good new Fengrush video for you

Tommy1979AtWar

Thanks OP for posting, I caught his last vid which was the first I'd seen of him and have to agree he raises some interesting points, I may even sub and become one of the so called "@Fengrush community" lol
Personally I agree with the guy and can see how passionate he is about the game but also see there's dejection there too, I've played the elder scrolls titles since daggerfall and was hyped for it being online, I feel zos being handed this title by zenimax media was like putting a silk scarf on a pig.
I used to pvp on PS4 but it's pointless trying to these days Iso I pve, I enjoy both so it's no hardship in that respect and I'm glad I have the option but yes pvp desperately needs to be fixed.
I'm critical of zos because I want them to do better, some critisism is more constructive than others but we all love the game or else we wouldn't be here.
Slapping zos on the back when they screw up telling them "awesome job guys" isn't how it gets fixed.
Buying every piece of crap they throw at you in the crown store... isn't how it gets fixed.
Subbing... isn't how it gets fixed.
Ignoring the issues... isn't how they get fixed.
Being a "white knight" and insulting or trolling someone who enjoys the game but wants it to be better doesn't mean someone from zos is going to facebook friend you or tweet how awesome they think you are and it certainly isn't going to get the game fixed.
I don't understand this complete and utter denial of any game breaking bugs within this game from certain forum members.
Look at the poll regarding whether people would buy another zos title... 60% say no just on the forum alone, if I was a zenimax media ceo reading that I'd be asking zos wtf is going on over there.

SienneYviete

Tommy1979AtWar wrote: »

Thanks OP for posting, I caught his last vid which was the first I'd seen of him and have to agree he raises some interesting points, I may even sub and become one of the so called "@Fengrush community" lol
Personally I agree with the guy and can see how passionate he is about the game but also see there's dejection there too, I've played the elder scrolls titles since daggerfall and was hyped for it being online, I feel zos being handed this title by zenimax media was like putting a silk scarf on a pig.
I used to pvp on PS4 but it's pointless trying to these days Iso I pve, I enjoy both so it's no hardship in that respect and I'm glad I have the option but yes pvp desperately needs to be fixed.
I'm critical of zos because I want them to do better, some critisism is more constructive than others but we all love the game or else we wouldn't be here.
Slapping zos on the back when they screw up telling them "awesome job guys" isn't how it gets fixed.
Buying every piece of crap they throw at you in the crown store... isn't how it gets fixed.
Subbing... isn't how it gets fixed.
Ignoring the issues... isn't how they get fixed.
Being a "white knight" and insulting or trolling someone who enjoys the game but wants it to be better doesn't mean someone from zos is going to facebook friend you or tweet how awesome they think you are and it certainly isn't going to get the game fixed.
I don't understand this complete and utter denial of any game breaking bugs within this game from certain forum members.
Look at the poll regarding whether people would buy another zos title... 60% say no just on the forum alone, if I was a zenimax media ceo reading that I'd be asking zos wtf is going on over there.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Of course it has a positive reception from people either bitter or who no longer play. Its always fun to hate on the game you used to play. Everyone is a fool for still playing it. WoW has been getting this kind of thing for 12 years now.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

I dont "stalk" anything. If you dont want public comment or people having opinions then not a good idea to post here. Just FYI I usually search via the recent button. Rarely do I pay attention to whos posting or what forum its in. I will comment on a subject but rarely do I comment on the person making the post. In this case it was just to say I never heard of you before a couple months ago.

Im not going to watch the video because I already know what you are saying. Everything is a mess and only you can solve it. Yet they wont listen to you. I get it.

scorpiodog

I absolutely cannot stand youtube videos that drone on over a painful hour endlessly repeating what could be said in less than 10 minutes.

Can someone post a summary or cliffs notes?

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

It's AOE caps!
It's Lightning Patch!
It's moving from Client to Server side!
It's the Anti-bot code!
It's Zenimax can't fix the code!

At least pick one and stick with it.

Fengrush, I agree with ya on a lot of things. Your not a programmer though, so every claim you make is completely speculative. Your spreading propaganda using your own delusions of grandeur as credibility. You posted a video doing a siege battle on BWB and then commented how BWB doesn't have the same issues you rant about. Issues that have been around in Vet campaigns for over a year. How does that make any of your arguments valid since all campaigns share the same code? Anyway, it's great you got some fans for reading last years newspaper.

danno8

I watched until the 17m mark as suggested. FENGRUSH makes good points.

But I don' think any discussion about the games performance can be complete without acknowledging the huge impact that spammable AoE's have on game performance.

