The imbalances in PvP

Master_Kas

Seems some players have run into Su'ki and/or Scribes

(No name & shame, Su'ki is My bff )

Master_Kas

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

A guy in heavy armor is finally hard to kill? About time, i'd say.

The unbeatable DKs going round on pts right now are medium armour. Well over 2k weapon power whilst achieving approx 30k spell AND physical resist at the same time. They are blocking a lot although not perma-blocking. It is a particularly effective build for the DK because of the sustain available with battle roar and cheap dragon leap ulti, and stamina regen from Helping Hands passive. They take next to no damage whilst dishing out massive damage with wrecking blow and dragon leap.

You sure about medium? I think it's heavy (reactive armor) or am I wrong?

pmn100b16_ESO

Master_Kas wrote: »

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

A guy in heavy armor is finally hard to kill? About time, i'd say.

The unbeatable DKs going round on pts right now are medium armour. Well over 2k weapon power whilst achieving approx 30k spell AND physical resist at the same time. They are blocking a lot although not perma-blocking. It is a particularly effective build for the DK because of the sustain available with battle roar and cheap dragon leap ulti, and stamina regen from Helping Hands passive. They take next to no damage whilst dishing out massive damage with wrecking blow and dragon leap.

You sure about medium? I think it's heavy (reactive armor) or am I wrong?

It's armor master

Wycks

The OP build has been brought to the attention of ZOS.

But here is the thing, they will let it run rampant for 4 months before they fix it and loose TONS of players.

The same exact thing happened on release, 4 months of DK perma ults and swarm causing players to quite in droves.

The devs have no one but themselves to blame for ESO not being a larger success, the majority of players have left because of them being so unfamiliar with how their own game even works.

MaxwellC

@Mr_Koh Fear + Cloak with a follow up of wrecking blow (before I can even break free and get immunity), you think I'm bad because I'm unable to avoid a cloaking NB that went up to me while cloaked feared me entered cloak then wrecking blowed me for crit damage in PvP?

The fact that you have to openly state that "you're better than me" shows that you are most definitely not better then me. I don't have to tell people that I'm better then them because when they come up against me then they know that I'm not someone to take lightly.

xylena

stam dk is very strong (maybe OP) for the same reason magicka sorc is... stacking your primary resource gives you both offense and defense without any tradeoff... magicka sorcs can do huge burst damage and can stack huge shields forever... stam dks can do huge burst damage and block/heal forever

neither build needs a nerf, the game simply needs softcaps back... minmaxing is the true OP

Yolokin_Swagonborn

xylena wrote: »

stam dk is very strong (maybe OP) for the same reason magicka sorc is... stacking your primary resource gives you both offense and defense without any tradeoff... magicka sorcs can do huge burst damage and can stack huge shields forever... stam dks can do huge burst damage and block/heal forever

neither build needs a nerf, the game simply needs softcaps back... minmaxing is the true OP

Pretty much this. You have to have controls somewhere. They removed controls on stats and regen stacking and now they are having to add usage penalties (essentially cooldowns) to game mechanics (dodge roll, block) and certain skills.

In a game we enjoy because it ostensibly has no cooldowns, the future looks grim. They will have to nerf skills again when people get to max CP. Holding block will cost stam eventually. Count on it.

Mr_Koh

@MaxwellCrystal yes you are bad because you died to a bad nightblade. why would a nightblade fear then cloak into a wrecking blow?? that doesnt even make sense, once youre feared they should just hit you with the wrecking blow. if they had time to cast cloak and wrecking blow before you could CC break then god bless your little fingers

Master_Kas

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

A guy in heavy armor is finally hard to kill? About time, i'd say.

The unbeatable DKs going round on pts right now are medium armour. Well over 2k weapon power whilst achieving approx 30k spell AND physical resist at the same time. They are blocking a lot although not perma-blocking. It is a particularly effective build for the DK because of the sustain available with battle roar and cheap dragon leap ulti, and stamina regen from Helping Hands passive. They take next to no damage whilst dishing out massive damage with wrecking blow and dragon leap.

You sure about medium? I think it's heavy (reactive armor) or am I wrong?

It's armor master

Allrighy then. I was for certain atleast suki used reactive armor since she didn't even break my fears sometimes thanks to the damage migation. Wasn't sure about scribes toguh. Ty ^^

FENGRUSH

Mr_Koh wrote: »

@MaxwellCrystal yes you are bad because you died to a bad nightblade. why would a nightblade fear then cloak into a wrecking blow?? that doesnt even make sense, once youre feared they should just hit you with the wrecking blow. if they had time to cast cloak and wrecking blow before you could CC break then god bless your little fingers

Then he can say he never saw it coming though.

