Eye of the Storm is beyond OP (maybe even broken) when used by an EMP.

fred4

I'm sorry I haven't read the whole thread and I don't PvP much in Cyrodiil, but only in IC and duels. With that out of the way, i want to point out to the OP that there ARE counters to this as a DK. First off, Corrosive Armor (or Magma Shell) completely mitigates the destro ulti. Furthermore a lot of people do not recognise Corrosive Armor and leave themselves open to attack while they think they have the upper hand, which they don't.

Secondly you mention the emp might use Immovability pots. Well, so can you. In addition I can only recommend switching from Rally (for those people that use it) to Forward Momentum, provided you can find healing elsewhere in your build. This will grant you 8 seconds snare (slowdown) immunity. Combine that with an Immovability + Speed pot and you can basically run away from anything. You can't be CCd, you can't be slowed, and you are faster than most. Re-reading your post, I'll readily concede this may not help in the confined spaces of a keep.

My PvP experience is mainly with stam DK. I can only guess how other classes might deal with this, but let me try:

(1) Blade Cloak. 20% AoE damage mitigation.
(2) Bolstering Darkness (NB Ulti). 60% damage mitigation, so this can get an NB up to 80% mitigation with (1).
(3) Shadow Image: Teleport away ... granted this takes a lot of foresight.
(4) Gap close away.
(5) Streak away.
(6) Spam shields.
(7) Spam Breath of Life.

I realise not all of these may be viable and apologise, if discussed before.

Sandman929

Artemiisia wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

so again the pvp'ers win

Yep, because before EotS PvE content was just impossibly difficult, right? Seriously, how weak is your PvE group that you need this to make it through?

Mojmir

I smell a "fix",broken in pvp and nerfed in pve incoming.

Artemiisia

Sandman929 wrote: »

Artemiisia wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

so again the pvp'ers win

Yep, because before EotS PvE content was just impossibly difficult, right? Seriously, how weak is your PvE group that you need this to make it through?

I do a lot of pvp, and dont really see the fuzz about having this ultimate as it is, and no I dont use it, im a dw/bow user, I think my deaths are like 1 out of 10 times only from this ultimate.

and I kill like 10 out of every 1 of my own deaths, you do the math

just learn to get out of it, instead of staying right in the middle, I see so many people staying inside and they deserve to die from it

Sandman929

Artemiisia wrote: »

Sandman929 wrote: »

Artemiisia wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

so again the pvp'ers win

Yep, because before EotS PvE content was just impossibly difficult, right? Seriously, how weak is your PvE group that you need this to make it through?

I do a lot of pvp, and dont really see the fuzz about having this ultimate as it is, and no I dont use it, im a dw/bow user, I think my deaths are like 1 out of 10 times only from this ultimate.

and I kill like 10 out of every 1 of my own deaths, you do the math

just learn to get out of it, instead of staying right in the middle, I see so many people staying inside and they deserve to die from it

That's the usual oversimplification. Just get out of it. It's good advice when there aren't 3-4 of them hitting simultaneously and where ever you run (assuming your feet aren't nailed to the floor by soft CCs) you're just standing in another Ulti.

asneakybanana

Artemiisia wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

so again the pvp'ers win

If you read the thread Instead of instantly reacting then you would know that a total damage nerf is not needed meerely a burst nerf.

asneakybanana wrote: »

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

When is this re-balance update? I'd like to know when i can resume playing ESO again because pvp is just terrible with all these procs sets, eots trains and root spamming dks/sorcs.

timidobserver wrote: »

Sureshawt wrote: »

EOTS got buff based on player feedback on PTS.

This is a perfect example of why ZoS should be very cautious when taking player input in terms of balance and really look at objective data before making these kinds of decisions.

Most players are inherently biased towards their class/playstyle etc. and not always what is best for the game.

It needed that buff for PvE. Not so much for PvP.

That buff has basically ruined pvp. It just had to be better then Meteor....

In pvp, Meteor is so counterable that the full damage potenail is never utalized.. but with EotS.... no comment. Im happy to see zos stating they will tweak it.

