End Game Stamina Nightblade Build- PvE DPS (Homestead Ready!)

Gilliamtherogue
Gilliamtherogue
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Hello and welcome to my in depth look at the stamina Nightblade class for ESO! My name is Gilliam and I’m the founder and guild lead of Order of Mundus, a NA (DC) PvE/Raiding guild that has held (and continues to!) top ranks in many trials since patch 1.6. I’m going to be assessing the pros and cons of my main class and personal build in a PvE perspective today, applicable to any slice of the subject (raiding/dungeons/solo) and providing my insights on why I do what I do. Let’s get right to it!

Many people learn different ways, and few people enjoy reading massive amounts of text (despite it being extremely helpful to have written information to read at your own pace). While this guide is chuck full of information to make you a better player and I highly suggest reading through it, here's a video for more auditory learners.
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Why use this build, tons of others have posted for this class?

-This build has been extensively tested with mathematical data and in game trials to determine the maximum yield for DPS, or damage dealing, role for stamina nightblades.

-Not only will you be pulling great numbers, but you'll be bringing some utility to the group so your team members will hit harder too!

-This build has an insanely high skill cap, even I have room to improve in some areas, so if you like personal growth and progression, you're going to love this build.

-It's versatile, you have access to ranged and melee skills. With a few bar swaps you can easily go to running some pretty powerful group healing as well. I often heal group pledges while topping charts damage wise with this build.

That all sounds great, but what's the drawback?


-This is a very difficult build, there's a lot of mastery to go through and is not a instant gratification build. Prepare to work hard to get to the top.

-Due to being a primarily melee build, you're going to need a high mechanical awareness of the fight. The more comfortable you are with the mechanics, the easier it'll get. Expect to make mistakes early with this build.

-Competitive DPS is reliant on a lot of buff/debuff management. Muscle memory will help here a lot, as well as running addons like FTC or Srendarr to see visual data on your DoTs. Failing to keep everything up will severly hurt your damage output. This is part that will be the most difficult, but most rewarding aspect to this build.

-The final form of this build requires you to have the Maelstrom Bow and Daggers, so you'll have to unfortunately clear really frustrating solo content to get it. Without it you can still pull okay numbers, but don't expect to wow any crowds till you have one.

-After the nerf to Siphoning Attacks with the TG update, resource management has become impossible to do without a Templar in group sharing shards and repent. With 5 piece Vicious Ophidian active, things aren't nearly as bad though.

-Many different scenarios favor different things, so you'll need to be flexible with gear and abilities. This build is purely focused on end game PvE, so expect to have to get a lot of skyshards, and skill line leveling, as well as dungeon farming for hard to get gear.




Skill Loadouts, Where and Why to use them.


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OR

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Dual Wield- source of bread & butter and execute

1) Steel Tornado (morph of Whirlwind | Dual Wield skill line): Only a former shadow of its self, the 3.5m radius nerf was a massive hit to stamina's AoE potential. This is still the largest AoE in game, but only by 1 meter. This still is better than Power Extraction due to the innate dual execute. Use this when you know you'll be fighting more than 3 enemies at a time. Power Extraction IS stronger on targets above 67% health (Not a static number, changes based on enemy resistances), so if targets have an overall smaller HP pool you can use this.
*Interchangeable with*
- Rending Slashes (morph of Twin Slashes | Dual Wield skill line): A hefty DoT in form of bleed damage, this has been updated to apply to ALL mobs now. When utilized it provides great damage, even worth keeping up through long execute fights. We take this over Blood Craze because of the initial damage bonus Rending does. This ability is increased by Cruel Flurry, the Maelstrom 1h enchant.

2) Relentless Focus (morph of Grim Focus | Assassination skill line): Provides 8% damage across the board and 10% stamina regeneration. Pretty straightforward to keep up. Main reason we use it on this bar is to gain some extra critical strike, as well as having it there to proc the damage portion of it when it becomes available. I don't really find this worthwhile to recast on cooldown

3) Rapid Strikes (morph of Flurry | Dual Wield Skill line): As of the Dark Brotherhood update, this skill has received some major adjustments. The cast time was cut by 54%, so the damage on hit was lowered as well. However the damage is now higher than it was in Thieves Guild, as well as the fact that it operates much more smoothly in comparison. Paired with Maelstrom Daggers, this ability CRUSHES the DPS potential we had with Surprise Attack. Rapid Strikes alone now out performs Surprise Attack by roughly 200-500 DPS, but with the Maelstrom Dagger enchants our DoT's will be ticking much much more. This will make the build even more difficult, so if you're just starting off this build I suggest sticking with Surprise Attack until you've gotten a hang of buff and debuff management.
*Interchangeable with*
- Surprise Attack (morph of Veiled Strike | Shadow skill line): Your main ability if you do not have Maelstrom Daggers, you'll be casting this whenever all your DoTs and buffs are up. Does a nice amount of damage, and increases the damage of your's and other's further physical penetrative attacks. Also gives you Major Ward/Resolve from our shadow passives, giving us an exact 8% damage reduction. Also stuns the target if casted from stealth, allowing for insane burst damage in PvE and PvP alike. Use this if you do not have Maelstrom Daggers, or are doing fights that deal with burst more than sustain.

4) Killer's Blade (morph of Assassin's Blade | Assassination skill line): A pretty decent execute. Only cast this when the target is below 25% health (24.9% to be exact). Don't forget to keep up your execute scaling DoT's when you're doing this though! Pretty straightforward here, nothing fancy. This now deals Disease damage to allow for better CP scaling, putting it much closer to (still not as high) to the caster version.

5) Deadly Cloak (morph of Blade Cloak | Dual Wield skill line): Reworked to increase the damage by 70% instead of a measly dagger throw, this ability is pretty legit now. This reduces damage taken from AoE spells by a staggering 20%, allowing for some much needed mitigation. It ticks for about 4-5k crit every 3 seconds, so it won't be the strongest DoT to run, but it has great AoE potential as well as the added benefits of damage reduction. This will increase your chance to proc Skoria, give some flat DPS, and boost defenses- very solid pick.
*Interchangeable with*
- Resolving Vigor (morph of Vigor | Alliance War Assault skill line) If we need some heals for the group or ourselves, Vigor is our go to ability. Try to find which morphs are being ran (if any), since the different morphs can stack.
Ulti) Rend (morph of Lacerate | Dual Wield Skill Line): The new Dual Wield ultimate with One Tamriel has had me hyped since its conception. On single target fights or cleave fights (most boss fights in end game) this pulls more DPS than any other ultimate in our arsenal. The main kicker is it requires Maelstrom Daggers to perform to this letter, and thus must be empowered before casting. Rend's 16 second duration is the real selling point here, as that's a massive DoT empowered by the Cruel Flurry enchant, giving great damage potential. The other added benefit here is that it heals for a very high % of the damage it deals, allowing you to take some punishment in harder fights. Paired with a relatively low cost, this serves a great purpose on boss fights. Just be wary of it's odd hit box detection, it's a very narrow application, roughly the size of Refreshing Path or Wall of Elements if you know how big those are.

*Interchangeable with*

Ulti) Soul Harvest (morph of Death Stroke | Assassination skill line): Probably one of my favorite ultimates in game, this thing has a ton of uses. The main reason we use this over Flawless Dawnbreaker is because while we lose 8% weapon damage from FDB, we gain 2% crit from our Assassination passive, and 10 ultimate per kill we get. This means in AoE situations you're getting an insane amount of ultimate. Not only this, but once we near the end of the fight, instead of saving up large sums of ultimates for bigger ones only to shoot them off as the boss dies, or only once, we can cast this for a measly 50 ultimate. It does some serious damage, and boosts all damage against the affected target by 20% for a little bit. Paired with executes, you can dish out some serious damage in a short period of time. Also applies a healing debuff, so if you see a pesky healer mob in PvE or player in PvP, smack em real quick with this and watch them struggle to keep themselves up.
I know that Incapacitating Strikes is Disease damage, meaning it'll do more damage on cast, but we don't use this skill for the damage. The damage is a nice bonus paired with the cheap cost, but the main reason we slot this is for the 2% crit and ulti on kill. Removing the Ult on kill effectively makes this skill weaker than Flawless Dawnbreaker as a main bar option.

