Icereach PC NA (Mulaamnir/Kyne/BWB NA PC - Final)

Mjollo

vamp_emily wrote: »

One thing I've heard over and over Is let people play the game like they want. Some people like playing in zerges, and some like playing solo. Just because I don't want to play the game like you, doesn't mean I am a troll.

No one is judging your actions. Just your motivations. They seem to be a little off.

Silky

Valen_Byte

@Deceiver0 Thats not nice at all, and I disagree. I know emily is lying to herself here. Shes not a bad person. She has just lost perspective.

Which brings me to a subject that I have wanted to bring up recently. Given all the new forum posters here. The attitude of late has been one of gloating and stroking of egos.

@everyone Why DO you play BwB? Is it to pown newbs? Is it to farm endless easy AP? Is it the community? Is it the help new players enjoy there time in game so that ESO will live long? Why?

I think its very easy for us, the veteran players of the sever to go full out cheese on new players not even running complete sets of gear and just utterly destroy them. But why? That just gives a false sense of uber skillz. You are not awesome because you can beat the crap out of new players. It just makes you a bully.

Do you think me weak because I care more about the new players enjoyment than my own? I assure you I am not weak. Not in game and not in person. It takes a stronger will to hold back than it does to go full L33T on newbs. I have compassion for people. Yes, people. These are not NPC's you are playing against. They are human beings, with real lives and feelings. People play games to let go for a while and just have some fun. I have several people in my guild that have real social issues. I care about these people in game and out. Some people, this is there only connection to other humans. I will not be the reason that someone I dont even know feels that they are totally alone in this world.

I know that some of you will not understand what I am saying and thats ok. We are all different. Thats why I ask, why are you here? Why do you play Bwb?

We do have a core group of veteran players in BwB. Some on each faction. Who have every right to play there. You all know what the pvpers on the vet servers think of us. They say we cant hack it, so thats why we are in BwB. We all know that isnt true. I have my reasons just like the rest of you.

Blacksmoke

Valen_Byte wrote: »

@Deceiver0 Thats not nice at all, and I disagree. I know emily is lying to herself here. Shes not not a bad person. She has just lost perspective.

Which brings me to a subject that I have wanted to bring up recently. Given all the new forum posters here. The attitude of late has been one of gloating and stroking of egos.

@everyone Why DO you play BwB? Is it to pown newbs? Is it to farm endless easy AP? Is it the community? Is it the help new players enjoy there time in game so that ESO will live long? Why?

I think its very easy for us, the veteran players of the sever to go full out cheese on new players not even running complete sets of gear and just utterly destroy them. But why? That just gives a false sense of uber skillz. You are not awesome because you can beat the crap out of new players. It just makes you a bully.

Do you think me weak because I care more about the new players enjoyment than my own? I assure you I am not weak. Not in game and not in person. It takes a stronger will to hold back than it does to go full L33T on newbs. I have compassion for people. Yes, people. These are not NPC's you are playing against. They are human beings, with real lives and feelings. People play games to let go for a while and just have some fun. I have several people in my guild that have real social issues. I care about these people in game and out. Some people, this is there only connection to other humans. I will not be the reason that someone I dont even know feels that they are totally alone in this world.

I know that some of you will not understand what I am saying and thats ok. We are all different. Thats why I ask, why are you here? Why do you play Bwb?

We do have a core group of veteran players in BwB. Some on each faction. Who have every right to play there. You all know what the pvpers on the vet servers think of us. They say we cant hack it, so thats why we are in BwB. We all know that isnt true. I have my reasons just like the rest of you.

Well dont know if you are really looking for answers here but might as well. This is from the perspective of someone who only started playing pvp a week ago in BWB. The reason I play in BWB is because of the community in every server people only complain and whine to each other but so far I barely saw this in BWB people have fun here and work together and we fight good fights. So for me its the community of friendly players and this forum where all factions can have a laugh and congratulate each other on wins or things that happend.

W0lf_z13

@Valen_Byte i play BwB mainly for the community ... i enjoy playing with and against the people in the forum cause i consider you all my pixelated friends . I enjoy playing in TF as well and kill quite a few but still die there....

