There are definately macro users

k2blader

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Darlgon wrote: »

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Legit question - are macro's against the rules in ESO?

Only if you can afk and run them, if I remember the last official word. So, if you are at your KB and hitting a macro, ZoS doesnt care.

This is what I'm wondering.. have ZOS said anything officially on it?

TheBull wrote: »

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Legit question - are macro's against the rules in ESO?

They wont help you. The system doesn't work that way.

Well, I don't think that's entirely true.. for example, it takes my sorc on 250-300 ping on average 4 seconds to rotate to my back bar and apply healing, hardened and harness and get back to my front bar to continue the fight. I know a guy who tested this same rotation using a macro and it took <1 second. Fairly major difference.


If it's against the rules that's fine, but if it isn't then in the interest of fairness I think everyone should know about it.

Interesting. I read threads where people are like, "sorcs can stack shields while dealing out insane DPS," and I'm always thinking, "I can't.." Never really contemplated people could be using macros for shields.

SkylarkAU

k2blader wrote: »

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Darlgon wrote: »

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Legit question - are macro's against the rules in ESO?

Only if you can afk and run them, if I remember the last official word. So, if you are at your KB and hitting a macro, ZoS doesnt care.

This is what I'm wondering.. have ZOS said anything officially on it?

TheBull wrote: »

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Legit question - are macro's against the rules in ESO?

They wont help you. The system doesn't work that way.

Well, I don't think that's entirely true.. for example, it takes my sorc on 250-300 ping on average 4 seconds to rotate to my back bar and apply healing, hardened and harness and get back to my front bar to continue the fight. I know a guy who tested this same rotation using a macro and it took <1 second. Fairly major difference.


If it's against the rules that's fine, but if it isn't then in the interest of fairness I think everyone should know about it.

Interesting. I read threads where people are like, "sorcs can stack shields while dealing out insane DPS," and I'm always thinking, "I can't.." Never really contemplated people could be using macros for shields.

That's an extra 3 seconds of dps, 20k+ damage potentially if things are going your way..

Same thing applies to any class though, DK with igneous shield + green dragons blood + hardened armor, vampires using healing ward + mist form, and so on..

Offensive macro's aside, saving time on defense equates to a direct increase to dps.

ZOS has gotta bring some clarity on this @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_GinaBruno

sadownik

k2blader wrote: »

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Darlgon wrote: »

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Legit question - are macro's against the rules in ESO?

Only if you can afk and run them, if I remember the last official word. So, if you are at your KB and hitting a macro, ZoS doesnt care.

This is what I'm wondering.. have ZOS said anything officially on it?

TheBull wrote: »

SkylarkAU wrote: »

Legit question - are macro's against the rules in ESO?

They wont help you. The system doesn't work that way.

Well, I don't think that's entirely true.. for example, it takes my sorc on 250-300 ping on average 4 seconds to rotate to my back bar and apply healing, hardened and harness and get back to my front bar to continue the fight. I know a guy who tested this same rotation using a macro and it took <1 second. Fairly major difference.


If it's against the rules that's fine, but if it isn't then in the interest of fairness I think everyone should know about it.

Interesting. I read threads where people are like, "sorcs can stack shields while dealing out insane DPS," and I'm always thinking, "I can't.." Never really contemplated people could be using macros for shields.

When i still was logging in to try get some decent pvp i had a very interesting chat with the guy on nb that was killing me in a second. After i said i couldnt be as good as him because i simply cant execute so many skills in so short time - his/her answer - "well learn to macro haha its new l2p "

Ofc its anegdotical and i might just made up this myself, but have you seen that thread lately, where one of the best pvp players was showing video how nimcrux bug is getting him, while clearly using at least 2 of the most common exploits himself.

BRogueNZ

<not really serious>

Seeing as its acceptable perhaps make 'Cancel Ability Animations' a toggle in options

If macro's are acceptable also, provide us with an interface to create our own in game ya know like that other game

</not really serious >

Leandor

Reading some prominent names in this thread and what they say, I start to agree with @Lava_Croft...

QuadroTony

im using bow build in pvp
so i cant use macroses for it right?

masrocess usefull only in close fights

sadownik

QuadroTony wrote: »

im using bow build in pvp
so i cant use macroses for it right?

masrocess usefull only in close fights

I dont see how you cant use them. Bow is exactly the same as all other weapons. And no it also works in ranged combat too.

Tankqull

CrowsDescend wrote: »

Woah. I'm so glad I'm not on PC for ESO then, because I know what you mean... macro-fests.

just for u

http://www.razerzone.com/gaming-controllers

in case you did´nt understand the small hint - macroing is as easily possible on consoles as it is on PCs

gjmgamesub17_ESO wrote: »

PC no longer master race?

