@ ZOS, when will Magicka Sorcerers be untied from Destruction Staves?

FatKidHatchets

I'd say over half of yhe sorcs out there use dual wield. And not just for PvP.

You want to use a two handed sword as a sorc go for it. Its doable.

What you are really saying is, "I want swallow soul as a sorcerer." Let's just call it for what it is.

Your class does fine and plays well as is. Both PvE and PvP. You can play with anyset up and do fine, while there maybe a build that does more damage out there iits a matter of min/max. Stop blaming your characters ability for you being stuck with a destro and look at your own ability to play the game, use more of your abilities and learn to use them better.

Anti_Virus

ManDraKE wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

Dr_Talos wrote: »

Two words:
Crystal
Shard

Two words back to you: Cast time.

1 word: noob.

Proc your frags, dear god.

It's people like you that will be the downfall of the game. You have a closed minded stubborn attitude which is not healthy.

Roymachine

Grao wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

But there are 3 different types of destro staff. It's a bit like saying when will stam builds be untied from melee weapons. Heavy attacks are spammable and free, return magicka and do anywhere from 5-10k instant damage. Put one in between every skill and you don't need a spammable dps skill. Sorcs are kings of burst, embrace it.

I'm being controversial I know but I see a lot of players demanding a spammable dps skill but I genuinely don't see the need in pvp. Sustained dps and high burst? It's got to be one or the other surely?

I would rather zos work out how to separate pvp and pve so tweaks to skills for one crowd don't negatively imapct the other crowd.

I am sorry, when it concerns end game PvE there is one elemental staff only and that is Fire. Lightning is still horrible for light attack weaving as it gets stuck in heavy attack mode at random times and the bonus from Ice is pretty much useless in PvE boss fights.

Sorcerers are the king of burst damage and that may be great for PVP< it is so good in PvP the class is often nerfed because of PvP complains. Where does that leave sorcerers in PvE though? No one from ZoS told sorcerers two years back that sorcerers would only ever bee good for burst and that even that would be constantly nerfed because of PvP complains. Where those two years of effort go now that the class is ruined for PvE?

Besides, ZoS has said again and again and again that ESO is supposed to be about 'play as you want', they said it so many times it got tiresome to hear it... Well, I want to play my magicka sorcerer with a main weapon that is not a staff...

So equip a bow, spec hybrid, and have a ball. Nothing is really stopping you.

Valrien

FatKidHatchets wrote: »

I'd say over half of yhe sorcs out there use dual wield. And not just for PvP.

You want to use a two handed sword as a sorc go for it. Its doable.

What you are really saying is, "I want swallow soul as a sorcerer." Let's just call it for what it is.

Your class does fine and plays well as is. Both PvE and PvP. You can play with anyset up and do fine, while there maybe a build that does more damage out there iits a matter of min/max. Stop blaming your characters ability for you being stuck with a destro and look at your own ability to play the game, use more of your abilities and learn to use them better.

In PvE, dual swords as a main bar is not viable. It is used for Overload and executing and that's about it. Dual Swords on a Sorcerer is plain BAD because there's no filler DPS, only a burst combo that has to be repeated and isn't viable for PvE.

If you move away from Destro as a Sorc, your DPS is worse. It's lower, and Sorcerers don't need lower DPS (they're already the lowest). I'd consider myself a very high-caliber players, and I've tried builds variant outside of the Force Pulse meta...and let me tell you IT DOES NOT WORK. For Sorcerers the option we do have for a spammable (Crystal Shards) has a couple of flaws:
1. It's too expensive to use. I tried using it to solo DPS bloodspawn (the best way to test) and I was consistently out of magicka at the end. Now, that was about 45 seconds and MoL fights last 5+ minutes.
2. It's simply not as good. The buffed DPS parses were 32k for the Force Pulse build, and 28k for the dual swords Crystal build. Not to mention that 32k is pretty high for a Sorcerer and it's low-end for other classes in terms of a competitive setting.
3. Crystal Blast travels in an arc, and Crystal Fragments is simply pointless in this kind of build since it procs off of abilities besides itself and your goal is to spam it. It's a loss of DPS either way if you're even considering this build.

So yeah, Sorc sucks and we're forced to use Destro staff.

Anti_Virus

@Grao

I think the main problem is the lack of ranged builds in general as I said before 3/4 classes are melee focused while the sorc is ranged but they designed the class to be supported by pets.

