The Akaviri Swords Motif.

Kuroinu · October 2015

The point of me posting this little snip of story is to show that even characters within ESO refer to Akaviri swords as Dai-Katanas/Katanas.

This is taken from a book in ESO that you can find within the Group Dungeon: Crypt of Hearts. The Ebony Blade(A Dai-katana), a Daedric relic related to Mephala lies within there. However the story goes that these adventurers think it may be an Akaviri sword that lies within.

To Faindor: Obviously, don't transcribe this note into the journal (you think you're funny—it's tragic). Nerien'eth may have time to review this introduction and provide further context—he's had a chance to analyze the Teeth before his recent trip across the continent, so bring this to his attention once he has finished cataloguing the artifacts he found out there. His letters mentioned an ancient weapon—a sword of some kind. He thinks it may be Akaviri. You're always reading about the Akaviri, aren't you? Finish this before the dormitory serves supper and I shall make certain you get a chance to see it.

You can read the rest of it here.

This is the Ebony Blade within the Crypt of Hearts.

kkampaseb17_ESO · October 2015

elias.stormneb18_ESO wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Potentates Sword, it is Akaviri, max VR level is VR10, look at the handle and the Tsuba guard..

So sad that they could not just use these models for the one handed versions..

I just want to craft these, how hard could it be for them to add them....

It is part of the Akaviri Motif and perfectly craftable. It is the second tier Akaviri sword, as I have already stated twice. There is no Tsuba Guard on that sword.

On no they didn't! Don't tell me that is the motif for sub VR14-16 gear but they gave us that lame looking leaf blade sword as top tier Akaviri?

What a hit and miss by a mile....

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO · October 2015

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

elias.stormneb18_ESO wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Potentates Sword, it is Akaviri, max VR level is VR10, look at the handle and the Tsuba guard..

So sad that they could not just use these models for the one handed versions..

I just want to craft these, how hard could it be for them to add them....

It is part of the Akaviri Motif and perfectly craftable. It is the second tier Akaviri sword, as I have already stated twice. There is no Tsuba Guard on that sword.

On no they didn't! Don't tell me that is the motif for sub VR14-16 gear but they gave us that lame looking leaf blade sword as top tier Akaviri?

What a hit and miss by a mile....

ummm, yes they did, thats why this thread is here and so many people are upset about it... and this isn't even the 1st thread/post about it, this is like the third or fourth..

Kuroinu · October 2015

Much discussion has been had in this thread and I believe most have came to the conclusion that even though the katana style is in the second tier, this is not acceptable since everyone works towards the final tier.

Therefore the katana style does not exist as a viable style option. It's that simple, no more meaningful discussion can be had about this. It's too obvious, at least to me.

Kuroinu · October 2015

@whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO - I believe his initial words are that of sarcasm lol. He is agreeing.

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO · October 2015

Riko_Futatabi wrote: »

Much discussion has been had in this thread and I believe most have came to the conclusion that even though the katana style is in the second tier, this is not acceptable since everyone works towards the final tier.

Therefore the katana style does not exist as a viable style option. It's that simple, no more meaningful discussion can be had about this. It's too obvious, at least to me.

Totally Agree here.... ZOS fix it...

killimandrosb16_ESO · October 2015

pvp reward v12 1hand sword is a katana. Get it.

Kuroinu · October 2015

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

pvp reward v12 1hand sword is a katana. Get it.

/facepalm - This isn't specifically about the lack or want of katanas. It's about the Akaviri motif not being properly represented.

If there was ever to be a Motif that had katana and dai-katana styled weapons, this was it. That is the problem here.

kkampaseb17_ESO · October 2015

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

elias.stormneb18_ESO wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Potentates Sword, it is Akaviri, max VR level is VR10, look at the handle and the Tsuba guard..

So sad that they could not just use these models for the one handed versions..

I just want to craft these, how hard could it be for them to add them....

It is part of the Akaviri Motif and perfectly craftable. It is the second tier Akaviri sword, as I have already stated twice. There is no Tsuba Guard on that sword.

On no they didn't! Don't tell me that is the motif for sub VR14-16 gear but they gave us that lame looking leaf blade sword as top tier Akaviri?

What a hit and miss by a mile....

ummm, yes they did, thats why this thread is here and so many people are upset about it... and this isn't even the 1st thread/post about it, this is like the third or fourth..

I know mate. I created the first one back on the second day when Orsinium was released on PTS. It is on the PTS forum.

This needs to change and give us katanas as final crafting stage....not intermediate one.

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO · October 2015

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

pvp reward v12 1hand sword is a katana. Get it.

