Do not buy Crown Crates!!!

omfgitsbatman · December 2016

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

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omfgitsbatman wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

There are people who buy crown crates without knowing that it is a scam ? Or, to say the least, a big risk of not getting items for the value spent ? I mean, really ?

Probably? Since no one knows the drop rates and the last RNG-based thing they introduced (flower bags) had rather generous RNG, people might assume (WRONGLY) that crown crates will be generous as well..

probably?

it could just be that people do understand it and don't really care that much about the drop rates because it is just a bit of fun.

I never said that everyone will be thinking like that.. I just said that some will, and I feel sorry for them. Because they are being scammed

Cazzy · December 2016

Playing Fallout 4 and ZOS themselves admit to doing this;

omfgitsbatman · December 2016

ArrerBoy wrote: »

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omfgitsbatman wrote: »

How is this a good deal?

It isn't. It's profitable. That's the whole reason these things keep popping up in games.

Sooo... why should we not protest this?

borgking · December 2016

is it wrong of me to feel ive been cheated....I got khajit body markings that I cant use cos im a dark elf?

Nyx2 · December 2016

danielpatrickkeaneub17_ESO wrote: »

It's not a scam. You know what you're getting into. You're all scamming yourself and blaming the dealer because you think hitting on a 20 is a good idea.

You mean that we already know that we give away our money for most likely nothing? So... scam then. You know full well that these kind of marketing concepts only exist to exploit idiots into buying content they don't want.

JimT722 · December 2016

Crown crates a scam? Really? You don't say.

They are supposed to be. Why sell thing when you can add rng elements to keep people spending. I thought ZOS wanted to be different from all the F2p games out there but I was wrong.

ArrerBoy · December 2016

omfgitsbatman wrote: »

Sooo... why should we not protest this?

I'm not saying you shouldn't, I'm saying you're going about it the wrong way. The reason the Imperial Edition protest failed was because enough people still bought it. You not only have to voice what you don't like, you also have to show how it will impact sales buy not buying them. And getting others to not buy them.

omfgitsbatman · December 2016

ArrerBoy wrote: »

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omfgitsbatman wrote: »

Sooo... why should we not protest this?

I'm not saying you shouldn't, I'm saying you're going about it the wrong way. The reason the Imperial Edition protest failed was because enough people still bought it. You not only have to voice what you don't like, you also have to show how it will impact sales buy not buying them. And getting others to not buy them.

And how do we get others to not buy them? By pointing out on the forums that it's a bad deal?

maybe we are going about it the right way, after all

Manoekin · December 2016

I bought 57 crates. Now have two storm atro's; one I got lucky with and one I bought with the gems.

I don't like RNG, but I wanted a bear. ZOS won't listen anyway they're just here to make some cash.

SickDuck · December 2016

Recremen wrote: »

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ArrerBoy wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

The practice of selling them should be discouraged. If you aren't helping that then you're complicit in it. I don't see why this is so difficult to grasp.

Okay let me take this slowly then.

If something doesn't sell well, you pull it from the market. That is good business practice.

As of now with people buying them by the truckload, complaining about it rings hollow because it still sends the message you're willing to pay for it no matter how much you don't like it.

Incorrect, lots of us have made it clear that we'd be willing to pay for the items in the gambling boxes only if they were put up for direct purchase with crowns like how it works in the normal store. Our message is loud and clear.

But they did not put these items in the normal store - load and clear. So guess it means those people can
a.) walk away and don't buy
b.) buy it anyway and shout scam when not getting what they fancy

THEDKEXPERIENCE · December 2016

Recremen wrote: »

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danielpatrickkeaneub17_ESO wrote: »

I posted this in another thread but it's relevant here.

"How many of you have played FIFA Ultimate team, spent $100 on cards and never sniffed a Messi or Ronaldo? It's the same thing. ZOS ain't the first to do it, and certainly will not be the last. What they have done is totally within their industry standards. It is up to you to know when to say when. I always give myself a $20 Ultimate team budget and stick to it. You're gonna have to do the same."