Gederic

BwB has a special place in my heart even though I don't play ESO religiously anymore. The fact that there have been like 4 extremely long forums speak volumes to the community, which for the most part is active and dedicated players, most of which are really great people. The fact that someone who has been playing here probably as long as me, and definitely more consistently than me has forgotten the basic campaign values is sad. You should go to Haderus if you want to pull that. This campaign has never tolerated it and likely never will.

Silky

BwB is good because of the wide range of builds that are viable and you aren't just forced to go full proctard meta slave. Also more opportunities for small scale fights vs Trueflame. Haderus IC is tons of fun but going into cyro proper its usually a buff map for one faction or another.

I used to come to BwB because the zergs were smaller and wouldn't cause the intense lag. But pushing vs DC lately has brought my fps down to 5 whenever I get near a keep.

As far as other players, a general sense of courtesy is given as long as it is reciprocated.

W0lf_z13

@Blacksmoke u missed the other couple of threads we had lol.... this is our i think 4th?? thread mainly because of not everyone getting along at times ... things got a bit over heated and the mods shut the thread down

vamp_emily

Vyle_Byte wrote: »

@vamp_emily

That's.. actually quite sad. Leaving Pugz of DC, a respected guild bc you want to gate camp noobs? So you want to make new players feel terrible and not play the server? I mean, I get you hate us but you are better than that, I just know it. Deep down in you, you know how wrong this is. You remember what its like to be pushed back every day and you are going to take it out on people that didn't do that to you. The ones who did, they don't even play anymore. That's.. just sad Em.

You wont hear crying from me, I only cry when I get stabbed in the back by friends and people I consider family and since we are already enemies, you cant hold that on me.

Id say I wish you luck, but I would be fibbing. I wish you heart.

It took a lot for me to put all that out there, and I except the fact I will lose friends in BwB. You don't understand how I have been feeling lately, it just needs to be this way. It is all fluffy's fault. I was running round t-bagging him every time I got a chance and I felt bad because I know Pugz wouldn't do that. I am not good enough for the pugz that is why I am leaving.

Also, I understand you and some others are good people but you represent a very small portion of AD. I used to love PvP so much, but AD took that away from me. At one point I almost quit the game because ZOS doesn't understand a few things about balance. I do have a lot of hatred towards AD and EP, but just remember I can't gate camp solo

Blacksmoke

@W0lf_z13 Oh dear well lets all be friend in this forum and enemys on the battlefield

Mjollo

A very good question, Valen. I could say there are many reasons that I play in Blackwater Blade but the only reason that comes to mind at the end of each day is fun. I have played for fun and I will always play for fun. The only thing that has changed is my views on fun. "What's Better? Fun for me? Or fun for everyone?" I instead, started looking at the picture as a whole. Sure teasing and taunting the enemy is fun but I think both parties would agree that it's better when you are both challenged. It makes getting kills feel more worthy and winning fights more deserved.

Majority of the PvPers do not and may never understand what it means to gate camp. My first emp was in a( now revoked) campaign called Thornblade where we fought against an AD emp who gate camped both factions for the entire 30-day cycle. The second you grabbed Farragut mine or a small resource just outside your gates, the emperor came running by himself at god-speed to wipe an ENTIRE EP zerg. I had never seen anything like it nor will I ever again. He was the most deadly emperor I had ever seen in all my days of ESO. imagine having 30 people with you in teamspeak and all of them dropping like flies the second the emp showed his face. It had lasted for 6 days and 14 hours until I had to call in a few favors to dethrone him and help crown myself. 6 days of me staying up 20 hours a day just to capture a resource. even after, I only held onto emp for a day before he locked-down the map to death again for the rest of the campaign cycle.

I never want to see something like that happen again nor have anyone experience what I did. Especially in a campaign with as many dedicated players as Blackwater Blade. Pushing people to the gates CAN actually hurt the populations. One major dominating faction CAN hurt the campaign. This is why Balance and fun is so important to me. Blackwater used to be more bustling a year ago when all 3 factions were pop-locked every night. Now it's just Yellow vs. Blue with EP poking either with a stick. But one day, I hope to see it in it's former glory again.

vamp_emily

Valen_Byte wrote: »

@Deceiver0 Thats not nice at all, and I disagree. I know emily is lying to herself here. Shes not not a bad person. She has just lost perspective.

