Final: Craft Bags for ESO plus members only! Please, share your opinion about the rest of us.

ShedsHisTail

Allow Inventory space to be increased for the price of gold beyond the 140 space limit.

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Other:
Introduce some sort of loyalty system that gives non-subs Crafting Bags according to a certain requirement (e.g. Purchased all DLCs, has spent over a certain amount in the Crown Store relative to when they started playing, etc).

I get the argument that subs reduce risk by giving projected sales but regular Crown Store purchasers also do as well. If the amount of cash spent is the same, the monetary value of ESO is the same and therefore the same benefits should be given. Realistically, there's no difference between these two groups seeing as subs can also stop spending cash very quickly.

BUT,..can ZOS guarantee that Crown Store purchasers will always buy a certain amount of crowns every month though?
That's the thing. Subbers can be guaranteed to pay their subs.At least those who have been subbing for some time.They tend to stick with it.

I can stop my sub today and not pay any more money which is the same as a non-sub. If the cash paid between a sub and a non-sub is the same, they therefore share the same monetary value of ESO are also subject to same risk.

Not quite.
I mean, I can see where you might think it would, but there are additional factor involved.

Yes, like you said, you could drop your sub at any time. At lets say you do, that's a flat amount of money per month removed from the pool. The fact that subs are the same amount every month allows the financial planners to make more reliable estimates because they can work in increments.

Second, there's the issue of laziness, this is more of a psychological issue, but it's real and it's there. Folks tend to be lazy. If they actually have to put effort into something they're less inclined to do it. In order to cancel your subscription you are required to take action; go to the site, find the right buttons, click the right buttons, etc. This means that players are less likely to cancel their sub during any given game period simply because it requires them to actually do something. This, too, can be factored into and estimation.

The thing with subs is that since they are incremental and estimably reliable, OS can look at their number of subs an past trends an say, "We anticipate a gain or loss of X-amount of subs in the next quarter." And they can translate that number into a dollar figure giving them a rough budget.


The Crown Store, though, is exactly the opposite. Firstly, there's no telling how much merchandise people are going to purchase. They Crowns in little bundles because it adds an element of incrementality to the purchase, but it's still pretty unreliable. Why? Because that laziness issue which works in ZOS favor when it comes to subs actually works against them when it comes to Crowns. Getting more Crowns requires player action.

That's why you can buy Crowns right there in game, but you have to hunt own the un-subscribe button on the internet somewhere. Because they want it to be as easy as possible to buy things, but more difficult to well, un-buy things. Then, of course, there's the possibility that the latest package of outfits or whatever they're selling aren't well received. Aesthetics and community reception are factors which virtually don't even apply to subbed customers.

Subs like the game as is and are enjoying what they have. ZOS doesn't have to convince them to buy more. All they have to do is not screw it up.

Crown purchases are fickle and significantly less reliable for a number of reasons that aren't even listed here. If ZOS wants people to buy Crowns they have to continue to offer new and exciting things.

Volkodav

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Other:
Introduce some sort of loyalty system that gives non-subs Crafting Bags according to a certain requirement (e.g. Purchased all DLCs, has spent over a certain amount in the Crown Store relative to when they started playing, etc).

I get the argument that subs reduce risk by giving projected sales but regular Crown Store purchasers also do as well. If the amount of cash spent is the same, the monetary value of ESO is the same and therefore the same benefits should be given. Realistically, there's no difference between these two groups seeing as subs can also stop spending cash very quickly.

BUT,..can ZOS guarantee that Crown Store purchasers will always buy a certain amount of crowns every month though?
That's the thing. Subbers can be guaranteed to pay their subs.At least those who have been subbing for some time.They tend to stick with it.

I can stop my sub today and not pay any more money which is the same as a non-sub. If the cash paid between a sub and a non-sub is the same, they therefore share the same monetary value of ESO are also subject to same risk.

Not quite.
I mean, I can see where you might think it would, but there are additional factor involved.

Yes, like you said, you could drop your sub at any time. At lets say you do, that's a flat amount of money per month removed from the pool. The fact that subs are the same amount every month allows the financial planners to make more reliable estimates because they can work in increments.