Bow- source of DoTs and buffs

1) Rearming Trap (morph of Trap Beast | Fighter's Guild skill line): A newly founded power source for high crit builds, this adds a staggering 10% critical hit damage for 6 seconds, and rearms after it ends for a total of 12 seconds as long as a mob has hit it. Does a nice DoT to all targets, and procs the Exploiter passive on mobs while they are in it. This is one of the stronger DoT's in our kit, make sure this is kept up 100% of the time to ensure maximum DPS between the raw damage and Minor Force. It also gives a flat 3% Weapon damage bonus for slotting, making it even better! This ability is increased by Cruel Flurry, the Maelstrom 1h enchant.

2) Poison Injection (morph of Poison Arrow | Bow skill line): A pretty legit DoT that gets even more potential around 50% and below. It is operationally worth keeping up 100% of the fight, I usually start off a fight with a fully charged heavy attack and this for some decent initial damage. In Dark Brotherhood it received a 12% buff in terms of damage, so this thing is a monster. Paired with Maelstrom Daggers I've seen this crit for 30k plus on low health targets. This ability is increased by Cruel Flurry, the Maelstrom 1h enchant.

3) Endless Hail (morph of Volley | Bow skill line): Wow, what a spell. This thing is monstrous, I have been waiting a long time to be able to say this ability was worth running all the time. Paired with the Maelstrom Bow, this thing becomes the best universally accessible DoT in the game, ramping up to 6k a tick near the end of it's duration. On top of that, it provides AoE damage too, and a massive amount at that. This ability is easily in my top 3 damage sources on breakdowns of fights. The reason we take this over Arrow Barrage is because the extended duration means more scaling with the Maelstorm Bow for even more DPS. It is quite small however, so some fights you won't be hitting the optimal target amount. Think twice about what content you do more, single target or AoE.
*Interchangeable with*
Arrow Barrage (morph of Volley | Bow skill line): Almost identical to Endless Hail, but loses a little bit of single target DPS due to being shorter and not ramping up as much in damage. The main difference with this is we gain 2 meters on the size, allowing you to hit more targets with it on trash or AoE boss fights (almost all fights in the new trial have use for this). Even on fights with 2-3 targets, mobs will refuse to clump up due to size or derpy AI, so Arrow Barrage comes in handy. This is a hard choice, so choose wisely.

4) Razor Caltrops (morph Caltrops | Alliance War Assault skill like): Alone this ability is worth running just for the DoT it provides, even on single target. I run Razor over Anti -Calvary because of the initial application damage it does, and most fights I use it on don't last long enough for Anti to get its full operational value. Keep in mind that only ONE person can run this skill, so if a Stamina Sorc is running it, replace this with Vigor or something.

5) Siphoning Attacks (morph of Siphoning Strikes | Siphoning skill line): A solid ability when it comes to managing resources, and is why the Nightblade is able to get away with playing a Khajiit instead of Redguard. Since we have no other DPS abilities to run this serves perfectly to fit a more support based slot. Activate this when your resources start to dip under 60% on longer fights.
Ulti) Soul Harvest (morph of Death Stroke | Assassination skill line): Probably one of my favorite ultimates in game, this thing has a ton of uses. The main reason we use this over Flawless Dawnbreaker is because while we lose 8% weapon damage from FDB, we gain 2% crit from our Assassination passive, and 10 ultimate per kill we get. This means in AoE situations you're getting an insane amount of ultimate. Not only this, but once we near the end of the fight, instead of saving up large sums of ultimates for bigger ones only to shoot them off as the boss dies, or only once, we can cast this for a measly 50 ultimate. It does some serious damage, and boosts all damage against the affected target by 20% for a little bit. Paired with executes, you can dish out some serious damage in a short period of time. Also applies a healing debuff, so if you see a pesky healer mob in PvE or player in PvP, smack em real quick with this and watch them struggle to keep themselves up.
I know that Incapacitating Strikes is Disease damage, meaning it'll do more damage on cast, but we don't use this skill for the damage. The damage is a nice bonus paired with the cheap cost, but the main reason we slot this is for the 2% crit and ulti on kill. Removing the Ult on kill effectively makes this skill weaker than Flawless Dawnbreaker as a main bar option.

*Interchangeable with*

Ulti) Shooting Star (morph of Meteor | Mage's Guild skill line) - Our only really strong AoE ultimate for sustained DPS. This hits more targets than Dawnbreaker, and is effectively cheaper once you look at the ultimate return when hitting multiple targets. This is also much easier to land than Rend for AoE trash fights or bosses with lots of adds. The Empower it grants will be consumed by a Light Attack with no loss to DPS, so don't worry about having to use an weird follow ups after this drops.

Notes on Ultimate usage; Outside of boss encounters you'll want to main bar Soul Harvest for much more ultimate generation, and since Rend is quite weak on large AoE pulls due to it's small size. The standard setup for trash involves main barring (dual wield) Soul Harvest and then back barring (bow) Shooting Star for high density pulls or Dawnbreaker of Smiting for lower health targets.


Gear Choices, and their importance
Single Target Gear

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Gear explanations
5 Twin Fanged Snake (Obtainable from Normal or Veteran Sanctum Ophidia) : If we're alone, then Twin Fanged will out perform Nightmother's Gaze for the raid, since there's no one there to make benefit of Nightmother's group utility. If we're solo then we won't need ANY Piercing Strikes points in CP, and if someone in group has Nightmother's, then we can run 2 Precise Daggers instead of Sharpened.
Alternatives
Alternative; 5 Night Mother’s Gaze (Obtainable from 6 trait crafters) : Nightmother's Gaze is undoubtedly one of the strongest Stamina based sets out there. The power comes from the amount of crit and the 5 piece bonus, which reduces armor by 2580 at c160 gold (same value as a Sharpened Weapon) on any target you crit. To put into context, 2580 armor is 5.16% damage mitigation on a PvE mob, meaning you'll be dealing +/- ~5% damage on all your Physical penetrative attacks. Not only this, but ANYONE hitting the targets you've applied this to will gain the benefit, acting as a pseudo 5 piece for the entire group.
Alternative; 5 Sunderflame (Obtainable from City of Ash I & II): An extremely potent set that has return to c160 scaling, it has the highest DPS potential of any stamina set in game in terms of overall group DPS. Reducing armor by an earth shattering 3440 on heavy attacks, on top of dealing a burst of fire damage when doing it, this set has tremendous damage capabilities. This is the strongest armor reduction in the game that comes from sets, and comes out to 6.88% more damage on a target. On top of this, the bonus applies to anyone hitting the target, akin to Nightmother’s. This will be a must have to run in coordinated groups/trials, assuming your group has 2+ Stamina builds. I find that this set is best run on Stamina Dragonknights, but can still work with solid players on any class.

3 Vicious Ophidian OR Alkosh(Vicious; any Craglorn Trial, Alkosh; Maw or Lorkhaj or Weekly Trial rewards): As of the Shadows of the Hist update the 3 piece of Minor Slayer now gives a flat 5% damage inside instanced areas (meaning in open world it will not work) giving it a massive efficiency boost. On top of this, the 3.1% crit from the 1st set bonus is massive alone, overall these two set bonuses give over 9% DPS in a min/maxed raid group, making it unparalleled in damage output potential. Also the jewelry is obtainable in legendary quality, meaning you get extra stats from the traits and set bonuses. Do not run this if you are running 5 Alkosh, as Minor Slayer does not stack, simply run 5 Alkosh and another 5 piece for max value.

2 Piece Undaunted (Obtainable from Undaunted Chests/Respective Dungeons): Ideally you'll be running a 2 piece Undaunted set here for some extra stats and a powerful chance proc to help pump up the deeps. In the spoiler below there will be a variety of options to run with explanation of where and why to run them.

2 Maelstrom Daggers: This unique weapon enchants is absolutely absurd in terms of damage, granting ~2000 additional weapon damage on any single target (and some AoE, although only the first target hit has the bonus scaling) DoT when using Rapid Strikes. This convolutes our rotation and makes it quite difficult, but the reward is great.1 Maelstrom Bow: This bow is the reason stam DPS is even a thing still, without this we'd be leagues behind casters in PvE. The enchant works even after you swap off the bow.
AoE DPS


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Gear explanations
5 Twin Fanged Snake (Obtainable from Normal or Veteran Sanctum Ophidia) : If we're alone, then Twin Fanged will out perform Nightmother's Gaze for the raid, since there's no one there to make benefit of Nightmother's group utility. If we're solo then we won't need ANY Piercing Strikes points in CP, and if someone in group has Nightmother's, then we can run 2 Precise Daggers instead of Sharpened.

