Re-trait and re-style

Elyu

fr33r4ng3r wrote: »

Yeah, I feel like no one will be running crafted gear anymore. The motif page grind seems pointless with all the new dropped sets and costumes that make armor styling redundant. Not to mention the research times for those players that are not yet all 9's, or farming for materials.

I get the imperative to encourage people to run content (over and over). Hence BOP and motif pages (instead of books). I'm not sure where crafting is headed, but without things like the ability to restyle and retrait gear, there seems to be no point to trying to collect motifs.

In my mind, offering restyling to known motifs, and changing traits of items bound by having a certain number of traits researched is the only way at this point to keep crafting relevant. Restyling and changing traits could have a high material costs to keep those relevant too.

^^From this thread: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/289471/where-are-the-new-craftable-sets#latest

Poll question is simple: should ZOS add a utility function to crafters that allow them to change an existing item's trait and/or style?

e.g. you own a bound, purple, well-fitted silks of the sun gloves. Using the new function, (AND if you have the style + trait learnt) for the style material and materials equal to 1/2 the cost of crafting CP160 gloves from scratch, you convert the gloves to DC style, impen.

Thoughts?

Rex-Umbra

Yes

Would be happy with restyle.

altemriel

Yes

yes both!

Tyrion87

Other (Please Explain)

Re-style - strong YES!
Re-trait - No (it would be too good, too simple, too easy). Just delete bad traits from end-game gear.

olsborg

Yes

Yes to both, if you have created or looted the set piece, but the trait or style doesnt fit, there should be an option to have it changed instead of having to grind some more to get the right trait.

Gilbert_Gaucirwb17_ESO

Yes

Yes to "Re-Style" because there is way to many motifs now and to craft the new motifs will downgrade my current equipment and set.

No to "Re-Trait" because the traits should be the part of the fun when a new item drops and it will be an upgrade because of the trait.

Mettaricana

Yes

Tyrion87 wrote: »

Re-style - strong YES!
Re-trait - No (it would be too good, too simple, too easy). Just delete bad traits from end-game gear.

Make retrait cost like 5-10 tempers and like 50k gold

WhiteCoatSyndrome

Yes

I'd REALLY like to restyle gear (monster helms -_-). I wouldn't mind being able to re-trait it and I know a lot of people would find it useful but I doubt ZOS will add that because they like their grinds for content too much.

Darlon

Other (Please Explain)

Re-style yes, re-trait no.

Much better than retrait would be to remove some of the useless traits from endgame drops alltogether.
Having the right trait every single drop would be to easy

Carbonised

Yes

Trait switching is somewhat controversial, and seeing how ZOS loves to add trash traits to the loottables, while saving that divine trait for the smallest chance possible, I don't really think trait changing is a thing that will ever happen. It simply goes against the core RNG element that ZOS likes to put in this game, and I think it's unrealistic to ever get trait changing, no matter how much one would want it or not.

Motif changing on the other hand is purely cosmetic, and quite frankly it baffles my why they haven't added this long ago. I have all motifs myself, and they're pretty much useless considering the benefits of looted sets, as well as monster sets. In almost every situation you'll end up in a jumble of 2 monster items, 5 pieces from a dropped set and 4-5 pieces from another dropped set or a crafted set. With the huge amount of CP160 sets and huge influx of new monster sets this patch, the need to be able to change motifs on dropped items is even more pertinent than ever.

The only reason I can possibly come up with is that they coerce people into buying their costumes from the crown store, since almost everyone would be unhappy with wearing stuff that only comes in specific styles, and would want to tailor and customize their look. That is currently not possible at all without resorting to whole costumes. Motifs is pretty much the most useless thing at the moment, as wearing an entire crafted set of equipment is completely gimping yourself, due to the lack of jewelcrafting and due to monster sets.

Not being able to wear the styles that I want to on all my pieces of equipment is one of the large reasons why I'm no longer active in this game, and I doubt I'll bother coming back or resubscribe until you're actually able to tailor the purely cosmetic aspect of motif styles on each and every one of your items.

It has been suggested time and time again that it could cost materials as well as motif style stones to change the motif, thus making it a much needed material/gold sink. But apprently ZOS thinks it's more important to sell their costumes in crown store for cash instead.

Tyrion87

Other (Please Explain)

Mettaricana wrote: »

Tyrion87 wrote: »

Re-style - strong YES!
Re-trait - No (it would be too good, too simple, too easy). Just delete bad traits from end-game gear.

Make retrait cost like 5-10 tempers and like 50k gold

Still too good to be true. I would give even 50 tempers and 500k gold to be able to re-trait my charged Maelstrom Inferno Staff to sharpened...

But I admit that bad traits on end-game gear are a problem which should be addressed by devs.

