New NPC guild questlines/Adding Mages&Fighters Repeatables

tinythinker

New NPC guild (Fighters Guild, Mages Guild, Thieves Guild, Dark Brotherhood, Psijic Order) storylines in future DLC

Some players seemed to really like the Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood questlines, while others felt they were too "local" and not epic enough. I can understand both views. I think the TG and DB stories were good recruitment tales that got you into the guilds and let you meet the NPCs, get a feel for the organization, get a rep with them, and so on. Maybe that underwhelmed you. Fair enough. But whether it did or whether you loved every minute of the stories, wouldn't a *new* story be interesting?

How this will work depends on what Matt Firor meant about episodic content going forward, which caused some concern/confusion when that news hit. Players don't know what they new content release format will be, so I can't give the best way to release such new stories. If it is one big drop per quarter but with many distinct/separate episodic elements, a new NPC guild storyline could be one of those distinct/side elements added in. If instead you buy a bundle per quarter but it is released monthly, or if a new mini-content bundle is sold separately each month, the new NPC guild storyline would be available that way.

In any case, the story itself could follow two paths. One path requires that you complete the original storyline of the relevant guild. This would allow consistency with characters who aren't recruited (or who haven't died yet) when you join that guild to appear (or not) appropriately in the new storyline. The other path uses only NPCs who are in the guild when you join it and who don't subsequently die during the original storyline. The problem is that some NPCs change their roles in the guilds, so that reduces the number of available faces even more. The workaround for that is that you are working with a branch of the guild in a new zone and NPCs/events from the storyline are largely omitted unless you had already finished it.

Personally I prefer a continuation or direct extension of the original storylines, but I would also take the indirect/sideways development as well. Either way, this could allow for a more epic story than TG and DB received and allow for more value to the FG and MG as well.

Which NPC guild would you want to be the first to get a new storyline?

What kind of story would you like it to be?





Repeatable quests for Fighters Guild and Mages guild

A new DLC zone or two could be added to give these guilds a "headquarters", but honestly the Mages Guild already has this with Eyevea and the Fighters Guild with the Earth Forge. If you have to complete the storylines of these guilds to get repeatable quests there is no problem, and this would be a good reward for doing so and make these mini-zones more useful and populated. An alternative to either adding a headquarters in a new zone (which wouldn't have to be all about the guild just an added bonus) or using the existing mini-zones would be adding quest-boards in all guild halls.

A compromise for all three:

-quest boards for basic quests available in all guild halls for base games and DLC zones
-special quests available only in Eyevea/the Earth Forge.

For the Fighters Guild, the contract against the daedra is still in place, so either these are all still related to that (daedra have appeared outside of some town, a portal to Oblivion has spawned in some little old lady's basement, etc) or maybe there is room for a little something different. Two types of special quests that occurred to me are training missions and hunts. Feel free to add your own ideas for types of special FG quests, but first read the spoiler-based concept I propose below which is hidden for new players who haven't done that guild's storyline or the main storyline:

The FG lost members like the traitor Aelif and got a new Guild Master when Merrick took over, and also suffered heavy losses as part of the invasion force that struck deep into Coldharbour but also gained members such as Skordo the Knife. Skordo is the one who runs the dailies, and has a quest type to help rebuild the Guild by assisting in the training of new (NPC) recruits. So you go out and help these NPCs with their missions. This doesn't have to mean escort quests!

Another special quest type for those who complete the Guild storyline is a separate board for really big monsters. They may or may not be daedra but they are all dangerous and need to be dealt with. Some can be soloed by pretty much anyone if you take long enough, some may require 2-4 players (unless you are just soooo good), and some may require 4-8 players (again your mileage may vary). You can pick which of each type to do (some or all) that are currently available, but they spawn in random places so there is also a hunting element involved. You would know the zone, but have to look for the beast. These would clearly have big rewards.

The Mages Guild would be similar to Fighters but without the restrictions the current setting/lore has on the targets of the Fighters Guild. These quests could be highly variable, from gathering ingredients in dangerous areas to rescuing researchers and so on. I have no particular ideas at the moment for the special quest types you unlock at the end of the Mages Guild storyline, but I am sure some fun things could be added. Not sure who the quest giver should be for those (Valaste doesn't make sense as she was important for her translating, so someone else should do this).

These new Fighters and Mages guild quests can be broad and creative, with jokes and nostalgia pulled from prior games as well as new things to fit the current era.