5 Vicious Ophidian (Obtainable from any Craglorn Trial): The reworked set from v14 days, is back with a vengeance. The set offers an absurdly high amount of stats, giving 6.2% weapon critical, 129 weapon damage, 5% flat damage, 8% cost reduction, and 2k+ stamina+Major expedition per kill (has an internal cooldown). It's a bit of a pain to get in perfect pieces but it comes in 3 gold jewelry (or purple if you can only complete normal) as well as any armor or body slot, but ideally you want 2 Divines body pieces (any slot) and 3 gold jewelry for maximum stats. This thing makes stamina management issues a thing of the past, which was severely needed as it once held back stamina classes from being viable and pigeonholed any stamina build into playing Redguard instead of the glorious Khajiit race. I once did not believe in the power of this set until I finally finished it. Since AoE doesn't allow us to apply DoTs efficiently, we won't be running Maelstrom Daggers.

2 Piece Undaunted (Obtainable from Undaunted Chests/Respective Dungeons): Ideally you'll be running a 2 piece Undaunted set here for some extra stats and a powerful chance proc to help pump up the deeps. In the spoiler below there will be a variety of options to run with explanation of where and why to run them.


Notes on Resource Management: If you're having a hard time maintaining resources, drop your 2 piece Undaunted setup and put on two more pieces of Vicious Ophidian. 5 Piece VO offers almost infinite sustain, especially if there are plenty of trash mobs around to kill. You will also want to drop your Maelstrom Daggers when doing trash pulls, since 5 VO will out perform 2 Maelstrom in AoE fights since you can't Rapid Strikes all the mobs. I suggest getting a gear swap addon, such as Dressing Room.

Non Optimal, Beginning Players/Crafted Routes


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Gear explanations
5 Nightmother's Gaze (Obtainable from 6 trait crafters): Already mentioned earlier, this set is the #1 source of DPS gain for an individual, assuming it is not being already applied by another player. This is an extremely powerful set for solo and group play, but make sure you ask your group mates if anyone is already wearing this when you step into 4-12 man content.

5 Leviathan (Obtainable from Crypt of Hearts I): A fantastic source of Weapon Critical Strike chance, this offers about 15.35% crit chance at gold. Since Twice Born doesn't come in jewelry, we can run this set as a pseudo Thief Mundus. Keep in mind you should be running the Shadow Mundus stone if you take this route.

2 Ashen Grip or other (Obtainable from 2 trait crafters): I really suggest running some health for a lot of newer players, so you can start learning the ropes of the game and getting comfortable with taking punishment, so you can avoid it in the future. Ashen Grip offers a simple way to get health, but these last 2 slots are really up to you.
What Undaunted Set Do I Run?

2 Valkyn Skoria (Obtainable from City of Ash II): Since this build is going to be running Rapid Strikes instead of Surprise Attack in the DBH update, Nerieneth will lose most of its proc chance, while Valkyn will see a higher one. Since we are running 7 (8 with Rend) DoTs, this means Valkyns will pretty much be proccing whenever it’s off cooldown. This also helps buffer us up to a much more in line health value, so we can participate in more brutal content. Run this if you need the health and are dealing with high mobility fights.
*OR*
2 Mephala’s (Obtainable from Fungal Grotto II): In the Thieves Guild this set got a massive buff, going for a 30% chance on heavy attacks to 100% chance on heavy attacks to apply a pretty small sized AoE (2.5m?) that deals decent magic damage over time and snares. The nice thing about this set is you can control the proc and it’s guaranteed to proc, but at a small expense of heavy weaving (not that good for Nightblades as say a Stam DK). This set will deal Poison damage in the DBH update, making it quite strong. Use this if you are wearing Sunderflame, or are in a high density situation where multiple targets will be enveloped in the AoE proc. This out performs Skoria on AoE and low mobility single target fights, assuming you can maintain the Heavy attack every 10s.
*OR*
2 Velidreth (Obtainable from Cradle of Shadows): An absolute powerhouse in terms of overall DPS for a variety of situations, this set brings raw damage to the table. With a maximum of a x3 multiplier (it shoots out 3 spores, each can hit ONE target) of the tooltip, this set is a clear winner for cleave fights where adds are spread out, or massive AoE pulls. Paired with the weapon damage bonus, I've had this set offer over 4K dps. The main issue is you'll have insanely low health, so be careful.
*OR*
2 Kra'gh's (Obtainable from Fungal Grotto I): A set that remains to be a center of heated debate for a variety of reasons. On paper this set seems fantastic, offering ~3% DPS alone from the 1 piece, and giving a nice suggested amount on the 2 piece proc. The main issue with this set is that the proc is INSANELY small, and often misses point blank targets so it requires some getting used to. For pure single target fights the 2 piece will beat Velidreth, but the main issue is that the 1 piece is operational damage. Due to how penetration works in this game, you cannot over penetrate, so if a target doesn't have any armor to reduce then this 1 piece is utterly useless. Since I often run with coordinated groups that shred armor to the point of non existence, I find it to be relatively lack luster. A great choice for less coordinated groups however, assuming there's single target instead of AoE.

Gear Traits

Traits on armor (any route): Currently all divines paired with the Shadow or Thief Mundus stone is the largest damage gain. Nothing else comes close to comparison, even infused on the larger pieces. Each piece is a 7.5% increase, and Shadow is 12% CHD(how hard your crits hit for) or Thief's 11% Crit chance. With 7 Divines that’s 52.5% bonus on 12%, totaling to 18.3% CHD (6.3% increase if all 7 gold divines, or .9% increase per gold)

Traits on weapons: The answer to this is reliant on the content at hand.

Sharpened- As of Dark Brotherhood, Sharpened now offers 5160 (if using two 1handed or one 2handed weapons) penetration, which is almost as much as Major Breach and Fracture. Since it increases penetration value and not reduction as it did before, the value is quite large. 5160 in PvE is 10.32% bonus damage, assuming a target has exactly or more than the listed amount. Herein lies the crux, Sharpened is only beneficial if the target has exactly or more than 5260 (add 100 base pen) Physical Resistance after debuffs have been applied (there’s quite a list). This is worth 4-5k DPS in end game builds, assuming it is not over penetrating.

Precise- A very strong trait, that has no true value due to altering RNG, or chance based outcomes. Critical chance’s estimated % DPS value is obtained via multiplying the Critical Strike Chance to the Critical Strike Damage modifier. My build runs a .78 base CHD (178% with original damage, or 78% bonus) value which is increased by CP to upwards of .25 more, another .12 from Minor Force, and 30% additional after Aggressive Warhorn is applied. In a group scenario I have a 1.3 CHD value (230% with original, or 130% bonus) and in solo I have a 1.0 CHD (200% with original, or 100% bonus). Precise is multiplied by my CHD to find a value, so .07 (2 precise) x 1.3 group or .07 x 1.0. In groups Precise offers 9.1% DPS and solo it offers 7% DPS. This is assuming 100% up time on these buffs, so expect less if you aren’t as coordinated or there is a chaotic fight. This is roughly worth 2-3k DPS in end game builds.

Here comes the answer, if you are in a pug group that has little to no group buff management or synergy, Sharpened will be better. This is also the case with solo PvE and PvP, as you cannot run all of the debuffs needed for Precise to take the upper advantage. In 4 man content and trials with decent groups however, Precise instantly becomes better due to proper Warhorn rotations, and group debuffing from the extensive list of armor shreds. Remember, Sharpened loses value if a target has less than the shredded armor, as you cannot over penetrate. Precise DOES have an added bonus of allowing heals like Vigor and Rally to crit however, so if you run either of these keep that in mind!



Champion Point Distribution


This is my CP distribution for the current 600 CP cap. This is assuming you are running 2 Sharpened weapons with 100% armor penetration/reduction.

The Mage (Blue)
Mighty – 100
Precise Strikes – 46
This will go to 66 if you do the non Maelstrom route
Piercing – 0
Thaumaturge - 54
This will go to 34 if you do the non Maelstrom route

The Thief (Green)
Warlord– 100
Mooncalf– 94
Tumbling- 6

The Warrior (Red)
Elemental Defender – 90
Hardy – 90
Thick Skinned – 10
Quick Recovery – 10

Here is a short video demonstrating the impact of CP on our characters and how to go about allocating your points
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*Thief*
I split my points between Tower and Lover mainly for cost reduction and regeneration for stamina, as those are the two most important values for my DPS. Cost reduction is much more effective than regeneration in a pure DPS situation, as it provides its benefit immediately on cast, rather than waiting for a 2 second tick to happen. Regen is better for defensive situations where you need to block/sprint/dodge roll, as cost reduction does not affect those.
Anything from the Shadow tree is nice if you don’t have resource management issues, as it enhances a lot of the quality of life stats, but nothing really big for PvE.