Even though we disliked each other in the beginning. For some reason I think you understand me the most.

DeadlyRecluse

Valen_Byte wrote: »

Is it to farm endless easy AP?

One comment on this: ANYONE will make better AP being a below average player in a vet camp than you will being a l33t player in BWB. If this is your motivation (and I'm accused of this often), you should consider going something else.

As a direct answer, I play in BWB because the people I enjoy playing with AND against play there. I play other servers for the same reason. BWB has some mechanical advantages (more balanced than Had or Azuras, less lag than Trueflame), and it has some gameplay advantages (minmaxing much less important, fewer procmonkeys, etc.) Even fights vs roughly equal opponents are more fun in BWB than any other campaign, imo.

I used to be a lot more "noble" about recruiting and training new players--when I was unemployed last summer I religously grabbed a few pugs out of zone, duoed with them, and made them a gearset. Sometimes I brought them into guild and showed them how we run groups. Quite a few of them play mainly in TF now, but still reach out occasionally for advice and whatnot.

I don't do that anymore, I'm too tired IRL and quite frankly got tired of certain elements in zone. Maybe I'll get back to that someday.


But ultimately: 90 percent of nights in BWB are fun, relatively balanced, and I am part of a fantastic community, both in terms of guilds and the campaign overall (barring a few rogue elements of crapitude).

Silky

Defialed wrote: »

Blackwater used to be more bustling a year ago when all 3 factions were pop-locked every night. Now it's just Yellow vs. Blue with EP poking either with a stick. But one day, I hope to see it in it's former glory again.

That's why I get a bit salty about people giving out *** for people being "traitors" for swapping factions. Specifically to EP. The holier than thou attitude I've seen just because someone you played with changed to try to balance the numbers is dumb. If EP has more numbers they become a legitimate threat to both alliances which keeps it from AD and DC pushing each other and treating EP as free keeps.

Having all factions at healthy numbers means more fights and a more entertaining campaign for everyone.

Blacksmoke

@DeadlyRecluse Well if you ever start giving tips again I'll gladly take some on running pug groups been going okay the past few days but I see I often mistakes that shouldnt have happend.

Vetixio

I play Blackwater Blade because of the community and my friends there. Although it is a lot more balanced than the other campaigns, way less proc sets etc and you can experiment with builds and skills without the fear of being shunned. I die a lot and I'm not the best player but that doesn't matter in BWB as the people are nicer and are just there to have fun not minmax and be the Grand Overlord Emp of Doom. And even tho I don't know many of EP and AD personally its nice to see the same people playing in BWB and you feel like you have a sort of mutual bond and respect for each other

Mjollo

@Silky If I can convince my guild to come back to ESO, I'll gladly switch back to EP without a second thought but for the past several months, I just haven't seen any proper organization or dedication from the players there myself and I could only do so much on my own. Although the current small group, that you've been running with has piqued my interest.

Silky

If Love Den comes back I'd have to switch back to AD for old times sake . I am working with some people to start running groups and teaching the EP pugs to take keeps. I think if some more organization is present and a couple good guilds start running effective groups then the numbers will come. Even if its not that many a couple well organized pug groups can actually make EP a threat to the other factions.

DCeiver0

vamp_emily wrote: »

DCeiver0 wrote: »

Well, I knew it would happen eventually, Emily's gone full troll.

One thing I've heard over and over Is let people play the game like they want. Some people like playing in zerges, and some like playing solo. Just because I don't want to play the game like you, doesn't mean I am a troll.

Well when you do it for the lulz... But idc Emily you do you. I'll still compliment your style.

Mjollo

Silky wrote: »

If Love Den comes back I'd have to switch back to AD for old times sake

Haha sounds like a deal!

Silky wrote: »

I am working with some people to start running groups and teaching the EP pugs to take keeps. I think if some more organization is present and a couple good guilds start running effective groups then the numbers will come. Even if its not that many a couple well organized pug groups can actually make EP a threat to the other factions.