Sallington

Yes

Either let us retrait, or fix the crappy unintelligent RNG system. What's in-game now isn't good enough.

Aionna

Other (Please Explain)

Re-style yes . You should be able to change the appearance of your gears. Give motifs more usefulness than just completing all related achievements.

Re-trait no.

Brrrofski

Re-trait when zos change traits? For sure.

I has 9 useless gold Nirnhoned swords after that change. 72 wasted alloys. Over a mil worth basically.

bebynnag

Other (Please Explain)

re-style yes but only if you already have 9 traits on that item & the motif,

re-trait again only if you have 9 traits on that item and ONLY on crafted items

Mettaricana

Yes

Every game out there these days has transmogrify for gear wow, diablo, mabinogi, vindictus, tera online, even eso halfass... well 1/38th ass has it in the convert to imperial style. I'd even take it as a buyable dlc addon like imperial edition or add it to eso plus or regular crown store as like a 50 -100 crown per item transmogrify thing I mean imagine how much money they'd get on micro purchases from that. only restriction I can see is must have the style stone and have learned that style for that peice.

Also retraiting could be rigged up as part of the crafting skill lines

Ex: maelstrom axe powered to retrait this you must have the trait you want researched and when you do the re traiting it takes like 10 days(kinda like researching) to do can only re trait one peice of gear per crafting type at a time and retraiting binds it to your account as well as item cannot be used while retraiting.

hrothbern

Other (Please Explain)

restyle: yes
Why bother to gather motifs if you cannot really use them

re-trait ?
hm
I think getting the desired set is Nr 1 and we have to work for getting the most optimal traits.

Sallington

Yes

hrothbern wrote: »

restyle: yes
Why bother to gather motifs if you cannot really use them

re-trait ?
hm
I think getting the desired set is Nr 1 and we have to work for getting the most optimal traits.

No one is complaining about working to get the item/trait combo they want. I wouldn't exactly call dozens and dozens, even hundreds of vMA runs without the trait you're looking for a lack of "working for it".

Xvorg

Yes

I agreee, re-trait and re-style but:

1- Re-style would mean that ZoS is not going to sell many costumes
2- Re-trait will send a clear message to ZoS regarding traits to be erased from the game (or at least changed... again)

Danikat

Yes

Yes to both, but especially re-style.

potirondb16_ESO

Yes

I think there could be a conversion status for some items. All of them maybe with a specific cost. Example 10 material can be turn i to a transformation stone for style. 50 specific stone can be turn into a trait conversion. Item once convert ca be sell if not equip but it will automaticly bound bop set and those won't be tradable inside group.

Converting an item don't modify gear status otherwise. Style must be available to the player.

potirondb16_ESO

Yes

End of mindless gear grinding ! New trade opportunity for crafter. Also as trader are currently the richest people of all the game it would lower the expectative for massive buy abd market controle.

Can also help rhe overall economy by slowly reduce overall pricing of BIS while keeping a decent opportunity for already Bis item to stand out.

The only thing is that with new trial BoP mindset there might be even more issue for them to gather enough money to be standing out compare to other economics faction (crafter/trader/openworl farmer/ etc.) which would significantly reduce their overall economics performance. ...

Might have to add Crafter bag at the end of trial to egalize overall market.

(2×25 alchemy regent from those they use/ 25 soul gem/ and 10 random motif regent)

Forestd16b14_ESO

Yes

Why is this even a poll ? It's a flat out yes and DO IT.

Number_51

Other (Please Explain)

Firmly in the yes/style, no/trait camp.

Although recently I was mulling over the idea of pulling enchants and a chance at more tempers off of deconstructed items for master crafters (the more traits known for a particular item gives a better chance). I hadn't considered master/maelstrom weapons but it is the enchant that makes them what they are yes? The enchants are also specific to a weapon type, and could only be re-applied to that weapon type. They would also have to be bound the minute you put the enchant on a re-crafted weapon.

As I said, I hadn't really considered master/maelstrom weapons so this throws a whole new kink into the idea that would have to be carefully examined. The original idea was more about tempers. Seems ridiculous to me that, as a 9-trait master crafter on all items, I only have a small chance of getting back 1 of the 8 tempering alloys I used to make a legendary weapon.

hrothbern

Other (Please Explain)

Sallington wrote: »

hrothbern wrote: »

restyle: yes
Why bother to gather motifs if you cannot really use them

re-trait ?
hm
I think getting the desired set is Nr 1 and we have to work for getting the most optimal traits.

No one is complaining about working to get the item/trait combo they want. I wouldn't exactly call dozens and dozens, even hundreds of vMA runs without the trait you're looking for a lack of "working for it".

@Sallington ,
Re-trait is too easy imo.
As simple as that.