Second, there's the issue of laziness, this is more of a psychological issue, but it's real and it's there. Folks tend to be lazy. If they actually have to put effort into something they're less inclined to do it. In order to cancel your subscription you are required to take action; go to the site, find the right buttons, click the right buttons, etc. This means that players are less likely to cancel their sub during any given game period simply because it requires them to actually do something. This, too, can be factored into and estimation.

The thing with subs is that since they are incremental and estimably reliable, OS can look at their number of subs an past trends an say, "We anticipate a gain or loss of X-amount of subs in the next quarter." And they can translate that number into a dollar figure giving them a rough budget.


The Crown Store, though, is exactly the opposite. Firstly, there's no telling how much merchandise people are going to purchase. They Crowns in little bundles because it adds an element of incrementality to the purchase, but it's still pretty unreliable. Why? Because that laziness issue which works in ZOS favor when it comes to subs actually works against them when it comes to Crowns. Getting more Crowns requires player action.

That's why you can buy Crowns right there in game, but you have to hunt own the un-subscribe button on the internet somewhere. Because they want it to be as easy as possible to buy things, but more difficult to well, un-buy things. Then, of course, there's the possibility that the latest package of outfits or whatever they're selling aren't well received. Aesthetics and community reception are factors which virtually don't even apply to subbed customers.

Subs like the game as is and are enjoying what they have. ZOS doesn't have to convince them to buy more. All they have to do is not screw it up.

Crown purchases are fickle and significantly less reliable for a number of reasons that aren't even listed here. If ZOS wants people to buy Crowns they have to continue to offer new and exciting things.

Thank you.What I have been trying to explain to people all along.

ShedsHisTail

Allow Inventory space to be increased for the price of gold beyond the 140 space limit.

Volkodav wrote: »

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Other:
Introduce some sort of loyalty system that gives non-subs Crafting Bags according to a certain requirement (e.g. Purchased all DLCs, has spent over a certain amount in the Crown Store relative to when they started playing, etc).

I get the argument that subs reduce risk by giving projected sales but regular Crown Store purchasers also do as well. If the amount of cash spent is the same, the monetary value of ESO is the same and therefore the same benefits should be given. Realistically, there's no difference between these two groups seeing as subs can also stop spending cash very quickly.

BUT,..can ZOS guarantee that Crown Store purchasers will always buy a certain amount of crowns every month though?
That's the thing. Subbers can be guaranteed to pay their subs.At least those who have been subbing for some time.They tend to stick with it.

I can stop my sub today and not pay any more money which is the same as a non-sub. If the cash paid between a sub and a non-sub is the same, they therefore share the same monetary value of ESO are also subject to same risk.

Not quite.
I mean, I can see where you might think it would, but there are additional factor involved.

Yes, like you said, you could drop your sub at any time. At lets say you do, that's a flat amount of money per month removed from the pool. The fact that subs are the same amount every month allows the financial planners to make more reliable estimates because they can work in increments.

Second, there's the issue of laziness, this is more of a psychological issue, but it's real and it's there. Folks tend to be lazy. If they actually have to put effort into something they're less inclined to do it. In order to cancel your subscription you are required to take action; go to the site, find the right buttons, click the right buttons, etc. This means that players are less likely to cancel their sub during any given game period simply because it requires them to actually do something. This, too, can be factored into and estimation.

The thing with subs is that since they are incremental and estimably reliable, OS can look at their number of subs an past trends an say, "We anticipate a gain or loss of X-amount of subs in the next quarter." And they can translate that number into a dollar figure giving them a rough budget.


The Crown Store, though, is exactly the opposite. Firstly, there's no telling how much merchandise people are going to purchase. They Crowns in little bundles because it adds an element of incrementality to the purchase, but it's still pretty unreliable. Why? Because that laziness issue which works in ZOS favor when it comes to subs actually works against them when it comes to Crowns. Getting more Crowns requires player action.

That's why you can buy Crowns right there in game, but you have to hunt own the un-subscribe button on the internet somewhere. Because they want it to be as easy as possible to buy things, but more difficult to well, un-buy things. Then, of course, there's the possibility that the latest package of outfits or whatever they're selling aren't well received. Aesthetics and community reception are factors which virtually don't even apply to subbed customers.

Subs like the game as is and are enjoying what they have. ZOS doesn't have to convince them to buy more. All they have to do is not screw it up.

Crown purchases are fickle and significantly less reliable for a number of reasons that aren't even listed here. If ZOS wants people to buy Crowns they have to continue to offer new and exciting things.