All that needs to be done to fix it is double duration and halve the damage per tick. It's still the same amount of overall dmg so will perform the same in pve but it doesn't have the insanely op burst that it currently has in pvp. Leave the fact that it is unblockable as it is one of the fee things that can reliably kill cancer tanks.

As you can see there I give a pretty good option to change things where everyone's precious pve dps won't be affected but it will fix the pvp aspect of the skill. @Artemiisia

Artemiisia

asneakybanana wrote: »

Artemiisia wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

so again the pvp'ers win

If you read the thread Instead of instantly reacting then you would know that a total damage nerf is not needed meerely a burst nerf. [quote="asneakybanana;3593895"

Im reacting to what Gina from Zos is writing, since thats the law, not peoples opinions in the rest of the thread, its no secret that pvp'ers are the main reason for any skill changes in this game, since its those that whine/complain the most on these forums about skills, classes, races, really anything that gets the fotm op something. Its been like that since game released, and the funny part of it, if they "fix" this, another new thing pops up as the new fotm. There is no satisfying a pvp'er.

asneakybanana

Artemiisia wrote: »

asneakybanana wrote: »

Artemiisia wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

so again the pvp'ers win

If you read the thread Instead of instantly reacting then you would know that a total damage nerf is not needed meerely a burst nerf. [quote="asneakybanana;3593895"

Im reacting to what Gina from Zos is writing, since thats the law, not peoples opinions in the rest of the thread, its no secret that pvp'ers are the main reason for any skill changes in this game, since its those that whine/complain the most on these forums about skills, classes, races, really anything that gets the fotm op something. Its been like that since game released, and the funny part of it, if they "fix" this, another new thing pops up as the new fotm. There is no satisfying a pvp'er.

Lol skills get changed for both pve and pvp. Why did templars get radiant destruction? Because they sucked in pve, why did blockade get buffed? Because people complained magic was getting out dps'd by stam, why did flurry get nerfed? Because people complained that stam was doing too much dps in pve, why did necrotic orbs get changed back in 1.3? Because people were abusing them for pve leaderboard scores. I can literally go on and on with tons of examples about skills getting changed for pve. The difference between pve and pvp though is that pvp players use far more skills than pve players do so there is a much wider spectrum of skills to be changed.

As for what Gina said she said nothing as to them gutting the skill or nerfing it she simply said they were looking at it so if you want to be a negative Nancy you can keep QQing and giving no suggestions or you can do something useful and come up with a change that would work for both pve and pvp players.

Also destro ult is broken in pve just as much as pvp. Cut 10 minutes off how long it takes a high end guild to do sanctum, so yea think about that.

Nifty2g

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

@ZOS_GinaBruno just to hopefully get this passed on
Maybe you should consider to make the ultimate blockable before you go ahead and nerf it.

GreenSoup2HoT

asneakybanana wrote: »

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

When is this re-balance update? I'd like to know when i can resume playing ESO again because pvp is just terrible with all these procs sets, eots trains and root spamming dks/sorcs.

timidobserver wrote: »

Sureshawt wrote: »

EOTS got buff based on player feedback on PTS.

This is a perfect example of why ZoS should be very cautious when taking player input in terms of balance and really look at objective data before making these kinds of decisions.

Most players are inherently biased towards their class/playstyle etc. and not always what is best for the game.

It needed that buff for PvE. Not so much for PvP.

That buff has basically ruined pvp. It just had to be better then Meteor....

In pvp, Meteor is so counterable that the full damage potenail is never utalized.. but with EotS.... no comment. Im happy to see zos stating they will tweak it.

All that needs to be done to fix it is double duration and halve the damage per tick. It's still the same amount of overall dmg so will perform the same in pve but it doesn't have the insanely op burst that it currently has in pvp. Leave the fact that it is unblockable as it is one of the fee things that can reliably kill cancer tanks.

Ive been saying this ever since eots hit live. The pts damage model was perfect. People cried because it wasnt the 1v1 ultimate killer when it was designed for group encounters. Its just stupid now and prevents me from playing in groups and resort to ganking.

I agree about the unblockable aspect.

THEDKEXPERIENCE

Big ultimate that hurts vampires a lot that the only solution to is to move out of its way?

