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Why did you get rid of animation canceling
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Autolycus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »It's not gone fully but almost ZOS just needs to drive that final nail to get rid of it.
Why you may ask. It is a broken mechanic that was never intentional that exploiters used to gain a very unfair advantage over others.
It's not a broken mechanic. The fact that it functions differently than originally intended has no relevance anymore. They've since looked into the concept and justified it, and they've adjusted the animations accordingly so that it is easier for us to see the attacks coming.
ex·ploit
1. make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource).
By definition, AC is in fact an "exploit," but does not carry the same connotation in which you are using it. There is nothing unfair about it. It's a combat mechanic that is available to everyone. If you don't like the combat mechanics in ESO, that's one thing, but saying it is broken is inaccurate.Edited by Autolycus on February 5, 2016 5:46PM3 -
Laranoye✭✭✭@AutolycusOkay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
You said it yourself its a "deal with it" situation. In the gaming industry those 3 words pretty much means broken and not working as it should or as well as it should. If youre smart enough to abuse ACing then youre smart enough to realize rules generally dictate something like ACing would have a UI or visual attachment and not a hidden combat mechanic that is in no way spoken about in game.
Just to throw something out there what you would be looking at is maybe a bar or a icon that light up or has a sweet spot for you to hit to make ACing work. Like gears of war reloading or something like that. Some type of visual so you know whats going on. Does this mean you should or shouldnt be doing it? Hell if I know. They cant stop you from doing it clearly because they cant fix it so why not. But seriously dont try justify the use of it. It is what it is. They made it pretty clear its not fixable at the moment or honestly they have soooooooo many other bugs to deal with before ACing.
To make it more clear so its fairly understandable to you what the situation really is. ACing is like putting 2 people in a fight and one is using groin shots or dirty tricks like throwing dirt in their face and at the moment the referee isn't there to call the shots. Thats pretty much what animation canceling is.... a dirty trick...
Edit: Also be aware. Logic dictates the fact they are patching ACing in any form what so ever means its not working as intended or as well as it should be. Lending validation to most peoples claims. Personally I am a healer so i don't have to pick a side. But i've also been playing MMO longer then some of these players have been born so I know what i see when I see it.
@Jumper45, lets take a look at ZOS' 'official' guide to animation canceling. Specifically at the picture they use to describe it. Notice how that block of red moves to the other bar? They could have easily made them all green, thus getting rid of animation canceling. But instead the put the time effort and testing into moving it to the front of the second bar. That takes actual coding and effort.
Far more coding and effort than would be worth it if they planned to get rid of it.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »In the Thieves Guild update, we wanted to make it more clear which attacks players are using, while preserving the responsiveness and feel of the combat system. So, we started with a simple premise: if an ability is successful, you should be able to see it impact (or launch, in the case of projectiles). Now, every successful attack will display until the moment of impact/launch. Instead of canceling the impact/launch of the first ability, we now obscure the first few milliseconds of the interrupting ability.
The above examples show a Heavy Attack interrupted with an instant ability. The green part is what you see, and the red part is what is not shown. In the first example, you can see the way it is currently on the Live megaservers and has been since launch. The Heavy Attack can be interrupted at almost any time during the wind-up. At the time it is interrupted, the strike happens, but it is invisible because it is obscured by the beginning of the interrupting ability. The second example shows our current method of handling interruptions. Instead of obscuring the strike/launch, we show it up until that point of impact/firing, opting to instead obscure the (less important) first few frames of the interrupting ability.
We believe this visual adjustment meets the criteria we set when we were designing this improvement:- A successfully-fired ability should not be visually obscured; if an attack lands or an ability is launched, we should show it happening
- DPS and other playstyles should not be adversely affected
- The game’s “feel” should not change
One side effect of this change is that there are shorter (or in some cases, no) blend times to smooth the transitions depending on exactly when you choose to fire an interrupting ability. When you’re dealing in milliseconds and giving players that kind of freedom , you sometimes have to forego perfectly smooth transitions in order to make sure the player is receiving proper feedback and telegraphing to other players exactly what they are choosing to do. Having said that, if you find particularly egregious combinations (ability X interrupted with ability Y), please let us know; there may be some things we can do to help smooth them out.
As always, we welcome your feedback. In fact, it will be instrumental in informing us how to proceed with this improvement. Our internal testing has proven to be very successful, but there are so many different playstyles, builds and rotations, we want to make sure we try to implement this in a way that feels good in all cases and doesn’t need to be taught through a tutorial; exactly what you see is what is happening.
I can say with high confidence that they are sticking with this statement;
https://youtu.be/ThZtwhYkKSs
Your in la la land... Its apparent its not something they can fix so they just leave it. Don't try to defend it..
The way it works just shows how it shouldnt be in a game.. Your ignorance is astounding.
Its's people like you that mess up abilities.
I suppose you also use WB spam and I bet your a NB too....2 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@AutolycusOkay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
You said it yourself its a "deal with it" situation. In the gaming industry those 3 words pretty much means broken and not working as it should or as well as it should. If youre smart enough to abuse ACing then youre smart enough to realize rules generally dictate something like ACing would have a UI or visual attachment and not a hidden combat mechanic that is in no way spoken about in game.
Just to throw something out there what you would be looking at is maybe a bar or a icon that light up or has a sweet spot for you to hit to make ACing work. Like gears of war reloading or something like that. Some type of visual so you know whats going on. Does this mean you should or shouldnt be doing it? Hell if I know. They cant stop you from doing it clearly because they cant fix it so why not. But seriously dont try justify the use of it. It is what it is. They made it pretty clear its not fixable at the moment or honestly they have soooooooo many other bugs to deal with before ACing.
To make it more clear so its fairly understandable to you what the situation really is. ACing is like putting 2 people in a fight and one is using groin shots or dirty tricks like throwing dirt in their face and at the moment the referee isn't there to call the shots. Thats pretty much what animation canceling is.... a dirty trick...