NB= Stamina/Magicka (Stam dominant) Melee dps
DK= Stamina/Magicka(Stam dominant) Melee dps
Templar= Stamina/Magicka(Magic dominant) Melee dps
Sorc= Magicka (Magic dominate) Ranged dps

The problem:

Your main dps skill has a cast time (unless procced) and NOBODY like cast times in a game where instant cast dps skills deal the most damage. This is why every sorc chooses crystal frags no matter how much dmg the other morph deals similarly to how snipe works since that skill also has a cast time.

The solution:

Make the other morph and instant cast ability with the knock down removed. Then compensate the damage for the cast time.
Also even though this is a thread about sorcs I would suggest that they also do the same thing to snipe as above ^^^.

Anti_Virus

Roymachine wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

But there are 3 different types of destro staff. It's a bit like saying when will stam builds be untied from melee weapons. Heavy attacks are spammable and free, return magicka and do anywhere from 5-10k instant damage. Put one in between every skill and you don't need a spammable dps skill. Sorcs are kings of burst, embrace it.

I'm being controversial I know but I see a lot of players demanding a spammable dps skill but I genuinely don't see the need in pvp. Sustained dps and high burst? It's got to be one or the other surely?

I would rather zos work out how to separate pvp and pve so tweaks to skills for one crowd don't negatively imapct the other crowd.

I am sorry, when it concerns end game PvE there is one elemental staff only and that is Fire. Lightning is still horrible for light attack weaving as it gets stuck in heavy attack mode at random times and the bonus from Ice is pretty much useless in PvE boss fights.

Sorcerers are the king of burst damage and that may be great for PVP< it is so good in PvP the class is often nerfed because of PvP complains. Where does that leave sorcerers in PvE though? No one from ZoS told sorcerers two years back that sorcerers would only ever bee good for burst and that even that would be constantly nerfed because of PvP complains. Where those two years of effort go now that the class is ruined for PvE?

Besides, ZoS has said again and again and again that ESO is supposed to be about 'play as you want', they said it so many times it got tiresome to hear it... Well, I want to play my magicka sorcerer with a main weapon that is not a staff...

So equip a bow, spec hybrid, and have a ball. Nothing is really stopping you.

Except you can't do that because this isn't 1.5 anymore.

Anti_Virus

FatKidHatchets wrote: »

I'd say over half of yhe sorcs out there use dual wield. And not just for PvP.

You want to use a two handed sword as a sorc go for it. Its doable.

What you are really saying is, "I want swallow soul as a sorcerer." Let's just call it for what it is.

Your class does fine and plays well as is. Both PvE and PvP. You can play with anyset up and do fine, while there maybe a build that does more damage out there iits a matter of min/max. Stop blaming your characters ability for you being stuck with a destro and look at your own ability to play the game, use more of your abilities and learn to use them better.

What you're saying is "Don't attempt to be different, conform to the meta like everyone else"

Not everyone want to run the same build to be competitive this is why we have forums to give up suggestions on how to improve the game.

Grao

FatKidHatchets wrote: »

I'd say over half of yhe sorcs out there use dual wield. And not just for PvP.

You want to use a two handed sword as a sorc go for it. Its doable.

What you are really saying is, "I want swallow soul as a sorcerer." Let's just call it for what it is.

Your class does fine and plays well as is. Both PvE and PvP. You can play with anyset up and do fine, while there maybe a build that does more damage out there iits a matter of min/max. Stop blaming your characters ability for you being stuck with a destro and look at your own ability to play the game, use more of your abilities and learn to use them better.

Have you actually played a sorcerer in end game, competitive PvE? Be cause if you haven't, then your opinion is just uninformed babbling.

What I want is what other Magicka classes have, an alternative to Force Pulse, which we currently don't have. What I want is an ability ZoS can use to regulate Magicka Sorcerer DPS that won't affect our performance too heavily in PvP. What I want is some build diversity for our Magicka builds because currently no matter what we choose to build towards, pets, magicka, spell power, we are completely tied to a destruction staff as our main hand weapon.

Until this patch we had one alternative in Trapping Webs and quite a few sorcerers were starting to go for it, but guess what? They made the skill and its morphs all stamina morphs! So we are all tied to staves... Again.

