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ZOS you should do this experiment for one quarter - make all BOP and BOE fully tradable and sellable
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Essiaga✭✭✭✭The title pretty much says it, I am not the only one, who does not like the BOE (bound on equip) and BOP (bound on pick up) system of many item sets in the game. It creates unneeded exclusivity and harms the economy of the game in my opinion.
I think you should make an experiment - for at least one quarter ZOS, for this limited time of this experiment, drop all BOP and BOE restrictions and make all the items in the game fully tradable and sellable. I bet it would totally boost the economy and improve the player experience of many many players. Definitely it would not harm anything. But to the contrary - it would make more people happy than unhappy. Maybe it would even attract many more players to the game!
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_KaiSchober @Wrobel @ZOS_RichLambert
I'm fine with how it is on live. You have BOE sets that are exclusive to the content. Examples are Vicious O, Infallible E. Spell Power Cure, Scathing Mage, etc. These sets are very specific and very powerful ... Typically BiS gear. Changing things now effects some of the population more then others. Hope you already got your VO, IE grear caus finding a group is going to be harder and harder and harder as time passes.
Think about it. How many LFG vWGT do you see now compared to months prior? Now, unless you have a regular group, you hope to farm it when it's the gold key cause they're isn't as much demand. Why? New gear elsewhere and people completing sets don't have the incentive of returning. Trading with in party is great for BOP items. It means you can help your friends farm with out letting your drops go to waste.
Once you have your 5 pcs from nTrials ... why go back?
Once you have your shoulder and helm from Undaunted keys ... why go back to 4 man dungeons?
Once you get your 5 pcs for World Boss ... Why go back? At least BoE lets you profit.
... If you have BoE across the game people will play their way. If not they'll do what they have to in order to get gear and gold for the things to want.
I think 'Overland' WB should drop only blue armor and weapons pieces ... Dungeons and Trials should drop purple jewelry, along with all else ... and all but the dungeon/trial specific sets should be BoE everywhere. Overland chests should have a decent chance at getting blue set jewelry found in that zone. For purple you do Trials or buy it from Guild Vendors, and Treasure maps should have a chance at for purple jewelry found in their zone as well. vTrials should drop gold pcs aside from Gold jewelry. Gold jewelry should drop for completion only, and of course weekly rewards.
ZOS to like to replace content, rather then expand content. Trials died for a year so they can drop DLCs. They re-released trials ... now they're attempting to replace them with World Boss farming. Why? They're NOT EVEN SELLING OneTam. Probably because this is the future of ESO. It's a new Orsinum style zones every 4 months. Single player content with WB hunting as end game.
Normal Trials were SO AWESOME. Raiding, but for casual players. Stepping stones to bridge the gap between the Casual and Hardcore raider and player. They gave value to guilds again, including Trading guilds. It's already getting difficult finding groups for nMaw. vAA/SO/Hel Ra are also drying. People are done there. BiS for them isn't there or they've already got it and are on to the next. BoE is at least an incentive to go back. With out, it what is?
Edited by Essiaga on September 6, 2016 9:11PM2 -
KingYogi415✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭^Smart man, all trials were now relevant. Which was huge. The number of people I know who run trials over the past couple months have gone from like 3 people to half my friends list. This twelve man content is bringing people together like never before in the last year.
Not even 2 months after they re-release Hel rah an AA, they want to replace all end-game farming to Dolmens???
WHO MAKES THESE CALLS?!1 -
potirondb16_ESO✭✭✭Totally agree with you @Essiaga ! It's been a struggle for a while to keep a group of 12 people running 3 night a weeks when there was no scale trial and Nothing to get. Now with all there is to get, we need to split people and create a core for veteran trial. Never has it been so enticing to be Inside a raiding community...Edited by potirondb16_ESO on September 6, 2016 9:30PM1 -
Rex-Umbra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭POP is lame POE is needed unless gear had a decay.Xbox GT: Rex Umbrah
GM of IMPERIUM since 2015.0 -
Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »
Well you aren't the whole playerbase, are you?
I'm sure many do that, but we're talking big numbers here.
And why would they take the risk that the majority of players will just happily go about playing all kinds of content, when they can just give people a concrete reason to play that content?
of course not, but neither are you
Correct. But the majority of players don't do content for the fun. They do it because they want to earn gear, and making gear BOP means they have to run the content more and for longer. Thus prolonging the life of the game for the MAJORITY of people.
If your not playing the game to enjoy it, then your doing it wrong.
Games are meant to be fun, not mindless boring slogs.
The day I stop enjoying content, will be the day I quit playing.
Well you're taking what I said far too literally, because you actually don't have a valid argument.
Of course people play video games for fun. What I'm saying is the MAJORITY OF PLAYERS find the fun/enjoyment by striving to earn the best gear. It's a fact which cannot be denied.
Let's take a look at vMSA: people complain about it all the time, it requires many hours of practice, building your character for it, learning mechanics and mob spawns. I can guarantee that the majority of people don't do this content for 'fun'. Perhaps they find it fun after a while when they master it, but people simply wouldn't play this content if there wasn't something so powerful (MSA weapons) at the end of it.