I ran pug groups for a bit and it worked quite well. We would take keeps in record time 2~4 minutes. I was very impressed. I left because of a few individuals I did not agree with who I knew would make organizing EP difficult but they ended up being hypocrites and faction-swapping anyways so I guess it's time to go back,

Vyle_Byte

Silky wrote: »

That's why I get a bit salty about people giving out *** for people being "traitors" for swapping factions. Specifically to EP. The holier than thou attitude I've seen just because someone you played with changed to try to balance the numbers is dumb. If EP has more numbers they become a legitimate threat to both alliances which keeps it from AD and DC pushing each other and treating EP as free keeps.

Having all factions at healthy numbers means more fights and a more entertaining campaign for everyone.

If I believed that "some" of those people were actually doing it for that reason, I'd have absolutely no problem with that. The people that do it for actual campaign health, I find that admirable and have no hard feelings towards them whatsoever.

However, the people that do it to sit in an AD keep or resource specifically to farm them, yup I do have a problem with that. That's me, I find it kind of disgusting. It discourages the new players and makes them rage quit. Its fun for one side and terribly frustrating and demoralizing for the other.

Now, if you are speaking to some of us in the riddle of a guild member that recently left.. its not something I wish to discuss here, I in no way wish to cause drama or hurt that person but since we are layin it all out... what that person did literally hurt my heart. They were our very first member, treated like family, I made every single piece of armor he'd ever had, never asked anything for it, had been with us for an entire year, considered him my friend and he attacked just Valen and I (it was only the 2 of us) with 5 and then sat and watched as new buddies tbagged the crap outta us, while he was still in my guild and laughed about it. That is different and personal, it was about respect. He chose his side and that is fine but it certainly wasn't about swapping factions. And that's all I'm gonna say about that.

DCeiver0

I use the term troll to define those who seek to anger others just for the hell of it. We all got a little troll in us. Emily just wants to let hers out to play.

Silky

Vyle_Byte wrote: »

However, the people that do it to sit in an AD keep or resource specifically to farm them, yup I do have a problem with that. That's me, I find it kind of disgusting. It discourages the new players and makes them rage quit. Its fun for one side and terribly frustrating and demoralizing for the other.

I tell pugs this all the time, the key to not getting farmed is to not go. Melodrama aside, not sure who or what you are referencing about with the last paragraph. Myself and my guildmates catch *** from people about swapping to EP which is what I was referring to.

Also farms are way more likely when one faction is down numbers. A 5 man can't cap a full keep so they find other ways to entertain themselves. Not to say that fixing numbers will prevent farms entirely, but when my group can't cap a keep we will go play distraction somewhere.

Just_call_me_Cola

I vote we let Emily play with tri keeps or find a better way to enforce the "don't hold those keeps" rule besides harassment via Forum.

It's a game, we're gonna play what, how and with whom we want. There's only so much we can do to try and make everyone happy, and more then likely they will always be someone upset at you because of how you played a video game.

Vyle_Byte

Silky wrote: »

I tell pugs this all the time, the key to not getting farmed is to not go. Melodrama aside, not sure who or what you are referencing about with the last paragraph. Myself and my guildmates catch *** from people about swapping to EP which is what I was referring to.

Also farms are way more likely when one faction is down numbers. A 5 man can't cap a full keep so they find other ways to entertain themselves. Not to say that fixing numbers will prevent farms entirely, but when my group can't cap a keep we will go play distraction somewhere.

I wasn't sure and that's okay, there are many who have asked about it and I thought, since BYTE was called out in zone the other night for being faction hoppers bc of said person, that I would just address it. Also, may give some insight to why I, personally, get a little salty about those things as well.

Also, I understand the farm in case of having no numbers, EP wants to play too and I don't discredit that. What I'm talking about mostly, is that the distraction seems to always be one sided. Now, I don't play DC so I can't fully attest to what truly happens over there but on this side it sure feels like its one sided. When DC has emp and are pushing the crap out of us and then EP sits on a resource at the same keep we are being attacked at, it gives that impression. I've seen many times EP runs clear across the map with a group and be ganking the AD trying to get from Nik to get to Ash. I don't see those same EP ganking the DC. Like I said, we see it from one side.

