Why Templar is the Worst Designed Class in ESO. *LONG*

Jar_Ek

Worst designed? No that would be sorcerers. Weakest - arguably.
Sorcerers are worst designed because stamina builds don't use any class skills, lots of toggles, minimal diversity in build and little support for non dps playstyles. Does that make them weak? Not as a magicka build in PVP no... Everything else maybe.

Btw I feel for you on the healing front having used restoration staves.

twistedmonk

ZOS_Alex wrote: »

Hi, everyone.

We understand that people are going to disagree from time to time, but please remember to keep your comments respectful at all times on our forums, even when you disagree with others. Insults or other disruptive behavior do not help further discussion and can move a thread off topic quickly. We encourage sharing opinions, but we ask that they are constructively stated when doing so, as this will help keep the discussion on track.

Thank you!

sigh...every time I see a ZOS response in a thread, I get excited...

but then it turns out to be a warning to those posting and not a real response to the original poster...

sigh

twistedmonk

For PvP, a class must have a combination of these attributes:

• instant cast spells
• CC
• mobility
• some method of escape

Templar is weak in all of these areas. We are talking class skill lines, since everybody has access to weapon skill lines.

Templars forced to take vampire to deal with lack of mobility and escape. But then there is huge disadvantages for doing so with the fire/undead vulnerability. You shouldn't have to be saddled with a huge disadvantage because the class design was horrible from day one.

For PVE DPS it goes DK, NB, Sorc, Temp.
For PVP DPS it goes NB, Sorc, DK, Temp.

With Patch 2.1.x, I think Sorc PvE DPS on single target is best with overload + molag kena set. but the rest looks legit.

Funny how this is obvious to anybody playing the game... and yet ZOS designers are so incompetent, they can't balance it.

Kaliki

Jar_Ek wrote: »

Worst designed? No that would be sorcerers. Weakest - arguably.
Sorcerers are worst designed because stamina builds don't use any class skills, lots of toggles, minimal diversity in build and little support for non dps playstyles. Does that make them weak? Not as a magicka build in PVP no... Everything else maybe.

Btw I feel for you on the healing front having used restoration staves.

Templar isn't any better.
The most effective magicka Templar builds I tried always looked like: Pick one damage skill to spam over and over and fill the rest of your bar with mages guild abilities for the extra magicka...

Kas

Nifty2g wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

This thread is a joke right? Surely you can't be serious, if you are then you got some serious l2p issues.
As for RD the execute range on this 30% not 20%
As for jabs/puncturing sweep, it procs burning light, so does shards and sweep/jabs.

If played correctly and speced correctly, templar dps in pve and pvp can be very dangerous, magicka and/or stamina.

Pro tip; being templar your main damage source comes from Thaumaturge, make use of it and Proximity Detonation/Dawnbreaker.

Some old and new dps screenshots from trials and vdsa

And the best ever

hmm not sure if your serious or not with this post.

1. your trying to use scenarios where the enemy stands in front of you and just takes damage. since IC is a PVP update, if I could get other players to just stand there then we wouldn't have a problem. but they don't.

2. next your showing us screen shots of no more then 80 secs. so basically your an PVE off healer who stands there opens with a spear then spams jabs until radiant destruction time?

3.those npc's just stand there. They also dont insta heal out of execute range like other players do and will in IC. Not to mention RD is getting nerfed.

4. your post proves absolutely nothing about pve dps other then we can put up decent numbers like I said. you posted no screen shots of your party's dps.

5.you show no pics from PVP. after all lets not forget that IC is a PVP update.

6.thaumature is not a pro tip especially in IC. your better off stacking healing. PVE yeah, but not PVP.

7.Jabs does proc burning light but at a lower rate then 25%. like I said. i'm guessing its because of all the crying about jabs so it got lowered. just like jabs used to not proc the evil hunter bonus. i'd have to test it to see if thats still the case.


also your build would be destroyed in pvp which, again, is what IC is.

...

meh. I expected nothing less. you were hoping to come in here with a few screen shots from live pve thinking this would prove all is well with templars and it didn't work. not even close. i'm guessing we won't be seeing your face on this post again because of this. but thanks for trying

No not at all but for a different reason, I hope baddies like you keep making threads like this to make the class even stronger than it is.
So keep going

[Moderator Note: Removed moderated quote]

with all due respect:

I do agree with much (not everyhting) you say and that this thread is over-the-top concerning templar balance. But with AR 21 (from your sig), I think it's safe to assume that you didn't exactly PvP every evening for the last year. Thus, I think you should maybe not draw conclusions from what you have experienced so far.

IIRC you're one of the NA top PvE guys, which is fine and an accomplishment for sure. Still, I think you should respect players complaining about their experience in PvP when they invested just as much (pr probably even more) time into that than what you invested in DSA. I think just calling people baddies is somewhat uncalled for while presenting a rank like that in your sig.

I have played my templar in PvP for more time than I have done anything else in this game. Still, I can take one of my twinks to PvP and be just as (or even more) successful after having trained a handful of evenings. This doesn't really add up to me and, most importantly, I don't see 1.7 make that any different (maybe except for the change that I'd have to take the NB now)

Nifty2g

Kas wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

This thread is a joke right? Surely you can't be serious, if you are then you got some serious l2p issues.
As for RD the execute range on this 30% not 20%
As for jabs/puncturing sweep, it procs burning light, so does shards and sweep/jabs.

If played correctly and speced correctly, templar dps in pve and pvp can be very dangerous, magicka and/or stamina.

Pro tip; being templar your main damage source comes from Thaumaturge, make use of it and Proximity Detonation/Dawnbreaker.

Some old and new dps screenshots from trials and vdsa

And the best ever

hmm not sure if your serious or not with this post.

1. your trying to use scenarios where the enemy stands in front of you and just takes damage. since IC is a PVP update, if I could get other players to just stand there then we wouldn't have a problem. but they don't.

2. next your showing us screen shots of no more then 80 secs. so basically your an PVE off healer who stands there opens with a spear then spams jabs until radiant destruction time?

3.those npc's just stand there. They also dont insta heal out of execute range like other players do and will in IC. Not to mention RD is getting nerfed.

4. your post proves absolutely nothing about pve dps other then we can put up decent numbers like I said. you posted no screen shots of your party's dps.

5.you show no pics from PVP. after all lets not forget that IC is a PVP update.

6.thaumature is not a pro tip especially in IC. your better off stacking healing. PVE yeah, but not PVP.

7.Jabs does proc burning light but at a lower rate then 25%. like I said. i'm guessing its because of all the crying about jabs so it got lowered. just like jabs used to not proc the evil hunter bonus. i'd have to test it to see if thats still the case.


also your build would be destroyed in pvp which, again, is what IC is.

...

meh. I expected nothing less. you were hoping to come in here with a few screen shots from live pve thinking this would prove all is well with templars and it didn't work. not even close. i'm guessing we won't be seeing your face on this post again because of this. but thanks for trying

No not at all but for a different reason, I hope baddies like you keep making threads like this to make the class even stronger than it is.
So keep going

[Moderator Note: Removed moderated quote]

with all due respect:

I do agree with much (not everyhting) you say and that this thread is over-the-top concerning templar balance. But with AR 21 (from your sig), I think it's safe to assume that you didn't exactly PvP every evening for the last year. Thus, I think you should maybe not draw conclusions from what you have experienced so far.

IIRC you're one of the NA top PvE guys, which is fine and an accomplishment for sure. Still, I think you should respect players complaining about their experience in PvP when they invested just as much (pr probably even more) time into that than what you invested in DSA. I think just calling people baddies is somewhat uncalled for while presenting a rank like that in your sig.

I have played my templar in PvP for more time than I have done anything else in this game. Still, I can take one of my twinks to PvP and be just as (or even more) successful after having trained a handful of evenings. This doesn't really add up to me and, most importantly, I don't see 1.7 make that any different (maybe except for the change that I'd have to take the NB now)

I've been pvping on and off for the last 6 months but got into it 3 months ago, that said I really don't think Alliance Rank proves anything at all, there are many players out there with high Alliance Ranks that aren't very good, I think how much AP you can soak up in a zerg shouldn't account for your skill level, but that's just my thoughts. But that said I'm not calling myself the greatest player I just personally think templar isn't that bad, well Stamina Templars are taking a massive hit in this update

There's not much I can say to change people's opinions about this whole topic but I do want some sort of escape method for a Templar, Solar Barrage also needs a fix where you dont get stuck in animation, because puncturing sweep doesn't crit heal you I think the heal should be increased from this ability to make it viable in situations considering it drops your block during the cast.

serjomalekrwb17_ESO

Vatter wrote: »

I've played a templar ever since beta stress testing was done.

I've played all builds. all different types of game play. When I rolled the character for live I chose a high elf templar because of the focus on magicka.

As everyone knows, the templar has been consistently the worst class to play in ESO. There have been multiple surveys that confirm this by other players.

Our DPS is last on the list. Even though we can put up some decent numbers, it is, still in fact, last place.
For PVE DPS it goes DK, NB, Sorc, Temp.
For PVP DPS it goes NB, Sorc, DK, Temp.
Now a lot of players who have never played a templar before generally come on the forums yelling about RADIANT DESTRUCTION this or BREATH OF LIFE that and BITING JABS this or BLAZING SHIELD that and these are generally the talking points people use to say the class is fine. But lets take a look at these.

1. Breath of Life and Honor the Dead - This is the number one argument people like to use on why they should get their healing buffed or why templars are a "good" class. What they don't know about is something called the "Smart Healing System" that ZOS has embedded in their code. Basically, when I hit BOL or HTD, the heal will go to the lowest health person in the range of the spell. So what that means is you are NEVER guaranteed to heal yourself unlike other classes unless you are out of range of other faction players. Other classes can stack up healing buffs through CP, mundus, Gear and Restoration staff abilities and are 100% guaranteed a self heal (in most cases 75%-90% of their total health bar is returned) in 1 or 2 instant casts.

How many times as a templar healer have you been in Cyrodill near a keep under siege with other players (whether in group or out of group) OR in a group for that matter going against another group, you get hit by siege or other players AOE's and are being drained of health fast, you try to heal your self using your "OP" class heal only to heal the dopes that are not even in your group who like to stand in siege fire or right in the middle of the opposing zerg and not cleansing, healing or moving themselves and you die? for me, its happened hundreds and hundreds of times.

So all of the sudden my "OP" class heal becomes a "maybe if I feel like it" heal. Here's an example you can try on your own. take you and a friend somewhere with an npc. Have your friend have only have 16 or 18k health and you 25-30k. you aggro the npc and let them hit you. as long as your health stays above your friends every heal you do will go to him instead of you even though he is at 100% health. try it.

This is a huge buff for night blades and sorcerers who have escape skills and shield (sorc) because of this they generally stack everything into spell and weapon power and have the lowest health in cyrodiil and because its usually group vs group they get all the heals. letting them survive longer until the templar is dead. then, when they are about to be overcome simply hit vanish or streak and live to fight on. the templar has to rez and horse it back to group. it's insane.

2. DPS - Another big problem with Templars is our dps skills. ALL OF THEM THAT ACTUALLY DO DAMAGE ARE CHANNELED OR DAMAGE OVER TIME. granted there is one or 2 that are instant such as javelin which of course costs an incredible amount of resources and hits like a wad of wet kleenex. lets take a look.

- biting jabs or puncturing sweep - channeled - 1.1 secs for 4 hits. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge through you, side step, back up, block, or CC you SINCE YOU ARE COMPLETELY OPEN TO ANY ATTACK WHILE CASTING THIS. Not to mention the other player gets a full cc immunity for a .5 sec knock back.
*this skill should have the same immunity as wrecking blow and have a lower cast time. .5 secs instead of 1.1

-spear shards - instant - but has an arc travel time so its close to .3 or .4 secs for initial damage to be done. the damage on initial hit is 2 - 2.5k then the other player has to stand in it which the area is only 8 meters for them to take the dot. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge, side step, or back up. Most people will just hold block and move back so your chances of striking someone with this ability over and over is low because of the arc travel time and small DOT radius.

-Sun shield and its morphs - Now completely useless. 15% of my max health as a shield for 6 secs? please just remove this skill completely from game because now it seems like your just laughing at us. not one single person is gonna slot this. skill destroyed.

-vampires bane and reflective light - instant - with travel time - initial blast is to low and damage over time is to low. not to mention the dot can easily be removed or soaked up by a damage shield.

-Solar flare and morph - channeled - 1.1 sec cast time - also has a high arc travel time so it can be close to 2 secs or more before any damage is done. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. due to the high arc travel time this skill is avoided 99% of the time. Who's idea was it to give these skills high arc paths? its just awful. The instant cast version of this has damage so low it makes you laugh.

