Stamina Sorcerer Feedback Thread: Patch 2.4.3 Update - Crit surge now affected by Battle Spirit

Spearblade

Streak should be kept the same old magicka zoom to random spot x meters ahead of you. Stamina morph should be targeted gap closer. Both have value then regardless if magicka or stam character then.

Spearblade

Thal wrote: »

I still think that if stam sorc-ness (think You, Me, and Dupree here) is crit-based, that the passives or abilities need to give access to a maj/min Force buff. i.e. Crit surge major brutality removed (it's not unique) and replaced with force in some iteration. I can get major brutality via the weapon skill lines that we''ve been pushed toward.

Nooooooooooooooooo. Losing Major Brutality on Critical Surge would mean Rally is even more of a must. Flying Blade's Major Brutality is far too short to be viable. While I do like the idea of Minor Force (Major would be OP), Major Brutality has to remain available thru a Sorcerer skill.

Erock25

Spearblade wrote: »

Thal wrote: »

I still think that if stam sorc-ness (think You, Me, and Dupree here) is crit-based, that the passives or abilities need to give access to a maj/min Force buff. i.e. Crit surge major brutality removed (it's not unique) and replaced with force in some iteration. I can get major brutality via the weapon skill lines that we''ve been pushed toward.

Nooooooooooooooooo. Losing Major Brutality on Critical Surge would mean Rally is even more of a must. Flying Blade's Major Brutality is far too short to be viable. While I do like the idea of Minor Force (Major would be OP), Major Brutality has to remain available thru a Sorcerer skill.

Flying blade brutality duration was increased to 20 seconds.

Jar_Ek

For a gap closer change the unused lightning splash morph (flood) or ball of lightning into a storm style ability that ports you to target and performs an aoe (drops a physical DoT for splash on landing, or stuns on landing for bolt variant).

KingShocker

do any of you stam sorc's like weapon damage?

Jar_Ek

@KingShocker What are you stacking to get that? Thinking about it isn't there a ui bug about mundus effects showing 10x - maybe you're suffering from that?

KingShocker

@Jar_Ek ya about 2k of it is from the bugged warrior mundus

Ajax_22

With Silver Leash being changed to a gap closer I don't see the need to have a class specific one. I think the dev time would be far better spent updating our passives or giving us some of the other things we lack.

Ahzek

KingShocker wrote: »

do any of you stam sorc's like weapon damage?

Warrior mundus is bugged and shows way more than it should. What would be more interesting is you TT damage.

NinjaApacHe

I love the changes they made to Hurricane, and love my stam sorc. Why utility with magicka? My best utility on my DK or NB is shuffle..... Then you have Energized that gives you +5% phisical damage. Slot Bound Armaments and u get +8% stam (+phisical damage) + 11% HA damage and passive +20% H&S recovery.

Grao

NinjaApacHe wrote: »

I love the changes they made to Hurricane, and love my stam sorc. Why utility with magicka? My best utility on my DK or NB is shuffle..... Then you have Energized that gives you +5% phisical damage. Slot Bound Armaments and u get +8% stam (+phisical damage) + 11% HA damage and passive +20% H&S recovery.

Utility is important for Raiding, it is the utility that makes classes more desirable in raids and sorcerers have very poor party utility since Negate was nerfed. I have hopes the new buffs to the ability can put it in the same level as Veil or Nova in damage mitigation.

Tyrannitar

Jar_Ek wrote: »

@KingShocker What are you stacking to get that? Thinking about it isn't there a ui bug about mundus effects showing 10x - maybe you're suffering from that?

Yep. This is because he's running Warrior mundus. The actual value would be around 6k

genjutsu_kami

DDuke wrote: »

I agree that stam sorcs need some more love and Hurricane not giving Major Expedition is a big nerf.

However, what I find to be the biggest problem of stamina sorcs is none of what you listed. It's the lack of a good CC.

Previously you had Wrecking Blow as kind of a CC & spammable DPS skill - well, you can still Wrecking Blow for damage (or use the new Flurry), but where are you going to get the CC from?


Also, you left out a pretty big one from your sorc passives list:

Daedric Protection
Increases your Health and Stamina recovery by 20% when a Daedric Summoning ability is slotted.


Anyway, back on topic: I'd add a CC portion to the Hurricane skill (maybe a knockback/knockdown after full duration or upon activation) & that alone goes a long way to fixing stamina sorc issues.

I don't think stamina sorcerers need a spammable dps skill, there's a reason DW & 2H skills exist.

but wait....

nightblades - Concealed weapon (instant dps ability)
dragon night - claw + fire breath (sorry don't know the names but they are both instant dps abilities with added benefits)
templar - biting jabs - (instant dps ability)
sorc - ............ bound armour .... (really....)

rrrrrmm so why would we not need an instant dps again ?? when every other class has one .....

Spearblade

NinjaApacHe wrote: »

I love the changes they made to Hurricane, and love my stam sorc. Why utility with magicka? My best utility on my DK or NB is shuffle..... Then you have Energized that gives you +5% phisical damage. Slot Bound Armaments and u get +8% stam (+phisical damage) + 11% HA damage and passive +20% H&S recovery.

