Console End-of-Life Transfer Option

Divinius

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

The file is locked behind PSN...case and point...it belongs to Sony as far as the customer wanting ZOS to take a file only accessible via PSN network...even tho ZOS has access...they cant make changes to PSN network items or files accessible via the PSN aggreement

Once again, and I'm running out of different ways to try to explain this, the files are owned by ZOS (not Sony), exist on servers that are owned and maintained by ZOS (not Sony), and are completely controlled by ZOS (not Sony). The files aren't "locked" behind anything of Sony's. They are merely accessed by the players, through Sony's network. ZOS, however, can freely access them at any time, without even needing to touch Sony's network. Nor do they need any permission from Sony to do so.

Basically, what you are arguing is akin to saying that Google can't modify or change their own home page without getting permission from your ISP, because you happen to access Google's servers through your ISP's network.

Dagoth_Rac

tannercrook wrote: »

I understand they may not allow me to transfer at all. Fine. Just give me a straight answer regarding when the new gen of consoles are released so I can plan accordingly.

We are probably about 7 years away from a new console generation. You are simply not going to get a straight answer about something 7 years in the future.

NewBlacksmurf

Divinius wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

The file is locked behind PSN...case and point...it belongs to Sony as far as the customer wanting ZOS to take a file only accessible via PSN network...even tho ZOS has access...they cant make changes to PSN network items or files accessible via the PSN aggreement

Once again, and I'm running out of different ways to try to explain this, the files are owned by ZOS (not Sony), exist on servers that are owned and maintained by ZOS (not Sony), and are completely controlled by ZOS (not Sony). The files aren't "locked" behind anything of Sony's. They are merely accessed by the players, through Sony's network. ZOS, however, can freely access them at any time, without even needing to touch Sony's network.

Regardless of who owns the file,the intellectual property involves Sony because the file was generated via PSN not ZOS excluding PSN.

Intellectual property (IP) refers to creations of the mind, such as inventions; literary and artistic works; designs; and symbols, names and images used in commerce.

You cannot legally take something that was created with another party and do as you please unless that is written in an agreement. I'm drawing that conclusion based on what I have read, what ZOS has shared and what PSN shares publicly.

Enodoc

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

These are separate terms but they don't apply independent of one another. I'm not confused because regardless of who owns the save file, the account required to play is owned by PSN and licensed as such. In order to play TESO TU on PS4, you must have both a PSN account and ZOS account but only are allowed to play ESO on the PSN network with PS4 hardware.

Yes, because your software license for that purchase is for PS4 software. To play the game on PC you need to buy a PC version license. But that doesn't affect the data storage, just the access.

So the site where the game is located, the account which is required for PSN and the network which is required to play on, is integrated with ZOS' server. This is all together and not separate so in the matter of, ZOS, they cannot allow anyone to move their account from console to PC without written permission from Sony due to all of the above and for sure some other Developer legal stuff that we don't have access to unless you're a dev. The account is not owned by the customer nor does ZOS own anything on the PSN network so anything on the PSN network has to go through Sony legally.

ZOS indeed doesn't own anything on the PSN network, but character information is stored on the ZOS network, not the PSN network.

The specific file...is being access through Sony so that by default makes that file part of Sony's intellectual property.

Sony is giving you access through PSN to the ESO PS4 server, owned by ZOS. The specific file is stored on the ESO server.

Consider the reverse; if the file was stored on the PSN network, it would be attached to your PSN ID, and you'd be able to log in to either the NA or the EU server and have the same characters available.


Similarly, if the file was stored on PSN, you wouldn't be able to change your linked PSN ID and keep your character progress. The very fact that you can change the PSN ID that is linked to your ZOS account and yet keep your character progress proves that your character data is stored with relation to your ZOS account, not your PSN ID.
Ah, scrap that. It appears whoever said that was possible initially was mistaken, or it is no longer the case (this is also relevant to @Eshelmen):
You will only be able to re-link your ESOTU account to the same PSN Online ID or Xbox Live Gold account to which it was previously linked. You will not be able to link your ESOTU account to a different console account.
I guess they decided that wasn't a good idea to prevent account sharing. I'm sure someone said they were able to do it before, though...

thanks for this....so it seems this disagrees with Sony's info?
ESO network and SOny's are intertwined...but PSN account trumps ZOS server file access because without PSN there is no access ZOS can't give customer access without using PSN network and PSN accounts....right?

