I don't use bows...but in pvp I'm taking 14k focused aim shots to the knee....thats 28k pve damage.... I think thats perfectly decent dps lol...
ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Hey guys,
Thanks for the discussion on Bow PvE DPS. We agree that "pure" Bow PvE builds are parsing a little bit lower than we'd like in dungeon and trial encounters. We want to improve Bow's sustained damage without buffing its burst (especially from Crouch), and we targeted a change that will help out Bow builds without influencing the hybrid Dual Wield/Bow or Two Handed/Bow builds (which are already very competitive).
In the next PTS build, you should see following change to the Hawk Eye passive:
Old Hawkeye:
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 8/15% when striking off balance enemies.
New Hawkeye:
Your successful Light and Heavy Attacks increase the damage of all your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times.
A standard Bow PvE DPS rotation should be able to generate and maintain Hawk Eye stacks throughout a boss encounter, and this keeps it out of reach of Crouch burst or hybrid builds who only use Bow to keep up Volley or Poison Injection.
@ZOS_KNowak: Additionally to the Hawk Eye passive change I think it would be great if you could fix Long Shots.
Tooltip says:
WITH BOW EQUIPPED
Gives you a damage bonus of up to 12% against enemies at longer range.
This bonus only applies to bow abilities though.
If it applied to ranged class abilities it would maybe give players running a bow nice synergies (comparable to the crit or flat damage bonuses you get with dual wield or two handed) .
ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Hey guys,
Thanks for the discussion on Bow PvE DPS. We agree that "pure" Bow PvE builds are parsing a little bit lower than we'd like in dungeon and trial encounters. We want to improve Bow's sustained damage without buffing its burst (especially from Crouch), and we targeted a change that will help out Bow builds without influencing the hybrid Dual Wield/Bow or Two Handed/Bow builds (which are already very competitive).
In the next PTS build, you should see following change to the Hawk Eye passive:
Old Hawkeye:
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 8/15% when striking off balance enemies.
New Hawkeye:
Your successful Light and Heavy Attacks increase the damage of all your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times.
A standard Bow PvE DPS rotation should be able to generate and maintain Hawk Eye stacks throughout a boss encounter, and this keeps it out of reach of Crouch burst or hybrid builds who only use Bow to keep up Volley or Poison Injection.
ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Hey guys,
Thanks for the discussion on Bow PvE DPS. We agree that "pure" Bow PvE builds are parsing a little bit lower than we'd like in dungeon and trial encounters. We want to improve Bow's sustained damage without buffing its burst (especially from Crouch), and we targeted a change that will help out Bow builds without influencing the hybrid Dual Wield/Bow or Two Handed/Bow builds (which are already very competitive).
In the next PTS build, you should see following change to the Hawk Eye passive:
Old Hawkeye:
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 8/15% when striking off balance enemies.
New Hawkeye:
Your successful Light and Heavy Attacks increase the damage of all your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times.
A standard Bow PvE DPS rotation should be able to generate and maintain Hawk Eye stacks throughout a boss encounter, and this keeps it out of reach of Crouch burst or hybrid builds who only use Bow to keep up Volley or Poison Injection.
I don't use bows...but in pvp I'm taking 14k focused aim shots to the knee....thats 28k pve damage.... I think thats perfectly decent dps lol...
Well the raw damage of the bow line is not the only issue. Dw and 2h use bow dots to compliment their dps rotation. But no other weapon can do the same for bow. Yeah, you can use them for execute and to improve your AoE dps, but single target it's still better to use a melee build with Volley and Poison Injection.
The whole issue for me is Snipe. In my book, bow is supposed to to be about mobility, yet the spam skill slows me down while casting. I literally have to interrupted my Snipe to avoid red circles from time to time.
The new Hawk Eye passive will make pvp players really mad as they lose the additional damage when they use bombard VS groups.
But it's nice to see ZOS trying to fix it.
ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Hey guys,
Thanks for the discussion on Bow PvE DPS. We agree that "pure" Bow PvE builds are parsing a little bit lower than we'd like in dungeon and trial encounters. We want to improve Bow's sustained damage without buffing its burst (especially from Crouch), and we targeted a change that will help out Bow builds without influencing the hybrid Dual Wield/Bow or Two Handed/Bow builds (which are already very competitive).
