How will we link items we want to sell on console?

NewBlacksmurf

@Mirra_Halfelven I do like the game and while I hold to my position I respect yours.
I disagree that being open minded somehow should cause me to agree that adding something that isn't required or needed but instead is a preference be OK as long as I can disable it.

Adding text chat is literally changing the communication to an extent that will drive very different behaviors. Behaviors that I've come to enjoy not being on console which for me, is why I buy and play certain games on PC and when available play those same games on console vs PC for the different experience. It also creates a divide and confuses the uses of the controller and the UI change from PC to console.

Again I respect your opinion and others but I passionately disagree that I'm not being open minded as I feel I've offered in a couple different ideas, work arounds and options in threads a few ideas to offset this. From experience playing MMO games in Xbox one and other massive multiplayer online games not considered an MMO, text chat isn't a positive feature for console.

Respectfully...adding text chat but being able to turn it off basically adds work for ZOS that only a portion will use. Then you'll have threads complaining why is the box on the console if we can turn if off this ignoring all text chat users.

The arguments about handicap and ease of trade and comfort around doing things similar to PC get confused because the feature is only for people who want to use this alienating those from the other population.
The goal is for Everyone to have the same experience and play together. It's not PC

you either do it and don't make it ignorable or you leave it off and do something else.
Lastly...you don't buy a console to use it like a PC for gaming and you don't buy a PC to use it like a console gaming. Let them stay apart as trying to create a cross platform experience without cross platform servers is a waste of development

Ojustaboo

uberkull wrote: »

Ojustaboo wrote: »

Agree with most of what's been said.

I suppose a way round would be a chat windows and we push a button on an item in our bag and we get the option to

Want to sell

So if we highlight "want to sell" we get asked how much, we enter 50g, press a button and it comes up in the chat windows that xyz wants to sell abc for 50g

but then there's got to be a way of responding

Problem with this is, there will be no chat window at all. And if you meant Chat Bubbles, you still had to enter in '50g' so that would mean some form of keyboard, on screen or USB. If there is that, might as well add a chat box that can be disabled.

I meant a chat windows for a global trade channel, chat bubbles would make the trade area too small.

and selecting "want to sell" would bring up a new on screen keyboard displaying 0 to 9 where you would use your controller to select the amount, for example moving pointer to 5, pressing button twice, you've selected 55g

But this is me thinking out loud for a way around their weird decision, personally I'm with you, give us a chat box

It's such an odd thing to not decide to put in, it's as though they want the game to get bad press, I simply don't get how they could possibly all sit around a meeting table and come to the conclusion that the lack of chat won't be catastrophic

Uberkull

Ojustaboo wrote: »

uberkull wrote: »

Ojustaboo wrote: »

Agree with most of what's been said.

I suppose a way round would be a chat windows and we push a button on an item in our bag and we get the option to

Want to sell

So if we highlight "want to sell" we get asked how much, we enter 50g, press a button and it comes up in the chat windows that xyz wants to sell abc for 50g

but then there's got to be a way of responding

Problem with this is, there will be no chat window at all. And if you meant Chat Bubbles, you still had to enter in '50g' so that would mean some form of keyboard, on screen or USB. If there is that, might as well add a chat box that can be disabled.

I meant a chat windows for a global trade channel, chat bubbles would make the trade area too small.

and selecting "want to sell" would bring up a new on screen keyboard displaying 0 to 9 where you would use your controller to select the amount, for example moving pointer to 5, pressing button twice, you've selected 55g

But this is me thinking out loud for a way around their weird decision, personally I'm with you, give us a chat box

It's such an odd thing to not decide to put in, it's as though they want the game to get bad press, I simply don't get how they could possibly all sit around a meeting table and come to the conclusion that the lack of chat won't be catastrophic

Understood. Yea, as soon as they add any form of a 'channel', it needs a place to show up, that's normally a chat box.

Zet-7

This problem sounds wonderful. I hope it becomes such a large problem that zos bails in and creates an AH.

Zazaaji

Huh.... anyone else having the problem of this thread in particular not re-bolding itself on the forum list when there's a new reply? It's making it difficult to tell if there's actually a new reply or not. Every other thread is working fine.