Again, I'm talking about the majority of people. Please understand that. It is literally just a game design technique which countless MMO developers use because it WORKS. It keeps people playing for months or even years, not just a few weeks until they farm a trial a bunch of times and buy all the gear they need.
Let's use an analogy:
You go to work. You earn money. You spend that money on a premade meal, but you don't have to find the food, clean the food, prepare the food, barely even cook the food. It's all there for you just to buy with the money from work.
Now you load up the game. You go to a trial. You earn money from selling the gear that drops. You spend that money on a dungeon gear set but you don't have to do the dungeon, kill the mobs, learn the mechanics.
Playing video games is supposed to be a release from real life, but this idea just emulates it. Do the same thing day in day out, earn money, buy stuff with it like zombies. OR you could be going to a farm, picking the potatoes yourself, cleaning them, cooking them, and I'm sure one would feel far more satisfied. So you could be going to the dungeon, learning the mechanics, overcoming challenging content, and getting a satisfying reward for partaking in that content.
Sorry for the wall of text and weird analogy. I just feel like the greedy people can't think about the GOOD this change will do to the game, rather than the bad it will do to their precious bank.1 -
Soleya✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well you're taking what I said far too literally, because you actually don't have a valid argument/
I believe I have a valid argument.
I don't play content over and over just to get gear. For me, grinding/farming is boring and unfun.
I play content because I enjoy it. For example, I run undaunted pledges and dungeon runs with my friends every week, because I have fun playing with them. Not because I need yet another undaunted key.
While some players may enjoy grinding stuff over and over. There are many who do not. You can see that by the fact that new people join every day and leave the game after a few weeks/months because they are tired of grinding for stuff.
If striving for best gear was why the majority of the people played. Threads like this wouldn't exists because everyone would want to get the gear doing that content.
The fact that gold sellers exist proves that not everyone just wants to earn everything.Edited by Soleya on September 7, 2016 7:01PM1 -
Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »Well you're taking what I said far too literally, because you actually don't have a valid argument/
I believe I have a valid argument.
I don't play content over and over just to get gear. For me, grinding/farming is boring and unfun.
I play content because I enjoy it. For example, I run undaunted pledges and dungeon runs with my friends every week, because I have fun playing with them. Not because I need yet another undaunted key.
While some players may enjoy grinding stuff over and over. There are many who do not. You can see that by the fact that new people join every day and leave the game after a few weeks/months because they are tired of grinding for stuff.
If striving for best gear was why the majority of the people played. Threads like this wouldn't exists because everyone would want to get the gear doing that content.
The fact that gold sellers exist proves that not everyone just wants to earn everything.
1) You aren't the only person playing this game, I'm talking about majorities here
2) So why do you care that items are going to be bind on pickup, when you can just trade with your 'friends'?
3) But do you think ZOS cares about those few people who are leaving after playing for a week cause they can't exploit the market so easily? No, ZOS cares about getting more people to play a wider range of content, obviously. Because if someone doesn't run dungeons because they can buy their gear with gold farmed from trials, then they probably won't be interested in buying the latest dungeon DLC. Marketing.
4) This is the first thread of this kind that I've seen so far. And if there are others, then the OP has created a duplicate thread, so this one should be locked/removed anyway.
5) In my 14 months of playing ESO I have not yet encountered a single gold seller. Honestly. So I'm not sure how your point there is relevant.0 -
Soleya✭✭✭✭✭
✭Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »Well you're taking what I said far too literally, because you actually don't have a valid argument/
I believe I have a valid argument.
I don't play content over and over just to get gear. For me, grinding/farming is boring and unfun.
I play content because I enjoy it. For example, I run undaunted pledges and dungeon runs with my friends every week, because I have fun playing with them. Not because I need yet another undaunted key.
While some players may enjoy grinding stuff over and over. There are many who do not. You can see that by the fact that new people join every day and leave the game after a few weeks/months because they are tired of grinding for stuff.
If striving for best gear was why the majority of the people played. Threads like this wouldn't exists because everyone would want to get the gear doing that content.
The fact that gold sellers exist proves that not everyone just wants to earn everything.
1) You aren't the only person playing this game, I'm talking about majorities here
2) So why do you care that items are going to be bind on pickup, when you can just trade with your 'friends'?
3) But do you think ZOS cares about those few people who are leaving after playing for a week cause they can't exploit the market so easily? No, ZOS cares about getting more people to play a wider range of content, obviously. Because if someone doesn't run dungeons because they can buy their gear with gold farmed from trials, then they probably won't be interested in buying the latest dungeon DLC. Marketing.
4) This is the first thread of this kind that I've seen so far. And if there are others, then the OP has created a duplicate thread, so this one should be locked/removed anyway.
5) In my 14 months of playing ESO I have not yet encountered a single gold seller. Honestly. So I'm not sure how your point there is relevant.