Sorcerers are not doing fine in PvE. The class has nearly no utility in their ultimates with Negate having been so weakened because of its power in PvP. We have been for several months the weakest stamina and magicka DPS out there. The changes to Ward make it nearly impossible to tank as a sorcerer and we can't heal as the pet we have for healing builds is paper thin and dies if you breath in its general direction. I am sorry, none of that is 'fine'.

Grao

ShadowStarKing wrote: »

@Grao

I think the main problem is the lack of ranged builds in general as I said before 3/4 classes are melee focused while the sorc is ranged but they designed the class to be supported by pets.

NB= Stamina/Magicka (Stam dominant) Melee dps
DK= Stamina/Magicka(Stam dominant) Melee dps
Templar= Stamina/Magicka(Magic dominant) Melee dps
Sorc= Magicka (Magic dominate) Ranged dps

The problem:

Your main dps skill has a cast time (unless procced) and NOBODY like cast times in a game where instant cast dps skills deal the most damage. This is why every sorc chooses crystal frags no matter how much dmg the other morph deals similarly to how snipe works since that skill also has a cast time.

The solution:

Make the other morph and instant cast ability with the knock down removed. Then compensate the damage for the cast time.
Also even though this is a thread about sorcs I would suggest that they also do the same thing to snipe as above ^^^.

Unfortunately the cast time is not the only issue with Crystal Fragments. The ability is extremely costly as well and its damage does not justify the high cost or the cast time. That is why Crystal Blast is not used (well, that and because apparently the ability has been bugged for a while), the only way it is useful to cast Crystal Fragments is to go through its proc which lower its cost by half and increase its damage by 35%.

iam117

i seriously do not understand why people keep saying that magicka nb uses swallow/funnel, most top dps mageblade in pve now use force pulse weave, its stronger. funnel is not an option for high end raiding anymore as force pulse outshines it pretty noticeably.

@Grao im curious what kind of numbers your seeing in pve? i know quite a few sorcs that are getting very respectable dps parses, even in vmol, myself included, that put sorks with the right driver higher than the majority of the game dps wise (over 30k bloodspawn, over 35k on twins in vmol). sure other classes with the right players will out dps, but imho magicka sork is right up there with magicka nb (i play both and raid with high output players that use both) maybe slightly behind. this is without overload obviously.

for pvp im not really going to comment on, other than to say it would be cool to see some changes made to class skills to add more utility within the sork trees with skills that are bassically dead.

in pve every magicka build is tied to destro staff in some way.

Kattemynte

Maybe it is just me but I think the sorcerer needs a spammable skill in their skill line. I think that the Crystal Frags proc rate to make it instant and deal more damage is a really cool mechanic that the other classes do not have. In PvE at least you are rotating through a lot of magicka skills and whenever Frags proc you get a high damage instant cast skill.

Yes, we are reliant on Force Pulse when Frags does not proc and having a different skill to be able to spam would be nice but I do not want it. I like the fact that each class has their own thing that makes them unique. I do not want the classes to have all the same type of skills with different names.

Grao

liv3mind wrote: »

i seriously do not understand why people keep saying that magicka nb uses swallow/funnel, most top dps mageblade in pve now use force pulse weave, its stronger. funnel is not an option for high end raiding anymore as force pulse outshines it pretty noticeably.

@Grao im curious what kind of numbers your seeing in pve? i know quite a few sorcs that are getting very respectable dps parses, even in vmol, myself included, that put sorks with the right driver higher than the majority of the game dps wise (over 30k bloodspawn, over 35k on twins in vmol). sure other classes with the right players will out dps, but imho magicka sork is right up there with magicka nb (i play both and raid with high output players that use both) maybe slightly behind. this is without overload obviously.

for pvp im not really going to comment on, other than to say it would be cool to see some changes made to class skills to add more utility within the sork trees with skills that are bassically dead.

in pve every magicka build is tied to destro staff in some way.

30K and 35K is not high DPS, sorcerers can get up to 40K, it is our limit. Other classes can get from 45k to 50k which is a huge difference if you also consider sorcerers being very little in Utility to a Raid. And while it is true every Magicka build is half tied to a Destro Staff, that does not mean they are tied to a Destro staff as their main weapon. It is huge difference.

By tying us so heavily to a destro staff ZoS forces us to main hand it, meaning we have to use Fire Staff. It also means we have no spells to weave during overload as our only spammable is part of a weapon tree, that lowers Overload sustained DPS considerably, making extended use of the Ultimate actually weaker than our normal rotation.