Mr_Koh

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

@MaxwellCrystal yes you are bad because you died to a bad nightblade. why would a nightblade fear then cloak into a wrecking blow?? that doesnt even make sense, once youre feared they should just hit you with the wrecking blow. if they had time to cast cloak and wrecking blow before you could CC break then god bless your little fingers

Then he can say he never saw it coming though.

@FENGRUSH at that point he would have cc immunity. So he got hit by a stamina nightblade who hit him with an uppercut while he had cc immunity. I don't even see why this is a scenario worth mentioning at this point. It's like the most mediocre encounter out there.

Getting upercutted straight from cloak, that's something you don't see coming. Getting feared first was him being polite.

And he got hit THREE times. So he got hit with 3 consecutive uppercuts while he had cc immunity. Baddies on the forums are ruining the game.

Sharee

Mr_Koh wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

@MaxwellCrystal yes you are bad because you died to a bad nightblade. why would a nightblade fear then cloak into a wrecking blow?? that doesnt even make sense, once youre feared they should just hit you with the wrecking blow. if they had time to cast cloak and wrecking blow before you could CC break then god bless your little fingers

Then he can say he never saw it coming though.

@FENGRUSH at that point he would have cc immunity. So he got hit by a stamina nightblade who hit him with an uppercut while he had cc immunity. I don't even see why this is a scenario worth mentioning at this point. It's like the most mediocre encounter out there.

Getting upercutted straight from cloak, that's something you don't see coming. Getting feared first was him being polite.

And he got hit THREE times. So he got hit with 3 consecutive uppercuts while he had cc immunity. Baddies on the forums are ruining the game.

I think Fengrush was making a joke up there

Alucardo

Did anyone watch Sypher PvPing that DK Scribes on Twitch the other night? Jesus man.. between Scribes' damage mitigation and DPS, Sypher didn't stand a chance. He was going from 60% hp to 0 in a matter of seconds and barely scratching the guy. It was like watching Molag Bal kick a puppy. I really want to know that guys build

actosh

Even in Heavy Armor with the Black Rose Set its i know how to say, sometimes funny, sometimes it seems broken.
Been a Dk since release and if u wear 7 heavy and Black Rose your Constitution passive (wich every ha user can access) restores a bit more than 500 Stam and Magicka every 4 Secs when u get hit.

If u go medium and Armor Master Set, its the *** ^^

Btw, one reason Stam Dk´s are strong, is since ZOS finaly fixed Battle Roar( used to scale just of your max Magicka) it is now scaling seperate for each ressource. That is what makes it sooo ostrong.

They should tune it down to 50% at least. Some Math Freak could try to figure out the formula for 1.7 if possible. Would be appriciated

EnOeZ

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Just go to king Richards latest broadcast and it's not my lack of rotations because I'm sure I can demolish each and every one of you guys talking about how the fault is my own instead of seeing it yourself. I'll be happy to show you all too how it isn't my rotation.

@MaxwellCrystal
@EnOeZ

So go look at it yourselves. And I'm not crying wrecking blow is op. My skill bar is fine. Do I have to be a streamer for you guys to believe that I'm actually good at the game? Like c'mon this is ridiculous. Just go ahead and watch the vids.

You can "demolish" me you say ? (why the heck you are not censored btw ?)
Of course if I afk you can... but be quick.

But mind you I am a Heavy Armor Stamina DK and according to you I can face tank now in 1.7 and even out resource and out dps a medium armor user !!!... Beware though that my cat does not accidentally spam wrecking blow and somehow you eat all of them with your uber skill.

@Mr_Koh has just a L2P "I can demolish each and everyone of you" (/quote) issue.

Ryuho

Stamina DKs will be great this patch. Wrecklin blow + dragon leap + executioner deals insane dmg.. and with that penetration "fix" u can esly penetrate som1 armor by 50% with maul.. I am just happy that now u can avoid wrecklin/dragon leap with cloak but even so, u can always dodge it, cc them when they try to wrecklin blow u, or keep distance.. wrecklin is highset dmg dealing stamina skill in 1.7 imo

Rune_Relic

xylena wrote: »

stam dk is very strong (maybe OP) for the same reason magicka sorc is... stacking your primary resource gives you both offense and defense without any tradeoff... magicka sorcs can do huge burst damage and can stack huge shields forever... stam dks can do huge burst damage and block/heal forever

neither build needs a nerf, the game simply needs softcaps back... minmaxing is the true OP

Amen.. to the reason.