Audigy

Argoniawind wrote: »

Audigy wrote: »

I think that the consoles offers some type of voice program, don't they? So just stand on the market place and shout out loud what you have to offer. If you shout loudest, then maybe someone will find you among the hundreds of other people doing the same

Yes this is sarcasm

Also, every RPG in this world is played with mouse & keyboard, so not having that supported is a big problem. Have you already forgotten how problematic the UI was at Skyrim on consoles?

If for whatever reason you don't like the comfort of keyboard and mouse, but prefer to use 20 fingers until you get what you want from your inventory, be our all guest. However, please respect and tolerate that there are people in this gaming world who have indeed grown up with ES games and therefore want the same comfort as they always had.

You don't need to use mouse and keyboard or chat.

Wow I was a fan wayyyyyyyy before Skyrim, sorry I bought Morrowind on the Original xbox when it first came out!!!
Also then continue to play on the pc, that don't affect me

[Moderator Note: Removed moderated quote and response]

As I said, it was me being a bit sarcastic I believe Morrowind was released on Xbox in June 2002

What I wanted to point out however is the choice. I play MMOs only on PC, but I always turn of the chat as its never really used for anything than spam. But!

I would never demand that games remove chat, just because I find it disturbing. To show you this was the intention of my post.

Attorneyatlawl

To those complaining about how an optional chat box would take up screen space, just like a minimap option that has been long-demanded, it's a very basic tool and if you didn't want to see it, you could close it. Problem solved.

Zhoyzu

Valen_Byte wrote: »

ZOS_LenaicR wrote: »

Hey there,

We understand that sometimes topics can be heated, but we would like to remind everyone to not flame/troll one another.

We would like to gather your sentiment and thoughts, thereby we are leaving this thread opened.
Please stay respectful and constructive, even when disagreeing.

So I click on this thread to see the answer from ZO$....only to find nothing useful....

as usual

shame on ZoS for such bad practice. Take away ZoS things from the mods so they dont draw unnecessary attention to threads anymore with their useless warnings

Rosveen

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

To those complaining about how an optional chat box would take up screen space, just like a minimap option that has been long-demanded, it's a very basic tool and if you didn't want to see it, you could close it. Problem solved.

Will the hardcore fans burn me at the stake if I say I played Morrowind with a minimap...? Actually, it was resized full map because MW has awesome UI, unlike its successors.

Uberkull

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

To those complaining about how an optional chat box would take up screen space, just like a minimap option that has been long-demanded, it's a very basic tool and if you didn't want to see it, you could close it. Problem solved.

Yea...this has become the obvious, and smart answer. I think we are at the point where some that oppose the chat box have dug themselves in so far that they are just arguing to argue at this point.

The chat box was there in console as of Feb and confirmed by ZOS. Then is was pulled before beta in April. Chalk it up to decisions made by a select few in design and development at the last minute, they probably said to leadership to do it right they would need to delay the release. So that was nixed and they pulled chat altogether instead of giving us what they had and enhancing it later. It's not like this was a new invention for MMOs.

In no way is this a marketing decision cause it's obvious you're going to get a massive negative reaction from reviewers. And customers who don't even know a text chat won't be available. IMO they better put 'Voice chat only, no text chat' on the front of the box or as a massive disclaimer before you buy digital or you're going to get a ton of returns.

NewBlacksmurf

If you want a traditional MMO experience...stay on PC
Don't try and ruin the console version too for those who don't want a traditional MMO experience

We like the presentation so far and we agree with ZOS's logic and decisions around console so far.

As far as reviews...the console has gotten GREAT reviews so why change what's working. The people who are bothered by no text chat boxes are mostly PC traditional MMO players who favor keyboard use or those who assumed the presentation would be the same as PC

This preference isn't indicative of what console gamers want or what they feel is needed. It's definately not required on console.

Kildayen

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

If you want a traditional MMO experience...stay on PC
Don't try and ruin the console version too for those who don't want a traditional MMO experience

We like the presentation so far and we agree with ZOS's logic and decisions around console so far.