We have an unhealthy number of abilities that borderline uselessness, I don't understand why is it such a problem that we want a skill every other class has access to. By the way, you, as nightblade, choose to use a destro staff for your main attack. We sorceres have no such choice. The two situations are worlds apart.

Grao

dtsv217_ESO wrote: »

Maybe it is just me but I think the sorcerer needs a spammable skill in their skill line. I think that the Crystal Frags proc rate to make it instant and deal more damage is a really cool mechanic that the other classes do not have. In PvE at least you are rotating through a lot of magicka skills and whenever Frags proc you get a high damage instant cast skill.

Yes, we are reliant on Force Pulse when Frags does not proc and having a different skill to be able to spam would be nice but I do not want it. I like the fact that each class has their own thing that makes them unique. I do not want the classes to have all the same type of skills with different names.

Cool, you can choose to keep using Force Pulse, some of us are looking for alternatives to increase our DPS and build diversity though. Being tied to a single weapon with one of the lowest damages among the single target spammable abilities is not cool.

Also, tell you didn't wish you had a spammable spell to weave with Overload light attacks and I will tell you that you don't play a sorcerer in end game competitive PvE.

Foxic

Grao wrote: »

dtsv217_ESO wrote: »

Maybe it is just me but I think the sorcerer needs a spammable skill in their skill line. I think that the Crystal Frags proc rate to make it instant and deal more damage is a really cool mechanic that the other classes do not have. In PvE at least you are rotating through a lot of magicka skills and whenever Frags proc you get a high damage instant cast skill.

Yes, we are reliant on Force Pulse when Frags does not proc and having a different skill to be able to spam would be nice but I do not want it. I like the fact that each class has their own thing that makes them unique. I do not want the classes to have all the same type of skills with different names.

Cool, you can choose to keep using Force Pulse, some of us are looking for alternatives to increase our DPS and build diversity though. Being tied to a single weapon with one of the lowest damages among the single target spammable abilities is not cool.

Also, tell you didn't wish you had a spammable spell to weave with Overload light attacks and I will tell you that you don't play a sorcerer in end game competitive PvE.

While I fully agree with most of your points. I cannot justify weaving a skill in between overloads.

And to @liv3mind there are a few sorcerers pulling decent numbers but we are far far behind all of the other magicka classes especially in the single target area

Grao

TotallyNotVos wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

dtsv217_ESO wrote: »

Maybe it is just me but I think the sorcerer needs a spammable skill in their skill line. I think that the Crystal Frags proc rate to make it instant and deal more damage is a really cool mechanic that the other classes do not have. In PvE at least you are rotating through a lot of magicka skills and whenever Frags proc you get a high damage instant cast skill.

Yes, we are reliant on Force Pulse when Frags does not proc and having a different skill to be able to spam would be nice but I do not want it. I like the fact that each class has their own thing that makes them unique. I do not want the classes to have all the same type of skills with different names.

Cool, you can choose to keep using Force Pulse, some of us are looking for alternatives to increase our DPS and build diversity though. Being tied to a single weapon with one of the lowest damages among the single target spammable abilities is not cool.

Also, tell you didn't wish you had a spammable spell to weave with Overload light attacks and I will tell you that you don't play a sorcerer in end game competitive PvE.

While I fully agree with most of your points. I cannot justify weaving a skill in between overloads.

And to @liv3mind there are a few sorcerers pulling decent numbers but we are far far behind all of the other magicka classes especially in the single target area

If you use Overload for extended periods of time you end up losing DPS when comparing the results you obtain with what you'd get through your normal rotation. That is due to being unable to use your weapon abilities while in Overload state, meaning you lose Elemental Blockade / Unstable Wall and Force Pulse. If we had a spammable ability that was as powerful or more powerful than Force Pulse we'd be able to weave it between overload light attacks increasing the overall damage resulting from using that ultimate quite considerable. Besides that, weaving an ability between the Overload light attacks prevents the ability from bugging and getting stuck in heavy attack mode as it resets the light attack every time.

As for our numbers, the difference is pretty clear. Our best build achieves about 40K DPS while other builds from other classes can achieve around 45-50 k DPS. That difference wouldn't be so harsh if Sorcerers brought utility to the raid group but in our current state, we simply don't. What is the motivation then for a raid leader aiming for competitive numbers to bring a sorcerer or three? We have the worse DPS and the worse utility as well...

