nirnhoned broken again

Darklord_Tiberius

Ezareth wrote: »

wrathofrraath wrote: »

I just tested it with molten whip on flame atros.

No CP in spell pen or apprentice stone
32,416 magicka

epic sharpened staff (12%):
1989 spell power
molten whip: 5929 base *8952* crit

legendary nirn staff (18%):
2029 spell power
molten whip: 5881 base *8880* crit

@ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom How can you guys continue to do this? Nirnhoned Weapons have been broken since release. Why is this so difficult to do right? Do you realize with the advent of 1.6 and the abundance of Spell Resistance how important spell penetration is? None of it works right and it takes someone literally 5 minutes to test these things after making changes in order to determine they are not working correctly.

All of the values reported on the tooltips of these weapons are *100% Arbitrary*. They don't correlate to each other and they surely don't correlate to what they should be doing. A Legendary Sharpened Sword with 7% Spell Penetration does not give half of the Penetration of a Legendary Staff with %14 Penetration. Two Legendary Sharpened Swords with 14% combined penetration do not even surpass a common Sharpened Staff with 8% Penetration. Please find someone in your development team who cares enough to look at this long enough to do it right!

Seriously, if you are having trouble with spell resistance, try a different class. I have seen plenty of Sorcs pull huge hits in Cyrodiil without using either of these traits. Learn to theory craft.

ginoboehm

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

There is a bug with the Sharpened Trait that we're working on a fix for.

As a reminder, we understand frustration over outstanding bugs, but please keep it constructive and respectful.

then please for the love of god treat us respectful this + the fall damage "bug fixing" is just insulting.

Hutuldur

Valnas wrote: »

After a lot more testing:

Nirnhoned is giving us 1.8% benefit, not 18% as the tooltip states. can we update this tooltip please.

also, shock dmg is pentrating armor in a bizarre manner, My Crushing shock dmg is favoring the lightning particularly.

You are sorcerer. They get bonus in lighting from passives.

Minack

lol...

EskimoBrother

Darklord_Tiberius wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

wrathofrraath wrote: »

I just tested it with molten whip on flame atros.

No CP in spell pen or apprentice stone
32,416 magicka

epic sharpened staff (12%):
1989 spell power
molten whip: 5929 base *8952* crit

legendary nirn staff (18%):
2029 spell power
molten whip: 5881 base *8880* crit

@ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom How can you guys continue to do this? Nirnhoned Weapons have been broken since release. Why is this so difficult to do right? Do you realize with the advent of 1.6 and the abundance of Spell Resistance how important spell penetration is? None of it works right and it takes someone literally 5 minutes to test these things after making changes in order to determine they are not working correctly.

All of the values reported on the tooltips of these weapons are *100% Arbitrary*. They don't correlate to each other and they surely don't correlate to what they should be doing. A Legendary Sharpened Sword with 7% Spell Penetration does not give half of the Penetration of a Legendary Staff with %14 Penetration. Two Legendary Sharpened Swords with 14% combined penetration do not even surpass a common Sharpened Staff with 8% Penetration. Please find someone in your development team who cares enough to look at this long enough to do it right!

Seriously, if you are having trouble with spell resistance, try a different class. I have seen plenty of Sorcs pull huge hits in Cyrodiil without using either of these traits. Learn to theory craft.

point is the trait is broken, has nothing to do with theory crafting.

Ezareth

Darklord_Tiberius wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

wrathofrraath wrote: »

I just tested it with molten whip on flame atros.

No CP in spell pen or apprentice stone
32,416 magicka

epic sharpened staff (12%):
1989 spell power
molten whip: 5929 base *8952* crit

legendary nirn staff (18%):
2029 spell power
molten whip: 5881 base *8880* crit

@ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom How can you guys continue to do this? Nirnhoned Weapons have been broken since release. Why is this so difficult to do right? Do you realize with the advent of 1.6 and the abundance of Spell Resistance how important spell penetration is? None of it works right and it takes someone literally 5 minutes to test these things after making changes in order to determine they are not working correctly.

All of the values reported on the tooltips of these weapons are *100% Arbitrary*. They don't correlate to each other and they surely don't correlate to what they should be doing. A Legendary Sharpened Sword with 7% Spell Penetration does not give half of the Penetration of a Legendary Staff with %14 Penetration. Two Legendary Sharpened Swords with 14% combined penetration do not even surpass a common Sharpened Staff with 8% Penetration. Please find someone in your development team who cares enough to look at this long enough to do it right!

Seriously, if you are having trouble with spell resistance, try a different class. I have seen plenty of Sorcs pull huge hits in Cyrodiil without using either of these traits. Learn to theory craft.

Lol do you even know who you're speaking to?

You'd be hard pressed to find another player in the game who knows more about the math behind *every* aspect of this game although there are many who know as much as I do.

The point is, I've crafted and then deconstructed half a dozen Legendary Sharpened staves and now that they've broken Nirnhoned yet again I'm being forced to craft yet another one to maximize my damage.

I wonder if you took the mean stamina based ability hit and compared it to the mean magicka based ability hit in Cyorodiil right now what you would find? I guarantee you'd find that stamina hits are doing 30% more damage or more right now.

CPT_CAPSLOCK

Nothing new, sharpened has never been fixed, they just nerfed the bug.

Galalin

Ezareth wrote: »

Darklord_Tiberius wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

wrathofrraath wrote: »

I just tested it with molten whip on flame atros.

