Glass Motif Ridiculousness

Epona222

Faulgor wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Being hard to get is one thing.

Being IMPOSSIBLE to get because RNG will keep giving you same chapter/motif over and over again without ability to trade it off (only raw glass shards from chests are tradeable).

People WILL BE screwed over by RNG.

All chapters/frags of glass motif must be tradeable.

The patch notes don't mention the pages being bound. Hope they aren't.

I thought the pages were tradable, and chapters were tradable. The raw style mat is tradable. The only thing that isn't tradable is when you turn 10 of the raw style mat into 1 of the refined style mats - that refined style mat isn't tradable. Not sure why, but I am a bit dubious about it. Probably lined up as a crown store purchase or something

starkerealm

Faulgor wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Being hard to get is one thing.

Being IMPOSSIBLE to get because RNG will keep giving you same chapter/motif over and over again without ability to trade it off (only raw glass shards from chests are tradeable).

People WILL BE screwed over by RNG.

All chapters/frags of glass motif must be tradeable.

The patch notes don't mention the pages being bound. Hope they aren't.

Yeah, I'm not seeing anything about stuff being bound here, except for the Malachite itself:

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Glass Style Motif
The secrets to crafting Glass arms and armor have begun to be revealed!

• You can learn to craft in the Glass style by finding the Chapters or the Book for it. These Chapters have been torn into unreadable Fragments by the ravages of time and travel, but can occasionally be found slipped into the Writ rewards for Blacksmiths, Clothiers, and Woodworkers.
• Once you’ve gathered ten Fragments, you can reconstitute them into a readable Chapter (or, if you’re exceptionally lucky, the whole Book) with some Merethic Restorative Resin.
  • This Resin is sold by Mystics around the world for a hefty price.
• You must be Rank 10 in the Metalworking, Tailoring, or Woodworking passives to understand the style’s intricacies and learn it permanently.
• You’ll also need some Malachite to actually craft an item in the Glass style.
  • Malachite Shards can be found in Treasure Chests around the world. Chests with more durable and difficult locks are more likely to contain them, but the chests that require a Treasure Map to find have the best chance by a wide margin.
  • Once you’ve collected ten Malachite Shards, you can refine them into a single chunk of Malachite at any equipment crafting bench, but know that this will bind the Malachite to your account, making it untradeable.
• Once you know the style and have the materials, you can craft Glass gear at any equipment crafting bench.

I get what that's about. They want Malachite to (effectively) stack to 20, instead of 200, so that it's harder to stockpile. Which is still annoying when they could just, you know, set it to stack to 20 instead of 200.

Rinmaethodain

"Malachite Shards can be found in Treasure Chests around the world. Chests with more durable and difficult locks are more likely to contain them, but the chests that require a Treasure Map to find have the best chance by a wide margin."

Now i see why people could datamine crown store treasure map packs.

Lionxoft

Just gonna say this once but your character has chicken pox. Might want to get that looked at.

Epona222

MaximusDargus wrote: »

"Malachite Shards can be found in Treasure Chests around the world. Chests with more durable and difficult locks are more likely to contain them, but the chests that require a Treasure Map to find have the best chance by a wide margin."

Now i see why people could datamine crown store treasure map packs.

Pretty sure Crown Store treasure maps are the same as the Collector's Edition treasure maps that I got for buying the CE - they only contain gear.

Also no-one needed to datamine them, we already knew they existed - are you are sure you are using the right word?

Rinmaethodain

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/201152/data-mining-new-loading-screens-and-crown-store-items-from-2-1-0/p1

http://elderscrolls.net/media/2015/07/gp_cwrn_collectible_treasuremapdominion_1x1.jpg
http://elderscrolls.net/media/2015/07/gp_cwrn_collectible_treasuremapcovenant_1x1.jpg
http://elderscrolls.net/media/2015/07/gp_cwrn_collectible_treasuremapcoldharbour_1x1.jpg


They might be the old CE treasure map packs but now they might be sold separately outside Adventure pack (without guar and any race any alliance) for the sole purpose of malachite crown farming.