Yes, we also tell the pugglets to not go there but you know as well as I do that they can potato and not listen. Then, I feel obligated to help those poor souls, bc I, as an AD and as a lead cant sit and just watch them do it. Its also hard when a guild gets called out in zone (not just ours) and says, Hey, this guild is letting their member farm us. It breaks down the respect that has been gained. Just my opinion, not trying to be melodramatic.

Silky

The distraction is everywhere, but being on one alliance people only see one side of it. I fall in to the salt trap as well, but at the end of the day its a game and people play to have fun their way, tri faction or not. I have seen plenty of AD groups farming EP back keeps and holding BRK while DC takes AD scrolls. Just like zone bitching about $Alliance zerg, it happens to everyone, but people only notice/care when it happens to them.

Valen_Byte

Thank you everyone who took time to answer my question. Sounds like most are playing in Bwb for the right reasons.

This is a game. But, it is not JUST a game. This is a social outlet for a lot of people. If you think having feelings and caring about others is melodramatic, than I am of the opinion that the Bwb community is not for you. Do as you wish. Farm as you see fit.

Valen_Byte

vamp_emily wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

@Deceiver0 Thats not nice at all, and I disagree. I know emily is lying to herself here. Shes not not a bad person. She has just lost perspective.

Even though we disliked each other in the beginning. For some reason I think you understand me the most.

I dont think I have ever properly addressed or explained my part in what happened to Bwb this past summer, and I should, so here goes.

We opened our family guild up in December of 2015. It took off like crazy. We had at least a full group going every night of the week and sometimes there was a need to open a second or third group. It was fun. The server was hopping and there where plenty of enemies to go around.

In the spring, things started to change. Some of our guildies did not agree with the "No Tri-keeps" rule. 2 members, that I had helped to become good group leaders left because of this rule that I would not budge on and created there own guild. They relentlessly perused the kind of tactics that I had refused to let them do while leading a BYTE group. We all know what happened from there. The map was in a constant state of yellow and eventually new players just stopped logging on. Some, like you @vamp_emily were left to deal with the mess that had been created.

I felt responsible in that I had trained these two how to run groups, how to run the map and how to get people to follow them. Weather or not I really was responsible is besides the point. I felt like I was. So, I stopped picking up new players. I stopped running guild groups even. For three months I hardly pvp'd at all.

Since then I have continued to shy away from picking up people in zone for fear of this happening again. I wanted to just back off and let the sever recover. Im glad to say that I think it has and will continue to get better with more even pops. Last night was the first time I have ran a group with randoms. I do still pick up new players from zone. But, Im very selective about who I bring into the fold. I guess Im still a bit gun shy.

I am sorry for what happened to the sever, and it is my goal to do my part to see that it doesnt happen again.

W0lf_z13

@Valen_Byte i def think it is heading in the right direction at least ... during the AD rule over the summer i think i made it maybe a month into it before i gave up ... if u remember 99% of my toons had the name "of Blackwater" at the end of it ... but with the campaign in the state it was in i got to the point i wanted nothing to do with the campaign anymore.
So i stopped entering BwB... deleted my toons that had "of Blackwater " (all but 1 cause hes my thief) and started playing in AS... eventually when DC started rolling the map there i gave up there and moved to TF and PvE ... but it looks as if BwB is returning to the way it once was before that.... granted i dont think ill make another toon with the name "of Blackwater" at the end of it again

DCeiver0

Valen_Byte wrote: »

Thank you everyone who took time to answer my question. Sounds like most are playing in Bwb for the right reasons.

This is a game. But, it is not JUST a game. This is a social outlet for a lot of people. If you think having feelings and caring about others is melodramatic, than I am of the opinion that the Bwb community is not for you. Do as you wish. Farm as you see fit.

Absolutely, everyone has the right to play any way they would like (within the rules of the EULA etc. Of course), but we are all entitled to our opinions about it as well. But that's all they are. Opinions. Emily is essentially leaving the guild to be free of those opinions, and if she's comfortable with that then she should not give a rat's arse about those opinions. And that is 100% fine. I will still fight along side her same as always. I personally may disapprove of that kind of thing, but if you don't care what I think, then you don't care what I think and that's OK.