Edit: Also be aware. Logic dictates the fact they are patching ACing in any form what so ever means its not working as intended or as well as it should be. Lending validation to most peoples claims. Personally I am a healer so i don't have to pick a side. But i've also been playing MMO longer then some of these players have been born so I know what i see when I see it.
@Jumper45, lets take a look at ZOS' 'official' guide to animation canceling. Specifically at the picture they use to describe it. Notice how that block of red moves to the other bar? They could have easily made them all green, thus getting rid of animation canceling. But instead the put the time effort and testing into moving it to the front of the second bar. That takes actual coding and effort.
Far more coding and effort than would be worth it if they planned to get rid of it.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »In the Thieves Guild update, we wanted to make it more clear which attacks players are using, while preserving the responsiveness and feel of the combat system. So, we started with a simple premise: if an ability is successful, you should be able to see it impact (or launch, in the case of projectiles). Now, every successful attack will display until the moment of impact/launch. Instead of canceling the impact/launch of the first ability, we now obscure the first few milliseconds of the interrupting ability.
The above examples show a Heavy Attack interrupted with an instant ability. The green part is what you see, and the red part is what is not shown. In the first example, you can see the way it is currently on the Live megaservers and has been since launch. The Heavy Attack can be interrupted at almost any time during the wind-up. At the time it is interrupted, the strike happens, but it is invisible because it is obscured by the beginning of the interrupting ability. The second example shows our current method of handling interruptions. Instead of obscuring the strike/launch, we show it up until that point of impact/firing, opting to instead obscure the (less important) first few frames of the interrupting ability.
We believe this visual adjustment meets the criteria we set when we were designing this improvement:- A successfully-fired ability should not be visually obscured; if an attack lands or an ability is launched, we should show it happening
- DPS and other playstyles should not be adversely affected
- The game’s “feel” should not change
One side effect of this change is that there are shorter (or in some cases, no) blend times to smooth the transitions depending on exactly when you choose to fire an interrupting ability. When you’re dealing in milliseconds and giving players that kind of freedom , you sometimes have to forego perfectly smooth transitions in order to make sure the player is receiving proper feedback and telegraphing to other players exactly what they are choosing to do. Having said that, if you find particularly egregious combinations (ability X interrupted with ability Y), please let us know; there may be some things we can do to help smooth them out.
As always, we welcome your feedback. In fact, it will be instrumental in informing us how to proceed with this improvement. Our internal testing has proven to be very successful, but there are so many different playstyles, builds and rotations, we want to make sure we try to implement this in a way that feels good in all cases and doesn’t need to be taught through a tutorial; exactly what you see is what is happening.
I can say with high confidence that they are sticking with this statement;https://youtu.be/ThZtwhYkKSs
Your in la la land... Its apparent its not something they can fix so they just leave it. Don't try to defend it..
The way it works just shows how it shouldnt be in a game.. Your ignorance is astounding.
Its's people like you that mess up abilities.
I suppose you also use WB spam and I bet your a NB too....
It's apparent by how they changed it that 'fixing' it would be far easier thant what they are currently doing to change it. Stop being in denial.This one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!3 -
Laranoye✭✭✭@AutolycusOkay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
You said it yourself its a "deal with it" situation. In the gaming industry those 3 words pretty much means broken and not working as it should or as well as it should. If youre smart enough to abuse ACing then youre smart enough to realize rules generally dictate something like ACing would have a UI or visual attachment and not a hidden combat mechanic that is in no way spoken about in game.
Just to throw something out there what you would be looking at is maybe a bar or a icon that light up or has a sweet spot for you to hit to make ACing work. Like gears of war reloading or something like that. Some type of visual so you know whats going on. Does this mean you should or shouldnt be doing it? Hell if I know. They cant stop you from doing it clearly because they cant fix it so why not. But seriously dont try justify the use of it. It is what it is. They made it pretty clear its not fixable at the moment or honestly they have soooooooo many other bugs to deal with before ACing.
To make it more clear so its fairly understandable to you what the situation really is. ACing is like putting 2 people in a fight and one is using groin shots or dirty tricks like throwing dirt in their face and at the moment the referee isn't there to call the shots. Thats pretty much what animation canceling is.... a dirty trick...
Edit: Also be aware. Logic dictates the fact they are patching ACing in any form what so ever means its not working as intended or as well as it should be. Lending validation to most peoples claims. Personally I am a healer so i don't have to pick a side. But i've also been playing MMO longer then some of these players have been born so I know what i see when I see it.
@Jumper45, lets take a look at ZOS' 'official' guide to animation canceling. Specifically at the picture they use to describe it. Notice how that block of red moves to the other bar? They could have easily made them all green, thus getting rid of animation canceling. But instead the put the time effort and testing into moving it to the front of the second bar. That takes actual coding and effort.
Far more coding and effort than would be worth it if they planned to get rid of it.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »In the Thieves Guild update, we wanted to make it more clear which attacks players are using, while preserving the responsiveness and feel of the combat system. So, we started with a simple premise: if an ability is successful, you should be able to see it impact (or launch, in the case of projectiles). Now, every successful attack will display until the moment of impact/launch. Instead of canceling the impact/launch of the first ability, we now obscure the first few milliseconds of the interrupting ability.
The above examples show a Heavy Attack interrupted with an instant ability. The green part is what you see, and the red part is what is not shown. In the first example, you can see the way it is currently on the Live megaservers and has been since launch. The Heavy Attack can be interrupted at almost any time during the wind-up. At the time it is interrupted, the strike happens, but it is invisible because it is obscured by the beginning of the interrupting ability. The second example shows our current method of handling interruptions. Instead of obscuring the strike/launch, we show it up until that point of impact/firing, opting to instead obscure the (less important) first few frames of the interrupting ability.
We believe this visual adjustment meets the criteria we set when we were designing this improvement:- A successfully-fired ability should not be visually obscured; if an attack lands or an ability is launched, we should show it happening
- DPS and other playstyles should not be adversely affected
- The game’s “feel” should not change
One side effect of this change is that there are shorter (or in some cases, no) blend times to smooth the transitions depending on exactly when you choose to fire an interrupting ability. When you’re dealing in milliseconds and giving players that kind of freedom , you sometimes have to forego perfectly smooth transitions in order to make sure the player is receiving proper feedback and telegraphing to other players exactly what they are choosing to do. Having said that, if you find particularly egregious combinations (ability X interrupted with ability Y), please let us know; there may be some things we can do to help smooth them out.