Why would I want to do it when I could be crafting my own VR16 Akaviri Katanas with the Akaviri Motif..

Oh thats right because the last tier is not in Katana style its in a European sword style...

ZOS fix it, we want Katana style swords throughout all tiers of the Motif, one handed and two handed.

Thank you for fixing it and not breaking the Lore.

AtriasNaradan · October 2015

I'll say it as well, Akaviri sword not looking like a Katana is something that's never seen on TES series...well, at least i don't see it on Oblivion and Skyrim that i've played.

Secondly, while it's true that Akavir is not just Tsaeci, and the other races might have different type of weaponries, the fact is that the one ever in contact with people of Tamriel in the existing lore by the time of ESO is the Tsaeci. Also changing the sword to non-katana while the armor still looks Japanese Samurai type of armor isn't logical to say that the higher tier one is from other races of Akavir, there's an obvious inconsitency there.

That to say, please also remember that the other Akavir races still named by east Asian type of name, which is sorry to say, no European looking sword would be logical whatsoever. If any, if you want to make it that higher tier of none katana in respect of other races of Akavir, then it should be one of other east Asian sword, and none of them looks as European as that Imperial motif (yes, that is a copy of an imperial motif sword).

The way i see it, the likelihood is that ZOS wants to add real world sword logic where katana is considered as an actual weak and brittle sharp sword, which making it a model of a strong sword of lvl v16 is non-immersive. They forget though, Akavir katana swords of TES universe did defy our real world logic, and still placed as one of the stronger weapon.

So in the end, as much as i don't really interested in getting myself a katana looking sword, but i would still say there's no reason to not making Akavir sword a katana all the way. Even changing tier, it can't completely change form from a Katana to a European based imperial looking of a sword. There are actually different types of katanas that can be made to represent different tier. No matter what though, it got to still be a Katana.

CONCLUSION: Non Katana Akavir sword on the time period of ESO, is simply lore breaking. Fixed it ZOS.

Kuroinu · October 2015

While I of course agree with you. The part where you assume that this may have been intentional because katanas are seen as brittle swords in the real world. This isn't entirely accurate because in the real world, when they are forged right, they can be the strongest of steel swords. But I'm just nit picking lol.

I actually mention in one of my post in this thread that the Fighters Guild weapons maybe have been mistakenly reskinned along with the armour. Since the Fighters Guild and Akaviri armour in ESO are of the same style. And like I said in that post, the sword style works for the Fighters Guild, but not for the Akaviri specific Motif.

kkampaseb17_ESO · October 2015

AtriasNaradan wrote: »

The way i see it, the likelihood is that ZOS wants to add real world sword logic where katana is considered as an actual weak and brittle sharp sword

Dotanuki katanas would like to have a word with you. They were forged when armors were introduced and they were more "meaty" in order to penetrate properly armor. Also these swords in the right hands can perform an actual kabutowari. Good luck doing that with a westernese sword.

But we are derailing this thread. Please fix this ZoS.

Evergnar · October 2015

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Potentates Sword, it is Akaviri, max VR level is VR10, look at the handle and the Tsuba guard..

So sad that they could not just use these models for the one handed versions..

I just want to craft these, how hard could it be for them to add them....

Yep, the potentates set is the closest thing I've found in game so far to a katana look (goes to VR14 btw).

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO · October 2015

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

AtriasNaradan wrote: »

The way i see it, the likelihood is that ZOS wants to add real world sword logic where katana is considered as an actual weak and brittle sharp sword

Dotanuki katanas would like to have a word with you. They were forged when armors were introduced and they were more "meaty" in order to penetrate properly armor. Also these swords in the right hands can perform an actual kabutowari. Good luck doing that with a westernese sword.

But we are derailing this thread. Please fix this ZoS.

Talk about swords that have the Penetration Trait, a Dotanuki katana was one

mamericus · October 2015

@ZOS_PaulSage

Could you please take a look at this issue and corroborate its loreness? Thank you, Your Loreship.

Your avid fan,
Marcus Arctus
5th Imperial Legion

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO · October 2015

@ZOS_RichLambert

Can we get a /lurk

?

elias.stormneb18_ESO · October 2015

Riko_Futatabi wrote: »

The point of me posting this little snip of story is to show that even characters within ESO refer to Akaviri swords as Dai-Katanas/Katanas.

This is taken from a book in ESO that you can find within the Group Dungeon: Crypt of Hearts. The Ebony Blade(A Dai-katana), a Daedric relic related to Mephala lies within there. However the story goes that these adventurers think it may be an Akaviri sword that lies within.