Don't agree with the fix though
Soft caps is an admission of being incompetent at balancing a game.
Granted thats fair by historical experience.
But I would rather have them do the job properly instead of half arsed and lazy.

You will simply have min/maxers cap everything instead...like before.

pmn100b16_ESO

bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »

The OP build has been brought to the attention of ZOS.

But here is the thing, they will let it run rampant for 4 months before they fix it and loose TONS of players.

The same exact thing happened on release, 4 months of DK perma ults and swarm causing players to quite in droves.

The devs have no one but themselves to blame for ESO not being a larger success, the majority of players have left because of them being so unfamiliar with how their own game even works.

This is what I fear (and as I'm going to be running a DK and NB in IC I'm not being biased when I say it), if this OP DK build is allowed to run rampant, it is really going to destroy a lot of people's opinion of this patch before they've even begun. Especially as a lot of players are going to be PvEers new to pvp in general.

MaxwellC

Mr_Koh wrote: »

@MaxwellCrystal yes you are bad because you died to a bad nightblade. why would a nightblade fear then cloak into a wrecking blow?? that doesnt even make sense, once youre feared they should just hit you with the wrecking blow. if they had time to cast cloak and wrecking blow before you could CC break then god bless your little fingers

Guess you're not familiar with crit increase once in stealth mode but by all means I'm definitely a "bad player" lol. If he feared me and I decided not to break cc in order to keep my precious resources do to the fact I don't have a ulti then that's what it is. But when he cloaked I thought "ah he's just gonna run" but I was wrong because I made that judgment.

Fact still stands you have to whine and moan because you got wrecked by an overly nerf'd stamina DK and you felt the need to make a thread discussing how horrible your experience was. Simple and short here like I stated above your rotation is bad and you just want everything handed to you.

You'd rather not work to block wrecking blow, you'd rather not work to CC, you just want to stand their while said player stops wrecking blowing you so you can kill him/her.

Septimus_Magna

xylena wrote: »

stam dk is very strong (maybe OP) for the same reason magicka sorc is... stacking your primary resource gives you both offense and defense without any tradeoff... magicka sorcs can do huge burst damage and can stack huge shields forever... stam dks can do huge burst damage and block/heal forever

neither build needs a nerf, the game simply needs softcaps back... minmaxing is the true OP

Softcaps were a little over the top imo. I mean 50% reduction is quite a harsh penalty for some playstyles who need to have much of a single resource to be effective.

I would like to see different softcaps, once you pass the point of the softcap the diminishing return value gets higher the more you stack into a single resource. Just over the softcap the reduction would only be 10%, but if you already have 40k max magicka the reduction for increasing magicka would be 50% for example.

Kronuxx

Mr_Koh wrote: »

FENGRUSH wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

@MaxwellCrystal yes you are bad because you died to a bad nightblade. why would a nightblade fear then cloak into a wrecking blow?? that doesnt even make sense, once youre feared they should just hit you with the wrecking blow. if they had time to cast cloak and wrecking blow before you could CC break then god bless your little fingers

Then he can say he never saw it coming though.

@FENGRUSH at that point he would have cc immunity. So he got hit by a stamina nightblade who hit him with an uppercut while he had cc immunity. I don't even see why this is a scenario worth mentioning at this point. It's like the most mediocre encounter out there.

Getting upercutted straight from cloak, that's something you don't see coming. Getting feared first was him being polite.

And he got hit THREE times. So he got hit with 3 consecutive uppercuts while he had cc immunity. Baddies on the forums are ruining the game.

Dude what are you smoking? I've seen King Richard's streams and he's been beaten by a NB as a DK on PTS. In fact, he recently just put out a build video for stamina sorcerer for PTS and he even stated and I quote "This Build is Super OP". It's not just DK that is the issue. It's about how to use a class properly.

Mr_Koh

MaxwellCrystal wrote: »

Mr_Koh wrote: »

@MaxwellCrystal yes you are bad because you died to a bad nightblade. why would a nightblade fear then cloak into a wrecking blow?? that doesnt even make sense, once youre feared they should just hit you with the wrecking blow. if they had time to cast cloak and wrecking blow before you could CC break then god bless your little fingers

Guess you're not familiar with crit increase once in stealth mode but by all means I'm definitely a "bad player" lol. If he feared me and I decided not to break cc in order to keep my precious resources do to the fact I don't have a ulti then that's what it is. But when he cloaked I thought "ah he's just gonna run" but I was wrong because I made that judgment.

