn + Blessed + Quick Recovery (potentially) on Resto ult cross heal and cross bubbles, etc.

vs???

Shield Breaker?

Lol
Yeah
My point is that in the CP trees damage, critical damage, dot damage, and penetration can be directly countered by other cp trees . There is a shield counter too. But I can't crit a heal debuff, now can I ?

Maybe that's why impen traits originally also reduced friendly crit heals? We should bring that back

I think morrowind cp changes adress this issue as leaked elfborn changes were only increasing dmg no longer healing.

Yea they are doing the same thing with precise strike which going to f over stamnb.

Lore_lai

KingJ wrote: »

Yea they are doing the same thing with precise strike which going to f over stamnb.

Pretty much this. Which is why I despise blanket-nerfs.
The poor stay poor, the rich get richer.

Same goes for sustain CPs - classes/specs who already suffer from sustain issues are going to be even more affected by said changes, while builds that pool their sustain mostly from things that are *not* affected by CP are going to be just as troll.
On the other hand - Siphoning Attacks might be made better by this change, indirectly.
***
@Minno - true, it wouldn't be fair to make stagger on block only available to stam, but I really hope one day we would see a mechanic like that that can break block.
Honestly, in regards to your other suggestions (not that they wouldn't add some spice) - I would be careful about adding even more offense to 1h&Shield (even with the caveats you mentioned). If anything (sadly I don't think this would work in ESO what with lag and all that) - the best offense a 1h&Shield should have would be a Perfect Block with a riposte.

Minno

Derra wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Metemsycosis wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

Metemsycosis wrote: »

It's a 3v1

Blessed, elfborn, quick recovery

Vs

Befoul

It's a 3v1
Bastion, Hardy/ele defender, Pirate Skeleton, Undeath, + Elfborn + Blessed + Quick Recovery (potentially) on Resto ult cross heal and cross bubbles, etc.

vs???

Shield Breaker?

Lol
Yeah
My point is that in the CP trees damage, critical damage, dot damage, and penetration can be directly countered by other cp trees . There is a shield counter too. But I can't crit a heal debuff, now can I ?

Maybe that's why impen traits originally also reduced friendly crit heals? We should bring that back

I think morrowind cp changes adress this issue as leaked elfborn changes were only increasing dmg no longer healing.

Ahhh! I forgot that was true. Still need to wait for Morrowind pts to test.

Minno

Lore_lai wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

Yea they are doing the same thing with precise strike which going to f over stamnb.

Pretty much this. Which is why I despise blanket-nerfs.
The poor stay poor, the rich get richer.

Same goes for sustain CPs - classes/specs who already suffer from sustain issues are going to be even more affected by said changes, while builds that pool their sustain mostly from things that are *not* affected by CP are going to be just as troll.
On the other hand - Siphoning Attacks might be made better by this change, indirectly.
***
@Minno - true, it wouldn't be fair to make stagger on block only available to stam, but I really hope one day we would see a mechanic like that that can break block.
Honestly, in regards to your other suggestions (not that they wouldn't add some spice) - I would be careful about adding even more offense to 1h&Shield (even with the caveats you mentioned). If anything (sadly I don't think this would work in ESO what with lag and all that) - the best offense a 1h&Shield should have would be a Perfect Block with a riposte.

Fair assessment! Thanks!

LordSlif

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

Yea but magplar have the cheapest purge that can be spammed.

Stam builds can't use it because they won't be able to use any of there other buff.Most magic build don't have room for it.

Just saying slotting purge doesn't address the problem.

Each class has something special templar cleanse is one of these things

KingJ

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

Yea but magplar have the cheapest purge that can be spammed.

Stam builds can't use it because they won't be able to use any of there other buff.Most magic build don't have room for it.

Just saying slotting purge doesn't address the problem.

Each class has something special templar cleanse is one of these things

Templars are the only class with a reliable purge. What I mean by reliable is that when they purge something it won't be reapplied right after.For example if a stambuild used efficient purge they would remove two negative effects but they can only use it twice. Than they will be out of magica and not able to use any other magic buff.Than they will just be defiled again after that person purged and leave the player at a disadvantage. For example a stamdk wouldn't be able to use igneous shield to get major mending or volitive armor to get major resolve. Two important buff that DK need. So saying anyone can remove healing debuff is true it isn't practical for any class or build but Templar. Just saying use purge isn't accurate or smart for any build other than Templar.