To Faindor: Obviously, don't transcribe this note into the journal (you think you're funny—it's tragic). Nerien'eth may have time to review this introduction and provide further context—he's had a chance to analyze the Teeth before his recent trip across the continent, so bring this to his attention once he has finished cataloguing the artifacts he found out there. His letters mentioned an ancient weapon—a sword of some kind. He thinks it may be Akaviri. You're always reading about the Akaviri, aren't you? Finish this before the dormitory serves supper and I shall make certain you get a chance to see it.

You can read the rest of it here.

This is the Ebony Blade within the Crypt of Hearts.

Yes... and?

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »

pvp reward v12 1hand sword is a katana. Get it.

Why would I want to do it when I could be crafting my own VR16 Akaviri Katanas with the Akaviri Motif..

Oh thats right because the last tier is not in Katana style its in a European sword style...

ZOS fix it, we want Katana style swords throughout all tiers of the Motif, one handed and two handed.

Thank you for fixing it and not breaking the Lore.

The Akaviri swords are NOT lorebreaking, do your reading because you obviously know nothing of TES Lore.

AtriasNaradan wrote: »

I'll say it as well, Akaviri sword not looking like a Katana is something that's never seen on TES series...well, at least i don't see it on Oblivion and Skyrim that i've played.

Secondly, while it's true that Akavir is not just Tsaeci, and the other races might have different type of weaponries, the fact is that the one ever in contact with people of Tamriel in the existing lore by the time of ESO is the Tsaeci. Also changing the sword to non-katana while the armor still looks Japanese Samurai type of armor isn't logical to say that the higher tier one is from other races of Akavir, there's an obvious inconsitency there.

That to say, please also remember that the other Akavir races still named by east Asian type of name, which is sorry to say, no European looking sword would be logical whatsoever. If any, if you want to make it that higher tier of none katana in respect of other races of Akavir, then it should be one of other east Asian sword, and none of them looks as European as that Imperial motif (yes, that is a copy of an imperial motif sword).

The way i see it, the likelihood is that ZOS wants to add real world sword logic where katana is considered as an actual weak and brittle sharp sword, which making it a model of a strong sword of lvl v16 is non-immersive. They forget though, Akavir katana swords of TES universe did defy our real world logic, and still placed as one of the stronger weapon.

So in the end, as much as i don't really interested in getting myself a katana looking sword, but i would still say there's no reason to not making Akavir sword a katana all the way. Even changing tier, it can't completely change form from a Katana to a European based imperial looking of a sword. There are actually different types of katanas that can be made to represent different tier. No matter what though, it got to still be a Katana.

CONCLUSION: Non Katana Akavir sword on the time period of ESO, is simply lore breaking. Fixed it ZOS.

As I sad previously it is NOT lorebreaking and Tamriel have had contact with far more than just the Tsaesci in the past. There was a bloody Kamal invasion just a FEW YEARS ago wich lead to the formation of the Ebonheart Pact.

Evergnar wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Potentates Sword, it is Akaviri, max VR level is VR10, look at the handle and the Tsuba guard..

So sad that they could not just use these models for the one handed versions..

I just want to craft these, how hard could it be for them to add them....

Yep, the potentates set is the closest thing I've found in game so far to a katana look (goes to VR14 btw).

That IS the second tier Akaviri sword and it is NOT a Katana. Learn you sword mate. The first tier Akaviri swords ARE Katanas.

PS. All you N'wahs do best in doing your research before replying to this comment.

willymchilybily · October 2015

I agree. i can get a V12 sword or craft a V8 or w/e sword in the Akaviri style that resembles a kanta. But if i actually want my character to be using top end gear and look like a badass Akaviri samurai whilst still not gimping thier performance by using vastly under powered weaopnary. Then I need a V9-V16 top tier motif style that also resembles this "kantana" that is clearly desirable.

for me i wont be using it. but for those who want it i totally get this.

Athenaac · October 2015

I don't know much about the Lore or whether it's a katana or something that looks similar, but I'd really love to see this kind of sword(s) ingame. It's nice, elegant, agile and proper sword which I would also love to use.

Greetings,
Athenaac of Tamriel, loyal to Queen Ayrenn and her cat Razum Dar

Abob · October 2015

If they do redesign the sword, they should redesign imperial heavy armor too while they are at it, or at least the helmet.

Sotha_Sil · October 2015

I think they just changed it on purpose so that katanas can be in dark brotherhood DLC as someone already stated in the beginning of this thread. So I don't think it will be changed back.

Kuroinu · October 2015

Sotha_Sil wrote: »

I think they just changed it on purpose so that katanas can be in dark brotherhood DLC as someone already stated in the beginning of this thread. So I don't think it will be changed back.