Just kidding, but this is definitely a perk for me on ps4, macro's aren't possible afaik.

wrong see above...

QuadroTony

sadownik wrote: »

QuadroTony wrote: »

im using bow build in pvp
so i cant use macroses for it right?

masrocess usefull only in close fights

I dont see how you cant use them. Bow is exactly the same as all other weapons. And no it also works in ranged combat too.

i think macroses have most advantage with meele weapons

for my build i need one shotted players with two snipes
and i cant macroin it to use two snipes in half second - global cooldown you know

pppontus

I still don't get it, I have never never never never ever ever ever ever seen one of these threads come with any sort of proof or even the slightest indication that it would ever be possible to cast abilities any faster with macros than without? Out of the 1 gazillion people who have to cry CHEAT whenever they lose, why hasn't a single one of you stepped up to record a video of your superspeed attacking with a macro just to show that it's possible?

I've been playing this game since it launched in PvP and PvE and I've never even seen an indication that a macro would be particularly bad, I would never use one but sure, I've heard of people who use macros to dodge roll in between every attack and sure - it's cheesy as ***.. but all you people who pretend that someone did 95 hits on you in one second - I'm sorry you either just sucked too bad, your computer froze or the game lagged to *** which it does all the time anyway.

You wouldn't believe how many of these threads I've asked for just some sort of indication that it's not all just made up in your heads about "macro spammers" or whatever, I never get it.. why? Why isn't it ever proven? Hm...... think for yourself.

You can animation cancel the *** much you want, you still won't be casting another ability within the "GCD"

Tankqull

pppontus wrote: »

I still don't get it, I have never never never never ever ever ever ever seen one of these threads come with any sort of proof or even the slightest indication that it would ever be possible to cast abilities any faster with macros than without? Out of the 1 gazillion people who have to cry CHEAT whenever they lose, why hasn't a single one of you stepped up to record a video of your superspeed attacking with a macro just to show that it's possible?

well i´m playing games for 20 years now i would call myself quite good at pushing key/mousebuttoms in a certain rotation to achieve maximum profit, none the less i´m at a 80-180ms in between two keykliicks (depending on my daily form). with a macro depending on your gaming device you can push this down to 1ms so i would be winning essentially 300ms - otherplayers have a way worse coordination and could win easily up to one second when macroing light+ulti+attack+bash for an innitial alpha strike e.g, or a simpler light+skill+bash. not to mention that alot of abilities have tied their effect to the end of the animation wich in can completly deny the spell effect thx to latancy issues on your opponent.

the advantage is there and it gets more advantagous the "weaker" the player is using it. [otherwise there would have never been any development into that direction]

Waylander

Macros undoubtedly offer an advantage

I think Zos remains fairly silent or refers to TOS as they may find it hard to prove.

I would welcome the removal of macros and a firm stance from Zos.

kevlarto_ESO

Macro's, animation canceling, broken exploitable game mechanics, like the multi dawnbreaker hit, broken sharpened trait, no caps on magika, stamina, giving way to infinite whatever's tie all these things together and there you go, everything from instajibing to just plain out right cheating, and I know the cheaters try to justify it by saying everyone is using them, and no everyone is not, some people buy a game to play it and have fun in the way the developers intended just because you can do something does not mean you should do something..:) Willa have to wait and see how things play out, once all the updates are in on the pts.

I think two ESO lives back they had an animation person on, and the last question Gina ask him was about animation canceling he said there are changes coming and he could not go into details at this time, crossing fingers they are doing away with it or if you cancel an animation you do not get full damage, cancel the animation at 50% you get 50% damage not full damage, no one knows at this time...

Armitas

@ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_GinaBruno

Rich, Gina, the macro question has been asked for years with people quoting mods saying yes and mods saying no. Is there any way you could use your powers of persuasion to get this permanently answered on the Knowledge Base section of the support section of the website? I have been here since beta and this question has never been answered to the satisfaction of my doubt because it's always answered differently.

