Official Feedback Thread for Prioritization of Combat Animations

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO · February 2016

the way it works now is really fine. not saying dont change it. but why fix whats not broken.

acw37162 · February 2016

After a day of silent celebration; for what in my opinion was a very nice executive call, I would like to add;

Understanding the changes in question are just being tabled until some of the issues can be worked out; I would like to submit the following request stolen directly from jackdanielseso.

Use the animation prioritization pass to give cancels an actual animation and sound that is both awesome looking and sounding.

Make preforming a block cancel/weapon swap cancel or bash cancel look, feel, and sound cool.

About the only thing I like a 2h, even though I'm stuck using it for a variety of reason I hope you address in Dark Brotherhood when you make a pass on stamina skills and stamina utility, is the way it sounds and feels to execute a bash cancel of executioner.

It sounds and feels solid.

Where as a light attack - throwing dagger - bash; does not sound or feel good at all in my opinion.

If you really want a majority of players to embrace the coming changes, take the time to make it look and feel awesome.

Im a console player and I purchased a second copy copy of ESO (against my own better judgement) on my alienware alpha so I could test the combat changes.

And I will say in my opinion the changes to the combat system were very very clunky.

Make it look and feel awesome and a great majority of the players will enjoy it.

Also; please find a way for console players who have an account and a PC, mac, or alienware alpha a way to access test server without a second purchase. That's actually really ***.

Tillalarrien · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Just wanted to update everyone on where we are at with the animation prioritization efforts going on right now. At its core, the goal for the change was to make it clear which attacks players were using, while preserving the responsiveness of combat. We’ve made great strides towards this, but there are still a number of cases where things just don’t look or feel right (blocking as an example). As such, we’re going to be rolling back this change in next week's PTS patch (2.3.4) and will not be taking it to the Live megaservers.

We will continue to iterate on the system internally and will roll out the changes when they are ready.

Thank you soo much

I like the idea behind this try and Im sure that with some more internal and PTS testing you can make it so both the developers and players are satisfied with new animation system.
Thank you again for you courage to reconsider the changes, for listening to the feedback and for generaly being smart with this

OGLezard · February 2016

you seriously should of let this go live....... the fact you can cancel attacks with a block and hide animations and effectively stack many skills into it without your enemy seeing it is just plan wrong. Oh well, guess the QQ wins again. I am sure my opinion on the topic wont make me any friends, but who cares. Thats why it is my opinion.

Jura23 · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Just wanted to update everyone on where we are at with the animation prioritization efforts going on right now. At its core, the goal for the change was to make it clear which attacks players were using, while preserving the responsiveness of combat. We’ve made great strides towards this, but there are still a number of cases where things just don’t look or feel right (blocking as an example). As such, we’re going to be rolling back this change in next week's PTS patch (2.3.4) and will not be taking it to the Live megaservers.

We will continue to iterate on the system internally and will roll out the changes when they are ready.

You just saved ESO. Thanks.

Instant · February 2016

OGLezard wrote: »

you seriously should of let this go live....... the fact you can cancel attacks with a block and hide animations and effectively stack many skills into it without your enemy seeing it is just plan wrong. Oh well, guess the QQ wins again. I am sure my opinion on the topic wont make me any friends, but who cares. Thats why it is my opinion.

Mabye the current system is not perfect but its million times better than the unresponsive new system. On PTS not even i can tell what my char is doing because of how *** up the animations are.

Jura23 · February 2016

OGLezard wrote: »

you seriously should of let this go live....... the fact you can cancel attacks with a block and hide animations and effectively stack many skills into it without your enemy seeing it is just plan wrong. Oh well, guess the QQ wins again. I am sure my opinion on the topic wont make me any friends, but who cares. Thats why it is my opinion.

I think the biggest problem causing lack of clues on enemy actions is bad Cyrodil performance rathar than animation cancelling. Usually you still have some clues like sounds for example or some secondary graphical effects. But the game has to be smooth.

Lucky28 · February 2016

Casdha wrote: »

So let me see if I understand this, and correct me if I'm wrong. Players are angry because with the old way when you block canceled it would allow you to string together damage faster but a block was never actually done unless you held it or hit it twice. Now, new way, if you hit block you actually perform a block in the same rotation and that is something you don't want to happen.

The "old way" all things are equal. however with this change. i can hardly AC any of my abilities on my Magkicka sorc. however, i can use a gap closer while at the same time charging a wreaking blow and hit the person i'm targeting with both at the same time.

it's an unequal change in which not every class can use Animation canceling. which would be really bad.

EDIT: didn't notice i was so far back.

DHale · February 2016

Two swollen thumbs up. Incremental changes not huge ones.

ToRelax · February 2016

OGLezard wrote: »

you seriously should of let this go live....... the fact you can cancel attacks with a block and hide animations and effectively stack many skills into it without your enemy seeing it is just plan wrong. Oh well, guess the QQ wins again. I am sure my opinion on the topic wont make me any friends, but who cares. Thats why it is my opinion.

Full of bugs and not exactly helpful because you saw even less of the ability before it hits you. The animations are like "btw, half a second ago I hit you with this skill"... but I wouldn't complain, would just make it harder for those who are less experienced and who rely more on visuals.