1. Of course you equate what you like to being the majority, yet you have no idea what the majority like. Your not the only one playing, and you don't speak for everyone.
2. Not all items are trade-able. Maelstrom gear isn't trade-able with friends since it's solo content.
3. ZOS cares about getting more people to buy the game or get subscriptions. When games are buy to play, new sales = more money. People who stay for years and don't have a subscription don't always put lots of money into the game.
4. I've seen dozens of these threads about BOP vs BOE over the past 2 years. They became more common after IC launch when more and more items became BOP.
5. You haven't been playing long enough. The months after launch were plagued with gold sellers. And while you don't see them in game anymore, you can still find them by doing a google search. Personally I find gold has almost no value in this game since there is very little you can buy with it. And the point about gold sellers to begin with, is that if people just want to grind for gear/gold, etc (like you suggest), then gold sellers wouldn't exist because there wouldn't be a market for them.
Example:
Lets say there is a rare weapon that is not BOP. This means a player could get it by doing some piece of content or by buying it with gold.
Player 1 likes doing that content so they do that content over and over and have dozens of these weapons. Player 2 does not like that content so instead they pick up crafting mats all day (something they enjoy), sell the mats and then buy the weapon.
Not seeing why this is a bad thing. Both players get to enjoy the game how they want. The content gets played by player 1 who likes doing it. And they now have incentive to keep doing it once they have the item cause they can always sell the stuff they get to someone else.
Now if that weapon was BOP. Then player 1 would do the content till they got that weapon, then never do it again since there is no incentive to do so. Player 2 will never do it anyway cause they hate the content.1 -
Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »Well you're taking what I said far too literally, because you actually don't have a valid argument/
I believe I have a valid argument.
I don't play content over and over just to get gear. For me, grinding/farming is boring and unfun.
I play content because I enjoy it. For example, I run undaunted pledges and dungeon runs with my friends every week, because I have fun playing with them. Not because I need yet another undaunted key.
While some players may enjoy grinding stuff over and over. There are many who do not. You can see that by the fact that new people join every day and leave the game after a few weeks/months because they are tired of grinding for stuff.
If striving for best gear was why the majority of the people played. Threads like this wouldn't exists because everyone would want to get the gear doing that content.
The fact that gold sellers exist proves that not everyone just wants to earn everything.
1) You aren't the only person playing this game, I'm talking about majorities here
2) So why do you care that items are going to be bind on pickup, when you can just trade with your 'friends'?
3) But do you think ZOS cares about those few people who are leaving after playing for a week cause they can't exploit the market so easily? No, ZOS cares about getting more people to play a wider range of content, obviously. Because if someone doesn't run dungeons because they can buy their gear with gold farmed from trials, then they probably won't be interested in buying the latest dungeon DLC. Marketing.
4) This is the first thread of this kind that I've seen so far. And if there are others, then the OP has created a duplicate thread, so this one should be locked/removed anyway.
5) In my 14 months of playing ESO I have not yet encountered a single gold seller. Honestly. So I'm not sure how your point there is relevant.
1. Of course you equate what you like to being the majority, yet you have no idea what the majority like. Your not the only one playing, and you don't speak for everyone.
2. Not all items are trade-able. Maelstrom gear isn't trade-able with friends since it's solo content.
3. ZOS cares about getting more people to buy the game or get subscriptions. When games are buy to play, new sales = more money. People who stay for years and don't have a subscription don't always put lots of money into the game.
4. I've seen dozens of these threads about BOP vs BOE over the past 2 years. They became more common after IC launch when more and more items became BOP.
5. You haven't been playing long enough. The months after launch were plagued with gold sellers. And while you don't see them in game anymore, you can still find them by doing a google search. Personally I find gold has almost no value in this game since there is very little you can buy with it. And the point about gold sellers to begin with, is that if people just want to grind for gear/gold, etc (like you suggest), then gold sellers wouldn't exist because there wouldn't be a market for them.
Example:
Lets say there is a rare weapon that is not BOP. This means a player could get it by doing some piece of content or by buying it with gold.
Player 1 likes doing that content so they do that content over and over and have dozens of these weapons. Player 2 does not like that content so instead they pick up crafting mats all day (something they enjoy), sell the mats and then buy the weapon.
Not seeing why this is a bad thing. Both players get to enjoy the game how they want. The content gets played by player 1 who likes doing it. And they now have incentive to keep doing it once they have the item cause they can always sell the stuff they get to someone else.
Now if that weapon was BOP. Then player 1 would do the content till they got that weapon, then never do it again since there is no incentive to do so. Player 2 will never do it anyway cause they hate the content.
To be fair you have some good points there. I'm actually on the fence about it after this discussion, there are good parts on both sides of it. Insightfuls for you
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Soleya✭✭✭✭✭
✭To be fair you have some good points there. I'm actually on the fence about it after this discussion, there are good parts on both sides of it. Insightfuls for you
Glad I could help you see a different point.
I get your point as well.
In the end, I think we all want as many people to enjoy the game as possible. More people supporting the game the better for everyone.1