KenaPKK

Yea I've got to disagree with this too. Sorcs already have tons of burst. I've been playing a max sustain build sorc, and I still have way more damage than my damage spec mageblade. Giving sorcs a spam dps move would be pretty ridic.

Grao

Did you get to late game with your sorcerer? Because if you haven't I can actually understand your post. We do pretty well while leveling, we just suck at all late game PvE, specially in group contents. ^^

Yes, sorcerers have more burst, likely the most burst of all the classes when built for it and that is effective, to a point in PvP. In PvE... Well, burst is pretty much useless. The idea of giving us our own spammable ability isn't to increase our burst and it wouldn't, just like Force Pulse, our current spammable does not factor much into Sorcerer's burst potential. I am not suggesting an over powered skill here, just something slightly stronger than Force Pulse with morphs for melee and ranged combat. Our passives acting upon the ability and being activated by this ability would take care of the rest.

But you are a PvPer from your signature. You don't understand how awful is the sorcerer situation on PvE...

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO

KenaPKK wrote: »

Yea I've got to disagree with this too. Sorcs already have tons of burst. I've been playing a max sustain build sorc, and I still have way more damage than my damage spec mageblade. Giving sorcs a spam dps move would be pretty ridic.

They need sustain though, burst means nothing at all in PvE, it's all about sustain there. They need to make PvP and PvE completely separate so that sorcs can be competitive with other classes instead of just being what you take when you absolutely have to but no other time.

Foxic

Grao wrote: »

TotallyNotVos wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

dtsv217_ESO wrote: »

Maybe it is just me but I think the sorcerer needs a spammable skill in their skill line. I think that the Crystal Frags proc rate to make it instant and deal more damage is a really cool mechanic that the other classes do not have. In PvE at least you are rotating through a lot of magicka skills and whenever Frags proc you get a high damage instant cast skill.

Yes, we are reliant on Force Pulse when Frags does not proc and having a different skill to be able to spam would be nice but I do not want it. I like the fact that each class has their own thing that makes them unique. I do not want the classes to have all the same type of skills with different names.

Cool, you can choose to keep using Force Pulse, some of us are looking for alternatives to increase our DPS and build diversity though. Being tied to a single weapon with one of the lowest damages among the single target spammable abilities is not cool.

Also, tell you didn't wish you had a spammable spell to weave with Overload light attacks and I will tell you that you don't play a sorcerer in end game competitive PvE.

While I fully agree with most of your points. I cannot justify weaving a skill in between overloads.

And to @liv3mind there are a few sorcerers pulling decent numbers but we are far far behind all of the other magicka classes especially in the single target area

If you use Overload for extended periods of time you end up losing DPS when comparing the results you obtain with what you'd get through your normal rotation. That is due to being unable to use your weapon abilities while in Overload state, meaning you lose Elemental Blockade / Unstable Wall and Force Pulse. If we had a spammable ability that was as powerful or more powerful than Force Pulse we'd be able to weave it between overload light attacks increasing the overall damage resulting from using that ultimate quite considerable. Besides that, weaving an ability between the Overload light attacks prevents the ability from bugging and getting stuck in heavy attack mode as it resets the light attack every time.

As for our numbers, the difference is pretty clear. Our best build achieves about 40K DPS while other builds from other classes can achieve around 45-50 k DPS. That difference wouldn't be so harsh if Sorcerers brought utility to the raid group but in our current state, we simply don't. What is the motivation then for a raid leader aiming for competitive numbers to bring a sorcerer or three? We have the worse DPS and the worse utility as well...

Yes but for its cost meteor is much better for sustained dps especially for things like vmol.

Although not only does sorc suffer in the sustained dps department. I cannot even compete with templar burst while using overload for 99% of boss fights. So really sorc has nothing. I haven't tested out the new negates yet but I doubt it's a significant enough change to make sorcerers competitive

Anti_Virus

KenaPKK wrote: »

Yea I've got to disagree with this too. Sorcs already have tons of burst. I've been playing a max sustain build sorc, and I still have way more damage than my damage spec mageblade. Giving sorcs a spam dps move would be pretty ridic.

What is a 'ton of burst'? Please explain that to me because magblade has more 'burst' than magsorc.