Thank you.What I have been trying to explain to people all along.

No problem.
Let's also not forget that subscriptions are a more solid number that people at OS can show to banks or shareholders or whomever typically require sales figures and say, "We have this many loyal customers."

Harder to do that with random Crown purchases.

clayandaudrey_ESO

That is all supposition on your part unless you work for ZOS. There is a reason they use the model they do and it is not because subs make them the money.

ShedsHisTail

Allow Inventory space to be increased for the price of gold beyond the 140 space limit.

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

That is all supposition on your part unless you work for ZOS. There is a reason they use the model they do and it is not because subs make them the money.

Who's supposing now?
I don't have to work for ZOS to see the inherent advantages and disadvantages of the two separate systems.

I didn't say those are the exact reasons ZOS does things, I'm simply refuting the presumption that both systems carry the same level of risk vs. reward.

Volkodav

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Other:
Introduce some sort of loyalty system that gives non-subs Crafting Bags according to a certain requirement (e.g. Purchased all DLCs, has spent over a certain amount in the Crown Store relative to when they started playing, etc).

I get the argument that subs reduce risk by giving projected sales but regular Crown Store purchasers also do as well. If the amount of cash spent is the same, the monetary value of ESO is the same and therefore the same benefits should be given. Realistically, there's no difference between these two groups seeing as subs can also stop spending cash very quickly.

BUT,..can ZOS guarantee that Crown Store purchasers will always buy a certain amount of crowns every month though?
That's the thing. Subbers can be guaranteed to pay their subs.At least those who have been subbing for some time.They tend to stick with it.

I can stop my sub today and not pay any more money which is the same as a non-sub. If the cash paid between a sub and a non-sub is the same, they therefore share the same monetary value of ESO are also subject to same risk.

Not quite.
I mean, I can see where you might think it would, but there are additional factor involved.

Yes, like you said, you could drop your sub at any time. At lets say you do, that's a flat amount of money per month removed from the pool. The fact that subs are the same amount every month allows the financial planners to make more reliable estimates because they can work in increments.

Second, there's the issue of laziness, this is more of a psychological issue, but it's real and it's there. Folks tend to be lazy. If they actually have to put effort into something they're less inclined to do it. In order to cancel your subscription you are required to take action; go to the site, find the right buttons, click the right buttons, etc. This means that players are less likely to cancel their sub during any given game period simply because it requires them to actually do something. This, too, can be factored into and estimation.

The thing with subs is that since they are incremental and estimably reliable, OS can look at their number of subs an past trends an say, "We anticipate a gain or loss of X-amount of subs in the next quarter." And they can translate that number into a dollar figure giving them a rough budget.


The Crown Store, though, is exactly the opposite. Firstly, there's no telling how much merchandise people are going to purchase. They Crowns in little bundles because it adds an element of incrementality to the purchase, but it's still pretty unreliable. Why? Because that laziness issue which works in ZOS favor when it comes to subs actually works against them when it comes to Crowns. Getting more Crowns requires player action.

That's why you can buy Crowns right there in game, but you have to hunt own the un-subscribe button on the internet somewhere. Because they want it to be as easy as possible to buy things, but more difficult to well, un-buy things. Then, of course, there's the possibility that the latest package of outfits or whatever they're selling aren't well received. Aesthetics and community reception are factors which virtually don't even apply to subbed customers.

Subs like the game as is and are enjoying what they have. ZOS doesn't have to convince them to buy more. All they have to do is not screw it up.

Crown purchases are fickle and significantly less reliable for a number of reasons that aren't even listed here. If ZOS wants people to buy Crowns they have to continue to offer new and exciting things.

Thank you.What I have been trying to explain to people all along.

No problem.
Let's also not forget that subscriptions are a more solid number that people at OS can show to banks or shareholders or whomever typically require sales figures and say, "We have this many loyal customers."

Harder to do that with random Crown purchases.

I know they get my $15.00 every month.Plus the crowns i buy as well,..sometimes.

Mr.Hmm

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

Honestly i am up for option 1 but i feel option 2 being a better compromise if they have second thoughts on the exclusive.

clayandaudrey_ESO

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

That is all supposition on your part unless you work for ZOS. There is a reason they use the model they do and it is not because subs make them the money.

Who's supposing now?
I don't have to work for ZOS to see the inherent advantages and disadvantages of the two separate systems.

