peoples thoughts on adding daedra races as playable choices

Nyx2

RedJoker wrote: »

Rosveen wrote: »

The story wouldn't make any sense and besides, most daedra aren't intelligent enough to be playable races. Clannfears don't even talk.

Yep. As ridiculous as letting our horse mounts be a playable race.

Well, you can intentionally use this idea and apply bad logic just like you can do something good with it. With vague concepts like this everything is up for debate so there is no need to make examples of how this doesn't work when perfectly viable options are available.

Taleof2Cities

Have daedra been playable races in prior Elder Scrolls games?


There's your answer.

AzuraKin

MythicEmperor wrote: »

Please... No.... ZO$ has already butchered the lore enough. Just no.

actually they havent.

AzuraKin

starkerealm wrote: »

AzuraKin wrote: »

Jamini wrote: »

AzuraKin wrote: »

but only the aedra have the power to create and the daedra have only the power to corrupt (change) life.

Verily incorrect.

The only distinction between Daedra (Dunmeri for "Not our ancestors") and Et'aedra (Our ancestors) is that Daedra did not participate in the creation of the world (and thus retained their sentience) while Aedra did (and were absorbed into the plane. If you paid attention doing the MSA quest, you would see this is a common pitfall for powerful Daedra when they put effort into creating a reality.)

Daedra certainly can create things. It is just that creation is harder and riskier than changing things for them. Creation takes a portion of their will/strength in order to bring something into existance, and larger creations can aborb the Daedra completely.

Regarding the book on the Kyne: Note that particular book is likely only for Daedra under the domain of Molag Bal. Daedra that follow other Princes may have different philosophies and natures. (Listen to the difference between Dark Seducers following Sheogorah and Dark Seducers following Molag Bal. Or the Seducer who follows Meridia that you meet in one of the questlines.) There are stark differences between lesser Daedra that follow different Daedric Princes/Realms.

Honestly, I strongly suspect that many of the in-game summons come from realms of Oblivion other than coldharbor. A clanfear from the Shivering Isles or an Atronarch from the Colored Rooms is very likely to have no issue working for a mortal for a short time in exchange for a boon from the summoner.

think you need to read up on your lore:

daedra cannot create, this is specifically pointed out in lore. this is why the daedric titans you face in eso are not creations of molag bal, he had to start with a dragon that already existed and corrupted him into what he is. as well as the changing of the dunmer, the khajit, the argonians, ect. these are all examples of a change of the status quo. in fact the true nature of aedra is stasis and the true nature of daedra is change. in fact the aedra as well do not create. creation actually comes from the elder or beginning gods padomey and anu. after creation of nirn there is no mention of anu so what happened to him we do not know. padomey on the otherhand created sithis, but in so doing so he burned out his essence. some theory state that padomey was reborn as sithis through the creation process.

based on that and on the lore on the creation of the races, the primary difference between the aedra and daedra powers is, aedra have the power to change inanimate matter into animate living matter (the races) whereas the daedra can only manipulate matter into another form (change a chimer into a dunmer, or a bosmer into a bear)

as to daedra, there are daedra which are bound to a prince, others are bound to mortals (summoners) and others are independent of any prince. in most likelyhood the minor daedra are leftover remnants from when anu (possibly with padomey's help lore isnt too clear on the creation of the good/bad gods) created the aedra and daedra.

This, isn't quite accurate. The Daedra can create things, and do so on a semi-regular basis. The problem is, they're not particularly good at it. So, even when they try to copy things they've seen, the results are simulacra. In world text usually attributes this to the Daedra being unable to create anything, but that's not supported by the various varieties of Daedra under their control.

The Aedra do create things. It's their schtick. They created the universe, then the Daedra wandered in, and went, "this is neat," and proceeded to start poking and breaking stuff. It's not that they're incapable of creation, they're just not skilled in it. Functionally, the only dividing line between the Aedra and the Daedra is, are they in the group that were originally building the universe and learning from that how it works, or did they drop by later to play with the stuff that was left out.

If the Daedra couldn't create anything, they wouldn't have their own planes of Oblivion. They made those for themselves.

lol anu and padomey created the universe. not the aedra. in a way you can look at anu and padomey as the god of order (anu) and the god of chaos (padomey) they created the aedra/daedra (planets) sithis (space) the celestials (stars/sun).