-backlash - instant - but it has a 6 sec build up time which can be removed or mitigated so no damage is even done.

-eclipse - instant - however its cc breakable and cannot be applied to ANYONE who is under cc immunity. ANYONE WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW WILL INSTANTLY CC BREAK THIS FOR THE IMMUNITY - there is no instant damage so it gives people a free immunity going in to a fight for some stamina.

-Radiant Destruction - the skill there has been soooo much crying over. lets break it down. 1. you have to be low health, under 20% for the bonus effect to kick in. even then the damage IS SPREAD OUT OVER 3.4 SECS. mine on pts does 9443. lets do the math 9443 / 3.4 secs = 2777 damage per second which is then cut by 50% for IC which is now 1388 per second. LOL 1,388 DAMAGE PER SECOND! - NOT TO MENTION IS CAN BE INTERRUPTED, CLEANSED, RANGED, BUBBLED AND LEAVES YOU OPEN THE ENTIRE TIME TO BE CC'D OR ATTACKED. with all the heal stacking that will be going on people are going to be insta healing to 75 - 100% health or bubbling or my favorite spamming cloak. So to get someone to 20% health with these mechanics AND awful templar dps is going to be very very hard.

lets look at the healing, the meat of what makes the templar class.

1. rushed ceremony and morphs - a good skill - that is if your lucky enough for it to be applied to you. even then it requires you stop dps in order to cast it. a superior skill is hardened ward where the sorcerer can stack magicka and spell damage into it have a huge bubble and can continue with full cannon dps.

2. healing ritual and morphs - the cast time is way to long and leaves you open to be interrupted, and cc'd

3. restoring aura and morphs - the +20% buff does not apply to magicka only health and stamina. the repentance morph requires dead bodies for it to work. npcs that are dead vanish very fast so you have to be johnny on the spot with this.

4. cleansing ritual and morphs - good cleanse skill heal over time is a little low for a burst damage game.

5. rune focus and morphs - used to be a good skill now you have to stay within the small area to gain the magicka or healing buff. the area itself is small.

On top of all this we have no speed buff, no escape, no aoe cc, bad regen, sub par passives, and little to no instant dps skills.

MY SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENTS IN ORDER OF IMPORTANCE TO ME.

1. there needs to be a hierarchy in your smart healing system. it should go self>group>everyone else. the way it is seriously nerfs the core of our class.

2. puncturing sweep and morphs should have same immunity as wrecking blow and be .5 sec to cast. even dropping the 4th hit with the knock back will do if thats whats needed to make the change. I'm also not sure why this skill works differently with burning light. the proc chance is much lower then 25% which i'm sure is by design. please revert whatever changes you made to it.

3.changes to ultimates need to happen - i'd make the dot damage from NOVA an instant cast explosion that comes from the player and does aoe damage and reduces enemy player damage by 15%. 20k aoe damage (scaled with moderate spell or weapon power) with 15 meter radius and 15% enemy reduced damage seems fair for 240 ultimate. seeing is how dawn breaker, dragon leap, and overcharge already do similar damage. with dawn breaker and overcharge being much more cheaper. the way it is now, as much as you want them to, no one is gonna stand in your nova.

4.make repentance a toggle skill that automatically takes the essences from killed npcs and players.

5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.

6.Eclipse being cast on self not on target.

7.make spear shards an aoe root or stun. similar to talons.

8. scale sun shield with spell damage and max magicka and extend the time to 20 secs.

I welcome to any feedback anyone else has concerning this breakdown. but before you comment please ask yourself.
do I have a v14 templar?
have I experienced all game content?
Do i understand that Imperial city is a pvp update?

Just to put my 10 cents on the matter.
in the current PTS build me and a friend of mine were having alot of dueling and build testings. I rolled a templar 3-4 times to test it and failed miserably to put a fight against my NB friend , tho my DK was literally Obliterating him.
so my friend got tiered of loosing to my DK-uppercut monster, and rolled a test Templar.

Imperial - with high HP and Stamina, Gliffed with Prismatic Gliffs , godlike regenaration and heavy armor 2h/s&b
the friend was mostly unkillable with capability to do both DPS and Take punishment.

With proper skill combo my buddy was able to surpass the NB DPS using his 2h hammer, and save himself or my (in teamfight) from a certain death in a matter of 2 seconds.

after some dueling i rolled my DK in same faction as him and we went off to fight others , wining nearly every battle ( unless boss came and mobs just swarmed us).
at some point the 2 of us encountered 4 Bananas and engaged them , immediately 3 smurfs came along and joined the fight.

after some time the 2 enemy factions started focusing fire on me and my templar pet, resulting in them breaking against us.
and 2 classes THAT ARE CURRENTLY CRYING ON FORUMS ( Templar and DK ) managed to Obliterate 7 enemy players....

the Templar is preforming VERY well if built and used properly.

what pisses me off tho , is that all u guys who rolled a Templar knew that his role was a support , while DK is a fighter, NB is a sin and sorc is well.... a sorc......

The Main job of a templar in PvP or PvE was to heal and buff, ultimately playing as a support for the group. wich he does well.......

i personaly find it irritating that people complain about DPS on a support class....its NOT YOUR JOB.
people cant cry that NB does 30% more dmg than a Templar , knowing that NB was built to damage.....

ESO gave us the Option to be what ever we want , 1 class can go all 3. Tank , DPS , support.
but every class is better at his own field......

and whining that a class designed to be strong at support is Slacking on DPS behind a sin....well , no **** sherlock......

basicaly , i am sorry but if you find that Templar is somewhat Behind other classes , you are doing it wrong , a good Templar will

1. rushed ceremony will also heal 2 other targets and most likely you will be one of them. my buddy never had a problem self healing while in a fight , you can always use rally or Vigor for a 100% sure heal on self , OR use healing Ritual.
2. healing ritual is also working properly , because he can get a player from 10% HP to 100% in 2 shots... Learn to position youreself and use this skill while under protection from a teammate.
3. Restoring aura is amazing as a buff. anough said.
4. cleansing ritual... see YOU DID IT WRONG AGAIN!!! you cry about the heal... while its an almost FREE purify skill , with a HoT AND boost to any healing you do.....
5. rune focus still lets you have the defence out of the rune , while the STAY-INSIDE mechanic is Justified considering you get 200 mana every seonds , summing up to 400 mana regen.....thats ALOT....


now THIS MADE ME LAUGH....
5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.
FOR REAL?!?! you want your support templar to be on par with a MAGE when it comes to ranged DPS.....?? see my point? thats stupid.....!!!!!!!!

eclipse is amazing , its forcing enemy to dump stamina , and if u learn to time it right , sorcs will have a bad day....
same goes to Swallow soul NB mages.....

Spear shards are also fine , its a ranged stun , with some DPS , AND can be picked up by a teammate to gain stamina back....its HUGE , and again , ITS SUPPORT!!!!!!!!!!!

Sun shield is not 10k shield anymore, but its anough to withstand an uppercut , time it properly now , l2p , instead of spamming it non stop to be unkillable like on live.

basicaly.... sorry but everything OP said is rubbish. nonsense and a L2P issue. i dont care how long you play a templar , but u failed to recognize the calss for his intended role , and try to make him what he is not , failing miserably....ither reroll to DK or NB , or start using Templar properly , and u will be fine.

Cyantific87

Templar master class

Springt-Über-Zwerge

serjomalekrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

I've played a templar ever since beta stress testing was done.

I've played all builds. all different types of game play. When I rolled the character for live I chose a high elf templar because of the focus on magicka.

As everyone knows, the templar has been consistently the worst class to play in ESO. There have been multiple surveys that confirm this by other players.

Our DPS is last on the list. Even though we can put up some decent numbers, it is, still in fact, last place.
For PVE DPS it goes DK, NB, Sorc, Temp.
For PVP DPS it goes NB, Sorc, DK, Temp.
Now a lot of players who have never played a templar before generally come on the forums yelling about RADIANT DESTRUCTION this or BREATH OF LIFE that and BITING JABS this or BLAZING SHIELD that and these are generally the talking points people use to say the class is fine. But lets take a look at these.

1. Breath of Life and Honor the Dead - This is the number one argument people like to use on why they should get their healing buffed or why templars are a "good" class. What they don't know about is something called the "Smart Healing System" that ZOS has embedded in their code. Basically, when I hit BOL or HTD, the heal will go to the lowest health person in the range of the spell. So what that means is you are NEVER guaranteed to heal yourself unlike other classes unless you are out of range of other faction players. Other classes can stack up healing buffs through CP, mundus, Gear and Restoration staff abilities and are 100% guaranteed a self heal (in most cases 75%-90% of their total health bar is returned) in 1 or 2 instant casts.

How many times as a templar healer have you been in Cyrodill near a keep under siege with other players (whether in group or out of group) OR in a group for that matter going against another group, you get hit by siege or other players AOE's and are being drained of health fast, you try to heal your self using your "OP" class heal only to heal the dopes that are not even in your group who like to stand in siege fire or right in the middle of the opposing zerg and not cleansing, healing or moving themselves and you die? for me, its happened hundreds and hundreds of times.

So all of the sudden my "OP" class heal becomes a "maybe if I feel like it" heal. Here's an example you can try on your own. take you and a friend somewhere with an npc. Have your friend have only have 16 or 18k health and you 25-30k. you aggro the npc and let them hit you. as long as your health stays above your friends every heal you do will go to him instead of you even though he is at 100% health. try it.

This is a huge buff for night blades and sorcerers who have escape skills and shield (sorc) because of this they generally stack everything into spell and weapon power and have the lowest health in cyrodiil and because its usually group vs group they get all the heals. letting them survive longer until the templar is dead. then, when they are about to be overcome simply hit vanish or streak and live to fight on. the templar has to rez and horse it back to group. it's insane.

2. DPS - Another big problem with Templars is our dps skills. ALL OF THEM THAT ACTUALLY DO DAMAGE ARE CHANNELED OR DAMAGE OVER TIME. granted there is one or 2 that are instant such as javelin which of course costs an incredible amount of resources and hits like a wad of wet kleenex. lets take a look.

- biting jabs or puncturing sweep - channeled - 1.1 secs for 4 hits. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge through you, side step, back up, block, or CC you SINCE YOU ARE COMPLETELY OPEN TO ANY ATTACK WHILE CASTING THIS. Not to mention the other player gets a full cc immunity for a .5 sec knock back.
*this skill should have the same immunity as wrecking blow and have a lower cast time. .5 secs instead of 1.1

-spear shards - instant - but has an arc travel time so its close to .3 or .4 secs for initial damage to be done. the damage on initial hit is 2 - 2.5k then the other player has to stand in it which the area is only 8 meters for them to take the dot. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge, side step, or back up. Most people will just hold block and move back so your chances of striking someone with this ability over and over is low because of the arc travel time and small DOT radius.

-Sun shield and its morphs - Now completely useless. 15% of my max health as a shield for 6 secs? please just remove this skill completely from game because now it seems like your just laughing at us. not one single person is gonna slot this. skill destroyed.

-vampires bane and reflective light - instant - with travel time - initial blast is to low and damage over time is to low. not to mention the dot can easily be removed or soaked up by a damage shield.

-Solar flare and morph - channeled - 1.1 sec cast time - also has a high arc travel time so it can be close to 2 secs or more before any damage is done. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. due to the high arc travel time this skill is avoided 99% of the time. Who's idea was it to give these skills high arc paths? its just awful. The instant cast version of this has damage so low it makes you laugh.

-backlash - instant - but it has a 6 sec build up time which can be removed or mitigated so no damage is even done.

-eclipse - instant - however its cc breakable and cannot be applied to ANYONE who is under cc immunity. ANYONE WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW WILL INSTANTLY CC BREAK THIS FOR THE IMMUNITY - there is no instant damage so it gives people a free immunity going in to a fight for some stamina.

-Radiant Destruction - the skill there has been soooo much crying over. lets break it down. 1. you have to be low health, under 20% for the bonus effect to kick in. even then the damage IS SPREAD OUT OVER 3.4 SECS. mine on pts does 9443. lets do the math 9443 / 3.4 secs = 2777 damage per second which is then cut by 50% for IC which is now 1388 per second. LOL 1,388 DAMAGE PER SECOND! - NOT TO MENTION IS CAN BE INTERRUPTED, CLEANSED, RANGED, BUBBLED AND LEAVES YOU OPEN THE ENTIRE TIME TO BE CC'D OR ATTACKED. with all the heal stacking that will be going on people are going to be insta healing to 75 - 100% health or bubbling or my favorite spamming cloak. So to get someone to 20% health with these mechanics AND awful templar dps is going to be very very hard.

lets look at the healing, the meat of what makes the templar class.