Actually I mentioned that those Dark Brotherhood greatswords etc. aren't quite katanas but elongated "Blades of Woe". That's what it looks like to me. Like I've said before this still doesn't properly represent the Akaviri Motif like it should, this is about the Akaviri motif more than it's about the want to craft katanas. If it was any other Motif I would not have made such a fuss. But the one motif that had the real chance of having viable "end game" katana styled swords, was this Akaviri Motif. Like I keep continually saying, this is the problem here. Sometime in the future I will restructure my original post to make all the other points I made more clear.

P.S. Please ignore Elias and any future posts he makes. He's really missing the point and lacking insight passed his own thoughts. I'm seriously surprised since I've continually explained to him the situation with this motif.

elias.stormneb18_ESO · October 2015

Riko_Futatabi wrote: »

Sotha_Sil wrote: »

I think they just changed it on purpose so that katanas can be in dark brotherhood DLC as someone already stated in the beginning of this thread. So I don't think it will be changed back.

Actually I mentioned that those Dark Brotherhood greatswords etc. aren't quite katanas but elongated "Blades of Woe". That's what it looks like to me. Like I've said before this still doesn't properly represent the Akaviri Motif like it should, this is about the Akaviri motif more than it's about the want to craft katanas. If it was any other Motif I would not have made such a fuss. But the one motif that had the real chance of having viable "end game" katana styled swords, was this Akaviri Motif. Like I keep continually saying, this is the problem here. Sometime in the future I will restructure my original post to make all the other points I made more clear.

P.S. Please ignore Elias and any future posts he makes. He's really missing the point and lacking insight passed his own thoughts. I'm seriously surprised since I've continually explained to him the situation with this motif.

All I have done is point out the facts and corrected people spreading misinformation. I do not think anyone, no matter how ignorant, should just be ignored (not that I'm calling anyone here ignorant). Nor do I think it is good for an opinion to remain unchallenged. You are trying to clean away anyone opposing you in this thread. You will likely ignore this comment, as you have stated that you will, but bear in mind that I am only trying to give life to a healthy discussion, not change anyone's opinion.

Helluin · October 2015

Considering the greatsword of the Deadly Strike set (that is Akaviri), I was expecting to be disappointed by the Akaviri Motif for sword.
I agree as well that lore wise it should be a Katana and I hope it will be changed.

The idea of another rare Motif with a Katana shape, but working as normal swords, can be a great idea but... then some kata would be super awesome as animations.

About lore and TESO, I came already long ago to the conclusion that, unfortunatley, several aspects in this game are not respecting the traditional TES lore.
Another simple example?
Wood Elves should be unmatched archers in Tamriel, but if you build two characters with the same gear, build, Champion build, buff, etc. the Imperial one would do always more damage than the Bosmeri one.
A Bosmer just learns faster how to use a bow but he/she is not master of this art, as it should be in TES lore, and this is another shame.
And we even have a book in TESO speaking about Bosmeri and Khajiiti archers...

elias.stormneb18_ESO · October 2015

Helluin wrote: »

Considering the greatsword of the Deadly Strike set (that is Akaviri), I was expecting to be disappointed by the Akaviri Motif for sword.
I agree as well that lore wise it should be a Katana and I hope it will be changed.

The idea of another rare Motif with a Katana shape, but working as normal swords, can be a great idea but... then some kata would be super awesome as animations.

About lore and TESO, I came already long ago to the conclusion that, unfortunatley, several aspects in this game are not respecting the traditional TES lore.
Another simple example?
Wood Elves should be unmatched archers in Tamriel, but if you build two characters with the same gear, build, Champion build, buff, etc. the Imperial one would do always more damage than the Bosmeri one.
A Bosmer just learns faster how to use a bow but he/she is not master of this art, as it should be in TES lore, and this is another shame.
And we even have a book in TESO speaking about Bosmeri and Khajiiti archers...

The appearance of the third tier Akaviri swords fit perfectly with established lore, go ask your nearest loremaster:

(map of the location of The Imperial Library librarians)
I'd suggest asking @LadyNerevar. You can also try to ask one of the official Loemasters, such as Schick or Kirkbride.
The other subject is a matter of gameplay and character build rather than anything else. It is not "lorebreaking" (gods, I hate that word) but I agree that Bosmer lorewise generally are better archers than Imperials.

AtriasNaradan · October 2015

Sotha_Sil wrote: »

I think they just changed it on purpose so that katanas can be in dark brotherhood DLC as someone already stated in the beginning of this thread. So I don't think it will be changed back.