AzuraKin

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Have daedra been playable races in prior Elder Scrolls games?


There's your answer.

ok then if that is the basis of your logic, then orcs must be taken out as a playable race. they were not an original playable race. they are giant versions of goblins.

disintegr8

When I saw the subject I though it was about Daedra Races - as in racing Deadras, first to the line is the winner - but was disappointed when I read what it was about. No thanks.

Taleof2Cities

AzuraKin wrote: »

ok then if that is the basis of your logic, then orcs must be taken out as a playable race. they were not an original playable race. they are giant versions of goblins.

Alright, good point ... though Orcs go back to Morrowind as a playable race which is still 2002 (14+ years ago).

Same as you, I think I would be for more playable races if it fits in the ES universe. However, as some of the other posters pointed out, a Daedra playable race would present a bumpy ride from a content developer's standpoint.

Van_0S

Snow elves, Sea elves and Akaviri race.

newtinmpls

WalksonGraves wrote: »

I want to make a sexy Sload

Hmmm... reminds me of a fanfic I started.

I'll have to get back to that at some point.

AzuraKin

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

AzuraKin wrote: »

ok then if that is the basis of your logic, then orcs must be taken out as a playable race. they were not an original playable race. they are giant versions of goblins.

Alright, good point ... though Orcs go back to Morrowind as a playable race which is still 2002 (14+ years ago).

Same as you, I think I would be for more playable races if it fits in the ES universe. However, as some of the other posters pointed out, a Daedra playable race would present a bumpy ride from a content developer's standpoint.

not really. a lot of the daedra are intelligent with quite a few capable of conversation. and to be frank, by making it something that you have to do the gold cadwells to use, it wouldnt matter then anyways if it made logical sense for a clannfear to talk to someone or not. and to be frank, a lot of players dont even do quests on thier alts.

Tempah

If it would ever be added I don't think daedroth twilight and clannfear would make the cut.
Maybe just dremora, xivlai(xivykn?) more mer/man like daedra .

drakhan2002_ESO

Interesting idea, but I am not sure; I guess I'm on the fence. However, I would really like to see new classes entered into the game at some point.

I'd love a necromancer or a hunter-type (i.e., beast pet) class.

Enodoc

Functionally, I think any of the Daedric races (as opposed to Daedric beasts) would work;

Aureal • Auroran • Dremora • Mazken • Spiderkith • Xivilai

The only exception would be Xivkyn, as they are most likely bound to the service of Molag Bal.

Lorewise, I don't think it would work though. There would have to be a considerable extension to the story to explain why it's happening, and that would have to link back to the Daedric Lord that they were bound to, which may conflict with the upcoming Daedra War storyline.

Nyx2

Enodoc wrote: »

Functionally, I think any of the Daedric races (as opposed to Daedric beasts) would work;

Aureal • Auroran • Dremora • Mazken • Spiderkith • Xivilai

The only exception would be Xivkyn, as they are most likely bound to the service of Molag Bal.

Lorewise, I don't think it would work though. There would have to be a considerable extension to the story to explain why it's happening, and that would have to link back to the Daedric Lord that they were bound to, which may conflict with the upcoming Daedra War storyline.

If as some already mentioned its exlusive to pvp or its own faction then the whole purpose would be that the player is part of Molag Bals forces. There are countless of options to integrate this intelligently into the game if ZoS is willing to put in the effort.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

First of all the storyline would not make sense as so many have said but here is a different reason as to why...

One simple reason Daedra couldn't care less about Nirn or it's inhabitants so why would they waste their time defending it? only daedra that could be considered would be the seducers as they are seemingly friendlier then the rest, As for daedric Intellect, some bestial daedra do have intellect such as the winged twilights but the clannfear and scamps on the otherhand are 2 tiles short of a house roof, in other words they are dumb.

But would it help if they made it so you can choose an Optional and separate character of a daedric race for PVP only for players who don't want their character to be in the army, that could be a 4th faction where everyone is against you including your main character who you wont ever encounter of course as they are not soldiers, it could be the purple alliance, would that make you happy?