Turelus

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

It seems all the new motifs, and mats are set up to be so difficult to collect, that people will have to buy them in the crown store.

This is a good business model for them though, as they need the money for the game to continue.

I kind of like how absurd this motif is, I would rather it not be in the Crown Store and this was truly a grand quest for the crafters who want to offer something very few can.

Additionally I don't think the gold cost is that high, look at the money some players have and how fast you can in theory make said gold these days from some mob grinding, nirn-farming or such.

I think the game needs some items which are once again damn hard to get, so players have goals they can work towards, those who don't want to invest the time but have the RL cash can skip ahead with Crown Items. I have the money, but would rather achieve it as a long term goal.

daemonios

WHY is the refined mat bound? Since anyone can refine the raw material, and the raw material is NOT bound, this seems like a stupid, arbitrary limitation to trading. I never sell raw materials in the guild stores, for instance, since I like to refine them myself for the chance at getting resins. And when I want materials for crafting, I always buy the refined ones. This seems like ZOS trolling us, to be honest...

As for the motif... I can understand they want to make them rare, but seriously? What is this, a Korean MMO grind-fest? I hated the mechanic for getting the Dwemer motif, but still got it in like a week. Same for the Psijic Ambrosia. I really can't stand chapters any more! Just make the glass motif a rare drop from the end-bosses of the new veteran dungeons, for crying out loud! Unless, like others have pointed out, ZOS are really only setting things up to put the motif in the crown store...

I don't think this is what crafting needs at this time. I hope at least the new crafted sets are going to be worth making, but even there ZOS has done a 360 and buffed dropped sets to be as powerful as crafted ones (I believe they once said crafted end-game sets would be better than drops). The only advantage of crafted sets right now is the greater ability to mix and match different slots and traits, but even then most classes are running with dropped sets because of better bonuses.

Rev Rielle

daemonios wrote: »

WHY is the refined mat bound? Since anyone can refine the raw material, and the raw material is NOT bound, this seems like a stupid, arbitrary limitation to trading. I never sell raw materials in the guild stores, for instance, since I like to refine them myself for the chance at getting resins. And when I want materials for crafting, I always buy the refined ones. This seems like ZOS trolling us, to be honest...

As for the motif... I can understand they want to make them rare, but seriously? What is this, a Korean MMO grind-fest? I hated the mechanic for getting the Dwemer motif, but still got it in like a week. Same for the Psijic Ambrosia. I really can't stand chapters any more! Just make the glass motif a rare drop from the end-bosses of the new veteran dungeons, for crying out loud! Unless, like others have pointed out, ZOS are really only setting things up to put the motif in the crown store...

I don't think this is what crafting needs at this time. I hope at least the new crafted sets are going to be worth making, but even there ZOS has done a 360 and buffed dropped sets to be as powerful as crafted ones (I believe they once said crafted end-game sets would be better than drops). The only advantage of crafted sets right now is the greater ability to mix and match different slots and traits, but even then most classes are running with dropped sets because of better bonuses.

I agree. Personally I think no item should be bound, but that's another issue.
It's just an old, out-dated mechanic. And often, it feels, the results of poor in-game economic planning, or knee-jerk reactions to fears.

In relation to Glass Armour though, it is entirely cosmetic in the game - and I'm not entirely sure it looks all that great. So I think it's probably best to put this one in the 'long term' MMO goal basket, and just let it tick over whilst playing and enjoying other aspects of the game. For if one tried to focus on it - due to the current mechanics in place for acquiring the full motif - I think it would drive most to utter frustration, and then away from playing the game entirely.

ewhite106b16_ESO

Glass motif will take a long time to get but IMO special armor appearences and other cosmetics are a good long term achievement for players who enjoy that sort of content.