No one has any idea what their chances of scoring a Ronaldo card but many spends hundreds and thousands ... and some probably hundreds of thousands ... to get one. If they don't they just scrap what they have for EA coins and eventually drop hundreds of thousands of those to get one. Sound familiar?

You should all consider yourself lucky that we're only talking about mounts, hats and costumes.

We should not consider ourselves lucky by any stretch of the imagination. Lucky would be them scrapping this sham and going back to only direct purchases of cosmetic items. It's false to imply that the only thing we can do is count our lucky stars that they've only done one bad thing. If this is "standard" for the industry then it is the laws governing the industry that need to change, not the consumers. For example, we have minimum age gambling laws, but these nonrefundable fiat currencies somehow are enough for their legal team to scoot around those laws. At least for now. That doesn't mean it's good, or won't one day be found illegal, it's just how it is now, and it behooves the company to think long and hard about the kind of brand they want to have.

I actually agree with you 100%. The paragraph before the one that I pasted actually said that nothing will change until Congress makes it change.

Just making a point that it could be way worse. What if this was a sharpened Maelstrom staff? That's the point.

ArrerBoy · December 2016

omfgitsbatman wrote: »

And how do we get others to not buy them? By pointing out on the forums that it's a bad deal? maybe we are going about it the right way, after all

That won't stop the many, many players in the game that don't bother coming to the forums and just buy stuff on the crown store because it's a bargain.

Publius_Scipio · December 2016

So, this thread is about you guys lacking the self control to either open a few crates, be dissatisfied, and not open anymore? Or simply dislike the whole idea of crown crates and not open them at all?

Or are you in fact simply angry that ZOS has included crown crates in THEIR product, THEIR game?

omfgitsbatman · December 2016

Manoekin wrote: »

I bought 57 crates. Now have two storm atro's; one I got lucky with and one I bought with the gems.

I don't like RNG, but I wanted a bear. ZOS won't listen anyway they're just here to make some cash.

That's 20k crowns for the thing you wanted... which is insane! About twice as much as the GAME cost

anitajoneb17_ESO · December 2016

omfgitsbatman wrote: »

And how do we get others to not buy them? By pointing out on the forums that it's a bad deal? maybe we are going about it the right way, after all

In my opinion, no. It would be much more efficient to NOT TALK about them at all. Everything we say or do is advertising for those crates and raises people's interest around them. Buzz mechanics.
Just go on our merry way and pretend they're not here. Don't react when other players or guildies show off their crown store stuff. Indifference is quite a powerful weapon.

ArrerBoy · December 2016

omfgitsbatman wrote: »

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Manoekin wrote: »

I bought 57 crates.
57 crates
57 crates
57 crates
I don't like RNG, but I wanted a bear. ZOS won't listen anyway they're just here to make some cash.

That's 20k crowns for the thing you wanted... which is insane! About twice as much as the GAME cost

And there's another problem you need to address You also need to convince players like that how much they're spending...before they spend it.

THEDKEXPERIENCE · December 2016

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

So, this thread is about you guys lacking the self control to either open a few crates, be dissatisfied, and not open anymore? Or simply dislike the whole idea of crown crates and not open them at all?

Or are you in fact simply angry that ZOS has included crown crates in THEIR product, THEIR game?

Yes!

SickDuck · December 2016

JimT722 wrote: »

Crown crates a scam? Really? You don't say.

They are supposed to be. Why sell thing when you can add rng elements to keep people spending. I thought ZOS wanted to be different from all the F2p games out there but I was wrong.

You pay 400 crowns (which is bought for real money) for a single crate which contain random cosmetic items that worth at least 400 crowns. Unless saying the whole CS concept is a scam, I can't see how this qualifies.

JahneeO · December 2016

You know, after all of these threads I still don't get it. I am not a big gambler, never really have been. But, that doesn't mean I don't buy the occasional scratch-off ticket or play the power ball lottery when the jackpot gets high.

And you know what, I'm sitting on 6k crowns that I tried to spend but there's nothing I want in the crown store, so I'll probably throw it at these crates. No big deal. The ethical quandaries that everyone brings up with this topic are crazy.