Um ... use Mist Form? Works pretty well.

Nifty2g

Actually I take that back, eye of the storm morph needs a rework.

Artemiisia

asneakybanana wrote: »

Artemiisia wrote: »

asneakybanana wrote: »

Artemiisia wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

so again the pvp'ers win

If you read the thread Instead of instantly reacting then you would know that a total damage nerf is not needed meerely a burst nerf. [quote="asneakybanana;3593895"

Im reacting to what Gina from Zos is writing, since thats the law, not peoples opinions in the rest of the thread, its no secret that pvp'ers are the main reason for any skill changes in this game, since its those that whine/complain the most on these forums about skills, classes, races, really anything that gets the fotm op something. Its been like that since game released, and the funny part of it, if they "fix" this, another new thing pops up as the new fotm. There is no satisfying a pvp'er.

Lol skills get changed for both pve and pvp. Why did templars get radiant destruction? Because they sucked in pve, why did blockade get buffed? Because people complained magic was getting out dps'd by stam, why did flurry get nerfed? Because people complained that stam was doing too much dps in pve, why did necrotic orbs get changed back in 1.3? Because people were abusing them for pve leaderboard scores. I can literally go on and on with tons of examples about skills getting changed for pve. The difference between pve and pvp though is that pvp players use far more skills than pve players do so there is a much wider spectrum of skills to be changed.

As for what Gina said she said nothing as to them gutting the skill or nerfing it she simply said they were looking at it so if you want to be a negative Nancy you can keep QQing and giving no suggestions or you can do something useful and come up with a change that would work for both pve and pvp players.

Also destro ult is broken in pve just as much as pvp. Cut 10 minutes off how long it takes a high end guild to do sanctum, so yea think about that.

thats the thing im not QQing about it, im fine with how it works now, its you whos QQing about it

altemriel

Hammy01 wrote: »

I know that many people have complained about the destro Ult being op for some time now and it is a really strong Ult on most players but when it is used by the EMP it is stupidly OP. I am not sure how many campaigns currently have an EMP that is using the Eye of the Storm Ult but the Red Emp on Xbox EU does use it and it is pretty much game over for everyone else. Not only does the destro morph itself does a ton of damage but when it is paired with Proxy Det and Vicious Death you have no hope of ever holding any flags as long as the Emp is there. The Emp has way too much health, regens Ult to fast and can use an immovable pot to be immune to CC.. so in that 15 seconds of immunity the Emp alone can wipe out a very large group of attackers/defenders by himself. Most of this is do to the fact that the only real way to fight against the Eye of the Storm morph is to stay out of its path but that is so very hard to do in a keep / outpost where we have limited space.. we need more ways to be able to shut down Eye of the Storm users or else you will see nothing else but Emps running some sort of Eye of the Storm build and being pretty much God like!!

Anyways sorry for the rant but I had to get it off my chest as I feel it is just another nail in the coffin for PvP unless something is done to fix it. Please for the love of all that is good ZOS, when you create skills (especially AOE) try to think worse case scenario.. like what would happen if we create this extremely strong AOE Ult that can be very hard to avoid or deal with and give it to the most powerful person on the server (Emperor)? Thinking about this stuff ahead of time may lessen the pain and suffering most of us PvPers experience daily!!

well, (s)he is an emperor, what do you expect?

KundaliniHero

Honestly, with so many people running around Cyrodiil with heavy armor cancer builds, coupled with cheesus beam and zerg spam this is what you choose to complain about?

There's alot wrong with the game but i've given up hope that zenimax has the ability to achieve any semblance of balance, the pattern of the last couple years should be painfully evident at this point. So while the majority of forum warriors go through their tireless loop of complaining and meta humping to garner some sort of artificial self esteem from the insignificant victories they weasel from mechanics, the rest of us will continue to go with the flow and enjoy the game for what it is = a game.