The file is locked behind PSN...case and point...it belongs to Sony as far as the customer wanting ZOS to take a file only accessible via PSN network...even tho ZOS has access...they cant make changes to PSN network items or files accessible via the PSN aggreement

Kinda; the customer can't access the ZOS server with the file on it without PSN access, because that counts as part of Sony acting as Reseller for a Service. But as far as I can tell, ZOS reserves the right to do whatever they want with the file because they own it; Sony's capacity as Reseller shouldn't have any influence of what ZOS do with their own data. If ZOS were to move the file to somewhere else, I don't think Sony would be in a position to oppose it.

Divinius

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Regardless of who owns the file,the intellectual property involves Sony because the file was generated via PSN not ZOS excluding PSN.

Intellectual property (IP) refers to creations of the mind, such as inventions; literary and artistic works; designs; and symbols, names and images used in commerce.

You cannot legally take something that was created with another party and do as you please unless that is written in an agreement. I'm drawing that conclusion based on what I have read, what ZOS has shared and what PSN shares publicly.

The IP doesn't involve Sony at all. Sony owns nothing of the IP. The creation of the save info was done on ESO's servers (owned by ZOS) by the player. The player himself is far more involved in the creation of the save info than Sony is, and even the player owns nothing, based on ZOS's licensing. Son'y owns nothing other than the network used to access the file, which doesn't give them any IP or rights to that data. Just like your ISP has no rights to the data you access on web-servers through their network.

Asherons_Call

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

They have answered it....no on all

How often will the migration from PC/Mac to consoles be allowed?
Updated 02/17/2016 01:56 PM Published 05/07/2014 02:54 PM

The console transfer was a one-time offer extended to eligible players who purchased the PC/Mac game either from The Elder Scrolls Online PC/Mac Store or from a retailer and activated their game code by 6/30/14 (11:59pm UTC).

When did the transfer to console window end?
Updated 02/09/2016 01:56 PM Published 06/04/2014 04:34 PM

If you purchased and activated the PC/MAC game on or before 6/30/14 (11:59pm UTC) you were able to buy the console transfer between April 9, 2015 and May 9, 2015 from The Elder Scrolls Online PC/Mac Store: https://account.elderscrollsonline.com/store.

Will there be another opportunity to become eligible for PC/Mac-to-console transfers after June 30, 2014?
Updated 03/16/2015 11:23 AM Published 01/07/2015 09:18 AM

We do not have plans to extend the eligibility window of the limited-time offer to transfer ESO accounts from PC/Mac to console.

Can I transfer my character to a different account?
Updated 12/08/2015 04:19 PM Published 12/02/2014 07:58 AM

Players are not able to transfer characters between different accounts, servers, or platforms. We do not offer a character transfer service.

all that is here: http://help.elderscrollsonline.com/app/home

You of all people should know that just because they have said no in the past doesn't mean it won't happen. *coughtextchatonconsolecough*

Thanks for sharing though

NewBlacksmurf

Enodoc wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

These are separate terms but they don't apply independent of one another. I'm not confused because regardless of who owns the save file, the account required to play is owned by PSN and licensed as such. In order to play TESO TU on PS4, you must have both a PSN account and ZOS account but only are allowed to play ESO on the PSN network with PS4 hardware.

Yes, because your software license for that purchase is for PS4 software. To play the game on PC you need to buy a PC version license. But that doesn't affect the data storage, just the access.

So the site where the game is located, the account which is required for PSN and the network which is required to play on, is integrated with ZOS' server. This is all together and not separate so in the matter of, ZOS, they cannot allow anyone to move their account from console to PC without written permission from Sony due to all of the above and for sure some other Developer legal stuff that we don't have access to unless you're a dev. The account is not owned by the customer nor does ZOS own anything on the PSN network so anything on the PSN network has to go through Sony legally.