The crown crates are a little different than other forms of gambling because you will always get something for your money even if it is not what you want. Try saying that about the lottery or black jack or keno or a football square; more times than not you come away empty handed.

Here's what we know for certain:

1. ZOS is not a not-for-profit charity organization; they have employees not volunteers.
2. When it comes to gambling, the house always wins.

If you don't like the risk, don't buy them.
Being this salty about such trivial matters in life isn't going to do anything but give you gray hair and stomach ulcers.

JimT722 · December 2016

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

So, this thread is about you guys lacking the self control to either open a few crates, be dissatisfied, and not open anymore? Or simply dislike the whole idea of crown crates and not open them at all?

Or are you in fact simply angry that ZOS has included crown crates in THEIR product, THEIR game?

Someone changes THEIR Product so controversially after 2.5 years, people have a right to be angry. I now own a game I don't want and would not have bought if it was marketed with these in it at release. I have played many like it and know I hate this business strategy and any company that adopts it.

anitajoneb17_ESO · December 2016

omfgitsbatman wrote: »

They see the difference, but may assume that the RNG will be equally generous. Just because the means of purchase is different, that shouldn't mean that the RNG will be worse.. Yet it is...

Come on... The Val Var merchant is an ingame shop. Truly virtual. Exchange pixels for pixels. The crown store is an online store just like Amazon. How can people just not be aware of the difference ?

Callous2208 · December 2016

I just read an interview on a gaming site with ZOS. Evidently the early numbers on crates are so good, they're gonna be able to push out some actual gaming content for the first time in years!

Publius_Scipio · December 2016

JimT722 wrote: »

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Publius_Scipio wrote: »

So, this thread is about you guys lacking the self control to either open a few crates, be dissatisfied, and not open anymore? Or simply dislike the whole idea of crown crates and not open them at all?

Or are you in fact simply angry that ZOS has included crown crates in THEIR product, THEIR game?

Someone changes THEIR Product so controversially after 2.5 years, people have a right to be angry. I now own a game I don't want and would not have bought if it was marketed with these in it at release. I have played many like it and know I hate this business strategy and any company that adopts it.

News flash Mr. Jim, you have all the right to be angry and ZOS and its parent company has all the rights to make a profit under the laws of this great country which i love!!!! THE UNTIED STATES OF AMERICA!!!! That is how the free market works.

Sallington · December 2016

The arguments of "they're just cosmetics", in an RPG, is dumb.

omfgitsbatman · December 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

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omfgitsbatman wrote: »

They see the difference, but may assume that the RNG will be equally generous. Just because the means of purchase is different, that shouldn't mean that the RNG will be worse.. Yet it is...

Come on... The Val Var merchant is an ingame shop. Truly virtual. Exchange pixels for pixels. The crown store is an online store just like Amazon. How can people just not be aware of the difference ?

Except at amazon you get what you order... there is no "get a random item" order (I HOPE). If anything, it would be reasonable to assume that RNG will be better, since you put actual money on the line. I'm not saying that people don't know the difference between real money and tel var. I'm saying that some people base their decisions on what they exerienced with in-game RNG so far.. and if your most recent experience was the flower bags, you'd be more inclined to give them money than if vma leaderboards were your last experience

Manoekin · December 2016

omfgitsbatman wrote: »

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Manoekin wrote: »

I bought 57 crates. Now have two storm atro's; one I got lucky with and one I bought with the gems.

I don't like RNG, but I wanted a bear. ZOS won't listen anyway they're just here to make some cash.

That's 20k crowns for the thing you wanted... which is insane! About twice as much as the GAME cost

ArrerBoy wrote: »

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omfgitsbatman wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

I bought 57 crates.
57 crates
57 crates
57 crates
I don't like RNG, but I wanted a bear. ZOS won't listen anyway they're just here to make some cash.

That's 20k crowns for the thing you wanted... which is insane! About twice as much as the GAME cost

And there's another problem you need to address You also need to convince players like that how much they're spending...before they spend it.