As far as reviews...the console has gotten GREAT reviews so why change what's working. The people who are bothered by no text chat boxes are mostly PC traditional MMO players who favor keyboard use or those who assumed the presentation would be the same as PC

This preference isn't indicative of what console gamers want or what they feel is needed. It's definately not required on console.

Who made you the official spokesperson for console players? lol...

Not everyone who prefers the console version feels the same as you, so your opinion is your own.

Uberkull

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

As far as reviews...the console has gotten GREAT reviews so why change what's working.

What reviews? The gane hasnt been released on console. No reputable game reviewer is reviewing the beta. That doesn't represent the gold product.

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

The people who are bothered by no text chat boxes are mostly PC traditional MMO players who favor keyboard use or those who assumed the presentation would be the same as PC

Or people with disabilities. You just don't get. 500 person guilds have many different types of people, and I would like to accommodate them all.

Uberkull

I'm not going to beat this drum, but I do care that we get the maximum possible community possible on console.

So if ZOS wants to keep inline, better make sure they get text chat back in quick...if it's in their plans at all.

Final Fantasy XIV Named Most Disability Accessible Game Of 2013

FFXIV - MMO. On console. With text chat that works with a USB keyboard.

NewBlacksmurf

@Rosveen and @Kildayen The comments are appropriate as I will remind others in this thread.
As I began placing feedback this is not just my opinions but others on Xbox One as well. I continue to get PM's on my xbox account and messages from those who cannot voice themselves on this thread as they did not buy the PC version of this game.

There is a much bigger voice outside of this small forum bubble which is dominated by a PC perspective right now.
I respect your opinions but that doesn't negate others who have opinions that are unable to voice them here. Its not just us who have opinions but are only allowed to post here because we own the game on PC.

This isn't a cross platform game

Romo

Strange..

Without a chat box, how do you ignore those annoying people you don't ever want to hear from again?

Uberkull

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

There is a much bigger voice outside of this small forum bubble which is dominated by a PC perspective right now.
I respect your opinions but that doesn't negate others who have opinions that are unable to voighost tce them here. Its not just us who have opinions but are only allowed to post here because we own the game on PC.

Yes, and that was pointed out to you with posts from other people on this forum which pointed out the numerous Reddit threads wanting text chat on console. You just keep making up things to support your opinion without applying rational thought to the issue.

Add a text chatbox back to th e console that you can turnoff. If its not a perfect implementation on release, just enhance it in a future patch. No different than the gawd awful looking for group tool in the pc game, its still there...hut could be enhanced.

Naivefanboi

Rosveen wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

To those complaining about how an optional chat box would take up screen space, just like a minimap option that has been long-demanded, it's a very basic tool and if you didn't want to see it, you could close it. Problem solved.

Will the hardcore fans burn me at the stake if I say I played Morrowind with a minimap...? Actually, it was resized full map because MW has awesome UI, unlike its successors.

lol cause morrowind was the first ES game? just kidding thats a joke. ES has been around since arena on pc.
still for the chat log! but horse is so dead its hard to care anymore lol.

Nerio

Easy solution to this problem, buy things from a guild trader. That's why the system exists. Without zone spam as a crutch, guild traders will become more valuable and more useful. It's exactly what happened with the group finder that so many are convinced doesn't work. It worked just fine when people used it during beta.

I feel like everyone has misplaced their outcry here. The majority of people complain that no text chat means it's going to be difficult to group with people or buy things, when there are already in-game systems for those. The focus should be more on things that don't have in-game systems, like guild recruitment. I'm not going to have to go to a website to find a dungeon group like I have to do when I play Destiny, but I will have to when I want to find a guild, or recruit for my guild.

Sylvyr

Teargrants wrote: »

Sounds like ZOS set themselves up the (failure) bomb.

Seriously an mmo without text chat is the most brain dead thing I've heard in a long long time.

It makes ZoSence.

Personally I'm torn. I want them to succeed, but like so many other things, they will do what makes sense to them for some wierd reason. And the other side of me wants to see them get facerolled for a good LOL.

NewBlacksmurf

Nerio wrote: »

Easy solution to this problem, buy things from a guild trader. That's why the system exists. Without zone spam as a crutch, guild traders will become more valuable and more useful. It's exactly what happened with the group finder that so many are convinced doesn't work. It worked just fine when people used it during beta.