As always, we welcome your feedback. In fact, it will be instrumental in informing us how to proceed with this improvement. Our internal testing has proven to be very successful, but there are so many different playstyles, builds and rotations, we want to make sure we try to implement this in a way that feels good in all cases and doesn’t need to be taught through a tutorial; exactly what you see is what is happening.
I can say with high confidence that they are sticking with this statement;https://youtu.be/ThZtwhYkKSs
Your in la la land... Its apparent its not something they can fix so they just leave it. Don't try to defend it..
The way it works just shows how it shouldnt be in a game.. Your ignorance is astounding.
Its's people like you that mess up abilities.
I suppose you also use WB spam and I bet your a NB too....
It's apparent by how they changed it that 'fixing' it would be far easier thant what they are currently doing to change it. Stop being in denial.
So your admitting its not intended then? thanks.
0 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@AutolycusOkay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
You said it yourself its a "deal with it" situation. In the gaming industry those 3 words pretty much means broken and not working as it should or as well as it should. If youre smart enough to abuse ACing then youre smart enough to realize rules generally dictate something like ACing would have a UI or visual attachment and not a hidden combat mechanic that is in no way spoken about in game.
Just to throw something out there what you would be looking at is maybe a bar or a icon that light up or has a sweet spot for you to hit to make ACing work. Like gears of war reloading or something like that. Some type of visual so you know whats going on. Does this mean you should or shouldnt be doing it? Hell if I know. They cant stop you from doing it clearly because they cant fix it so why not. But seriously dont try justify the use of it. It is what it is. They made it pretty clear its not fixable at the moment or honestly they have soooooooo many other bugs to deal with before ACing.
To make it more clear so its fairly understandable to you what the situation really is. ACing is like putting 2 people in a fight and one is using groin shots or dirty tricks like throwing dirt in their face and at the moment the referee isn't there to call the shots. Thats pretty much what animation canceling is.... a dirty trick...
Edit: Also be aware. Logic dictates the fact they are patching ACing in any form what so ever means its not working as intended or as well as it should be. Lending validation to most peoples claims. Personally I am a healer so i don't have to pick a side. But i've also been playing MMO longer then some of these players have been born so I know what i see when I see it.
@Jumper45, lets take a look at ZOS' 'official' guide to animation canceling. Specifically at the picture they use to describe it. Notice how that block of red moves to the other bar? They could have easily made them all green, thus getting rid of animation canceling. But instead the put the time effort and testing into moving it to the front of the second bar. That takes actual coding and effort.
Far more coding and effort than would be worth it if they planned to get rid of it.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »In the Thieves Guild update, we wanted to make it more clear which attacks players are using, while preserving the responsiveness and feel of the combat system. So, we started with a simple premise: if an ability is successful, you should be able to see it impact (or launch, in the case of projectiles). Now, every successful attack will display until the moment of impact/launch. Instead of canceling the impact/launch of the first ability, we now obscure the first few milliseconds of the interrupting ability.
The above examples show a Heavy Attack interrupted with an instant ability. The green part is what you see, and the red part is what is not shown. In the first example, you can see the way it is currently on the Live megaservers and has been since launch. The Heavy Attack can be interrupted at almost any time during the wind-up. At the time it is interrupted, the strike happens, but it is invisible because it is obscured by the beginning of the interrupting ability. The second example shows our current method of handling interruptions. Instead of obscuring the strike/launch, we show it up until that point of impact/firing, opting to instead obscure the (less important) first few frames of the interrupting ability.
We believe this visual adjustment meets the criteria we set when we were designing this improvement:- A successfully-fired ability should not be visually obscured; if an attack lands or an ability is launched, we should show it happening
- DPS and other playstyles should not be adversely affected
- The game’s “feel” should not change
One side effect of this change is that there are shorter (or in some cases, no) blend times to smooth the transitions depending on exactly when you choose to fire an interrupting ability. When you’re dealing in milliseconds and giving players that kind of freedom , you sometimes have to forego perfectly smooth transitions in order to make sure the player is receiving proper feedback and telegraphing to other players exactly what they are choosing to do. Having said that, if you find particularly egregious combinations (ability X interrupted with ability Y), please let us know; there may be some things we can do to help smooth them out.
As always, we welcome your feedback. In fact, it will be instrumental in informing us how to proceed with this improvement. Our internal testing has proven to be very successful, but there are so many different playstyles, builds and rotations, we want to make sure we try to implement this in a way that feels good in all cases and doesn’t need to be taught through a tutorial; exactly what you see is what is happening.
I can say with high confidence that they are sticking with this statement;https://youtu.be/ThZtwhYkKSs
Your in la la land... Its apparent its not something they can fix so they just leave it. Don't try to defend it..
The way it works just shows how it shouldnt be in a game.. Your ignorance is astounding.
Its's people like you that mess up abilities.
I suppose you also use WB spam and I bet your a NB too....
It's apparent by how they changed it that 'fixing' it would be far easier thant what they are currently doing to change it. Stop being in denial.
So your admitting its not intended then? thanks.
Its apparent that you also dont know what a quote is. It is obvious they have changed the animation system to better visually account for what is happening. So animations as they currently are are not intended, sure. And since you dont understand what quoting implies in a context like this, quoting or paraphrasing a debate oponents view like this is used to contrast your own. As in 'these are your words and i disagre with them.'This one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!1 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭This is like ESO style conspiracy theories.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU2 -
Jumper45✭✭✭@AutolycusOkay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
You said it yourself its a "deal with it" situation. In the gaming industry those 3 words pretty much means broken and not working as it should or as well as it should. If youre smart enough to abuse ACing then youre smart enough to realize rules generally dictate something like ACing would have a UI or visual attachment and not a hidden combat mechanic that is in no way spoken about in game.
