*Bows need more Love

Paazhahdrimaak

I've always love playing a marksman character in elder scrolls games. But in ESO my NB has very limited options when it comes to being a good marksman.
I would really like to see a bow special move. It would be nice. Bows are fun. But almost all the NB powers are for stealthy duel wielding or something . My NB tank is awesome. But my stealthy NB is tricky with limited options for bows.

Just wondering if anyone else agrees if bows should have a little more love.

ryanmjmcevoy_ESO

If I pulled off my rotation perfectly without hiccups, my old DK archer build could pull ~11k ST dps in PvE on bosses. Honestly, that's about as good as you can get with a bow. So, there is the ability to use the Bow end-game, but it doesn't compare to any other damage setup in the game; everything outshines it.

Single target bow DPS is all about maxing weapon damage and spamming Focused Aim, dropping meteor and maybe a dot or two as you go.

But I agree with your point, Bows are lackluster compared to the other options. The other 2 stam based weapons have ability to get Major Brutality, bows have nothing. Bows wind up with less weapon damage than the others. The Bow passive which increases damage @ range is useless for PvE content, and even most of the IC. The AoE options don't do enough damage, imo. I do love Bombard, but it's expensive and not as damaging as id like. Volley still seems pretty meh to me, I think it'd be cool to add some kind of rapid-shot ability in place of it.

Poison damage now scaling off spell power if its higher than weapon power though could open up some interesting NB builds though. All the DoTs are magika anyway, so setup for magika, but use bow and lethal arrow with ranged magic dots.

If I could have anything, Bow just needs a bit of a damage buff and the ability to get Major Brutality.

Carde

Knootewoot

Paazhahdrimaak wrote: »

I've always love playing a marksman character in elder scrolls games. But in ESO my NB has very limited options when it comes to being a good marksman.
I would really like to see a bow special move. It would be nice. Bows are fun. But almost all the NB powers are for stealthy duel wielding or something . My NB tank is awesome. But my stealthy NB is tricky with limited options for bows.

Just wondering if anyone else agrees if bows should have a little more love.

I am a bowtard. Not as powerfull as the magicka, dual wield or 2-handed NB's. But I also play stealthy archer (in daggerfall/morrowind with a crossbow mostly) since the dawn of ages.

Currently I only use focused aim as a bow skill. Pretty much I am forced to switch to melee since the last update. So I went to the Arena to have my butt kicked over and over again so I could see what skills where used mostly. You know what it was?....


Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow, Wrecking blow,

So now I use that as back-up weapon.

But I can't find out why some people can knock back be with every blow and I can't do it with them. CC-immunity no work on poor me. Must be something to do with animation cancelling. But since I never block I can't cancel. I tried with bash but then my finger hurts.

Carde

My wrecking blows were hitting for a solid 23k+ on average in like VR1-3 gear. My focused aims were hitting for about 16k on average. My crushing shock hits for like 4k.

Buff bows imho?

VincentBlanquin

agree that bow should get love, but not for gank. bufff light attack was not enough, so they can provide bigger buff or get light attack be quicker. also other abilities in bow line should get love. poison injection or scatter shot should hit harder when morphed. tree line should get some CC - daze or root on hit

Robotmafia

yessss please more bow love! i always favor the bow in mmos and its been a rough road this time around...

VincentBlanquin

or at least add armor set which heavily support bow way

DovresMalven

They need less burst and more sustain. Stronger dots, weaker snipe.

Asmael

Knootewoot wrote: »

But I can't find out why some people can knock back be with every blow and I can't do it with them. CC-immunity no work on poor me. Must be something to do with animation cancelling. But since I never block I can't cancel. I tried with bash but then my finger hurts.

Mmh... Very curious indeed...

Mitchblue

I'd love to get back on my bow character.

Knootewoot

Some new skills for bow:

- Homing arrows
- Exploding arrows
- Crossbows (normal crossbows reloading should take longer, but damage must be higher at close range)
- Gattling cross-bow (like a machine gun it shoots bolts)
- Bow-melee (you slap a character with bow. 10 second stun)
- Arrow melee (you pierce an eyeball with an arrow/bolt. Sets enemy of balance and is blinded for 10 secs)
- Bow whip. (you use the Bow as a whip. Your horse gain +20 speed for 10 seconds. when use on enemies the are fleeing for 3 seconds)
- Piercing arrow/bolt (goes through shields and flappy wings)

DeanTheCat

I just want VR16 Hawk's Eye, Increased Poison Arrow base damage, and the cast time on Snipe to be reverted to 1.8 seconds and the 5% damage nerf reverted. Those changes will then be awesome

R0M2K

Indeed needs a deep revision, tweak mechanic and dmg.

Focused aim needs to get that white signal away.
Magnum shoot needs to get your knockback away.
Lethal arrow needs to scale with piercing instead of spell penetration.

Then general dmg/cast times tweaks.

willymchilybily

oh my my my. So many people saying buff bows.