I feel like everyone has misplaced their outcry here. The majority of people complain that no text chat means it's going to be difficult to group with people or buy things, when there are already in-game systems for those. The focus should be more on things that don't have in-game systems, like guild recruitment. I'm not going to have to go to a website to find a dungeon group like I have to do when I play Destiny, but I will have to when I want to find a guild, or recruit for my guild.

Exactly

:-) this just really will drive behaviors where people have opportunities and reasons to establish more friends and contacts which is what happens in Destiny and more often people will use the tools as you mention as well as beginning to play in small parties. the trading concerns dissapear as you meet more contacts, use guilds and the going to a website may work for some while others can just play and grow their networks.

Varicite

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

@Rosveen and @Kildayen The comments are appropriate as I will remind others in this thread.
As I began placing feedback this is not just my opinions but others on Xbox One as well. I continue to get PM's on my xbox account and messages from those who cannot voice themselves on this thread as they did not buy the PC version of this game.

There is a much bigger voice outside of this small forum bubble which is dominated by a PC perspective right now.
I respect your opinions but that doesn't negate others who have opinions that are unable to voice them here. Its not just us who have opinions but are only allowed to post here because we own the game on PC.

This isn't a cross platform game

Small forum bubble, huh? How many messages have you received?

Is it more than the tens of thousands of users in this "small forum bubble"? If not, then I'm going to go ahead and say that it's probably completely anecdotal.

Just like your opinion that text chat isn't necessary, even after this thread where you even went so far as to tell some posters that they were reading the "wrong comments" because I told them exactly what ZOS had already announced about the lack of text chat.

9 pages you argued w/ players about how they were somehow wrong for not simply believing in ZOS. Ha.

You keep perpetuating this "us and them" mentality for some reason, when most of the people who are interested in these features would just like the game to be more accessible for more potential players, some of whom enjoy TES games immensely, but prefer to type rather than be forced to constantly use voice chat.

And while "Then don't play it!" might seem like a perfectly valid option to you, to a company that has been hemorrhaging money for over a year now, it's probably not the most preferable solution. If they are smart, they will announce a plan to implement some of these sought-after features in the future.

After all, it effects literally nobody in a negative manner.

pecheckler

Nerio wrote: »

Easy solution to this problem, buy things from a guild trader. That's why the system exists. Without zone spam as a crutch, guild traders will become more valuable and more useful. It's exactly what happened with the group finder that so many are convinced doesn't work. It worked just fine when people used it during beta.

I feel like everyone has misplaced their outcry here. The majority of people complain that no text chat means it's going to be difficult to group with people or buy things, when there are already in-game systems for those. The focus should be more on things that don't have in-game systems, like guild recruitment. I'm not going to have to go to a website to find a dungeon group like I have to do when I play Destiny, but I will have to when I want to find a guild, or recruit for my guild.

50 sale slots per trader is not even close to enough to have that exclusively be the only means of trading. It would also leave no recourse for selling stuff to players in guilds which failed to land a good trader kiosk location.

KrisButtar

I have been thinking there are so many Pros/Cons with a text chat box and things that I don't think voice chat or emotes are able to do. If there was a text chat box I wouldn't want it like a normal one on PC, something that I would want would severely be limited to only linking items, X area boss is up, and a few other things. I wouldn't want the box but just show a line or 2 of text, that would remove most of the cons to having one and provide some necessary features needed but the text would only show if your in range.

So if your not close enough to the area boss, the line of text wouldn't appear to attack the boss, If your not in range of where people are linking items, the text showing the linked items won't appear. In PvP linking attack X position, defend X position, gather at X position but also they only have limited range where you only see the text when nearly to begin with. The option to look at the history would be a tab in the menu where you could scroll up and down if it fades to fast and also an option of how long it says visible on screen.

To link, my suggestion is pressing a certain button while the item is highlighted and linking map points would be pressing a certain button while your hovering over the icon on the map. The game would decide the attack/defend command simply based if its enemy/allied controlled icon in PvP as you would only be linking the position. It would use attack for the area bosses, dolmens, forts, etc

We don't need it to find groups as we have group finder. In no way do I think we should be able to text whatever we like in the box.