I didn't say those are the exact reasons ZOS does things, I'm simply refuting the presumption that both systems carry the same level of risk vs. reward.

It is not risk vs reward. It is all about money. There is a reason they are on the model they are on. Just there is a reason for the model swtor is on. Just every other game's model. It is the most profitable. If subs were the main income the model would be different.

Volkodav

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

That is all supposition on your part unless you work for ZOS. There is a reason they use the model they do and it is not because subs make them the money.

Sorry,but subs DO make them money.Every month.Like clockwork.They can depend on that as income. How can you refuse to see such in your face logic?
Sorry,didnt mean to sound rude there.XD
But its true. You actually believe that ZOS doesnt depend on those people paying them money every month? You actually believe that non-subbers will pay that much every month,..dedicatedly,..every month?

Volkodav

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

That is all supposition on your part unless you work for ZOS. There is a reason they use the model they do and it is not because subs make them the money.

Who's supposing now?
I don't have to work for ZOS to see the inherent advantages and disadvantages of the two separate systems.

I didn't say those are the exact reasons ZOS does things, I'm simply refuting the presumption that both systems carry the same level of risk vs. reward.

It is not risk vs reward. It is all about money. There is a reason they are on the model they are on. Just there is a reason for the model swtor is on. Just every other game's model. It is the most profitable. If subs were the main income the model would be different.

They have the non sub as an option,but those people still have to pay for the base game and all DLCs. It is ZOS just hedging their bets.Getting revenue from all sides.If they didnt make good money on Subs,they would have just dropped the sub side totally.Which they havent done.Non subbing just gives them a bit of extras,..on the side.

ShedsHisTail

Allow Inventory space to be increased for the price of gold beyond the 140 space limit.

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

That is all supposition on your part unless you work for ZOS. There is a reason they use the model they do and it is not because subs make them the money.

Who's supposing now?
I don't have to work for ZOS to see the inherent advantages and disadvantages of the two separate systems.

I didn't say those are the exact reasons ZOS does things, I'm simply refuting the presumption that both systems carry the same level of risk vs. reward.

It is not risk vs reward. It is all about money. There is a reason they are on the model they are on. Just there is a reason for the model swtor is on. Just every other game's model. It is the most profitable. If subs were the main income the model would be different.

That's what I mean. It's a financial risk vs reward.

There is more risk in the crown store model because it's less predictable, it fluctuates more, it's fickle.

You know how everyone hates RNG, try running a whole business on one.

Smitch_59

Allow Inventory space to be increased for the price of gold beyond the 140 space limit.

I could be tempted to start a sub to get the crafting bag, but the terrible female armor designs that ZOS has been releasing lately discourage me from subbing. So I will probably just continue using mules to hold my excess inventory.

Volkodav

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

That is all supposition on your part unless you work for ZOS. There is a reason they use the model they do and it is not because subs make them the money.

Who's supposing now?
I don't have to work for ZOS to see the inherent advantages and disadvantages of the two separate systems.

I didn't say those are the exact reasons ZOS does things, I'm simply refuting the presumption that both systems carry the same level of risk vs. reward.

It is not risk vs reward. It is all about money. There is a reason they are on the model they are on. Just there is a reason for the model swtor is on. Just every other game's model. It is the most profitable. If subs were the main income the model would be different.

That's what I mean. It's a financial risk vs reward.

There is more risk in the crown store model because it's less predictable, it fluctuates more, it's fickle.

You know how everyone hates RNG, try running a whole business on one.

There are those who dont sub that wont understand what you are saying.Dependable income is better than casual income.

newtinmpls

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

I didn't say those are the exact reasons ZOS does things, I'm simply refuting the presumption that both systems carry the same level of risk vs. reward.

That was pretty clear....

rotaugen454

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, and DO NOT increase the inventory of other players.

The ESO+ bag should let you crawl inside it to hide from guards.

ShedsHisTail

Allow Inventory space to be increased for the price of gold beyond the 140 space limit.

newtinmpls wrote: »

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

I didn't say those are the exact reasons ZOS does things, I'm simply refuting the presumption that both systems carry the same level of risk vs. reward.

That was pretty clear....

I thought so.
But apparently not.

Elderscrollian

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

There weren't really enough varied answers in the poll to be honest, but for me I think the following.