Fact still stands you have to whine and moan because you got wrecked by an overly nerf'd stamina DK and you felt the need to make a thread discussing how horrible your experience was. Simple and short here like I stated above your rotation is bad and you just want everything handed to you.

You'd rather not work to block wrecking blow, you'd rather not work to CC, you just want to stand their while said player stops wrecking blowing you so you can kill him/her.

You kids have no idea what you're talking about, but yet never hesitate to post as if you guys are actually on the PTS constantly testing. With so few people playing the PTS lately I know who has been ingame testing things non stop, and it ain't you guys with the big talk. Heavy armor is out of control broken, maybe it might just be the black Rose set but the mitigation and damage achieved by heavy armor wearers isn't balanced at all, and DK'S benefit the most from it. The problem is that some of you are so horrible at the game that you don't see this because when you fight nightblades and they cloak you think they're running away....

In 1.6 you could eventually run a heavy armor out of stam and kill them through cc. This is no longer the case which created a new trend of juggernauts that has damage, sustain, and mitigation. I don't even care much about wrecking blow itself. What I care about are tanks smacking people for 9k damage with them which should never be the case. Tanks now have the proper mitigation, they should not out sustain and out damage medium armor wearers (assuming both players are good and not players like maxwell)

AshTal

This happens all the time with ZOS - they create an unbeatable template. Notice it on Beta, then they roll it out to live where it gets 10 times worse, then 4 months down the line they finally decide to nerf it and then they get a lot of angry people who re-rolled just to play the unbeatable class.

I wouldn't be so annoyed but they keep doing it. And it really doesn't take much to see how unbalanced PvP is. Play in an off peak time and watch as one person fights 10 and kills half the group before dying. Some people may claim its skill but 10 VET 14's hitting on a single guy who appears to shield and heal faster than they can damage him while dishing out damage to take them down is insane.

MaxwellC

Ok @Mr_Koh Don't make any presumptions based on little information I gave you about one little encounter.

First and foremost it seems you think heavy armor is broken still when in fact it is broken in the aspect to the horrible passives it has.

You call "OMG OP DK" first now you say it's heavy armor, it goes to show you don't know what happened but because you got wrecked Multiple times by wrecking blow you just wanna whine and moan about it. black rose set didn't even need a nerf but it was because people complained about it returning stamina upon blocking (quite sure it wasn't constant but based on RNG percentages e.g. 10% for it to invoke).

You also love to flex some "elitism" which I find funny

Mr_Koh wrote: »

With so few people playing the PTS lately I know who has been ingame testing things non stop, and it ain't you guys with the big talk.

Also for some reason you feel that tanks have "proper mitigation" as when they run PVE now they're often dying due to many of the nerfs implicated e.g. 0% stam regen upon blocking, and the broken heavy passives as stated above.

When a tank has to rely on shield stacking in order to survive you know it's a sad day.

The fact that you got wrecked by someone in full heavy armor just shows how little DPS you had and your bad rotation. I've faced plenty players who knew how to work around me real quick by using constant CCs following up with a lot of attacks ranging from executes to animation canceling.

You simply lack a strong cognitive.

MaxwellC

@Kronuxx I couldn't have said it any better than what you just said. The OP thinks DK is OP but he just can't admit his/her rotation sucks and needs improvement. He's one of "those people" who cries nerf after getting wrecked, this type of mentality is what has ruined a lot of class skills and classes in general.

A perfect example would be my favorite DK class skill (Flames of oblivion) because of complainers like the OP, it's now a Mage light substitute that even Mage light out shines.

superman9393_ESO

I've played all classes on pts and dk has awesome resource management compared to other classes along with very high 2h damage.

Anazasi

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

The OP needs to L2P. It's so easy to avoid a WB.

This is more trolling than the OP.

When WB can hit you 15 meters away something is not working as intended. Might want to think about that for a while.

Thecapeo

Wait, HA stam DKs are getting as good/better sustain than MA stam DKs? How are they achieving that? Is it just based around the changes to battle roar and these new sets? I'm a total console noob so I don't know the ins and outs of the best ways to achieve sustain but I tried HA for a bit and it just crushed my sustain. I figured it would worse after the patch.

Armitas

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

The OP needs to L2P. It's so easy to avoid a WB.

Dks will be spam taloning you hardcore this update. It won't be as easy as you can think.

Mr_Koh

@MaxwellCrystal you're all talk. People like you ruin the game by coming on the forums and giving the devs your ignorance that they make decisions off of. Would you like to see my rotations little boy?