In the guilds/groups tab options they could have a text chat box for the guild/group and only the text sent would show in on the screen and fade for the members of the group/guild, again not having the text chat window.

Maybe this could be used as the start of a solution for getting the functions needed without having a chat box since I don't believe voice chat or emotes can cover all that is required. Let me know what everyone thinks

NewBlacksmurf

Varicite wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

@Rosveen and @Kildayen The comments are appropriate as I will remind others in this thread.
As I began placing feedback this is not just my opinions but others on Xbox One as well. I continue to get PM's on my xbox account and messages from those who cannot voice themselves on this thread as they did not buy the PC version of this game.

There is a much bigger voice outside of this small forum bubble which is dominated by a PC perspective right now.
I respect your opinions but that doesn't negate others who have opinions that are unable to voice them here. Its not just us who have opinions but are only allowed to post here because we own the game on PC.

This isn't a cross platform game

Small forum bubble, huh? How many messages have you received?

Is it more than the tens of thousands of users in this "small forum bubble"? If not, then I'm going to go ahead and say that it's probably completely anecdotal.

Just like your opinion that text chat isn't necessary, even after this thread where you even went so far as to tell some posters that they were reading the "wrong comments" because I told them exactly what ZOS had already announced about the lack of text chat.

9 pages you argued w/ players about how they were somehow wrong for not simply believing in ZOS. Ha.

You keep perpetuating this "us and them" mentality for some reason, when most of the people who are interested in these features would just like the game to be more accessible for more potential players, some of whom enjoy TES games immensely, but prefer to type rather than be forced to constantly use voice chat.

And while "Then don't play it!" might seem like a perfectly valid option to you, to a company that has been hemorrhaging money for over a year now, it's probably not the most preferable solution. If they are smart, they will announce a plan to implement some of these sought-after features in the future.

After all, it effects literally nobody in a negative manner.

It's your opinion that your preferences won't bother anyone. But your ignoring the cause and result of the item that you feel won't bother others. Your point of view is with the text box and the ability to hide it if a user doesn't want to use it or see it.

It's not that simple

When you create another means of communication in this case that is optional, it drives certain behaviors. As seen on PC, those behaviors are in opposition to tools and systems created by ZOS in the game.

So to suggest that your preference won't bother or disrupt another players experience, that's false and we see the impact on PC of such a feature. My passionate disagreement is a lot larger than what shows up on the screen and wether it's optional, but instead the overall impact that the features will have on all players regardless of whether they use it, disable it, like it, want it, don't care or don't want it.

"We" as I'll continue to comment that understand that it's not as simple as a feature for some and not for others, desire a different experience or encounter with TESO than what exists on PC.

"We" does equal a lot more people than who are commenting in these threads and while there are thousands who use the forums, based on unique votes and comments there are approx 260+/- out of the thousands who use the forum that have expressed to have text chat.

Considering all of those players use PC or both that's not a lot. There are at least 260+/- that cannot voice themselves as they don't or can't play this on PC or as a few of my messages share...they chose not to buy on PC because they don't want the experiences that the PC present not limited to text chat, keyboard and mouse usage.

Varicite

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

It's your opinion that your preferences won't bother anyone. But your ignoring the cause and result of the item that you feel won't bother others. Your point of view is with the text box and the ability to hide it if a user doesn't want to use it or see it.

It's not that simple

When you create another means of communication in this case that is optional, it drives certain behaviors. As seen on PC, those behaviors are in opposition to tools and systems created by ZOS in the game.

You seem to be under the completely false assumption that simply because text chat is the most prevalent manner of communication in the PC version, players do not also utilize voice chat. This is clearly not true.

Also, if voice chat were actually included in the PC version (which it will be, I believe was said), it would be used much more broadly.

Would it replace many of the things that are simply easier to do w/ text? Probably not. But it will certainly be advantageous to use BOTH systems where there are strongest.

PS) Know what else is coming to the PC version? Official controller support. That's right, ZOS clearly understands that it shouldn't matter how you are comfortable playing the game, so long as you are comfortable playing it.