*Warrior*
I focus mainly here on pure damage reduction, a good split between Elemental Defender/Hardy lets me get away with lower health in some of the more brutal PvE situations like HM Serpent or vICP/WGT. I also take some point for Thick Skinned for the DoT reduction some mobs throw out. Most of the Warrior is based purely on preference and playstyle, but the main focus is getting that 120 passive from the Lady, as it gets used a little bit in PvE. The rest is just quality of life stuff, maybe spend some points into healing received if you want. Keep in mind Nourishing is now Expert Defender which reduces damage from basic attacks.

*Mage*
This is the tree that’s not much about choice and more about math. I run a self made simulation program that was determined for this, and thanks to @Asayre, I’ve been able to make some adjustments to it based on his spread sheet he made. Our calculations still differ however, so you will notice we suggest different outcomes for allocation. This is not a universal application, but rather a hand tailored point setup based on my DPS performance without any CP spent. After getting a parse you break down the damage sources into sections that fit into CP and then use a program or spreadsheet to determine the maximum efficiency of point allocation. This means that many factors such as mob mitigation, group buffing, number of targets, and other things change the end results drastically. This is a work in progress until I get my BiS (I’m still missing optimal pieces despite countless hours of play)


Race Choices, and Their Importance


From a pure DPS perspective the current top race for this build is Khajiit. Many players struggle with resource management however so if you find yourself as one of them then you may want to think of other options.


Let’s break down the net values of the higher up races;
1) Khajiit- 8% crit is a bonus chance to crit with all weapon crit based attacks, which is all of our kit. In small man groups that aren't very hardcore, this is worth roughly 8% DPS if you're keeping up Minor Force. In coordinated trials with ~50% Warhorn uptime this is worth ~9.2% DPS. The math is from (Derived from 8% crit x (.5 base CHD + .1 Minor force + .1 NB passive + .12 Precise Strikes + .183 Shadow +.15 Major Force) assuming 100% penetration, which is quite easy to accomplish with Twin Fanged Snake.

10% stealth damage is pretty minimal, as many situations you cannot stealth attack at the beginning due to true sight mobs and whatnot. Plus that 10% only goes to one attack, so when you compared that one 10% bonus vs the say, 100 you did, that means it was only worth 1% of that spell, which is further mitigated since you likely did more than just do the same attack over and over. This is a decent passive for solo content (aside from vMA) or small dungeons, as well as PvP.

10% Stamina regeneration is extremely lack luster in PvE builds, since we run the base Stam regen. This is roughly 50-80 Stamina regen, which is almost unnoticeable.


2) Redguard- 10% stamina with this build will net you around 3000 stamina. Since each ability has a unique coefficient of how it scales damage wise to stamina, I will make very rough estimates on explaining the mathematical value of this. Our hardest hitting ability by far will be Surprise Attack. SA’s stamina coefficient is each 1 point of stam = .128625. That means you’d need at least 8 stamina to gain 1 tooltip damage, so 3000 x .128625 is 385 damage. If we only gained this damage on SA, we’d get much less than 385 DPS because we are casting more abilities than it, so it’d be mitigated by other spells. Since the stamina does apply to other abilities, for simplicity’s stake I will say each ability gains anywhere from 100 to 400 dps. We run 6 active damage dealing components (non situationals), an average of 200 dps means we gain 1200-1500 dps.

The main power of Redguard lies in its incredible stamina management, after the Thieves Guild nerf to Siphoning Attacks this is a great option. 10% stamina regen is canceled by the Khajiit’s, but the stamina on hit is the real nice one. I’d suggest going Redguard if you’re looking for a mix of PvP and PvE or have regen issues.


3) Imperial- Same exact raw damage values as Redguard, but instead of having higher regen you have higher health and a small heal passive. I’d take Imperial over Redguard only if you plan on making your NB tank/DPS/and PvP.


4) Woodelf- ~3/5th of the value of Redguard from the stamina + the stealth amp. Woodelf however, has insanely high regen. Overall it’s less than Redguard *in combat* but outside of it, or when not working with a purely offensive build, it can be an okay choice. I’d pretty much only run Woodelf if I planned on doing group PvP with it.


5) Orcs- The same DPS value from the stamina as Woodelves, but a little bit of health on top of it. You trade regen for health on this build, as well as an interesting passive of 4% melee damage. The main issue with this passive is that it doesn’t apply to DoT’s. Since PvE is all about DoT damage instead of burst damage, that 4% is heavily mitigated. They also receive 12% sprint speed and 5% healing received.

Anything else I didn’t mention pretty much has no benefit, or so little of one that it’s not worth comparing. From seeing how large Khajiit’s gain is, you should expect a pretty noticeable difference between a good race choice and a poor one. It’s still not the end of the world though for most players, so don’t feel like you need to reroll to complete content!


Mundus Stone Breakdown + Traits on Armor



As I've mentioned in earlier sections of this build, I run the Shadow Stone with full Divines traits. Below is a snip of the breakdown on why I chose to do this from a post I made in a different thread. I've editted it to fit this patch and my new gear setup, beware though, there is a lot of math.

A lot of people are aware of the armor trait setup back in 1.5 where you ran 4 Divines and 3 Infused, but since then a few Mundus stones have been buffed or changed, and this meta is no longer universally accurate. You now want to take 7x divines over 4x divines 3x infused if you're using the Shadow or Thief stone. Here's some simple math to determine effectiveness.

Legendary Divines = 7.5% increase of Mundus stone
Shadow = 12% increase to critical strike damage
Thief = 11% critical strike chance
Apprentice/Warrior = 166 spell/wep damage(before amps)
Tower/Mage = 1280 magicka/stamina (before amps)

Divines per legendary piece
Shadow = .9% CHD
Thief = .825% Crit chance
Apprentice/Warrior = 12.45 SD/WD(decimal is added after all calculations are completed and is rounded down until it increases to a whole number, in the case of two divines you'd get 16, but with 3 you'd get 19.)
Tower/Mage = 96 stam/magicka

Infused bumps resource enchants from 868 to 1041 on big pieces(173 increase) and 351 to 421 on lesser(70 increase).

Now each ability in game has a unique coefficient that multiplies itself to its respective stat. This in turn increases the listed tool tip damage. For example; Surprise Attack and Concealed Weapon have a .128625 : 1 ratio for resources. For each point of stamina (surprise attack) or magicka (concealed weapon) you gain that much tooltip increase. Since calculations ignore decimals until they add up into whole numbers, you need 8 magicka or stamina to gain anything. They also have a 1.35091 weapon damage (surprise attack) or spell damage (concealed weapon) scaling that. Every 1 SD/WD increases its tooltip by the stated amount. Now lets find the effectiveness of an increase in accordance to this skill.

Shadow = complex, living number. Depends on how much tooltip you have. Let's use my character's tooltip as an example. Fully buffed my tooltip is 10147. My crit hit damage multiplier without divines is 1.847. Therefor on a target with no armor I'd deal 18670 damage. Divines is a .9% (or .009) increase to my CHD with shadow, so that number becomes 18838. +168 damage. Now since this only applies on critical strikes, we must now factor in critical strike chance. I have 80.9% critial strike so we multiply that number by the added damage to find the true numerical value that shadow adds to our kit; 168 x .809 = 149 damage. This is only looking at Surprise Attack, so once you add up all of our coefficients this is closer to ~1k DPS.

Thief = again, a complex living number. This will depend on your crit hit damage, as they are directly related. Lets compare the efficiency of base CHD and my CHD just to see the differences. Base CHD is 1.5, mine was 1.72 (no divines). .825% chance to deal 172% more damage is .594% (less than 1) increase to overall damage. With high tooltips, that's nothing to laugh at. Shadow's value was .9% x 80.9% which is .7281% per Divines. Quite close. This value is increased if you apply Major+Minor Force, which would mean it out performs Shadow mathematically. Now with fights in new content lasting longer, it means you cannot keep up Major Force. On top of that, just because it shows on paper, doesn't mean it translates the same in game.