Actually, making Dark Brotherhood using Katana isn't right in my opinion. Dark Brotherhood had nothing to do with the Akavir...and i don't like the idea of my Dark Brotherhood killer using katana as a weapon, acting like a lame ninja, while it's been always based more on middle-eastern to western assassins on the other TES games. People really need to quit making all assassins stereotyped as ninja looking shadow warriors running around with their katana....

AtriasNaradan · October 2015

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

AtriasNaradan wrote: »

The way i see it, the likelihood is that ZOS wants to add real world sword logic where katana is considered as an actual weak and brittle sharp sword

Dotanuki katanas would like to have a word with you. They were forged when armors were introduced and they were more "meaty" in order to penetrate properly armor. Also these swords in the right hands can perform an actual kabutowari. Good luck doing that with a westernese sword.

But we are derailing this thread. Please fix this ZoS.

You need to learn how to read context properly. I couldn't care less myself what weapon consider weak or strong, the katana vs western sword debate is silly argument for me, not interested. For me, a sword is a sword, why the *** should i care wether it's weaker or not, it's not like i need it in real life anyway. i just simply tell the possibility of what kind of reasoning ZOS uses, not what opinion i held about real sword.

AtriasNaradan · October 2015

Riko_Futatabi wrote: »

While I of course agree with you. The part where you assume that this may have been intentional because katanas are seen as brittle swords in the real world. This isn't entirely accurate because in the real world, when they are forged right, they can be the strongest of steel swords. But I'm just nit picking lol.

I actually mention in one of my post in this thread that the Fighters Guild weapons maybe have been mistakenly reskinned along with the armour. Since the Fighters Guild and Akaviri armour in ESO are of the same style. And like I said in that post, the sword style works for the Fighters Guild, but not for the Akaviri specific Motif.

I'll be honest, i don't like the Akavir look of fighter guild's armor. For me, the Akavir look is something that signify a Dragonguard aka Blades. If those fighter guilds use the same armor motif as Dragonguard, those Blades are not as unique as i thought they're on Tamriel :P

There's also a part of me who never like the look of samurai armor on TES though...it's somewhat really out of place, and to top it of, they don't even make it looks anything cool...they look boring as hell...real samurai armor looks way better. Also i was hoping that at least the fighter guilds got their own cool unique armor motif, instead of the lame Akavir motif lol

AtriasNaradan · October 2015

elias.stormneb18_ESO wrote: »

Helluin wrote: »

Considering the greatsword of the Deadly Strike set (that is Akaviri), I was expecting to be disappointed by the Akaviri Motif for sword.
I agree as well that lore wise it should be a Katana and I hope it will be changed.

The idea of another rare Motif with a Katana shape, but working as normal swords, can be a great idea but... then some kata would be super awesome as animations.

About lore and TESO, I came already long ago to the conclusion that, unfortunatley, several aspects in this game are not respecting the traditional TES lore.
Another simple example?
Wood Elves should be unmatched archers in Tamriel, but if you build two characters with the same gear, build, Champion build, buff, etc. the Imperial one would do always more damage than the Bosmeri one.
A Bosmer just learns faster how to use a bow but he/she is not master of this art, as it should be in TES lore, and this is another shame.
And we even have a book in TESO speaking about Bosmeri and Khajiiti archers...

The appearance of the third tier Akaviri swords fit perfectly with established lore, go ask your nearest loremaster:

(map of the location of The Imperial Library librarians)
I'd suggest asking @LadyNerevar. You can also try to ask one of the official Loemasters, such as Schick or Kirkbride.
The other subject is a matter of gameplay and character build rather than anything else. It is not "lorebreaking" (gods, I hate that word) but I agree that Bosmer lorewise generally are better archers than Imperials.

What's that real world map for?? Nirn map is nowhere close to that, the whole nirn landmass are probably not even nearly as big lol

Anyway, it's still not good with lore, because ESO is basically happens in the past of all other existing TES games. If there's any different type of Akavir sword ever introduced, made, and used on Tamriel, traces of it are logically should be there on other TES games. Also like i've said before, the Katana of Akavir did shown as the stronger weapon than most on each TES games, with that Katana looks.

It's simply not logically on the line with the lore that a stronger Akavir sword only able to be created on different type of sword than katana. It would be more logical if they make all Akavir weapon like that from low to high tier, instead of making katana on low tier and imperial looking broadsword on high tier. Not to mention, they're keeping the armor Japanese looking the whole way, which is inconsistency if we assume the high tier as Kamal based that maybe not samurai.

So, as i've said above, the way i see it, ZOS developer there seems to want to add their real life sword theory and applied it on the game, trying to make a point that katana can't be high tier. They're breaking the established fact that Akavir katanas are stronger than any type of swords from the same materials.