1. rushed ceremony and morphs - a good skill - that is if your lucky enough for it to be applied to you. even then it requires you stop dps in order to cast it. a superior skill is hardened ward where the sorcerer can stack magicka and spell damage into it have a huge bubble and can continue with full cannon dps.

2. healing ritual and morphs - the cast time is way to long and leaves you open to be interrupted, and cc'd

3. restoring aura and morphs - the +20% buff does not apply to magicka only health and stamina. the repentance morph requires dead bodies for it to work. npcs that are dead vanish very fast so you have to be johnny on the spot with this.

4. cleansing ritual and morphs - good cleanse skill heal over time is a little low for a burst damage game.

5. rune focus and morphs - used to be a good skill now you have to stay within the small area to gain the magicka or healing buff. the area itself is small.

On top of all this we have no speed buff, no escape, no aoe cc, bad regen, sub par passives, and little to no instant dps skills.

MY SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENTS IN ORDER OF IMPORTANCE TO ME.

1. there needs to be a hierarchy in your smart healing system. it should go self>group>everyone else. the way it is seriously nerfs the core of our class.

2. puncturing sweep and morphs should have same immunity as wrecking blow and be .5 sec to cast. even dropping the 4th hit with the knock back will do if thats whats needed to make the change. I'm also not sure why this skill works differently with burning light. the proc chance is much lower then 25% which i'm sure is by design. please revert whatever changes you made to it.

3.changes to ultimates need to happen - i'd make the dot damage from NOVA an instant cast explosion that comes from the player and does aoe damage and reduces enemy player damage by 15%. 20k aoe damage (scaled with moderate spell or weapon power) with 15 meter radius and 15% enemy reduced damage seems fair for 240 ultimate. seeing is how dawn breaker, dragon leap, and overcharge already do similar damage. with dawn breaker and overcharge being much more cheaper. the way it is now, as much as you want them to, no one is gonna stand in your nova.

4.make repentance a toggle skill that automatically takes the essences from killed npcs and players.

5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.

6.Eclipse being cast on self not on target.

7.make spear shards an aoe root or stun. similar to talons.

8. scale sun shield with spell damage and max magicka and extend the time to 20 secs.

I welcome to any feedback anyone else has concerning this breakdown. but before you comment please ask yourself.
do I have a v14 templar?
have I experienced all game content?
Do i understand that Imperial city is a pvp update?

Just to put my 10 cents on the matter.
in the current PTS build me and a friend of mine were having alot of dueling and build testings. I rolled a templar 3-4 times to test it and failed miserably to put a fight against my NB friend , tho my DK was literally Obliterating him.
so my friend got tiered of loosing to my DK-uppercut monster, and rolled a test Templar.

Imperial - with high HP and Stamina, Gliffed with Prismatic Gliffs , godlike regenaration and heavy armor 2h/s&b
the friend was mostly unkillable with capability to do both DPS and Take punishment.

With proper skill combo my buddy was able to surpass the NB DPS using his 2h hammer, and save himself or my (in teamfight) from a certain death in a matter of 2 seconds.

after some dueling i rolled my DK in same faction as him and we went off to fight others , wining nearly every battle ( unless boss came and mobs just swarmed us).
at some point the 2 of us encountered 4 Bananas and engaged them , immediately 3 smurfs came along and joined the fight.

after some time the 2 enemy factions started focusing fire on me and my templar pet, resulting in them breaking against us.
and 2 classes THAT ARE CURRENTLY CRYING ON FORUMS ( Templar and DK ) managed to Obliterate 7 enemy players....

the Templar is preforming VERY well if built and used properly.

what pisses me off tho , is that all u guys who rolled a Templar knew that his role was a support , while DK is a fighter, NB is a sin and sorc is well.... a sorc......

The Main job of a templar in PvP or PvE was to heal and buff, ultimately playing as a support for the group. wich he does well.......

i personaly find it irritating that people complain about DPS on a support class....its NOT YOUR JOB.
people cant cry that NB does 30% more dmg than a Templar , knowing that NB was built to damage.....

ESO gave us the Option to be what ever we want , 1 class can go all 3. Tank , DPS , support.
but every class is better at his own field......

and whining that a class designed to be strong at support is Slacking on DPS behind a sin....well , no **** sherlock......

basicaly , i am sorry but if you find that Templar is somewhat Behind other classes , you are doing it wrong , a good Templar will

1. rushed ceremony will also heal 2 other targets and most likely you will be one of them. my buddy never had a problem self healing while in a fight , you can always use rally or Vigor for a 100% sure heal on self , OR use healing Ritual.
2. healing ritual is also working properly , because he can get a player from 10% HP to 100% in 2 shots... Learn to position youreself and use this skill while under protection from a teammate.
3. Restoring aura is amazing as a buff. anough said.
4. cleansing ritual... see YOU DID IT WRONG AGAIN!!! you cry about the heal... while its an almost FREE purify skill , with a HoT AND boost to any healing you do.....
5. rune focus still lets you have the defence out of the rune , while the STAY-INSIDE mechanic is Justified considering you get 200 mana every seonds , summing up to 400 mana regen.....thats ALOT....


now THIS MADE ME LAUGH....
5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.
FOR REAL?!?! you want your support templar to be on par with a MAGE when it comes to ranged DPS.....?? see my point? thats stupid.....!!!!!!!!

eclipse is amazing , its forcing enemy to dump stamina , and if u learn to time it right , sorcs will have a bad day....
same goes to Swallow soul NB mages.....

Spear shards are also fine , its a ranged stun , with some DPS , AND can be picked up by a teammate to gain stamina back....its HUGE , and again , ITS SUPPORT!!!!!!!!!!!

Sun shield is not 10k shield anymore, but its anough to withstand an uppercut , time it properly now , l2p , instead of spamming it non stop to be unkillable like on live.

basicaly.... sorry but everything OP said is rubbish. nonsense and a L2P issue. i dont care how long you play a templar , but u failed to recognize the calss for his intended role , and try to make him what he is not , failing miserably....ither reroll to DK or NB , or start using Templar properly , and u will be fine.

You must be joking this game is about play how you want so if I want to do a support dk I can make a support dk and it works very good so gtfo with your templar is a support class stop whining

Septimus_Magna

Meanwhile Spyhper is wrecking people in 1vX with his magicka templar on PTS. Biting Jabs spam supposed to be pretty strong on high spell dmg/magicka builds with the mutal benefit towards the strong templar heals. He also mentioned his build wasnt optimal because he didnt have the vamp skills and passives.

Springt-Über-Zwerge

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Meanwhile Spyhper is wrecking people in 1vX with his magicka templar on PTS. Biting Jabs spam supposed to be pretty strong on high spell dmg/magicka builds with the mutal benefit towards the strong templar heals. He also mentioned his build wasnt optimal because he didnt have the vamp skills and passives.

Sypher is wrecking people no matter what he plays so I woulnt take him as the average player and I saw many of his videos in many of them the enemies dont try to seriously kill him.

Alucardo

I got to level 40 and stopped after I just found myself spamming focused charge + puncturing sweep because everything else seemed somewhat useless.

Kas

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Meanwhile Spyhper is wrecking people in 1vX with his magicka templar on PTS. Biting Jabs spam supposed to be pretty strong on high spell dmg/magicka builds with the mutal benefit towards the strong templar heals. He also mentioned his build wasnt optimal because he didnt have the vamp skills and passives.

oh god... can we please stop jumping to conclusions from a few kills? I have been running builds for 20min or so that didn't work at all. so have other people. Whenever someone wins a 1v5 chances are, it's related to the builds the 5 are trying out and not the build the 1 is playing. besides, there are still terrible players in this game. However, the much bigger factor is people trying out stuff (new builds, classes they have 0 experience with, stam/mag switch). Don't take the outcome of a few fights as an indicator for balance...

serjomalekrwb17_ESO

Kas wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Meanwhile Spyhper is wrecking people in 1vX with his magicka templar on PTS. Biting Jabs spam supposed to be pretty strong on high spell dmg/magicka builds with the mutal benefit towards the strong templar heals. He also mentioned his build wasnt optimal because he didnt have the vamp skills and passives.

oh god... can we please stop jumping to conclusions from a few kills? I have been running builds for 20min or so that didn't work at all. so have other people. Whenever someone wins a 1v5 chances are, it's related to the builds the 5 are trying out and not the build the 1 is playing. besides, there are still terrible players in this game. However, the much bigger factor is people trying out stuff (new builds, classes they have 0 experience with, stam/mag switch). Don't take the outcome of a few fights as an indicator for balance...

That , and half of Sypher fights look like they were taken from bollywood. enemies dont even attack him half the time.

Fizzlewizzle

serjomalekrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

I've played a templar ever since beta stress testing was done.

I've played all builds. all different types of game play. When I rolled the character for live I chose a high elf templar because of the focus on magicka.

As everyone knows, the templar has been consistently the worst class to play in ESO. There have been multiple surveys that confirm this by other players.

Our DPS is last on the list. Even though we can put up some decent numbers, it is, still in fact, last place.
For PVE DPS it goes DK, NB, Sorc, Temp.
For PVP DPS it goes NB, Sorc, DK, Temp.
Now a lot of players who have never played a templar before generally come on the forums yelling about RADIANT DESTRUCTION this or BREATH OF LIFE that and BITING JABS this or BLAZING SHIELD that and these are generally the talking points people use to say the class is fine. But lets take a look at these.

1. Breath of Life and Honor the Dead - This is the number one argument people like to use on why they should get their healing buffed or why templars are a "good" class. What they don't know about is something called the "Smart Healing System" that ZOS has embedded in their code. Basically, when I hit BOL or HTD, the heal will go to the lowest health person in the range of the spell. So what that means is you are NEVER guaranteed to heal yourself unlike other classes unless you are out of range of other faction players. Other classes can stack up healing buffs through CP, mundus, Gear and Restoration staff abilities and are 100% guaranteed a self heal (in most cases 75%-90% of their total health bar is returned) in 1 or 2 instant casts.

How many times as a templar healer have you been in Cyrodill near a keep under siege with other players (whether in group or out of group) OR in a group for that matter going against another group, you get hit by siege or other players AOE's and are being drained of health fast, you try to heal your self using your "OP" class heal only to heal the dopes that are not even in your group who like to stand in siege fire or right in the middle of the opposing zerg and not cleansing, healing or moving themselves and you die? for me, its happened hundreds and hundreds of times.

So all of the sudden my "OP" class heal becomes a "maybe if I feel like it" heal. Here's an example you can try on your own. take you and a friend somewhere with an npc. Have your friend have only have 16 or 18k health and you 25-30k. you aggro the npc and let them hit you. as long as your health stays above your friends every heal you do will go to him instead of you even though he is at 100% health. try it.

This is a huge buff for night blades and sorcerers who have escape skills and shield (sorc) because of this they generally stack everything into spell and weapon power and have the lowest health in cyrodiil and because its usually group vs group they get all the heals. letting them survive longer until the templar is dead. then, when they are about to be overcome simply hit vanish or streak and live to fight on. the templar has to rez and horse it back to group. it's insane.

2. DPS - Another big problem with Templars is our dps skills. ALL OF THEM THAT ACTUALLY DO DAMAGE ARE CHANNELED OR DAMAGE OVER TIME. granted there is one or 2 that are instant such as javelin which of course costs an incredible amount of resources and hits like a wad of wet kleenex. lets take a look.

- biting jabs or puncturing sweep - channeled - 1.1 secs for 4 hits. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge through you, side step, back up, block, or CC you SINCE YOU ARE COMPLETELY OPEN TO ANY ATTACK WHILE CASTING THIS. Not to mention the other player gets a full cc immunity for a .5 sec knock back.
*this skill should have the same immunity as wrecking blow and have a lower cast time. .5 secs instead of 1.1

-spear shards - instant - but has an arc travel time so its close to .3 or .4 secs for initial damage to be done. the damage on initial hit is 2 - 2.5k then the other player has to stand in it which the area is only 8 meters for them to take the dot. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge, side step, or back up. Most people will just hold block and move back so your chances of striking someone with this ability over and over is low because of the arc travel time and small DOT radius.

-Sun shield and its morphs - Now completely useless. 15% of my max health as a shield for 6 secs? please just remove this skill completely from game because now it seems like your just laughing at us. not one single person is gonna slot this. skill destroyed.