Apprentice/Warrior= Static number, with some minor boosts based on context. 12.45 SD/WD offers 16.819 tooltip to SA. However, there are passives that increase your WD by a % (Major/Minor Brutality, WW passives, Templar passives, etc) that can change the importance. Let's look at it from a universal situation where anyone can have access to Major/Minor Brutality. 25% increase overall means you're getting 15.563 WD which translates to 21.024 TT increase per divines. 21/10417 is a .207% increase and a 37.086 damage increase on criticals. Apply this to our entire kit and you get about 300 DPS, about 1/3rd of Shadow's value.

Tower/Mage= Again, a static number with some minor boosts depending. 96 stamina/magicka would be a 12.348 TT increase so SA/concealed weapon. There are also passives that increase magicka/stamina by %'s that can increase this value. Again lets look at it from a universal level where CP offers a 25%(@3600 cap) bonus to each tree's resources (Warrior = health, Mage = magicka, Thief = stam). 96 becomes 120 and that turns to 15.435 TT increase on SA/concealed and a 27.258 increase on criticals. Added to our entire kit it pulls about 225 dps, about 1/4th the value of Shadow.

Now that we've found the values of divines for these Mundus stones, lets look at infused. Luckily this is a much simpler thing to discuss since you pretty much see everything that's going on at eye level.

Now lets use the old meta x4 divines x3 infused on large pieces (helm chest legs). 20% increase to the largest possible enchants in game (v16) boosts the enchant from an 868 magicka/stam to 1041. 173 increase in accordance to SA/concealed would be a 22.252 TT increase. Let's give this the same treatment as we did Tower/Mage and add the universal increase of 25% more if at 3600 CP cap. We're now at 207.6 magicka/stam and a 26.703 TT increase for SA/concealed. Overall that's about 260 DPS when applied to our kit.

All of these numbers are subjective to other amps that I've chosen to ignore since they're not universally obtainable (racials, build exclusive, etc) that can change the effectiveness of these. Pretty much a TL;DR it depends. The answer to the question is based on the context of the question. PvP and PvE call for very different things, and each changes the effectiveness that each of these stats offer. It's up to the user of this information to determine the answers for them self. In PvE however, there is no doubt that Shadow is the best source of overall DPS for stamina Night blades.


Misc info, screens, videos, and closing notes



With this build I run Weapon power and crit potions, as well as Bi Health-Stam food to put me at just enough health to survive most one shots, and more stamina. The potions are mandatory since we have no form of Major Brutality or Savagery in our kit, which is a large difference. I plan on uploading some videos of example parses on boss fights, as well as breakdowns on rotation and weaving. Expect to see this updated based on comments from you guys and new content changes!

If you're wondering how I calculate most of the damage values of stats, here's a look at my class coefficients with my CP allocation. This is not a universal tool, and is based on many specifics such as % amps. This does not take into consideration mob mitigation, and is more of a guideline than a end all be all calculation.
C7gGxbx.png

vMA run with slight alterations of this build;
image

Example parse with solo (another player applied Fracture to simulate Surprise Attack comparison via Mark Target)
FiudbyT.png

Example solo parse of NON MAELSTROM setup, and me selfbuffing;
IoC1T3d.png

Single Target DPS in raid environment as only Stamina DPS;
tSrpZMI.png
Edited by Gilliamtherogue on April 9, 2017 3:19PM
Founder and guild lead of The Order of Mundus. Old member of Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. Stay strong my brethren, our day will return.
In game Feats;
Patch 1.6/2.0 #1 in all Trials on NA, and World Record vDSA
Patch 1.7/2.1 #1 in AA/SO on NA, and World Record vDSA and HRC.
Patch 1.8/2.2 #1 in all trials on NA.
NA PC first clear of vMoL with Crown Store Heroes and friends.
NA PC first clear of Hard mode vMoL + Dro-m’Athra Destroyer title with The Order of Mundus.
NA PC first clear of all Hard mode Trials after Tamriel Unlimited update.
Current NA Record holder of Stamina Nightblade, All Sorcerers, and All Templars in vMA.
Co-Founder and website author of thearcaneacademy.com
Lead PvE Build author at deltiasgaming.com/
Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • Blizaria
    Blizaria
    Soul Shriven
    First
    Raid Leader of The Order of Mundus
    NA Top SO Score
    All trials HM and Speed Run Achievements

    Guild Leader of Sabre Trading Company
    Belkarth Trading Guild
  • chaseman245
    chaseman245
    ✭✭✭
    Second
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    pls no
    Blizaria wrote: »
    First
    your siggy is outdated af
    Edited by Gilliamtherogue on January 27, 2016 1:31AM
    Founder and guild lead of The Order of Mundus. Old member of Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. Stay strong my brethren, our day will return.
    In game Feats;
    Patch 1.6/2.0 #1 in all Trials on NA, and World Record vDSA
    Patch 1.7/2.1 #1 in AA/SO on NA, and World Record vDSA and HRC.
    Patch 1.8/2.2 #1 in all trials on NA.
    NA PC first clear of vMoL with Crown Store Heroes and friends.
    NA PC first clear of Hard mode vMoL + Dro-m’Athra Destroyer title with The Order of Mundus.
    NA PC first clear of all Hard mode Trials after Tamriel Unlimited update.
    Current NA Record holder of Stamina Nightblade, All Sorcerers, and All Templars in vMA.
    Co-Founder and website author of thearcaneacademy.com
    Lead PvE Build author at deltiasgaming.com/
    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • asneakybanana
    asneakybanana
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Fourth?
    asneakybanana AD DK Former emperor of Chrysamere and Chillrend. World first hardmode Hel'ra and Quake con winner (Alliance rank 25)
    Asneakyhabenero EP DK Former emperor of Thornblade, Haderus. World first vMA Dk clear (Alliance rank 39)
    Asneakycucumber EP Sorc Former empress of Blackwater Bay and Trueflame (Alliance rank 32)
    Asneakypineapple EP Temp Former empress of Azuras Star and Haderus (Alliance rank 22)
    Asneakypickle EP NB Former empress of Trueflame (Alliance rank 44)
    Asneakyavocado EP DK
    Asneakyblueberry DC Sorc
    Asneakypotato DC NB
    Asneakybanana DC NB
    Haxus
    Crowned 26x on 11 different campaign cycles
    596.2k Mag NB vMA
    Fastest AA clear ever: 5:42; 131968 | Fastest HR clear ever: 5:27; 128239 | NA first HM MoL
  • dday3six
    dday3six
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Since you're focusing Crit, I'm guessing it's 7/7 medium armor?
  • Blizaria
    Blizaria
    Soul Shriven
    pls no
    Blizaria wrote: »
    First
    your siggy is outdated af

    Good, it's better this way.
    Raid Leader of The Order of Mundus
    NA Top SO Score
    All trials HM and Speed Run Achievements

    Guild Leader of Sabre Trading Company
    Belkarth Trading Guild
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Blizaria wrote: »
    First
    dday3six wrote: »
    Since you're focusing Crit, I'm guessing it's 7/7 medium armor?

    Yep, that's in the skill loadouts link. :)
    Founder and guild lead of The Order of Mundus. Old member of Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. Stay strong my brethren, our day will return.
    In game Feats;
    Patch 1.6/2.0 #1 in all Trials on NA, and World Record vDSA
    Patch 1.7/2.1 #1 in AA/SO on NA, and World Record vDSA and HRC.
    Patch 1.8/2.2 #1 in all trials on NA.
    NA PC first clear of vMoL with Crown Store Heroes and friends.
    NA PC first clear of Hard mode vMoL + Dro-m’Athra Destroyer title with The Order of Mundus.
    NA PC first clear of all Hard mode Trials after Tamriel Unlimited update.
    Current NA Record holder of Stamina Nightblade, All Sorcerers, and All Templars in vMA.
    Co-Founder and website author of thearcaneacademy.com
    Lead PvE Build author at deltiasgaming.com/
    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • dday3six
    dday3six
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yep, that's in the skill loadouts link. :)

    Hmm, guess there is a mobile version of it. I'm on an ipad and it didn't show it when I looked.