Get what I'm saying @LordSlif ?

Tasear

Always blame the healer >.>

thankyourat

Lore_lai wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

Yea they are doing the same thing with precise strike which going to f over stamnb.

Pretty much this. Which is why I despise blanket-nerfs.
The poor stay poor, the rich get richer.

Same goes for sustain CPs - classes/specs who already suffer from sustain issues are going to be even more affected by said changes, while builds that pool their sustain mostly from things that are *not* affected by CP are going to be just as troll.
On the other hand - Siphoning Attacks might be made better by this change, indirectly.
***
@Minno - true, it wouldn't be fair to make stagger on block only available to stam, but I really hope one day we would see a mechanic like that that can break block.
Honestly, in regards to your other suggestions (not that they wouldn't add some spice) - I would be careful about adding even more offense to 1h&Shield (even with the caveats you mentioned). If anything (sadly I don't think this would work in ESO what with lag and all that) - the best offense a 1h&Shield should have would be a Perfect Block with a riposte.

I think it's a good thing that certain classes miss out on key parts to a build. That way you know what a class is weak against and can counter. So classes with bad sustain will be worse at sustaining and that's fine (dark deal being the exception but it needs to be nerfed) a nightblade shouldn't have good burst healing and a sorc shouldn't have good sustain. The reason the game is so unbalanced is because people want a build that can do everything and that should not be possible. I think healing and sustain nerfs are a step in the right direction..

LordSlif

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

Yea but magplar have the cheapest purge that can be spammed.

Stam builds can't use it because they won't be able to use any of there other buff.Most magic build don't have room for it.

Just saying slotting purge doesn't address the problem.

Each class has something special templar cleanse is one of these things

Templars are the only class with a reliable purge. What I mean by reliable is that when they purge something it won't be reapplied right after.For example if a stambuild used efficient purge they would remove two negative effects but they can only use it twice. Than they will be out of magica and not able to use any other magic buff.Than they will just be defiled again after that person purged and leave the player at a disadvantage. For example a stamdk wouldn't be able to use igneous shield to get major mending or volitive armor to get major resolve. Two important buff that DK need. So saying anyone can remove healing debuff is true it isn't practical for any class or build but Templar. Just saying use purge isn't accurate or smart for any build other than Templar.

Get what I'm saying @LordSlif ?

Yep and i agree bro

KingJ

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

Yea but magplar have the cheapest purge that can be spammed.

Stam builds can't use it because they won't be able to use any of there other buff.Most magic build don't have room for it.

Just saying slotting purge doesn't address the problem.

Each class has something special templar cleanse is one of these things

Templars are the only class with a reliable purge. What I mean by reliable is that when they purge something it won't be reapplied right after.For example if a stambuild used efficient purge they would remove two negative effects but they can only use it twice. Than they will be out of magica and not able to use any other magic buff.Than they will just be defiled again after that person purged and leave the player at a disadvantage. For example a stamdk wouldn't be able to use igneous shield to get major mending or volitive armor to get major resolve. Two important buff that DK need. So saying anyone can remove healing debuff is true it isn't practical for any class or build but Templar. Just saying use purge isn't accurate or smart for any build other than Templar.

Get what I'm saying @LordSlif ?

Yep and i agree bro

Umm ok.

NBrookus

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

Yea but magplar have the cheapest purge that can be spammed.

Stam builds can't use it because they won't be able to use any of there other buff.Most magic build don't have room for it.

Just saying slotting purge doesn't address the problem.

Each class has something special templar cleanse is one of these things

Templars are the only class with a reliable purge. What I mean by reliable is that when they purge something it won't be reapplied right after.For example if a stambuild used efficient purge they would remove two negative effects but they can only use it twice. Than they will be out of magica and not able to use any other magic buff.Than they will just be defiled again after that person purged and leave the player at a disadvantage. For example a stamdk wouldn't be able to use igneous shield to get major mending or volitive armor to get major resolve. Two important buff that DK need. So saying anyone can remove healing debuff is true it isn't practical for any class or build but Templar. Just saying use purge isn't accurate or smart for any build other than Templar.

Get what I'm saying @LordSlif ?

To play devil's advocate:

If a magicka toon goes into Cyrodiil with 10k stam chances are they are dead meat. When magicka users complain about the difficulty of dodging, breaking free, blocking and heaven forbid sprinting or using a stam skill, they are told to run more stam and manage it better.