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

So to suggest that your preference won't bother or disrupt another players experience, that's false and we see the impact on PC of such a feature. My passionate disagreement is a lot larger than what shows up on the screen and wether it's optional, but instead the overall impact that the features will have on all players regardless of whether they use it, disable it, like it, want it, don't care or don't want it.

Both of these features are present in many other games. I think you're overreacting, personally.

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

"We" as I'll continue to comment that understand that it's not as simple as a feature for some and not for others, desire a different experience or encounter with TESO than what exists on PC.

Quit speaking for anybody but yourself. You are not representative of anyone but yourself, 1 player. Anything beyond "you", I'm going to simply ignore, because... well, I can also say I know 400,000 people who tell me all the time that they would buy this game in a heartbeat if the console version had text chat.

Still means nothing to anyone.

Uberkull

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

:-) this just really will drive behaviors where people have opportunities and reasons to establish more friends and contacts which is what happens in Destiny and more often people will use the tools as you mention as well as beginning to play in small parties. the trading concerns dissapear as you meet more contacts, use guilds and the going to a website may work for some while others can just play and grow their networks.

What? In Destiny, the lack of a group finder, lack of text chat, and forcing the player to go out to a app or a website to read Grimore cards for the story are all the biggest complaint about the game.

I've played Destiny since beta...and it's now a ghost town in regards to the players I played with since launch. No one plays it anymore because it lacks community tools in the game.

Moderator note: Edited for rude comments.

Bouvin

One more reason console is going to flop.

Varicite

His optimism is endearing, but that hasn't stopped him from ultimately being wrong in the past.

They say history repeats itself.

/shrug

NewBlacksmurf

Varicite wrote: »

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

It's your opinion that your preferences won't bother anyone. But your ignoring the cause and result of the item that you feel won't bother others. Your point of view is with the text box and the ability to hide it if a user doesn't want to use it or see it.

It's not that simple

When you create another means of communication in this case that is optional, it drives certain behaviors. As seen on PC, those behaviors are in opposition to tools and systems created by ZOS in the game.

You seem to be under the completely false assumption that simply because text chat is the most prevalent manner of communication in the PC version, players do not also utilize voice chat. This is clearly not true.

Also, if voice chat were actually included in the PC version (which it will be, I believe was said), it would be used much more broadly.

Would it replace many of the things that are simply easier to do w/ text? Probably not. But it will certainly be advantageous to use BOTH systems where there are strongest.

PS) Know what else is coming to the PC version? Official controller support. That's right, ZOS clearly understands that it shouldn't matter how you are comfortable playing the game, so long as you are comfortable playing it.

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

So to suggest that your preference won't bother or disrupt another players experience, that's false and we see the impact on PC of such a feature. My passionate disagreement is a lot larger than what shows up on the screen and wether it's optional, but instead the overall impact that the features will have on all players regardless of whether they use it, disable it, like it, want it, don't care or don't want it.

Both of these features are present in many other games. I think you're overreacting, personally.

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

"We" as I'll continue to comment that understand that it's not as simple as a feature for some and not for others, desire a different experience or encounter with TESO than what exists on PC.

Quit speaking for anybody but yourself. You are not representative of anyone but yourself, 1 player. Anything beyond "you", I'm going to simply ignore, because... well, I can also say I know 400,000 people who tell me all the time that they would buy this game in a heartbeat if the console version had text chat.

Still means nothing to anyone.

Well the industry and the experiences crafted for console that differ from PC in addition to games that are on multiple platforms but where they drastically differ due to the hardware proves that people don't want the same experiences as another platform.

Also recall my original position and how it's opened to suggest and offer other possibilities as this discussion continues through different threads. Those have come from other people's suggestions who have a voice but cannot voice themselves here.

There are again valid reasons why people want text chat and valid reasons why it shouldn't be added as well as valid reasons it should be added and why people don't want text chat on console. The valid reasons on either side don't support a reason that it's "needed" or "required" but only communicate preferences rather than needs.

I passionately don't want to have the PC experiences of text spam, people trying to circumvent systems intended to drive a certain experience, or any separation of players even more due to adding a keyboard text communication.
Also knowing controller support is coming to PC soon with text chat...why push it to be on console?

Moderator note: Removed off topic conversation.