Just to throw something out there what you would be looking at is maybe a bar or a icon that light up or has a sweet spot for you to hit to make ACing work. Like gears of war reloading or something like that. Some type of visual so you know whats going on. Does this mean you should or shouldnt be doing it? Hell if I know. They cant stop you from doing it clearly because they cant fix it so why not. But seriously dont try justify the use of it. It is what it is. They made it pretty clear its not fixable at the moment or honestly they have soooooooo many other bugs to deal with before ACing.
To make it more clear so its fairly understandable to you what the situation really is. ACing is like putting 2 people in a fight and one is using groin shots or dirty tricks like throwing dirt in their face and at the moment the referee isn't there to call the shots. Thats pretty much what animation canceling is.... a dirty trick...
Edit: Also be aware. Logic dictates the fact they are patching ACing in any form what so ever means its not working as intended or as well as it should be. Lending validation to most peoples claims. Personally I am a healer so i don't have to pick a side. But i've also been playing MMO longer then some of these players have been born so I know what i see when I see it.
For starters, the manner in which you address me specifically is distasteful. My last post was in no way provocative or inaccurate, yet you speak to me like you know of my experience and credentials, and somehow that makes you better? It's not like I'm the one telling everyone to "deal with it," that's simply the verdict from ZOS. If they wanted to remove AC from the game, they would have instead of simply adding a QoL adjustment to it. Also, some of your comments suggest you didn't actually read my other posts, as you didn't address a couple of points that I mentioned which contradict what you've said here:
1. They can stop us from doing it, but won't because they want it to remain.
2. They can fix it, but they chose to leave it in the game because they like the way it works and don't feel the need to redo the combat system.
3. They adjusted the animations as a courtesy to players, to make attacks easier to predict, but to allow for this combat mechanic to remain. Logic dictates that after doing an analysis of animation cancelling and deciding that all they needed to do was make some attacks more transparent, that the combat system is almost where they want it to be. Making a minor improvement to a mechanic is not the same as an admission of a broken mechanic.
There is no point addressing me specifically or quoting me if you're going to ignore part of my initial comments, and frankly I don't care how old you are or how much MMO experience you have, as you know nothing of me or my experience, and thus discrediting me on such grounds is without merit.
The underlying issue here is the inability to see any of the animation of certain abilities in a string of attacks. ZOS already addressed it, and it's rolling out in the next month.
@Autolycus
You want to get defensive after the first few words fine with me -shrug- thats the power of getting emotional over text lol.
Anyways there is plenty point in quoting you. More importantly im not even speaking on animations themselves so im not sure why that would mean i havnt read your comments on the patch notes for ACing. I mention it at the bottom which clearly you didnt get down to lol. Assuming thats what u were speaking on anyways. What I spoke on was the visual aid for people attempting to use AC not to see other people using it.
which is quite an interesting thing when youre using first person or from the backside of your character which hides most animations in the first place.
As for your prompt 1 2 3 number off lol
1 and 2 are pretty much the same thing. They would stop you by doing it by fixing it . But something like that you dont just skip your lunch and fix it. More importantly with their track record on fixing things over the past year or so is pretty bad. Every patch creating new bugs which is the business. But its pretty much unmitigated so far.
We'll never know since none of us were in the designing meetings to what the core combat direction was but considering there are deep rooted problems in the combat this many months out of the box I am going with a educated guess it either was not thought out properly or tested properly or was not intended to function that way. Any 3 of those cases would be a failure on someones part in the most grand of ways.
As for #3. Again I wasn't speaking to that end. While it solves half a problem. The problem is still there of people actually doing it properly. I will agree while the inability to see the animations is a issue no doubt it still needs to be fixed. Thus as I said everyones concerns involving ACing is valid in the fact that it is indeed broken at the moment. While it may not be broken in execution it can be broken in other ways. Visual ques need to go both ways. To the user and the one its being used on. Why is this an issue? because in raids or pvp you want your fellow players to be on par with yourself to help.
Is it easy to sit on the outside after the fact and say yeah this is wrong etc. Yeah. But then again understand there are A LOT of issues with the game and it has been a long time so far. They have to keep up with the DLC race and bug upkeep at the same time so I wouldnt take a lack of speed or leniency of the ACing issue as the plan. They very well could have made the mistake and just ran with it because changing core combat this late in the race can cause some very big issues. I hope you do not agree with the way combat is now is the way it should be because its broken in so many aspects right now. ACing being only 1 of many issues.
“All right, I've been thinking, when life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade! Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons! What am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager!
Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons! Do you know who I am? I'm the man whose gonna burn your house down - with the lemons!” (Portal 2)
17 Years MMORPG Experience healing and I still havn't figured out why people stand in red circles.0 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭People who are getting hung up on "animation canceling" are focusing on the wrong thing, in my opinion. All I care about is my sustained DPS. When I tested my spell/attack weaving this morning on the PTS, all I wanted to know was this:
1) Can I still weave an instant spell like Crushing Shock with a medium attack every second or so?
2) Can I still weave a hard cast spell like (unprocced) Crystal Frag with a medium attack every 1.5 seconds?
The answer to both of these questions turned out to be YES. From a combat mechanics point of view, very little has changed. The only major thing I noticed was that you have to be careful not to start your medium attack too soon into the cast time of the spell. I didn't have any trouble adjusting to this, but some people might.#CAREBEARMASTERRACE3 -
Aunatar✭✭✭Emma_Eunjung wrote: »People who are getting hung up on "animation canceling" are focusing on the wrong thing, in my opinion. All I care about is my sustained DPS. When I tested my spell/attack weaving this morning on the PTS, all I wanted to know was this:
1) Can I still weave an instant spell like Crushing Shock with a medium attack every second or so?
2) Can I still weave a hard cast spell like (unprocced) Crystal Frag with a medium attack every 1.5 seconds?
The answer to both of these questions turned out to be YES. From a combat mechanics point of view, very little has changed. The only major thing I noticed was that you have to be careful not to start your medium attack too soon into the cast time of the spell. I didn't have any trouble adjusting to this, but some people might.