-vampires bane and reflective light - instant - with travel time - initial blast is to low and damage over time is to low. not to mention the dot can easily be removed or soaked up by a damage shield.

-Solar flare and morph - channeled - 1.1 sec cast time - also has a high arc travel time so it can be close to 2 secs or more before any damage is done. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. due to the high arc travel time this skill is avoided 99% of the time. Who's idea was it to give these skills high arc paths? its just awful. The instant cast version of this has damage so low it makes you laugh.

-backlash - instant - but it has a 6 sec build up time which can be removed or mitigated so no damage is even done.

-eclipse - instant - however its cc breakable and cannot be applied to ANYONE who is under cc immunity. ANYONE WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW WILL INSTANTLY CC BREAK THIS FOR THE IMMUNITY - there is no instant damage so it gives people a free immunity going in to a fight for some stamina.

-Radiant Destruction - the skill there has been soooo much crying over. lets break it down. 1. you have to be low health, under 20% for the bonus effect to kick in. even then the damage IS SPREAD OUT OVER 3.4 SECS. mine on pts does 9443. lets do the math 9443 / 3.4 secs = 2777 damage per second which is then cut by 50% for IC which is now 1388 per second. LOL 1,388 DAMAGE PER SECOND! - NOT TO MENTION IS CAN BE INTERRUPTED, CLEANSED, RANGED, BUBBLED AND LEAVES YOU OPEN THE ENTIRE TIME TO BE CC'D OR ATTACKED. with all the heal stacking that will be going on people are going to be insta healing to 75 - 100% health or bubbling or my favorite spamming cloak. So to get someone to 20% health with these mechanics AND awful templar dps is going to be very very hard.

lets look at the healing, the meat of what makes the templar class.

1. rushed ceremony and morphs - a good skill - that is if your lucky enough for it to be applied to you. even then it requires you stop dps in order to cast it. a superior skill is hardened ward where the sorcerer can stack magicka and spell damage into it have a huge bubble and can continue with full cannon dps.

2. healing ritual and morphs - the cast time is way to long and leaves you open to be interrupted, and cc'd

3. restoring aura and morphs - the +20% buff does not apply to magicka only health and stamina. the repentance morph requires dead bodies for it to work. npcs that are dead vanish very fast so you have to be johnny on the spot with this.

4. cleansing ritual and morphs - good cleanse skill heal over time is a little low for a burst damage game.

5. rune focus and morphs - used to be a good skill now you have to stay within the small area to gain the magicka or healing buff. the area itself is small.

On top of all this we have no speed buff, no escape, no aoe cc, bad regen, sub par passives, and little to no instant dps skills.

MY SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENTS IN ORDER OF IMPORTANCE TO ME.

1. there needs to be a hierarchy in your smart healing system. it should go self>group>everyone else. the way it is seriously nerfs the core of our class.

2. puncturing sweep and morphs should have same immunity as wrecking blow and be .5 sec to cast. even dropping the 4th hit with the knock back will do if thats whats needed to make the change. I'm also not sure why this skill works differently with burning light. the proc chance is much lower then 25% which i'm sure is by design. please revert whatever changes you made to it.

3.changes to ultimates need to happen - i'd make the dot damage from NOVA an instant cast explosion that comes from the player and does aoe damage and reduces enemy player damage by 15%. 20k aoe damage (scaled with moderate spell or weapon power) with 15 meter radius and 15% enemy reduced damage seems fair for 240 ultimate. seeing is how dawn breaker, dragon leap, and overcharge already do similar damage. with dawn breaker and overcharge being much more cheaper. the way it is now, as much as you want them to, no one is gonna stand in your nova.

4.make repentance a toggle skill that automatically takes the essences from killed npcs and players.

5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.

6.Eclipse being cast on self not on target.

7.make spear shards an aoe root or stun. similar to talons.

8. scale sun shield with spell damage and max magicka and extend the time to 20 secs.

I welcome to any feedback anyone else has concerning this breakdown. but before you comment please ask yourself.
do I have a v14 templar?
have I experienced all game content?
Do i understand that Imperial city is a pvp update?

Just to put my 10 cents on the matter.
in the current PTS build me and a friend of mine were having alot of dueling and build testings. I rolled a templar 3-4 times to test it and failed miserably to put a fight against my NB friend , tho my DK was literally Obliterating him.
so my friend got tiered of loosing to my DK-uppercut monster, and rolled a test Templar.

Imperial - with high HP and Stamina, Gliffed with Prismatic Gliffs , godlike regenaration and heavy armor 2h/s&b
the friend was mostly unkillable with capability to do both DPS and Take punishment.

With proper skill combo my buddy was able to surpass the NB DPS using his 2h hammer, and save himself or my (in teamfight) from a certain death in a matter of 2 seconds.

after some dueling i rolled my DK in same faction as him and we went off to fight others , wining nearly every battle ( unless boss came and mobs just swarmed us).
at some point the 2 of us encountered 4 Bananas and engaged them , immediately 3 smurfs came along and joined the fight.

after some time the 2 enemy factions started focusing fire on me and my templar pet, resulting in them breaking against us.
and 2 classes THAT ARE CURRENTLY CRYING ON FORUMS ( Templar and DK ) managed to Obliterate 7 enemy players....

the Templar is preforming VERY well if built and used properly.

what pisses me off tho , is that all u guys who rolled a Templar knew that his role was a support , while DK is a fighter, NB is a sin and sorc is well.... a sorc......

The Main job of a templar in PvP or PvE was to heal and buff, ultimately playing as a support for the group. wich he does well.......

i personaly find it irritating that people complain about DPS on a support class....its NOT YOUR JOB.
people cant cry that NB does 30% more dmg than a Templar , knowing that NB was built to damage.....

ESO gave us the Option to be what ever we want , 1 class can go all 3. Tank , DPS , support.
but every class is better at his own field......

and whining that a class designed to be strong at support is Slacking on DPS behind a sin....well , no **** sherlock......

basicaly , i am sorry but if you find that Templar is somewhat Behind other classes , you are doing it wrong , a good Templar will

1. rushed ceremony will also heal 2 other targets and most likely you will be one of them. my buddy never had a problem self healing while in a fight , you can always use rally or Vigor for a 100% sure heal on self , OR use healing Ritual.
2. healing ritual is also working properly , because he can get a player from 10% HP to 100% in 2 shots... Learn to position youreself and use this skill while under protection from a teammate.
3. Restoring aura is amazing as a buff. anough said.
4. cleansing ritual... see YOU DID IT WRONG AGAIN!!! you cry about the heal... while its an almost FREE purify skill , with a HoT AND boost to any healing you do.....
5. rune focus still lets you have the defence out of the rune , while the STAY-INSIDE mechanic is Justified considering you get 200 mana every seonds , summing up to 400 mana regen.....thats ALOT....


now THIS MADE ME LAUGH....
5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.
FOR REAL?!?! you want your support templar to be on par with a MAGE when it comes to ranged DPS.....?? see my point? thats stupid.....!!!!!!!!

eclipse is amazing , its forcing enemy to dump stamina , and if u learn to time it right , sorcs will have a bad day....
same goes to Swallow soul NB mages.....

Spear shards are also fine , its a ranged stun , with some DPS , AND can be picked up by a teammate to gain stamina back....its HUGE , and again , ITS SUPPORT!!!!!!!!!!!

Sun shield is not 10k shield anymore, but its anough to withstand an uppercut , time it properly now , l2p , instead of spamming it non stop to be unkillable like on live.

basicaly.... sorry but everything OP said is rubbish. nonsense and a L2P issue. i dont care how long you play a templar , but u failed to recognize the calss for his intended role , and try to make him what he is not , failing miserably....ither reroll to DK or NB , or start using Templar properly , and u will be fine.

My personal 2 cents about your your story.
First off, the PTS server. Most people enter the PTS server to gain advanced information (items mostly, for making money when the update goes life) before it goes to life. Very few actually experiment with classes, builds and whatnot. The ones that do get face rolled (without them caring, they aren't testing stuff for nothing) making guys like you claim that a class is OK because you are killing people on a TEST SERVER.

Personally, i fall under neither categories. I don't care about items, nor builds, and often only join for a sightseeing trip.
All previous PTS patches were mostly garbage for me, besides the one where our account got imported, as i mostly work with crafted item sets, and the PTS accounts don't know any traits themselves.
(I can't craft ***)

Back to topic.
When i joined this game (early access) i choose the Sorc first, but soon switched to Templar as i prefer a SUPPORT class over an Tank or offensive class. Every few updates our support skills got cut down and destroyed for the sake of "balance" (some people couldn't stand it that the rumored "support class" out healed those classes with nothing but offensive skills).

At this current moment our "uber support build" exists out of 1 skill and a Restoration staff, without any synergy between our healing skill and the Restoration staff skill tree, besides the Restoration expert passive (Restoration staff), which only kicks in if your allies are almost dead.
All other passives (3, which not sound like much unless you know that there were 4 passives which boosted either healing skill tree) became either "When healing with a Restoration staff" or "When using Restoring Light skill".
And, Lets not forget the Restoring Light trees own nerf for Rite of Passage and Restoring Aura, a 50% nerf and a 68% nerf (100% nerf if you look at the fact that the buffs you get are no longer stand-alone buffs).

I personally wouldn't mind if if all our offensives got reduced even further, but we became a decent support class in return for it. But with the upcoming IC update (current PTS), the only thing i see are further nerfs for the Templar without (again) anything useful in return.

Vatter

serjomalekrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

I've played a templar ever since beta stress testing was done.

I've played all builds. all different types of game play. When I rolled the character for live I chose a high elf templar because of the focus on magicka.

As everyone knows, the templar has been consistently the worst class to play in ESO. There have been multiple surveys that confirm this by other players.

Our DPS is last on the list. Even though we can put up some decent numbers, it is, still in fact, last place.
For PVE DPS it goes DK, NB, Sorc, Temp.
For PVP DPS it goes NB, Sorc, DK, Temp.
Now a lot of players who have never played a templar before generally come on the forums yelling about RADIANT DESTRUCTION this or BREATH OF LIFE that and BITING JABS this or BLAZING SHIELD that and these are generally the talking points people use to say the class is fine. But lets take a look at these.

1. Breath of Life and Honor the Dead - This is the number one argument people like to use on why they should get their healing buffed or why templars are a "good" class. What they don't know about is something called the "Smart Healing System" that ZOS has embedded in their code. Basically, when I hit BOL or HTD, the heal will go to the lowest health person in the range of the spell. So what that means is you are NEVER guaranteed to heal yourself unlike other classes unless you are out of range of other faction players. Other classes can stack up healing buffs through CP, mundus, Gear and Restoration staff abilities and are 100% guaranteed a self heal (in most cases 75%-90% of their total health bar is returned) in 1 or 2 instant casts.

How many times as a templar healer have you been in Cyrodill near a keep under siege with other players (whether in group or out of group) OR in a group for that matter going against another group, you get hit by siege or other players AOE's and are being drained of health fast, you try to heal your self using your "OP" class heal only to heal the dopes that are not even in your group who like to stand in siege fire or right in the middle of the opposing zerg and not cleansing, healing or moving themselves and you die? for me, its happened hundreds and hundreds of times.

So all of the sudden my "OP" class heal becomes a "maybe if I feel like it" heal. Here's an example you can try on your own. take you and a friend somewhere with an npc. Have your friend have only have 16 or 18k health and you 25-30k. you aggro the npc and let them hit you. as long as your health stays above your friends every heal you do will go to him instead of you even though he is at 100% health. try it.

This is a huge buff for night blades and sorcerers who have escape skills and shield (sorc) because of this they generally stack everything into spell and weapon power and have the lowest health in cyrodiil and because its usually group vs group they get all the heals. letting them survive longer until the templar is dead. then, when they are about to be overcome simply hit vanish or streak and live to fight on. the templar has to rez and horse it back to group. it's insane.

2. DPS - Another big problem with Templars is our dps skills. ALL OF THEM THAT ACTUALLY DO DAMAGE ARE CHANNELED OR DAMAGE OVER TIME. granted there is one or 2 that are instant such as javelin which of course costs an incredible amount of resources and hits like a wad of wet kleenex. lets take a look.

- biting jabs or puncturing sweep - channeled - 1.1 secs for 4 hits. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge through you, side step, back up, block, or CC you SINCE YOU ARE COMPLETELY OPEN TO ANY ATTACK WHILE CASTING THIS. Not to mention the other player gets a full cc immunity for a .5 sec knock back.
*this skill should have the same immunity as wrecking blow and have a lower cast time. .5 secs instead of 1.1

-spear shards - instant - but has an arc travel time so its close to .3 or .4 secs for initial damage to be done. the damage on initial hit is 2 - 2.5k then the other player has to stand in it which the area is only 8 meters for them to take the dot. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge, side step, or back up. Most people will just hold block and move back so your chances of striking someone with this ability over and over is low because of the arc travel time and small DOT radius.