Currently as a sorc you have to force pulse weave to proc a frag but DKs,Templars and NBs all have instant cast dps skill that synergies well with their class

Furthermore sorcs are suppose to be the range dps but are poor at it compared to magblade since they have a ranged instant cast dps skill(swallow soul) and a ground based dot (twisting path) which are alternatives to force pulse and WoE allowing them to go dual wield and still be effective.

Grao

TotallyNotVos wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

TotallyNotVos wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

dtsv217_ESO wrote: »

Maybe it is just me but I think the sorcerer needs a spammable skill in their skill line. I think that the Crystal Frags proc rate to make it instant and deal more damage is a really cool mechanic that the other classes do not have. In PvE at least you are rotating through a lot of magicka skills and whenever Frags proc you get a high damage instant cast skill.

Yes, we are reliant on Force Pulse when Frags does not proc and having a different skill to be able to spam would be nice but I do not want it. I like the fact that each class has their own thing that makes them unique. I do not want the classes to have all the same type of skills with different names.

Cool, you can choose to keep using Force Pulse, some of us are looking for alternatives to increase our DPS and build diversity though. Being tied to a single weapon with one of the lowest damages among the single target spammable abilities is not cool.

Also, tell you didn't wish you had a spammable spell to weave with Overload light attacks and I will tell you that you don't play a sorcerer in end game competitive PvE.

While I fully agree with most of your points. I cannot justify weaving a skill in between overloads.

And to @liv3mind there are a few sorcerers pulling decent numbers but we are far far behind all of the other magicka classes especially in the single target area

If you use Overload for extended periods of time you end up losing DPS when comparing the results you obtain with what you'd get through your normal rotation. That is due to being unable to use your weapon abilities while in Overload state, meaning you lose Elemental Blockade / Unstable Wall and Force Pulse. If we had a spammable ability that was as powerful or more powerful than Force Pulse we'd be able to weave it between overload light attacks increasing the overall damage resulting from using that ultimate quite considerable. Besides that, weaving an ability between the Overload light attacks prevents the ability from bugging and getting stuck in heavy attack mode as it resets the light attack every time.

As for our numbers, the difference is pretty clear. Our best build achieves about 40K DPS while other builds from other classes can achieve around 45-50 k DPS. That difference wouldn't be so harsh if Sorcerers brought utility to the raid group but in our current state, we simply don't. What is the motivation then for a raid leader aiming for competitive numbers to bring a sorcerer or three? We have the worse DPS and the worse utility as well...

Yes but for its cost meteor is much better for sustained dps especially for things like vmol.

Although not only does sorc suffer in the sustained dps department. I cannot even compete with templar burst while using overload for 99% of boss fights. So really sorc has nothing. I haven't tested out the new negates yet but I doubt it's a significant enough change to make sorcerers competitive

Meteor is a non class ultimate, so again sorcerers are being shoehorned into seeking their Utility and even their damage from outside of their class. It is ridiculous when other classes enjoy ultimates so damn essential to raiding such as Veil and Nova.

That aside, Templars burst come from their incredibly powerful Execute and DPSing for extended period using Overload and the few DoTs you can still manage is a general loss in DPS as you have no ability to weave with your light attacks. You may get a slightly higher DPS with overload if you are using dual wield swords, but that doesn't reflect the ultimates power and usability, but the power of Dual Wield in magic builds. Meteor is a better damage alternative in long fights as you can drop it several times for a considerable amount of damage.

That situation would change if sorcerers had a spammable ability though.

Rilmarshim

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

Dr_Talos wrote: »

Two words:
Crystal
Shard

Two Words

@Dr_Talos noob

That's one word ^^

bloodenragedb14_ESO

You know, just a stray thought, why not let frags proc off itself? i think that would add a little versatility and dps to us mag-sorc's. This is only said, however, since ive seen no willingness from ZOS to lower the cast time, or give us a better spamable ability

Grao

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

You know, just a stray thought, why not let frags proc off itself? i think that would add a little versatility and dps to us mag-sorc's. This is only said, however, since ive seen no willingness from ZOS to lower the cast time, or give us a better spamable ability

Could be interesting but I doubt they'd do it. Can you imagine getting hit by two Crystal Fragments in roll in PvP. The tears would flow.

No, the best alternative is to give us a good enough spammable to replace Useless Exchange. It can't be that hard, they have enough particles in their library to recolor a nice looking one and use that for a sorcerer skill. The mechanics also seem pretty simple... It could be done even in this short amount of time... But like you I doubt it will happen...