SorataArisugawa

ewhite106b16_ESO wrote: »

Glass motif will take a long time to get but IMO special armor appearences and other cosmetics are a good long term achievement for players who enjoy that sort of content.

^This

But I have to say: We need a possibility to change the style of a weapon/armor. We need a lot of time to find the new motifes and get everything togehter, but in the end, we can use it for like 2 Setpieces (or less). We get 23 new sets but only 3 are craftable...

@ZOS_GinaBruno Pls ask the defs, if we can get a way for the crafters to change the style of a weapon/armor. It could be something material expensive as well and should just work like that way, that you switch the style of e.g. a light should piece in a style of a other light shoulder piece, you could craft.

They way it is now, the new motives are a wast, because most parts you will wear are from dropsets...

Pls Gina help!!!

starkerealm

MaximusDargus wrote: »

"Malachite Shards can be found in Treasure Chests around the world. Chests with more durable and difficult locks are more likely to contain them, but the chests that require a Treasure Map to find have the best chance by a wide margin."

Now i see why people could datamine crown store treasure map packs.

Yeah, those are part of the any race/any alliance pack. So you can already buy them. But, only once.

We'll see when 1.7 hits, but those might not actually be as valuable as you'd hoped... actually, I'm going to check that right now on PTS.

Elsonso

Jakhajay wrote: »

tplink3r1 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

tplink3r1 wrote: »

25k? thats cheap.

That doesn't get you the book. It gets you your third copy of the boots chapter.

I know, and it still looks cheap to me.
Unless all you do is stand in RawlKha spamming abilities, 25k is REALLY easy to make.

Not if you only get to play for an hour a day...

For people like you, there will be the Crown Store.

For there to be a convenience in the Crown Store, there has to be an inconvenience in the game. The more inconvenient it is, the cheaper the price appears to be in the Crown Store.

pdebie64b16_ESO

Jakhajay wrote: »

I've started doing writs on the PTS to try and tease out a drop rate on the fragment pieces. Not enough testing yet to hazard a guess (currently one 1 frag in 3 writs), but one thing I did notice was the frankly stupid price of the restorative resin. 25k!



So not only do you have to chase down an absurd number of fragment pieces, but you have to pay 25k for a chapter, or some unknown chance of getting the whole motif!

What. The. F***

I predict the glass motif will be in the Crown store by year end

Price is so high because that npc needs the gold to cure his acne vulgaris.

starkerealm

starkerealm wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

"Malachite Shards can be found in Treasure Chests around the world. Chests with more durable and difficult locks are more likely to contain them, but the chests that require a Treasure Map to find have the best chance by a wide margin."

Now i see why people could datamine crown store treasure map packs.

Yeah, those are part of the any race/any alliance pack. So you can already buy them. But, only once.

We'll see when 1.7 hits, but those might not actually be as valuable as you'd hoped... actually, I'm going to check that right now on PTS.

Okay, it's not exhaustive, but if those crown store treasure maps are the same packs as the Preorder bonus maps then you don't have anything to worry about there.

I just burned a bunch of those on the PTS.

They contain 4 blues, one green, and some gold. That's up from 2 blues and a green on 1.6. So they are more valuable than before.

No malachite shards.

I cracked two normal treasure maps (on a VR1, in non-VR zones), and got a malachite shard from each treasure map consumed. Keep in mind, those are normal, non-Crown Store maps that I pulled off monsters, out of chests, or wherever, on the live server.

So... not as much to worry about with the way of Pay to Win with those packs.

EQBallzz

Turelus wrote: »

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

It seems all the new motifs, and mats are set up to be so difficult to collect, that people will have to buy them in the crown store.

This is a good business model for them though, as they need the money for the game to continue.

I kind of like how absurd this motif is, I would rather it not be in the Crown Store and this was truly a grand quest for the crafters who want to offer something very few can.

Additionally I don't think the gold cost is that high, look at the money some players have and how fast you can in theory make said gold these days from some mob grinding, nirn-farming or such.