-Sun shield and its morphs - Now completely useless. 15% of my max health as a shield for 6 secs? please just remove this skill completely from game because now it seems like your just laughing at us. not one single person is gonna slot this. skill destroyed.

-vampires bane and reflective light - instant - with travel time - initial blast is to low and damage over time is to low. not to mention the dot can easily be removed or soaked up by a damage shield.

-Solar flare and morph - channeled - 1.1 sec cast time - also has a high arc travel time so it can be close to 2 secs or more before any damage is done. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. due to the high arc travel time this skill is avoided 99% of the time. Who's idea was it to give these skills high arc paths? its just awful. The instant cast version of this has damage so low it makes you laugh.

-backlash - instant - but it has a 6 sec build up time which can be removed or mitigated so no damage is even done.

-eclipse - instant - however its cc breakable and cannot be applied to ANYONE who is under cc immunity. ANYONE WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW WILL INSTANTLY CC BREAK THIS FOR THE IMMUNITY - there is no instant damage so it gives people a free immunity going in to a fight for some stamina.

-Radiant Destruction - the skill there has been soooo much crying over. lets break it down. 1. you have to be low health, under 20% for the bonus effect to kick in. even then the damage IS SPREAD OUT OVER 3.4 SECS. mine on pts does 9443. lets do the math 9443 / 3.4 secs = 2777 damage per second which is then cut by 50% for IC which is now 1388 per second. LOL 1,388 DAMAGE PER SECOND! - NOT TO MENTION IS CAN BE INTERRUPTED, CLEANSED, RANGED, BUBBLED AND LEAVES YOU OPEN THE ENTIRE TIME TO BE CC'D OR ATTACKED. with all the heal stacking that will be going on people are going to be insta healing to 75 - 100% health or bubbling or my favorite spamming cloak. So to get someone to 20% health with these mechanics AND awful templar dps is going to be very very hard.

lets look at the healing, the meat of what makes the templar class.

1. rushed ceremony and morphs - a good skill - that is if your lucky enough for it to be applied to you. even then it requires you stop dps in order to cast it. a superior skill is hardened ward where the sorcerer can stack magicka and spell damage into it have a huge bubble and can continue with full cannon dps.

2. healing ritual and morphs - the cast time is way to long and leaves you open to be interrupted, and cc'd

3. restoring aura and morphs - the +20% buff does not apply to magicka only health and stamina. the repentance morph requires dead bodies for it to work. npcs that are dead vanish very fast so you have to be johnny on the spot with this.

4. cleansing ritual and morphs - good cleanse skill heal over time is a little low for a burst damage game.

5. rune focus and morphs - used to be a good skill now you have to stay within the small area to gain the magicka or healing buff. the area itself is small.

On top of all this we have no speed buff, no escape, no aoe cc, bad regen, sub par passives, and little to no instant dps skills.

MY SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENTS IN ORDER OF IMPORTANCE TO ME.

1. there needs to be a hierarchy in your smart healing system. it should go self>group>everyone else. the way it is seriously nerfs the core of our class.

2. puncturing sweep and morphs should have same immunity as wrecking blow and be .5 sec to cast. even dropping the 4th hit with the knock back will do if thats whats needed to make the change. I'm also not sure why this skill works differently with burning light. the proc chance is much lower then 25% which i'm sure is by design. please revert whatever changes you made to it.

3.changes to ultimates need to happen - i'd make the dot damage from NOVA an instant cast explosion that comes from the player and does aoe damage and reduces enemy player damage by 15%. 20k aoe damage (scaled with moderate spell or weapon power) with 15 meter radius and 15% enemy reduced damage seems fair for 240 ultimate. seeing is how dawn breaker, dragon leap, and overcharge already do similar damage. with dawn breaker and overcharge being much more cheaper. the way it is now, as much as you want them to, no one is gonna stand in your nova.

4.make repentance a toggle skill that automatically takes the essences from killed npcs and players.

5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.

6.Eclipse being cast on self not on target.

7.make spear shards an aoe root or stun. similar to talons.

8. scale sun shield with spell damage and max magicka and extend the time to 20 secs.

I welcome to any feedback anyone else has concerning this breakdown. but before you comment please ask yourself.
do I have a v14 templar?
have I experienced all game content?
Do i understand that Imperial city is a pvp update?

Just to put my 10 cents on the matter.
in the current PTS build me and a friend of mine were having alot of dueling and build testings. I rolled a templar 3-4 times to test it and failed miserably to put a fight against my NB friend , tho my DK was literally Obliterating him.
so my friend got tiered of loosing to my DK-uppercut monster, and rolled a test Templar.

Imperial - with high HP and Stamina, Gliffed with Prismatic Gliffs , godlike regenaration and heavy armor 2h/s&b
the friend was mostly unkillable with capability to do both DPS and Take punishment.

With proper skill combo my buddy was able to surpass the NB DPS using his 2h hammer, and save himself or my (in teamfight) from a certain death in a matter of 2 seconds.

after some dueling i rolled my DK in same faction as him and we went off to fight others , wining nearly every battle ( unless boss came and mobs just swarmed us).
at some point the 2 of us encountered 4 Bananas and engaged them , immediately 3 smurfs came along and joined the fight.

after some time the 2 enemy factions started focusing fire on me and my templar pet, resulting in them breaking against us.
and 2 classes THAT ARE CURRENTLY CRYING ON FORUMS ( Templar and DK ) managed to Obliterate 7 enemy players....

the Templar is preforming VERY well if built and used properly.

what pisses me off tho , is that all u guys who rolled a Templar knew that his role was a support , while DK is a fighter, NB is a sin and sorc is well.... a sorc......

The Main job of a templar in PvP or PvE was to heal and buff, ultimately playing as a support for the group. wich he does well.......

i personaly find it irritating that people complain about DPS on a support class....its NOT YOUR JOB.
people cant cry that NB does 30% more dmg than a Templar , knowing that NB was built to damage.....

ESO gave us the Option to be what ever we want , 1 class can go all 3. Tank , DPS , support.
but every class is better at his own field......

and whining that a class designed to be strong at support is Slacking on DPS behind a sin....well , no **** sherlock......

basicaly , i am sorry but if you find that Templar is somewhat Behind other classes , you are doing it wrong , a good Templar will

1. rushed ceremony will also heal 2 other targets and most likely you will be one of them. my buddy never had a problem self healing while in a fight , you can always use rally or Vigor for a 100% sure heal on self , OR use healing Ritual.
2. healing ritual is also working properly , because he can get a player from 10% HP to 100% in 2 shots... Learn to position youreself and use this skill while under protection from a teammate.
3. Restoring aura is amazing as a buff. anough said.
4. cleansing ritual... see YOU DID IT WRONG AGAIN!!! you cry about the heal... while its an almost FREE purify skill , with a HoT AND boost to any healing you do.....
5. rune focus still lets you have the defence out of the rune , while the STAY-INSIDE mechanic is Justified considering you get 200 mana every seonds , summing up to 400 mana regen.....thats ALOT....


now THIS MADE ME LAUGH....
5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.
FOR REAL?!?! you want your support templar to be on par with a MAGE when it comes to ranged DPS.....?? see my point? thats stupid.....!!!!!!!!

eclipse is amazing , its forcing enemy to dump stamina , and if u learn to time it right , sorcs will have a bad day....
same goes to Swallow soul NB mages.....

Spear shards are also fine , its a ranged stun , with some DPS , AND can be picked up by a teammate to gain stamina back....its HUGE , and again , ITS SUPPORT!!!!!!!!!!!

Sun shield is not 10k shield anymore, but its anough to withstand an uppercut , time it properly now , l2p , instead of spamming it non stop to be unkillable like on live.

basicaly.... sorry but everything OP said is rubbish. nonsense and a L2P issue. i dont care how long you play a templar , but u failed to recognize the calss for his intended role , and try to make him what he is not , failing miserably....ither reroll to DK or NB , or start using Templar properly , and u will be fine.

wow.....there is so much failure in this post I'm struggling to know where to begin......

1. PTS for NA is a template right now. your choices are only from a set list of items, armor, glyphs, weapons, etc etc. your skills are not maxed out like they are once characters on pts goes live. and most of all people are testing other builds and characters that have not been optimized yet with gear, weapons, enchants, potions that they will actually use when it hits live. That right there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE. of course you are gonna win some fights in this manner.

2. in your entire rant you say absolutely nothing about the skills your friend is using to make him "mostly unkillable" you only admit to your own failure (which is funny) at rolling a templar.

3. LOL templar is only a support class. you have not a SINGLE CLUE what your talking about. you think that because we have breath of life and spear shards we are now a dedicated "support" class? WHAT A JOKE!

- EVERY SINGLE CLASS CAN GIVE THE SAME EXACT "SUPPORT" USING A MASTER RESTORATION STAFF AND RESTO SKILLS. using just these 2 things they can heal AND return stamina AND give a damage buff (something a templar skill line doesn't have) AND bubble both the wounded and player (ALSO something a templar doesn't have)

-DKS have green dragon blood which gives 33% health returned AND increases health AND stamina regen.
-SORCS have hardened ward which gives a bubble EQUAL TO IF NOT MORE then a heal from breath of life.
-NB's can use funnel health to heal not only themselves BUT 2 OTHER ALLYS FOR 25% OF DAMAGE DONE EVERY 2 SECS.

so why aren't these classes considered "support"? instead each one gets to enjoy a DIFFERENT VARIETY OF INSTANT DPS SKILLS, ESCAPES, AOE ROOTS, BUBBLES, MOVEMENT BUFFS AND HUGE DPS.

4. YEAH IT MADE ME LAUGH TOO. SORCS GET HARDENED WARD WHICH GIVES A BUBBLE EQUAL TO IF NOT GREATER THEN A SELF HEAL FROM BREATH OF LIFE. NOT TO MENTION YOUR "MAGE" CAN ALSO DO THE EXACT SAME SUPPORT AS ME. SO YEAH I THINK THIS SUGGESTION ISNT TO MUCH TO ASK. SEE MY POINT? THATS STUPID...!!!

5.lolol yea l2p now that we can't use sun shield. seeing as how classes have skills equal to sunshield that were not nerfed like it was.
- DK - has reflective scales
- sorc has hardened ward
- nb has dark cloak.


basically....of course your gonna come in here trying to say its all rubbish. you have noy a single clue or idea what your talking about. not to mention, ironically, you failed to successfully play a templar. luckily, everyone who actually plays a templar knows what I'm talking about and simply sees your post as the rantings of troll.

serjomalekrwb17_ESO

Vatter wrote: »

serjomalekrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

I've played a templar ever since beta stress testing was done.

I've played all builds. all different types of game play. When I rolled the character for live I chose a high elf templar because of the focus on magicka.

As everyone knows, the templar has been consistently the worst class to play in ESO. There have been multiple surveys that confirm this by other players.

Our DPS is last on the list. Even though we can put up some decent numbers, it is, still in fact, last place.
For PVE DPS it goes DK, NB, Sorc, Temp.
For PVP DPS it goes NB, Sorc, DK, Temp.
Now a lot of players who have never played a templar before generally come on the forums yelling about RADIANT DESTRUCTION this or BREATH OF LIFE that and BITING JABS this or BLAZING SHIELD that and these are generally the talking points people use to say the class is fine. But lets take a look at these.

1. Breath of Life and Honor the Dead - This is the number one argument people like to use on why they should get their healing buffed or why templars are a "good" class. What they don't know about is something called the "Smart Healing System" that ZOS has embedded in their code. Basically, when I hit BOL or HTD, the heal will go to the lowest health person in the range of the spell. So what that means is you are NEVER guaranteed to heal yourself unlike other classes unless you are out of range of other faction players. Other classes can stack up healing buffs through CP, mundus, Gear and Restoration staff abilities and are 100% guaranteed a self heal (in most cases 75%-90% of their total health bar is returned) in 1 or 2 instant casts.

How many times as a templar healer have you been in Cyrodill near a keep under siege with other players (whether in group or out of group) OR in a group for that matter going against another group, you get hit by siege or other players AOE's and are being drained of health fast, you try to heal your self using your "OP" class heal only to heal the dopes that are not even in your group who like to stand in siege fire or right in the middle of the opposing zerg and not cleansing, healing or moving themselves and you die? for me, its happened hundreds and hundreds of times.