And as for the lore they have butchered it, if you don't think they have then you might not know the lore as well as you think, Can you explain Cropsford's existence in the 2nd era despite the town being founded in the 3rd era? what about the existence of Black Briar Mead or the odd rotation of the Imperial City? or the fact that the portal to Sovngarde is no longer a secret and how death is seemingly meaningless now because even spirits from said Sovngarde seem to like hanging out in the solder camps in the rift or how Riften is called Riften despite the fact it's mentioned in a book in skyrim that before the 4th era it was named Rifton or how the Imperial name exists, they were not called Imperials until Tiber Septims time.

Enodoc

Nyx2 wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

Functionally, I think any of the Daedric races (as opposed to Daedric beasts) would work;

Aureal • Auroran • Dremora • Mazken • Spiderkith • Xivilai

The only exception would be Xivkyn, as they are most likely bound to the service of Molag Bal.

Lorewise, I don't think it would work though. There would have to be a considerable extension to the story to explain why it's happening, and that would have to link back to the Daedric Lord that they were bound to, which may conflict with the upcoming Daedra War storyline.

If as some already mentioned its exlusive to pvp or its own faction then the whole purpose would be that the player is part of Molag Bals forces. There are countless of options to integrate this intelligently into the game if ZoS is willing to put in the effort.

They wouldn't do that though. You've never been able to fight for the primary antagonist in a TES game.

theher0not

If they are going to add a race I'd want to sea the maomer (pun intended) as playable.
Though I am fine with the 9 (10 with imperial edition) races we have.

Rosveen

starkerealm wrote: »

katiesmith12341 wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Daedra really don't like humans. Except perhaps as a main course. We can make amusing prey for hunting fun as well apparently.

How could any daedra interacting with men/mer on a normal basis be tortured out of a storyline?

Daedra can be tamed though

Its an interesting idea, perhaps Sorc builds could transform into one, or perhaps a monster helm allows you to transform into A daedra in that time you can do extra damage (stamina based) on players/monsters. Although it would probably be going down a Transform Skill?

They really can't. Even the animal like ones have human level intelligence. (Daedrats may be an exception.) They can be reasoned and bargained with, but they can't be tamed, and cannot be trusted.

"The Scamps have small thoughts, and cannot fear greatly.
The Vermai have no thoughts, and cannot fear.
The Dremora have deep thoughts, and must master fear to overcome it."

Written by a daedra. Most of them have some intelligence, but it's misinformation to say it's human-level (unless you're comparing them to babies or mentally handicapped people). Depending on variety, they can be anything between a sapient person and a mindless beast.

Nyx2

Enodoc wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

Functionally, I think any of the Daedric races (as opposed to Daedric beasts) would work;

Aureal • Auroran • Dremora • Mazken • Spiderkith • Xivilai

The only exception would be Xivkyn, as they are most likely bound to the service of Molag Bal.

Lorewise, I don't think it would work though. There would have to be a considerable extension to the story to explain why it's happening, and that would have to link back to the Daedric Lord that they were bound to, which may conflict with the upcoming Daedra War storyline.

If as some already mentioned its exlusive to pvp or its own faction then the whole purpose would be that the player is part of Molag Bals forces. There are countless of options to integrate this intelligently into the game if ZoS is willing to put in the effort.

They wouldn't do that though. You've never been able to fight for the primary antagonist in a TES game.

It was never an online game either. Of course it's something entirely new but that's not really a reason to not do it. In fact that is only one more reason why they should do this. I know how unlikely this all is but I can't deny that this is something I would love to see.

Artis

Wow that's some serious lack of manners.

How come you forgot to answer to me @AzuraKin even though you replied to so many other comments? What about that proof that all vampires serve Molag Bal? Cause Lamae and Virgar the Red in game particularly say they don't. And Virgar even helps us to destroy the Heart of Harvest and progress in Coldharbour.

Aww could it be that you got caught spewing bull and have nothing to say?

AzuraKin

Enodoc wrote: »

Functionally, I think any of the Daedric races (as opposed to Daedric beasts) would work;

Aureal • Auroran • Dremora • Mazken • Spiderkith • Xivilai

The only exception would be Xivkyn, as they are most likely bound to the service of Molag Bal.