In the next PTS build, you should see following change to the Hawk Eye passive:
Old Hawkeye:
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 8/15% when striking off balance enemies.
New Hawkeye:
Your successful Light and Heavy Attacks increase the damage of all your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times.
A standard Bow PvE DPS rotation should be able to generate and maintain Hawk Eye stacks throughout a boss encounter, and this keeps it out of reach of Crouch burst or hybrid builds who only use Bow to keep up Volley or Poison Injection.
Thanks, kind regards!
P.s. In the name of Y'ffre, a tiny bonus to bow damage or ranged damage should be a must for Bosmer racial passives!
Bandaari are amazing with venoms, but archery is Bosmeri!
I don't use bows...but in pvp I'm taking 14k focused aim shots to the knee....thats 28k pve damage.... I think thats perfectly decent dps lol...
Thanks, kind regards!
P.s. In the name of Y'ffre, a tiny bonus to bow damage or ranged damage should be a must for Bosmer racial passives!
Bandaari are amazing with venoms, but archery is Bosmeri!
I would disagree with this. I don't think a single race should the "x weapon" race. We already see far too much "If you want to be x build you must be y class" having one fully focused in bonuses specific to a single weapon type wouldn't help the issue.
We already have the bonus XP for skill lines which are favoured by our races, I think that's enough.
ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Hey guys,
Thanks for the discussion on Bow PvE DPS. We agree that "pure" Bow PvE builds are parsing a little bit lower than we'd like in dungeon and trial encounters. We want to improve Bow's sustained damage without buffing its burst (especially from Crouch), and we targeted a change that will help out Bow builds without influencing the hybrid Dual Wield/Bow or Two Handed/Bow builds (which are already very competitive).
In the next PTS build, you should see following change to the Hawk Eye passive:
Old Hawkeye:
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 8/15% when striking off balance enemies.
New Hawkeye:
Your successful Light and Heavy Attacks increase the damage of all your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times.
A standard Bow PvE DPS rotation should be able to generate and maintain Hawk Eye stacks throughout a boss encounter, and this keeps it out of reach of Crouch burst or hybrid builds who only use Bow to keep up Volley or Poison Injection.
Surely for Bombard is a big nerf instead.
MonarchChief wrote: »
MonarchChief wrote: »
You are referring to people who only spam the skill right? Meaning no weaving, etc.?A lot of people don't like it because it's an AOE root and snare damaging ability. It does have a pretty hefty cost, so you can't just sit there spamming it all day.
Personally I prefer the new one, because it's more all around across contents and you get instead a 15% damage more vs every target (obviously if you use L/H attacks at least) and not just off balance ones.
ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Hey guys,
Thanks for the discussion on Bow PvE DPS. We agree that "pure" Bow PvE builds are parsing a little bit lower than we'd like in dungeon and trial encounters. We want to improve Bow's sustained damage without buffing its burst (especially from Crouch), and we targeted a change that will help out Bow builds without influencing the hybrid Dual Wield/Bow or Two Handed/Bow builds (which are already very competitive).
In the next PTS build, you should see following change to the Hawk Eye passive:
Old Hawkeye:
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 8/15% when striking off balance enemies.
New Hawkeye:
Your successful Light and Heavy Attacks increase the damage of all your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times.
A standard Bow PvE DPS rotation should be able to generate and maintain Hawk Eye stacks throughout a boss encounter, and this keeps it out of reach of Crouch burst or hybrid builds who only use Bow to keep up Volley or Poison Injection.
I really appreciate you guys actually looking into this, but I'm not a big fan of the New Hawkeye suggestion because what happens if you accidentally proc Molag Kena 2pc when you weren't ready? It shouldn't be tied into light/heavy attacks because there's other sets that do the same and you might not want them to go off.
Can't you just remove the off balanced enemies part from the old Hawkeye gear? It's not like bow is OP as it is.