I mean, I am chasing the devs and admins on the forum linking this thread to them in the hopes we will at least get an answer, but so far, not a pip...

bloodenragedb14_ESO

Grao wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

You know, just a stray thought, why not let frags proc off itself? i think that would add a little versatility and dps to us mag-sorc's. This is only said, however, since ive seen no willingness from ZOS to lower the cast time, or give us a better spamable ability

Could be interesting but I doubt they'd do it. Can you imagine getting hit by two Crystal Fragments in roll in PvP. The tears would flow.

No, the best alternative is to give us a good enough spammable to replace Useless Exchange. It can't be that hard, they have enough particles in their library to recolor a nice looking one and use that for a sorcerer skill. The mechanics also seem pretty simple... It could be done even in this short amount of time... But like you I doubt it will happen...

I mean, I am chasing the devs and admins on the forum linking this thread to them in the hopes we will at least get an answer, but so far, not a pip...

while i think giving us a spammable dark magic dps ability would be awsome, i think it would cause more tears than my idea honestly, people will whine and moan about the sorc that heals itself on every hit.

Adding a spammable dps ability to bound armor morphs seems less controversial to me.

That, or, and this is just spitballing, change the execute in storm call to something with a high dps output.

Dont get me wrong, i agree with you on the dark exchange is mostly useless, but from where i am sitting i doubt it will get changed due to the aforementioned reasons

zuto40

this is now a nerf sorc thread

bloodenragedb14_ESO

zuto40 wrote: »

this is now a nerf sorc thread

from what i have seen, no, no it is not, its a discussion on how to make sorc's more competitive in pve.

please be constructive, rather than a troll. this is the last ill acknowledge you until you are constructive

Grao

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

You know, just a stray thought, why not let frags proc off itself? i think that would add a little versatility and dps to us mag-sorc's. This is only said, however, since ive seen no willingness from ZOS to lower the cast time, or give us a better spamable ability

Could be interesting but I doubt they'd do it. Can you imagine getting hit by two Crystal Fragments in roll in PvP. The tears would flow.

No, the best alternative is to give us a good enough spammable to replace Useless Exchange. It can't be that hard, they have enough particles in their library to recolor a nice looking one and use that for a sorcerer skill. The mechanics also seem pretty simple... It could be done even in this short amount of time... But like you I doubt it will happen...

I mean, I am chasing the devs and admins on the forum linking this thread to them in the hopes we will at least get an answer, but so far, not a pip...

while i think giving us a spammable dark magic dps ability would be awsome, i think it would cause more tears than my idea honestly, people will whine and moan about the sorc that heals itself on every hit.

Adding a spammable dps ability to bound armor morphs seems less controversial to me.

That, or, and this is just spitballing, change the execute in storm call to something with a high dps output.

Dont get me wrong, i agree with you on the dark exchange is mostly useless, but from where i am sitting i doubt it will get changed due to the aforementioned reasons

The numbers on the self heal from that spammable abilities can be managed though, Blood Magic it self only heals for 8% of your max health, that in case of magicka sorcerers is about 16k health, so about 1200 health per attack? That is not a huge heal, it is even less than they are giving sorcerers with Surge and it is not like we will be using the spammable ability every second as we have other skills to manage as well. Blockade or Unstable wall would still be part of our base build (though in a back bar) so would be liquid lightning.

I think the buffs to Aegis and Armaments should aim towards buffs and heals. Aegis is supposed to relate a shield which in turn relates to tanking. A good self healing that is instant would be great here. Meanwhile armaments could grant Stamina sorcerers one of the buffs they so desperately need like Minor Berserk or Minor Breach (Berserk would even be a temptation for magicka sorcerers).

bloodenragedb14_ESO

Grao wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

You know, just a stray thought, why not let frags proc off itself? i think that would add a little versatility and dps to us mag-sorc's. This is only said, however, since ive seen no willingness from ZOS to lower the cast time, or give us a better spamable ability

Could be interesting but I doubt they'd do it. Can you imagine getting hit by two Crystal Fragments in roll in PvP. The tears would flow.

No, the best alternative is to give us a good enough spammable to replace Useless Exchange. It can't be that hard, they have enough particles in their library to recolor a nice looking one and use that for a sorcerer skill. The mechanics also seem pretty simple... It could be done even in this short amount of time... But like you I doubt it will happen...