Wait...what? Are you honestly saying DK and NB don't have magicka utility skills?

Cloak, Dragon Blood, Resolve, Spiked Armor, Double Take/Mirage, Relentless Resolve, Shadow Image...

*boggle*

Shuffle is good, to be sure, but it's Stamina and everybody can get it.

Tyrannitar

Jar_Ek wrote: »

For a gap closer change the unused lightning splash morph (flood) or ball of lightning into a storm style ability that ports you to target and performs an aoe (drops a physical DoT for splash on landing, or stuns on landing for bolt variant).

I could see this being easily coded if code from storm NPCs was hijacked and reworked.

That skill where a mage NPC ports to you and then a huge aoe lightning effect does it's thing


But these kinds of suggestions are out of the realm of possibility for next patch.

The best we can hope for is for @wrobel to fix crit surge and give us a instant-cast dps ability for stam

Tyrannitar

Spearblade wrote: »

NinjaApacHe wrote: »

I love the changes they made to Hurricane, and love my stam sorc. Why utility with magicka? My best utility on my DK or NB is shuffle..... Then you have Energized that gives you +5% phisical damage. Slot Bound Armaments and u get +8% stam (+phisical damage) + 11% HA damage and passive +20% H&S recovery.

Wait...what? Are you honestly saying DK and NB don't have magicka utility skills?

Cloak, Dragon Blood, Resolve, Spiked Armor, Double Take/Mirage, Relentless Resolve, Shadow Image...

*boggle*

Shuffle is good, to be sure, but it's Stamina and everybody can get it.

I don't even know why he's running shuffle over mirage as a nb period honestly.

XaXa

long time reader, first time writer. Made an account just for this.

Has their been any word as to whether Surge not being effected by Battle Spirit is intended or not?

Also fingers crossed they have been reading this and plan to bring some more changes next incremental...

Sublime

Grao wrote: »

Utility is important for Raiding, it is the utility that makes classes more desirable in raids and sorcerers have very poor party utility since Negate was nerfed. I have hopes the new buffs to the ability can put it in the same level as Veil or Nova in damage mitigation.

Just in case you are talking about PvP. Negate is easily going to outclass any other ultimate, because of it's unbreakable CC.

PainfulFAFA

Sublime wrote: »

Grao wrote: »

Utility is important for Raiding, it is the utility that makes classes more desirable in raids and sorcerers have very poor party utility since Negate was nerfed. I have hopes the new buffs to the ability can put it in the same level as Veil or Nova in damage mitigation.

Just in case you are talking about PvP. Negate is easily going to outclass any other ultimate, because of it's unbreakable CC.

Assuming the target is out of stam inside the Negate.
Just to clarify, the CC will be breakable but there are two CCs now one from stun and the other from silence

Jar_Ek

I thought PvP Negate only did a silence and tbh can't you just walk out of it?

exiledtyrant

Jar_Ek wrote: »

I thought PvP Negate only did a silence and tbh can't you just walk out of it?

An unbreakable silence that takes about 2 rolls from the center to escape or 1 roll from the edge. It'll be good for fighting in bottlenecks though. Like blocking off a road to a keep on one of the various bridges or forts. Terrible in open fighting like resources though. Atronach is better for stuff like that when you can land the stun on a big group. The heal is really good now though. I was able to solo kvach arena mostly because of negate.

RoyJade

I tried negate on a stamsorc in pvp, the encase/bombard + rune prison + dual sword build totally wrecked magbuild. I just kill all their stamina with cc and ground based dot (volley, spike), then drop a negate and kill them with dots while keeping all the cc. Magsorc especially can't do anything.

Birdovic

Jar_Ek wrote: »

I thought PvP Negate only did a silence and tbh can't you just walk out of it?

I guess they talk about block bashing while IN negation field to remove "silence".
But im happy they fixed that, so it cannot be broken anymore.

Birdovic

XaXa wrote: »

long time reader, first time writer. Made an account just for this.

Has their been any word as to whether Surge not being effected by Battle Spirit is intended or not?

Also fingers crossed they have been reading this and plan to bring some more changes next incremental...

I think no official word about that, yet.
I really hope they keep it like that.

Grao

genjutsu_kami wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

I agree that stam sorcs need some more love and Hurricane not giving Major Expedition is a big nerf.

However, what I find to be the biggest problem of stamina sorcs is none of what you listed. It's the lack of a good CC.

Previously you had Wrecking Blow as kind of a CC & spammable DPS skill - well, you can still Wrecking Blow for damage (or use the new Flurry), but where are you going to get the CC from?


Also, you left out a pretty big one from your sorc passives list:

Daedric Protection
Increases your Health and Stamina recovery by 20% when a Daedric Summoning ability is slotted.


Anyway, back on topic: I'd add a CC portion to the Hurricane skill (maybe a knockback/knockdown after full duration or upon activation) & that alone goes a long way to fixing stamina sorc issues.