Craft Bags should remain a perk purely for ESO plusers, they are a perk for subscribing afterall.

I don't object to increasing the inventory/bank space of anyone else, but as with existing upgrades that should be either via gold or crown store purchase.

You could sell a significantly reduced capacity lesser craft bag in the crown store but really...just subscribe.. more subscriptions is better for the game and dramatically increases the chance of additional perks. If people like the game, then providing they are able supporting it really shouldn't be an issue.

FLuFFyxMuFFiN

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, and DO NOT increase the inventory of other players.

Subscribe if you want the sweet sweet benefits. It's not rocket science.

Fukutsu

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

newtinmpls wrote: »

Fukutsu wrote: »

@Taisynn

Hey we pretty much have all agreed that the Craft Bag should be an exclusive.
Also, I think most people think its bull crap that ESO plus members don't get the DLC's included.

I am an ESO sub-er and I do get the DLC's included.

Are some having an issue with that?

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

He wants them as if he purchased them.

^its what clayandaudrey said. I feel like it should be something like, if you subscribed for 12 months, you get to keep whatever DLC's that were released in that twelve months. I just think benefits should be good enough for subscribers to be happy they sub'ed and non subs to be temped to sign up. You gotta understand I don't know the full history of ESO. So from the perspective of someone that has just joined the ESO community, the whole crown store vs ESO plus vs people who pay for neither, is all f'ed up. I find the disgruntled ESO+ members especially confusing, since they chose to sign up. I tried to research whether I should buy DLC's or sub, and figured I would just pay for all the DLC's as they come, and play at my leisure. That way, if my work or college studies become too overwhelming to continue ESO, I can just break and have the DLC's upon my return. Plus, there was nothing appealing about a membership to me, anyway. I don't want to be sub'ed and then not play for a month or so. I used to hate doing that with my xbox live account. It was such a waste.

Volkodav

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

Fukutsu wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

Fukutsu wrote: »

@Taisynn

Hey we pretty much have all agreed that the Craft Bag should be an exclusive.
Also, I think most people think its bull crap that ESO plus members don't get the DLC's included.

I am an ESO sub-er and I do get the DLC's included.

Are some having an issue with that?

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

He wants them as if he purchased them.

^its what clayandaudrey said. I feel like it should be something like, if you subscribed for 12 months, you get to keep whatever DLC's that were released in that twelve months. I just think benefits should be good enough for subscribers to be happy they sub'ed and non subs to be temped to sign up. You gotta understand I don't know the full history of ESO. So from the perspective of someone that has just joined the ESO community, the whole crown store vs ESO plus vs people who pay for neither, is all f'ed up. I find the disgruntled ESO+ members especially confusing, since they chose to sign up. I tried to research whether I should buy DLC's or sub, and figured I would just pay for all the DLC's as they come, and play at my leisure. That way, if my work or college studies become too overwhelming to continue ESO, I can just break and have the DLC's upon my return. Plus, there was nothing appealing about a membership to me, anyway. I don't want to be sub'ed and then not play for a month or so. I used to hate doing that with my xbox live account. It was such a waste.

Do autopay and you wouldnt lose anything.I do that.I dont have to think about whether I have to pay and never miss my payment.

dwtdwtdwt

I'm a subscriber, and I think making the crafting bags exclusive to subscribers is the WORST idea the developers have come up with (and that's a lot of bad ideas). Crafting Bags should be just that- crafted. Make them ridiculous to craft, of course, with the amount of materials, a difficult pattern to acquire, the quality of rare materials, etc. But do not give them to subs for the sake of subbing. Subscribers already get many benefits. This one is crossing the line as far as fairness. If you want every player to subscribe, implement a mandatory subscription base like you had at launch. But don't punish players for not subbing. I feel this craft bag issue is a form of punishment for those who do not sub.

Fukutsu

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

Volkodav wrote: »

Fukutsu wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

Fukutsu wrote: »

@Taisynn

Hey we pretty much have all agreed that the Craft Bag should be an exclusive.
Also, I think most people think its bull crap that ESO plus members don't get the DLC's included.

I am an ESO sub-er and I do get the DLC's included.

Are some having an issue with that?

clayandaudrey_ESO wrote: »

He wants them as if he purchased them.