Specifically it should cover

• Use of gaming mice and keyboards as is
• Use of gaming mice and keyboards and the accompanying software using performance macros
• Use of stand alone software to perform performance macros
• Use of botting programs (we know the answer to this but it should be in the knowledge base)
• If there are any specific performance macros that would be in violation list them
• See thread in case anyone adds something I failed to list

In short just be as detailed and specific as possible to finally put this question to rest

pppontus

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

I still don't get it, I have never never never never ever ever ever ever seen one of these threads come with any sort of proof or even the slightest indication that it would ever be possible to cast abilities any faster with macros than without? Out of the 1 gazillion people who have to cry CHEAT whenever they lose, why hasn't a single one of you stepped up to record a video of your superspeed attacking with a macro just to show that it's possible?

well i´m playing games for 20 years now i would call myself quite good at pushing key/mousebuttoms in a certain rotation to achieve maximum profit, none the less i´m at a 80-180ms in between two keykliicks (depending on my daily form). with a macro depending on your gaming device you can push this down to 1ms so i would be winning essentially 300ms - otherplayers have a way worse coordination and could win easily up to one second when macroing light+ulti+attack+bash for an innitial alpha strike e.g, or a simpler light+skill+bash. not to mention that alot of abilities have tied their effect to the end of the animation wich in can completly deny the spell effect thx to latancy issues on your opponent.

the advantage is there and it gets more advantagous the "weaker" the player is using it. [otherwise there would have never been any development into that direction]

I get that, but 180ms between klicks still leaves you with loads and loads and loads of deadtime in between every "animation cycle". Sure, they can do LA+skill+bash with a macro slightly faster than you can.. but they still can't do their next LA or their next skill or their next bash any faster. Additionally, where are these people who actually do LA+skill+bash? That never happens to me and who in their right mind would waste stamina on a non-interrupting bash for 500dmg?

No, I'm pretty sure to convince people that this is advantageous and not just QQ because someone lost a fight, it needs to be proven how macros supposedly would benefit you. I just don't see anyone possibly being able to create a macro especially in PvP that will be anything more than say dodging between every attack, which could potentially be beneficial but also potentially pretty stupid..

All I know for sure is, my PvP performance would be much worse however I tried to make a macro compared to what it is having a human being execute the correct actions depending on the situation.. and having followed these threads for a year now, I'm 100% convinced that everyone accusing people of "macroing" is nothing but a giant crybaby with no understanding of game mechanics. So many threads have come and gone over all these months, and proof has been supplied in exactly 0 cases.

Sykis

People report all kinds of things. Anyone who has reported knows ZOS will tell you they can not release the determination details to you. ZOS has to find proof that's the reported person is macroing and that can only be done if the macro is done from an addon in game. If the player is using hardware macros ZOS is unable to know if the person is macroing or just pressing the sequence of buttons really fast. Many gaming keyboards allow for macros to be programmed in. So the only way for ZOS to prove the player is macroing is in game data from addons or the player admitting to it. If ZOS bans or suspends someone for using a macro and that person files a lawsuit ZOS has to prove how they determined the macro was used.

Akavir_Sentinel

While I don't doubt there are macro users out there, you don't have to use a macro to hit someone with multiple attacks in a short period of time. I don't use macro's and I can hit you with 5 attacks in 1 second simply by pressing a single button. Let me give you an example of this.

Affliction Set [Disease Damage]
Dominion's Bow [1000 Unresistible Damage]
Heavy Attack
Poison Injection
Camouflaged Hunter

So, by simply stealthing, drawing back for a heavy attack, and releasing it with Poison Injection, I can hit you with 5 attacks in 1 second. You will get hit with Camouflaged Hunter, Unresistible Damage, Heavy Attack, Poison Injection, and Affliction all at the same time, no macro needed.

TequilaFire

There are macro users in every game, since the advent of gaming keyboards with them built in and modded console controllers.
Most might even say there doing nothing wrong, after all major companies like Microsoft and Razer sell them right? smh

QuadroTony

i wont be sick with "tunnel syndrome" one day
so if i see in any game there is a behavious where you must press the same combination of keys over and over - i writing macro for it
win win

Tankqull

pppontus wrote: »

So many threads have come and gone over all these months, and proof has been supplied in exactly 0 cases.

but you cant prove some one is wearing seducer or any other non "obvious set" when fiighting them as a player as well - and saying they don´t just because you cant prove it is not that clever

the advantage provided by macros are small(and can if done wrong be more of a nuisance) but they are existing. and they definatly don´t do wonders for you.

Emma_Overload

pppontus wrote: »

I still don't get it, I have never never never never ever ever ever ever seen one of these threads come with any sort of proof or even the slightest indication that it would ever be possible to cast abilities any faster with macros than without? Out of the 1 gazillion people who have to cry CHEAT whenever they lose, why hasn't a single one of you stepped up to record a video of your superspeed attacking with a macro just to show that it's possible?

I've been playing this game since it launched in PvP and PvE and I've never even seen an indication that a macro would be particularly bad, I would never use one but sure, I've heard of people who use macros to dodge roll in between every attack and sure - it's cheesy as ***.. but all you people who pretend that someone did 95 hits on you in one second - I'm sorry you either just sucked too bad, your computer froze or the game lagged to *** which it does all the time anyway.