Every time I see a video of the early game where 100's of players are on screen moving around freely with no lag, it is always the same scenario. People are light attacking, or using single target skills or the like. There is no huge balls of groups spamming Healing springs, Proxy Det, Steel Tornado, Impulse etc.

It wasn't until people refined their PvP to realize that the best strategy was to ball up and use AoE that performance began to truly suffer.

FENGRUSH

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

It's AOE caps!

AOE caps is a PVP balance/combat thing - its just a bonus it would alleviate stress on the server.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

It's AOE caps!

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

It's Lightning Patch!
It's moving from Client to Server side!
It's the Anti-bot code!
It's Zenimax can't fix the code!

At least pick one and stick with it.

Fengrush, I agree with ya on a lot of things. Your not a programmer though, so every claim you make is completely speculative.

Lighting patch, anti bot code, client server... same thing man. What are with your posts actually questioning what this is or if this really did happen? Did you even watch the comparitive difference of one patch then following after the lighting patch (without even mass players around). Game performance just went in the toilet. And what is it youre looking for????

Yea.. I picked one, its detailed in the video. AOE caps are another issue. If you know the things I talk about, I dont know how you dont understand the explanation behind them honestly. I dont just throw these phrases out, I take the time to explain them.

Its more than speculative in nature that the bot issue was fixed and how this game functioned changed that patch. Pretty sure you could find more definitive info on this - but it generally isnt needed. Its from awhile back, and its generally understood what changed.

Myxril

Enraged_Tiki_Torch wrote: »

It's AOE caps!
It's Lightning Patch!
It's moving from Client to Server side!
It's the Anti-bot code!
It's Zenimax can't fix the code!

At least pick one and stick with it.

Why demand he stick with just one when all of them are the problem?

blabafat

@mb10

PvPers just want some recognition and bug fixes.

We want a functioning PvP system. We want a balanced, lag free, and rewarding PvP system. We've been doing the same thing since launch (1 map with the same objectives) - IC was great for a month or two, and that's it (no PvP incentive).

ArgoCye

So six pages of comments already and some are questioning the value of this thread and the reason why it was created. Reckon that question has been well and truly answered.

Thanks for the vid, FENGRUSH. Love ya beard, love ya work.

Tommy1979AtWar

blabafat wrote: »

@mb10

PvPers just want some recognition and bug fixes.

We want a functioning PvP system. We want a balanced, lag free, and rewarding PvP system. We've been doing the same thing since launch (1 map with the same objectives) - IC was great for a month or two, and that's it (no PvP incentive).

Tbh I don't think it's just a pvp issue these days, we're seeing the same thing bleed into pve too, the only saving grace is that in pve you don't have dozens of people spamming aoe at the same time in close proximity to eachother, even console is having fps drops and the odd crash when there's nobody around and nothing happening.
Riding one of my fully trained mounts at speed through any city causes my screen and system sounds to stutter, it never used to do that and I've tried it on a friends PS4 too... same thing.

Wing

I love how people downright admit to not watching the video, then post opinions about it...

ig·no·rance /ˈiɡnərəns/
noun
noun: ignorance
lack of knowledge or information

btw I do play this game, do enjoy this game, am subbed to the game, and do completely agree with what he said. so don't try to undermine his very valid opinion and the opinions of others who feel the same with sweeping generalizations about those who agree with him.

Wing

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

then you really should not be posting in this thread

we are trying to discuss points made in a video. if you don't want to do that, then pretty please don't "contribute". really not trying to be mean, but you don't seem interested in the core point of this thread and it would be against your best interest (and detrimental to this thread) to continue posting in it.

[edited to remove quote]

Ashtaris

So just out of curiosity, how would people feel about having Cyrodiil such that there was nothing there that could be harvested? No nodes, bosses, or anything else where bots could take advantage of that area so that they could completely eliminate the anti-bot code for that zone. I'm sure they could set it up somehow so that particular zone could be made so the anti-bot code was removed.

Or if that's not possible, then just have the anti-bot code removed from Cyrodiil and let the bots roam free in that zone. After all, you are there to do PVP, not farm.

It would be better if we can just nuke the companies that create the bots, but unfortunately that might start a International incident with China

JadeNaria

Xjcon wrote: »

I have nothing against Fengrush but isn't it possible if we cared enough we would go to his stream or channel to get this? Why do his followers keep pushing these in the ESO forums?

I for one thank ppl that facilitate these videos being found.

Moglijuana wrote: »

The advertisement of PvP battles was a MAIN FEATURE when ESO was being released.