ZOS indeed doesn't own anything on the PSN network, but character information is stored on the ZOS network, not the PSN network.

The specific file...is being access through Sony so that by default makes that file part of Sony's intellectual property.

Sony is giving you access through PSN to the ESO PS4 server, owned by ZOS. The specific file is stored on the ESO server.

Consider the reverse; if the file was stored on the PSN network, it would be attached to your PSN ID, and you'd be able to log in to either the NA or the EU server and have the same characters available.


Similarly, if the file was stored on PSN, you wouldn't be able to change your linked PSN ID and keep your character progress. The very fact that you can change the PSN ID that is linked to your ZOS account and yet keep your character progress proves that your character data is stored with relation to your ZOS account, not your PSN ID.
Ah, scrap that. It appears whoever said that was possible initially was mistaken, or it is no longer the case (this is also relevant to @Eshelmen):
You will only be able to re-link your ESOTU account to the same PSN Online ID or Xbox Live Gold account to which it was previously linked. You will not be able to link your ESOTU account to a different console account.
I guess they decided that wasn't a good idea to prevent account sharing. I'm sure someone said they were able to do it before, though...

thanks for this....so it seems this disagrees with Sony's info?
ESO network and SOny's are intertwined...but PSN account trumps ZOS server file access because without PSN there is no access ZOS can't give customer access without using PSN network and PSN accounts....right?

The file is locked behind PSN...case and point...it belongs to Sony as far as the customer wanting ZOS to take a file only accessible via PSN network...even tho ZOS has access...they cant make changes to PSN network items or files accessible via the PSN aggreement

Kinda; the customer can't access the ZOS server with the file on it without PSN access, because that counts as part of Sony acting as Reseller for a Service. But as far as I can tell, ZOS reserves the right to do whatever they want with the file because they own it; Sony's capacity as Reseller shouldn't have any influence of what ZOS do with their own data. If ZOS were to move the file to somewhere else, I don't think Sony would be in a position to oppose it.

Divinius wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Regardless of who owns the file,the intellectual property involves Sony because the file was generated via PSN not ZOS excluding PSN.

Intellectual property (IP) refers to creations of the mind, such as inventions; literary and artistic works; designs; and symbols, names and images used in commerce.

You cannot legally take something that was created with another party and do as you please unless that is written in an agreement. I'm drawing that conclusion based on what I have read, what ZOS has shared and what PSN shares publicly.

The IP doesn't involve Sony at all. Sony owns nothing of the IP. The creation of the save info was done on ESO's servers (owned by ZOS) by the player. The player himself is far more involved in the creation of the save info than Sony is, and even the player owns nothing, based on ZOS's licensing. Son'y owns nothing other than the network used to access the file, which doesn't give them any IP or rights to that data. Just like your ISP has no rights to the data you access on web-servers through their network.

OK if you guys are sure...then lets go with it.

I just don't see where that conclusion was drawn because ZOS was under an impression that they determined on console who could play their game....like on Xbox One where the game is accessible to anyone who accessed the xbox one home console with an Xbox Live profile.

Where it doesn't require that customer have a ZOS account created or linked back.

I just think there are a lot of assumptions whereas I know legally it doesn't work that way on Xbox live...

ZOS cannot allow a customer change update or move files on PSN or Xbox Live without permission so regardless of who runs the server and who owns the files....the network owner owns the key to the data.

but maybe im wrong....anyways....good discussions

Enodoc

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

I just don't see where that conclusion was drawn because ZOS was under an impression that they determined on console who could play their game....like on Xbox One where the game is accessible to anyone who accessed the xbox one home console with an Xbox Live profile.

Where it doesn't require that customer have a ZOS account created or linked back.

I'm sure that each individual Xbox Live profile on the Home console still requires their own linked ZOS account. You may only need one copy of the game, but you each need your own XBL-ZOS account link to be able to log in. Or are you saying this isn't the case?

americansteel

i was on ESO well before the time limit yet never recieved an email regarding my transfer.

NewBlacksmurf

Enodoc wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

I just don't see where that conclusion was drawn because ZOS was under an impression that they determined on console who could play their game....like on Xbox One where the game is accessible to anyone who accessed the xbox one home console with an Xbox Live profile.