You wouldn't believe how many of these threads I've asked for just some sort of indication that it's not all just made up in your heads about "macro spammers" or whatever, I never get it.. why? Why isn't it ever proven? Hm...... think for yourself.

You can animation cancel the *** much you want, you still won't be casting another ability within the "GCD"

Agreed. While I have no doubt players are using macros, I also know for a fact that the claims of 6 attacks being macro'd in 1 second are totally false. Since ESO launched, I've only seen ONE instance where you could fire consecutive attacks faster than intended (with a bow), and ZOS hotfixed that bug/exploit within a day.

SanderBuraas

pppontus wrote: »

Macros can't bypass the global cooldown. Is there really anyone who can't execute all possible actions within the global cooldown already? If so, L2 do that yourself, absolutely don't need a macro and 99,99% of all players you're accusing of macroing aren't.

This. You can not bypass the duration it takes to use a skill, even with animation canceling. A human can do what a macro can in this game.

timidobserver

It is a waste of time to make something against the rules that they can't easily detect or prevent.

pppontus

Tankqull wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

So many threads have come and gone over all these months, and proof has been supplied in exactly 0 cases.

but you cant prove some one is wearing seducer or any other non "obvious set" when fiighting them as a player as well - and saying they don´t just because you cant prove it is not that clever

the advantage provided by macros are small(and can if done wrong be more of a nuisance) but they are existing. and they definatly don´t do wonders for you.

What I was mostly trying to hint at was from the "macroing" side, i.e. out of all the hundreds of people who have come out and screamed about macro spammers and cheaters - you'd think one of them ever tried to create a macro to see exactly how it actually worked? Even recorded it, shared it here, etc. like all other exploits/bugs/unintended mechanics before that.. they end up here, but this one only comes with hearsay from someone who died from 1000 soul harvests in one second from one guy who was level 28

Dahkoht

No problem with social macro's or targetting "calling out X target macros"


Any macros that are for actual combat button presses are the crutch for the weak who can't think for themselves or press buttons fast enough. And yes , if you use a combat macro it means you aren't good enough to do it without it.

Nothing more enjoying that killing a combat macro user , knowing even with his crutch he still can't beat you.

Not referring to this game only , any game. Rift was notorious for this , it became evident too , as you'd see fools using the exact same abilities and rotations every time , then wreck them because they didn't know how to adjust on their own.

Sadishist

One of the advantages to having console is not dealing with this at all.

Rebornlogic

well why wouldn't macroing be bannable. it is a script of code after all? and what do bots use, a script of code. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/1827438#Comment_1827438
do most macros outside combat affect gameplay? no. but they do make a huge difference inside combat. i have used macros on other game's FPS normally , macro clicking .067ms repeatedly with a semi automatic gun? and make it shoot faster then a smg does that seem really "fair" to you? when all you have to do is hold a button and aim. even in a MMO there is a huge diffrence when using macro's. thats what they were intended for right? automated actions that your either to lazy to do yourself, or its just not possible

FriedEggSandwich

iamnotweakrwb17_ESO wrote: »

pppontus wrote: »

Macros can't bypass the global cooldown. Is there really anyone who can't execute all possible actions within the global cooldown already? If so, L2 do that yourself, absolutely don't need a macro and 99,99% of all players you're accusing of macroing aren't.

There are NO global cooldowns in eso. Abilities work via animation duration, hence why animation cancelling is so prevalent. You are getting off 2 or less commonly 3 abilities in the duration you are "meant" to get off 1 because the animations are being cancelled. Macroing or scripting abilities together is easy as pie especially for classes with extended range and it most certainly yields a pretty heavy advantage over players who are not doing it.

The fact is that if Zenimax got rid of animation cancelling, macroing would be rather pointless. Then they simply need to adjust the system so that casting light or heavy attacks periodically yields a distinct advantage. ie bleeds the target, causes your next ability to do increase damage, lowers resistances, boosts spell damage for x number of seconds, etc, etc.

There are 3 global cooldowns for attacks afaik; skills, weapon attacks and ultimates. It's not possible to fire off skills faster than the gcd allows, *even with animation cancelling*, but you can overlap the gcds to get multiple attacks off quickly. Surprise attack, surprise attack, surprise attack isn't possible in under a second, neither is light attack, light attack, light attack, because they have their own gcds. But light attack, surprise attack, dawnbreaker is possible to fire off in under a second because they use separate gcds. There are obvious limitations to this though such as ultimate generation; you can't cycle LA, SA, DB cos you have to wait for DB to recharge.

*edit*

FriedEggSandwich

One more thing; zos can't remove animation cancelling while there are "instant cast" abilities in the game, of which there are a lot.

AzraelKrieg

Stop necro'ing old threads for the sake of Talos.