That is exactly what I said in my thread that was removed by ZoS.

People either don't get it or enjoy trolling these types of threads.

Wing

I don't know what kind of strain the nodes put on it, but if it helped I would not mind seeing them go, its not a farm zone (unless farming players counts)
but they cannot change the netcode for a specific instance of the game, just not possible that's not how it works.

I would love to see IC be relevant though, I wish they would open the bridges up so that you could travel straight through overworld to IC districts without going through the sewers. . .maybe even take the scrolls through there eh, eh.

Wing

btw I'm actually not a follower or a sub (sorry @FENGRUSH ) I don't watch twitch, but I occasionally check him and a few other youtubers like sypher for eso content, and sometimes I feel its worth sharing. ^_^

Ashtaris

Wing wrote: »

I don't know what kind of strain the nodes put on it, but if it helped I would not mind seeing them go, its not a farm zone (unless farming players counts)
but they cannot change the netcode for a specific instance of the game, just not possible that's not how it works.

I would love to see IC be relevant though, I wish they would open the bridges up so that you could travel straight through overworld to IC districts without going through the sewers. . .maybe even take the scrolls through there eh, eh.

Well I'm not an expert on net code myself, but I have run a game server and know a bit about them. I don't see any reason why a seperate server instance couldn't be created where the ant-bot code wasn't in effect. I hate people telling me something can't be done, but would rather try to figure out what can be done

Wing

Ashtaris wrote: »

I hate people telling me something can't be done, but would rather try to figure out what can be done

you know what your totally right, agreed.

Ajax_22

Ashtaris wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

I don't know what kind of strain the nodes put on it, but if it helped I would not mind seeing them go, its not a farm zone (unless farming players counts)
but they cannot change the netcode for a specific instance of the game, just not possible that's not how it works.

I would love to see IC be relevant though, I wish they would open the bridges up so that you could travel straight through overworld to IC districts without going through the sewers. . .maybe even take the scrolls through there eh, eh.

Well I'm not an expert on net code myself, but I have run a game server and know a bit about them. I don't see any reason why a seperate server instance couldn't be created where the ant-bot code wasn't in effect. I hate people telling me something can't be done, but would rather try to figure out what can be done

The problem isn't that there is no way to limit the lag we experience. The problem is, that since a large portion of the PvP community has left for other games, it is no longer worth it financially to make any significant changes just for the sake of PvP.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Wing wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

You dont need to watch the video just read his posts. Im not going to go to his page and grant him a view so he can claim me as one of his "fans".

then you really should not be posting in this thread

we are trying to discuss points made in a video. if you don't want to do that, then pretty please don't "contribute". really not trying to be mean, but you don't seem interested in the core point of this thread and it would be against your best interest (and detrimental to this thread) to continue posting in it.

I didnt know I needed your permission to post here. The fact is I posted in repsonse to someone talking about DB. I said if you cant post some kind of summary of the video then Im not going to bother watching it. So thanks for the advice but you know what you can do with it.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Ajax_22 wrote: »

.

Im not trying to start anything. I responded to someone about a comment what the DB would bring. Anything else was simply responses to people talking to me. Last time I checked thats participating in a discussion. The fact my opinion on the game differs from yours doesnt mean Im trolling. As I said in my second post I am not sitting through an entire video. If someone cant post cliff notes then oh well.

[edited for quote]

acw37162

Well to @Fengrush's credit anybody who pays attention, has worked for a paycheck, provided a service, worked on a service, or listens to or works around corporate speak. It is painfully obvious @zenimax has no intention of making the financial commitment to fix Cyrodil.

Either in personal capable of finding and implementing a fix or hardware and software necessary.

The cash cow is churning out the stuff people will pay for on a regular basis mounts, bankers, and poor fitting and some case cases flat out disgustingly ugly costumes.

There is tons of content and since a majority of players who spend at least $20 dollars in game never reach max level they are more concerned with constantly turning over the bottom.

A small percentage of a bigger number is greater then a large percentage of a smaller number.

Put another way 20 or less dollars from X new customers who only play for two months and never reach max level is greater then 500 dollars from Y players who have multiple accounts and play all the time.

JadeNaria

JMadFour wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

I agree with @FENGRUSH entirely. I do think most new players dont have a clue what pvp used to be like or how awesome it used to be. I remember spending like 4 or 5 hours defending keeps with a tiny group of half ass pugs and some forwards camps with 3 walls down against wave after wave of zerging onslaught. That *** just doesn't happen anymore.
.