Where it doesn't require that customer have a ZOS account created or linked back.

I'm sure that each individual Xbox Live profile on the Home console still requires their own linked ZOS account. You may only need one copy of the game, but you each need your own XBL-ZOS account link to be able to log in. Or are you saying this isn't the case?

I'm saying I know that's not the case and has not been the case since launch.

I myself have a PC account and Xbox live account. I did the copy so I'm linked and all set.

My game is shared on one of my two Xbox consoles.
My wife, brother, and daughter each have their own Xbox live profiles and each can play but none of them have a ZOS account. They were sent the email but ignored it.

They still play and group just fine.
Only my brother has Xbox live gold so I can play while simultaneously sharing that digital game on the other Xbox and my wife often plays with my game and my Xbox live gold with no link or ZOS account

This is because Xbox determine what and how the ZOS product and any developer works subject to the Xbox live terms and agreements subject to change whenever Xbox live decides and does not require notice thereof from Xbox live on all changes.

Eiagra

I'm pretty sure that the earlier transfer is a one-and-done, as others have mentioned.

However, I do see the merit in a console-to-PC transfer at the console's end-of-life, and should ZOS choose to shut down their console megaservers and not migrate to, say, the next iteration of XBox and Playstation consoles.

I think ultimately, it's going to depend on just what happens once the XBox One and the Playstation 4 consoles become defunct.

In the mean time... because that will be a long time coming... you could always just grit your teeth, buckle down, and move to the PC platform regardless. It's the least likely to succumb to obsolescence, and there's always new people to meet and befriend. Leaving your old friends can be hard, but the tone of your posts seems to suggest that circumstances are otherwise.

Orgrimar

Please add console to PC transfer

Eirikir

I never played the PC but would pay money to transfer to the PC given the chance. I have spent to much to drop all the items to start over at lv1.

Would pay for the privilege.

Enodoc

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

I just don't see where that conclusion was drawn because ZOS was under an impression that they determined on console who could play their game....like on Xbox One where the game is accessible to anyone who accessed the xbox one home console with an Xbox Live profile.

Where it doesn't require that customer have a ZOS account created or linked back.

I'm sure that each individual Xbox Live profile on the Home console still requires their own linked ZOS account. You may only need one copy of the game, but you each need your own XBL-ZOS account link to be able to log in. Or are you saying this isn't the case?

I'm saying I know that's not the case and has not been the case since launch.

I myself have a PC account and Xbox live account. I did the copy so I'm linked and all set.

My game is shared on one of my two Xbox consoles.
My wife, brother, and daughter each have their own Xbox live profiles and each can play but none of them have a ZOS account. They were sent the email but ignored it.

They still play and group just fine.
Only my brother has Xbox live gold so I can play while simultaneously sharing that digital game on the other Xbox and my wife often plays with my game and my Xbox live gold with no link or ZOS account

This is because Xbox determine what and how the ZOS product and any developer works subject to the Xbox live terms and agreements subject to change whenever Xbox live decides and does not require notice thereof from Xbox live on all changes.

I don't understand how that can work - not saying that it doesn't, just that it shouldn't - according to ZOS support, Each different Xbox Live gamertag or PSN Online ID on a console will have a unique ESO account and login; If you want to play The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited on the Xbox One, you will be prompted to create a new ESOTU account (or link to an existing one) directly from the console; and specifically:

CAN I PLAY THE ELDER SCROLLS ONLINE: TAMRIEL UNLIMITED USING ONLY MY XBOX ONE LOGIN DETAILS?

Updated 06/10/2015 03:29 PM          Published 04/20/2015 12:02 PM

No. Access to ESOTU requires that players have a link between their Xbox One account and their ESOTU account. When they access the game from their Xbox One for the first time, players who already have an ESOTU account will be able to log in with their ESOTU User ID and password once they link their ESOTU and Xbox Live accounts.

New players will need to create a new ESOTU account - accessible via a link on their consoles - register their e-mail address, choose a password, and complete the account creation steps. They will also have the option to sign up for Bethesda updates, newsletters, and special offers at this time.