I think the game needs some items which are once again damn hard to get, so players have goals they can work towards, those who don't want to invest the time but have the RL cash can skip ahead with Crown Items. I have the money, but would rather achieve it as a long term goal.

Is it really a "grand quest" if people can just buy it on the crown store? I guess I could see the absurdity of this process if the rewards were something few would have but it severely cheapens the experience if it ends up people can just buy their way to the end with a crown store purchase. I get they need to make money but they need to not design the content in such a way that the game becomes a PITA without crown store purchases. It's manipulative, predatory and not good game design IMO. Maybe that's not how it's going to go but it sort of looks that way with how this is being set up and based on the previous motifs going on the store.

Dracane

Couldn't I just create 6 characters, do the 3 daily writs with them to have a chance to get Glass thingy things. And after that, I delete them and create new ones ?

starkerealm

Dracane wrote: »

Couldn't I just create 6 characters, do the 3 daily writs with them to have a chance to get Glass thingy things. And after that, I delete them and create new ones ?

No, because you're limited to 3 deletions, and you only regenerate one of those per day. Also because the writs that actually pay out with glass are going to (probably) require craglorn turnins... which... hey, if you can get six charters from level 3 to craglorn in an afternoon... then holy crap, man. I'd be impressed.

Dracane

starkerealm wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Couldn't I just create 6 characters, do the 3 daily writs with them to have a chance to get Glass thingy things. And after that, I delete them and create new ones ?

No, because you're limited to 3 deletions, and you only regenerate one of those per day. Also because the writs that actually pay out with glass are going to (probably) require craglorn turnins... which... hey, if you can get six charters from level 3 to craglorn in an afternoon... then holy crap, man. I'd be impressed.

Is it hard to get to craglorn ? Couldn't I just port there ?
But they said, porting to players is no longer possible in 1.7, so probably not.

Rinmaethodain

Dracane wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Couldn't I just create 6 characters, do the 3 daily writs with them to have a chance to get Glass thingy things. And after that, I delete them and create new ones ?

No, because you're limited to 3 deletions, and you only regenerate one of those per day. Also because the writs that actually pay out with glass are going to (probably) require craglorn turnins... which... hey, if you can get six charters from level 3 to craglorn in an afternoon... then holy crap, man. I'd be impressed.

Is it hard to get to craglorn ? Couldn't I just port there ?
But they said, porting to players is no longer possible in 1.7, so probably not.

You can get to craglorn only if you are at least VR1

starkerealm

Dracane wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Couldn't I just create 6 characters, do the 3 daily writs with them to have a chance to get Glass thingy things. And after that, I delete them and create new ones ?

No, because you're limited to 3 deletions, and you only regenerate one of those per day. Also because the writs that actually pay out with glass are going to (probably) require craglorn turnins... which... hey, if you can get six charters from level 3 to craglorn in an afternoon... then holy crap, man. I'd be impressed.

Is it hard to get to craglorn ? Couldn't I just port there ?
But they said, porting to players is no longer possible in 1.7, so probably not.

There are some places you can't port to unless you've unlocked them.

Craglorn requires Vet 1.

Cadwell's silver zones require you to have completed the main quest.

Cadwell's gold zones require you to have completed Cadwell's silver.

So even if you see someone on your friends list or in your guild roster, you can't go there until you actually meet the requirements.

Also, you can't control which writ tier you pick up. You probably need the new Tier 10 or maybe the current cap tier 9 writs to get those fragments. I'm guessing, but based on prior experience, it IS a reasonable assumption. Which in turn requires that you have a character with 45 (or 50) points in that crafting tree, and they need to spend 9 (or 10) skill points in that line, minimum. Which is a bit more work than you'd want to do for a quick run and dump.

EQBallzz

Dracane wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Couldn't I just create 6 characters, do the 3 daily writs with them to have a chance to get Glass thingy things. And after that, I delete them and create new ones ?