No CP in spell pen or apprentice stone
32,416 magicka

epic sharpened staff (12%):
1989 spell power
molten whip: 5929 base *8952* crit

legendary nirn staff (18%):
2029 spell power
molten whip: 5881 base *8880* crit

@ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom How can you guys continue to do this? Nirnhoned Weapons have been broken since release. Why is this so difficult to do right? Do you realize with the advent of 1.6 and the abundance of Spell Resistance how important spell penetration is? None of it works right and it takes someone literally 5 minutes to test these things after making changes in order to determine they are not working correctly.

All of the values reported on the tooltips of these weapons are *100% Arbitrary*. They don't correlate to each other and they surely don't correlate to what they should be doing. A Legendary Sharpened Sword with 7% Spell Penetration does not give half of the Penetration of a Legendary Staff with %14 Penetration. Two Legendary Sharpened Swords with 14% combined penetration do not even surpass a common Sharpened Staff with 8% Penetration. Please find someone in your development team who cares enough to look at this long enough to do it right!

Seriously, if you are having trouble with spell resistance, try a different class. I have seen plenty of Sorcs pull huge hits in Cyrodiil without using either of these traits. Learn to theory craft.

Lol do you even know who you're speaking to?

You'd be hard pressed to find another player in the game who knows more about the math behind *every* aspect of this game although there are many who know as much as I do.

The point is, I've crafted and then deconstructed half a dozen Legendary Sharpened staves and now that they've broken Nirnhoned yet again I'm being forced to craft yet another one to maximize my damage.

I wonder if you took the mean stamina based ability hit and compared it to the mean magicka based ability hit in Cyorodiil right now what you would find? I guarantee you'd find that stamina hits are doing 30% more damage or more right now.

We all knew this would happen.... it was a matter of time... i asked the question before what would happen if the shoe was on the other foot... well now it is and everyone who went out and crafted a nirn for the broken trait is left with junk... kinda ironic.

And yes @Ezareth is one of the best sorcs around and i have 0 doubt he has researched the living crap out of this game. With that saidi would trust his math without question

DK SCRUB OUT

Sacadon

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

There is a bug with the Sharpened Trait that we're working on a fix for.

As a reminder, we understand frustration over outstanding bugs, but please keep it constructive and respectful.

Agreed on being respectful. However, ZOS has little to no credibility on this topic and for valid and non-subjective reasons. Also, respect works both ways. The added frustration is what feels like a lack of respect for your customers. And It's amplified by how simple it is to test and how many times this has been missed.

supernico

#sharpenedmasterrace

Nirnhorned too expansive anyways

Taonnor

Again:

I need some correct numbers:

1. How much spell resist did negate the 5/5 light armor bonus?
2. How much spell resist did negate the nirnhorned trait now?
3. How much spell resist did negate the CP points?

Please in one unit (% or spell resist)


Please some serious testings. For example i will know, how much resistance i negate with 11k concentration... 5k Spell resist or 11k? Or 20k?!

How much percent gives nirn now in spell resist numbers... 1k? 2k? 10k?

How much percent gives sharpened now in spell resist numbers?!


So much blabla in this forums... No hard facts here.

HiP

Taonnor wrote: »

How much percent gives nirn now in spell resist numbers... 1k? 2k? 10k?

How much percent gives sharpened now in spell resist numbers?!


So much blabla in this forums... No hard facts here.

LOL
if it's a percentage, it cannot be absolute numbers... it's a percentage of another number, and that number varies...
we don't even know if that number is the penetration we get from light armor (which would mean no penetration at all if we dont have the passive), or if it is calculated against the spell resist of the target you hit.
with some addons, you get the focus rating displayed, but i'm not sure it shows anything.

still pulling the same numbers as before in pvp, with nirn.
maybe it's only bugged in pve ?

Ezareth

Taonnor wrote: »

Again:

I need some correct numbers:

1. How much spell resist did negate the 5/5 light armor bonus?
2. How much spell resist did negate the nirnhorned trait now?
3. How much spell resist did negate the CP points?

Please in one unit (% or spell resist)


Please some serious testings. For example i will know, how much resistance i negate with 11k concentration... 5k Spell resist or 11k? Or 20k?!

How much percent gives nirn now in spell resist numbers... 1k? 2k? 10k?

How much percent gives sharpened now in spell resist numbers?!


So much blabla in this forums... No hard facts here.

I've spent so many hours testing spell penetration that the only thing I've been able to determine with certainty is that it follows no logical methodology. There is obviously some bugs inherently coded in the system itself. Thus far, the best ZoS has been able to do to "fix" this is through tweaking various Focus rating values given by various items.

Considering how many times these values have changed from patch to patch and the fact one item/bonus/ability or another isn't working as intended from patch to patch you basically have to retest the entire system every patch to get an understanding how it works.

I for one have wasted enough of my time testing this and posting my findings only to have them ignored. That's the main reason I (and I'm sure so many others) are pretty frustrated.

If it was as simple as you can Penetrate 'X' amount of spell resist and some items added to this value and other items multiplied it I would be extremely happy. This however is not even remotely the case.

As I stated earlier, the tooltips you see on your Sharpened and Nirnhoned weapons are 100% Arbitrary.. The only thing you can certain of is the value that your existing weapon with penetration on it will give you will increase linearly with what its value is when you upgrade it.

wrathofrraath

Honestly thought theyd fix this with todays patch, oh well i guess its time to break out the sharpened staves from my bank >: )

Spangla

Told ya 1.6 was a bad idea.

1.5 was still in the beta stages.