I like them as they are, and don't see why they need a buff. @ryanmjmcevoy_ESO its a stam weapon scaling poison with magicka/spell damage would not be good, and i don't think DW can give you a Major Brutality buff? if it could you could get the buff and switch to bow on second bar.

bow is a great weapon for maneuvering and CC and dots, below is what I wrote about it for PvP Previously, but i think its applicable to PVE. It's damage output isn't on par with the close range weapons, but that's to be expected risk vs reward. Though i do wonder how it compares to starves.

Venom Arrow: interrupts casting and puts an enemy off balance and stuns for 3 seconds, combine this with "opportunist" from the champion points passives (10CP into mage>ritual) for +15% damage on the next attack, and "molten armaments" from the DK (+40% to heavy attacks) and the fact heavy attacks do more damage and knock down off balance enemies. You have a nice little combo right there to get a really hard hitting heavy attack. And you can further buff bow heavy attacks with CP

Magnum shot: knocks the enemy back and your self back (i prefer this morph as you can use the effect on a CC immune target and they wont get knocked back but you will) so its great to create space and get away from the melee range

Lethal Arrorw hits hard and afflicts the enemy with a huge healing debuff (reduced healing by 40%)

bombard/spray snares (slow by 40% iirc) and immobilizes an enemy for 2 seconds, but even better its a cone/directional AOE CC effect

Techlisp

I am enjoying my Khajiit, NB, 2h + Bow level 36 gameplay more than my VR 14 Sorc to be honest. Sometimes I just forget I have a 2h weapon as I am skipping about with a bow, with not a care in the world [accept dying more than my Sorc solo on the same world bosses].

Asmael

With the exception of Volley which is definitely sub-par to other bow skills, the bow skill line is in a pretty good spot right now... Between magnum shot and bombard, you have a very good kiting kit. Both morphs of Arrow spray go through reflective scales as well.

It's true, they have no way to buff their damage, so yo have to rely on your secondary bar for this, but you have a few choices there.

sophiek_8

Exploding arrows to make me feel like Katniss!

I do want to use my bow more, but it's just so much easier to run in with dual wield..

TequilaFire

My biggest problem with bow is the camera putting grass behind you in your face when you aim up at someone on a keep wall.

That and not being able to shoot your bow over a 2 foot wall in front of you even though you are taller like at the EP Morrowind north gate.

Knootewoot

TequilaFire wrote: »

My biggest problem with bow is the camera putting grass behind you in your face when you aim up at someone on a keep wall.

That and not being able to shoot your bow over a 2 foot wall in front of you even though you are taller like at the EP Morrowind north gate.

The same if you put down a trebuchet and a tree is covering all your screen. They should get transparent.

UltimaJoe777

Bows don't need to be buffed, ya'll just need to learn how to aim for the knee.

GuyNamedSean

I've no problem with bows currently. You can use them for extremely high initial burst damage and I feel like that's what they should be for. I don't feel like a bow should be a physical staff. When someone mentions fighting with a bow I immediately envision previous Elder Scrolls games where you would hide, kill your enemy in a quick burst, and then move on to the next. Bows in Elder Scrolls never really have been good for sustained combat because they're slow but heavy hitting.

Faulgor

As far as I'm concerned, the bow skill line has only 3 skills.
Can somebody tell me what the applications for Volley and Scatter Shot are? Because I haven't found any.

The passives are so-so. Hasty Retreat is pretty pointless now after the nerf, and Hawk Eye has little synergy with the rest of the skill line because the only way to put someone off balance is with Venom Arrow while interrupting them.

What I find curious though is that all bow skills are offensive, yet it has one of the lowest dps. All other weapon skills have at least one buff or debuff (Defensive Stance, Momentum, Blade Cloak, Elemental Weakness). Regardless of which skill should receive improvements or not, I feel this is the biggest oversight. It doesn't even have to be Major Brutality - I think Major Savagery would work better with the existing focus on crits for bows.

Just some stupid ideas here:

Concentration
20 second duration.
Critical Hits have a chance to set the target off balance.
While slotted, grant Major Savagery.

Morph1: Owl's Eye
20 second duration.
Critical Hits have a chance to set the target off balance and return x Stamina.
While slotted, grant Major Savagery.

Morph2: Snake Bite
20 second duration.
Critical Hits have a chance to set the target off balance and deal x% more damage against poisoned enemies.
While slotted, grant Major Savagery.

Master_Kas

VincentBlanquin wrote: »

or at least add armor set which heavily support bow way

There is one, hawks eye set.

Sadly it only drops to V14 from PVP boxes for AP (guildstores also have them)

Alot of armor pieces exists + rings for not very high prices, check the craglorn guildstores.

Very good set for bow dps

Edit, link here:
http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Hawk's+Eye+Set

VincentBlanquin

know about it. know about morag tong too. but if i oversee numbers it dont looks much better than hunding rage for example. i tought reaaly good set ...