I know exactly how much I spent. I didn't just get the thing I wanted either I got some things that I was happy to keep and didn't realize I wanted until I had them. These things should definitely be in the crown store for direct purchase, but sadly they are not. It is up to the consumer to decide how much the item they want is worth to them.

Plus I had quite a stockpile of crowns from many months of subscribing.

Nyx2 · December 2016

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

So, this thread is about you guys lacking the self control to either open a few crates, be dissatisfied, and not open anymore? Or simply dislike the whole idea of crown crates and not open them at all?

Or are you in fact simply angry that ZOS has included crown crates in THEIR product, THEIR game?

What kinda reasoning is that? We're their costumers and without costumers "THEIR game" will shut down. They lock away exclusive content behind RNG paywalls that just feed you with junk over and over again. They will do this with more future items and as said they depend on us paying for their content.

Except we don't get anything that we want so how is this even surprising to you? How is this ok with anyone? The only reason I could think of is that you're incredibly rich and enjoy the thought of being one of the few that ride these money bag mounts among other content. Or you really like being fooled and spend money for nothing.

JimT722 · December 2016

SickDuck wrote: »

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JimT722 wrote: »

Crown crates a scam? Really? You don't say.

They are supposed to be. Why sell thing when you can add rng elements to keep people spending. I thought ZOS wanted to be different from all the F2p games out there but I was wrong.

You pay 400 crowns (which is bought for real money) for a single crate which contain random cosmetic items that worth at least 400 crowns. Unless saying the whole CS concept is a scam, I can't see how this qualifies.

Your right. The previous method of a set price is just as much of a scam compared to unknown price. My boss should go to his customers and tell them "I will sell you the products you want but I don't know how much it will cost you." That's brilliant.

anitajoneb17_ESO · December 2016

omfgitsbatman wrote: »

Except at amazon you get what you order... there is no "get a random item" order (I HOPE). If anything, it would be reasonable to assume that RNG will be better, since you put actual money on the line. I'm not saying that people don't know the difference between real money and tel var. I'm saying that some people base their decisions on what they exerienced with in-game RNG so far.. and if your most recent experience was the flower bags, you'd be more inclined to give them money than if vma leaderboards were your last experience

I get what you're saying.
But it's worrying if people truly get confused between RNG drops as part of a game's design in a virtual, closed economy, and an RNG system based on real purchases with RL money.
I'm an idealist, I always assume people know what they're doing...

People have to realize : those boxes are like if Amazon started selling "book boxes". Cost only 1 dollar but you don't get to choose your book - surprise !! And you might also get a pile of blank paper too.

Publius_Scipio · December 2016

Nyx2 wrote: »

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Publius_Scipio wrote: »

So, this thread is about you guys lacking the self control to either open a few crates, be dissatisfied, and not open anymore? Or simply dislike the whole idea of crown crates and not open them at all?

Or are you in fact simply angry that ZOS has included crown crates in THEIR product, THEIR game?

What kinda reasoning is that? We're their costumers and without costumers "THEIR game" will shut down. They lock away exclusive content behind RNG paywalls that just feed you with junk over and over again. They will do this with more future items and as said they depend on us paying for their content.

Except we don't get anything that we want so how is this even surprising to you? How is this ok with anyone? The only reason I could think of is that you're incredibly rich and enjoy the thought of being one of the few that ride these money bag mounts among other content. Or you really like being fooled and spend money for nothing.

Because ZOS has their right to do as they please, change their product and services as they please. As you have a right to do as you please, do be happy or angry, etc. If ZOS loses customers, that is their failure to own. If ZOS makes a profit, that is their success. That is called the free market. You are a free person to do as you please. You continue playing ESO or you stop playing ESO. You open crown crates till your eyes explode, you open a few crown crates, you open zero crown crates because they disgust you. That's your choice of your own free will.

This isn't some study of how the free market, business, etc should operate.

What do you people expect? Is Zenimax not in business to make a profit for its investors like every other for-profit company in the world? Does Zenimax pay its employees with handshakes and a pat on the back? is the Zenimax Online Studios team comprised of charity workers, saints, and volunteers, who decided to spend hours and years of their life developing a AAA MMO video game for people to play at their leisure out of charity?