Frawr · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Just wanted to update everyone on where we are at with the animation prioritization efforts going on right now. At its core, the goal for the change was to make it clear which attacks players were using, while preserving the responsiveness of combat. We’ve made great strides towards this, but there are still a number of cases where things just don’t look or feel right (blocking as an example). As such, we’re going to be rolling back this change in next week's PTS patch (2.3.4) and will not be taking it to the Live megaservers.

We will continue to iterate on the system internally and will roll out the changes when they are ready.

@ZOS_RichLambert great decision, thank you!

Really appreciate you guys listening.

In terms of improvements to animations, it has been said before but I'll repeat, it would be amazing if you could time the damage to fire in sync with the animation of the strike hitting the player. This way, cancelling before the strike would result in no damage firing. This would give us reactive combat, allowing cancellation of animations but also preventing invisible damage.

Also, a key point for animations. I often find that once someone initiates some sort of gap closer or other type of distance damage, you cannot block it once the animation has started, even if they have not yet visually struck you. I think that it would improve gameplay if we could react in real time to visual animations

Aunatar · February 2016

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Just wanted to update everyone on where we are at with the animation prioritization efforts going on right now. At its core, the goal for the change was to make it clear which attacks players were using, while preserving the responsiveness of combat. We’ve made great strides towards this, but there are still a number of cases where things just don’t look or feel right (blocking as an example). As such, we’re going to be rolling back this change in next week's PTS patch (2.3.4) and will not be taking it to the Live megaservers.

We will continue to iterate on the system internally and will roll out the changes when they are ready.

Thanks for listening!
All the community will be glad to test the new animation prioritization when it will be ready, thank you again!

bhlegit · March 2016

I've jsut been on the pts and I want to say - apart from the obvious slight lag (being in eu) the animations are great, fluid and responsive again. Thanks guys!

bhlegit · March 2016

I think, looking forward, there should be a tutorial in game about the technicalities of animations during in combat (cancelling/weaving)

Emma_Overload · March 2016

Triumviri wrote: »

Honestly they need to take it a step further, and make it so if you cancel a attack to dodge or block the skill you cancelled does not go off.

i want fluid combat, actual spell weaving, the animation plays thru to its conclusion before you fire off another, then use a compatible spell or attack animation to make legit combos, and make it seamless, almost like a dance.

Regardless of what has been stated Animation cancelling should be in but NO DAMAGE if you cancel it, feel free to cancel a attack but do not expect the fruits of no labor.

This will NEVER work in ESO because people will constantly cancel attacks by accident. Seriously, there must be hundreds of MMOs with clunky cooldowns and sluggish combat. Don't ruin ESO because you can't keep up!

bhlegit · March 2016

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Don't ruin ESO because you can't keep up!

that should be the name of this thread

NinjaApacHe · March 2016

zerosingularity wrote: »

I noticed the following:

Light Attack - Skill is essentially the same as on live in terms of performance. (Main DPS animation cancel.)

Skill - Dodge Roll or Block or Bash. Here is the biggest change, part of the skill MUST fire before you can dodge roll/block/bash, and if you do so too early, no skill goes off. Not a big effect in PvE, but I can see this being big in PvP. Many will not like this. I think it is alright, but this is where people think combat may feel clunky or slower. Skill - Weapon Swap is NOT affected. (This is a good thing, it would majorly affect DPS if it was.)

Also, sometimes after weapon swapping or running, skills won't activate. Dunno how to reproduce this, but it is an issue and I dunno if anyone else noticed this.

This is the reason why they have to IMPROVE this with the next patch! Also if I won't be able to use it anymore, I really want this horrible thing to be removed from the game.

MikeB · March 2016

bhlegit wrote: »

show previous quotes

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Don't ruin ESO because you can't keep up!

that should be the name of this thread

Elitist much? I love how those for AC automatically assume those against it need to "L2P". Fact is out of the 15 people I play with, all of whom are MMO vets of 10+ years, only 2 couldnt care less about AC; the other 13 know how to AC and still think it's a broken attempt at fluid dynamic combat. Dynamic combat isn't cancelling an animation 0.3 seconds into its 2.0 Second cast time and while AC hiding 1-2 other damaging abilities in a combined ~1 sec attack time and getting 100% of the damage of all the abilities cast and AC'd. The animation prioritization on the PTS may have been fundamentally broken but you would have to play ESO blindfolded, or have no prior dynamic combat experience, to say AC isnt. Games with intended AC dont have abilities with cast times just animated insta-cast abilities (think CFrags).

The truth with AC is in the abilities themselves. Heavy hitting, buffing and debuffing abilities like Wrecking Blow, among many other cast time abilities, wouldn't have those long cast times if AC was taken into consideration. Its obvious when they are compared to instant cast abilities. Cast time abilities need to have a GCD equal to the cast time or reworked to consider AC if it is going to be left in the game.

Gargath · May 2016

I could not find any more related thread... but was wondering if the animation of Explosive Charge (morph from Focused Charge in Aedric Spear Templar skill) was somehow improved recently.

I use a quick combo with the below skills and usually got an animation freezing for a second soon after jumped to target, in a moment when explosion ticks:

I'm not sure if this freeze is my PC issue (memory usage or else) or it's game animations issue when using too many quick aoe and dot in very short time.

1x Blazing Spear, morph from Spear Shards
2x Reflective Light, morph from Sun Fire
1x Explosive Charge