I don't think stamina sorcerers need a spammable dps skill, there's a reason DW & 2H skills exist.

but wait....

nightblades - Concealed weapon (instant dps ability)
dragon night - claw + fire breath (sorry don't know the names but they are both instant dps abilities with added benefits)
templar - biting jabs - (instant dps ability)
sorc - ............ bound armour .... (really....)

rrrrrmm so why would we not need an instant dps again ?? when every other class has one .....

You think as a Stamina Sorcerer you are bad on that? I am sorry, Magicka Sorcerers have 1 choice of main attack. 1! And it is not even a good one! Force Pulse has Lower DPS then other classes single target spammable and that is mostly what leads Magicka Sorc DPS to be so damn low. So I am sorry, before they give a spammable ability for stamina sorcs, they have to give one for Magicka.

Currently ZoS can't increase our damage because the abilities they's have to buff all cause issues in PvP, they can't buff Crystal Fragments or people will QQ, can\t buff Daedric Curse because it is part of the combo to burst people in PvP, can't buff our Execution, can't buff Overload... They could buff our DoT, but that is already a strong ability, so they won't. We need a spammable ability that can be regulated freely to set the Magicka Sorc DPS in par with other DPS.

Stam Sorcs have several main attacks to choose from the weapon lines. We are stuck on stupid destro staffs because of this demented limitation.

Ajax_22

Grao wrote: »

genjutsu_kami wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

I agree that stam sorcs need some more love and Hurricane not giving Major Expedition is a big nerf.

However, what I find to be the biggest problem of stamina sorcs is none of what you listed. It's the lack of a good CC.

Previously you had Wrecking Blow as kind of a CC & spammable DPS skill - well, you can still Wrecking Blow for damage (or use the new Flurry), but where are you going to get the CC from?


Also, you left out a pretty big one from your sorc passives list:

Daedric Protection
Increases your Health and Stamina recovery by 20% when a Daedric Summoning ability is slotted.


Anyway, back on topic: I'd add a CC portion to the Hurricane skill (maybe a knockback/knockdown after full duration or upon activation) & that alone goes a long way to fixing stamina sorc issues.

I don't think stamina sorcerers need a spammable dps skill, there's a reason DW & 2H skills exist.

but wait....

nightblades - Concealed weapon (instant dps ability)
dragon night - claw + fire breath (sorry don't know the names but they are both instant dps abilities with added benefits)
templar - biting jabs - (instant dps ability)
sorc - ............ bound armour .... (really....)

rrrrrmm so why would we not need an instant dps again ?? when every other class has one .....

You think as a Stamina Sorcerer you are bad on that? I am sorry, Magicka Sorcerers have 1 choice of main attack. 1! And it is not even a good one! Force Pulse has Lower DPS then other classes single target spammable and that is mostly what leads Magicka Sorc DPS to be so damn low. So I am sorry, before they give a spammable ability for stamina sorcs, they have to give one for Magicka.

Currently ZoS can't increase our damage because the abilities they's have to buff all cause issues in PvP, they can't buff Crystal Fragments or people will QQ, can\t buff Daedric Curse because it is part of the combo to burst people in PvP, can't buff our Execution, can't buff Overload... They could buff our DoT, but that is already a strong ability, so they won't. We need a spammable ability that can be regulated freely to set the Magicka Sorc DPS in par with other DPS.

Stam Sorcs have several main attacks to choose from the weapon lines. We are stuck on stupid destro staffs because of this demented limitation.

This is incorrect Force Shock does more damage than Strife, and all of the Magic spamables are on par with each other. The reason Magic Sorcs have such low DPS is the same reason Stam Sorcs do, lack of DoTs.

While one would be very nice, Magic Sorcs don't need a class spamable to have competitive DPS. You need more DoTs, but ZOS can't give you any as long as the have the insane PvE burst you currently do.

Spearblade

"So I am sorry, before they give a spammable ability for stamina sorcs, they have to give one for Magicka."

Uhhhhhh...why? Because of a misguided notion that Sorcerers are made to be a Magicka class? GTFO.

Side note, this isn't a thread for Magicka Sorcs. Go try to scream over the QQ about shields on a Mag Sorc thread.

Xsorus

I will say this, Stamina Sorcs are absolutely going to suck to deal with as a Nightblade, that Hurricane Morph is anti Stealth to the max...

Ahzek

Xsorus wrote: »

I will say this, Stamina Sorcs are absolutely going to suck to deal with as a Nightblade, that Hurricane Morph is anti Stealth to the max...

Its fine, you can spam incap to cut down our healing.
Similary Hurricane has the unfortunate side effect of being an AoE DoT (like caltrops) and as such proccs Falassas guile, which seems to be rising in popularity, at least on the PTS. This means using Hurricane ( a primary defensive buff) will cut down your healing in half for 15 seconds.
This set is the ultimate hardcounter to storcs.

Spearblade

Boundless Storm will already flush out stealth/invis people. But...yes. I am admittedly excited for the few seconds of large radius invis flushing.