People do PvP as well :'D
Btw, I guess I will have to test it on the live version, since PTS tends to be laggy as hell and my latency is never lower than 265@Aunatar
V16 Sorcerer - Aunatar
V16 DK - Aunatarans (Currently main)
V16 DK - Aunatar Evereth
V16 DK - Aunataran
V16 NB - Aunatars
V4 Templar - Lysindel
Lvl 30 NB - Vile Aunataroni De Pipino
Free spot, looking for suggestions0 -
Autolycus✭✭✭✭✭
✭
...Okay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
You said it yourself its a "deal with it" situation. In the gaming industry those 3 words pretty much means broken and not working as it should or as well as it should. If youre smart enough to abuse ACing then youre smart enough to realize rules generally dictate something like ACing would have a UI or visual attachment and not a hidden combat mechanic that is in no way spoken about in game.
Just to throw something out there what you would be looking at is maybe a bar or a icon that light up or has a sweet spot for you to hit to make ACing work. Like gears of war reloading or something like that. Some type of visual so you know whats going on. Does this mean you should or shouldnt be doing it? Hell if I know. They cant stop you from doing it clearly because they cant fix it so why not. But seriously dont try justify the use of it. It is what it is. They made it pretty clear its not fixable at the moment or honestly they have soooooooo many other bugs to deal with before ACing.
To make it more clear so its fairly understandable to you what the situation really is. ACing is like putting 2 people in a fight and one is using groin shots or dirty tricks like throwing dirt in their face and at the moment the referee isn't there to call the shots. Thats pretty much what animation canceling is.... a dirty trick...
Edit: Also be aware. Logic dictates the fact they are patching ACing in any form what so ever means its not working as intended or as well as it should be. Lending validation to most peoples claims. Personally I am a healer so i don't have to pick a side. But i've also been playing MMO longer then some of these players have been born so I know what i see when I see it.
For starters, the manner in which you address me specifically is distasteful. My last post was in no way provocative or inaccurate, yet you speak to me like you know of my experience and credentials, and somehow that makes you better? It's not like I'm the one telling everyone to "deal with it," that's simply the verdict from ZOS. If they wanted to remove AC from the game, they would have instead of simply adding a QoL adjustment to it. Also, some of your comments suggest you didn't actually read my other posts, as you didn't address a couple of points that I mentioned which contradict what you've said here:
1. They can stop us from doing it, but won't because they want it to remain.
2. They can fix it, but they chose to leave it in the game because they like the way it works and don't feel the need to redo the combat system.
3. They adjusted the animations as a courtesy to players, to make attacks easier to predict, but to allow for this combat mechanic to remain. Logic dictates that after doing an analysis of animation cancelling and deciding that all they needed to do was make some attacks more transparent, that the combat system is almost where they want it to be. Making a minor improvement to a mechanic is not the same as an admission of a broken mechanic.
There is no point addressing me specifically or quoting me if you're going to ignore part of my initial comments, and frankly I don't care how old you are or how much MMO experience you have, as you know nothing of me or my experience, and thus discrediting me on such grounds is without merit.
The underlying issue here is the inability to see any of the animation of certain abilities in a string of attacks. ZOS already addressed it, and it's rolling out in the next month.
Anyways there is plenty point in quoting you. More importantly im not even speaking on animations themselves so im not sure why that would mean i havnt read your comments on the patch notes for ACing. I mention it at the bottom which clearly you didnt get down to lol. Assuming thats what u were speaking on anyways. What I spoke on was the visual aid for people attempting to use AC not to see other people using it.
which is quite an interesting thing when youre using first person or from the backside of your character which hides most animations in the first place.
1 and 2 are pretty much the same thing. They would stop you by doing it by fixing it . But something like that you dont just skip your lunch and fix it. More importantly with their track record on fixing things over the past year or so is pretty bad. Every patch creating new bugs which is the business. But its pretty much unmitigated so far.
As for #3. Again I wasn't speaking to that end. While it solves half a problem. The problem is still there of people actually doing it properly. I will agree while the inability to see the animations is a issue no doubt it still needs to be fixed. Thus as I said everyones concerns involving ACing is valid in the fact that it is indeed broken at the moment. While it may not be broken in execution it can be broken in other ways. Visual ques need to go both ways. To the user and the one its being used on. Why is this an issue? because in raids or pvp you want your fellow players to be on par with yourself to help.
...
I recognize why it came off as defensive. I won't try to justify it or deny it. My preference would be to discuss the topic at hand instead.
I emphasize again that animation cancelling is not broken. The fact that it was initially unintended is irrelevant, as it has since been examined and addressed. ZOS looked at the concept and decided that providing a minor adjustment to animations so that they are more easily noticeable and readable is enough, and I've mentioned this point several times. It is neither unfair nor broken, it simply exists. It is an opportunity for efficiency within the current combat system that is available to everyone, therefore it is fair. To put it in your words, "throwing dirt in someone's face or making groin shots" is something both parties can do. I would note here that I don't view AC as fighting dirty, but it is fine that we disagree on that point, as it is subjective anyway.