GreenSoup2HoT

altemriel wrote: »

Hammy01 wrote: »

I know that many people have complained about the destro Ult being op for some time now and it is a really strong Ult on most players but when it is used by the EMP it is stupidly OP. I am not sure how many campaigns currently have an EMP that is using the Eye of the Storm Ult but the Red Emp on Xbox EU does use it and it is pretty much game over for everyone else. Not only does the destro morph itself does a ton of damage but when it is paired with Proxy Det and Vicious Death you have no hope of ever holding any flags as long as the Emp is there. The Emp has way too much health, regens Ult to fast and can use an immovable pot to be immune to CC.. so in that 15 seconds of immunity the Emp alone can wipe out a very large group of attackers/defenders by himself. Most of this is do to the fact that the only real way to fight against the Eye of the Storm morph is to stay out of its path but that is so very hard to do in a keep / outpost where we have limited space.. we need more ways to be able to shut down Eye of the Storm users or else you will see nothing else but Emps running some sort of Eye of the Storm build and being pretty much God like!!

Anyways sorry for the rant but I had to get it off my chest as I feel it is just another nail in the coffin for PvP unless something is done to fix it. Please for the love of all that is good ZOS, when you create skills (especially AOE) try to think worse case scenario.. like what would happen if we create this extremely strong AOE Ult that can be very hard to avoid or deal with and give it to the most powerful person on the server (Emperor)? Thinking about this stuff ahead of time may lessen the pain and suffering most of us PvPers experience daily!!

well, (s)he is an emperor, what do you expect?

Even if they were Emperor, it only escalated an on going issue. Without Emperor the ultimate was an issue. It first became an issue when pvp players complained that it wasnt as good as meteor. Nobody knew the ultimate was unblockable at that time. Nobody knew how good it would be in group play. There was no testing seriously done with the pts damage model for group play since everyone was more concerned about dueling. Given so many people complained that an AoE ultimate was trash in 1v1 zos buffed it, now it is a monster and stomping over all group play and arguably 1v1's aswell. This buff did not make group play or dueling better, it became another 1 button game changer to faceroll large groups of players like when proxi got revamped and VD was released. Even in duels its arguably overpowered and its ment for AoE situations.

Now there is a simple fix. Go back to the pts damage model. Doesnt change its pve impact but changes its pvp impact. The ultimate will still be the faceroll ability in group play but will at least be survivable if counter measures are used (barriers, soul siphons, quick cloaks, heals, movement) instead of the instagib no fly zone it creates currently when used it groups. It will be decent in 1v1s still but not at potent since its an aoe ultimate. This ultimate applies pressure not an instant death.

Before anyone yells at me for providing facts about there 1 button win ultimate, i still think proc sets and shuffle need to be addressed. They are issues. Heavy Armour is also an issue. 50% executes in my opinion are issues. No root immunity or gap closer immunity is an issue as well.

These things take time but hopefully we can endure the pain until it happens.

Nutshotz

I just come here to eat popcorn and lawl at omg eye of the storm so OP..... there is always going to be a ult, or class or skill that is OP. Just deal with it. So yeah there is no way to block it and such but my gawd when I use it I get gap spammed to prevent me from rolling that group. So yes they're ways to how shall I say it dodge it, and so forth. It's not a matter of L2P, it's a matter of adapt to the scenario.

Enslaved

Here is how zos should fix it. Make duration last half of what it is now and boost damage by 100%.

Sound familiar?

Minalan

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Eye of the Storm is intended to be a pretty strong ability. That said, we are taking a look at adjusting the damage as part of our re-balance in the upcoming update.

Meaning it will be completely useless when you're done with it.

Our stamina overlords demand their one button block counter to everything. You best make it happen.

Mayrael

I still prefer 2 EOTS on me than 2 incap strikes one me, at least I can do something against EOTS...

Lord-Otto

EotS is perfectly fine and needed.
What makes it broken is root spam, ridiculously slowing snares and gapclosers with sniper range. Because then you can't get out.
This has been plagueing magicka builds since... ever! And now stamina players get a taste of that, too.

So, can we finally get to[SNIP] work, Master Wroebel, and implement root immunity, restore original snare strength and make gapclosers GAPclosers, not CHASMclosers that hit you from Aetherius?
Thanks, sweeting!

Blackfyre20

Mayrael wrote: »

I still prefer 2 EOTS on me than 2 incap strikes one me, at least I can do something against EOTS...