Lorewise, I don't think it would work though. There would have to be a considerable extension to the story to explain why it's happening, and that would have to link back to the Daedric Lord that they were bound to, which may conflict with the upcoming Daedra War storyline.

actually according to lore, the daedra can be in service to any of the princes or summoners, or even independent.

AzuraKin

Nyx2 wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

Nyx2 wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

Functionally, I think any of the Daedric races (as opposed to Daedric beasts) would work;

Aureal • Auroran • Dremora • Mazken • Spiderkith • Xivilai

The only exception would be Xivkyn, as they are most likely bound to the service of Molag Bal.

Lorewise, I don't think it would work though. There would have to be a considerable extension to the story to explain why it's happening, and that would have to link back to the Daedric Lord that they were bound to, which may conflict with the upcoming Daedra War storyline.

If as some already mentioned its exlusive to pvp or its own faction then the whole purpose would be that the player is part of Molag Bals forces. There are countless of options to integrate this intelligently into the game if ZoS is willing to put in the effort.

They wouldn't do that though. You've never been able to fight for the primary antagonist in a TES game.

It was never an online game either. Of course it's something entirely new but that's not really a reason to not do it. In fact that is only one more reason why they should do this. I know how unlikely this all is but I can't deny that this is something I would love to see.

pretty sure you never got to play for the sith in a star wars game before the swtor.

AzuraKin

Artis wrote: »

Wow that's some serious lack of manners.

How come you forgot to answer to me @AzuraKin even though you replied to so many other comments? What about that proof that all vampires serve Molag Bal? Cause Lamae and Virgar the Red in game particularly say they don't. And Virgar even helps us to destroy the Heart of Harvest and progress in Coldharbour.

Aww could it be that you got caught spewing bull and have nothing to say?

actually i did but i will respond again. molag bal is about domination. it doesnt matter to him how he does it. and one of the easiest ways to dominate someone without them even knowing, is to convince them they are fighting against you. but since molag bal is the lord of domination, thus any acts of domination over another is service to molag bal. and the ideal behind vampirism is domination over ones prey.

Milicent

Technically you character is a daedra. Forged by Molag.

starkerealm

Enodoc wrote: »

Functionally, I think any of the Daedric races (as opposed to Daedric beasts) would work;

Aureal • Auroran • Dremora • Mazken • Spiderkith • Xivilai

The only exception would be Xivkyn, as they are most likely bound to the service of Molag Bal.

Lorewise, I don't think it would work though. There would have to be a considerable extension to the story to explain why it's happening, and that would have to link back to the Daedric Lord that they were bound to, which may conflict with the upcoming Daedra War storyline.

This is, unfortunately, where I come out.

Also with the other non-daedric races that are traditionally non-playable. It would be cool to see Maomer, (uncorrupted) Falmer, and even some of the Akaviri races available. But, introducing them into the MMO as playable choices would get really problematic. These are groups that range from unusual to extremely rare in Tamriel.

While Dremora do pop up on Tamriel with unusual frequency, they're universally mistrusted. I can get behind the idea of wanting to play one, but can you really see the City Guard of Daggerfall picking a Dremora to investigate a threat on the King's life, or Raz picking a Auroran to function as his "inconspicuous," associate? You really think that Davon's Watch would accept the warnings of a Golden Saint that just staggered in saying the Covenant was attacking?

If ZOS went the extra mile, and recorded new dialog for every single interaction with these characters, to accurately reflect their distrusted status... with alternate quest paths so you really are experiencing a different set of stories... that would actually be really cool, and something I could get behind. But, I don't see that happening. I mean, the game doesn't even give you to talk in Khajiiti grammar if you're playing as one.

Now, if we got a Daedric PvP Warzone, it could be neat to roll up new dedicated PvP Daedra, but as a normal addition to the game, I don't see this working out from a lore perspective.

starkerealm

Milicent wrote: »

Technically you character is a daedra. Forged by Molag.

"Like a Daedra," not technically one. Your character was, originally, a mortal.

Now, there is that entire, "Nirn is just another plane of Oblivion," quagmire from Mankar Camoran. If you want to go that route.