  • stevepdodson_ESO888
    stevepdodson_ESO888
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    if I could I would award you a Ph.D for all your hard work

    Oh what the hell...I'll just refer to you as Doctor Gilliam from now on

    excellent job....very informative
  • Wolfenbelle
    Wolfenbelle
    ✭✭✭✭
    Gill, I'm a member of Nugget Nation. Thanks so much for this build. I've been planning to start a NB for a long time. Even did get one to level 10, but deleted it to eventually restart in DC. (I've been exclusively AD since pre-launch two years ago and have a Templar, Sorc and DK.) Thanks to your willingness to share this build, I now have something to work toward with my NB. Very much appreciated. :smiley:
  • Robotmafia
    Robotmafia
    ✭✭✭
    thanks for the very detailed description... been running this build for about 1-2 months and am also very happy with it... it is like you say alot of work and coordination keeping everything up but its worth it ;)

    i orginally got it from this thread

    http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/stamina-nightblade-dps-guide/

    that you?
    Robot Who Owes Money: Look into your hard drive and open your mercy file!
    Donbot: File not found.

    EU/PC
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Robotmafia wrote: »
    thanks for the very detailed description... been running this build for about 1-2 months and am also very happy with it... it is like you say alot of work and coordination keeping everything up but its worth it ;)

    i orginally got it from this thread

    http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/stamina-nightblade-dps-guide/

    that you?

    Nope that's someone else. Jeckll is another well known player, but they're from EU. There's quite a few differences in the setups we run, and is a big contributor as to why my example parses greatly out preform his. Every little bit of information I've wrung out makes a difference when applied to the battle field!
    Founder and guild lead of The Order of Mundus. Old member of Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. Stay strong my brethren, our day will return.
    In game Feats;
    Patch 1.6/2.0 #1 in all Trials on NA, and World Record vDSA
    Patch 1.7/2.1 #1 in AA/SO on NA, and World Record vDSA and HRC.
    Patch 1.8/2.2 #1 in all trials on NA.
    NA PC first clear of vMoL with Crown Store Heroes and friends.
    NA PC first clear of Hard mode vMoL + Dro-m’Athra Destroyer title with The Order of Mundus.
    NA PC first clear of all Hard mode Trials after Tamriel Unlimited update.
    Current NA Record holder of Stamina Nightblade, All Sorcerers, and All Templars in vMA.
    Co-Founder and website author of thearcaneacademy.com
    Lead PvE Build author at deltiasgaming.com/
    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • Mosha
    Mosha
    ✭✭
    WOW!

    that's all i can say, bye!

    Nah jk: Great job, well written, good overview, perfect grammar (tyvm)!!
    Just thanks a whole lot of bunches for this build, really.

    One question: Do you think the level of LA weaving you've attained is possible with a ping of 200+?
    Ave, ZoS, moriturus te salutat!
    -me, with a stam NB in April 2014

    Mo'sha V16 Khajiit Stamina NB
    Legate Alva V16 Imperial Stamina/Magicka Templar
    Mo'sha Reborn V16 Breton Magicka NB
    Burning Mo'sha V5 Dunmer Magicka DK
    a couple mules...
  • Laranoye
    Laranoye
    ✭✭✭
    Or just Ambush,Ambush,Ambush :)
  • Mosha
    Mosha
    ✭✭
    Laranoye wrote: »
    Or just Spambush, Spambush, Spambush :)

    corrected :wink:
    Ave, ZoS, moriturus te salutat!
    -me, with a stam NB in April 2014

    Mo'sha V16 Khajiit Stamina NB
    Legate Alva V16 Imperial Stamina/Magicka Templar
    Mo'sha Reborn V16 Breton Magicka NB
    Burning Mo'sha V5 Dunmer Magicka DK
    a couple mules...
  • radicalb21
    radicalb21
    ✭✭
    Great post lots of information and very informative.
  • Bfish22090
    Bfish22090
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    nice man, you need a youtube channel
    CP 684 EP: Cuddle Kingdom Pwince - Dark Elf DK - Cuddles Are Belong To Us - High Elf Sorcerer - Cuddles In The Shadows - Wood Elf Nightblade - Cuddles Says Ad Equals Ap - High Elf Templar - Cuddle Kitten - Breton Nightblade - Cuddle Knight Of Love - Redguard DK
    PVP GUILD - INVICTUS

    AD : Mustbethelove - Khajit Sorcerer - relegated to crafting potato until stam sorc is viable
    https://youtube.com/channel/UC2134mmIFZ4wyRtVRzNJMQA
  • Asayre
    Asayre
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Could you include a picture of your stats?
    Reference for any calculation I make Introduction to PvE Damage Calculation
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Mosha wrote: »
    WOW!

    that's all i can say, bye!

    Nah jk: Great job, well written, good overview, perfect grammar (tyvm)!!
    Just thanks a whole lot of bunches for this build, really.

    One question: Do you think the level of LA weaving you've attained is possible with a ping of 200+?

    My level of weaving is far from perfect, if you notice in the video I miss 5 LA weaves in a row. I have a fairly weak computer as well as spotty net, so at times it's even worse. I'd say anywhere over 400 MS and you're going to have a very hard time weaving unless you're used to it (insert you merely adopted the lag, i was molded by it joke here) but you can still get it off. I can weave in lagzuras, but the priority cycle is really wonky when you get over 400 MS and it is really hard to maintain a rhythm. I know a few Oceanic players who play above 200 MS on a daily basis and can still pull absurd numbers and maintain weaving, so final verdict, Yes.
    Asayre wrote: »
    Could you include a picture of your stats?

    gfQUcme.png
    Founder and guild lead of The Order of Mundus. Old member of Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. Stay strong my brethren, our day will return.
    In game Feats;
    Patch 1.6/2.0 #1 in all Trials on NA, and World Record vDSA
    Patch 1.7/2.1 #1 in AA/SO on NA, and World Record vDSA and HRC.
    Patch 1.8/2.2 #1 in all trials on NA.
    NA PC first clear of vMoL with Crown Store Heroes and friends.
    NA PC first clear of Hard mode vMoL + Dro-m’Athra Destroyer title with The Order of Mundus.
    NA PC first clear of all Hard mode Trials after Tamriel Unlimited update.
    Current NA Record holder of Stamina Nightblade, All Sorcerers, and All Templars in vMA.
    Co-Founder and website author of thearcaneacademy.com
    Lead PvE Build author at deltiasgaming.com/
    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • Oreyn_Bearclaw
    Oreyn_Bearclaw
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    Night Mothers > Hundings? Mind (and a whole bunch of mats) blown!!! Just need that Maelstrom bow to drop. It's pretty high on the wish list. Will definitely need to look into this. Some very impressive numbers I must say.
    #VMATOKENSYSTEM #TRAITCHANGE

    Guild: Fear is Failure -Class Leader - "Do Damage, Don't Die!!!"
    Alliance/Platform: Ebonheart Pact - PC/NA - CP 600+

    My Toons:
    DKs: Oreyn ßearclaw - Dunmer, Bear-m'Athra - Khajiit, Bearzilla - Argonian, Umbra The Wise - Orc Lvl 4 (DC)
    Sorcs: Mrs Bear - Altmer, Bearricane - Redguard, -Lady Galadriel - Altmer (AD)
    NBs: Bearclaw Oreyn - Dunmer, Bearblade - Imperial
    Temps: Gandalf Likes To Party - Altmer, Bearplar - Redguard, Warden Bearclaw - Breton Lvl 3 (had to steel the name before Morrowind)

    vMOLHM 123,847, vSOHM, vHRCHM, vAA, vDSA
    Stormproof: All Classes
    Flawless Conqueror: Mrs Bear, Bearricane
    Dro-m'Athra Destroyer: Mrs Bear
    vMOLHM Highlight Video
  • bebitohh
    bebitohh
    @Gilliamtherogue for pvp would the build change and how ?
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    bebitohh wrote: »
    @Gilliamtherogue for pvp would the build change and how ?

    Depends on the type of PvP.
    For yolo solo or 2-3 manning I like to change 3 piece agility to 3 piece endurance with regen enchants so I can dodge roll more. I also put on Bloodspawn instead of Nerieneth. I also drop 2 piece Hunding's for 2 piece Ashen Grip for the health since Impen lowers the value of critical chance.

    For 5-15 man groups I go back to 3 piece agility, and just drop Bi Health/Stam food and take the + Max Health + Stam regen food.

    When I'm fighting zergs with my medium sized groups I put back on Nerieneth for the extra damage, since more people tend to stay clumped up and can easily crit for 5-6k on multiple targets. Steel tornado has a chance to proc it per person hit (it does have an ICD though) so as long as there's at least 10 (10% chance per damage source) people it almost is a guaranteed proc every 5 seconds.