But I can very well understand what you say:
I do agree with you that hundreds of runs to get your desired item-trait combo, especially for your weapon, is unfair

And in vMA you cannot trade with your group members !!!
Perhaps ZOS did not fully got that distinction with other raids

I think there is a middle ground possible in various ways.
I can list suggestions up, but those would be details

Recremen

Other (Please Explain)

I don;'t much care about retraiting, but restyling is sorely needed. Creative Director and all-around good guy @ZOS_RichLambert mentioned at PAX West that they don't have any "short-term" plans to add restyling systems of any type, but that gives me hope that there ARE at least long-term considerations!! I love the motifs in this game, and can always craft all of them shortly after every patch drops, but I can never really use them because I'd need to make brand-new gold gear every time I wanted to change a style! How would I even know that I like the look of it, or what styles I wanted to mix and match? Even if I did make multiple sets of the same legendary gear in all the styles that I wanted to change between, imagine the toll on my bank space!! I've got maxed bank slots, crafting bag, etc, but there's no way I could get every piece in every style to really show off the beautiful motifs the game has to offer.

He mentioned that if you don't like the motif an item drops in, you can dye it or wear a costume, which is remarkably poignant, as a restyling system should definitely be modeled on the player-friendly nuances of those systems. It should have some cost associated with unlocking it (for dyes this is via achievements of varying difficulty, for costumes this is generally a Crown Store purchase), but after that it should be trivial to switch between items you've unlocked. Dyes can be changed easily and freely at a dye station. Costumes can be changed easily and freely from the Collections UI. Changing how your armor looks should be similar!

I cover some ways that such a system might look in my Restyling Masterpost, and go into a lot more detail about the arguments for and against such a system. Take a look if you're really interested in the topic!

I really hope that a restyling system is being talked about internally, because without one the game that's supposed to be top-tier in terms of customization is going to be outperformed in a key area by vastly inferior games!

Carbonised

Yes

The primary reason why they haven't implemented motif change is probably that it forces you into their crown store to be able to have satisfying visuals on your character. Whether they admit it or not, that's the only reason that makes sense.

Monetizing and cash milking is about to ruin this game as it has ruined so many others. Don't even get me started on the crown crates.

Mojmir

Yes

retrait yes,restyle is cosmetic doesn't matter to me.

phreatophile

Yes

Re-trait would obviate the need for a token system, so I'm for it.

Re-style would be excellent if it meant any style and material level you have learned, a lot of the lower level armors are much more aesthetically pleasing than the higher level armors that all look the same after level 26ish. More variety would be nice.

Recremen

Other (Please Explain)

Carbonised wrote: »

The primary reason why they haven't implemented motif change is probably that it forces you into their crown store to be able to have satisfying visuals on your character. Whether they admit it or not, that's the only reason that makes sense.

Monetizing and cash milking is about to ruin this game as it has ruined so many others. Don't even get me started on the crown crates.

But they aren't mutually exclusive, so unless they have some solid numbers about how much such a system would decrease costume sales then it's kind of a bogus rationale. Even people who are satisfied with how they look buy and wear costumes because it gives them more variety to play with (and usually high-quality texture variety at that!) I have a full legendary crafted set in exactly the motifs I want right now, but I love wearing one of my any costumes every few days. And I love dyeing those costumes so it's rarely the same thing twice! Heck, I've seen a half-dozen PvPers all open the Crown Store and buy a costume just because the one person did it and it looked kind of cool and they wanted to match for the day. If they really are holding off on restyling due to fears that Crown Store sales will go down, then I really hope they do a deeper market analysis and reconsider based on their (probably against-expectations) findings.

potirondb16_ESO

Yes

Number_51 wrote: »

Firmly in the yes/style, no/trait camp.

Although recently I was mulling over the idea of pulling enchants and a chance at more tempers off of deconstructed items for master crafters (the more traits known for a particular item gives a better chance). I hadn't considered master/maelstrom weapons but it is the enchant that makes them what they are yes? The enchants are also specific to a weapon type, and could only be re-applied to that weapon type. They would also have to be bound the minute you put the enchant on a re-crafted weapon.

As I said, I hadn't really considered master/maelstrom weapons so this throws a whole new kink into the idea that would have to be carefully examined. The original idea was more about tempers. Seems ridiculous to me that, as a 9-trait master crafter on all items, I only have a small chance of getting back 1 of the 8 tempering alloys I used to make a legendary weapon.

Maestrom and master weapon should a 1pc and an enchant aince yes they are by far the best ingame weapon but sometime they lack that usefullness that would make them BiS such as Maestrom s&b or both Master and Maestrom 2h.

Considering how many of some you can get while looking for a particular one ! Would be nice to be able to use those extra one.