AzuraKin

starkerealm wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

Functionally, I think any of the Daedric races (as opposed to Daedric beasts) would work;

Aureal • Auroran • Dremora • Mazken • Spiderkith • Xivilai

The only exception would be Xivkyn, as they are most likely bound to the service of Molag Bal.

Lorewise, I don't think it would work though. There would have to be a considerable extension to the story to explain why it's happening, and that would have to link back to the Daedric Lord that they were bound to, which may conflict with the upcoming Daedra War storyline.

This is, unfortunately, where I come out.

Also with the other non-daedric races that are traditionally non-playable. It would be cool to see Maomer, (uncorrupted) Falmer, and even some of the Akaviri races available. But, introducing them into the MMO as playable choices would get really problematic. These are groups that range from unusual to extremely rare in Tamriel.

While Dremora do pop up on Tamriel with unusual frequency, they're universally mistrusted. I can get behind the idea of wanting to play one, but can you really see the City Guard of Daggerfall picking a Dremora to investigate a threat on the King's life, or Raz picking a Auroran to function as his "inconspicuous," associate? You really think that Davon's Watch would accept the warnings of a Golden Saint that just staggered in saying the Covenant was attacking?

If ZOS went the extra mile, and recorded new dialog for every single interaction with these characters, to accurately reflect their distrusted status... with alternate quest paths so you really are experiencing a different set of stories... that would actually be really cool, and something I could get behind. But, I don't see that happening. I mean, the game doesn't even give you to talk in Khajiiti grammar if you're playing as one.

Now, if we got a Daedric PvP Warzone, it could be neat to roll up new dedicated PvP Daedra, but as a normal addition to the game, I don't see this working out from a lore perspective.

your missing though one key part. a mmo doesnt have to stick rigidly into the lore based playable race set.

starkerealm

Rosveen wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

katiesmith12341 wrote: »

JKorr wrote: »

Daedra really don't like humans. Except perhaps as a main course. We can make amusing prey for hunting fun as well apparently.

How could any daedra interacting with men/mer on a normal basis be tortured out of a storyline?

Daedra can be tamed though

Its an interesting idea, perhaps Sorc builds could transform into one, or perhaps a monster helm allows you to transform into A daedra in that time you can do extra damage (stamina based) on players/monsters. Although it would probably be going down a Transform Skill?

They really can't. Even the animal like ones have human level intelligence. (Daedrats may be an exception.) They can be reasoned and bargained with, but they can't be tamed, and cannot be trusted.

"The Scamps have small thoughts, and cannot fear greatly.
The Vermai have no thoughts, and cannot fear.
The Dremora have deep thoughts, and must master fear to overcome it."

Written by a daedra. Most of them have some intelligence, but it's misinformation to say it's human-level (unless you're comparing them to babies or mentally handicapped people). Depending on variety, they can be anything between a sapient person and a mindless beast.

I was actually using their ability to cast spells as an indicator that something's going on in there. Generally speaking, a character (or monster) having access to Magicka indicated they had a respectable intelligence score, even if they weren't incredibly smart.

crashen17b14_ESO

You are going to get a lot of people saying no. As well they should. Just about every daedra you listed can not wear normal armor or weapons, or function on the level needed to be playable. Winged twilight? Daedroth? Scamp? C'mon. Get real.

That said, there ARE the best Xivkyn polymorphs from Imperial City. Now, it would take some serioud mental gymnastics to justify a Xivkyn, hand-bred by Molag Bal to be his elite champions, working directly against him, with mortals, on Nirn.

However, I can think of a few ways, mainly because I am doing the same thing. One could have been summoned and bound by Vanus Galarien to serve the Mage's Guild. They would hate every second of it, but it could happen. One could also somehow manage to defect and change sides, leaving Molag Bal and instead serving a different Prince, like Azura. Such a daedra could then be summoned and bound by the Tribunal, or by an Ashlander tribe.

You would still be hated by all (except maybe some dunmer), but it could be somewhat believable. You would be an anomalous case, far too rare to justify a mass population like if it was a normal playablw race.

As for your base race, Dunmer makes most sense ability and themewise.

SnubbS

Would be the greatest thing ever.

However at this point I'll settle for a skin. Hey ZoS maybe you could put it in crown crates c;