^its what clayandaudrey said. I feel like it should be something like, if you subscribed for 12 months, you get to keep whatever DLC's that were released in that twelve months. I just think benefits should be good enough for subscribers to be happy they sub'ed and non subs to be temped to sign up. You gotta understand I don't know the full history of ESO. So from the perspective of someone that has just joined the ESO community, the whole crown store vs ESO plus vs people who pay for neither, is all f'ed up. I find the disgruntled ESO+ members especially confusing, since they chose to sign up. I tried to research whether I should buy DLC's or sub, and figured I would just pay for all the DLC's as they come, and play at my leisure. That way, if my work or college studies become too overwhelming to continue ESO, I can just break and have the DLC's upon my return. Plus, there was nothing appealing about a membership to me, anyway. I don't want to be sub'ed and then not play for a month or so. I used to hate doing that with my xbox live account. It was such a waste.

Do autopay and you wouldnt lose anything.I do that.I dont have to think about whether I have to pay and never miss my payment.

Well, the thing is I don't see why I would ever sub now. Since I have the DLC's, and enough crowns for the upcoming DLC, there is no benefit to sub monthly. I don't find the perks to be appealing. and although the Craft Bag is epic AF, I've made some decisions to improve my space management. I'll continue to buy DLC's, and if yall consider me a "casual" player because of it, that's fine. I think it's pretty stupid to be sub'ed instead of just buying crowns. That's just my opinion. For everyone who hates on non-subs for not supporting the game, I have to question what makes them feel responsible for keeping the servers up. I played a decade+ of Diablo II, and never once sent them a check.

Volkodav

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, but I'm alright with increasing inventory for everyone.

dwtdwtdwt wrote: »

I'm a subscriber, and I think making the crafting bags exclusive to subscribers is the WORST idea the developers have come up with (and that's a lot of bad ideas). Crafting Bags should be just that- crafted. Make them ridiculous to craft, of course, with the amount of materials, a difficult pattern to acquire, the quality of rare materials, etc. But do not give them to subs for the sake of subbing. Subscribers already get many benefits. This one is crossing the line as far as fairness. If you want every player to subscribe, implement a mandatory subscription base like you had at launch. But don't punish players for not subbing. I feel this craft bag issue is a form of punishment for those who do not sub.

No.I wouldnt agree to this. Non-subers arent being punished. You have this whole thing upside down,sweety.
It's all about giving an extra something to those who DO sub,..a reward.
No one is being punished.If t hey were the devs would have taken something AWAY from them,but they havent.
I sub,and whether they give me that bag iss neither here nor there.I am of the belief that that basg remain with subbers,and allow non subbers to buy a bag that has a very large,but limited bagspace.
As to the idea of the bags being ridiculous to craft and all those requirements you mentioned wouldnt do a thing to help ZOS gain new subbers. Which is also what that bag is.An incentive to sub.
Your suggestions in themselves for the difficulty in crafting the bags would be a punishment.To everyone.
**Please do not think I meant to berate you in anyway.I was just commenting my thoughts on your suggestions.**

dwtdwtdwt

Volkodav wrote: »

It's all about giving an extra something to those who DO sub,..a reward.
No one is being punished.If t hey were the devs would have taken something AWAY from them,but they havent.

If you want to give something as a reward for subbing, give subbers a new mount, or vanity pet, or costume- like they have done in the past for loyalty. But we are taking about a bag that will change bank and bag inventory in an astronomical way for the game. And I'm really not exaggerating.

Maintaining bag space has been an issue for everyone since the game's launch, at a time when everyone was a subscriber. And now, after two years of this problem, they are "rewarding", not those players who have been around for the duration of the entire game, but only to the players who are currently forking out $15/month, while leaving all those loyal players who happen to not do a monthly sub, but still buy the DLC's and other nicnacs from the Crown Store, left with nothing... like a punishment for not subbing. The "devs" might as well be taking away a crafting bag from us, because it is in the game, "but you aren't supporting the company they way we want you to, so this game changing inventory increase is going to those who spend more money". Sorry, that's just how I see this. And I'm a sub!

Volkodav wrote: »

Which is also what that bag is.An incentive to sub.

I made that point in my previous post.

ИВАН_ВОДКА

okay guys ZOs deleted my post about timecards because advertisement in it
its right

i just told you you you want to pay like me - 14 dollars per two week for timecard, and +3000 crowns, you need to google
and when you google you will find this sites where you can buy legit cheap timecards

cheers

phobossion

Make Craft Bags ESO plus exclusive, and DO NOT increase the inventory of other players.