If this is added what requirements would you want to see? Just joining? Getting to max rank? Completing the storyline?

What kinds of quests would you like to see



{Tagging @Gidorick since he likes new content ideas and @Elloawendy since she tweeted a wish for a sequel to the DB storyline. Also tagging @ZOS_JessicaFolsom, @ZOS_RichLambert for an indication if something like this is remotely of interest to ZOS (/lurk) or might already be in development (/wink) at this time.}

Enodoc

tinythinker wrote: »

{Tagging Gidorick since he likes new content ideas and Elloawendy since she tweeted a wish for a sequel to the DB storyline.}

Hey, you forgot me!

I had some ideas for how Mages Guild and Fighters Guild repeatable quests could work a while back, as well as a bunch of repeatable quests from the Tamriel Guard that would take the standard "bounty hunter" and "escort" roles. Since the Mages Guild's primary thing is preserving Lore, their dailies are about recovering unreadable Lorebooks. I like the ideas for recovering ingredients and rescuing researchers, too.

Enodoc wrote: »

Fighters Guild dailies for destroying Mini-Anchors:
Something akin to the existing Dark Fissures, but in the style of Oblivion's Oblivion gates. You are tasked to go to a Dark Fissure location where instead of a Fissure, a Mini-Anchor has spawned (anyone who is not on the quest would just see a Fissure, as normal), and you need to defeat the enemies there. Once defeated, activate the pinion to be pulled into a delve-sized Coldharbour area. Fight through and defeat the boss to reach the Mooring Pinion. In addition to the immediate quest reward, you can stock up on Mooring Pinions to exchange for rewards. The assets for Mini-Anchors already exist; I think they are (or were? not sure if they're still around) part of a Dremora's spell arsenal.

Mages Guild dailies for collecting Lost Lore:
A quest to go recover a random lorebook (but not a purple one) from a delve. The book would be in a chest located behind the delve boss. In addition to the immediate quest reward, you also get some token that you can stock up on to exchange for rewards later on.

Enodoc wrote: »

What we also need are some solo dailies (that are interesting enough and rewarding enough to be worth repeating). All PvE-zone dailies at the moment (apart from Crafting) are for groups.

• Fighters Guild Dailies: You're sent out to shut down a mini dark anchor. These could occur in the same random places as the existing dark fissures, but you need to go into Coldharbour to find the pinions (a la Oblivion's Oblivion Gates). If you're not on the quest, you get the standard dark fissure which disappears after defeating the boss. If you are, you get to enter the mini anchor after defeating the boss and experience a delve-sized dungeon on your way to the pinions. In addition to the standard reputation/experience/gold reward, you get to keep the Anchor Pinion, which can be exchanged for gear. The more you collect before you exchange them, the better gear you receive.
• Mages Guild Dailies: You're sent to a delve in the region to recover lorebooks to be brought back and translated (a la Skyrim's Shalidor's Insights). If you're not on the quest, the delve acts like normal and the chest containing the book cannot be found. The chest would either be in the main boss room, or in a side room with a mini-boss. In addition to the standard reputation/experience/gold reward, you get a Gem Fragment, which can be exchanged for items. The more you collect before you exchange them, the better items you receive.
• City Guard Dailies: (Not very interesting, but would give you a bit more gold and XP if you want to go grinding.)
  • [x] creature is harassing [y] location. Go and kill [n] of them.
  • [x] criminal has escaped and is hiding at [y]. Go and apprehend them.
  • [x] item has been stolen, and has been taken to [y]. Go and retrieve it.
  • [x] citizen has been kidnapped and taken to [y]. Go and rescue them.

The Justice System, Thieves Guild, and Dark Brotherhood would add some more opportunities for dailies.

I would love to see a continuation of the Guild storylines with some new quests. Since both of them were fully resolved, they would be entirely new storylines that take place after the first one has ended.

tinythinker

Enodoc wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

{Tagging Gidorick since he likes new content ideas and Elloawendy since she tweeted a wish for a sequel to the DB storyline.}

Hey, you forgot me!

I had some ideas for how Mages Guild and Fighters Guild repeatable quests could work a while back, as well as a bunch of repeatable quests from the Tamriel Guard that would take the standard "bounty hunter" and "escort" roles. Since the Mages Guild's primary thing is preserving Lore, their dailies are about recovering unreadable Lorebooks. I like the ideas for recovering ingredients and rescuing researchers, too.