Amen to this

a1i3nz

We can't we go one single patch without some garbage getting thrown in the mix. Currently it's EoTS which you're right is very OP even without emp.

They do it on purpose. They are professional game designers. As much as we like to assume it's a office full of idiots they do what they do for a reason. I think the reason for proxi, VD, and EoTS was reducing lag by ending large battles faster.

But these are just band aids. They need to fix the larger issues and then nerf all the OP crap so we can go back to when things were almost balanced. After they nerfed proxi things were close to being there. Then they added all the bs....

Sanct16

@asneakybanana

Imo, a better change would be reducing the duration to 3 seconds with the same damage and reducing the cost to 110 ultimate (3/7 of the current cost). This way it will still provide very high dps but using it will require more skill, as well as it allows for better counterplay. In group vs group fights it will reward good movement as you can render opposing storms useless by pulling back after they cast them.

Doubling the duration would be a very bad change imo. There is no way to avoid getting hit by a 14 second duration ultimate, so the best way to deal with it is just trying to tank through it, effectively making the game more brainless.

Fodore

Umm, I'm pretty sure that emporers are supposed to be that op... If they were not then what's the point of an emp push unless you haven't gotten the costume and dye before?

tonemd

My only concern with destro ults is visibility. A high damage ability with slow loading or non-obvious visible effects would be annoying in PVE and is absolutely game-breaking in PVP.

SRASinister

Meh only one Emperor on xbox na scourge was op with it. In fact he needed it due to to the yellows zerging down the map with 3 pop bars while every one else was 1 bar or 2 at prime time. Hulk was savage to watch with it until a banana zerg of 80 heavy armor templars get on in the morning when no one else is on turn the entire map yellow.

I've seen the two yellow emps in scourge try to use the ulti, but honestly it is just too funny considering most bombers hit harder than either of them did/do including ones in their very own group (lol I know you hit harder ali3nz). Hulk would constantly have his ult up while the yellow emps would have to build theirs up after burning it on people they zerg down.
Now if only the doc holiday would quit sleeping when he finally gets crowned both times.

Thraben

tonemd wrote: »

My only concern with destro ults is visibility. A high damage ability with slow loading or non-obvious visible effects would be annoying in PVE and is absolutely game-breaking in PVP.

1. This. It just needs both an acoustic marker (thunder) and a visual marker (whirlwind reaching from the player to the clouds above him) that tells people: Kill the guy!

2. Using capclosers should cause the AoE field to stay on its previous place or just cause it to follow the casting player with normal run speed.

I´m against weakening the skill itself, I just want to have a fair chance to counter it for those who can´t afford certain sets, or those who don´t want to be forced into certain playstyles.

Unsent.Soul

SRASinister wrote: »

Meh only one Emperor on xbox na scourge was op with it. In fact he needed it due to to the yellows zerging down the map with 3 pop bars while every one else was 1 bar or 2 at prime time. Hulk was savage to watch with it until a banana zerg of 80 heavy armor templars get on in the morning when no one else is on turn the entire map yellow.

I've seen the two yellow emps in scourge try to use the ulti, but honestly it is just too funny considering most bombers hit harder than either of them did/do including ones in their very own group (lol I know you hit harder ali3nz). Hulk would constantly have his ult up while the yellow emps would have to build theirs up after burning it on people they zerg down.
Now if only the doc holiday would quit sleeping when he finally gets crowned both times.

I noticed over the weekend we were able to take emp, hulk and his group did well and it was a great time. I passed out at like 4am. Woke up at 11 and yellow had emp for 3 hours, all I could do was shake my head. I've heard of this 2 zerg group of yellow turning the map in the early morning hours, glow glow does what glow glow does best....

THEDKEXPERIENCE

It's not even that bad if you're not in an enclosed space. If they want a nerf suggestion make it uncastable in areas where the whole animation can't fit. Setting it off in a hallway is mostly instant death. Dying to it in a field is your own fault or simply good play by your opponent sneaking up on you.

Personally I hate it because I die every time I use it by getting the Cyrodiil equivalent of beer muscles.

I'll stick with my handy blue beam of death.