No, because you're limited to 3 deletions, and you only regenerate one of those per day. Also because the writs that actually pay out with glass are going to (probably) require craglorn turnins... which... hey, if you can get six charters from level 3 to craglorn in an afternoon... then holy crap, man. I'd be impressed.

Is it hard to get to craglorn ? Couldn't I just port there ?
But they said, porting to players is no longer possible in 1.7, so probably not.

It's not a matter of getting to Craglorn. It's getting the skill maxed out so that the daily writ has you turn it in at the Craglorn location. If you do a level 1 (craft skill level not player level) writ the turn in is in the starting city. If you do a max level writ the turn in is in Craglorn.

SIN-X

LunaRae wrote: »

In addition to being merchant sold there should be VIABLE alternatives, such as

• Include chance in undaunted daily for resin to drop, in both normal and vet, increase chance for completing optional silver/gold difficulty
• Include TWO resin as quest rewards for completing MAJOR milestone content in IC, one in PvE and one in PvP
• Include chance of resin as campaign rewards in top 10% for leaderboards at end of campaigns.
• Include chance of resin as reward for completing trials

I think higher chance of drop for activities you can't grind out, like campaign reward and less chance for things you can grind like trials and to an extent undaunted daily.

lol yea right cause ppl don't farm campaigns.......

Xendyn

Could just be good luck, but I got a Shard out of the one random chest I picked in IC yesterday, so did the guy I was playing with. Might not be as bad as it seems...

AlnilamE

Well, people do complain that this game doesn't have enough gold sinks...

Cuyler

So if I'm getting this right it's:

10 fragments per chapter, with 14 chapters = 140 fragments to find
then
25k resin per 10 fragments to make a chapter so 14*25k= 350k gold
then
10 Malchite shards to make 1 chunk of Malchite

ZOS u

Elsonso

... or 5000 Crowns

Dreddnawt

Cuyler wrote: »

So if I'm getting this right it's:

10 fragments per chapter, with 14 chapters = 140 fragments to find
then
25k resin per 10 fragments to make a chapter so 14*25k= 350k gold
then
10 Malchite shards to make 1 chunk of Malchite

ZOS u

You forgot to mention these are all RARE drops that will only come from end game elite bosses in PvE 4 player quest dungeons or the new 4 player PvP delves.

So to be Glass crafters we need:
To farm out 420 unique, rare drop, items to make one set of new style gear;
AND
350k in gold sink to npc vendors for resins;
AND
the 350k cost of upgrade mats to make gold items;
AND
trait stones;
AND
the time it takes to grind a character to vet levels so they have skill points for each craft;
AND
the sheer mountain of time and effort it takes to level a dedicated crafter in each craft;
AND
the year plus to learn all the traits.........

All combines to a game breaking epic fail that will turn this game to crown store pay to win or offline for life.

Further info: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/202164/new-motifs-broken-glass-and-xivkyn

WhiteCoatSyndrome

And there's a level limit before you can start Writs period isn't there? Level 8 or so? So you couldn't just pop in with a new character and start them, you'd need to do at least a little questing/grinding to get to them too.

Pangnirtung

daemonios wrote: »

As for the motif... I can understand they want to make them rare, but seriously? What is this, a Korean MMO grind-fest? I hated the mechanic for getting the Dwemer motif, but still got it in like a week. Same for the Psijic Ambrosia. I really can't stand chapters any more! Just make the glass motif a rare drop from the end-bosses of the new veteran dungeons, for crying out loud! Unless, like others have pointed out, ZOS are really only setting things up to put the motif in the crown store...

Or it's a substitute for REAL content.

Instead of playing non-existent content players will grind and mine away. It's easier and quicker to add trinkets to the game and make them difficult to get than to create new quests and storylines. But does it really matter so many people seem to be in a rush to max out there character that it seems that very few actually read NPC dialog and follow the story.