Enodoc wrote: »

Fighters Guild dailies for destroying Mini-Anchors:
Something akin to the existing Dark Fissures, but in the style of Oblivion's Oblivion gates. You are tasked to go to a Dark Fissure location where instead of a Fissure, a Mini-Anchor has spawned (anyone who is not on the quest would just see a Fissure, as normal), and you need to defeat the enemies there. Once defeated, activate the pinion to be pulled into a delve-sized Coldharbour area. Fight through and defeat the boss to reach the Mooring Pinion. In addition to the immediate quest reward, you can stock up on Mooring Pinions to exchange for rewards. The assets for Mini-Anchors already exist; I think they are (or were? not sure if they're still around) part of a Dremora's spell arsenal.

Mages Guild dailies for collecting Lost Lore:
A quest to go recover a random lorebook (but not a purple one) from a delve. The book would be in a chest located behind the delve boss. In addition to the immediate quest reward, you also get some token that you can stock up on to exchange for rewards later on.

Enodoc wrote: »

What we also need are some solo dailies (that are interesting enough and rewarding enough to be worth repeating). All PvE-zone dailies at the moment (apart from Crafting) are for groups.

• Fighters Guild Dailies: You're sent out to shut down a mini dark anchor. These could occur in the same random places as the existing dark fissures, but you need to go into Coldharbour to find the pinions (a la Oblivion's Oblivion Gates). If you're not on the quest, you get the standard dark fissure which disappears after defeating the boss. If you are, you get to enter the mini anchor after defeating the boss and experience a delve-sized dungeon on your way to the pinions. In addition to the standard reputation/experience/gold reward, you get to keep the Anchor Pinion, which can be exchanged for gear. The more you collect before you exchange them, the better gear you receive.
• Mages Guild Dailies: You're sent to a delve in the region to recover lorebooks to be brought back and translated (a la Skyrim's Shalidor's Insights). If you're not on the quest, the delve acts like normal and the chest containing the book cannot be found. The chest would either be in the main boss room, or in a side room with a mini-boss. In addition to the standard reputation/experience/gold reward, you get a Gem Fragment, which can be exchanged for items. The more you collect before you exchange them, the better items you receive.
• City Guard Dailies: (Not very interesting, but would give you a bit more gold and XP if you want to go grinding.)
  • [x] creature is harassing [y] location. Go and kill [n] of them.
  • [x] criminal has escaped and is hiding at [y]. Go and apprehend them.
  • [x] item has been stolen, and has been taken to [y]. Go and retrieve it.
  • [x] citizen has been kidnapped and taken to [y]. Go and rescue them.

The Justice System, Thieves Guild, and Dark Brotherhood would add some more opportunities for dailies.

I would love to see a continuation of the Guild storylines with some new quests. Since both of them were fully resolved, they would be entirely new storylines that take place after the first one has ended.

Sorry to leave you out. Thanks for the quest examples. Yeah I guess lore books would make sense for the special repeatables for Mages.

The issue isn't whether they need new storylines for the Guilds but how well they should tie-in with the originals. Should they be direct sequels that clearly play on what happened before or should they be stand-alones that don't require completing the originals? I am guessing ZOS would favor the latter, but they could have some extra/optional quests that go a little further in the new storylines/offer more to the story if you've already done the originals.

EDIT: Oh, I'm also on-board with expanding dark fissures... "The places where you hear a fog horn, a glowing tear in the sky appears, and minions of Molag Bal drop down. Make these events bigger, add more/larger waves, and a final random "boss" type that is tough. Give these events the dolmen treatment above for scaling. Something that 2-3 new/average players (at scale) would need to take 2.5-4 minutes to finish, something visible from a somewhat greater distance, and something with a cool xp/gold reward at the end. Make them interesting and sufficiently different from dolmens, with unique challenges and mechanics, but on par with the difficulty and time investment of dolmens."

UrQuan

Personally I'd love to see a DLC that adds new storylines to the guilds. In my mind the right way to do it would be to have the completion of the previous guild main story be a requirement to start the new one, and to make this very clear when the DLC is being purchased (if you're trying to buy it while logged on with a character who hasn't completed the previous guild story it could be greyed out saying that you don't meet the criteria, or maybe there could be a big red warning that pops up saying that you won't be able to start the DLC on that character until they have completed the previous guild story).

I don't really have a preference for which one I'd like to see first, but I suppose it should probably be Fighters or Mages, seeing as they've been around in-game for the longest.