I mean, I am chasing the devs and admins on the forum linking this thread to them in the hopes we will at least get an answer, but so far, not a pip...

while i think giving us a spammable dark magic dps ability would be awsome, i think it would cause more tears than my idea honestly, people will whine and moan about the sorc that heals itself on every hit.

Adding a spammable dps ability to bound armor morphs seems less controversial to me.

That, or, and this is just spitballing, change the execute in storm call to something with a high dps output.

Dont get me wrong, i agree with you on the dark exchange is mostly useless, but from where i am sitting i doubt it will get changed due to the aforementioned reasons

The numbers on the self heal from that spammable abilities can be managed though, Blood Magic it self only heals for 8% of your max health, that in case of magicka sorcerers is about 16k health, so about 1200 health per attack? That is not a huge heal, it is even less than they are giving sorcerers with Surge and it is not like we will be using the spammable ability every second as we have other skills to manage as well. Blockade or Unstable wall would still be part of our base build (though in a back bar) so would be liquid lightning.

I think the buffs to Aegis and Armaments should aim towards buffs and heals. Aegis is supposed to relate a shield which in turn relates to tanking. A good self healing that is instant would be great here. Meanwhile armaments could grant Stamina sorcerers one of the buffs they so desperately need like Minor Berserk or Minor Breach (Berserk would even be a temptation for magicka sorcerers).

it may not be a huge heal, on that ill agree, but if procing off a instant attack ability would make it a tad op, not to say we do not need it of course, but i can just hear the whining now. rather than getting the ability, then blood magic being nerfed down the line, id rather avoid that whole nightmare. We do need a instant spammable dps ability, but i dont think it should be in the dark magic tree, however much i would like it to be

Grao

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

You know, just a stray thought, why not let frags proc off itself? i think that would add a little versatility and dps to us mag-sorc's. This is only said, however, since ive seen no willingness from ZOS to lower the cast time, or give us a better spamable ability

Could be interesting but I doubt they'd do it. Can you imagine getting hit by two Crystal Fragments in roll in PvP. The tears would flow.

No, the best alternative is to give us a good enough spammable to replace Useless Exchange. It can't be that hard, they have enough particles in their library to recolor a nice looking one and use that for a sorcerer skill. The mechanics also seem pretty simple... It could be done even in this short amount of time... But like you I doubt it will happen...

I mean, I am chasing the devs and admins on the forum linking this thread to them in the hopes we will at least get an answer, but so far, not a pip...

while i think giving us a spammable dark magic dps ability would be awsome, i think it would cause more tears than my idea honestly, people will whine and moan about the sorc that heals itself on every hit.

Adding a spammable dps ability to bound armor morphs seems less controversial to me.

That, or, and this is just spitballing, change the execute in storm call to something with a high dps output.

Dont get me wrong, i agree with you on the dark exchange is mostly useless, but from where i am sitting i doubt it will get changed due to the aforementioned reasons

The numbers on the self heal from that spammable abilities can be managed though, Blood Magic it self only heals for 8% of your max health, that in case of magicka sorcerers is about 16k health, so about 1200 health per attack? That is not a huge heal, it is even less than they are giving sorcerers with Surge and it is not like we will be using the spammable ability every second as we have other skills to manage as well. Blockade or Unstable wall would still be part of our base build (though in a back bar) so would be liquid lightning.

I think the buffs to Aegis and Armaments should aim towards buffs and heals. Aegis is supposed to relate a shield which in turn relates to tanking. A good self healing that is instant would be great here. Meanwhile armaments could grant Stamina sorcerers one of the buffs they so desperately need like Minor Berserk or Minor Breach (Berserk would even be a temptation for magicka sorcerers).

it may not be a huge heal, on that ill agree, but if procing off a instant attack ability would make it a tad op, not to say we do not need it of course, but i can just hear the whining now. rather than getting the ability, then blood magic being nerfed down the line, id rather avoid that whole nightmare. We do need a instant spammable dps ability, but i dont think it should be in the dark magic tree, however much i would like it to be

They could insert a CD in Blood Magic, similar to what they have with Surge. It would be a huge change from what is now as we don't currently activate that many Dark Magic Abilities that do damage. It is mostly the random proc of Crystal Frags right now.

I just don't see the spammable fitting in the Summing Tree, besides, it would benefit of none of the passives and would make no sense for bound aegis to have such a damage element.