Not really trying to start a fight here, but I also remember streamers bitching about how they don't want to spend 4 or 5 hours defending keeps anymore, they want Arenas. and complaining about zergs this, and zergs that and how pvp wasn't fun because zerg zerg zerg. and calling Cyrodiil a "horse simulator" and other such nonsense.

I remember people trying to hijack a twitch stream spamming "WE WANT ARENAS NOW" over and over again.

so why are we being all nostalgic about large-scale pvp all of a sudden?

weren't people JUST complaining about large-scale pvp?

what am I missing here?

You're missing the point that those videos portray performance that we do not have.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

acw37162 wrote: »

Well to @Fengrush's credit anybody who pays attention, has worked for a paycheck, provided a service, worked on a service, or listens to or works around corporate speak. It is painfully obvious @zenimax has no intention of making the financial commitment to fix Cyrodil.

Either in personal capable of finding and implementing a fix or hardware and software necessary.

The cash cow is churning out the stuff people will pay for on a regular basis mounts, bankers, and poor fitting and some case cases flat out disgustingly ugly costumes.

There is tons of content and since a majority of players who spend at least $20 dollars in game never reach max level they are more concerned with constantly turning over the bottom.

A small percentage of a bigger number is greater then a large percentage of a smaller number.

Put another way 20 or less dollars from X new customers who only play for two months and never reach max level is greater then 500 dollars from Y players who have multiple accounts and play all the time.

To be fair cash is how they pay the bills. I would be all for what makes the most money as well.

Tommy1979AtWar

Ashtaris wrote: »

So just out of curiosity, how would people feel about having Cyrodiil such that there was nothing there that could be harvested. No nodes, bosses, or anything else where bots could take advantage of that area so that they could completely eliminate the anti-bot code for that zone. I'm sure they could set it up somehow so that particular zone could be made so the anti-bot code was removed.

Or if that's not possible, then just have the anti-bot code removed from Cyrodiil and let the bots roam free in that zone. After all, you are there to do PVP, not farm.

It would be better if we can just nuke the companies that create the bots, but unfortunately that might start a International incident with China

Losing nodes would probably lessen the script usage a bit but I'm unsure about bot coding or if infact there is any, if it's server side then they probably wouldn't need something that sweeps the grid like that, honestly my guess and it purely is a guess is that it's a mixture of being server side rendering (if it is truly server side) aoe (as particle effects and script usage have a huge impact on system rendering and server stress) and lighting (it's surprising how much strain simple shadow effects have on a grids status)

Purely speculation though, a developers input would be worthwhile on these types of threads as they obviously know more than any of us.

JadeNaria

Myxril wrote: »

Xjcon wrote: »

I have nothing against Fengrush but isn't it possible if we cared enough we would go to his stream or channel to get this? Why do his followers keep pushing these in the ESO forums?

Why is it that people who 'don't care' about these threads always come to these threads to talk about how annoyed they are about something they don't care about, as if anybody actualy cares that they are annoyed and don't care?

Because ppl who are bitter or pessimistic in life enjoy spreading the negativity.

JadeNaria

Tommy1979AtWar wrote: »

Thanks OP for posting, I caught his last vid which was the first I'd seen of him and have to agree he raises some interesting points, I may even sub and become one of the so called "@Fengrush community" lol
Personally I agree with the guy and can see how passionate he is about the game but also see there's dejection there too, I've played the elder scrolls titles since daggerfall and was hyped for it being online, I feel zos being handed this title by zenimax media was like putting a silk scarf on a pig.
I used to pvp on PS4 but it's pointless trying to these days Iso I pve, I enjoy both so it's no hardship in that respect and I'm glad I have the option but yes pvp desperately needs to be fixed.
I'm critical of zos because I want them to do better, some critisism is more constructive than others but we all love the game or else we wouldn't be here.
Slapping zos on the back when they screw up telling them "awesome job guys" isn't how it gets fixed.
Buying every piece of crap they throw at you in the crown store... isn't how it gets fixed.
Subbing... isn't how it gets fixed.
Ignoring the issues... isn't how they get fixed.
Being a "white knight" and insulting or trolling someone who enjoys the game but wants it to be better doesn't mean someone from zos is going to facebook friend you or tweet how awesome they think you are and it certainly isn't going to get the game fixed.
I don't understand this complete and utter denial of any game breaking bugs within this game from certain forum members.
Look at the poll regarding whether people would buy another zos title... 60% say no just on the forum alone, if I was a zenimax media ceo reading that I'd be asking zos wtf is going on over there.

Post of the year!!!!!!! :-)

Samphaa

Did console release and tamriel unlimited ruin this game?