I like your suggestions for repeatables for Fighters and Mages, here are a couple of additional possibilities that could be used.

Fighters Guild Repeatable:
Extermination: An island/mine/isolated valley/walled town/whatever has been overrun with pirates/undead/goblins/bandits/whatever and the Fighters Guild has been hired to wipe out the offending creatures. These quests would basically just be instanced grind spots, intended primarily for players who just want to grind XP. Each would have a large (but finite) number of mobs to kill (with a kill counter showing how many you've killed and how many are left), and you'd get a higher level of reward for killing them within a certain period of time. These quests would be shareable, so you could get a grind partner and do a couple of them together. There would be maybe half a dozen different possible extermination missions, so you could get a group and do all of them in a day (like the Wrothgar world boss dailies), but naturally being in a group of more than 2 would reduce your mob XP, so grinders would probably only want to group up in pairs.

Mages Guild Repeatable:
Ancient Ruin Exploration: The guild wants to retrieve relics from ancient Ayleid/Dwemer/Dragon Priest/Yokudan/whatever ruins. In order to explore the ruins you need to get past various sealed doors that require you to solve puzzles/collect mechanical parts to power the door/find claw keys/answer riddles/whatever, and you need to get past whatever guardians are in the ruins. Within each ruin you need to find a certain number of relics, that will be in different spots (much like how in heists the actual locations of various items you're stealing are randomized).

Enodoc

tinythinker wrote: »

The issue isn't whether they need new storylines for the Guilds but how well they should tie-in with the originals. Should they be direct sequels that clearly play on what happened before or should they be stand-alones that don't require completing the originals? I am guessing ZOS would favor the latter, but they could have some extra/optional quests that go a little further in the new storylines/offer more to the story if you've already done the originals.

I would say that they should be direct sequels, but they should be an entirely new and unrelated storyline. It wouldn't make sense for the storylines to run in parallel, as the storylines are the primary focus of the Guild at that time. Compare with something like Reaper's March in relation to Greenshade; the Reaper's March storyline is independent, but it takes place after Greenshade.

Gidorick

heh. LOVE it @tinythinker , thanks for tagging me ! I posted a similar thread a while back and actually copied/pasted what @Enodoc wrote inside that thread because... well.. he had some good ideas. heheh

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/182288/continued-viability-of-fighters-mages-guild-concept-and-discussion/p1

Gidorick wrote: »

This is a pretty quick one:

One of the most frustrating aspects of the Fighter’s Guild and the Mage’s Guild in ESO is how they simply cease being a viable source for gameplay. Your character essentially saves each guild and then you are meant to forget about them.

Each guild offers services to the denizens of Tamriel, yet there is nothing for the player to do beyond each guild’s story. Players should always be able to run into their guild, grab a contract or two and run out into the wild to serve the people of Tamriel.

ZOS should add to each Zone of ESO a handful of dynamically generating quests that use sets of variables to generate objectives. Each time the quest is generated it can use a different set of NPCs, MOBs, quantities, and could offer varying rewards for completion.

Fighter’s Guild Perpetual Quests Types:

• Reinforcement: One or more of your fellow Fighter’s Guild members in trouble. They were sent to some place in the zone and are pinned down. Players must join the other members of the fighters guild and fight off waves of enemies.
• Retrieval & Rescue: An NPC or a Fighter’s member is missing! Track them down by going to their last known location and follow the dynamically generated trail they left. The trail could be breadcrumbs, blood, broken sticks, footprints, etc. Fight enemies as you follow their trail. The NPC could be alive or dead when you find them.
• Escort & Bodyguard: An NPC is going from one location in the zone to another. Escort them and keep them safe.
• Extermination: There has been a report of an infestation of some beast or daedra. Clear out the area for a reward.

Mage’s Guild Perpetual Quests Types:

• Stolen Artifact: An artifact has been stolen! Find and follow the bandit or beast that has stolen the artifact, fighting off their friends while in pursuit.
• Hunting & Gathering: The Mage’s guild supplies are low! Go out into the wilderness and collect the ingredients/glyphs/souls/etc. that are needed.
• Research & Explore: Notes on a local dungeon are mixed at best. Escourt a Mages Guild member through the dungeon and protect them as they study various locations in the dungeon to complete the Mage’s Guild’s notes on the subterranean vault.
• Dungeon Raider: Reports of a rare artifact have been whispered around the guild. Visit the dungeon and pilfer the artifact. Getting the artifact was the easy part, escaping in one piece will be a challenge.