So all of the sudden my "OP" class heal becomes a "maybe if I feel like it" heal. Here's an example you can try on your own. take you and a friend somewhere with an npc. Have your friend have only have 16 or 18k health and you 25-30k. you aggro the npc and let them hit you. as long as your health stays above your friends every heal you do will go to him instead of you even though he is at 100% health. try it.

This is a huge buff for night blades and sorcerers who have escape skills and shield (sorc) because of this they generally stack everything into spell and weapon power and have the lowest health in cyrodiil and because its usually group vs group they get all the heals. letting them survive longer until the templar is dead. then, when they are about to be overcome simply hit vanish or streak and live to fight on. the templar has to rez and horse it back to group. it's insane.

2. DPS - Another big problem with Templars is our dps skills. ALL OF THEM THAT ACTUALLY DO DAMAGE ARE CHANNELED OR DAMAGE OVER TIME. granted there is one or 2 that are instant such as javelin which of course costs an incredible amount of resources and hits like a wad of wet kleenex. lets take a look.

- biting jabs or puncturing sweep - channeled - 1.1 secs for 4 hits. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge through you, side step, back up, block, or CC you SINCE YOU ARE COMPLETELY OPEN TO ANY ATTACK WHILE CASTING THIS. Not to mention the other player gets a full cc immunity for a .5 sec knock back.
*this skill should have the same immunity as wrecking blow and have a lower cast time. .5 secs instead of 1.1

-spear shards - instant - but has an arc travel time so its close to .3 or .4 secs for initial damage to be done. the damage on initial hit is 2 - 2.5k then the other player has to stand in it which the area is only 8 meters for them to take the dot. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge, side step, or back up. Most people will just hold block and move back so your chances of striking someone with this ability over and over is low because of the arc travel time and small DOT radius.

-Sun shield and its morphs - Now completely useless. 15% of my max health as a shield for 6 secs? please just remove this skill completely from game because now it seems like your just laughing at us. not one single person is gonna slot this. skill destroyed.

-vampires bane and reflective light - instant - with travel time - initial blast is to low and damage over time is to low. not to mention the dot can easily be removed or soaked up by a damage shield.

-Solar flare and morph - channeled - 1.1 sec cast time - also has a high arc travel time so it can be close to 2 secs or more before any damage is done. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. due to the high arc travel time this skill is avoided 99% of the time. Who's idea was it to give these skills high arc paths? its just awful. The instant cast version of this has damage so low it makes you laugh.

-backlash - instant - but it has a 6 sec build up time which can be removed or mitigated so no damage is even done.

-eclipse - instant - however its cc breakable and cannot be applied to ANYONE who is under cc immunity. ANYONE WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW WILL INSTANTLY CC BREAK THIS FOR THE IMMUNITY - there is no instant damage so it gives people a free immunity going in to a fight for some stamina.

-Radiant Destruction - the skill there has been soooo much crying over. lets break it down. 1. you have to be low health, under 20% for the bonus effect to kick in. even then the damage IS SPREAD OUT OVER 3.4 SECS. mine on pts does 9443. lets do the math 9443 / 3.4 secs = 2777 damage per second which is then cut by 50% for IC which is now 1388 per second. LOL 1,388 DAMAGE PER SECOND! - NOT TO MENTION IS CAN BE INTERRUPTED, CLEANSED, RANGED, BUBBLED AND LEAVES YOU OPEN THE ENTIRE TIME TO BE CC'D OR ATTACKED. with all the heal stacking that will be going on people are going to be insta healing to 75 - 100% health or bubbling or my favorite spamming cloak. So to get someone to 20% health with these mechanics AND awful templar dps is going to be very very hard.

lets look at the healing, the meat of what makes the templar class.

1. rushed ceremony and morphs - a good skill - that is if your lucky enough for it to be applied to you. even then it requires you stop dps in order to cast it. a superior skill is hardened ward where the sorcerer can stack magicka and spell damage into it have a huge bubble and can continue with full cannon dps.

2. healing ritual and morphs - the cast time is way to long and leaves you open to be interrupted, and cc'd

3. restoring aura and morphs - the +20% buff does not apply to magicka only health and stamina. the repentance morph requires dead bodies for it to work. npcs that are dead vanish very fast so you have to be johnny on the spot with this.

4. cleansing ritual and morphs - good cleanse skill heal over time is a little low for a burst damage game.

5. rune focus and morphs - used to be a good skill now you have to stay within the small area to gain the magicka or healing buff. the area itself is small.

On top of all this we have no speed buff, no escape, no aoe cc, bad regen, sub par passives, and little to no instant dps skills.

MY SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENTS IN ORDER OF IMPORTANCE TO ME.

1. there needs to be a hierarchy in your smart healing system. it should go self>group>everyone else. the way it is seriously nerfs the core of our class.

2. puncturing sweep and morphs should have same immunity as wrecking blow and be .5 sec to cast. even dropping the 4th hit with the knock back will do if thats whats needed to make the change. I'm also not sure why this skill works differently with burning light. the proc chance is much lower then 25% which i'm sure is by design. please revert whatever changes you made to it.

3.changes to ultimates need to happen - i'd make the dot damage from NOVA an instant cast explosion that comes from the player and does aoe damage and reduces enemy player damage by 15%. 20k aoe damage (scaled with moderate spell or weapon power) with 15 meter radius and 15% enemy reduced damage seems fair for 240 ultimate. seeing is how dawn breaker, dragon leap, and overcharge already do similar damage. with dawn breaker and overcharge being much more cheaper. the way it is now, as much as you want them to, no one is gonna stand in your nova.

4.make repentance a toggle skill that automatically takes the essences from killed npcs and players.

5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.

6.Eclipse being cast on self not on target.

7.make spear shards an aoe root or stun. similar to talons.

8. scale sun shield with spell damage and max magicka and extend the time to 20 secs.

I welcome to any feedback anyone else has concerning this breakdown. but before you comment please ask yourself.
do I have a v14 templar?
have I experienced all game content?
Do i understand that Imperial city is a pvp update?

Just to put my 10 cents on the matter.
in the current PTS build me and a friend of mine were having alot of dueling and build testings. I rolled a templar 3-4 times to test it and failed miserably to put a fight against my NB friend , tho my DK was literally Obliterating him.
so my friend got tiered of loosing to my DK-uppercut monster, and rolled a test Templar.

Imperial - with high HP and Stamina, Gliffed with Prismatic Gliffs , godlike regenaration and heavy armor 2h/s&b
the friend was mostly unkillable with capability to do both DPS and Take punishment.

With proper skill combo my buddy was able to surpass the NB DPS using his 2h hammer, and save himself or my (in teamfight) from a certain death in a matter of 2 seconds.

after some dueling i rolled my DK in same faction as him and we went off to fight others , wining nearly every battle ( unless boss came and mobs just swarmed us).
at some point the 2 of us encountered 4 Bananas and engaged them , immediately 3 smurfs came along and joined the fight.

after some time the 2 enemy factions started focusing fire on me and my templar pet, resulting in them breaking against us.
and 2 classes THAT ARE CURRENTLY CRYING ON FORUMS ( Templar and DK ) managed to Obliterate 7 enemy players....

the Templar is preforming VERY well if built and used properly.

what pisses me off tho , is that all u guys who rolled a Templar knew that his role was a support , while DK is a fighter, NB is a sin and sorc is well.... a sorc......

The Main job of a templar in PvP or PvE was to heal and buff, ultimately playing as a support for the group. wich he does well.......

i personaly find it irritating that people complain about DPS on a support class....its NOT YOUR JOB.
people cant cry that NB does 30% more dmg than a Templar , knowing that NB was built to damage.....

ESO gave us the Option to be what ever we want , 1 class can go all 3. Tank , DPS , support.
but every class is better at his own field......

and whining that a class designed to be strong at support is Slacking on DPS behind a sin....well , no **** sherlock......

basicaly , i am sorry but if you find that Templar is somewhat Behind other classes , you are doing it wrong , a good Templar will

1. rushed ceremony will also heal 2 other targets and most likely you will be one of them. my buddy never had a problem self healing while in a fight , you can always use rally or Vigor for a 100% sure heal on self , OR use healing Ritual.
2. healing ritual is also working properly , because he can get a player from 10% HP to 100% in 2 shots... Learn to position youreself and use this skill while under protection from a teammate.
3. Restoring aura is amazing as a buff. anough said.
4. cleansing ritual... see YOU DID IT WRONG AGAIN!!! you cry about the heal... while its an almost FREE purify skill , with a HoT AND boost to any healing you do.....
5. rune focus still lets you have the defence out of the rune , while the STAY-INSIDE mechanic is Justified considering you get 200 mana every seonds , summing up to 400 mana regen.....thats ALOT....


now THIS MADE ME LAUGH....
5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.
FOR REAL?!?! you want your support templar to be on par with a MAGE when it comes to ranged DPS.....?? see my point? thats stupid.....!!!!!!!!

eclipse is amazing , its forcing enemy to dump stamina , and if u learn to time it right , sorcs will have a bad day....
same goes to Swallow soul NB mages.....

Spear shards are also fine , its a ranged stun , with some DPS , AND can be picked up by a teammate to gain stamina back....its HUGE , and again , ITS SUPPORT!!!!!!!!!!!

Sun shield is not 10k shield anymore, but its anough to withstand an uppercut , time it properly now , l2p , instead of spamming it non stop to be unkillable like on live.

basicaly.... sorry but everything OP said is rubbish. nonsense and a L2P issue. i dont care how long you play a templar , but u failed to recognize the calss for his intended role , and try to make him what he is not , failing miserably....ither reroll to DK or NB , or start using Templar properly , and u will be fine.

wow.....there is so much failure in this post I'm struggling to know where to begin......

1. PTS for NA is a template right now. your choices are only from a set list of items, armor, glyphs, weapons, etc etc. your skills are not maxed out like they are once characters on pts goes live. and most of all people are testing other builds and characters that have not been optimized yet with gear, weapons, enchants, potions that they will actually use when it hits live. That right there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE. of course you are gonna win some fights in this manner.

2. in your entire rant you say absolutely nothing about the skills your friend is using to make him "mostly unkillable" you only admit to your own failure (which is funny) at rolling a templar.

3. LOL templar is only a support class. you have not a SINGLE CLUE what your talking about. you think that because we have breath of life and spear shards we are now a dedicated "support" class? WHAT A JOKE!

- EVERY SINGLE CLASS CAN GIVE THE SAME EXACT "SUPPORT" USING A MASTER RESTORATION STAFF AND RESTO SKILLS. using just these 2 things they can heal AND return stamina AND give a damage buff (something a templar skill line doesn't have) AND bubble both the wounded and player (ALSO something a templar doesn't have)

-DKS have green dragon blood which gives 33% health returned AND increases health AND stamina regen.
-SORCS have hardened ward which gives a bubble EQUAL TO IF NOT MORE then a heal from breath of life.
-NB's can use funnel health to heal not only themselves BUT 2 OTHER ALLYS FOR 25% OF DAMAGE DONE EVERY 2 SECS.

so why aren't these classes considered "support"? instead each one gets to enjoy a DIFFERENT VARIETY OF INSTANT DPS SKILLS, ESCAPES, AOE ROOTS, BUBBLES, MOVEMENT BUFFS AND HUGE DPS.

4. YEAH IT MADE ME LAUGH TOO. SORCS GET HARDENED WARD WHICH GIVES A BUBBLE EQUAL TO IF NOT GREATER THEN A SELF HEAL FROM BREATH OF LIFE. NOT TO MENTION YOUR "MAGE" CAN ALSO DO THE EXACT SAME SUPPORT AS ME. SO YEAH I THINK THIS SUGGESTION ISNT TO MUCH TO ASK. SEE MY POINT? THATS STUPID...!!!

5.lolol yea l2p now that we can't use sun shield. seeing as how classes have skills equal to sunshield that were not nerfed like it was.
- DK - has reflective scales
- sorc has hardened ward
- nb has dark cloak.


basically....of course your gonna come in here trying to say its all rubbish. you have noy a single clue or idea what your talking about. not to mention, ironically, you failed to successfully play a templar. luckily, everyone who actually plays a templar knows what I'm talking about and simply sees your post as the rantings of troll.