What is unfair about it? How is it broken? I recognize that you were, at least at one point, attempting to make a suggestion for streamlining the AC mechanic. This is something I can support, however you mask it with claims of it being unfair and broken. Is it affirmation that I like or dislike your suggestion that you are interested in, or a discussion as to whether the mechanic should exist in ESO? I will admit the former is an interesting concept, while the latter is something I am rather indifferent about.Edited by Autolycus on February 5, 2016 8:22PM1 -
vortexman11✭✭✭✭✭
✭Whats animation canceling? I thought we were supposed to fight by spamming bow light attacks
Edited by vortexman11 on February 5, 2016 8:01PMGuild of Shadows ~Elite~Învictus ~Council~
EP | Vortexman | Dunmer DragonKnight | LvL 50 | Rank 50 | Former Emperor of Haderus & Chillrend |
EP | Phobos | Altmer Nightblade | LvL 50 | Rank 26 |
EP | Cheezus Sliced | Argonian Templar | LvL 50 | Rank 30 |
EP | Eterno Tempesta | Altmer Sorcerer | LvL 50 | Rank 33 |
DC | Vortexman | Dunmer DragonKnight | LvL 50 | Rank 12 |
DC | Divine Storm | Altmer Sorcerer | LvL 50 | Rank 04 |
EP | Pocket Vortex | Bosmer Templar | LvL 50 | Rank 24 |
EP | Vortexman | Redguard DragonKnight | LvL 50 | Rank 28 |
EP | Fungal Growth | Argonian Warden | LvL 50 | Rank 26 |
EP | Eternal Guardian | Bosmer Warden | LvL 50 | Rank 13 |
and a few other random toons
Teaching by example > https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5479085#Comment_54790853 -
dodgehopper_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Working fine my end. The roll dodging ani cancelling sometimes doesn't go off, but apart from that it's fine. Combat and movement in general does feel more sluggish though. I really hope they don't plan on releasing it like this.
I'm curious to hear about animation cancellation and biting jabs. I can't cram in the test server on my laptop right now so I'm forced to see what others are talking about. Is it possible to dodge roll out of jabs or does it force you to fully commit to the move now? If so that will be a huge nerf to the Jabs skill.US/AD - Dodge Hopper - Vet Imperial Templar | US/AD - Goj-ei-Raj - Vet Argonian Nightblade
US/AD - Arondonimo - Vet Altmer Sorcerer | US/AD - Azumarax - Vet Dunmer Dragon Knight
US/AD - Barkan al-Sheharesh - Vet Redguard Dragon Knight | US/AD - Aelus Vortavoriil - Vet Altmer Templar
US/AD - Shirari Qa'Dar - Vet Khajiit Nightblade | US/AD - Ndvari Mzunchvolenthumz - Vet Bosmer Nightblade
US/EP - Yngmar - Vet Nord Dragon Knight | US/EP - Reloth Ur Fyr - Vet Dunmer Sorcerer
US/DC - Muiredeach - Vet Breton Sorcerer | US/DC - Nachtrabe - Vet Orc Nightblade
EU/DC - Dragol gro-Unglak - Vet Orc Dragon Knight | EU/DC - Targan al-Barkan - Vet Redguard Templar
EU/DC - Wuthmir - Vet Nord Sorcerer | EU/DC - Kosh Ragotoro - Vet Khajiit Nightblade
<And plenty more>1 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »Working fine my end. The roll dodging ani cancelling sometimes doesn't go off, but apart from that it's fine. Combat and movement in general does feel more sluggish though. I really hope they don't plan on releasing it like this.
I'm curious to hear about animation cancellation and biting jabs. I can't cram in the test server on my laptop right now so I'm forced to see what others are talking about. Is it possible to dodge roll out of jabs or does it force you to fully commit to the move now? If so that will be a huge nerf to the Jabs skill.
Thats a pretty good concernThis one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!1 -
Jumper45✭✭✭
...Okay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
You said it yourself its a "deal with it" situation. In the gaming industry those 3 words pretty much means broken and not working as it should or as well as it should. If youre smart enough to abuse ACing then youre smart enough to realize rules generally dictate something like ACing would have a UI or visual attachment and not a hidden combat mechanic that is in no way spoken about in game.
Just to throw something out there what you would be looking at is maybe a bar or a icon that light up or has a sweet spot for you to hit to make ACing work. Like gears of war reloading or something like that. Some type of visual so you know whats going on. Does this mean you should or shouldnt be doing it? Hell if I know. They cant stop you from doing it clearly because they cant fix it so why not. But seriously dont try justify the use of it. It is what it is. They made it pretty clear its not fixable at the moment or honestly they have soooooooo many other bugs to deal with before ACing.
To make it more clear so its fairly understandable to you what the situation really is. ACing is like putting 2 people in a fight and one is using groin shots or dirty tricks like throwing dirt in their face and at the moment the referee isn't there to call the shots. Thats pretty much what animation canceling is.... a dirty trick...
Edit: Also be aware. Logic dictates the fact they are patching ACing in any form what so ever means its not working as intended or as well as it should be. Lending validation to most peoples claims. Personally I am a healer so i don't have to pick a side. But i've also been playing MMO longer then some of these players have been born so I know what i see when I see it.
For starters, the manner in which you address me specifically is distasteful. My last post was in no way provocative or inaccurate, yet you speak to me like you know of my experience and credentials, and somehow that makes you better? It's not like I'm the one telling everyone to "deal with it," that's simply the verdict from ZOS. If they wanted to remove AC from the game, they would have instead of simply adding a QoL adjustment to it. Also, some of your comments suggest you didn't actually read my other posts, as you didn't address a couple of points that I mentioned which contradict what you've said here:
1. They can stop us from doing it, but won't because they want it to remain.
2. They can fix it, but they chose to leave it in the game because they like the way it works and don't feel the need to redo the combat system.
3. They adjusted the animations as a courtesy to players, to make attacks easier to predict, but to allow for this combat mechanic to remain. Logic dictates that after doing an analysis of animation cancelling and deciding that all they needed to do was make some attacks more transparent, that the combat system is almost where they want it to be. Making a minor improvement to a mechanic is not the same as an admission of a broken mechanic.
There is no point addressing me specifically or quoting me if you're going to ignore part of my initial comments, and frankly I don't care how old you are or how much MMO experience you have, as you know nothing of me or my experience, and thus discrediting me on such grounds is without merit.
The underlying issue here is the inability to see any of the animation of certain abilities in a string of attacks. ZOS already addressed it, and it's rolling out in the next month.
Anyways there is plenty point in quoting you. More importantly im not even speaking on animations themselves so im not sure why that would mean i havnt read your comments on the patch notes for ACing. I mention it at the bottom which clearly you didnt get down to lol. Assuming thats what u were speaking on anyways. What I spoke on was the visual aid for people attempting to use AC not to see other people using it.
which is quite an interesting thing when youre using first person or from the backside of your character which hides most animations in the first place.