ADarklore

willymchilybily wrote: »

ESO its a stam weapon scaling poison with magicka/spell damage would not be good, and i don't think DW can give you a Major Brutality buff? if it could you could get the buff and switch to bow on second bar.

Hidden Blade on DW now gives 10/s Major Brutality buff. Also, Poison already scales with Magicka on Bow skills from what I've read.

Further... in all previous characters I created, leveled for awhile, then deleted... I never used a Bow. With my new character, a full-Stamina Sorc, I'm using Bow/DW and I'm finding I destroy things that my other builds couldn't do Solo or couldn't do as easily. As a Sorc, I use the Clannfear pet to draw aggro, and use Restraining Prison, Hardened Ward and Critical Surge- these are the only Sorc abilities I use- all my damage comes from weapons.

Now, I lock down mobs with RP, then drop Scorched Earth down on them, then blast them with Bombard- which keep them locked in the AoE through the entire duration. Single target I'll use Focused Aim from distance and Poison Injection, then Bombard as they grow closer- if they survive that long. Even with Steel Tornado slotted on my DW bar, I still find myself remaining on my Bow bar, only using the DW bar for the Sorcerer buffs. Although, in an overwhelming mob, where RP wouldn't work well, I swap to Steel Tornado.

My point is, MUCH depends on your Class, Race, build-focus, etc... on how successful you're going to be with any given weapon. So many people come on here and complain that this or that doesn't work- yet- it works extremely well for others.

Hostyle34

They need to add a slot for a quiver. Using a bow or 2h means you're losing a whole slot compared to dual wielding and tanks. Adding a quiver would bring bow up a bit. Adding that enchant and trait would be a nice bonus.

Merlin13KAGL

Knootewoot wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

My biggest problem with bow is the camera putting grass behind you in your face when you aim up at someone on a keep wall.

That and not being able to shoot your bow over a 2 foot wall in front of you even though you are taller like at the EP Morrowind north gate.

The same if you put down a trebuchet and a tree is covering all your screen. They should get transparent.

Indeed, the ambiance is great in this game, but the camera view suck is very OP.

@TequilaFire , bring your lawnmower when you go to Cyrodiil. Turn the grass off in video settings. It will help when you're focusing a higher target / keep wall, etc.

It will not do anything for the tree-view, unfortunately. I agree with @Knootewoot , there should be an aura of transparency between camera and seige weapon/target arc. It shouldn't show enemy players you wouldn't otherwise visually see (not going for spy-treb, here), but you should be able to halfway see what you're trying to aim at.

Presently, it's zoom out: Great Oak. Zoom in: back of your own head. See nothing or see nothing is not a good option. And Azura save you if you're zoomed out to see the target (without being able to see the seige) and someone comes to attack you.

Knootewoot

I now have to rely on 2-handed rally for xx% WD buff. I want that buff just by slotting a bow.
Also above, a quiver which is enhantable and trait is a good idea. Although I think trait is not really necessary as it is twice the amount of a single dagger (if im correct)

2-handed / staff should have something similar, like you enchant the shaft and the pummel

Also, they should adjust view for catapult. You can hardly see what you are hitting. should be same view as ballista.

willymchilybily

ADarklore wrote: »

Hidden Blade on DW now gives 10/s Major Brutality buff. Also, Poison already scales with Magicka on Bow skills from what I've read.

@ADarklore thanks for the insight.

I am still not certain i believe you about magicka scaling poison damage. if you are refering to patch notes see http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en-GB/discussion/comment/2211468/#Comment_2211468 where gina clarrified. Im pretty sure the posion dots use spell or weapon power (the higher of) but the main skill is based off stamina. maybe some one can confirm or disprove.

VincentBlanquin wrote: »

or at least add armor set which heavily support bow way

Just from googling/eso academy i can see a few. Some of them new additions

old sets:
hawk eye - pretty clear
morag tong - still probably the best for posion focused builds

sets recently added:
sheer venom - posion injection is considered an execute dot so by keeping it up you can proc this at 50% health enemies (in theory). And poison damage is great because you can already buff it to in CP and other ways to make the most out of bow morphs and say a masters bow. Though PS4 so cant test this, but is what i assume the set is for.

Toxic defiance - may work better for some than others in 2.1 say maybe a Nb using relentless focus etc can also proc this without a DPS loss, and get extra damage to all their dots and snipes.

ADarklore

willymchilybily wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

Hidden Blade on DW now gives 10/s Major Brutality buff. Also, Poison already scales with Magicka on Bow skills from what I've read.

@ADarklore thanks for the insight.

I am still not certain i believe you about magicka scaling poison. Im pretty sure the posion dot use to but even that has/is change. I'll look for some of the posts i saw and get back to you.

From the patch notes: "Poison will now scale off of Weapon Damage or Spell Damage" and seems to apply only to the 'status effect' per GinaBruno's comment.