1. my toon is maxed on skills and everything on live , so the only thing that differ me from PTS is about 50 CP and 1 set of armor ( one of the new ones)
2. my friend is using 1st bar : jabs , crit rush , executioner , rally and unknown. 2nd bar , spear shards , ceremony , aura , cereony and focus. ultimates are sweep and healing.
3. YES silly, templar has the biggest utility arsenal hands down , he has build in Purify , BUILD IN Regen buff , BUILD IN mass heal etc.... yes , he was made with SUPPORT in mind. sallow soul is *** of a heal , the sorc Bubble is SELF bubble and he cant support anyone , Master resto staff is not a build in mechanic of a class , so dont even bring it up here. and DK GDB is SELF HEAL also ,

SO I GUESS TEMPLAR IS THE ONLY CLASS WITH A BUILT IN BIG-INSTA-HEAL , BUFF FOR REGENS and CLEANS IN THE GAME

5. you cant play for *** can you? how exacly a sorc will pull you out of a near-death state? put a bubble on you? my DK cracks them Open in 1 -2 shots , and new armor set called SHIELD BRAKER will *** you under those bubbles , while Templar can HEAL , remember that BUBBLE is NOT a HEAL.

Reflective scales is only good for 4s against ranged , will NOT save you from anything because its only 4 shots.
Hardened ward , melts under shield breaker and Uppercuts , they are not even worth mentioning atm.
NB Dark Cloak , yeah 3s of inv , still cant get too far on foot.
while HEAL IS A HEAL. templar wins.

but leave that aside , you are yelling that Teplar is not a support but all you have as an argument is proof that other classes are EGOISTS. SELF heals , SELF bubbles , STEALTH....PROVING ME RIGHT as a templar is a SUPPORT CLASS!!!

noob.

serjomalekrwb17_ESO

on a side not , alot of people are yelling that Templars dont have an escape skill....
as a DK i dont remember having one ither......weird , why dont i see so much Whining from DKs on that matter?

david.haypreub18_ESO

serjomalekrwb17_ESO wrote: »

3. Restoring aura is amazing as a buff. anough said.

LOL, do you even know how this skill works? You know the active effect doesn't stack with potions, right? If you are using a potion it is literally worthless.

david.haypreub18_ESO

serjomalekrwb17_ESO wrote: »

on a side not , alot of people are yelling that Templars dont have an escape skill....
as a DK i dont remember having one ither......weird , why dont i see so much Whining from DKs on that matter?

Here you go, straight from the PTS:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/209686/dk-relief#latest

And then more from the PTS:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/210182/dk-needs-a-love-long#latest

Vatter

serjomalekrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

serjomalekrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Vatter wrote: »

I've played a templar ever since beta stress testing was done.

I've played all builds. all different types of game play. When I rolled the character for live I chose a high elf templar because of the focus on magicka.

As everyone knows, the templar has been consistently the worst class to play in ESO. There have been multiple surveys that confirm this by other players.

Our DPS is last on the list. Even though we can put up some decent numbers, it is, still in fact, last place.
For PVE DPS it goes DK, NB, Sorc, Temp.
For PVP DPS it goes NB, Sorc, DK, Temp.
Now a lot of players who have never played a templar before generally come on the forums yelling about RADIANT DESTRUCTION this or BREATH OF LIFE that and BITING JABS this or BLAZING SHIELD that and these are generally the talking points people use to say the class is fine. But lets take a look at these.

1. Breath of Life and Honor the Dead - This is the number one argument people like to use on why they should get their healing buffed or why templars are a "good" class. What they don't know about is something called the "Smart Healing System" that ZOS has embedded in their code. Basically, when I hit BOL or HTD, the heal will go to the lowest health person in the range of the spell. So what that means is you are NEVER guaranteed to heal yourself unlike other classes unless you are out of range of other faction players. Other classes can stack up healing buffs through CP, mundus, Gear and Restoration staff abilities and are 100% guaranteed a self heal (in most cases 75%-90% of their total health bar is returned) in 1 or 2 instant casts.

How many times as a templar healer have you been in Cyrodill near a keep under siege with other players (whether in group or out of group) OR in a group for that matter going against another group, you get hit by siege or other players AOE's and are being drained of health fast, you try to heal your self using your "OP" class heal only to heal the dopes that are not even in your group who like to stand in siege fire or right in the middle of the opposing zerg and not cleansing, healing or moving themselves and you die? for me, its happened hundreds and hundreds of times.

So all of the sudden my "OP" class heal becomes a "maybe if I feel like it" heal. Here's an example you can try on your own. take you and a friend somewhere with an npc. Have your friend have only have 16 or 18k health and you 25-30k. you aggro the npc and let them hit you. as long as your health stays above your friends every heal you do will go to him instead of you even though he is at 100% health. try it.

This is a huge buff for night blades and sorcerers who have escape skills and shield (sorc) because of this they generally stack everything into spell and weapon power and have the lowest health in cyrodiil and because its usually group vs group they get all the heals. letting them survive longer until the templar is dead. then, when they are about to be overcome simply hit vanish or streak and live to fight on. the templar has to rez and horse it back to group. it's insane.

2. DPS - Another big problem with Templars is our dps skills. ALL OF THEM THAT ACTUALLY DO DAMAGE ARE CHANNELED OR DAMAGE OVER TIME. granted there is one or 2 that are instant such as javelin which of course costs an incredible amount of resources and hits like a wad of wet kleenex. lets take a look.

- biting jabs or puncturing sweep - channeled - 1.1 secs for 4 hits. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge through you, side step, back up, block, or CC you SINCE YOU ARE COMPLETELY OPEN TO ANY ATTACK WHILE CASTING THIS. Not to mention the other player gets a full cc immunity for a .5 sec knock back.
*this skill should have the same immunity as wrecking blow and have a lower cast time. .5 secs instead of 1.1

-spear shards - instant - but has an arc travel time so its close to .3 or .4 secs for initial damage to be done. the damage on initial hit is 2 - 2.5k then the other player has to stand in it which the area is only 8 meters for them to take the dot. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. they can simply roll dodge, side step, or back up. Most people will just hold block and move back so your chances of striking someone with this ability over and over is low because of the arc travel time and small DOT radius.

-Sun shield and its morphs - Now completely useless. 15% of my max health as a shield for 6 secs? please just remove this skill completely from game because now it seems like your just laughing at us. not one single person is gonna slot this. skill destroyed.

-vampires bane and reflective light - instant - with travel time - initial blast is to low and damage over time is to low. not to mention the dot can easily be removed or soaked up by a damage shield.

-Solar flare and morph - channeled - 1.1 sec cast time - also has a high arc travel time so it can be close to 2 secs or more before any damage is done. ANY PLAYER WHO IS NOT ABSOLUTELY BRAND NEW TO GAME IS NOT GONNA SIT THERE AND TAKE THIS. due to the high arc travel time this skill is avoided 99% of the time. Who's idea was it to give these skills high arc paths? its just awful. The instant cast version of this has damage so low it makes you laugh.

-backlash - instant - but it has a 6 sec build up time which can be removed or mitigated so no damage is even done.

-eclipse - instant - however its cc breakable and cannot be applied to ANYONE who is under cc immunity. ANYONE WHO IS NOT BRAND NEW WILL INSTANTLY CC BREAK THIS FOR THE IMMUNITY - there is no instant damage so it gives people a free immunity going in to a fight for some stamina.

-Radiant Destruction - the skill there has been soooo much crying over. lets break it down. 1. you have to be low health, under 20% for the bonus effect to kick in. even then the damage IS SPREAD OUT OVER 3.4 SECS. mine on pts does 9443. lets do the math 9443 / 3.4 secs = 2777 damage per second which is then cut by 50% for IC which is now 1388 per second. LOL 1,388 DAMAGE PER SECOND! - NOT TO MENTION IS CAN BE INTERRUPTED, CLEANSED, RANGED, BUBBLED AND LEAVES YOU OPEN THE ENTIRE TIME TO BE CC'D OR ATTACKED. with all the heal stacking that will be going on people are going to be insta healing to 75 - 100% health or bubbling or my favorite spamming cloak. So to get someone to 20% health with these mechanics AND awful templar dps is going to be very very hard.

lets look at the healing, the meat of what makes the templar class.

1. rushed ceremony and morphs - a good skill - that is if your lucky enough for it to be applied to you. even then it requires you stop dps in order to cast it. a superior skill is hardened ward where the sorcerer can stack magicka and spell damage into it have a huge bubble and can continue with full cannon dps.

2. healing ritual and morphs - the cast time is way to long and leaves you open to be interrupted, and cc'd

3. restoring aura and morphs - the +20% buff does not apply to magicka only health and stamina. the repentance morph requires dead bodies for it to work. npcs that are dead vanish very fast so you have to be johnny on the spot with this.

4. cleansing ritual and morphs - good cleanse skill heal over time is a little low for a burst damage game.

5. rune focus and morphs - used to be a good skill now you have to stay within the small area to gain the magicka or healing buff. the area itself is small.

On top of all this we have no speed buff, no escape, no aoe cc, bad regen, sub par passives, and little to no instant dps skills.

MY SUGGESTIONS FOR IMPROVEMENTS IN ORDER OF IMPORTANCE TO ME.

1. there needs to be a hierarchy in your smart healing system. it should go self>group>everyone else. the way it is seriously nerfs the core of our class.

2. puncturing sweep and morphs should have same immunity as wrecking blow and be .5 sec to cast. even dropping the 4th hit with the knock back will do if thats whats needed to make the change. I'm also not sure why this skill works differently with burning light. the proc chance is much lower then 25% which i'm sure is by design. please revert whatever changes you made to it.

3.changes to ultimates need to happen - i'd make the dot damage from NOVA an instant cast explosion that comes from the player and does aoe damage and reduces enemy player damage by 15%. 20k aoe damage (scaled with moderate spell or weapon power) with 15 meter radius and 15% enemy reduced damage seems fair for 240 ultimate. seeing is how dawn breaker, dragon leap, and overcharge already do similar damage. with dawn breaker and overcharge being much more cheaper. the way it is now, as much as you want them to, no one is gonna stand in your nova.

4.make repentance a toggle skill that automatically takes the essences from killed npcs and players.

5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.

6.Eclipse being cast on self not on target.

7.make spear shards an aoe root or stun. similar to talons.

8. scale sun shield with spell damage and max magicka and extend the time to 20 secs.

I welcome to any feedback anyone else has concerning this breakdown. but before you comment please ask yourself.
do I have a v14 templar?
have I experienced all game content?
Do i understand that Imperial city is a pvp update?

Just to put my 10 cents on the matter.
in the current PTS build me and a friend of mine were having alot of dueling and build testings. I rolled a templar 3-4 times to test it and failed miserably to put a fight against my NB friend , tho my DK was literally Obliterating him.
so my friend got tiered of loosing to my DK-uppercut monster, and rolled a test Templar.

Imperial - with high HP and Stamina, Gliffed with Prismatic Gliffs , godlike regenaration and heavy armor 2h/s&b
the friend was mostly unkillable with capability to do both DPS and Take punishment.

With proper skill combo my buddy was able to surpass the NB DPS using his 2h hammer, and save himself or my (in teamfight) from a certain death in a matter of 2 seconds.

after some dueling i rolled my DK in same faction as him and we went off to fight others , wining nearly every battle ( unless boss came and mobs just swarmed us).
at some point the 2 of us encountered 4 Bananas and engaged them , immediately 3 smurfs came along and joined the fight.

after some time the 2 enemy factions started focusing fire on me and my templar pet, resulting in them breaking against us.
and 2 classes THAT ARE CURRENTLY CRYING ON FORUMS ( Templar and DK ) managed to Obliterate 7 enemy players....

the Templar is preforming VERY well if built and used properly.

what pisses me off tho , is that all u guys who rolled a Templar knew that his role was a support , while DK is a fighter, NB is a sin and sorc is well.... a sorc......

The Main job of a templar in PvP or PvE was to heal and buff, ultimately playing as a support for the group. wich he does well.......

i personaly find it irritating that people complain about DPS on a support class....its NOT YOUR JOB.
people cant cry that NB does 30% more dmg than a Templar , knowing that NB was built to damage.....