1 and 2 are pretty much the same thing. They would stop you by doing it by fixing it . But something like that you dont just skip your lunch and fix it. More importantly with their track record on fixing things over the past year or so is pretty bad. Every patch creating new bugs which is the business. But its pretty much unmitigated so far.
As for #3. Again I wasn't speaking to that end. While it solves half a problem. The problem is still there of people actually doing it properly. I will agree while the inability to see the animations is a issue no doubt it still needs to be fixed. Thus as I said everyones concerns involving ACing is valid in the fact that it is indeed broken at the moment. While it may not be broken in execution it can be broken in other ways. Visual ques need to go both ways. To the user and the one its being used on. Why is this an issue? because in raids or pvp you want your fellow players to be on par with yourself to help.
...
I recognize why it came off as defensive. I won't try to justify it or deny it. My preference would be to discuss the topic at hand instead.
I emphasize again that animation cancelling is not broken. The fact that it was initially unintended is irrelevant, as it has since been examined and addressed. ZOS looked at the concept and decided that providing a minor adjustment to animations so that they are more easily noticeable and readable is enough, and I've mentioned this point several times. It is neither unfair nor broken, it simply exists. It is an opportunity for efficiency within the current combat system that is available to everyone, therefore it is fair. To put it in your words, "throwing dirt in someone's face or making groin shots" is something both parties can do. I would note here that I don't view AC as fighting dirty, but it is fine that we disagree on that point, as it is subjective anyway.
What is unfair about it? How is it broken? I recognize that you were, at least at one point, attempting to make a suggestion for streamlining the AC mechanic. This is something I can support, however you mask it with claims of it being unfair and broken. Is it affirmation that I like or dislike your suggestion that you are interested in, or a discussion as to whether the mechanic should exist in ESO? I will admit the former is an interesting concept, while the latter is something I am rather indifferent about.
You really have to look at it on a grand scale since it does effect every player. Its broken because in that light it certainly does not shine. Hell, some players dont even know what animation canceling is! Its a hidden mechanic thats why its cheap/broken etc what ever you want to call it. We wouldn't even be having this conversation if it was working as intended heh.
There is no visual or mechanic UI understanding of it. The only simple thing you can know is when you see multi hits in your combat window or floating numbers. Console players by the way do not even get these things. Assuming were both on par on our knowledge of ACing. We can look at how abusive macros are with ACing. You can literally string 3-4 abilities with the press of 1 button macro for PC. Which is rough to deal with when you cant even see it. Your character literally jitters and thats it. Thankfully that is being fixed but what of console players? They cant use Macros to force ACing like PC can. It is literally almost an art on console. Thankfully console doesnt have to deal with macros but their problems are its more hidden then PC macros are. So you can be in pvp. get hit with 4 different things and just be like what in the hell was that and you wont know till youre dead and see the death recap window.
If you play PC or Console just be aware ACing plagues them in diffrent aspects but ultimately leads to the same problem. Its just unfair in its current state. Me personally. Crap or get off the pot in my outlook on it. They either fully add it or get rid of it. Not this lame half way in between stuff its currently at. If it was intended why is it hidden. If it wasn't intended why is it still here?
If they want to keep it on fine. All the more power to it. But it needs to be known and have visuals etc. Animations is just one part of it. A player who just joins the game may have NO clue what it is. How to do it and why they should even be doing it. Its not the same as looking at your hot bar and seeing 1,2,3,4,5 etc and seeing those abilities and knowing what they do etc. If they had a bar or anything visual for ACing it would be a different story which im all for. Not to mention first person hindering the situation which was almost a mandatory addon for them for them apparently. Why build combat around ACing with no animations while also limiting said animations with 1st person.“All right, I've been thinking, when life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade! Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons! What am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager!
Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons! Do you know who I am? I'm the man whose gonna burn your house down - with the lemons!” (Portal 2)
17 Years MMORPG Experience healing and I still havn't figured out why people stand in red circles.0 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »Working fine my end. The roll dodging ani cancelling sometimes doesn't go off, but apart from that it's fine. Combat and movement in general does feel more sluggish though. I really hope they don't plan on releasing it like this.
I'm curious to hear about animation cancellation and biting jabs. I can't cram in the test server on my laptop right now so I'm forced to see what others are talking about. Is it possible to dodge roll out of jabs or does it force you to fully commit to the move now? If so that will be a huge nerf to the Jabs skill.
I can interrupt me casting things in all usual ways, including dodging while using jabs.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU0 -
a1i3nz✭✭✭✭Why does animation canceling even bug people? Everybody can do it given they use abilities that can be AC. You're telling me you don't AC Dawnbreaker, because I don't know anyone who doesn't.
I agree that WB should not be on the list because of just how hard it hits and it not (like Dawnbreaker) ending up on everyone's bar. But everything else seems pretty fair. I've been killed countless times by all 4 classes AC.
2 -
VincentBlanquin✭✭✭Okay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
So stringing a few attacks together instantly is fair?... rightttt.
Its who ever can get 1st hit of first wins...
That's not a game. Its equivalent of bringing a knife to a gun fight lol.
So even the fight by bringing a gun yourself, or shut up about animation cancelling. You're all over the forums trashing it when there's no need. It's staying.
so you will now telling people to shut up? do you even have end game character to be able to talk about game properly alucardo?
maybe you should rather consider posting at "finally vet16" ))))Edited by VincentBlanquin on February 6, 2016 9:41AMIrwen Vincinter - Nord - Dragonknight
Irw´en - Bosmer - Nightblade1 -
Kova✭✭✭✭✭So I was in pts and I can say for certain that it's mostly a magicka problem. I can't cancel my shields and have the effect happen outside of the animation. The only magical attack I can cancel is a frag. I was still able to ani cancel my executioners and surprise attacks though, so...yay stam?EP Sorc: Aydinn
AD Stamplar: Verdant`Knight
DC Stamblade: Apple`Punch
EP Stam Sorc: Kós
AD DragonKnight: Transmigrant
EP NIghtblade: Aydinn1 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭So I was in pts and I can say for certain that it's mostly a magicka problem. I can't cancel my shields and have the effect happen outside of the animation. The only magical attack I can cancel is a frag. I was still able to ani cancel my executioners and surprise attacks though, so...yay stam?