One thing to remember in the sub vs. DLC purchase discussion is that when you are subbing, you do get access to all the DLCs, but only as long as you are subbed. So you don't really get the same thing for your money (even if you pay more or less the same amount as someone above has pointed out). As the number of DLCs grow, this is only gonna get worse.

CelticStones

I wanted the bag, so I just subbed for the first time. It's gonna be a huge time saver for me, so more actual play time, not swapping stuff between alts, re-logging, getting confused, forgetting things. Old age is a *** sometimes.

sigsergv

dwtdwtdwt wrote: »

If you want to give something as a reward for subbing, give subbers a new mount, or vanity pet, or costume- like they have done in the past for loyalty. But we are taking about a bag that will change bank and bag inventory in an astronomical way for the game. And I'm really not exaggerating.

Maintaining bag space has been an issue for everyone since the game's launch, at a time when everyone was a subscriber. And now, after two years of this problem, they are "rewarding", not those players who have been around for the duration of the entire game, but only to the players who are currently forking out $15/month, while leaving all those loyal players who happen to not do a monthly sub, but still buy the DLC's and other nicnacs from the Crown Store, left with nothing... like a punishment for not subbing. The "devs" might as well be taking away a crafting bag from us, because it is in the game, "but you aren't supporting the company they way we want you to, so this game changing inventory increase is going to those who spend more money". Sorry, that's just how I see this. And I'm a sub!

That's a very good point indeed!

Sunburnt_Penguin

newtinmpls wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

I can stop my sub today and not pay any more money which is the same as a non-sub. If the cash paid between a sub and a non-sub is the same, they therefore share the same monetary value of ESO are also subject to same risk.

And (to continue the commitment metaphor) if you are married, you can divorce.

But there is still a certain class of ... subject (MMORPG or potential spouse/date) that likes to reserve the "good stuff" to someone who actually commits.

My point though is even if you do sub, your commitment is minimal as if you want to stop you can do at a moments notice without any penalty.

So, when you compare a sub and non-sub who have both paid the same amount of money and both want to stop spending money, there's nothing preventing the sub from stopping. Therefore, there's no extra value to ZOS assigned to that sub compared to the non-sub and as a result IMO both should get access to the Crafting Bag.

Sunburnt_Penguin

Volkodav wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Volkodav wrote: »

Sunburnt_Penguin wrote: »

Other:
Introduce some sort of loyalty system that gives non-subs Crafting Bags according to a certain requirement (e.g. Purchased all DLCs, has spent over a certain amount in the Crown Store relative to when they started playing, etc).

I get the argument that subs reduce risk by giving projected sales but regular Crown Store purchasers also do as well. If the amount of cash spent is the same, the monetary value of ESO is the same and therefore the same benefits should be given. Realistically, there's no difference between these two groups seeing as subs can also stop spending cash very quickly.

BUT,..can ZOS guarantee that Crown Store purchasers will always buy a certain amount of crowns every month though?
That's the thing. Subbers can be guaranteed to pay their subs.At least those who have been subbing for some time.They tend to stick with it.

I can stop my sub today and not pay any more money which is the same as a non-sub. If the cash paid between a sub and a non-sub is the same, they therefore share the same monetary value of ESO are also subject to same risk.

Will you commit to buying the same amount of crowns every month? Not subbed? People who buy crowns only,and not sub,have no incentive to purchase them every month.They are "casuals" in that they cannot be relied on for income every month.They are just casual income. They purchase crowns whenever they want something.If there is nothing they want to buy,they dont buy crowns,..for the majority of non-subbed players.
Non-dependable income is the non-subber who buys crowns.Sure,they buy a lot,..sometimes.That is the point.

I am subbed so I can't answer that.

I'm not talking about non-subs who buy the odd DLC and Crown Store item when they wish. I'm talking comparing two people, a sub and a non-sub who both spend the same amount of cash on Crown Store items (incl. Sub) over a period of time.

Due to the equal amounts of cash spent their monetary values of ESO is therefore same (because if the non-sub had a lower monetary value of ESO compared to the sub then it simply wouldn't spend as much cash). As the monetary value is the same and there's no penalty for cancelling the sub (should they want to), there's therefore the same risk attached to both people stopping spending cash.