ESO gave us the Option to be what ever we want , 1 class can go all 3. Tank , DPS , support.
but every class is better at his own field......

and whining that a class designed to be strong at support is Slacking on DPS behind a sin....well , no **** sherlock......

basicaly , i am sorry but if you find that Templar is somewhat Behind other classes , you are doing it wrong , a good Templar will

1. rushed ceremony will also heal 2 other targets and most likely you will be one of them. my buddy never had a problem self healing while in a fight , you can always use rally or Vigor for a 100% sure heal on self , OR use healing Ritual.
2. healing ritual is also working properly , because he can get a player from 10% HP to 100% in 2 shots... Learn to position youreself and use this skill while under protection from a teammate.
3. Restoring aura is amazing as a buff. anough said.
4. cleansing ritual... see YOU DID IT WRONG AGAIN!!! you cry about the heal... while its an almost FREE purify skill , with a HoT AND boost to any healing you do.....
5. rune focus still lets you have the defence out of the rune , while the STAY-INSIDE mechanic is Justified considering you get 200 mana every seonds , summing up to 400 mana regen.....thats ALOT....


now THIS MADE ME LAUGH....
5.Solar flare being thrown instead of heaved(straight flight time instead of high arc) . put it on par with crystal fragments in terms of speed and cast time and damage. keep the de-buff and no insta cast proc chance.
FOR REAL?!?! you want your support templar to be on par with a MAGE when it comes to ranged DPS.....?? see my point? thats stupid.....!!!!!!!!

eclipse is amazing , its forcing enemy to dump stamina , and if u learn to time it right , sorcs will have a bad day....
same goes to Swallow soul NB mages.....

Spear shards are also fine , its a ranged stun , with some DPS , AND can be picked up by a teammate to gain stamina back....its HUGE , and again , ITS SUPPORT!!!!!!!!!!!

Sun shield is not 10k shield anymore, but its anough to withstand an uppercut , time it properly now , l2p , instead of spamming it non stop to be unkillable like on live.

basicaly.... sorry but everything OP said is rubbish. nonsense and a L2P issue. i dont care how long you play a templar , but u failed to recognize the calss for his intended role , and try to make him what he is not , failing miserably....ither reroll to DK or NB , or start using Templar properly , and u will be fine.

wow.....there is so much failure in this post I'm struggling to know where to begin......

1. PTS for NA is a template right now. your choices are only from a set list of items, armor, glyphs, weapons, etc etc. your skills are not maxed out like they are once characters on pts goes live. and most of all people are testing other builds and characters that have not been optimized yet with gear, weapons, enchants, potions that they will actually use when it hits live. That right there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE. of course you are gonna win some fights in this manner.

2. in your entire rant you say absolutely nothing about the skills your friend is using to make him "mostly unkillable" you only admit to your own failure (which is funny) at rolling a templar.

3. LOL templar is only a support class. you have not a SINGLE CLUE what your talking about. you think that because we have breath of life and spear shards we are now a dedicated "support" class? WHAT A JOKE!

- EVERY SINGLE CLASS CAN GIVE THE SAME EXACT "SUPPORT" USING A MASTER RESTORATION STAFF AND RESTO SKILLS. using just these 2 things they can heal AND return stamina AND give a damage buff (something a templar skill line doesn't have) AND bubble both the wounded and player (ALSO something a templar doesn't have)

-DKS have green dragon blood which gives 33% health returned AND increases health AND stamina regen.
-SORCS have hardened ward which gives a bubble EQUAL TO IF NOT MORE then a heal from breath of life.
-NB's can use funnel health to heal not only themselves BUT 2 OTHER ALLYS FOR 25% OF DAMAGE DONE EVERY 2 SECS.

so why aren't these classes considered "support"? instead each one gets to enjoy a DIFFERENT VARIETY OF INSTANT DPS SKILLS, ESCAPES, AOE ROOTS, BUBBLES, MOVEMENT BUFFS AND HUGE DPS.

4. YEAH IT MADE ME LAUGH TOO. SORCS GET HARDENED WARD WHICH GIVES A BUBBLE EQUAL TO IF NOT GREATER THEN A SELF HEAL FROM BREATH OF LIFE. NOT TO MENTION YOUR "MAGE" CAN ALSO DO THE EXACT SAME SUPPORT AS ME. SO YEAH I THINK THIS SUGGESTION ISNT TO MUCH TO ASK. SEE MY POINT? THATS STUPID...!!!

5.lolol yea l2p now that we can't use sun shield. seeing as how classes have skills equal to sunshield that were not nerfed like it was.
- DK - has reflective scales
- sorc has hardened ward
- nb has dark cloak.


basically....of course your gonna come in here trying to say its all rubbish. you have noy a single clue or idea what your talking about. not to mention, ironically, you failed to successfully play a templar. luckily, everyone who actually plays a templar knows what I'm talking about and simply sees your post as the rantings of troll.

1. my toon is maxed on skills and everything on live , so the only thing that differ me from PTS is about 50 CP and 1 set of armor ( one of the new ones)
2. my friend is using 1st bar : jabs , crit rush , executioner , rally and unknown. 2nd bar , spear shards , ceremony , aura , cereony and focus. ultimates are sweep and healing.
3. YES silly, templar has the biggest utility arsenal hands down , he has build in Purify , BUILD IN Regen buff , BUILD IN mass heal etc.... yes , he was made with SUPPORT in mind. sallow soul is *** of a heal , the sorc Bubble is SELF bubble and he cant support anyone , Master resto staff is not a build in mechanic of a class , so dont even bring it up here. and DK GDB is SELF HEAL also ,

SO I GUESS TEMPLAR IS THE ONLY CLASS WITH A BUILT IN BIG-INSTA-HEAL , BUFF FOR REGENS and CLEANS IN THE GAME

5. you cant play for *** can you? how exacly a sorc will pull you out of a near-death state? put a bubble on you? my DK cracks them Open in 1 -2 shots , and new armor set called SHIELD BRAKER will *** you under those bubbles , while Templar can HEAL , remember that BUBBLE is NOT a HEAL.

Reflective scales is only good for 4s against ranged , will NOT save you from anything because its only 4 shots.
Hardened ward , melts under shield breaker and Uppercuts , they are not even worth mentioning atm.
NB Dark Cloak , yeah 3s of inv , still cant get too far on foot.
while HEAL IS A HEAL. templar wins.

but leave that aside , you are yelling that Teplar is not a support but all you have as an argument is proof that other classes are EGOISTS. SELF heals , SELF bubbles , STEALTH....PROVING ME RIGHT as a templar is a SUPPORT CLASS!!!

noob.

- not sure what your toon has to do with anything. your friend was the one who supposedly is the templar king. remember?
- your friend is not using stamina and also doing massive group heals. this just shows again you have not a clue what your talking about.
- everyone has purge ability so saying templars can build around purify is again showing you have no clue
- the regen buff requires DEAD PLAYERS OR NPCS AND THE OTHER MORPH IS ONLY 20% STAMINA AND HEALTH AND DOESNT STACK WITH POTIONS.
- AGAIN....ALLL CLASSES HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR MASS HEALING. learn to read.
- a sorc can use ward ally to not only bubble you BUT ALSO himself. you know...the skill with the +300% strength on low health targets. oh thats you have no clue.
- sheild breaker already has been countered. but you don't have a clue about that.
- reflective scales is spammable and absolutely WILL save you
- hardened ward is spammable. are seriously saying that a sorc just sat there and took your uppercuts? they are gonna streak all over you spamming curse then firing off shards when proc'd. get real dude.
- dark cloak mixed with double take or path is the best escape in the game at the moment and can get you out of range within milli secs.
- a heal is not a heal since you templars are never guaranteed a heal with smart healing system. learn to read.

wow. just wow. its insane the incredible lack of knowledge shown for the templar. I can't figure out why you are so adamant against templars when you don't even play one. I'm guessing on live your were once killed by a templar on your dk. how that is even possible is beyond me. please troll somewhere else. your posts are pointless.

Speely

As a Templar, I feel that we are a very versatile class that requires different play styles to excel at, for which I am thankful because the trend of just giving everyone the same capabilities with different skill names does nothing for build diversity. I DO wish we had Flashes back instead of Jesus Beam (I am in the minority here, but I don't think we needed a class-based execute... I think we needed MORE support and CC, as this is supposed to be an AVA game, not an arena PvP smasher, and our support capabilities used to be better.)

Perfect? No, but I feel like it is THE best-designed and balanced class and probably a good model to use when weighing the strengths and weaknesses of other classes. You don't hear people complaining about Temps being OP much, but if you look, you'll notice they are actually doing quite well when people play to the class rather than trying to use it like they would a Sorcerer or NB.

Anazasi

They could have achieved the same impact by addressing the passives of dawns wrath line and keeping blinding flashes. RD was added to solve the DPS issue Templar had pre 1.5 when all they really needed was adjust the travel time of abilities and increase the dos a little.

Now however, we are facing in 1.7 some serious issues with abilities that just have no use in pvp. Honestly I do believe that Templar will be ok it will take a while to tune your play style. But don't worry, by the time the die hard Templar with more than 120 hours played on character get settled ZOS will agree the class needs a make over and change everything. Maybe they will get it right the second time around or perhaps they will add a new class that better.

I can say the bench marks for what magic Templars will need post 1.7 have been identified so lets see what happens.

Septimus_Magna

Kas wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Meanwhile Spyhper is wrecking people in 1vX with his magicka templar on PTS. Biting Jabs spam supposed to be pretty strong on high spell dmg/magicka builds with the mutal benefit towards the strong templar heals. He also mentioned his build wasnt optimal because he didnt have the vamp skills and passives.

oh god... can we please stop jumping to conclusions from a few kills? I have been running builds for 20min or so that didn't work at all. so have other people. Whenever someone wins a 1v5 chances are, it's related to the builds the 5 are trying out and not the build the 1 is playing. besides, there are still terrible players in this game. However, the much bigger factor is people trying out stuff (new builds, classes they have 0 experience with, stam/mag switch). Don't take the outcome of a few fights as an indicator for balance...

Im taking his word for it, not a couple kills. He probably has played all classes on PTS and has a good idea where they all stand, so if he says magicka templars are really strong than I have no reason to doubt that. In the video you could see how fast health bars were dropping with his jabs spam, he also didnt seem to have trouble going from 30 to 100% health with very little efford. Good damage with good survivability makes a strong pvp class.

Kas

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Kas wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Meanwhile Spyhper is wrecking people in 1vX with his magicka templar on PTS. Biting Jabs spam supposed to be pretty strong on high spell dmg/magicka builds with the mutal benefit towards the strong templar heals. He also mentioned his build wasnt optimal because he didnt have the vamp skills and passives.

oh god... can we please stop jumping to conclusions from a few kills? I have been running builds for 20min or so that didn't work at all. so have other people. Whenever someone wins a 1v5 chances are, it's related to the builds the 5 are trying out and not the build the 1 is playing. besides, there are still terrible players in this game. However, the much bigger factor is people trying out stuff (new builds, classes they have 0 experience with, stam/mag switch). Don't take the outcome of a few fights as an indicator for balance...

Im taking his word for it, not a couple kills. He probably has played all classes on PTS and has a good idea where they all stand, so if he says magicka templars are really strong than I have no reason to doubt that. In the video you could see how fast health bars were dropping with his jabs spam, he also didnt seem to have trouble going from 30 to 100% health with very little efford. Good damage with good survivability makes a strong pvp class.

i bet he'll play NB in 1.7. Imho actions should be taken over words. i don't want to join the "templar broken" crytrain. imho the whole everything-cut-in-half thing is really a big chance for templars. however, I have doubts that anyone has played enough pts and consistently against enemy players of consistent strength to draw real conclusion on classes he doesn't even main.

Rook_Master

Templar is perfectly balanced, I got killed by Jesus Beam that one time.

AfkNinja

If you are objectively reviewing the Templar class as a whole, I am talking both Stamina and Magicka, and are comparing class SKILLS vs other class SKILLS there is no way you can say Templar is fine. More Templar skills are flat out broken than any other class, our reflect is the only one that can fail to work at ALL if the player has CC immunity, which Templars give out like candy. Looks at the skills, compare how they function for the same role vs other classes. Templar underperforms, to top it off we have no mobility and no PASSIVES for resource regen. Templar should not be the only class with no passive form of resource regeneration. We should not be FORCED to go Vampire for this and mobility. Dragon Knight also needs a ton of Love. The whole point of Elder Scrolls has always been play as you want, Templar should be able to function in all roles just like every class should. Please keep balancing all the classes until every class is balanced in all three roles of DPS/Healer/Tank both Stamina and Magicka.

P.S. please stop nerfing Radiant Destruction and just take it away, fix our passives and broken skills. Give us back Blinding flashes or something else instead of RD. RD is just holding us back, giving everyone an excuse to ignore us.

BugCollector

Still no buffs...

BugCollector

@ZOS_GinaBruno Will we finally get all our buffs we asked for when the DLC releases?

Kaliki

BugCollector wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno Will we finally get all our buffs we asked for when the DLC releases?

Of course we will (get the same treatment since the Templar dev discusstion dating June 2014).

My new Templar builds for PvE damage and healing are using up to 3 Templar abilities distributed over two bars. (But only need 1, which is Puncturing Sweep for dmg and BoL for healing).

Templars must be great if they don't need to slot more than 1 class ability to perform well.