If the reason you don't want to do this is because of PVP/PVE balance then it could have a double effect:
5 items) Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 15% against NPCs
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks against players by 8%
MonarchChief wrote: »You are referring to people who only spam the skill right? Meaning no weaving, etc.?A lot of people don't like it because it's an AOE root and snare damaging ability. It does have a pretty hefty cost, so you can't just sit there spamming it all day.Personally I prefer the new one, because it's more all around across contents and you get instead a 15% damage more vs every target (obviously if you use L/H attacks at least) and not just off balance ones.
Could this be considered a buff to the skill then? It's more flexible right? Because if you weave attacks, you would, ideally, have that 15% pretty often (against multiple targets, no less)? Or are you guys speaking mostly in terms of something like "Look, the enemy is off balance, so I'll swap to my bow and get the extra damage", which would no longer be an option?
ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Hey guys,
Thanks for the discussion on Bow PvE DPS. We agree that "pure" Bow PvE builds are parsing a little bit lower than we'd like in dungeon and trial encounters. We want to improve Bow's sustained damage without buffing its burst (especially from Crouch), and we targeted a change that will help out Bow builds without influencing the hybrid Dual Wield/Bow or Two Handed/Bow builds (which are already very competitive).
In the next PTS build, you should see following change to the Hawk Eye passive:
Old Hawkeye:
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 8/15% when striking off balance enemies.
New Hawkeye:
Your successful Light and Heavy Attacks increase the damage of all your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times.
A standard Bow PvE DPS rotation should be able to generate and maintain Hawk Eye stacks throughout a boss encounter, and this keeps it out of reach of Crouch burst or hybrid builds who only use Bow to keep up Volley or Poison Injection.
I am happy for this change, but as a few have said before, the bow should not be as strong as melee. It is just like they have talked about with magicka damage intentionally being less than stamina. Up close and personal damage has higher risk so it makes sense for it to hit harder. I look forward to hearing from people after testing this on PTS.
Tower_Of_Shame wrote: »ZOS_KNowak wrote: »Hey guys,
Thanks for the discussion on Bow PvE DPS. We agree that "pure" Bow PvE builds are parsing a little bit lower than we'd like in dungeon and trial encounters. We want to improve Bow's sustained damage without buffing its burst (especially from Crouch), and we targeted a change that will help out Bow builds without influencing the hybrid Dual Wield/Bow or Two Handed/Bow builds (which are already very competitive).
In the next PTS build, you should see following change to the Hawk Eye passive:
Old Hawkeye:
Increases the damage of your Bow attacks by 8/15% when striking off balance enemies.
New Hawkeye:
Your successful Light and Heavy Attacks increase the damage of all your Bow abilities by 2/5% for 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times.
A standard Bow PvE DPS rotation should be able to generate and maintain Hawk Eye stacks throughout a boss encounter, and this keeps it out of reach of Crouch burst or hybrid builds who only use Bow to keep up Volley or Poison Injection.
hmmmmm finally i can make money out of my AP. hahhha
@ZOS_KNowak: Additionally to the Hawk Eye passive change I think it would be great if you could fix Long Shots.
Tooltip says:
WITH BOW EQUIPPED
Gives you a damage bonus of up to 12% against enemies at longer range.
This bonus only applies to bow abilities though.
If it applied to ranged class abilities it would maybe give players running a bow nice synergies (comparable to the crit or flat damage bonuses you get with dual wield or two handed) .
Bow needs stronger dot component. That fix won't help. And the duritaion is a bit short, unless this buff not only stacks, but refreshes on each hit.
I am happy for this change, but as a few have said before, the bow should not be as strong as melee. It is just like they have talked about with magicka damage intentionally being less than stamina. Up close and personal damage has higher risk so it makes sense for it to hit harder. I look forward to hearing from people after testing this on PTS.
Toc de Malsvi wrote: »Bow needs stronger dot component. That fix won't help. And the duritaion is a bit short, unless this buff not only stacks, but refreshes on each hit.
This buff will be great if you are properly weaving with heavy/medium/light attacks. It is not designed to make bow much stronger in pvp although it will improve open play just not opening burst. It is designed for PVE and sustained boss fights, and it should provide a solid boost to Bow dps although maybe not quite put it on top.