Maybe stam players need to build for more magicka and manage it better?

olsborg

I dont agree. Blessed is the only way stamblades have at boosting their otherwise abyssmal healing. Heavy armor, minor and major mending(stacking too) is the main issue imo. If you simply removed blessed, you would actually be hurting other people more then these "unkillables"

ToRelax

NBrookus wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

Yea but magplar have the cheapest purge that can be spammed.

Stam builds can't use it because they won't be able to use any of there other buff.Most magic build don't have room for it.

Just saying slotting purge doesn't address the problem.

Each class has something special templar cleanse is one of these things

Templars are the only class with a reliable purge. What I mean by reliable is that when they purge something it won't be reapplied right after.For example if a stambuild used efficient purge they would remove two negative effects but they can only use it twice. Than they will be out of magica and not able to use any other magic buff.Than they will just be defiled again after that person purged and leave the player at a disadvantage. For example a stamdk wouldn't be able to use igneous shield to get major mending or volitive armor to get major resolve. Two important buff that DK need. So saying anyone can remove healing debuff is true it isn't practical for any class or build but Templar. Just saying use purge isn't accurate or smart for any build other than Templar.

Get what I'm saying @LordSlif ?

To play devil's advocate:

If a magicka toon goes into Cyrodiil with 10k stam chances are they are dead meat. When magicka users complain about the difficulty of dodging, breaking free, blocking and heaven forbid sprinting or using a stam skill, they are told to run more stam and manage it better.

Maybe stam players need to build for more magicka and manage it better?

I would agree with you if Purge reliably removed the desired effect. That not being the case, it seems like a futile effort for a stam build.

LordSlif

ToRelax wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

KingJ wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

KingJ wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

And take away something that helps other classes, besides Temps, heal? No. It's fine. Run more healing debuff or stuff to run them out of resources like CC and poisons. As an NB I need both blessed and quick recovery for my healing to be on par with other classes that have superior healing.

I would agree with you if templars couldn't just remove any heal debuff or poison you apply.I agree with you NB need all the healing buffs we can't get and still not be in par with other classes healing.

Anyone can remove heals debuff, just use purge

Yea but magplar have the cheapest purge that can be spammed.

Stam builds can't use it because they won't be able to use any of there other buff.Most magic build don't have room for it.

Just saying slotting purge doesn't address the problem.

Each class has something special templar cleanse is one of these things

Templars are the only class with a reliable purge. What I mean by reliable is that when they purge something it won't be reapplied right after.For example if a stambuild used efficient purge they would remove two negative effects but they can only use it twice. Than they will be out of magica and not able to use any other magic buff.Than they will just be defiled again after that person purged and leave the player at a disadvantage. For example a stamdk wouldn't be able to use igneous shield to get major mending or volitive armor to get major resolve. Two important buff that DK need. So saying anyone can remove healing debuff is true it isn't practical for any class or build but Templar. Just saying use purge isn't accurate or smart for any build other than Templar.

Get what I'm saying @LordSlif ?

To play devil's advocate:

If a magicka toon goes into Cyrodiil with 10k stam chances are they are dead meat. When magicka users complain about the difficulty of dodging, breaking free, blocking and heaven forbid sprinting or using a stam skill, they are told to run more stam and manage it better.

Maybe stam players need to build for more magicka and manage it better?

I would agree with you if Purge reliably removed the desired effect. That not being the case, it seems like a futile effort for a stam build.

Stamplayers can dodge magplayere dn't lol

Hutch679

Remove shuffle.

technohic

All I know is keep these nerf calls to CP stuff. Majority of the so called OP stuff I just don't see in Azuras.

LordSlif

Hutch679 wrote: »

Remove shuffle.

Dont need this. Stamplayers can dodge, break free, shuffle and now are complaining about cleanse lol. If they have this we can have cleanse too

LordSlif

technohic wrote: »

All I know is keep these nerf calls to CP stuff. Majority of the so called OP stuff I just don't see in Azuras.

CP must be nerfflol lol

Merlin13KAGL

BoxFoxx wrote: »

A cool down time on being healed in between heals, applicable only while in Cyrodiil.

They have one of those already, debuff by the name of "Death," I think?

Death: While active, gain 100% immunity to damage, healing, and movement speed, as well as inventory, skill bar, and mail access. Cost: situational. Duration: Indefinite.