Many of variables in these quests can be chosen from a predetermined list:

• Specific NPC
• Types of mobs
• Item/Artifact involved
• Quest Location
• Item Reward (if any)

Many of variables in these quests can be created dynamically:

• Number of enemies
• Path to follow
• Waypoints
• XP and Gold reward

Each of these quests could be obtained from a job-board or from a specific member of the guild. It is true that eventually players would see all the content each dynamic quest has to offer, but if each zone offers their own set of perpetual quests, players would find that they have some justification to revisit old Zones. If enough variables were included players could find themselves being surprised by content that they feel they have run many times before.

@Enodoc has some great thoughts about how these could be added as dailies:

Enodoc wrote: »

Fighters Guild dailies for destroying Mini-Anchors:
Something akin to the existing Dark Fissures, but in the style of Oblivion's Oblivion gates. You are tasked to go to a Dark Fissure location where instead of a Fissure, a Mini-Anchor has spawned (anyone who is not on the quest would just see a Fissure, as normal), and you need to defeat the enemies there. Once defeated, activate the pinion to be pulled into a delve-sized Coldharbour area. Fight through and defeat the boss to reach the Mooring Pinion. In addition to the immediate quest reward, you can stock up on Mooring Pinions to exchange for rewards. The assets for Mini-Anchors already exist; I think they are (or were? not sure if they're still around) part of a Dremora's spell arsenal.

Mages Guild dailies for collecting Lost Lore:
A quest to go recover a random lorebook (but not a purple one) from a delve. The book would be in a chest located behind the delve boss. In addition to the immediate quest reward, you also get some token that you can stock up on to exchange for rewards later on.

Enodoc wrote: »

What we also need are some solo dailies (that are interesting enough and rewarding enough to be worth repeating). All PvE-zone dailies at the moment (apart from Crafting) are for groups.

• Fighters Guild Dailies: You're sent out to shut down a mini dark anchor. These could occur in the same random places as the existing dark fissures, but you need to go into Coldharbour to find the pinions (a la Oblivion's Oblivion Gates). If you're not on the quest, you get the standard dark fissure which disappears after defeating the boss. If you are, you get to enter the mini anchor after defeating the boss and experience a delve-sized dungeon on your way to the pinions. In addition to the standard reputation/experience/gold reward, you get to keep the Anchor Pinion, which can be exchanged for gear. The more you collect before you exchange them, the better gear you receive.
• Mages Guild Dailies: You're sent to a delve in the region to recover lorebooks to be brought back and translated (a la Skyrim's Shalidor's Insights). If you're not on the quest, the delve acts like normal and the chest containing the book cannot be found. The chest would either be in the main boss room, or in a side room with a mini-boss. In addition to the standard reputation/experience/gold reward, you get a Gem Fragment, which can be exchanged for items. The more you collect before you exchange them, the better items you receive.
• City Guard Dailies: (Not very interesting, but would give you a bit more gold and XP if you want to go grinding.)
  • [x] creature is harassing [y] location. Go and kill [n] of them.
  • [x] criminal has escaped and is hiding at [y]. Go and apprehend them.
  • [x] item has been stolen, and has been taken to [y]. Go and retrieve it.
  • [x] citizen has been kidnapped and taken to [y]. Go and rescue them.

The Justice System, Thieves Guild, and Dark Brotherhood would add some more opportunities for dailies.

Do you like the idea of always having something to do in the Guilds? What are some other Dynamic Quest ideas?

tinythinker

Gidorick wrote: »

heh. LOVE it @tinythinker , thanks for tagging me ! I posted a similar thread a while back and actually copied/pasted what @Enodoc wrote inside that thread because... well.. he had some good ideas. heheh

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/182288/continued-viability-of-fighters-mages-guild-concept-and-discussion/p1

Before the One Tamriel announcement it would have been a bit harder to pull off adding new guild content, but that change will make adding such new content not only much simpler but also a great move from a business stand point.

They've had some practice and received feedback with TG and DB repeatables so they should have no issue with taking what has worked and improving on it for FG and MG. It almost seems inevitable as a simple way to add replay/continued play value. The question seems more of a "when" and a "how" it will be done.

The other half, adding in new storylines for the guilds, seems much less certain. It would take much more of an investment. I still think it would help their bottom line but I wouldn't want to bet on that kind of new content happening. They may simply settle for having NPCs from those guilds pop up for one-off quests in future DLC zones.