I'm very surprised by that assessment... didn't notice anything like it. x)DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU1 -
LoreRiley✭✭✭✭Okay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
"Exploiting"? Zemimax team itself said it was intended to work that way.
No the hell they did not. They said it was not intended but a unintended consequence of their system. Do your research3 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I really don't care why it's there or not.
What I do care about: what is different between then and now?
Could someone break it down for me?0 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Okay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
"Exploiting"? Zemimax team itself said it was intended to work that way.
No the hell they did not. They said it was not intended but a unintended consequence of their system. Do your research
They certainly did say that. Then they said this.https://youtu.be/ThZtwhYkKSs
You can spin it however you want, the most common one is that they can't fix it so they said that. But they said it's not an exploit and that people should do it. And recent changes have shown that they can in fact get rid of it and they don't want to.Edited by Shunravi on February 6, 2016 7:39PMThis one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!1 -
nemisan✭✭✭See, the problem with AC is not if its an exploit or cheating, it just one way of keeping ppl out of the cryo. Imagine if you are a new player...it it a game breaker. Plus, I use to play Warhammer Online, when it closed about 150 of us came over to eso...lag and AC killed 145 of them, and they are very experienced pvp er's . My point is simple, AC is bad for the game, no question about it.0 -
aLi3nZ✭✭✭✭Been trying duels on pts. Weaving with destro staff seems harder and less reliable but it still works. Maybe can get used to it. Maybe change a good thing so animations actually show.0
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Laranoye✭✭✭Lol, Perhaps people shouldn't get used to exploiting (AC) and when they actually do make a change to how it is supposed to actually you may be able to play?!0
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Islyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Okay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
Wth? Wrong on all levels.3 -
Islyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭VincentBlanquin wrote: »Okay, the title is everything you need: why did you get rid of animation canceling?
You claimed that it was intended to exist and it was a matter of player's skills, now you get rid of it?
What was the issue?
Because it was the sensible thing to do? It was basically exploiting and used by people who cannot play the game properly.
If by exploit you mean utilizing a pre-existing mechanic to take advantage of opportunities for efficiency, then yes. Ani cancelling was used by people who can play the game properly. For months people have been arguing about how it's broken and unfair, but it's not. It's a combat mechanic available to everyone, and if one cannot properly AC or refuses to do so, then it's really a "deal with it" kind of situation. It doesn't suddenly become taboo b/c a few people refuse to use it.
So stringing a few attacks together instantly is fair?... rightttt.
Its who ever can get 1st hit of first wins...
That's not a game. Its equivalent of bringing a knife to a gun fight lol.
So even the fight by bringing a gun yourself, or shut up about animation cancelling. You're all over the forums trashing it when there's no need. It's staying.
so you will now telling people to shut up? do you even have end game character to be able to talk about game properly alucardo?
maybe you should rather consider posting at "finally vet16" ))))
And if you are v16 I suggest l2p. If you're not weaving esp as a mana user you're doing it wrong.2 -
rager82b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭They are testing the waters tryings things. I look forward to the day they get rid of it fully. If DCO got rid of it. So can they.0 -
Stigant✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »It's not gone fully but almost ZOS just needs to drive that final nail to get rid of it.
Why you may ask. It is a broken mechanic that was never intentional that exploiters used to gain a very unfair advantage over others.
This mechanic actually WAS intentional, so you can react on any incoming attacks with interupt (bash), block, dodge or weapon swap in the last possibe moment, or at the moment you need/want to, or during your own action, or to be able to interrupt your own action. This was stated out loud by developers in ESO Live about a year ago. The only thing that came to them unexpected is the fact that people found a way to use it offensively. But because the combat is designed as it is they can't (don't know how or don't want to) remove animation canceling without breaking the whole game.
Every player, even those most invested against Animation Canceling, actually DO IT VERY OFTEN themselves, they just don't utilize it to its full potential.
The change they are doing is just "visual" aesthetic ... if they wanted to remove AC then they would simply put animation lock in place, like some other games do. Then you'd be complaining again that the combat is unresponsive, clunky, not fun to play at all... I belive thats one of VERY FEW THINGS they are actually doing right lately.
Its not a class specific problem, everyone can (AND IS) doing it, therefore its not exploit when someone does that, its your loss when you dont actually.
Edited by Stigant on February 8, 2016 10:33AM1 -
Laranoye✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »It's not gone fully but almost ZOS just needs to drive that final nail to get rid of it.
Why you may ask. It is a broken mechanic that was never intentional that exploiters used to gain a very unfair advantage over others.
This mechanic actually WAS intentional, so you can react on any incoming attacks with interupt (bash), block, dodge or weapon swap in the last possibe moment, or at the moment you need/want to, or during your own action, or to be able to interrupt your own action. This was stated out loud by developers in ESO Live about a year ago. The only thing that came to them unexpected is the fact that people found a way to use it offensively. But because the combat is designed as it is they can't (don't know how or don't want to) remove animation canceling without breaking the whole game.
Every player, even those most invested against Animation Canceling, actually DO IT VERY OFTEN themselves, they just don't utilize it to its full potential.
The change they are doing is just "visual" aesthetic ... if they wanted to remove AC then they would simply put animation lock in place, like some other games do. Then you'd be complaining again that the combat is unresponsive, clunky, not fun to play at all... I belive thats one of VERY FEW THINGS they are actually doing right lately.
Its not a class specific problem, everyone can (AND IS) doing it, therefore its not exploit when someone does that, its your loss when you dont actually.
Everything you just said contradicted what you said in the first paragraph... How can AC be intentional if the aim was to have combat to be fluid and to look for cues to defend/counter?!
I think half you people whining about it, actually have no idea how this should work. And just use this as it stands because it makes you pew pew more.
Anyone arguing the fact that it is not broken and working as intended is the the land of rainbows and unicorns...0
This discussion has been closed.