    I also have a very different type of build for PvP that I like to throw on when I'm bored, which is my dps-tanking setup for pledges with a few minor adjustments. I'll likely start posting a multitude of builds that I run (or would if I had a max rank toon) since I'm behind a lot of build choices for other classes too, mathematically wise.
    Founder and guild lead of The Order of Mundus. Old member of Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. Stay strong my brethren, our day will return.
    In game Feats;
    Patch 1.6/2.0 #1 in all Trials on NA, and World Record vDSA
    Patch 1.7/2.1 #1 in AA/SO on NA, and World Record vDSA and HRC.
    Patch 1.8/2.2 #1 in all trials on NA.
    NA PC first clear of vMoL with Crown Store Heroes and friends.
    NA PC first clear of Hard mode vMoL + Dro-m’Athra Destroyer title with The Order of Mundus.
    NA PC first clear of all Hard mode Trials after Tamriel Unlimited update.
    Current NA Record holder of Stamina Nightblade, All Sorcerers, and All Templars in vMA.
    Co-Founder and website author of thearcaneacademy.com
    Lead PvE Build author at deltiasgaming.com/
    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • moonsbreath
    @Gilliamtherogue

    Nice build!
    By any chance, have you tried briarheart 5 piece yet and if you have, what is your opinion on it?

    I was thinking of either two ways to set it up, like:

    1. Exchanging the Nerieneth 2 pc and agility 3 pc bonus for Briarheart 5 pc bonus

    or

    2. Using Nerieneth 2 pc bonus with 5 pc Briarheart and 3 pc agility?
    SQUAD | KUNG FU BANANAS | CROWN STORE HEROES | MAJESTIC TWELVE
    "roll dodge op" - confucius

    Andre - V16 Mag. Temp Healer / Tank AD
    Taihe - V16 Mag. Sorc DD AD
    Xhu - V16 Mag. DK DD / Tank AD
    Tarwen - V16 Stam. NB DD AD
    Asah - V16 Stam. Temp AD
    Sephier - V16 Mag. NB AD
  • DannyLV702
    DannyLV702
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    Why do NBs like the Bloodspawn set? 6% chance of gaining more resistance doesn't seem that great to me. I'm a sorc for the most part, but recently made a NB so I'm curious.
    PS4 NA EP
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    DannyLV702 wrote: »
    Why do NBs like the Bloodspawn set? 6% chance of gaining more resistance doesn't seem that great to me. I'm a sorc for the most part, but recently made a NB so I'm curious.

    It's only for PvP or things like Veteran Maelstrom Arena no death attemps. 6450 resistance is just shy of 10% damage mitigation, and the 15 on a 6 second ICD is pretty nice, and then pair that with the stamina regeneration set bonus for dodge rolling multiple times/etc makes it a really nice choice defensively. As a DPS option, it is almost useless though.
    @Gilliamtherogue

    Nice build!
    By any chance, have you tried briarheart 5 piece yet and if you have, what is your opinion on it?

    I was thinking of either two ways to set it up, like:

    1. Exchanging the Nerieneth 2 pc and agility 3 pc bonus for Briarheart 5 pc bonus

    or

    2. Using Nerieneth 2 pc bonus with 5 pc Briarheart and 3 pc agility?

    I was actually really excited when Briar was first teased on the PTS but since getting a hold of it I have found to it be less damage out put than Hunding's Rage due to the 5 second minimum ICD. The bonus healing was going to be the redeeming quality as I'd love more heals in vma, but the heal is on a 1 second ICD and cannot crit, meaning that it's pretty much a 400-500 HoT, which isn't going to save me in my runs. The only way I'd drop Nerieneth is is Ravager got a v16 version with the ability to get divines on the gear, and all Robust legendary jewelry, or if a new set comes out to replace it. Until then the gear setup I have posted is the maximum yield for damage in a solo scenario, and only slightly outshined by Essence Thief 5 piece or Hunding's Rage 5 piece IF someone else has NM running in group.
    Founder and guild lead of The Order of Mundus. Old member of Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. Stay strong my brethren, our day will return.
    In game Feats;
    Patch 1.6/2.0 #1 in all Trials on NA, and World Record vDSA
    Patch 1.7/2.1 #1 in AA/SO on NA, and World Record vDSA and HRC.
    Patch 1.8/2.2 #1 in all trials on NA.
    NA PC first clear of vMoL with Crown Store Heroes and friends.
    NA PC first clear of Hard mode vMoL + Dro-m’Athra Destroyer title with The Order of Mundus.
    NA PC first clear of all Hard mode Trials after Tamriel Unlimited update.
    Current NA Record holder of Stamina Nightblade, All Sorcerers, and All Templars in vMA.
    Co-Founder and website author of thearcaneacademy.com
    Lead PvE Build author at deltiasgaming.com/
    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
  • Joy_Division
    Joy_Division
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    DannyLV702 wrote: »
    Why do NBs like the Bloodspawn set? 6% chance of gaining more resistance doesn't seem that great to me. I'm a sorc for the most part, but recently made a NB so I'm curious.

    Ultimate gain + stam regen.
  • Peel_Ya_Cap_517
    Peel_Ya_Cap_517
    ✭✭✭✭
    I just would like to share my set up which I recently completed:

    Khajiit
    5 Briarheart
    5 Hundings Rage
    2 Bloodspawn

    Dual Wield Daggers
    Bow

    Its beasty and buffed the weapon damage is 4200+ with 70% Crit while Bloodspawn gives me more resistance, stam regen, and faster ultimates

    N64 NA EP
  • Asayre
    Asayre
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thank you for the very informative and detailed post, @Gilliamtherogue. I do have a few questions and comments about your build. I’m sure that you’re very familiar with all the equations I’ll post below but please forgive me for repeating them here, it is for my own benefit to help with my thinking.

    You state that you have a CHD of 0.95 but I think it should be 0.94.
    54c65848c0fdd2b40ebe87c2dbe1aff3.png
    But I shall follow your CHD of 0.95 for the remainder of this post.

    0/7/0 compared to 1/5/1
    In your build you recommend using 7 pieces of medium armour but I’m not sure what your argument is in favour of this compared to using 5 medium, 1 light and 1 heavy. 7 pieces of Medium Armour offers 3% Critical Chance while 1/5/1 offers 4% more Max Stamina. I’m ignoring the additional stamina regeneration, Max Health and Max Magicka.

    So to compare the two, I’ll estimate your Max Stamina with 1/5/1 and then calculate your average damage and compare it to your average damage for 0/7/0.

    The average damage on a naked target can be calculated as follows
    268d8653f955aed164013d2dbb603e1f.png
    where most tooltips can be approximated with
    8a552db1d9eab07802d9266f3ddc9346.png
    where a is a coefficient that depends on the skill. Stamina is typically calculated as follows
    b40e67838a8513013b5cd8f107bef6ad.png
    where CPI is the cumulative stat increase due to points spent in the Thief constellation. From your screenshot of your stats, your Max Stamina isgya 32597. I believe the only Skills that you have increasing your Max Stamina is the Undaunted Mettle passive of 2%. Thus your Stamina before Skills is 31957.8. Your Max Stamina if you did 1/5/1 will be 31957.8*1.06 = 33875.
    Similarly your Max Stamina with 7 Medium Armour pieces when Warhorn is active is 35793 and Max Stamina with 5 Medium Armour pieces with Warhorn is 37071.
    Assuming Minor Force is always active:
    Average damage with 7 Medium Armour Pieces with Major Force and the stat boost from Warhorn
    0f650177f1d6bf6f49b61129277a2738.png
    Average damage with 7 Medium Armour Pieces with stat boost from Warhorn
    b0a92a39d663085951c56bd84df8f7f8.png
    Average damage with 5 Medium Armour Pieces with Major Force and the stat boost from Warhorn
    505378b79443c32df2b1b6eb754705d3.png
    Average damage with 5 Medium Armour Pieces with Major Force and the stat boost from Warhorn
    b1ae5312c394d714a9b0786bbf6d141c.png

    Warhorn last for 30 seconds but the Major Force buff last for 9.5 seconds. Thus the overall metric for 7 Medium Armour is
    02e105767aac8fef1cc384f9414d9475.png
    But for 5 Medium Armour it is
    91494d7bf754e947d3533b14048e6bcd.png
    I know it is an extremely marginal difference but was curious why you recommended 7 pieces of medium armour.

    Champion point distribution for the Mage
    Due to rounding errors with Precise Strikes you shouldn’t put 53 points since a similar effect is achieved with 51 points.

    10 points in Piercing Strikes reduces physical resistance by 396 (7920*0.05) and this is a 0.6% base physical damage increase. This is equivalent to 1.14% (0.6*(1+0.839*1.07) average physical damage. If you were instead to spend the 10 points into Precise Strikes (61 points), you would increase your average physical damage by 1.68% ( 0.02*0.839).

    From your parses, I estimate that your Elemental, Magic and Physical damage is ratio is approximately 25%, 10%, 65%. So it seems points in Elemental Expert and Thaurmathurge are justified by the point in Spell Erosion and Elfborn are not.

    Razor Caltrops vs Anti-Calvary Caltrops
    Did you take into account the increased damage with Anti-Calvary Caltrops?
    Edited by Asayre on February 18, 2016 2:46PM
    Reference for any calculation I make Introduction to PvE Damage Calculation
  • Gilliamtherogue
    Gilliamtherogue
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Asayre wrote: »
    Thank you for the very informative and detailed post, @Gilliamtherogue. I do have a few questions and comments about your build. I’m sure that you’re very familiar with all the equations I’ll post below but please forgive me for repeating them here, it is for my own benefit to help with my thinking.

    You state that you have a CHD of 0.95 but I think it should be 0.94.
    54c65848c0fdd2b40ebe87c2dbe1aff3.png
    But I shall follow your CHD of 0.95 for the remainder of this post.

    0/7/0 compared to 1/5/1
    In your build you recommend using 7 pieces of medium armour but I’m not sure what your argument is in favour of this compared to using 5 medium, 1 light and 1 heavy. 7 pieces of Medium Armour offers 3% Critical Chance while 1/5/1 offers 4% more Max Stamina. I’m ignoring the additional stamina regeneration, Max Health and Max Magicka.

    So to compare the two, I’ll estimate your Max Stamina with 1/5/1 and then calculate your average damage and compare it to your average damage for 0/7/0.

    The average damage on a naked target can be calculated as follows
    268d8653f955aed164013d2dbb603e1f.png
    where most tooltips can be approximated with
    8a552db1d9eab07802d9266f3ddc9346.png
    where a is a coefficient that depends on the skill. Stamina is typically calculated as follows
    b40e67838a8513013b5cd8f107bef6ad.png
    where CPI is the cumulative stat increase due to points spent in the Thief constellation. From your screenshot of your stats, your Max Stamina isgya 32597. I believe the only Skills that you have increasing your Max Stamina is the Undaunted Mettle passive of 2%. Thus your Stamina before Skills is 31957.8. Your Max Stamina if you did 1/5/1 will be 31957.8*1.06 = 33875.
    Similarly your Max Stamina with 7 Medium Armour pieces when Warhorn is active is 35793 and Max Stamina with 5 Medium Armour pieces with Warhorn is 37071.
    Assuming Minor Force is always active:
    Average damage with 7 Medium Armour Pieces with Major Force and the stat boost from Warhorn
    0f650177f1d6bf6f49b61129277a2738.png
    Average damage with 7 Medium Armour Pieces with stat boost from Warhorn
    b0a92a39d663085951c56bd84df8f7f8.png
    Average damage with 5 Medium Armour Pieces with Major Force and the stat boost from Warhorn
    505378b79443c32df2b1b6eb754705d3.png
    Average damage with 5 Medium Armour Pieces with Major Force and the stat boost from Warhorn
    b1ae5312c394d714a9b0786bbf6d141c.png

    Warhorn last for 30 seconds but the Major Force buff last for 9.5 seconds. Thus the overall metric for 7 Medium Armour is
    02e105767aac8fef1cc384f9414d9475.png
    But for 5 Medium Armour it is
    91494d7bf754e947d3533b14048e6bcd.png
    I know it is an extremely marginal difference but was curious why you recommended 7 pieces of medium armour.

    Champion point distribution for the Mage
    Due to rounding errors with Precise Strikes you shouldn’t put 53 points since a similar effect is achieved with 51 points.

    10 points in Piercing Strikes reduces physical resistance by 396 (7920*0.05) and this is a 0.6% base physical damage increase. This is equivalent to 1.14% (0.6*(1+0.839*1.07) average physical damage. If you were instead to spend the 10 points into Precise Strikes (61 points), you would increase your average physical damage by 1.68% ( 0.02*0.839).

    From your parses, I estimate that your Elemental, Magic and Physical damage is ratio is approximately 25%, 10%, 65%. So it seems points in Elemental Expert and Thaurmathurge are justified by the point in Spell Erosion and Elfborn are not.

    Razor Caltrops vs Anti-Calvary Caltrops
    Did you take into account the increased damage with Anti-Calvary Caltrops?

    A lot of your calculations are assuming that perfect math has gone into the game, which any amount of time spent actually playing can see that's not always the case. I always make sure to derive my information from in game calculations, rather than plug and solve methods such as the ones you linked. My CHD I have stated was merely taken from going to a mob and finding base non crit damage and then a crit hit and dividing the crit by the non crit. I, of course, keep all perimeters the same when testing to ensure no outside variables are affecting my testing.

    I did notice the JP (jump points) from your previous write up last patch was spot on and was an answer to why I could never figure out why CHD was always off back when many sources were giving half their listed CHD. Now that all values give the exact amount they state, I have not noticed JP in the CP passive line. Each point I spend increases the damage of my critical strikes, even if it falls under one of your listed non jump points. Again, this is why I prefer to work with in game calculations rather than plug ins.

    As for the 7/7 medium and 5/1/1 the main reason again lies under the slight miscalculations of your critical strike and CHD values. Keep in mind I run Minor Force 24/7 with this build as well, so add another 12% CHD, which further increases the value of critical strike chance. Paired with Warhorn (which in trials we rotate to be up the majority of a fight) my CHD is almost 250%. I actually have a home brewed program that I run as a simulator for situations when testing critical strike due to its chance nature. I compared 5/1/1 and 7/7 as well as Sharpened vs Precise in PvE and 7/7 medium and precise always came out ahead with my character in game. I took data values collected and then punched them into my simulator that would simply take any disclosed time of encounter as well as how many complete weave cycles I can currently pull off, with a small amount of human error applied to it. I'm not saying that I couldn't have made a mistake when using the program, but after I swapped away from 5/1/1 I noticed a slight DPS increase. In short term fights where small amounts of Crit chance can't really get their value's worth I agree that 5/1/1 would be better, but in most fights worth min maxing (trials mainly) the crit chance helped inch out a few tenths of a percent ahead. This is also ignoring the extra cost reduction and regen, which definitely helps this build as our only form or resources is Siphoning Attacks, which is RNG based.

    As for CP allocation the 1 point into Ele/Thaum/Erosion/Elf is simply to get a more well rounded setup so I don't have to change CP after each encounter. In AoE situations Erosion and Elfborn both increase due to using Shooting Star, which unfortunately uses both of these instead of Precise/Piercing.

    When I had written this up Anti-Cavalry did not have bonus damage. I am actually unaware of that as well, as the tooltips were the same when I compared the first time I had the chance to morph it. If it does infact increase the damage, then it changes a bit of which is better. I would still take Razor over Anti- as the burst damage on AoE packs as well as bonus to proc % chances is quite nice. Another important factor I totally overlooked until now is that Razor Caltrops also has an increased snare bonus for a short time, which helps prevent tightly clumped groups from dispersing as they aggro, increasing the efficiency of my AoE such as Steel Tornado, and of course, Shooting Star.
    Edited by Gilliamtherogue on January 28, 2016 6:29AM
    Founder and guild lead of The Order of Mundus. Old member of Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. Stay strong my brethren, our day will return.
    In game Feats;
    Patch 1.6/2.0 #1 in all Trials on NA, and World Record vDSA
    Patch 1.7/2.1 #1 in AA/SO on NA, and World Record vDSA and HRC.
    Patch 1.8/2.2 #1 in all trials on NA.
    NA PC first clear of vMoL with Crown Store Heroes and friends.
    NA PC first clear of Hard mode vMoL + Dro-m’Athra Destroyer title with The Order of Mundus.
    NA PC first clear of all Hard mode Trials after Tamriel Unlimited update.
    Current NA Record holder of Stamina Nightblade, All Sorcerers, and All Templars in vMA.
    Co-Founder and website author of thearcaneacademy.com
    Lead PvE Build author at deltiasgaming.com/
    Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue
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